GistoftheFist:
Do you know or call 'crime scene cleaners'? People who handle the bodies and cleaning up the blood and such. Most people assume it's the officer's job to clean up all the nastiness but it isn't.

What does someone do if the police don't seem very willing to help? A few years ago I was walking home from school when a black SUV pulled near the curb and the passenger threw a handful of broken glass in my face. I was wearing sunglasses so no shards got in my eyes but it still hurt. I managed to get the license plate (148 LND, i'll never forget it) and called the police station to report it, but whoever I talked to didn't seem to care very much. I got "there's really not a whole lot we can do but we'll look into it" as an answer. I would see that SUV with the same two douchebags driving around once in a while months after that.

Crime Scene Cleaners in the last 6 or 7 years has actually become an over saturated marketplace in the united states. There was some sort of movie that popularized how the initial investment of the very lucrative field isn't that bad. (it costs about as much as starting up a construction contractor business) Problem is now there are so many of them they have to price more competitively. They are usually only called if there is a biohazard mess. Two of the companies my dept uses are family owned and have about 3 employees each. This is all a town of 500,000 really needs.

The other one you have to realize it's your word against his. There are no other witnesses or evidence an overburdened dept can sometimes ignore things like that. It's a fact of life. It sucks. I always at least make a GESTURE that I tried. It helps people feel a little better.

thaluikhain:
Hmmm...gone through the thread, very informative, and although the question of weapons has come up a few times, nobody seems to have asked about what other bits and pieces you carry around that helps in your job. Was wondering, do US detectives keep anything unusual in their pockets?

Most detectives keep a sketch pad/note pad (or PDA if their younger and more tech savvy) at all times, many also have something to record people during street interviews. Disposable non-latex gloves (latex leaves a powder residue). I'd say 75% of all detectives also keep cigarettes and the means to light them. Not because they smoke (though most do) but it makes you seem friendly if you offer a smoke.

Many are also very superstitious and keep a lucky coin/pen something like that.

I make my own damn luck.

ace_of_something:
They are usually only called if there is a biohazard mess. Two of the companies my dept uses are family owned and have about 3 employees each. This is all a town of 500,000 really needs.

Unless there were more gory murders...Just sayin'...

Does your squad car have one of those fancy laptops? Also, are you a union member?

ace_of_something:
I couldn't tell you the science behind it all and don't quote me if I turn out to be wrong. But blood is easier to contaminate and only gets you down to people in the same blood line (not an individual) which can be a problem. I'll see if I can't find you a better answer by asking people who know more.

My guess would be that blood has less DNA per unit volume. The vast majority of cells in a blood sample, red blood cells (erythrocytes if you want to sound fancy), are anucleated. They have no nucleus and no DNA. So a small sample may not contain any nucleated cells, or the few nucleated cells might die if it starts coagulating. Semen is obviously filled with millions of DNA carrying swimmers. Quick check at wikipedia reference ranges says there are about over four orders of magnitude more nucleated cells in semen per mL.

ace_of_something:

I couldn't tell you the science behind it all and don't quote me if I turn out to be wrong. But blood is easier to contaminate and only gets you down to people in the same blood line (not an individual) which can be a problem. I'll see if I can't find you a better answer by asking people who know more.

There are a couple of factors for that:
A.) Semen has a much higher concentration of DNA per unit volume (far smaller cells packed into a much thicker solution)
B.) Gametes (sperm cells and eggs) only have one set of chromosomes rather than the standard doubled pairs. When testing DNA, they use enzymes that snip the coding at locations with a specific data sequence. A single strand is slightly easier for those enzymes to deal with than a full helix, reducing error bars.
C.) Gametes contain ALL of the coding for an individual. Most specialized cells like blood cells only contain a portion of it, which also makes narrowing down to only one individual more difficult.

Heronblade:
There are a couple of factors for that:
B.) Gametes (sperm cells and eggs) only have one set of chromosomes rather than the standard doubled pairs. When testing DNA, they use enzymes that snip the coding at locations with a specific data sequence. A single strand is slightly easier for those enzymes to deal with than a full helix, reducing error bars.
C.) Gametes contain ALL of the coding for an individual. Most specialized cells like blood cells only contain a portion of it, which also makes narrowing down to only one individual more difficult.

Restriction enzymes (used in DNA fingerprinting) only cut at double stranded DNA. This is why they're almost always palindromic, both strands have the same sequence. Also, gametes don't contain homologous chromosomes, but their DNA is still double stranded.

Here's the most common restriction enzyme used in texts, EcoRI:

All nucleated cells contain all the genetic material, at least. A kidney tubule (or cheek swab) cell has all the DNA required to become a brain cell. The difference is only in the expressed genes. They're there, just not doing anything.

How would you feel if say, something/someone like Inquisitors from W40k existed?

If you don't know anything about 40k, it's basically an Investigator who is sanctioned by the government. He is encouraged to work within local laws but has the authority to conduct his investigation in whatever way he feels best, and is allowed access to whatever local or government resources he feels necessary.

If he wanted to go undercover and be low key, he can; if he wants to call in the military and have them smash doors down and make arrests without warrants or any reason, he can do so.

They wouldn't be someone who tries to take down joe the pot peddler who works on the corner of 5th and shyster. They'd be in charge of taking down major criminal organizations or operation. (a drug cartel for instance)

What would you do with that kind of power? Or would you refuse it, knowing that it would only lead to trouble? Hell, would you work under someone like that? Or for a government that would employ such a person?

GenericAmerican:
How would you feel if say, something/someone like Inquisitors from W40k existed?

If you don't know anything about 40k, it's basically an Investigator who is sanctioned by the government. He is encouraged to work within local laws but has the authority to conduct his investigation in whatever way he feels best, and is allowed access to whatever local or government resources he feels necessary.

Er, since when are Inquisitors encouraged to act within local laws? Some might do that, but they are under no obligation whatsoever to adhere to anyone's rules but their own. They are totally beyond the law.

In context, they are forever using extreme measures because of the extreme circumstances. If they aren't resorting to mass murder, they don't really fit the bill (on the other hand, unless LA is overrun by aliens or daemons, it doesn't work either).

Dags90:

Restriction enzymes (used in DNA fingerprinting) only cut at double stranded DNA. This is why they're almost always palindromic, both strands have the same sequence. Also, gametes don't contain homologous chromosomes, but their DNA is still double stranded.

Here's the most common restriction enzyme used in texts, EcoRI:

All nucleated cells contain all the genetic material, at least. A kidney tubule (or cheek swab) cell has all the DNA required to become a brain cell. The difference is only in the expressed genes. They're there, just not doing anything.

...

Upon review, I've come to the conclusion that I need to go and get a refund for this bloody Biology textbook of mine, which still says almost exactly what I did, and possibly for the related courses I took. This is the second time I found I have been fed questionable information.

trollpwner:
I have to say this has been a very informative and interesting thread. However, I do wonder: you do frequently refer to an "us and them" mentality between the police and the public. What do you think causes this and what do you think would help fix it?

CAPTCHA: Come clean.

Oh wow. Interesting timing much?

*deep breath*

I'm trying to think of the most concise way to say what causes the us v. them thought process but it isn't easy to explain.

Day in day out as an officer your every move is scrutinized by your partner, superior, the mayor whatever one screw up your career is over, one mistake and the whole world calls for your blood. Now more than ever with this new trend of people video taping half an officer encounter and cutting out the parts that tell the whole story. Then there's the knowing that if you screw up. People's lives can be shattered. People's treasured possessions lost for ever. People could die. The pressure is not for the faint of heart.

Then you get a call about say, a gang shooting, you go there, you have 20 witnesses but no one saw anything... you think "why won't they help us don't they know what's at stake?"

Right there you've entered part of the process that separates you from the public. I believe the best way to stop this is something called 'community' policing (i'm a huge, vocal, activist for it in our dept) Essentially it means listening to the community and eventually they won't see you as the enemy either.

Me and a couple other guys some years ago spearheaded a survey for some of the most crime ridden neighborhoods to see what people were most concerned about we got something like 9,000 responses. This neighborhood was one with a body count. Sons and daughters going to jail every day. The number #1 concern of this neighborhood by a wide margin more than half the people that responded said this was their big concern...

What do you think it was?

Once we focused on that particular problem the people in that area we never got calls from before were reporting crimes. They felt listened to and the door was open...

this sort of thing is the key to solving the problem.

Dags90:

ace_of_something:
They are usually only called if there is a biohazard mess. Two of the companies my dept uses are family owned and have about 3 employees each. This is all a town of 500,000 really needs.

Unless there were more gory murders...Just sayin'...

Does your squad car have one of those fancy laptops? Also, are you a union member?

As a detective I know longer drive a 'squad car' I drive one of the unmarked cars. My station has about 12 of them they're all ugly as sin by typically under the hood they are unreasonably good and souped up. All of them are as of 6 months ago equipped with a touch screen in console computer. The squad cars still have the laptops.

I'm a union REP unions are essential for law enforcement. Guess how many times I've been sued? (never once lost btw) 3 times! I've had stuff that hasn't made it past a grand jury like 10 times as well. Usually it involves use of force. I'm what is called a 'lawsuit rod' because I'm a tall and big. Officers who are larger tend to get accused of being rough more often cuz people perceive everything you do as more 'powerful'. When a 5'10" takes a cracked out woman to the ground to handcuff her 'he did what he had to' if a 6'6" guy does it he's 'being a bully he could've done something else'
Thankfully I'm part of the union who will pay for my attorney otherwise most cops would be broke. That and they fight for making the work conditions bearable. Without union involvement the dangerous often times thankless job of being an officer would have even more people quitting in the first 2 years than it already does.

Are you familiar with the show The Wire? What are your thoughts? I hear it often praised for its realism, since it was written by a police reporter with assistance from a former homicide cop.
Great thread by the way!