France is cool, Proust is teh ultimatezor roxxor!

I can't imagine living in a country that was known for losing all but one war, and was afraid to stand up for itself. Plus the fact that they willingly cemented cannon emplacements along ONE border, not even planning for the eventuality that they might come around the other side. Stupid ccomes to mind. Yeah, God forbid we don't turn out like those idiots.

Dont forget the alps! Who would want to live in a country with sutch horrid mountains?

All good points gentlemen. I would hate all of that too. I stand by my sniveling pansies comment though.

Well you can get Crossiants from Mc Donalds (I think) so maybe it has already happend.

America wasn't much better in Vietnam mate wandered into a situation horrendously unprepared...oh and think before you knock the country that gave you one of the key icons in America.

hughball:
America wasn't much better in Vietnam mate wandered into a situation horrendously unprepared...oh and think before you knock the country that gave you one of the key icons in America.

Not to mention the constitution was 99% based on french Philosophy.

sammyfreak:

hughball:
America wasn't much better in Vietnam mate wandered into a situation horrendously unprepared...oh and think before you knock the country that gave you one of the key icons in America.

Not to mention the constitution was 99% based on french Philosophy.

And the French helped the Americans fight their war of independence.

Anniko:

sammyfreak:

hughball:
America wasn't much better in Vietnam mate wandered into a situation horrendously unprepared...oh and think before you knock the country that gave you one of the key icons in America.

Not to mention the constitution was 99% based on french Philosophy.

And the French helped the Americans fight their war of independence.

A toast, to the French general, the Marquis de Lafayette. Who was pivotal in the American Revolution, as we all well know.

Honestly, I'm not sure why "The French surrendered to the Germans, that makes them worthy of scorn!" is thought of as high commentary. Among the modern american right, of course, France Bashing is an acceptable, even mandatory enterprise. Why, say, any other country that surrendered or was allied with the Nazi's doesn't get this treatment, I'm not sure. I mean, what about the Italians, who were actual allies?

And of course, the Maginot line took about two decades to build, and the *reason* it wasn't expanded along the Belgian border was a) It would probably cost too much, and b) It would be the military and political equivalent of the French saying to the Belgians "we know we have no hope of defending you if the Germans invade." It was a political impossibility.

Add in the fact that the French surrender was something engineered by the French *right*, who basically concluded that the Nazis were right, they were going to win, and they should make themselves helpful to them. And, of course, during the interwar period French politics were almost frozen because of the split between the right and the left, and when push came to shove the right decided to accommodate the Nazi's for fear of the French Left.

In any case, the why's and how's of the Vichy regime have little to do with modern French politics or attitudes, and the fact that some (usually american) observers insist on interpreting all their actions through that lens says more about the observers than about France.

Chilango2:
Honestly, I'm not sure why "The French surrendered to the Germans, that makes them worthy of scorn!" is thought of as high commentary.

I think it was the "surrendered in all but one war" part, not just WW2.

I don't go around hating the French (or many people at that), but I can at least find amusement from that little historical fact.

Yan-Yan:

Chilango2:
Honestly, I'm not sure why "The French surrendered to the Germans, that makes them worthy of scorn!" is thought of as high commentary.

I think it was the "surrendered in all but one war" part, not just WW2.

I don't go around hating the French (or many people at that), but I can at least find amusement from that little historical fact.

I couldn't find a convenient timeline of French Wars and their outcomes, so I was hoping you might be able to provide reference for your fact?

Aside from that, I would say more but Chilango2 already said it (well said, btw). The only thing I would add is that the actual Maginot fortifications didn't fall to force: they were still under French control up until the surrender, and only fell once the surrender occurred, requiring them all to put down arms and volunteer for stints in POW camps.

sammyfreak:

hughball:
America wasn't much better in Vietnam mate wandered into a situation horrendously unprepared...oh and think before you knock the country that gave you one of the key icons in America.

Not to mention the constitution was 99% based on french Philosophy.

More John Locke, as far as I'm aware, and he was very, very English.

Feel free to show me I'm wrong, knoweldge of American politcal history is hardly my strongpoint, but I have done a little Locke in my time, and the constitution did come up.

As to the mongs going on about France's defeat in the second world war, the German Bliztkrieg swept past everything in its path, be it Polish, Belgium, French or British expeditionary. The German millitary was outstanding in its initiative and speed at the begining of the war. French command made mistakes, but so do all commanders, the problem here being there was no room for error; Germany was ascendant, its millitary nigh unstoppable. If they'd made it across the channel, I'm under not allusions: Britain would have fallen too.

The Germans stomped on everything with their much more advanced war machine. Do not judge France.

Mr Wednesday:

sammyfreak:

hughball:
America wasn't much better in Vietnam mate wandered into a situation horrendously unprepared...oh and think before you knock the country that gave you one of the key icons in America.

Not to mention the constitution was 99% based on french Philosophy.

More John Locke, as far as I'm aware, and he was very, very English.

Feel free to show me I'm wrong, knoweldge of American politcal history is hardly my strongpoint, but I have done a little Locke in my time, and the constitution did come up.

Well, the constitution is an interesting document that way. It has alot of inspiration from John Locke, but also alot from Rousseau and Montague (I think that's how you spell his name).

The French philosophical influence was definitely there, however.

And of course, the French Revolution had a lasting impact on the practice of american democracy, much as it would bequeath to the world pretty much the full set of modern ideology.

cool13011:
Mit Romney is sad because he thinks that America could become the France of the 21st century. Oh yea, I'd hate to live in that third world backwater country (being sarcastic). lol. What do you think of his blatant disregard for international courtesy?

Heh. You sir, are a raving hypocrite.

So. It is a blatant disregard to courtesy to accuse you of being like the French? It could mean a plethora of things, but by taking offence, you are accusing France of all the things you feel obliged to defend yourself against. So, it's ok for you to consider France to be guilty of all these crimes, but if someone should suggest your country is guilty of the same things, why! It is most abominably rude!

I'll also point out that most French grade-school students can actually find America on a world map, a feat yet to be matched in the US. (Finding America, I mean... we'll work up to finding European nations after we've got them trained up on their own back yard.)

Seriously, if the US wants to earn back some sort of good-will and credit in the international community they've got to stop reinforcing the "hicks with missile silos" impression their politicians keep giving out; they could start by not barking back idiot bigotries like trained seals.

(And they're going to need the credit soon... or Wall St. will, anyway, which means the guys who sign their paycheques do too.)

-- Steve

cool13011:
Look at france now, all economically stable. Oh, I would hate to have a strong international currency. I would hate to have a strong economy. I would hate to have efficient cars. I would hate to have vehicles that don't pollute the air. I would hate to have nice countrysides and wine. Oh no, I would hate to live in that third world backwater country. Oh no, please, anything but France. lol

Not sure what you're talking about with efficient cars. Citroen's are notorious for their habit of breaking down.

But otherwise, France is a pretty cool country. Their politics aren't the best, but they're nowhere near as bad as a certain other right-wing nations. And considering that Hitler managed to conquer most of Europe, France surrendering doesn't shock me (though the patriot in me does like to believe we here in Blighty could have held Jerry off).

Well I'm not perticularly fond of France for several reasons. But that comment should be below any politician(at least).

Yan-Yan:

Chilango2:
Honestly, I'm not sure why "The French surrendered to the Germans, that makes them worthy of scorn!" is thought of as high commentary.

I think it was the "surrendered in all but one war" part, not just WW2.

I don't go around hating the French (or many people at that), but I can at least find amusement from that little historical fact.

I don't hate the French, I just love to make fun of their history of losing or surrendering in every war. Other than that, France has some pretty cool culture.

sammyfreak:
France is cool, Proust is teh ultimatezor roxxor!

Proust is great. So are Sartre and Camus. Apparently they actually have portraits of Sartre in the tabacs (newsagents/convenience stores) in France. Enough said. They also have great universal healthcare and public transport: two things the UK and US most certainly do not have.

j-e-f-f-e-r-s:

Not sure what you're talking about with efficient cars. Citroen's are notorious for their habit of breaking down.

Not as much as Rover! :D (I know, we've almost only owned rovers, which worked well there)

But otherwise, France is a pretty cool country. Their politics aren't the best, but they're nowhere near as bad as a certain other right-wing nations. And considering that Hitler managed to conquer most of Europe, France surrendering doesn't shock me (though the patriot in me does like to believe we here in Blighty could have held Jerry off).

People often forget about the resistance. Things just happened so fast... and there wasn't enough misery and zeal to commit suicide bombings either.
Ultimately, when a government betrays the nation and has an extremely powerful army put in place before anything can be organized and mounted efficiently, it's game over.

Of course, there's that bizarre rampant idea that since the Americans helped France in the 40s, France is obligated to suck America's cock repeatedly. Go figure.
I think the rosbeefs are doing that well enough, we leave it to them. *wink wink*

Darth Mobius:

Yan-Yan:

Chilango2:
Honestly, I'm not sure why "The French surrendered to the Germans, that makes them worthy of scorn!" is thought of as high commentary.

I think it was the "surrendered in all but one war" part, not just WW2.

I don't go around hating the French (or many people at that), but I can at least find amusement from that little historical fact.

I don't hate the French, I just love to make fun of their history of losing or surrendering in every war. Other than that, France has some pretty cool culture.

Sorry, just wanted to quote that bit for the record. Not that I'm really moved by who won or lost. I think judging the value of a nation by its collection of war medals is just absurd. But that's just me. ;)

Mr Wednesday:
The Germans stomped on everything with their much more advanced war machine. Do not judge France.

I agree, I don't think the descision to surrender was entirely a bad one. Having seen the wholesale mayhem and destruction that was visited upon every other country that stood its ground and fought. The French government had the best of intentions for it's citezens.

I'm amazed that people still insult them over this, I mean, it was over 60 bloody years ago.

Back on topic, I think it shows Romney to be a bit small minded and a tad backward. But, what the fuck everyone to thier own, I wont't pass judgement.

Chilango2:

Mr Wednesday:

sammyfreak:

hughball:
America wasn't much better in Vietnam mate wandered into a situation horrendously unprepared...oh and think before you knock the country that gave you one of the key icons in America.

Not to mention the constitution was 99% based on french Philosophy.

More John Locke, as far as I'm aware, and he was very, very English.

Feel free to show me I'm wrong, knoweldge of American politcal history is hardly my strongpoint, but I have done a little Locke in my time, and the constitution did come up.

Well, the constitution is an interesting document that way. It has alot of inspiration from John Locke, but also alot from Rousseau and Montague (I think that's how you spell his name).

The French philosophical influence was definitely there, however.

And of course, the French Revolution had a lasting impact on the practice of american democracy, much as it would bequeath to the world pretty much the full set of modern ideology.

Um, the American Revolution inspired the French Revolution... Or are you implying that France's rebellion against their government made them behave better? Both arguments are wrong. The American Government behaved better because we had just beaten back the British, surely we could beat back a government with no standing army at the time.

Whilst I'm not really the biggest fan of France however i just think France bashing isn't really all that intelligent, particularly using ww2 as an example plus it screams of spoilt child syndrome, they didn't do what you want now you mock them about historical events. What people seem to forget about the British empire is they never had a large professional army when push came to shove they relied on the colonies.

To paraphrase John Fallon of AITH, "He fell off his soapbox, clean, into a pit of molten lava. And I mean...CLEAN!" This is what I like to refer to as political suicide.

Topic title is now 'cool13011 commits account suicide and we all point and laugh, while remembering him as he was before he went insane and died.'

Someone jog my memory; who was cool13011 again?

Geoffrey42:

Yan-Yan:

Chilango2:
Honestly, I'm not sure why "The French surrendered to the Germans, that makes them worthy of scorn!" is thought of as high commentary.

I think it was the "surrendered in all but one war" part, not just WW2.

I don't go around hating the French (or many people at that), but I can at least find amusement from that little historical fact.

I couldn't find a convenient timeline of French Wars and their outcomes, so I was hoping you might be able to provide reference for your fact?

Sorry I'm so late getting back to you on this, but I've been nursing a cold all day while trying desperately to sleep so I can go to work tonight. Anyway, it is a bit of a false claim to say they lost all their wars, though their war history is amusing:

Click Here To See The History Of France In War

EDIT: Jeez, some people seem to have read the posts above and come to the same conclusion: "people are dissing France because of WWII!", which was only stated by people saying it's wrong to do that. Well yeah. No one is actually doing that. It's like I'm watching a political circle jerk where everyone pats each other on the back saying "it's bad to do this, and you're bad for saying we should do this!" when no one has actually done it, or said anyone should do it.

Color me confused on how people got to that point.

I dunno. He wasn't banned for this topic though. He was banned for pissing on someone's work and admitting he didn't read all of it.