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News Room Contributor  Posts: 4827 Joined: 12 Nov 2002     | |
Muckraker  Posts: 301 Joined: 4 Jun 2008     | So when you're game doesn't sell, you blame it on torrents. I think that's just an eventuality that they never had to deal with on consoles and now that it's happening to them, they over-react |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 1828 Joined: 14 Nov 2007    | It's been said many times, but piracy seems to have become the ultimate scapegoat for devs. "My game didn't sell well on the PC" "Pirates" "All the developers are jumping ship to consoles" "Pirates" "My son's become a woman-beating crack fiend" "... probably Pirates" |
Press Junketeer  Posts: 389 Joined: 15 Jul 2008   |
Actually I'd say that last one is probably due more to 4chan than pirates. Lesse, you release a console port to the PC. Now, even if it's a good console port, you've already got a lot of things going against you. |
Beat Writer  Posts: 215 Joined: 7 Jun 2008  | "Piracy's not the ultimate cause..." (But I won't openly admit my game sucks for the platform, so I'm going to pretend like it is.) |
Copy Clerk  Posts: 72 Joined: 25 Apr 2008  | I wouldn't expect DMC to sell well on the PC even if there were no pirates at all. This is a game that works best (I think) with a controller, a lot of PC gamers hate the idea of using a gamepad with their PC's. I'm not one of them, but many that I know are very dismissive of the very idea. Besides, as was pointed out, people who were really interested in the game already have it for one of their consoles. It's not the type of game that normally appeals to a lot of PC gamers. I'm disturbed by how enthused he sounds over DRM that constricts the rights (not privileges, rights) of the consumers. Mass Effect and Bioshock both have lousy DRM schemes that limit the number of installations or activations possible. While Bioshock has since removed that limit, it's not one that should have been there to start with. If you buy a game, the developer and publisher should not be allowed to put limits or conditions on what would be considered normal use. Yes, limit copying and the like if you want, that's not normal use. Don't you dare limit my installs, that's like saying I have to call Saturn for permission every damned time I want to start my car. That's normal use, and I should be allowed that without interference or having to jump through hoops. |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 1203 Joined: 9 Dec 2007   | Doesn't he mean that its been pirated to World's End and back? Heheheh. |
Infamous Scribbler  Posts: 527 Joined: 9 Oct 2007 | I'm not sure how good the DMC4 port is, but if it's anything like the fucking terrible Resident Evil 4 port (it had zero mouse support), then it's no surprise that no one wants to buy it. Likewise, DMC4 has and always will be a console game. It's associated with consoles so it's a big name for console only gamers. Many PC gamers have probably never really played a DMC game and thus have little interest in it. Not to mention, I'm sure a large majority of people didn't even know that it was released on PC. Piracy may have played a factor in it's poor sales, but it certainly isn't the only reason for it. |
Infamous Scribbler  Posts: 618 Joined: 8 Jul 2008 | I am very disappointed with these digital pirates. Nothing like the old, REAL Pirates, who stole real treasure instead of video games. |
BANNED Posts: 2 Joined: 1 Aug 2008 | Mass Effect has nice sales because Mass Effect is a good game. Devil May Cry 4 is sold poorly because no one gives a fuck about Devil May Cry 4. Now, here are some nice statistics to back such claims: Assassins Creed REPACK-RELOADED 112,653 downloads Mass Effect (RELOADED, VITALITY and DETONATION) around 20000 downloads Devil May Cry 4-RELOADED 7,916 downloads There, you have it. Now, cry me a river for being a pirate. :'( User was banned for: Devil May Cry 4 "Pirated To Hell And Back" On PC. (Permanent) |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 3688 Joined: 29 Nov 2007     | So, a game that requires constant twitch timing and combinations, doesn't sell well on something prone to LAG, and they decide it's pirates? When did the world get stupid? |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 2802 Joined: 20 Dec 2007 |
Actually Capcom has learned from their mistakes, the port for DMC4 is great. -but no one is gonna buy it if they already have it on their consoles, and there isn't really much to change with DMC4 in modability and there is hardly replay value either. Really, it's worth a rent at most and all the DMC fans have bought it at launch, so this isn't like Mass Effect or Bioshock where getting it on PC will be a huge difference if not a whole new experience, but it's just that people don't want to pay full price for a game they aren't able to trade back in >_< ANYWAY, I don't care if people bitch about piracy as long as they have legit claims that it is being pirated. No one wants to admit that "no one is buying my product!" so we gotta have the easiest scapegoat around and that's piracy. For what it's worth, I bought DMC4 on PC and it's great, so there capcom, you have my support, now give me RE5 for PC god damnit! |
Muckraker  Posts: 261 Joined: 24 Dec 2007 |
it's not that you're not trustworthy, but you should probably supply your statistics with some sort of backup. Like, say, a link to their source |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 2082 Joined: 12 May 2008 |
The pirate bay...dur |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 2913 Joined: 21 Jan 2008 | Yeh, you try playing DMC4 without a controller... it's not impossible, but I reckon that the controller, as others have stated, is better suited for this game. |
Anonymous Source Posts: 2 Joined: 14 Jul 2008 | I bought DMC4 for the PC and use an Xbox controller. The game rocks and has some of the most beautiful visuals I've ever seen in a PC game. It's a shame the fucking pirates are ruining things. |
Gone Gonzo Posts: 2802 Joined: 20 Dec 2007 |
You know you can use a controller on PC's right? believe it or not, I'm better with a keyboard :\ btw I hear this will go to digital distribution stores soon (not just Steam and D2D) so the pirates won't screw it all up. If DMC3's port did good on steam then I'm sure DMC4's actual well done port will do great.
You tryin' to get the guy banned? He's already on the borderline... |
News Room Contributor Posts: 4827 Joined: 12 Nov 2002 | 1. Piracy is a serious problem. 2. Not all problems with PC gaming, or gaming on any system, can be blamed on piracy. 3. I'm pretty sure that this is a case of 2 much than 1. As a die-hard PC gamer, I can say there's one simple reason why I haven't bought DMC 4 yet: The box. All I need to do is look at that shit and I know I won't be buying it. Am I missing out on a great game? Maybe. But I'll never know, 'cause I ain't playing it. "Gamers are gamers," but I don't think it can be denied that there's console bias of all sorts, and god knows PC gamers are as guilty of it as anyone. And since DMC 4 was released for consoles, the button-mashers - who this game would appeal to the most - already have the game on their platform of choice. That means the core demographic for the PC release of the game will be the "pure" PC gamers, who I really don't see as huge, untapped market for this kind of game. Blaming piracy for the failure of PC releases is almost becoming de rigueur, which is a problem in itself because it distracts from the very real problems caused by illegal copying. Instead of taking the problem seriously, people will just blow it off as repeated crying of wolf. |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 1960 Joined: 16 May 2008   | Action games like DMC don't exist on the PC why would you release DMC on the PC in the first place? PC gamers don't play DMC, and I think the falling sales show that. DMC isn't the first game to get heavily pirated. Did those other games that have been pirated even more suffer such horrible losses due to the Piracy? Nope. Stick to Consoles Capcom. |
Copy Clerk  Posts: 100 Joined: 21 Jan 2008 |
... video games :are: real treasure. >_> |
Beat Writer Posts: 215 Joined: 7 Jun 2008 | I think we seriously overrate piracy for PC software (games + apps). I like Brad Wardell's statements on pirates: If they're a problem ignore them. People who steal things aren't part of the potential consumer base. It's actually a good business model that extends to other businesses. Look at the mother of all evil; Walmart. You've got to figure that things get stolen from Walmart all the time. I'm willing to bet at least 5%, if not closer to 15% of their merchandise just walks away. Walmart has two choices at this point: pay for better security and make cuts somewhere else (or raise prices) or just leave it. They opted for the latter (old people as greeters to guilt people into not shoplifting notwithstanding). And they turn profits up the wazoo. They treat their employees in a way that makes EA look like an all-expenses paid resort, but still, they do it accepting that a portion of their stuff is going at REALLY cut-throat rates. It's almost foolish to bend over backwards to fight digital "theft" of a computer game. You've got to accept that someone who regularly downloads torrent games will almost never purchase it. After all, why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free? Even if you could lock down your game so no one could pirate it, that wouldn't make a pirate buy it. They just wouldn't buy it. I mean, for me, as an honest buyer who doesn't pirate, that's what I do. Since I'm investing 100s of dollars in my entertainment, I've had to make decisions, decisions like "No... Assassin's Creed just isn't worth it." Someone who never spends money on a game isn't gonna suddenly go "Oh, well, I guess EA wins. I'll buy the game." They're gonna go "Screw EA." There's some belief in the game publishing world that someday, somehow, a publisher will develop the ultimate in DRM, a CD-Key to rule them all. That's never going to happen. That's like someone saying they'll invent the lock for your front door that'll keep 100% of criminals from getting in. If you hear that, that person is lying to you. They'll probably be breaking in later. |
Press Junketeer Posts: 389 Joined: 15 Jul 2008 |
You tell us, you're the one complaining about a single player game as if it was a multiplayer game. Have you ever even played DMC? I really don't think it's totally fair to completely write off piracy. Iron Lore's Titan Quest was absolutely gutted by pirates who then complained about their cracked copies being buggy (before the game was even released on TQ's actual forums!) as if it was the game's fault and not the fact that it was a cracked copy. You have to look at this on a case by case basis. DMC4's failing is its publishers own idiotic fault for thinking that a game that caters to the console players would do well on the PC. |
Muckraker Posts: 308 Joined: 25 Feb 2008 | You'd think that Iron Lore figured out that making it look as if the game was extremely buggy before release was not the smartest thing to do either. |
Paperboy  Posts: 18 Joined: 2 Oct 2007 | They were moronic to ever think it would have even similar sales to console versions, i bought it cause a)DMC is win b)cause i still had a 360 controller hanging about and c)cause DMC is win, but when push comes to shove, im a special case (no comments!!!), i sold my console to get a pc, and thus lost DMC4, but to say pirates is to be honest so laughable its silly, even if it is being pirated, the fact is the market isnt their for it, I love the game on PC, but only as much as i loved it on 360. my 2 cents |
Gone Gonzo Posts: 2802 Joined: 20 Dec 2007 |
NOOO, PLEASE CAPCOM, I WILL SUPPORT YOU, DON'T GET OUT OF THE PC WATERS JUST YET, YOU HAVE HAD OTHER GOOD PC SALES! OK Now you aren't reading far enough into this Altorin, people will play action games on a PC - last action game I know of that sold well was Assassin's Creed - now anyway, if people will buy racing games, then they'll get action games, but the problem is that the majority own more than one system, and those who DO have a "gamepad" probably have a 360 or a PS3 already, which had DMC4 on it for months before it came to PC, and the PC version isn't like say, Mass Effect, that one is significantly different from the 360 version, but DMC4 is pretty much the same game, and not worth buying it again at full price. |
Muckraker Posts: 301 Joined: 4 Jun 2008 |
I have several friends who need to read this. You've just made my life so much easier |
Beat Writer Posts: 186 Joined: 18 Jun 2008 | MEh, I'd rather just wait a few years and pick up a console copy in a bargain bin for $8. Console devs can't seem to grasp what it is that makes PC games great. Nor do you have to deal with tons of questionable security on consoles. |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 1137 Joined: 13 Jan 2007 |
He has points in how companies could exploit piracy, but let's be honest, the easier to steal stuff, the more people will steal it. It's still part of the problem. If tomorrow, when I open the door, I find on the steps a fully functionnal illegal copy of a game I planned to acquire, do you think I'm going to go buy it afterwards? Now, I totally agree that using different strategies to focus on those who buy the games would probably be a good way to fight piracy by using the consumer against it. A good example would be to look at sales figures with games sold at full price and then at Platinum prices. It's not just price, there are ways of fidelization to consider.
I agree, it only hurts the honest cowsumer in the end. |
Gone Gonzo Posts: 1137 Joined: 13 Jan 2007 |
Devil May Cry 4... Assassin's Creed... Devil May Cry 4... Assassin's Creed... Apples...
Oranges...
|
IT Director  Posts: 993 Joined: 13 Jun 2002    |
Unfortunately, your example doesn't correspond well to this business. Digital products can be duplicated and distributed almost effortlessly. Wal-Mart isn't going to get a gallon of milk stolen, and then find that 10% of their milk-drinking customers across the world just got a copy of the gallon free from some guy over the internet. And it was delivered. When it comes down to it, there are hundreds of thousands of pirate downloads for any major game. That's more downloads than game sales in many cases, and it's easy enough to check (like our banned friend up there did). It would be stupid for us to pretend that none of these would become sales of some sort if the game wasn't available for free. Even if we're only taking about 5%, that would be a huge change in numbers for most games. It's just simple math - why be an honest person when you can download the game for free and spend the money on something else instead? All we're going to see in the end is even more security wrapped around the games. Online activation, centralized account systems, check-in's, PunkBuster-style system checks. Or they just won't get released on PC at all. And PC gamers have nobody to thank for it other than themselves. |
Devil May Cry 4 "Pirated To Hell And Back" On PC
Devil May Cry 4 for the PC isn't doing so well at retail, leading one Capcom executive to point out that the game is being "pirated to hell and back."
In a message posted on the official Capcom community forums, Christian Svensson, the company's vice president of business development, wrote, "I'm not sure how Capcom in general feels, but [Devil May Cry 4 for PC] is not doing as well as I would like in the U.S. at retail. It's such a good version and it really deserves better sales."
"I know it's getting pirated to hell and back (it was up on torrents literally the day it shipped)," he added.
When pressed about how much of an impact piracy is actually having on the game's sales, Svensson said, "Piracy's not the ultimate cause... but it's a factor." But he also went on to admit that the game's well-known console roots may also be working against it in the PC market.
"Most reviewers write it off as 'console dreck' because it's not an RTS, an FPS or an MMO," he said. "Indeed, it's content that doesn't often show up on the PC, and I think that's part of the reason we wanted to put it there. We think there is an audience for action games on the PC (that aren't FPSes), even if they are sometimes best played with a gamepad rather than a KB and a mouse."
He also spoke out in support of DRM schemes in fighting piracy, saying, "To my knowledge, Mass Effect still isn't fully cracked (tripwires still result in certain bugs in the pirated versions... pirates haven't found them all yet). And our data collected on BioShock is pretty damn solid too from certain audit services, and their integration wasn't as deep as Mass Effect's."
"They are more effective than people think," he continued. "Part of the problem though is that EA and T2 didn't actually communicate what's supposed to happen. The result of that lack of communication is that the pirates just think the game is buggy." THQ Creative Director made similar comments in March as part of a notorious rant about the role of piracy in the downfall of Titan Quest developer Iron Lore Entertainment.
The full conversation about Devil May Cry 4 for the PC can be read (or joined) at capcom-unity.com.
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