Your most Unpopular Media Opinion

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erttheking:

Canadamus Prime:

erttheking:
Metroid Prime 2 Echoes was the best of the Prime Triology.

What's so unpopular about that?

As for me, I fail to find any appeal in Neon Genesis Evangelion

I've seen a lot of people slag it off, saying it has artificial difficulty and uninteresting environments. Obviously I disagree.

And I don't think disliking Eva is an unpopular opinion. That series is...divisive.

I like it better than the 3rd one.

As for Eva, it just it seems to be one of those iconic animes. Not nearly as big as Dragon Ball Z obviously, but still pretty big, and I fail to see why.

Sniper Team 4:
Revenge of the Sith is the worst Star Wars movie, and I think that The Phantom Menace is actually the best of the prequels.

Was this not already the established opinion? I thought that everyone thought this.

Speaking of Star Wars: The Force Awakens was the worst Star Wars movie. It was almost a shot-for-shot remake of A New Hope and I could have written a better scripted with both my hands loped off and my tongue cut out.

Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Firefly are trash. Joss Whedon is terrible at writing and directing. The shows only survive off nostalgia and a weird LBGTQ following in the case of Buffy.

Star Trek is fucking trash. Across the board, it is the worst kind of science fiction. I call it "word bank soup." The writers are handed a bank of made up words and are told to pick ten.

Tina Tiny is the most insufferable character in any game I have every played. Ever. May a pox befall the fuckwits at Gearbox who dreamed her up.

Dungeons & Dragons is a terrible RPG system. It just happens to be the least terrible system I've encountered.

Squilookle:
Nice one.

I'll hit the ground running here and say that among all those brilliant British comedies, Fawlty Towers is a steaming turd.
It's literally 'idiot tries to do some thing his way. Said thing blows up in his face in front of everyone. Idiot is supposed to be likable'. Its the same shit every episode, and he never learns. Never grows, tries to better relate to anyone or anything.

This kind of shows the main difference between British and American comedies. In British comedies there's no expectation that the main character will be likeable or relatable. The "lovable idiot" archetype is very much an American one... can't think why that would be. The British archetype for a comic main character is a smug idiot who thinks he's clever but ends up digging himself further and further into trouble in a misguided attempt to maneuver his way out of responsibility. The situations evolve because of the characters rather than the characters evolve because of the situations.

One successful British thing that I don't like though is Sherlock.

The writing and acting is far too goofy to be effectively dramatic and it's far too self-satisfied to be funny for more than fleeting moments. Moriarty in particular doesn't really work for me because he tries to be both playful and sinister without being genuinely threatening or particularly witty.

It also doesn't really work as a mystery/ detective show because the solutions are almost all really narratively unsatisfying.

I actually don't really like any adaptation of Sherlock Holmes and I think his brand of "logic" is really fucking annoying but the modern Sherlock is extra annoying because of how clever it thinks it is.

Hawki:

Squilookle:

And finally the Indiana Jones trilogy isn't perfect.

I thought it was a quadrilogy? :p

Four Jones movies? What an active imagination you have there!

image

Definitely agree with you though on Tron Legacy and Prince of Persia. While I've almost entirely forgotten PoP- I was entertained throughout and didn't think any of it was wasting my time.

K12:

Squilookle:
Nice one.

I'll hit the ground running here and say that among all those brilliant British comedies, Fawlty Towers is a steaming turd.
It's literally 'idiot tries to do some thing his way. Said thing blows up in his face in front of everyone. Idiot is supposed to be likable'. Its the same shit every episode, and he never learns. Never grows, tries to better relate to anyone or anything.

This kind of shows the main difference between British and American comedies. In British comedies there's no expectation that the main character will be likeable or relatable. The "lovable idiot" archetype is very much an American one... can't think why that would be. The British archetype for a comic main character is a smug idiot who thinks he's clever but ends up digging himself further and further into trouble in a misguided attempt to maneuver his way out of responsibility. The situations evolve because of the characters rather than the characters evolve because of the situations.

That's not really a difference between British and US comedy though. Like I said, Curb follows the exact same formula. The main cast of Seinfeld were not mean to be likeable- so much so that we're supposed to feel their ultimate fate was deserved. Also how many British main characters are actually smug? Chris Barrie plays a few sure, The Mighty Boosh perhaps, but otherwise they usually just seem aware of their own abilities and are exasperated by the idiots around them, like Black Books, IT Crowd, Blackadder etc.

Episodic shows tend to get the reset button effect a lot with their characters, I get that, but when your own flaws and life lessons are so unabashedly on display every episode, to see no change whatsoever is nothing but frustrating.

Avatar, the James Cameron movie, is better as a tech demo than it is as a film. The plot is terrible and I wanted to hang the main character off a lamp post by the end due to the fact that he is even worse than Benedict Arnold and Vidkun Quisling combined. He turned his back on the human race (pertinently the people who gave him that spiffy body that he is wearing) because the mining dudes and the security team were assholes? Fine I can sort of see that. Aboragating his mission to find a PEACEFUL solution because he was too busying having Navi head tentacle sex? The blood of all the people who died in that fight are on his hands to some degree. Are you sure he's the hero? Also, unobtainium is too important. This time it is a mining operation, when word gets back to Earth (because he also let some survivors leave), the next expedition will likely be a genocidal military operation. Practically everyone sympathetic to the Navi stayed on Pandora, there are little to few people who would contradict an extremely skewed version of events.

Harry Potter literally runs on stupid. A lot of the dangers Harry and co get into are basically due to adult negligence. Dumbledore does not come across as a wise mentor but as an evil or senile old man cosplaying as one. He stuck Harry into the Dursley household and did not check on him for years. After a childhood of abuse, what makes him think that Harry would not become the next Tom Riddle? It was a miracle that Harry was as sweet and well-adjusted as he was (which was not much but at least above zero). If Harry had not met his friends but was instead bullied during his time in Hogwarts since a bloody hat determines your House, he might have just shrugged and become a Death Eater (a name I have always found unbearably pretentions) when offered. After all, the world is provably a dark and miserable place, why not just burn it down? Plenty of the problems could be solved by a man with a gun, Dumbledore actually doing his job as headmaster or a person equipped with pepper spray.

Star Trek never did it for me, that kind of Utopianism is patently unrealistic. Humans are bastards who can rise above their base desires but for the whole species to basically go hippie? No way in hell. Not in a million years. Star Trek is making the assumption that given a matter replicator, most people would not simply make enough drugs to get high forever or use a holodeck as their personal masturbatory fantasy generator.

-2010>2001 (for the films, it's the opposite for the books.

Johnny Novgorod:

I love reading and prefer my books as actual books, not as .docs or audiologs.

Ditto. But my shelves hate me for it.

CrazyGirl17:

-I prefer dubs over subs. I don't mind subtitles, but I'd prefer to not constantly watch the screen all the time.

Ditto.

CrazyGirl17:

-Also, shows like Family Guy and Teen Titans go have been running for too long, and I stand by that.

That's unpopular?

McElroy:
I mean, I know you have that list written down since I've seen you post it before, but notes about Episode V too? How big are these archives of yours?

Actually it isn't pre-written. You've probably seen those entries before as this isn't the first time this topic has come up, but I wrote it out again here - it's simply a case of me still having the same opinions. Even Ep. 5 is a case of writing it up on the spot. I mean, I've always felt meh about Empire, and it wasn't until I rewatched the six main Star Wars films in 2015 (in preparation for TFA) that I found myself able to articulate why.

Xsjadoblayde:
WESTWORLD!!

It's not perfect. But it's fucking brilliant.

That's unpopular?

Well, anyway, Westworld is pretty damn awesome.

Ironman126:

Was this not already the established opinion? I thought that everyone thought this.

Eh, no? Ask people what the worst Star Wars movie is and they'll usually say Phantom or Clones. Revenge tends to rank higher than its prequel contemporaries, some even putting it into top tier listing.

FF7 is overrated.

Game of Thrones isn't very enjoyable.

The Who/Aerosmith/The Rolling Stones are all mediocre bands with a handful of solid songs.

One Piece is okay.
Bleach sucks.
Naruto got boring, fast.

Ozzy best music was in the 90s/00s (not that the 80s stuff was bad, just not as good).

Dio's Black Sabbath (AKA: Heaven & Hell) weren't worthy of the name 'Black Sabbath' when they were using it.

Princess Diana wasn't any amazing person.

Nearly all of the 'Modern Warfare' Call of Duty games have sucked.

There hasn't been a GOOD DC Cinematic Universe movie. Wonder Woman was a solid C at best.

Breaking Bad kind of bored me, barely made it past the first season.

I liked the ending to Dexter.

-I hate Star Wars, it's literally unwatchable for me. I hate just about all the characters from the annoying robots to annoying Chewbacca. Yoda's backwards talking, so annoying as well. Luke is so plain and uninteresting. Han is fine but he's paired with Chewy so...

-I find anime to have about a 99.9% chance of being crap (well above Sturgeon's law) and I've been burned on anime more than anything else by a large margin. And, I'm talking shows/movies that have basically a consensus rating of being a masterpiece like Neon Genesis Evangelion sitting at an IMDB of 8.6 to Elfen Lied sitting at an 8.1. Elfen Lied was so bad and so short I couldn't stop watching it because it was a train wreck that I couldn't look away from. Just recently, I gave The Girl Who Leapt Through Time a shot because it's only a movie so a low time commitment, that was hot garbage yet rated so highly. I want to try new things whether it's anime or something else, but the ratings make no sense. Never have I seen anything else rated 8+ on IMDB that is complete and utter garbage except for anime. I want to want to try new anime because there are some great ones out there like Ghost in the Shell: SAC, which is one of my favorite TV shows of all time.

ObsidianJones:
The Following will be a Rant over my most Unpopular Media Opinion, my hate for Batman. But please, share your thoughts about your most unpopular opinion in regards to Media.

I just don't get why people let other people ruin things they like. I literally have no idea what any fandom of the things I cherish are like. Firefly is my favorite show, I have no clue what the fandom is like or how they are even perceived, I couldn't care less.

Jojos bizarre adventure has never been good and will never be good
trigger is mediocre at best and they've never produced a stand out show
breaking bad was an awful show
george rr martin is not a good writer and the show handled the characters better than the books
young adult novels are almost always complete garbage
the call of duty and battlefield series were always bad
"shipping" culture around childrens cartoons is disgusting and awful
cowboy bebop is dull and unlikable
ditto for firefly
the prequel trilogy is on part with the ot
too many boardgames are priced $50 above what they should be just so that they can shoehorn in a bunch of shitty minis that won't even look good with paint
ticket to ride is on par with monopoly on how awful it is
ditto for settlers of catan
nendoroids are a waste of plastic (but still preferable to funko pops)

The Matrix trilogy is not deep and philosophical, and the best film of the three is the second one

Commando is the best thing ever put on film: spoilers below.

It has prime Arnie doing exactly what hes good at. Talking shit, punching people, throwing them around, dropping one liners and and shooting massive guns.

Hes deadly, funny and likable.

When you think it cannot get any better hes cornered and wounded, the villain has a gun while Arnie hasnt. How do you fix this? You can't but Arnies massive balls mean he calls him a pussy and convinces him to throw the gun away so they can knife fight to the death. Bravo sir, Bravo.

Its easier to say you think something popular is over rated.

Marter:
The Scorpion King 3: Battle for Redemption is the best movie of forever.

It's only an unpopular opinion because most people haven't seen it.

:)

Can you really say its better than commando? I love the rock as much as the next man but arnie in his prime?

Battlefield is neither better nor more difficult then Call of Duty.

Hawki:
People have started to leave more than one unpopular opinion per thread, so okay, I'll chip in:

I'm sure there's others I can think of, but they're the ones off the top of my head.

Silentpony:

Hawki:
Most unpopular eh? Hmm...Okay. Here's one...

The Empire Strikes Back is the weakest Star Wars OT film.

Interesting opinion. Why so?

Oh, so we get to ask the hows and whys here? Excellent. I can now grill everyone. ^_^

But as for my opinion here...well, here's the thing. Empire doesn't really have any major flaws in the same way that, say, Phantom or Clones has, and it's arguably a less flawed movie than Jedi. However, I do have the following gripes with the movie:

So, yeah. I don't think Empire is a bad film, and it does take my #4 Star Wars film spot. And as you can tell, a lot of these gripes are subjective, and I do admit that Jedi probably has more flaws. But Jedi also has higher highs than Empire for me, and Empire...there's something about the film that just feels off to me. Very unpopular opinion (hence why I chose it), but I'm afraid all I can be is honest.

What cliche does Cameron's Avatar subvert?

Here goes....

Death to Smoochy was an entertaining dark comedy.

Final Fantasy: Spirits Within is a decent film. It's just not a final fantasy film and should never have been called such. Trying to sell it as part of the final fantasy series just alienated fans and non-fans for totally different reasons.

Blade Runner is an okay film that's much better technically then it is a film. Plenty of other works(Final Fantasy IX, Westworld, etc) cover the same ground/ideas and do it far better. It's the definition of "Less then the sum of it's parts". "Tears in the Rain" is great but much of the rest of the film does not hold up to it.

Saints Row 3 is a worthy game in the series that suffers from some poor pacing(half the game are activities that are made mandatory to introduce said activity), the gameplay and story segregation is all over the place and the best endgame is the non-canonical one locked behind making a really stupid decision(letting Shaundi die so you can kill a man who you already defeated for reasons).

Call of Duty: Advenced Warfare was the last good game in the series, mostly because the series decided to go "Fuck it! Let's pretend this is a James Bond game!". Kevin Spacey as a morally grey bond villain who kind of had a good point which is ruined by some of the late game evilness(the concentration/prison camp). And yes, the QTE's were often really stupid.

That being said, Infinite Warfare was a decent game, with a cool idea shackled to a crappy execution and a terrible bland Shouty Jon Snow of a villain.

The 90s Disney Beauty and the Beast was a terrifying tale of what Stockholm Syndrome can do to a person. That movie was written by means of a 'fill in the blanks' type of script; guy is a distant loner and an asshole but has some redeeming qualities the woman can see and these qualities ultimately take over and redeem the character as a whole. Except they forgot to put in these very important redeeming qualities. Never does he change his act until the end. What ended up the villain of that movie, I thought was going to be the hero. That beast needed to be slaughtered.

Now the new version with Emma Watson it seems is very busy with changing the script so that the beast actually redeems itself before it's too late, but it still carries the stink of the original. The whole concept is weird.

I still maintain that 'A New Hope' is the best of the Star Wars movies and the only one that can carry its own weight. You have good guys, bad guys and a story that ended in such a way that there could have never been a sequel and the film would have been remembered fondly.

tippy2k2:
Oh, I haven't gotten to do this in a while! Yah!!!!

Dragon Age 2 was a good game. It had plenty of flaws but I firmly believe that the people who hate it hate it BECAUSE of the name and expectations, not because of the game itself. While I'm not going to quite go Greg "5/5" Tito on the setup, it was a solid game that didn't deserve the mountains of shit people threw at it.

Dragon Age II is one of those games that I feel would have been a lot better received if it hadn't been the direct sequel.

Call it Dragon Age: Kirkwall, leaving the potential of a proper sequel to come, and people would have liked Hawke's adventures a lot more.

As it was the whole thing just felt lacking, even the 'better' combat was near identical to that of the first game.

tippy2k2:
And now for the funner one...

I liked the Mass Effect 3 ending (pre-"fix"; I never even played the game after the supposed fixed ending so I have never even seen what changes were made). Maybe I just have a low tolerance for entertainment or maybe everything happened to fall in line perfectly with how my own story went but I thought that the Mass Effect 3 ending was not only tolerable but good.

Granted, it could have been better but I think that people were expecting "Suicide Mission" level of customization for all the decisions made over the trilogy, which is not what I had expected at all. But yeah, overall, I liked the ending of Mass Effect 3.

I always liked the ideas of the endings, not how I would have gone I admit, but I could appreciate the ideas behind them.

What I always find hard to believe though from people who liked the shipped endings, is that they liked the execution of them. We are told that our choices will drastically change the galaxy and then get shown three near identical sets of cinematics. Forget taking into account what happened during the trilogy, it's like Bioware didn't even take into account the one choice we made at the end.

Agent_Z:

What cliche does Cameron's Avatar subvert?

Cliche 1: Settings tropes

Explanation: This isn't technically a cliche, it's rather a trope, but I feel it's worth noting. Basically, science fiction can be broadly divided into "hard" and "soft" settings, and the writing in the setting usually matches the type of worldbuilding. Avatar however is a mix of hard sci-fi (mostly) with soft-type writing. Or, in other worlds, it's a fairy tale that's mixed with hard sci-fi, yet doesn't fall into the sci-fa genre. It's a type of combination I don't see often.

Cliche 2: Alien Invasions

Explanation: Avatar is essentially an alien invasion movie with the roles reversed. Now, alien invasion stories can be written well (e.g. War of the Worlds, how it functions narratively as well as being an allegory for imperialism, or whatever contemporary subject its adaptations felt like reflecting), but mostly, alien invasions boil down to "evil aliens invade, good humans must fight them." And that can be fun (e.g. Independence Day), but it's pulp sci-fi. Avatar reverses the roles, which would be rare (but not unheard of) enough, but doesn't do a complete 180. Humanity is 'invading' Pandora, but doing so in a way that feels less overtly villanous than what the genre usually provides. They try to converse with the na'vi, they hold back, they use force as a last resort (this becomes important later), but it's still an invasion. Space colonialism if you will. So while alien invasion stories are common, and human invasion stories not unheard of, Avatar's take on the subject is far more nuanced than what we're used to.

Cliche 3: Nature vs. Science

Avatar doesn't entirely escape this cliche, but it doesn't descend into it either, even if it would have been easy to do so. At various points, there's the idea of becoming one with nature, of abandoning science and putting faith in nature/whatever, and things will work out. FernGully is sort of an example of this, in that we have a binary divide between technology (Hexus controlling the bulldozer) and the natural world (it's Krysta's seed that stops him). Like I said, Avatar doesn't entirely escape this cliche, because there's the whole aspect of newbie Jake succeeding where Grace and co. have failed, and Eywa's hand in the battle at the end. Still, I count this as a cliche subverted, because while humans rely on advanced technology in the film, it's the same kind of advanced technology that allows the na'vi to prevail. Eywa can send out Pandoran life, but Jake's still the one that has to take out the Valkyrie with an M60 and grenades, not to mention that advanced science is the thing that allows his Avatar to exist at all.

Cliche 4: Humans are Special

There's a cliche/trope I despise in writing and that's "humans are special" (look it up on TV Tropes). There's some universes that pull this off, but they tend to be the exception rather than the rule. This ties in with the alien invasion genre as a whole - of course humanity is going to emerge unscathed, because don't ya know that humans rule? Like I said, some of these stories evade it (e.g. War of the Worlds - humanity only survives against the aliens due to luck), but again, Independence Day. In ID1, humanity succeeds where no other species has. In Resurgence, humanity is so damn awesome that the sphere wants us to lead the resistance of aliens that failed by virtue of not being human.

So that brings us to Avatar. Not only are humans space colonials, but they get kicked off Pandora. There's no reconciliation, or anything like that. Humanity loses unobtanium, and things on Earth will get worse. And why not? The universe doesn't care about humanity. There's no special reason why we should succeed. We tried, we failed, and we have to face the consequences. I know from EU material that isn't what ends up happening, but in the context of Avatar alone, it's a stark theme. Sometimes, only one species can survive. Humanity isn't owed survival. We have to earn it. And if we fail, too bad. I've seen people try to rationalize the RDA's activities on Pandora, but I have to ask, if the na'vi invaded us, would those attempts exist? There seems to be great uncomfortableness in humans being anything other than protagonists in sci-fi, and I know this from writing experience when I tried inverting Battle: Los Angeles for a sympathetic view on the aliens (who in the film are nothing more than generic evil alien invaders that are human heroes must kill because humans are so damn awesome and all that). Avatar isn't interested in that, and is a stronger movie for it.

Now, by this point, you may be asking "but what about how Avatar is basically Dances with Wolves/FernGully/Pocohantas in space?" And, okay, yeah, maybe, but I feel Avatar does enough with its premise that it feels fresh, not to mention that it's an updated take on the type of story, since the "hero going native" stories that came centuries ago didn't have to deal with the environmental crisis we're facing in the 21st century. That, and it succeeds on its writing/characterization/worldbuilding/themes/plot regardless.

bjj hero:
Commando is the best thing ever put on film

I agree, we should all celebrate.

Hawki:
snip

Hey, you said there were no archives, but I just checked your Fanfiction.net page. Oh boy, I have to say that I will no longer be surprised, and you are definitely one of the biggest geeks I've ever seen.

You can take that as a compliment.

I do have one more unpopular media opinion though: Logan is good, but it's excellent only when compared to other movies of the X-Men franchise.

Silentpony:

Hawki:
Most unpopular eh? Hmm...Okay. Here's one...

The Empire Strikes Back is the weakest Star Wars OT film.

Interesting opinion. Why so?

At that point it was decided it would become a trilogy, because of that it lacked an opening and an ending.
And suffered for it.

Warcraft was a good movie, but it would have been better if they'd skipped to the WoW time period, during or at the begining of The Burning Crusade xpac.

I thought Dragon Age 2 was a good game. It's the weakest in the series sure but it's like Captain America levels of week. It's not the best in the franchise but compared to a lot of other games it's still pretty good. The combat is fun, the story is pretty engaging, the characters are like normal Bioware characters and have depth to them, and the romances were fun too. There's plenty of things to criticize just as their is plenty of things to praise it for too.

I also thought Mass Effect 3 was a good game too. While I did think the ending sucked it wasn't enough of a negative to take away the other 95% of the game I loved.

life possesses inherent value.

If I were to consider myself a fan of anything it would be Batman.

However...

I really don't care if Batman kills bad guys, not that I think he should just that whenever he has in comics or film's it never bothered me.

Everything that supposedly makes The Joker such a great and iconic villain actually just serves to make him boring and impossible to engage with especially when he is as overexposed as he is currently.

As far as I'm concerned 'The Killing Joke' is the Jokers definitive origin, screw this "multiple choice" rubbish.

The Joker, Bane and Ras Al Ghul all fall at the bottom of my list of favourite Batman villains.

The Penguin is in my top three.

Batman: Arkham Origins is the best game in the series after Arkham Asylum.

Batman would lose to to every other member of the Justice League one on one.

Kodomo no Jikan is a deep coming of age story worth reading solely for the characters and plot.

People freak out over the fanservice elements too much but it's just intended to be comedic and not actually sexual because that's just a type of Japanese humor that's normal.

The actual char development in that series is extremely well-done (as it is written by a woman who has daughters, who had experience being a girl and is also raising her girls) hence if you actually try to read it with an open mind and no prejudice you can find a lot to love.

Hawki:

Xsjadoblayde:
WESTWORLD!!

It's not perfect. But it's fucking brilliant.

That's unpopular?

Well, anyway, Westworld is pretty damn awesome.

It's no way near popular enough. Which was my precise thinking when first viewing Breaking Bad and everybody I asked never heard of it. Granted, this is in non-internet circles.

Mechamorph:

Star Trek never did it for me, that kind of Utopianism is patently unrealistic. Humans are bastards who can rise above their base desires but for the whole species to basically go hippie? No way in hell. Not in a million years. Star Trek is making the assumption that given a matter replicator, most people would not simply make enough drugs to get high forever or use a holodeck as their personal masturbatory fantasy generator.

The Federation is a utopia? TNG depicted the Federation pretty awfully. Forced migration of a group of Native American colonists seeking to keep their culture alive. Allowing ridiculously powerful crime syndicates (like the Orion Syndicate) to basically own slaves, occupy entire star systems, and even skirmish into Federation space regularly ... yet thd Federation does nothing about it.

Arguably the only reason the Federation allows it is because they buy the pergium from places like Sapporo despite their slave trading. Also, I'm pretty cashed up and an occasional drug user. Yet I don't just do lines every hour of the day.

And I imagine precisely for that reason, holodecks would be restricted areas. Designed pretty much for just training simulators. I mean they seem to have entire planets deficated to pleasure. Holodecks for pleasure would seem to be only useful for ships expecting extending time at duty with limited capacities for shore leave.

The problem with your argument is it lacks relative argumentation. Our world, now, is a pretty 'Star Trek utopia' to someone 500 years ago. Democracies!? 'Police' officers that serve the public!? Due process!? Ending debtor prosons!? MOBILITY RIGHTS!?

After all, Thomas Hobbes believed that democracies would be inadequate for protecting civil liberty, that you needed a hypothetical absolute monarch to demand and enforce them to the exclusion of any populist means to annul... He'd think our democracies are 'utopian stupidity'. That was just over only three centuries ago.

ST is 200 years in the future. Best not to discount what we might achieve by then in terms of civil liberty.

Public education, universal healthcare... advanced capitalist marketplaces survive them. Voting for women. Age and invalid pensions. Ending conscription. Public housing. And so on...

And sure... in 200 years the future to us now will look like some Star Trek utopia, and there be two people on the neuronet ... one saying Dimension Quest utopianism is stupid, free g-mods and neuroprosthetics is a fantasy because people are jerks... and another person telling you how garbage it was back in the 20th century.

I do agree however that we won't likely ever meet alien life that matches our intelligence.

Phoenixmgs:

ObsidianJones:
The Following will be a Rant over my most Unpopular Media Opinion, my hate for Batman. But please, share your thoughts about your most unpopular opinion in regards to Media.

I just don't get why people let other people ruin things they like. I literally have no idea what any fandom of the things I cherish are like. Firefly is my favorite show, I have no clue what the fandom is like or how they are even perceived, I couldn't care less.

I explained in my post.

I personally don't care what people enjoy. Everyone should like what they do. Everyone loves chocolate and I can't stand the stuff. But I want them to like chocolate. Same thing with Cheese.

But that's where the problem comes in.

Since everyone LOVES cheese, Cheese is everywhere. Literally, I'm regulated to maybe a quarter of a menu when I go out to eat because everyone tries to sneak cheese into almost every menu item. That's the problem I have with Batman due to his fans. Because there are so many fans of Batman, they try to put him in more where he doesn't belong.

They keep touting him to be a normal human, but a normal human that can keep up with Gods, Robots, and Amazons. And not only keep up, but outpace them regularly.

Hawkeye and Black Widow know they can't keep up, so they don't go for the end goal and help from the sides. Fine. I get that. Everyone has their place due to what they can do. But because no one in fiction is as popular as Batman now, Batman gets center billing and characters become dumber so Batman can win or at least compete.

-See my comment about Superman's Super Speed. If he can run in Super Speed, he can process things much faster. Why let Batman drop a grenade at all?

-Darkseid has world ending Omega Beams that he regularly uses to destroy anything that even bothers him without moving a muscle. It's basically his version of hello. What Does Darkseid do when they HAVE to shoehorn Batman into the final fight of Brainiac-Merged Darkseid (literally probably the most powerful version of him up to that point)?

He throws him casually. Not through a Building. Not his amazing Omega Beams that are neigh impossible to dodge by the fastest of people and most agile of all beings (but yet, human Batman can do it). Not grab Batman with one hand and pulp him easily with his ungodly power. Just a casual hip toss.

-Batman beats the shit out of all of the Turtles at the same time

-Batman beats the Hulk by kicking the INVULNERABLE HULK SO. DAMN. HARD... that the Hulk feels it and is forced to gasp for breath, breathing in knock out gas.

To put that in perspective. Here's the Hulk getting hit twice by Thor with Mjolnir and not slowing down or even being really phased.

Fuck, Batman vs Superman is literally a movie because people wanted to prove how much better Batman is since they wanted their hero to usurp the position of top billing Hero in the DC universe.

I don't care if fans love anything more than anything else. But when writers, producers, and developers start putting nerf hammers down on the entire universe so that thing or character can get more focus, it's a middle finger to everyone else who might like anything else in that universe. Too bad you're not on the hype train. Watch your unpopular get inexplicably wreck by the New Hype.

Batman ruins fiction because everyone wants him to win. That's why the fans matter in this case.

The Fool's Errand (1987) is GOAT.

ObsidianJones:

Phoenixmgs:

ObsidianJones:
The Following will be a Rant over my most Unpopular Media Opinion, my hate for Batman. But please, share your thoughts about your most unpopular opinion in regards to Media.

I just don't get why people let other people ruin things they like. I literally have no idea what any fandom of the things I cherish are like. Firefly is my favorite show, I have no clue what the fandom is like or how they are even perceived, I couldn't care less.

I explained in my post.

I personally don't care what people enjoy. Everyone should like what they do. Everyone loves chocolate and I can't stand the stuff. But I want them to like chocolate. Same thing with Cheese.

But that's where the problem comes in.

Since everyone LOVES cheese, Cheese is everywhere. Literally, I'm regulated to maybe a quarter of a menu when I go out to eat because everyone tries to sneak cheese into almost every menu item. That's the problem I have with Batman due to his fans. Because there are so many fans of Batman, they try to put him in more where he doesn't belong.

They keep touting him to be a normal human, but a normal human that can keep up with Gods, Robots, and Amazons. And not only keep up, but outpace them regularly.

Hawkeye and Black Widow know they can't keep up, so they don't go for the end goal and help from the sides. Fine. I get that. Everyone has their place due to what they can do. But because no one in fiction is as popular as Batman now, Batman gets center billing and characters become dumber so Batman can win or at least compete.

-See my comment about Superman's Super Speed. If he can run in Super Speed, he can process things much faster. Why let Batman drop a grenade at all?

-Darkseid has world ending Omega Beams that he regularly uses to destroy anything that even bothers him without moving a muscle. It's basically his version of hello. What Does Darkseid do when they HAVE to shoehorn Batman into the final fight of Brainiac-Merged Darkseid (literally probably the most powerful version of him up to that point)?

He throws him casually. Not through a Building. Not his amazing Omega Beams that are neigh impossible to dodge by the fastest of people and most agile of all beings (but yet, human Batman can do it). Not grab Batman with one hand and pulp him easily with his ungodly power. Just a casual hip toss.

-Batman beats the shit out of all of the Turtles at the same time

-Batman beats the Hulk by kicking the INVULNERABLE HULK SO. DAMN. HARD... that the Hulk feels it and is forced to gasp for breath, breathing in knock out gas.

To put that in perspective. Here's the Hulk getting hit twice by Thor with Mjolnir and not slowing down or even being really phased.

Fuck, Batman vs Superman is literally a movie because people wanted to prove how much better Batman is since they wanted their hero to usurp the position of top billing Hero in the DC universe.

I don't care if fans love anything more than anything else. But when writers, producers, and developers start putting nerf hammers down on the entire universe so that thing or character can get more focus, it's a middle finger to everyone else who might like anything else in that universe. Too bad you're not on the hype train. Watch your unpopular get inexplicably wreck by the New Hype.

Batman ruins fiction because everyone wants him to win. That's why the fans matter in this case.

Most comic-book writing is dumb logic. Not for critical thinking. I would recommend not wasting the neurons over it too much. (But I understand what you mean about Batman's fan/plot armour).

Xsjadoblayde:
Most comic-book writing is dumb logic. Not for critical thinking. I would recommend not wasting the neurons over it too much. (But I understand what you mean about Batman's fan/plot armour).

I AM A GEEK AND A NERD, YOU CAN NOT TELL ME WHERE TO PUT MY UNYIELDING CRITICISM!!!!

But no, you're absolutely right. I'm fully aware of inconsistencies. But that's even more why I am so bugged by the fans. Because they can't say in one breath "I love Batman because he's a normal human" and then "He would easily be able to beat a Space God!!!!" and expect me to take them or anything they stand for seriously again in life.

Addendum_Forthcoming:

Mechamorph:

Star Trek never did it for me, that kind of Utopianism is patently unrealistic. Humans are bastards who can rise above their base desires but for the whole species to basically go hippie? No way in hell. Not in a million years. Star Trek is making the assumption that given a matter replicator, most people would not simply make enough drugs to get high forever or use a holodeck as their personal masturbatory fantasy generator.

The Federation is a utopia? TNG depicted the Federation pretty awfully. Forced migration of a group of Native American colonists seeking to keep their culture alive. Allowing ridiculously powerful crime syndicates (like the Orion Syndicate) to basically own slaves, occupy entire star systems, and even skirmish into Federation space regularly ... yet thd Federation does nothing about it.

Arguably the only reason the Federation allows it is because they buy the pergium from places like Sapporo despite their slave trading. Also, I'm pretty cashed up and an occasional drug user. Yet I don't just do lines every hour of the day.

And I imagine precisely for that reason, holodecks would be restricted areas. Designed pretty much for just training simulators. I mean they seem to have entire planets deficated to pleasure. Holodecks for pleasure would seem to be only useful for ships expecting extending time at duty with limited capacities for shore leave.

The problem with your argument is it lacks relative argumentation. Our world, now, is a pretty 'Star Trek utopia' to someone 500 years ago. Democracies!? 'Police' officers that serve the public!? Due process!? Ending debtor prosons!? MOBILITY RIGHTS!?

After all, Thomas Hobbes believed that democracies would be inadequate for protecting civil liberty, that you needed a hypothetical absolute monarch to demand and enforce them to the exclusion of any populist means to annul... He'd think our democracies are 'utopian stupidity'. That was just over only three centuries ago.

ST is 200 years in the future. Best not to discount what we might achieve by then in terms of civil liberty.

Public education, universal healthcare... advanced capitalist marketplaces survive them. Voting for women. Age and invalid pensions. Ending conscription. Public housing. And so on...

And sure... in 200 years the future to us now will look like some Star Trek utopia, and there be two people on the neuronet ... one saying Dimension Quest utopianism is stupid, free g-mods and neuroprosthetics is a fantasy because people are jerks... and another person telling you how garbage it was back in the 20th century.

I do agree however that we won't likely ever meet alien life that matches our intelligence.

Well this is the thread for unpopular opinions isn't it? ;)

No, I do not think that the Federation is a Utopia, rather that the underlying assumptions behind its foundational philosophy is Utopian, as in the philosophy not the state of being.

The thing is the changes you ascribe to our "utopian" state vis a vis people from hundreds of years ago are not all new things. Democracy is from Ancient Athens, police officers have been around one way or another in some form for quite a while as well (albeit not always employed by the State), due process was arguably part of the Code of Hammurabi (circa 3000BC Sumeria), debtor prisons still exist albeit part of the larger penitentiary system (go ahead and default on all of your debts, see what happens. Especially outside of a Western Liberal Democracy) and mobility rights had long been a thing although not necessarily extended to everyone; an Imperial Roman citizen for example could move from Italy to Hispania with relative ease.

Public education? Several civilizations had them. Universal healthcare? Made possible only through modern advances in medicine, before that it was one part superstition, one part hope and one part empirical method. Many of society's changes over history are predictable given how our technology evolved. Now riddle me this, what do you think post-scarcity would do to the people? We can make practically anything given a replicator. We can go anywhere on a planet with a transporter, we can live any fantasy through a holodeck, anti-matter supplies all the energy we need and work? Does the Federation even have money? To buy what? How would you even prevent people from building holodecks? All it takes is one guy leaking the plans on their version of the internet and a replicator can make the parts if not the holodeck wholesale for an industrial sized relicator. There is a reason why many episodes of Star Trek's earlier incarnations had to handwave away reasons for their technology not to work just to maintain dramatic tension.

Just holodecks, transporters and replicators alone would remove most of the manufacturing, logistics and resource extraction jobs. Increasingly powerful computers would take care of a lot of white collar jobs too. What does this do for employment in the Federation? What sort of work do most people do? It looks like it would mainly be skilled labour, the ultimate knowledge economy. And the fact of the matter is that it would very difficult to generate enough jobs for the seven billion we have on Earth let alone the population in some sci-fi future.

Yes, we have drug addicts today. Now imagine that your drugs were free, made to order in the comfort of your house. Any hit you want. Any time you want. What if you had no job or a part time job? Or one that was undemanding or boring? Holodecks are also free to use if you want to decline recreational biochemistry. We are beginning to see the cusp of free, endless on-demand entertainment but the modern internet is small potatoes compared to Star Trek's technology. I dunno, but throughout history give the people consequence free indulgence in luxury and they will. Many Chinese dynasties fell because the Emperor was too busy playing with concubines rather than governing. Imperial Romans were not even found in the Legions by the end of the Empire. They were busy mimicking the Epicureans and their vomitoriums.

Also it is not a particularly good argument to say that just because modern society does not look like older society this would somehow entail that the Federation would exist just because it's not the same as our society. That's akin to a false equivalency statement. More pertinently society had seen relatively little change for quite some time during the High Middle Ages. So there was change, just that it was in slow spurts. If we are speaking speculatively, there is an argument to be made that we are reaching a plateau where our breakneck technological advancement will slow down to a relative crawl. I have even seen some academics believe that we are headed towards technological stagnation with refinement of existing technologies being the norm rather than important new innovations popping up every few years.

ObsidianJones:

I AM A GEEK AND A NERD, YOU CAN NOT TELL ME WHERE TO PUT MY UNYIELDING CRITICISM!!!!

But no, you're absolutely right. I'm fully aware of inconsistencies. But that's even more why I am so bugged by the fans. Because they can't say in one breath "I love Batman because he's a normal human" and then "He would easily be able to beat a Space God!!!!" and expect me to take them or anything they stand for seriously again in life.

I doubt your geek/nerd status...do you have your official documents and photo verification??
Fandoms are curious emergent social structures...sort of like mild variations of cult thinking perhaps, far less threatening and enveloping (mostly), but no less illogical. Could be why I avoid looking into them for my own preferred material. Batman has become a victim of its' own pop-culture status it would seem.

I think Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice is one of the best, if not the best superhero movie ever made. But we've been over this.

I think Star Wars: A New Hope is the only truly great Star Wars movie. Some of the other ones are pretty good but New Hope set a standard they never lived up to.

Oh: Lord of the Rings is extremely overrated and for the most part doesn't hold up that well. It's a simple story weighed down by a wealth of overly complicated lore, mostly underdeveloped characters that lack in genuine humanity, a depiction of various fantasy races that carries some rather unpleasant connotation from a modern perspective (There's a reason rightists keep using it for their shitty memes, folks) and a lot of extraneous details that make what's ultimately a simple adventure story a pretty clunky read.

Surprisingly, I still enjoy The Hobbit a lot. Shame about the movies.

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