Heath Ledger's Joker Theory

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I was watching TDK last night and I realised something.

What if The Joker was actually targeting the mob throughout the entire film.

Think about it; 1. He brings around the death of the mob's three highest members: Gambol, The Chechen and Salvatore Maroni.

2. He burns half of their funding which he didn't even earn as he didn't keep his side of the deal (to kill Batman).

3. He orchestrates the loading of the rest of the mob onto a ferry where they have a 75% chance of being blown-up.

If he weren't foiled at the last moment by Batman he would have brought the mob to it's knees far faster than any attempts by The Caped Crusader.

The thing that sparked this idea was the explanation The Joker gives Rachel for the origin if his scars. Unlike the 1st one we see The Joker deliver to Gambol before killing him this explanation gets him visibly distressed in contrast to the 1st which you can actively see him making it up as he goes along and admits from the start that it's a lie.

I know it's almost certainly not what Nolan intended but I like to think that The Joker may have just been taking out the mob in revenge for what they did to his wife and his marriage. It makes him more relatable than the "bringing everyone in Gotham down to his own lawless level" motivation.

Well yeah thats why other villains dont like to work with him.

Or maybe the Joker is the real good guy and batman can't take not being the hero.

I always preffered the whole 'nobody knows' Joker origin. It gave him an edge over batman seeing as they both had the superpower to 'get away with it'.

AlexWinter:
It makes him more relatable than the "bringing everyone in Gotham down to his own lawless level" motivation.

He's not meant to be relatable. That's not what he's for, Two-Face is meant to be relatable, Joker's just meant to be a nutjob. A force of nature more than a person. He represents chaos. Not really a fan of that style of villain myself.

AlexWinter:
I know it's almost certainly not what Nolan intended but I like to think that The Joker may have just been taking out the mob in revenge for what they did to his wife and his marriage. It makes him more relatable than the "bringing everyone in Gotham down to his own lawless level" motivation.

He's not supposed to be relatable. That's the whole point of the Joker. It's what makes him dangerous, it's what sets him apart from other criminals despite his lack of any real abilities or prowess. He acts without any discernible purpose or motivation beyond sowing chaos and entropy. He's not attacking the mob because he hates the mob. He's attacking the mob because they're there, and he feels like it.

Um, you know the part where he visits the mob bosses, and he's got a whole stack of grenades?

If he wants to get rid of them, he can stay outside and send the grenades in.

But, then again, could be, the movie requires a massive amount of not-thinking on anyone's part. Dye your hair green, paint your face white, and the police are utterly helpless to even notice you most of the time, it seems. Stupid criminal magic powers.

I'm sorry but it's kind of bothering me; using the apostraphe in the title in that way means that I thought this post was going to be about a special theory Heath ledger had about the Joker.

A better way may have been to say "Theory About Heath Ledger's Joker" or just knock it out entirely so; "Heath Ledger Joker Theory".

Bunch of idiots >.> Michael Caine explained who the Joker was

"Some people just want to watch the world burn..."

Instead of experimenting on mice he experimented on people cause he enjoys all the emotion, that's all there is to it

Well if you squint really hard you could say that, but actually he just wanted to fuck with everyones shit, the mob simply had the unfortunate luck of playing in his backyard (also being the only "top guys" the movie could spare).

Matthew94:
Or maybe the Joker is the real good guy and batman can't take not being the hero.

Or maybe Batman was indoctrinated by Reapers and the Joker represents his own scarred psyche.

Zachary Amaranth:

Matthew94:
Or maybe the Joker is the real good guy and batman can't take not being the hero.

Or maybe Batman was indoctrinated by Reapers and the Joker represents his own scarred psyche.

Did you just spoil ME3 for me?

All of these theories on Joker.

image

Dude...

Though personally I think the Joker was just a violent anarchist who wanted the world to plunge headfirst into chaos because that's how he gets his jollies.
Or as it's already been said, he just wanted to watch the world burn.
Some of the theories do make sense though.

Or maybe he just likes to fuck shit up? It doesn't matter who it is or for whatever reason, he just likes to fuck shit up. As Alfred says in the film "Some men just want to watch the world burn" hell, even Joker himself says at one point "Everything burns."

Joker doesn't need a reason for anything he does. He just does things because he's totally insane and finds causing chaos fun.

You're implying that he's supposed to be relateable. Joker's entire schtick is how much you don't relate with him.

Otherwise, it's an interesting theory, but he damages far too much to be "targeting" the mob. That's like blowing up a building with a hydrogen bomb.

BloatedGuppy:
He's not attacking the mob because he hates the mob. He's attacking the mob because they're there, and he feels like it.

That pretty much sums up my opinion.

If something's there, then most assuredly tried to kill it.

thaluikhain:
Dye your hair green, paint your face white, and the police are utterly helpless to even notice you most of the time, it seems.

Marvel as I remove my spectacles and become SUPERMAN.

Thinking isn't a big thing with comics as a whole.

"How can we disguise a superhero".

"Put some glasses on him, no one will know".

Funnily enough my brother is also a glasses wearing superhero. With them on he is ordinary David but without them he becomes ... "CANTSEEFUCKALL'MAN".

I thought it was pretty evident from the start that The Joker just likes to fuck with everybody as much as he can. They established even in the opening scene that The Joker is not the guy you want to work with, he will screw you over in one way or another.

Some body hasn't read the killing Joke (hello there OP)

lacktheknack:
You're implying that he's supposed to be relateable. Joker's entire schtick is how much you don't relate with him.

Otherwise, it's an interesting theory, but he damages far too much to be "targeting" the mob. That's like blowing up a building with a hydrogen bomb.

Admittadly, that's kindof the Joker's style. That or tell everyone he's blownig up a building, and then instead filling it with streamers.

OT: Interesting idea, but I more feel that the Joker just destroys for the sake of destruction. Criminals don't expect to be treated like that, so they make both easier targets and targets that are just more fun. They just don't see it coming....
image

Rawne1980:

thaluikhain:
Dye your hair green, paint your face white, and the police are utterly helpless to even notice you most of the time, it seems.

Marvel as I remove my spectacles and become SUPERMAN.

But Superman's DC!

This is a fair argument, BUT, and this is a

BIG BUT

The Jokers main obsession is batman. He doesn't really give a shit about anyone but batman and himself. The stuff with the mob is largely coincidence and used to get Batsy's attention. The entire ploy was to draw attention to himself to get batman on his trail, which he got, so he raised the stakes. All this is also fun to him, Everyone is a target. Hence Killing Robin but not batman in the comics.

Dethenger:

Rawne1980:

thaluikhain:
Dye your hair green, paint your face white, and the police are utterly helpless to even notice you most of the time, it seems.

Marvel as I remove my spectacles and become SUPERMAN.

But Superman's DC!

Still a superhero, same rules apply.

As much lack of logic as you could possibly crayon in.

AlexWinter:
If he weren't foiled at the last moment by Batman he would have brought the mob to it's knees far faster than any attempts by The Caped Crusader.

You just-Blew. My. Mind.

Anybody ever see that South Park where the kids write a book, and it's called the best book ever written, and everybody starts reading too much into it?

Yeah, just saying.

Rawne1980:

thaluikhain:
Dye your hair green, paint your face white, and the police are utterly helpless to even notice you most of the time, it seems.

Marvel as I remove my spectacles and become SUPERMAN.

Thinking isn't a big thing with comics as a whole.

"How can we disguise a superhero".

"Put some glasses on him, no one will know".

Funnily enough my brother is also a glasses wearing superhero. With them on he is ordinary David but without them he becomes ... "CANTSEEFUCKALL'MAN".

Ah, but Superman's glasses are magic, carved from the windshield of his spaceship or something.

And/or, it's a scathing commentary of the state of US's journalists, now that I think of it.

I always assumed the entire point of Joker was he was an incomprehensible madman who did the things he did simply for the fun of it, of course something resembling a backstory would be nice, hell we don't even know his name. Though that might defeat the point.

I think OP makes a good point in that the joker might have planned to take down the mob just because "screw it, I can fuck over everybody". In that sense, it fits with the motivation of his character. We know he's capable of complex schemes, so that could have just been part of it. Just generating as much chaos and entropy as possible for all parties involved. I HIGHLY doubt it would have been a revenge thing though.

Also, everyone knows that cops can't see clowns.

Not sure if it is cannon for the movie series, but the Joker has been stated to know he is in a comic book and thus can't die. He then proceeds to do whatever he pleases as he knows he is the hero's anti-thesis, making him integral to the comics. Even if he is caught he will be free again to cause chaos.

The easiest way to paint the Joker is to imagine a 6 year old child given unlimited access to explosives and no moral compass.

Nice theory, but Occam's Razor boils it down so that the Joker kept lashing out at the Mob because they were constantly within reach. If the Joker had not been targeting innocent civilians, I'm certain Batman could have just kept hiding and let the Joker take care of the mob all by himself.

lacktheknack:
You're implying that he's supposed to be relateable. Joker's entire schtick is how much you don't relate with him.

Otherwise, it's an interesting theory, but he damages far too much to be "targeting" the mob. That's like blowing up a building with a hydrogen bomb.

Which is probably exactly how the Joker would go about destroying a building :P

tzimize:

lacktheknack:
You're implying that he's supposed to be relateable. Joker's entire schtick is how much you don't relate with him.

Otherwise, it's an interesting theory, but he damages far too much to be "targeting" the mob. That's like blowing up a building with a hydrogen bomb.

Which is probably exactly how the Joker would go about destroying a building :P

Hence why I don't think he targets people.

barbzilla:
Not sure if it is cannon for the movie series, but the Joker has been stated to know he is in a comic book and thus can't die. He then proceeds to do whatever he pleases as he knows he is the hero's anti-thesis, making him integral to the comics. Even if he is caught he will be free again to cause chaos.

The easiest way to paint the Joker is to imagine a 6 year old child given unlimited access to explosives and no moral compass.

Darn you beat me to it.

The Joker is aware that he is not real.

Imagine how maddening that revelation would be?

I like to think his reaction is what a lot of folks would do if they found out they actually were created from dust by someone else for lulz.

barbzilla:
Not sure if it is cannon for the movie series, but the Joker has been stated to know he is in a comic book and thus can't die. He then proceeds to do whatever he pleases as he knows he is the hero's anti-thesis, making him integral to the comics. Even if he is caught he will be free again to cause chaos.

The easiest way to paint the Joker is to imagine a 6 year old child given unlimited access to explosives and no moral compass.

This, and the TDK scenes where he tells the different origin stories for himself are a tribute to "The Killing Joke" which suggests 1 origin story (the best one I've heard) but then plants the idea that the Joker remembers it differently every time and is most likely always lying about his origin. Or better put not "lying," but actually wrong every time.

Joker just wanted to create chaos. He says to Dent that he tries to show schemers how pathetic they are. The mob is organised and plans like the police do so he tried to bring them both down. He's really intellegent when you think about it. He used the mobs greed against itself to bring it down while also using them to bring the police down.

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