The Rage I See Around Here...

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This isn't to call anyone out, nor scold a majority whatsoever. However, when I was visiting a few threads (3 different ones in a row actually) I saw a ton of flaming. I'm all about debating and sharing opinions even if my debater doesn't see eye to eye with me.. but there's a lot of disrespect going on lately.

What I want to ask you Escapists is this: When someone (or you if this applies to how you post) expresses their anger or rage, do they really tend to direct it at their debater or is it really because they strongly believe in what they're defending thus feel the anger coming off that alone?

I'm only asking because by nature I am a very calm, easy going person. Not perfect of course.. got my flaws yet one of my good traits is keeping myself aware of how I respond to people in general. Also if you feel like this topic is meaningless, please feel free to add about threads that shouldn't be brought up because it's going to draw a lot of anger out of the community.

I think it is both. We have our share of, shall we say, "controversial" figures *cough* Zeel *cough* who can garner a lot of hate. But, many of the topics we discuss have a lot of emotion behind them and can have strong opinions for or against (retake ME). So, a bit of both, I would say.

It's both. Most of the flaming only happens during controversial topics though.

Mention your religion or political view point and your going to be buried in differing opinions and people telling you that you're wrong.

People on the internet are assholes, basically :V

I'd say it's both but for me it's the latter. I don't dislike a person, I dislike an idea. Not that I rage >.>.

People certainly seem quick to dehumanise other people these days. Its as if they believe all that matters is what they say instead of how they say it. If some people took a moment to stop at the end of their rant, realise that the user they are responding to is a real human being and as such will respond so much better to a more considerately written post. They'd probably find people agreeing with them more often.

Its the difference between making constructive criticism and flaming. There doesn't seem to be a middle option for some people anymore.

Raven's Nest:
People certainly seem quick to dehumanise other people these days.

Because that's oh-so easy to do when you can't see the other person in the flesh. As they say:
image

Humans gonna human y'know. It ain't a complicated thing mister Frappe.

Caramel Frappe:
snip.

you played ME3 didnt you?

dont tell me that didnt get a strong emotional reaction

uhh..thats what this is about right? people are complainging about peopel complaing about ME3

they dont care, no ones forcing them to click on threads so I dont se the issue

Cowabungaa:

Raven's Nest:
People certainly seem quick to dehumanise other people these days.

Because that's oh-so easy to do when you can't see the other person in the flesh. As they say:
image

Humans gonna human y'know. It ain't a complicated thing mister Frappe.

I'm familiar with the theory, its just that the escapist used to be relatively free of the worst of it. That's what Mr Frappe is pointing out. The standards have slipped hugely since before I joined... Monkey see monkey do.... And there are considerably more monkeys around now.

Raven's Nest:
I'm familiar with the theory, its just that the escapist used to be relatively free of the worst of it. That's what Mr Frappe is pointing out. The standards have slipped hugely since before I joined... Monkey see monkey do.... And there are considerably more monkeys around now.

That too is pretty simple to explain; we just got bigger. I've been here even longer, the change is quite noticeable indeed, but it never came to me as a surprise.

But believe me, there were a fair amount of shitcocks around three years ago as well. Oh yes. It's not without reason that a lot of old, high-profile members have been banned. MaxTheReaper for example, and he was far from the only one.

You don't know what it's like, spendin' all those years trapped behind a wall of politeness, bound and gagged. A dark and silent world where nothing grows but the anger.

Now I got that out of the way, it's just kind of a rule. Human beings, when given online anonymity, naturally regress into total fuckheads. It's just the way things work. I've just given up bothering to care about what arseholes people are over the internet at this point. God knows I do it too.

Cowabungaa:

Raven's Nest:
I'm familiar with the theory, its just that the escapist used to be relatively free of the worst of it. That's what Mr Frappe is pointing out. The standards have slipped hugely since before I joined... Monkey see monkey do.... And there are considerably more monkeys around now.

That too is pretty simple to explain; we just got bigger. I've been here even longer, the change is quite noticeable indeed, but it never came to me as a surprise.

But believe me, there were a fair amount of shitcocks around three years ago as well Oh yes. It's not without reason that a lot of old, high-profile members have been banned. MaxTheReaper for example, and he was far from the only one.

There's always been douchenozzle's that's for sure, for the most part max didn't openly flame people until the end of his tenure.

For sure more traffic brings more scum, but it seems like the behaviour is rubbing off onto others. This isn't me being nostalgic but a couple of years ago the community were a lot stricter on eachother for things like grammar, flaming and trolling and because of that the way you were encouraged to behave on the forums was much higher.

Now there isn't such a common display of high standards, just belief that we're a better community of people than that of gamefaq's etc. These forums aren't all that different at times.

Its like people use controversial threads and issues as a chance to belittle and gang up on those with minority views pretending their opinions are invalid because they have strength in numbers. Its textbook flaming.

Caramel Frappe:

What I want to ask you Escapists is this: When someone (or you if this applies to how you post) expresses their anger or rage, do they really tend to direct it at their debater or is it really because they strongly believe in what they're defending thus feel the anger coming off that alone?

For me usually at the person. If they hold despicable views then I will dislike them personally for it. And I can be annoyed even by things that I don't care for that strongly simply by being faced with an utter lack of logic or sense. I do try to keep it from going too far as I don't want to get banned. But any anger is certainly directed at the person. It could be incidentally directed at the position as well, but if the position is that bad then I will certainly feel that way about the person who holds is.

If you think the escapist forums are bad, you should go see reddit, somethingawful or 4chan.

But opinions will be opinions and there's nothing wrong with expressing them. I'm much more inclined to be appalled by a forum in which everyone agrees with eachother than a forum in which everyone argues.

I usually get cranky at the other person not for their views, but for their attitude. Like, if they try to put words in my mouth, if they base their argument on some convenient rule that they themselves are an even more convenient exception of, stuff like that.

I am perfectly willing to accept the existance of views I personally find despicable. I am not perfectly willing to like it, though ^^

I think it's mostly just a way to vent. It was for me at least, a while back.

But I generally enjoy the forums here more when I stop taking them seriously. Sort of like now.

I think we need less threads about "why I think _____ game is stupid/good and everyone else is wrong" and more light hearted threads. People can say that it doesn't have as much discussion value, but they degrade into flamewars all the same anyways to be honest.

I don't mind a good debate, but I don't think a lot of people know what a debate is.

Been listening to to this so if I post something today it will probably contain some amount of rage

JoesshittyOs:
I think it's mostly just a way to vent. It was for me at least, a while back.

But I generally enjoy the forums here more when I stop taking them seriously. Sort of like now.

The same with me, and also with games online, if I only play it a few times now and then without caring much for the score I have a lot more fun (and even play better) then if I play the game all the time obsessed with winning.

ME3 is a cancer upon this site, which can be blamed for the increase in flaming. To be honest I haven't noticed much of an increase, but I've noticed an increase in the number of flamebait threads (Danyal, Killuminati, and Zeel) that have been left alone by the mods.

I try to keep calm except when someone posts something so mind-blowingly stupid/wrong that it has to be countered, which is possibly about once a week? I'd say that the number of ME3 threads is the forum's biggest issue though - Gaming Discussion is practically unusable.

I just come here to blow off steam... And chose my name accordingly.

It works and not as "illegal" as, say, drowning innocent children, setting fire to a homeless person, smashing my laptop against the toilet bowl or breaking my neighbours violin over his practising face...

Nah just kidding. I would never break my laptop... that's shit's expensive!

But seriously. I don't think the "anonymity makes you unpleasant" trope is whole justified. Partly because one's composure still remains a conscious choice between constructive and destructive behaviour, along with the subsequent consequences. Some might chose the former or latter consistently, or reserve the nastiness for one particular forum or chat-room. Nice thing about the internet is that, even though you can find anything you want, you have to look for it first! So, if you don't like the anger: don't read it! Look at pictures of cats and rabbits! Have a nice discussion about what your favourite flavoured yoghurt! Mine is you're mother's herpes! Hmmmm! delicious!

"You wouldn't act the same in other peoples faces now would you, coward?!" is a regular response..... But... isn't... that a.... GOOD THING!? Yes there is anger on the forum so that there does not have to be (as much) anger in you're daily interaction. If I wouldn't come here to be a dick on purpose I would not have been able to kiss ass at work, or take shit from my partner or NOT strangle that old crow in front of me, EVERY TIME, at the store with one bloody potato, trying to fish out the exact 0.42p change in copper shrapnel but fails because she's to old to forget we no longer USE SILVER SHILLINGS! The world is an awe-full place! The fucking shit every day coming into my living room through the tv; war, rape, death, disease, corruption, genoside, "think twice about having kids, because the water and temperature is rising, so they'll drown and then be cooked to broth!".

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!

So yeah. Being a dick to you on this forum, makes life a bit more bearable. Selfish? Hell yeah. But then again: an insult is like a gift shirt. There is no way to refuse receiving it, but that doesn't mean you have to wear it.

Devil'sAdvocate:
I just come here to blow off steam... And chose my name accordingly.

Being a devil's advocate has nothing to do with blowing off steam, actually. Nor does it have anything to do with behaving offensively in order to provoke a reaction. Trying too hard to be snarky also doesn't fall under one's duties, I believe...

...actually, I don't think you chose your name well at all...

BreakfastMan:
I think it is both. We have our share of, shall we say, "controversial" figures *cough* Zeel *cough* who can garner a lot of hate. But, many of the topics we discuss have a lot of emotion behind them and can have strong opinions for or against (retake ME). So, a bit of both, I would say.

Pretty much this.
That and how things come across on the Internet.

I am a calm person generally, and will try to have an intelligent discussion. The number of times I have re-read a paragraph I was typing and redone or retconned the whole thing because it could be taken the wrong way however...
Its kinda hard to get across exactly what you're trying to say on the Internet sometimes, and sometimes 'flaming' can be a misinterpreted statement.

Nevertheless however, there is no doubt a number of people who do simply flame for the sake of it. It is inevitable.

Devil'sAdvocate:

So yeah. Being a dick to you on this forum, makes life a bit more bearable. Selfish? Hell yeah. But then again: an insult is like a gift shirt. There is no way to refuse receiving it, but that doesn't mean you have to wear it.

Ugh, this is exactly the problem. The escapist forums are not designed to be your personal ranting ground where you can blow off steam by being a dick to people because you are too afraid of the consequences in real life!

Get your own blog and abuse the people who want to be abused by you. Not some poor well meaning user who happens to structure his/her opinion poorly.

Please, just leave if that is what you think becoming a part of this community is all about. There are plenty of other spiteful individuals in other other darker recesses of the internet for you to play with.

Devil'sAdvocate:

Oh and your mum says hi. I think... more of a mumble I suppose, hard to hear her whilst her tongue is up my ass.

So your way of relaxing is being a dick online? I thought there was a no under 13 policy here....

Oh, and another thing:

Caramel Frappe:
When someone (or you if this applies to how you post) expresses their anger or rage

It's not anger nor rage. It's annoyance, indignation or frustration. Anger is a pretty strong feeling that forums rarely impose, usually expressed when someone has personally harmed you or someone you know. It doesn't go away that fast.
Rage implies you're physically tearing shit up. You might say that writing something really aggressive while swearing in all caps is somewhat akin to rage, but I don't think I ever saw that on these forums and it's pretty hard to rage in real life while you're standing in front of a keyboard and typing. Unless you're Angry German Kid, but I like to believe no one is really tearing their keyboards apart when they post on this forum. (and yes, I have seen THAT guy. No, I still don't think he's raging)

Annoyance is when something offends you without really harming you. Like the thought that a person on the internet just told you that you're a moron. You know it's not true, but you can't help feel annoyed at the thought.
Indignation is when someone holds views that you consider despicable or appalling. Like when someone considers child pornography should be legal, or (to use a more mild example) when they consider Dragon Age 2 a good game.
Frustration stems from repeatedly wanting to get the point across to someone who either doesn't get it or keeps defending it with points you feel are invalid, misunderstood or factually wrong. That's when your repeated failure to reach him becomes just like repeated failures to do anything else you want to do in real life or, say, in games. You get frustrated. Pretty simple really.

Generally, one thing I really want everyone to understand is that someone CAN think different things about a game, event or situation and still not be wrong even if he totally contradicts what you think.

It's nice that people can show such passion towards a topic/game/etc but I think the problem comes from it being so misplaced. I don't think everybody should be peaceable, the world needs a few angry people, but I think people should really reflect before they post. Try to see where the other person is coming from.

I mean, if you mention Nintendo on this site, just once... you'd swear they'd killed their pet or something. It's great.

Misplaced feelings, as I'd said. I don't like Skyrim, nor do I like the Mass Effect series, the settings don't appeal to me, simple as, I don't feel angry that other people enjoy them, though. Nor do I disrespect those who enjoy them, to each their own, we end up with a much more colourful conversation as a result.

There are plenty of other spiteful individuals in other other darker recesses of the internet for you to play with.

Yeah, true... But that would hardly be fun now would it?

Caramel Frappe:
This isn't to call anyone out, nor scold a majority whatsoever. However, when I was visiting a few threads (3 different ones in a row actually) I saw a ton of flaming. I'm all about debating and sharing opinions even if my debater doesn't see eye to eye with me.. but there's a lot of disrespect going on lately.

What I want to ask you Escapists is this: When someone (or you if this applies to how you post) expresses their anger or rage, do they really tend to direct it at their debater or is it really because they strongly believe in what they're defending thus feel the anger coming off that alone?

I'm only asking because by nature I am a very calm, easy going person. Not perfect of course.. got my flaws yet one of my good traits is keeping myself aware of how I respond to people in general. Also if you feel like this topic is meaningless, please feel free to add about threads that shouldn't be brought up because it's going to draw a lot of anger out of the community.

I'm surprised that it took you this long to notice. This really isn't the friendliest or calmest of sites, most of the time, though there are exceptions (like you).

Personally, I'm just disappointed that I didn't get to see more people going ballistic on the forums over RAGE. It would've been so very appropriate.

Raven's Nest:
Get your own blog and abuse the people who want to be abused by you.

Well there goes my day. Gonna have Eurythmics playing in my head for god knows how long D:

OT: I guess if the debater is doing a poor job he/she will become a target of spite, but i think at least around the Escapist people try to make reasonable arguments without any attacks on people.

Don't think i've ever seen a debate on here like those on youtube where one side has to resort to finding grammar flaws because he just realised he's not gonna get anywhere in a civil manner.

But yeah... if you're in a debate just keep a firm, but honest attitude and both sides will probably benefit more from it.

Keyboard warriors have been getting more numerous generally the last few years. Its not exclusive to the escapist.

Devil'sAdvocate:

There are plenty of other spiteful individuals in other other darker recesses of the internet for you to play with.

Yeah, true... But that would hardly be fun now would it?

The user's here do not post responses in order to satisfy your definition of fun. If you are seen to be flaming you will be reported to the mods who will swiftly rain justice upon thee.

I see you have already been issued a warning. You have already posted another moderation worthy post in this thread so I guess I won't have to worry about a troll like you for much longer...

Ulquiorra4sama:

Raven's Nest:
Get your own blog and abuse the people who want to be abused by you.

Well there goes my day. Gonna have Eurythmics playing in my head for god knows how long D:

Ha, yeah it popped into my head when I wrote it too.

Usually when the anger manifests its directed at the offending subject.

Of course sometimes people (thanks to GIFT) get a bit too uppity from time to time. But i consider this a perfectly natrual occurence of someone not considering that internet anonymity wont stop people from tracking you down if you piss them off enough, especially when theyre stupid enough to link thier Facebook accounts.

Anyway, as gamers, disrespect is something we should be used to. We arent normally the popular sort in real life.

blaqknoise:
It's both. Most of the flaming only happens during controversial topics though.

Mention your religion or political view point and your going to be buried in differing opinions and people telling you that you're wrong.

People on the internet are assholes, basically :V

Correction: people are assholes, basically.

Hallvard Dovakiin:

blaqknoise:
It's both. Most of the flaming only happens during controversial topics though.

Mention your religion or political view point and your going to be buried in differing opinions and people telling you that you're wrong.

People on the internet are assholes, basically :V

Correction: people are assholes, basically.

I'd say that the person you are online isn't the same you are offline (same goes for when you are drunk, for certain people). Just because it happens to be the part you show at the time, doesn't make you a permanent asshole.

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