I'm just a scoche bamboozled here.

At the end of Final Fantasy VII, Cloud defeats Sephiroth in one deft blow, proving A. That he'd become as or more powerful than Sephiroth and B. That Sephiroth couldn't control him anymore. Flash forward to the movie, and Cloud gets his but whooped repetedly by a trio of emo SOLDIER wannabies (EMO!). I got to thinking about this, and three words came to mind, one of which I cannot repeat in civil conversation. I guess I could think about it a little more, but I think too much for my own good as it is, and I was wondering if it would be too much trouble to ask the lot of you to do it for me.

The way I took it was the events of Advent Children happened after FFVII. Cloud in his battle with Sephiroth in FFVII showed him in "top form". Tifa makes reference that they had all been stronger back in the day when she's on the airship watching Cloud fight Kadaj/Sephiroth. Plus in the earlier fights of Advent Children, Cloud has been substantially weakened by Geostigma. But if you remember, he is bathed in the water of the lifeforce which is why, although a struggle, he can defeat Kadaj/Sephiroth in the end of the movie. God, I'm such a Final Fantasy Fanboy. I really hate myself right now. I hope that made sense. If someone disagrees, pleased correct me. Thanks.

1. Cloud wasn't alone when he beat Sephiroth in FF7
2. Those "Emo" pussies hold ALL of the FF7 team's materia, meaning magic for them, and f**k all for Cloud.

I always see cloud and sephiroth when they're striped down to the basics are sort of even. Yhe only advantage each has is sephiroth whos older and trainned longer. then you have their swords, Sephy's sword has more range and thinner for slicing (like a katana), yet clouds is more weighted and could do crushing damage but is slower (like a bastard sword/claymore). Then again a 3 on one fight is unfair... but then again in ff7 at the end it was like a 7 vs 1, then 3 vs 1 to the final 1 vs 1 - but then cloud uses his onmislash.
Personal I just love cloud, I don't see the emo side of him like everyone else does (unless you watch advent children when it magnifided 100%). I'm going off now to revert back to a ff7 fangirl... I hope your happy...

I guess it also bears mentioning that "Claude" and his friends beat the snot out of him twice, first in his "puss spewing sin against god" and "are you sure I have enough wings" forms before the somewhat anti-climatic showdown, so you'll forgive him if he's a bit winded ;)

Dude, fanservice doesn't have to make sense. If it has a depressed guy with big hair and a bigger sword, and a quiet guy with longer hair and a slimmer/more graceful/smaller but just as large sword, you will pay money for it. It doesn't matter as long as opera music is playing and FFVII is being beaten like a dead horse. You may find this harsh, but it's time to move on, people. If anything, Dirge Of Cerberus should have been an adequate message.

Could be worse, Square could be making games about a water polo enthusiast who's just a figment of some whale's imagination.

To be honest, another FFVII spinoff where you play as ol Sephy during the Wutai war would get my fanboy senses tingling.

Bodb:
Dude, fanservice doesn't have to make sense. If it has a depressed guy with big hair and a bigger sword, and a quiet guy with longer hair and a slimmer/more graceful/smaller but just as large sword, you will pay money for it. It doesn't matter as long as opera music is playing and FFVII is being beaten like a dead horse. You may find this harsh, but it's time to move on, people. If anything, Dirge Of Cerberus should have been an adequate message.

Precisely. It's like comic books with this stuff, people. We all give these things far more thought than the money guys who just want flashy smack-downs to sell a product.

I mean, I don't think that makes it any less cool. I like flashy.

Seriously? There are people posting on a video game thread telling us not to discuss a video game? If you don't care about FFVII, don't read the thread, but some of us still enjoy the game, even eleven years later.

Zombielifecoach is right, Cloud's skill had atrophied from two years of non-violence, as pointed out by Tifa.

Agreed, firstly... off topic, does it upset anyone that in Advent Children Red XIII had less lines than Cait Sith?

On topic I third Zombielifecoach's post. Plus getting smacked up by knights of the round a few times probably didn't do much for Sephy's motivation.

Towards the end Cloud gets shot through the shoulder/chest/heart? and then gets blown up by Voz and Yazoo, tell me that isn't tough.

Hmm, the way I saw it, during FF7 you grind away bringing yourself up to level 60 or whatever, so that when Cloud and company face off against Sephiroth, they're actually strong enough to beat him.

In FF7, though, it's implied that Cloud has spent the years after Aeris' death moping around on his motorbike and not doing a whole lot. The strength that he had has gone. Add to that that he's got geostigma. And his materia get stolen. And that he fights a newly rejuvenated Sephiroth alone (because his friends think it's cool to, y'know, sort these things out by himself. Bastards!) And that it's more dramatic to watch a one-on-one fight between Cloud and Sephy (and the team already did their bit against Bahamut). I think it makes sense in the grand context of things.

I think technically Aerith would kick both their asses now. She is like the goddess of the entire planet now. Can't get much more powerful than that.

I think technically Aerith would kick both their asses now. She is like the goddess of the entire planet now. Can't get much more powerful than that.

ZenMonkey47:
Could be worse, Square could be making games about a water polo enthusiast who's just a figment of some whale's imagination.

To be honest, another FFVII spinoff where you play as ol Sephy during the Wutai war would get my fanboy senses tingling.

Heh, best description of FFX I ever heard. Sir, I salute you.

Strafe Mcgee:

ZenMonkey47:
Could be worse, Square could be making games about a water polo enthusiast who's just a figment of some whale's imagination.

To be honest, another FFVII spinoff where you play as ol Sephy during the Wutai war would get my fanboy senses tingling.

Heh, best description of FFX I ever heard. Sir, I salute you.

We should start an "insulting description of game plots" topic! What do ya all say?

When I thought about it, I totally think Sephiroth would have won in that final battle in Advent Children, had Cloud been equipped with Zack's (Wait...Wasn't it Angeal's in the first place?) buster sword, and not that like...7 sword combo. Besides, that thing has to way upwards of 100-200 pounds...
...
...
...
I think Cloud was stashing some of those Gyshal Greens...

ZenMonkey47:
Could be worse, Square could be making games about a water polo enthusiast who's just a figment of some whale's imagination.

took a very long time for me to get that you were talking about FFX but that is close to the funniest thing ive ever heard

as per topic, most of its been mentioned but the final thing is that A) if cloud has something to live for, or rather fight for then he becomes ungodly, i believe in both FF7 and advent children he fights for his friends and the whole world, once he realizes his friends, and how much they need him (maybe) he fights that much harder that or B)that the closer he gets to death the stronger he gets (as his final blade would lead you to believe) or C) who cares just enjoy the movie

granted i haven't played or watched either in a very very long time so who knows.

I still don't see why everyone obsesses over Cloud and Sephi's fight. Tifa vs Loz in the church was a MUCH cooler battle.

[quote=Khell_Sennet]1. Cloud wasn't alone when he beat Sephiroth in FF7
quote]

...I thought that the other things were...not Sephiroth, as to not put too fine a point on it.

In any case, I apreciate so many people helping me with the mundane issue of the day. Now I have more energy to focus on the bigger things, like that world peace thing that everyone's been talking about...

In all seriousness, though, I apreciate it

Aye i loved the tifa battle, it was totally awesome!
Sadly they needed just more of them fighting people, heck fight the geo kids!

Khell_Sennet:
I still don't see why everyone obsesses over Cloud and Sephi's fight. Tifa vs Loz in the church was a MUCH cooler battle.

But the team verus Bahamut was the coolest battle.

zombielifecoach:
The way I took it was the events of Advent Children happened after FFVII. Cloud in his battle with Sephiroth in FFVII showed him in "top form". Tifa makes reference that they had all been stronger back in the day when she's on the airship watching Cloud fight Kadaj/Sephiroth. Plus in the earlier fights of Advent Children, Cloud has been substantially weakened by Geostigma. But if you remember, he is bathed in the water of the lifeforce which is why, although a struggle, he can defeat Kadaj/Sephiroth in the end of the movie. God, I'm such a Final Fantasy Fanboy. I really hate myself right now. I hope that made sense. If someone disagrees, pleased correct me. Thanks.

Agreed. Cloud kills him in the game after the whole parties fight. It's not a one-hit-kill.

Is it just me, or did anyone else feel the "stolen materia" thing made Advent Children less of what it could be? Final Fantasy with out magic is more like Final Reality. I was dying to see how they'd interpret Knights of the Round.

Khell_Sennet:
Is it just me, or did anyone else feel the "stolen materia" thing made Advent Children less of what it could be? Final Fantasy with out magic is more like Final Reality. I was dying to see how they'd interpret Knights of the Round.

That would rock! A cue of Knights in full armour standing in line to beat you round the head.

Apone:

Khell_Sennet:
Is it just me, or did anyone else feel the "stolen materia" thing made Advent Children less of what it could be? Final Fantasy with out magic is more like Final Reality. I was dying to see how they'd interpret Knights of the Round.

That would rock! A cue of Knights in full armour standing in line to beat you round the head.

well....we'd have to add another 30 minutes to the movie if they wanted to add that.

VRaptorX:

Apone:

Khell_Sennet:
Is it just me, or did anyone else feel the "stolen materia" thing made Advent Children less of what it could be? Final Fantasy with out magic is more like Final Reality. I was dying to see how they'd interpret Knights of the Round.

That would rock! A cue of Knights in full armour standing in line to beat you round the head.

well....we'd have to add another 30 minutes to the movie if they wanted to add that.

Only if they used Quad summon and mimic... :D

Isn't is staple that the main character always wins? He/she could have no legs,arms,Torso or head and STILL win at the end!

Well main character in Versus doesn't end up winning, but thats an awesome film