Being Fat isn't Bad

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xXxJessicaxXx:
You could just say nothing at all...:/

I just think this thread has been more harm than help. Next time my councillor says 'It's okay to go out no one is staring at or judging you' I'll be sure to show them this thread and what people really think.

.. What? .. Harmful, how so if I may ask?

I don't understand- threads are to ask people's opinions while giving off your own opinion or viewpoint. You came to this thread knowing what it's about, yet you suggest I should of said nothing because some users are disagreeing with me..? That's silly, we wouldn't have debates then and no one would understand or learn from one another even if both parties agree on something.

Besides that, I think you're to worried about what society makes of you. That was exactly what I was talking about- who has a right to judge you? Mainly in this thread people are saying that losing weight is a wise choice but that's it (some are more detailed but I won't get into that). You're a great person :} don't let others tell you otherwise. If you dislike how you look or weigh then just take time getting that fixed. It's hard I know, but you can do for I have to do that everyday since I pig out on junk food lol.

Jogging works, push ups help, but the best method is to do a bit of working out while you push aside any sweets, drinks, or foods that have to much fattening in them. But you don't have to take my advise, I can hear you out in a PM if you want to talk about the issues at hand but yeah.

xXxJessicaxXx:

It's not exactly like you can prove you are working out or dieting in public though. People just as likely to tease a fat person eating a salad as they are someone eating a massive burger.
You can't win.

If you are actively trying to better yourself, then fuck em. As you get better the teasing will slow and eventually stop. But for the time being its something you have to deal with for letting yourself get so bad in the first place. Think of it as a penance.

BloatedGuppy:
snip

Okay, I acknowledge that there are a lot of legitimate health concerns here, but judging by a lot of other replies on this thread, it would appear most people taking umbrage with other people's weight are a lot less altruistically motivated shall we say. Even if they're more moderately overwieght if not necessarily obese, what upsets me is how many simply find fat people repulsive to look at. A lot of the concern seems to be coming from a very jejune and mean spirited place, I'll try to refrain from unabatedly voicing my feelings lest I get another warning, but the comment above about the overweight being 'worthy of disdain' makes me...uneasy to say the least. At this point, I acknowledge I'm really solely focusing on the appearance side of things rather than health issues, but I genuinely feel people will carry this kind of attitude over to those only moderately overweight or not so likely to risk major health problems. People as a whole are immensely shallow. You do make a lot of good points, people really don't take their health very seriously, I won't hesitate to admit that I'm guilty of that, the obesity rate is increasing at a pretty dangerous rate and there really ought to be something done about it at a higher level. Though at the same time I feel you underestimate just how much of the general public's indignation over this is based around aesthetics.

Caramel Frappe:
Being fat isn't really bad at all.. yes there are health risks but the primary issue is what people make of you.

No, you are wrong. The primary issue is being fat leads to SUBSTANTIAL health risk. You will die sooner (you didn't really want to see your kids grow up right?), the chance of many diseases go up, your quality of life is reduced (everything from more physically limited/difficulty in sex, to not fitting into rides/chairs/etc), increased chance of diabetes that can lead to blindness and limb amputation, permanent and cumulative knee and hip damage that can lead to needing hip and knee replacements, and so on.

Of course none of that hits the scopes of most people when they are teenagers, all they care about then is if it makes them feel bad and its when their body starts to fall apart that they recognize the real problem.

The one thing you have right is being "the perfect weight" or anorexic isn't a big deal, but being obese really is ("fat" of course means nothing, its one part of your body).

Kroxile:

xXxJessicaxXx:

It's not exactly like you can prove you are working out or dieting in public though. People just as likely to tease a fat person eating a salad as they are someone eating a massive burger.
You can't win.

If you are actively trying to better yourself, then fuck em. As you get better the teasing will slow and eventually stop. But for the time being its something you have to deal with for letting yourself get so bad in the first place. Think of it as a penance.

The reason my weight goes up and down is that I suffer from depression and I don't get much exercise because I don't like going out. I kind of have already suffered enough in my life not sure why I should have to suffer 'penance' aswell.

OmniscientOstrich:
Okay, I acknowledge that there are a lot of legitimate health concerns here, but judging by a lot of other replies on this thread, it would appear most people taking umbrage with other people's weight are a lot less altruistically motivated shall we say. Even if they're more moderately overwieght if not necessarily obese, what upsets me is how many simply find fat people repulsive to look at. A lot of the concern seems to be coming from a very jejune and mean spirited place, I'll try to refrain from unabatedly voicing my feelings lest I get another warning, but the comment above about the overweight being 'worthy of disdain' makes me...uneasy to say the least. At this point, I acknowledge I'm really solely focusing on the appearance side of things rather than health issues, but I genuinely feel people will carry this kind of attitude over to those only moderately overweight or not so likely to risk major health problems. People as a whole are immensely shallow. You do make a lot of good points, people really don't take their health very seriously, I won't hesitate to admit that I'm guilty of that, the obesity rate is increasing at a pretty dangerous rate and there really ought to be something done about it at a higher level. Though at the same time I feel you underestimate just how much of the general public's indignation over this is based around aesthetics.

I don't doubt that it is, but it's clouding the issue. When I tried to convince my girlfriend to stop smoking, it was as much because I hated how it made her smell as because I was worried about her health down the line. But that didn't mean that having her stop smoking wasn't highly desirable anyway regardless of how we arrived there.

The problem with letting this become a debate about the ethical merits of fat shaming is you end up with people taking the "Fuck you, I'll look how I want" stance, and eating themselves into a heart attack because they don't want to cave in to bullying.

I agree wholeheartedly that there's some really ugly shit that gets thrown around, and that people are quick to belittle and attack, and it's not helping anyone. But I don't want people lashing back by developing "fat pride" any more than I wanted my girlfriend to develop "smokers pride", because the behaviors that lead to being seriously overweight are so terribly, terribly bad for us.

Does that make sense?

No, actually it sucks, no need to explain why, there are too many reasons as to why it sucks and all of them are too obvious. Life became a lot more tolerable after i lost weight, i'm not saying that fat people are miserable or anything like that, but that was my experience during school days.

xXxJessicaxXx:
The reason my weight goes up and down is that I suffer from depression and I don't get much exercise because I don't like going out. I kind of have already suffered enough in my life not sure why I should have to suffer 'penance' aswell.

You don't have to go out to get exercise. I highly recommend a recumbent bike, or an elliptical. Both have an extremely high "actual exercise" to "perceived exercise" ratio, and you can use them while watching television/listening to music to help the time pass faster.

I lost 35 lbs in a little under two months doing nothing more than riding the recumbent and taking the occasional walk. And eating SLIGHTLY better.

Caramel Frappe:

xXxJessicaxXx:
You could just say nothing at all...:/

I just think this thread has been more harm than help. Next time my councillor says 'It's okay to go out no one is staring at or judging you' I'll be sure to show them this thread and what people really think.

.. What? .. Harmful, how so if I may ask?

I don't understand- threads are to ask people's opinions while giving off your own opinion or viewpoint. You came to this thread knowing what it's about, yet you suggest I should of said nothing because some users are disagreeing with me..? That's silly, we wouldn't have debates then and no one would understand or learn from one another even if both parties agree on something.

Besides that, I think you're to worried about what society makes of you. That was exactly what I was talking about- who has a right to judge you? Mainly in this thread people are saying that losing weight is a wise choice but that's it (some are more detailed but I won't get into that). You're a great person :} don't let others tell you otherwise. If you dislike how you look or weigh then just take time getting that fixed. It's hard I know, but you can do for I have to do that everyday since I pig out on junk food lol.

Jogging works, push ups help, but the best method is to do a bit of working out while you push aside any sweets, drinks, or foods that have to much fattening in them. But you don't have to take my advise, I can hear you out in a PM if you want to talk about the issues at hand but yeah.

Because you are just giving people a chance to say how much they hate fat people and how awful they are :/

xXxJessicaxXx:

Kroxile:

xXxJessicaxXx:

It's not exactly like you can prove you are working out or dieting in public though. People just as likely to tease a fat person eating a salad as they are someone eating a massive burger.
You can't win.

If you are actively trying to better yourself, then fuck em. As you get better the teasing will slow and eventually stop. But for the time being its something you have to deal with for letting yourself get so bad in the first place. Think of it as a penance.

The reason my weight goes up and down is that I suffer from depression and I don't get much exercise because I don't like going out. I kind of have already suffered enough in my life not sure why I should have to suffer 'penance' aswell.

Then its your own fault and you have no one else to blame but yourself and you must deal with the consequences until you either get so sick of it you decide to do something about it or decide to just keep feeling sorry for yourself until the day you die.

I know depression as a survivor of an attempted suicide but you know what? I got over it, changed what was unhealthy, and am a better person because of it. I absolutely refuse to believe that no one else is capable of doing the same.

If you refuse to change, then you deserve the suffering that comes with it. You must suffer this "penance" because you allowed yourself to get into the position you are in and must suffer the consequences of you actions... or inaction whatever the case may be.

Kroxile:

xXxJessicaxXx:

Kroxile:

If you are actively trying to better yourself, then fuck em. As you get better the teasing will slow and eventually stop. But for the time being its something you have to deal with for letting yourself get so bad in the first place. Think of it as a penance.

The reason my weight goes up and down is that I suffer from depression and I don't get much exercise because I don't like going out. I kind of have already suffered enough in my life not sure why I should have to suffer 'penance' aswell.

Then its your own fault and you have no one else to blame but yourself and you must deal with the consequences until you either get so sick of it you decide to do something about it or decide to just keep feeling sorry for yourself until the day you die.

I know depression as a survivor of an attempted suicide but you know what? I got over it, changed what was unhealthy, and am a better person because of it. I absolutely refuse to believe that no one else is capable of doing the same.

If you refuse to change, then you deserve the suffering that comes with it. You must suffer this "penance" because you allowed yourself to get into the position you are in and must suffer the consequences of you actions... or inaction whatever the case may be.

But the position I'm in isn't my fault, at all. So why is it okay that people make me suffer for it?

xXxJessicaxXx:
Because you are just giving people a chance to say how much they hate fat people and how awful they are :/

People are just like that sadly. To me, they actually don't hate fat people they just feel strongly about the health issues which I didn't focus on in my OP so they're getting on me for that lol. Besides that, fat people aren't awful at all. Because people are people no matter what race, gender, religion choice.. they are still human to me it's just their actions I focus on primarily.

This thread went for the wrong turn but nothing reflected upon you now. Really, it's not against you at all but rather I spoke my opinion and some people actually support my case which they are fine with who you are. Like I said, don't let others harm you with their words or hatred. You make of how you live, we have no right to judge :} and I really hope for the best you find happiness. Everyone deserves to be happy, you kidding?

Also worrying about being fat or getting fat is worse then anything because the stress that comes off the worrying can actually kill you so yeah that's why I tend to eat and think of just working out instead of worrying constantly. That's just me though!

xXxJessicaxXx:

But the position I'm in isn't my fault, at all. So why is it okay that people make me suffer for it?

Then who's fault is it you overeat, don't exercise, and are depressed? There's prescriptions for chemical imbalances in the brain to help with depression. Afraid of social stigma? Deal with it.

By chance are you crippled in some way? Well then, my condolences, but its something you have to deal with, regardless.

Bottom line is: if you are capable of getting up and moving around, even a little, there is no excuse and it is YOUR fault for your issue.

As a fat person who works my ass off (my diet is between 800-1000 calories a day and i excersise for at last an hour every day) and can't lose weight, I find stereotypes really piss me off. Yes a large portion of fat people are over eaters and lazy but you cant paint us all with the same brush. I've seen doctors, nutritionists, personal trainers etc etc and taken weightloss drugs to help that have done nothing but burn up a heck of a lot of money. Do I still get judged? yes. And it sucks. Unfortunately for me I am on medication that means that despite my way of living I will always struggle with loosing weight. So to all those people out there disgusted with fat people, think before you treat us fatties like second class citizens. Not all of us are overeating slobs.

xXxJessicaxXx:

But the position I'm in isn't my fault, at all. So why is it okay that people make me suffer for it?

It isn't. Some people are just being horrible, and using a weird superiority-complex to justify it.

EDIT: to explain myself further, I just don't think "Because I got over a horrible part of my life" is reason enough to make life miserable for someone who haven't.

Aurora Firestorm:

Kroxile:
Simple fact of the matter is: If you're fat; you're seen as a person who cannot master themselves and thus are worthy of disdain.

Being genetically chubby isn't one's own fault; though that doesn't mean they shouldn't take extra care to prevent themselves from ballooning up to blimp status.

The morbidly obese who make no effort to change their ways however, are worthy of every bit of disdain they receive regardless of their other qualities.

Any who want to disagree can if they want, but society as a whole is on my side and that will most likely never change.

Double post just to focus on this. Have you *seen* how society has changed? In a relatively short time span in history, we have gone through all kinds of perceptions of body size.

Have you seen historical art? Lots of the women were very curvy -- we would call many of them obese now. Back then, that meant you were prosperous and could afford rich and plentiful food. It was a sign of success. People considered these voluptuous women to be the pinnacle of beauty. Nowadays, people like you would look down on them and call them lazy and uncaring for themselves, because nowadays you get fat because you're sedentary and work at your desk, not because you're lucky enough to afford good food. Today, thin is in, because it means you spend your leisure time exercising instead of working more, and also because (whether erroneously or not) it has come to symbolize self-control in a country where it is very easy to obtain calorie-dense food.

The same happened with skin tone. Pale was beautiful when it meant that you didn't have to work in the sun because you were rich. Now, tan is beautiful because you can afford to lie out in the sun instead of work indoors all day.

Society *does* change. Someday thin might not be the popular way to be. And honestly, it doesn't have to be rail-thin or blimp-fat anyway -- statistics are pointing towards most Americans still preferring middle-range women, those who have fluff but are neither very fat nor very thin. Models are not a good reference for this.

BlueMage: try telling that to the people who have disorders in their hormones that prevent them from feeling satiation. It has been scientifically shown that certain genetic anomalies will cause animals -- and people -- to lose sight of when their appetite is and isn't active, and when they should stop eating. Also, the body has a number of mechanisms to prevent fat loss, including slowing the metabolism under high levels of exercise.

Losing weight is very much possible. But it isn't necessarily a sign of laziness or lack of work that some people have a hard time doing so.

And here I was going to toss up an impenetrable wall of text making, among other things, those exact points (it may now be a somewhat-penetrable wall of text). Thank you for helping my carpal tunnel heal by saying it already :D. Although in regards to your points on slowing metabolism under exercise: This actually happens when you try to lose weight as well. If you're eating less and exercising more, your body goes into starvation mode (in attempts to keep all your fat), making you feel hungrier and slowing down your metabolism. (My source: http://www.npr.org/player/v2/mediaPlayer.html?action=1&t=1&islist=false&id=141794801&m=141855724 . It's not the best ever, and I've posted it in a similar thread before, but I trust NPR as an accurate news source)

To everyone in the thread saying weight loss is super easy, you just have to eat less: You are correct. Completely. It is totally just that simple. You can lose tons of weight by not eating anything for a month. Or doing some crazy diet of only celery or grapefruit. If calories in is less than calories out, you win weight loss. So, if it's really so darned simple, why hasn't everyone done it?

Suppose, for a moment, you want to lose weight. The reason for your purposed weight loss is unimportant. Now that you've decided, what do you do? The media has been telling you "Try this diet, you'll lose in no time!", "Come to our gym, you'll lose in no time!", "Spend money on this treatment, you'll lose in no time!" Now you know whatever it is that you try is going to help you lose weight in "no time." Makes weeding out the bad choices pretty easy: if you don't lose 200 pounds (or something like that) in two months (or something like that), whatever treatment you were going with is a scam and you can try a new one. (Note: I am not currently addressing the situation where you would want to lose weight quickly for an event/season/personal reason/etc. This obviously happens, I'm just not addressing it.)

Now that hypothetical fat you has a new diet that helps you lose weight, all is well, right? Well, depending on what that diet is, there's a chance you're going to want to be off of it at some point. Maybe exercising three times a day is practical now, but won't be in two months from now. Maybe eating nothing but celery for every meal is not how you want to spend your Thanksgiving. So, when you've lost those amazing 200 pounds, you stop your diet. You go back to all those wonderful foods you've missed. And the weight comes back. But the media just told you "If you spend X money for the X fat-loss solution, you will be rid of all that fat forever and ever and everyone will love you!" right? Those readily-available solutions aren't working anymore. So what happens now? You get discouraged. You were told it would work, but it didn't. Everyone looks down on you. You tried and you failed.

Maybe you're the type of person who won't give up after that. Maybe you'll take a look at what happened and think, "Oh, hmm, looks like this was a bad diet after all. Perhaps I'll ask my doctor/nutritionalist or do some more research on the subject before I try again." If this is you, know that you are not everyone. There are a lot of people who aren't that secure with themselves--who think that weight loss just won't work on them--and give up. These are the people who need to hear: "Hey. You. You can do this. Being fat does not mean you're not a worthwhile person. Being fat just means you're fat. It doesn't mean you haven't tried, but if you have, whatever you're doing isn't working. Try something else. And get help. Help never fails to, well, help!" The unfortunate part is when this message becomes: "You shouldn't try to fix your fat, because fat is something to be proud of!", which is what I think the biggest issue people have with this thread is.

Honestly, the secret to weight loss? Find a diet you like that you don't mind doing FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE. Yeah, it sucks. Sometimes a lot (why yes, yes I do wish I could eat a full box of Thin Mints without consequences. Or a whole chocolate cake by myself). But a good support group and an easy (easier than only grapefruit) diet will help. Those diets don't cause you to lose very fast, but you can maintain the darned thing indefinitely.

[tl;dr]: Please stop preaching: "Quit eattin', fatty!" It's not helping. Suggestions for helping are listed above.

Apologies for awkward sentences and tone (all "you"s are the general kind), I didn't have much time for proof-reading.

People are people, and I don't care if your fat or skinny, but let's be honest, some people just don't care and what I mean is I see most people I grew up with go from being pretty fit to letting themselves go, and what I mean is they don't respect themselves enough to take care of themselves. I'm not saying you need to be a meat head or a twig but a girl I fooled around with in high school who weighed about 120 and at our 10 year last year, she looked around 300+Is that self respect or healthy? Also to note are my friend who weighed about 200+ now she's around 130 so I say its not always what the world sees but not care to take care of yourself shows. As far as personalies or the kind of person they are I can care less about weight, but don't expect the world to accomodate your lack of self respect if you decide to keep gaining.

Kroxile:

xXxJessicaxXx:

But the position I'm in isn't my fault, at all. So why is it okay that people make me suffer for it?

Then who's fault is it you overeat, don't exercise, and are depressed? There's prescriptions for chemical imbalances in the brain to help with depression. Afraid of social stigma? Deal with it.

By chance are you crippled in some way? Well then, my condolences, but its something you have to deal with, regardless.

Bottom line is: if you are capable of getting up and moving around, even a little, there is no excuse and it is YOUR fault for your issue.

You clearly have no idea about depression and think it's just 'being sad' or something. I overeat and don't go out because I have depression and anxiety disorder. Which I have because of things other people have done to me so hardly my fault.

It's not fat I worry about, its healthiness,
I know many people: My boss/ best mate, family members, friends that are overweight, and yet lead healthy lifestyles, eat well, exercise and still have excessive body fat.
These people are at a higher risk of some diseases sure, but I've also known people, who are smaller than me (me being 78kg with a body fat percentage of 13%) who have gotten sick with heart disease, suffer from the cold (during my division's naval survivability test the fittest guy there got hypothermia from the water) and lead unhealthy lifestyles.

So its not Fat, Skinny, Overweight, Underweight that is bad to me, its being unhealthy; eating too much sugar/salt, drinking too much, not eating enough, etc etc.

If you exercise, eat well, have fun, your in a good place, if not there's your problem

xXxJessicaxXx:

Kroxile:

xXxJessicaxXx:

But the position I'm in isn't my fault, at all. So why is it okay that people make me suffer for it?

Then who's fault is it you overeat, don't exercise, and are depressed? There's prescriptions for chemical imbalances in the brain to help with depression. Afraid of social stigma? Deal with it.

By chance are you crippled in some way? Well then, my condolences, but its something you have to deal with, regardless.

Bottom line is: if you are capable of getting up and moving around, even a little, there is no excuse and it is YOUR fault for your issue.

You clearly have no idea about depression and think it's just 'being sad' or something. I overeat and don't go out because I have depression and anxiety disorder. Which I have because of things other people have done to me so hardly my fault.

Keep on telling yourself that if it makes you feel better, but the fact of the matter is that it IS your fault. Deal with it.

I changed when I was depressed to the point of suicide, or did you miss that? There is no reason why you cannot do the same. None at all.

You want to discuss issues with people that are overweight that AREN'T specifically related to personal health or aesthetics? Fine.

1. They sweat a lot.

2. Because they sweat a lot and have decreased air flow over their folds, they also tend to smell bad too.

3. They tend to be more susceptible to asthma (they breathe f*cking loudly).

4. Proneness to sleep apnea (they snore really f*cking loudly).

5. They go to the bathroom excessively.

6. They take up a lot of space (combine that with the last five and they are almost intolerable to sit next to on a bus, airplane, or movie theater).

7. They have increased infant mortality rates.

8. The variety of health risks they are prone to means that they tend to be less productive and are more likely to be absent from work than healthier people, in addition to costing employers more in the way of health insurance and worker's comp.

You can cry all you want about how "fat people are people too" or "it's about their personality, not their appearance" until the cows literally come home, but the fact of the matter is that people that are overweight are inconvenient to be around. Especially strangers. If I'm trapped with some fat, sweaty, smelly bloke in an elevator who's constantly breathing hard in my ear then I'm not going to bother giving him the benefit of a doubt. I'm not going to sit him down and try to get to know him better, nor am I going to remind myself of all the famous fat people in the world and what they've done for society. I'm going to get off at the nearest floor and take the stairs, the last place I should hope to run into him.

I don't have a problem with fat people per say.

I do however have a problem with fat people pitying themselves.

Kroxile:

xXxJessicaxXx:

Kroxile:

Then who's fault is it you overeat, don't exercise, and are depressed? There's prescriptions for chemical imbalances in the brain to help with depression. Afraid of social stigma? Deal with it.

By chance are you crippled in some way? Well then, my condolences, but its something you have to deal with, regardless.

Bottom line is: if you are capable of getting up and moving around, even a little, there is no excuse and it is YOUR fault for your issue.

You clearly have no idea about depression and think it's just 'being sad' or something. I overeat and don't go out because I have depression and anxiety disorder. Which I have because of things other people have done to me so hardly my fault.

Keep on telling yourself that if it makes you feel better, but the fact of the matter is that it IS your fault. Deal with it.

I changed when I was depressed to the point of suicide, or did you miss that? There is no reason why you cannot do the same. None at all.

I don't believe you, as you wouldn't be so flippant about something so serious. Saying Deal with it over and over isn't going to suddenly make you right.

GrimTuesday:
Well that was patronizing as fuck. As a fat person, I don't need someone who has no idea the sort of shit I put up with telling me that despite the fact that I'm fat, I can be successful in life, and love. I'm not some fucking pansy who needs people to tell me that I'm not shit. There is no doubt that people look at me differently due to my size, its just part of life and I'm not going to bitch about it. Being fat is not good, its unhealthy and leads to heart disease, and other potentially mortal ailments and it makes preventing these more difficult because its harder to exercise.

Ooh, you said what I was going to say, with some minor addendums:

Being fat is not unhealthy in and of itself. Large amounts of excess fat, particularly *visceral* fat, is a symptom of an underlying body-fueling disorder. Likewise being excessively thin is ALSO a symptom of an underlying disorder, which may be an eating disorder and may be something else.

The goal body-wise is to be healthy and fit. Achieving this goal is going to be different for everyone. For some people it'll mean yes, you get to eat mountains of mashed potatoes, have 5% body fat and wear a size 0. For some of us, it means completely eschewing carbohydrates, having 22% body fat, and wearing a size 12.

The only people who comment and bother me on my appearance are the ones who look at my 5'10", 345 lb frame and try to assure me that I'm still "pretty" or similar, because that's total BS. I know it's BS. YOU should know it's BS. I got up to 380 lbs because I was mismanaging my health. Now I've lost weight, I feel better, my chronic pains and swelling are disappearing--I'm properly managing my health. When I get down to a good weight as a result of REGAINING MY HEALTH you can celebrate with me and tell me I'm a hot mama IF you actually think so.

Until then, keep this self-esteem BS to yourself.

I have a metabolic condition which has screwed up my body in a lot of ways and yet I have a BMI of 20.9. Why is this?

This is because despite my tendency to gain weight, plus the medication I have to take which also makes me...du du duuuuh, gain weight, as a countermeasure I do not eat sweets, rice, pasta etc, heck, I don't even eat bread. I constantly drink water through the day and avoid caffine. I eat three small meals a day with a lot of salad and protien and my last meal is at 6.

I have lived like this for about a year now and I am happy with the results. Yes, it sucks but I love being thin and healthy and energetic. Before this diet, I was tired a lot and steadily gaining weight.

I cannot control getting sick but I can control what I put in my mouth.

I hate gaining weight. I think I look horrible (my stomach gets all bloated and bleh) and I also have a sweet jar. In this jar, I put in the money that I would have spent on sweets, save up and buy nice clothes.

If I am not careful I will end up with type 2 diabetes too therefore I think that being fat sucks more than giving up krispy creme donuts (boy, that was hard...)

Muspelheim:

xXxJessicaxXx:

But the position I'm in isn't my fault, at all. So why is it okay that people make me suffer for it?

It isn't. Some people are just being horrible, and using a weird superiority-complex to justify it.

EDIT: to explain myself further, I just don't think "Because I got over a horrible part of my life" is reason enough to make life miserable for someone who haven't.

Amen. There are few things in the world more self-righteous than a "reformed (whatever)".

OT: There are many, many great reasons to keep a healthy weight, but a lot of people fool themselves into thinking they're perfectly healthy just because they're not overweight. I'm at a healthy weight and I'm a mostly healthy person, mental illness aside, but a lot of that is a forgiving metabolism and the fact that I notice when I gain even a few pounds before it gets out of hand. My family has a history of thyroid problems and genetic weight problems, so I know that even if I could eat anything I wanted to when I was young, I can't be complacent now that I'm older. So, I eat mostly healthy foods (it helps that I absolutely despise sweet foods and fried foods) and incorporate exercise into my every day life (parking further from the door, taking the stairs instead of the elevator, etc.) because I hate exercise that feels like work.

The one thing that really, really pisses me off when it comes to overweight people, though is how people deride them when they're trying to do something about it. See a fat person at the gym? Make fun of them! Yep, that'll damned sure make them want to come back. See a fat person eating a salad? Laugh and point at the futility of it. Yay for positive reinforcement!

Meh.

It depends on how fat they are and what else they're doing with their life. Someone who creates great art or plays guitar really well or is athletic for their size a la professional props or linemen may focus on things other than weight control. It doesn't bother me at all as long as someone is within a vaguely healthy range. I may not find a genuinely overweight girl that attractive, but I'm not going to hate her for that or anything. I know people have different metabolisms and it's more difficult for some people to lose weight.

I get irritated with tremendously fat people who obviously are making no effort to be even remotely healthy. For example, those monstrously fat people at supermarkets on the scooters who are only buying potato chips and soda, for example. They're wasting everyone else's time, energy, and effort because they won't get off their lazy asses and make even the small lifestyle changes that could bring them back to a reasonable level.

tl;dr: Stay reasonably healthy (healthy can include extra flab) and it's no big deal. People who deliberately take up resources out of laziness piss me off.

Being fat tends to show little motivation and laziness. While I agree that it shouldn't really come in to what people think of you on first glance I am sure everyone does it to people given so many people put time into the appearance which tends to show what kind of person they are. Otherwise what's the need of going to business interviews in a suit, you may as well dye your hair and come in a GIMP costume because it shouldn't make a difference. But what I find interesting is that you have shown that not being fat is fantastic. Get judged on your weight? Be Thin. Get rejected by a girl? Be thin. Have health problems? Be thin. Why would anyone want to be overweight?

Fat not fat, does it matter? You play the hand you're dealt in life and you decide what you're worth. Fat, skinny, tall, short, ugly, beautiful... it all amounts to jack fucking shit. YOU make you worth a damn, not your body weight or looks.

BloatedGuppy:
Does that make sense?

It does, I understand where you're coming from and I realise that refusing to abide by a weight loss plan out of stubborn pride and not wanting to give their tormentors the satisfaction is very myopic and pretty damn stupid decision, they should know better. However, that being said I still feel the 'fat shaming' side of things is something that needs to be addressed, particularly in schools where it really fucks the kids up through later in life. At that kind of age, weight is generally the product of and leaves them in a state of crippling insecurity. You ever been in school and see one of the fat kids (disabled kids too, they don't show mercy) trying to participate in a sport? They're excited and they want to be involved, but the fucking second the normal kids get a whiff of it watching them tire after a few gentle jogs round the pitch it becomes their fucking entertainment, they laugh and the kid just becomes crestfallen, the minute they try to get ingratiated or try to do something about their wieght they get their confidence knocked right back down again. They need the kind of environment where they can feel relaxed enough and secure enough to start trying to improve their situation. Otherwise that insecurity only exacerbates and encumbers them to the point where they just break and give up, resigning themselves to the attitude that it's not worth the effort and carrying that with them through adulthood. If you tackle that bullying and that 'fat shaming' mentality from an early age, then it makes it a lot easier for them to work to improve their physical condition. And while adults really should make the effort, making the decision to lose weight doesn't make it any easier to deal with abuse. I live with someone who is obese and they're trying to lose weight, but it's a slow, arduous process, she's been on this diet plan for almost a year and lost about 2 stone. And what makes it all the harder is that the outsider isn't going to notice the difference or the effort made to change and that can be very deflating, especially when you're trying to break down habits built up for over 40 years, getting chewed up and spit out from your place of employment and getting your confidence shattered to the point where it took her months to feel alright going outside, it makes it all the more difficult. It's as you were saying earlier the problem tends to run a lot deeper than just needing to go on tredmill ever now and again, there's a whole host of issues to combat. Another issue I think needs looking at is what exactly constitutes fat in regard to this threads question. When we ask if fat is bad, to what scale? Are we just talking about obesity here, or also those who are just generally overweight, or looking a bit chubby and not in very good shape? It's weird how some of the people have these qualifiers, some kind of invisible quota where someone is just about fat enough that they deserve the shit they get. I mean if someone is slightly or moderately overweight than are they running significant risks with their health? Should they be compelled to change as well? The problem is it opens up questions upon which I'm not entirely sure where I stand, at what point is someone considered in a dangerous weight range? How far should they be pushed? To what extent do you get involved before leaving it to them? I'm not entirely sure, these are things obviously completely dependant on the individual, my dad excerises very regularly but is still pretty fat, having been screwed over by a dodgy metabolism, though I wouldn't consider him in any real danger despite being overweight. It's a complicated issue that spans over multiple problems beyond the purely physical that as you've mentioned earlier entails quite a lot of psychological concerns. All in all though, you're right, if someone's weight is going to causing them serious affliction, then they really should work to resolve that irrespective of the abuse. That being said, I'm not going to pass judgement on those who choose not to, I know how insecurities can really bear down on and overwhelm you and I'm really not in a postion to judge someone for thier inhibition when I have plenty of my own problems that I'm not willing to face up to.

First, I'll just throw in a few personal definitions, so you know what I'm talking about. I'll use men as a standard out of familiarity (I am in fact a man, and I've been through at least some of this spectrum). Just add a few extra percent for women, as they do naturally have a bit more fat on them:

Properly skinny: <10% body fat
Well defined: 10-15% body fat
Normal: 15-22% body fat
A little bit extra: 23-30% body fat
Chubby: >30% body fat
Fat: >40% body fat

All categories above save for "fat", I think are fine. I personally find well defined through normal the most aesthetically pleasing. There's some wiggle room at either end, but that's my general preference. I do find the "fat" category should generally do something about their situation though, because living like that pretty much guarantees illness. They can do what they want, but should be fully aware that what they're doing isn't healthy. Save for that category, it's the people that want to change but don't do anything about it that I struggle to respect. There are certainly cases where certain disorders completely prevent you from losing fat. But, I'd wager that those are in the minority. If you're chubby and happy with yourself, I have no issues with that. I probably won't find you physically attractive, but I can't change that. I won't treat you any differently, though.

I used to be right at the point between "a bit extra" and "chubby". It mildly annoyed me for years, but I was too lazy to do anything about it. Then I randomly just started doing some mega cardio 5 days a week, and within half a year I'd lost 50 pounds. More sustained exercise over the next few years dropped that by another 10 pounds. I'm currently in the normal range. At this point, I'm just trying to put some muscle on me, and lose maybe another 4% body fat (but have a net weight gain).

My motivation for doing this is as follows:

- I want to look good for myself. I'm doing alright in this respect, but I can do better.
- I want to improve my fitness so I'm generally better at things I try. I already have pretty damn good cardio, but my strength to weight ratio is pretty bad by my standards. Ideally, I want to improve both.

I do think people, and even the medical community way oversimplify this sort of thing, though. Weight alone is a completely useless metric. Height and body composition definitely need to be considered along with it. I'm semi-tall, so I'll always be a bit heavier. Same with anyone who is muscular. But, as far as completely useless metrics go, body mass index (BMI) is the most useless metric ever. It COMPLETELY ignores your body composition. Someone with 10% body fat and a decent amount of muscle could be considered obese using BMI. Someone decently chubby with below average musculature could be considered the paragon of fitness using BMI. It's utter bullshit. Further, it's hardly an indicator of fitness. I know people who would score right in the "perfect" part of the spectrum but can barely run for a minute. BMI means nothing. And yet, I've read dozens of peer reviewed, scientific journal articles basing their entire damn thesis on a bunch of useless BMI results, instead of measuring actual body fat percentage (which is very easily done).

And, while body fat on its own does correlate with fitness, it can't be taken as a supreme indicator. It's not like every athlete has 5% body fat or something. They'd probably perform pretty poorly if they did. In terms of general fitness, "well defined" through "normal" is generally optimal, but again... it's not like carrying a bit extra means you're a useless blob who can't do anything. Quite the opposite, in fact. People do need reserves. If you ever run for an extended distance (say, >10km), that "second win", the burst of energy you get after struggling for a while is your body eating into your fat reserves.

As for the media's portrayal of all this... my opinions are mixed. Super models should not be starving themselves before a show. Celebrities should not to have to starve themselves to avoid being insulted by a tabloid or something. But, if they're naturally skinny and still maintain a healthy lifestyle (a lot of them are), I don't see anything wrong with that. I remember reading an article about how different Victoria's Secret models prepared for their big show. About half of them basically starved and dehydrated themselves for a week before the show. The other half said "yeah, I just stuck with my usual normal, healthy diet, and made no effort to cut any fat".

I also want to address the "Fat shaming" thing briefly. I can't believe people do this, honestly. How someone looks is none of my business. If they're nice, I'll be nice to them. Simple as that. I might not find them attractive, but that doesn't mean you have to treat them poorly and make fun of them. I also get the impression that people don't realize the "shaming" thing goes both ways, though. I've seen a loooooot of skinny shaming over the past few years. I can only conclude that, in both cases, it just comes from a person's insecurities. Overweight people who aren't secure with themselves will shame people for being skinny. Skinny people who wish they could put on some weight will call everyone fat. No matter where it's coming from, it needs to stop. Think what you will, but treat people with respect. If you don't find someone attractive because of their weight, fine. But it's not like common courtesy and treating someone with respect requires you to hop into bed with them.

The tendency to judge people based on their physical appearance is one of those things I always hope people will leave behind once they get out of high school.

Most people do. Some don't.

When I was a little kid in grade school, I used to make fun of this one kid for being fat and stupid. One day, one of my friends, a girl named Sarah, told me that he was going to come over and hang out with us and she wanted me to help him with his math homework and we'd all play video games afterward. I said, "Why do you want to hang out with HIM?" and she said, "Because he's my friend." And I said, "But he's fat and stupid." She responded, "You don't even know him. He's my friend, why don't you give him a chance?"

So I did, and we all had a great time, and I realized what a fucking idiot I was to judge someone that way. I was fortunate to have a friend to set me straight, but perhaps not everyone has such good influences in their life.

Anyway, it's possible to be both fat and healthy. The two issues aren't necessarily connected. Genetics plays a big part, as always. What's important is how you make use of the body you've got, not whether it fits into some shallow societal view of what is attractive.

I've had fat friends, dated fat girls. I don't even look at it or think about it anymore. Some of the fat people I've known needed to be consoled from time to time regarding their weight, and I think that's pretty damn unfortunate. There is NO goddamn reason why they should've ever been made to feel ugly or unwanted. No one deserves that.

Wow, looks like both sides of the argument came with their a-games. The insane, naive apologists who insist that there's nothing wrong with any weight and pander to overweight people like they're children who need role models. The misanthropic body-fascists claiming that overweight people are a bane upon all of humankind, denying that there could be any involuntary reason for a person's weight, and insisting that we let the fatties die while they masturbate to their own neo-Darwinian bullshit.

I do a good job of capturing how stupid you all sound?

Let me reiterate one of the challenges I've heard a lot but never seen answered: what the fuck defines someone as "fat"? At what point does the extra weight become a health risk? Well, let me explain it. A person is defined as being overweight when their BMI is between 25 and 30 kg/m2, and obese when it is greater than 30 kg/m2. Now, I'm no fan of obesity. It's a scientific fact that being medically obese is detrimental to your health. But just overweight? Doctors Flegal, Braubard, Williamson, and Gail found that the mortality rate for the overweight might actually be lower than for those who have the so-called "ideal" BMI of 18.5 to 25 kg/m2.

In summation, I fucking hate body fascists. I fucking hate that our society's standards of beauty are this ridiculously-narrow spectrum one can only realistically achieve if they happen to be the lucky 5-percent born with a genetic predisposition to the "tall and skinny" body-type. At the end of the day, if it's not going to kill you then you're doing fine. And you probably still look good naked.

bluepilot:
...and yet I have a BMI of 20.9.

You mean a BMI right in the middle of the FUCKING IDEAL?

the moment i will get mad (yes, mad) because of fat people, is when it are children. seriously, when i look at to little kids who have almost my weight, i can only think what kind of excuse the parents would have. i don't give me that "it's genetics" crap. if your child is fat at the point of being unhealthy, then you are doing something wrong.

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