http://gameoverthinker.blogspot.com/2012/04/episode-69-aftermass.html?spref=tw
Oh god Bob, find something else to talk about...
I'm not going to talk about any opinions about Mass Effect, because even I'm tired of reading debates on that damned ending, and auteur theory, and the FTC, and blah blah blah.
But still, I can't help but feel like I needed to say something about this. So here are my points on this latest episode, again not disputing your arguments about the Re-Take movement.

1: The beginning Hyperbole:
Bob, when you go around calling people 'babies', and 'would be activists' it does not help the serious bits of your argument. Even if you then go on to state that your were making generalizations for comedy purposes, you've still said what you've just said. Not that 'Ivan' made much of a disclaimer anyway, what with the whole "are you going to try to sell me on E-trade" deal at the end. If this is supposed to be the vaguely serious games discussion part of the episode, separate from the just for fun storyline, then why are you doing that ad hominem stuff, especially if you're just going to say that you "didn't totally mean it" only a few second afterwards? If you didn't MEAN those generalizations, why put them in? Did you just get really angry when you originally recorded it and then figure that people might take it the wrong way, so you added in that Ivan bit in post?

2: Marketing
Well, yeah Bob, I think we've all had that feeling that we've been lied to by the marketing before, probably sometime during childhood.
I remember being vaguely disappointed in my first video game console when I wasn't literally sucked into an amazing fantasy world, but whatever...Damn it...
So, does the fact that misleading marketing exists make it ok? Are we taking the structural functionalist view of the world, wherein if it exists it does so for the benefit of society. Knowing your dislike of Classical Optimism a la Spinoza and Leibniz, this can not be the case.
By saying that someone shouldn't be surprised by disappointment, you do not make your argument any stronger. Again, this is pointless to your main argument.

3: Setting back the medium
Given how many debates have been sparked over this sentiment, ie. that players being able to demand a different ending is therefore threatening the artistic integrity of THE ENTIRE MEDIUM, can we REALLY say that it is "unquestionably" so? Your argument is being made much weaker by these sorts of statements that cannot be objectively proven. You can BELIEVE that the artistic integrity of the medium has been hurt, and you can have good reason to feel a such. But there is no metric with which to measure artistic integrity, and no way to scientifically test this hypothesis. Therefore, it is NOT unquestionable until we have the historical hindsight to look back at this event and then take in the sum of it's parts. As of now, it's still happening so we can't really make judgements about the after-effects with any real depth just yet.

4: the BBB
The fact that the BBB kind of/sort of agrees with the 'Retake' people's side of the argument DOES mean a whole lot. Most people aren't excited because they think that the BBB is a government organization, but rather because it is an IMPORTANT organization, being one of the most prominent consumer rights lobbying groups in the country. It is STILL a big deal, even though we'd all see it coming given the organization's history. Although, I'm actually more surprised that EA didn't just buy the BBB off, like so many other companies have.

5: Derision
No bob, as with point 3, since you cannot PROVE that this has set the industry back, this fact alone does not give you the right to simply disregard the movement with snarky derision 'for a little bit'. You still have that right, of course, but only because you are entitled to your opinions like everyone else is. Again, it is not invalid to criticize the sometimes overblown and over-dramatic Retake movement but the idea o 'having the right to do it BECAUSE they've done something stupid' doesn't play much of a role. You regard them as you do, because you are of the opinion that they are wrong and this is jut fine because you are backing it up with reasons, but don't go blaming 'them' for something that we don't really know that 'they've' done.

6: We just know...
Again, I don't want to start debating the validity of this Mass Effect 3 ending thing, I'm just talking about Bob's argument.
Anyway: HOW do we know that audiences were disappointed at the ending of the Godfather or with the revelation that Vader was Luke's father? I'm not saying that I don't think that certain members of the audience weren't disappointed, but you don't back this up at all.
Not with any news stories, or statements from the director/cast/producer etc, or even what critics were saying at the time though these sources likely exist. You just expect the viewer to assume that people would have been disappointed by the downer ending. While I can definitely see this happening, I can't just make the assumption that it did and then allow my future interpretation of your argument to be based on a historical precedent that has no solid evidence attached to it, even though it SEEMS likely.

7: No I don't
I don't see it because I can't see it. The only way you can prove that you've opened Pandora's box is if a whole bunch of people get sick with diseases that we don't already have names for, and the same goes for the potential damage to the concept gaming as an art form. The gaming community itself is ALWAYS debating whether it wants the greater popular culture to make games considered to be art in what has become known as the traditional sense, as the very definition of art is nebulous and impossible to pin down.
If the Escapist/Most Gaming forums were anything like a classroom, "Gaming as Art" would be the most written about thesis topic right behind DLC Controversies and Reviews of Bad NES Games. You did a whole episode on the very subject. Yes, I do see your point as to what precedent may have been established with this case, but this video doesn't make much of a good argument for it.
I'm not saying that your point isn't valid, but what I am saying however is that this argument is weak.
Why, if you're trying to be taken seriously here, would you do that hyperbole crap if you're just going to disclaim it? If I shouldn't take what you're saying seriously, then why should I listen in the first place?

What I get is that you reasonably believe that the Re-Take movement has blown the problem with the ending out of proportion and has therefore made the broader gaming culture look less serious. Fine, that's very easily demonstrable.
But consider this: By giving so much negative attention to them and making out what they're doing to be so very grievous, aren't you then supporting the idea that this is indeed a very big deal and therefore deserves the attention it's getting?

Doesn't that, therefore, validate a good portion of the outrage felt by 'Retake' if people like yourself are so offended that they make two full GO episodes about the issue, tweet about it constantly, write an article linking them to the Old Ones from in Cabin in the Woods, alongside everything else you've done about them so far.

Bob, I like your opinions (most of the time, but I can't say that about most people period so "Go you!") which is why I feel so cheated by this recent stuff of yours.
While you've been bothering way too much with this crap, Extra Credits has been talking about things like analyzing Skyrim's Opening, Western and Japanese RPGs, Games you might not have tried #3, the implications of Crowd-funding, and exploring the implications of Kinect style controls on the way games are made. I know that you don't have the same skill set or hands on experience with the industry that these guys do, but that's ok. People think that your opinion matters for a reason, Bob, and that's because you can get a conversation started. You are SUPPOSED to be the Game OVERthinker, not the Game Do-OVERthinker nor the Game ReThinker. When I started watching your show, as with many others, it was because you gave insightful and interesting perspective to issues that I had either never thought about or hadn't looked at too hard. The debates that I've had over your ideas have been some of the most scintillating and interesting I've ever had about gaming, and likely would not have happened if you didn't start doing videos.

This is why I cannot stand for stuff like this anymore.
Yea, I know that you say the next episode is going to be better or more fun somehow, but I can't take that risk anymore.
This is why I am official starting the Re-take Bob Chipman campaign!
With any luck, we're going to convince the Better Business Bureau to tie you down to a chair and force you to talk about...
Idunno, the implications of The Japanese Post-War Economic Boom to the mutation of originally Western cultural tropes and idioms alongside how they've effected game design or whatever. Yaknow, like how WE kind of invented the Stereotypical Indian with the feathers and whatnot, but then guys like that show up in Sunset Riders...
Maybe you could tie it in with a storyline where the Anti/Necro/Strawman's Third cousin twice removed/Whatever Thinker forces you to walk down Video Gaming's Trail of Tears a la The Sorrow's boss battle.
Just so long as you don't end up comparing Wounded Knee to the Mass Effect Ending debacle, or end up making a Retake strawman organization into some kind of A.I.M stand in (on a side note, A.I.M totally rocks).

Never the less, with my long ass petition and even longer ass blog/escapist postings, we will one day be able to annoy Bob Chimpman to the point where he FINALLY gives up and replaces all his old ME3 videos with new ones where he talks about Goth Chicks/Crap Movies/Film History/The Racist Origins of Bonk the Caveman/The Best Classic Transformers Episodes.

Yeah! Re Take Bob Chimpman!

(Wait, did I just spell his name as Bob CHIMPman? Hey, looks like I just created a new Moviebob character! Maybe he throws poo at sexism or something?)

Mydogisblue:
Words I never want to hear again:

Artistic integrity

Video games as a medium

Retake

Entitled

Consumer Rights.

From me or Bob?

Captcha: there once was
A man from Nantucket, who's...

Don't forget,this have set gaming back a whole TEN YEARS (yes, Moviebob said that on his twets). His points are fucking stupid. That he doesn't "get it" that we don't like it for being a downer ending. It's because it makes no fucking sense!

Mydogisblue:
Words I never want to hear again:

Artistic integrity

Video games as a medium

Retake

Entitled

Consumer Rights.

My artistic integrity forces me to see videogames as a medium that will help us retake entitled consumer rights. :P

Sorry, just couldn't help myself. :3

Edit: Bah, left out the rest of my post.

Anyways, I'm pretty certain that talking about anything ME related is officially "so last month". As such you (the author of this thread), Bob, and everyone else need to just let go. Halo 4 officially has a release date, time to start bitching about how much it's going to suck before it even comes out. Or any other game between now and then.

Re-Edit: I voted for Egoraptor because I love his Awesome series and the Sequelitis he did on Mega Man. :3

Mydogisblue:

RJ 17:

Mydogisblue:
Words I never want to hear again:

Artistic integrity

Video games as a medium

Retake

Entitled

Consumer Rights.

My artistic integrity forces me to see videogames as a medium that will help us retake entitled consumer rights. :P

Sorry, just couldn't help myself. :3

That's it, you've gone and done it now.

I can't be held responsible for whatever actions I may take now.

_{I can't believe I didn't even realize how easily I set that up. They were all in order too...}

xD you did kinda walk right into that one. Which is why I just couldn't help myself. I'm surprised I was able to put'em all into a sentence that actually could make sense!

I could only get a few minutes in before I had to stop watching. I used to be very pissed off about the ending, but I've come around on it and actually enjoy it in light of indoctrination theory(which opens up a can of worms about EA/Bioware all on its own, but I digress). I've never fully ascribed myself as a member of the Retake ME3 movement since I think the name sends the wrong message nor have I given any credibility to calls that demand, as opposed to ask for, a new ending or tout consumer rights. That's just silly.

But the other side of this, almost predominantly game "journalists", have acted like bigger "babies" than the Retake movement ever has. They've conducted themselves with malice towards a legitimate group and have used their platforms to act like schoolyard bullies. Whether they are doing this because they honestly feel this way or because they see an opportunity to get more page views, I don't know and their motivations are ultimately irrelevant. Either way, their constant bullying is more toxic to the gaming community than Retake community could possibly be. It chills public discussion of controversial issues and sets a horrible example for others to follow. I know some shows and features make their bread off of being "edgey" and "bombastic". Fine. But regressing back to elementary school tactics as a legitimate form of serious argument should not be tolerated by the community and those who do it should be sentenced to obscurity by our lack of participation in their particular brand of vitriolic discussion.

Bob is and always has been a hypocrite on the internet, his poisonous opinions have led to the idea that since he was "bullied in school", he can bully everyone else....

Then comes his arguments against the ending, even though he hasn't played the damned thing. This is like attempting to ban Coca-cola without actually tasting it.

Holding us back?! HA! When we, as a community, are loud enough, developers listen, this is a good thing, why do you think that MW3 held onto its "quick-scoping"? Because people asked for it (As wrong as it was) Bethesda also changed the ending to Fallout 3!

I also love how he ignored that fans wanted the ending to the original Sherlock Holmes changed so they litterally picketed the author until he wrote more of the famous detective

Another point is, its like there are three people on this site when it comes to the issue:

For the movement: Jim Sterling
Neutral Either Way: Yahtzee
Against the movement: Moviebob

The OP just made the best post I've seen on this website.

Anyway, could his Eminem-esq lack of new things to talk about be a sign of a possible descent to madness? Pretty soon, he's gonna start thinking that everything he doesn't like in the world is the result of a massive conspiracy masterminded by the people who picked on him in high school, who conveniently work for Activision, and Master Chief is their leader.

Imagine the Green County Conspiracy, but twenty times bigger.

Promethax:
The OP just made the best post I've seen on this website.

Anyway, could his Eminem-esq lack of new things to talk about be a sign of a possible descent to madness? Pretty soon, he's gonna start thinking that everything he doesn't like in the world is the result of a massive conspiracy masterminded by the people who picked on him in high school, who conveniently work for Activision, and Master Chief is their leader.

Imagine the Green County Conspiracy, but twenty times bigger.

I wouldn't go that far. After all, the next G.O. promises to be totally unrelated to M.E.3.
Besides, most of the time he's just joking when he talks about his own background, Ala the Scr4m review wherein most his background was exaggerated for comedy purposes.
It's not the self deprecating exaggeration that I feel hurts his arguments, though they are often misread. It's the aforementioned hyperbole when he talks about things like Retake that I feel make his perfectly reasoned opinions feel cheaper and less relevant.

I still enjoy and respect his take on topics he actually researches and has a good grasp of. With ME I get the impression he just got tired of being asked about it and decided to bust out the 'ol cudgel he used to berate fanboys of Star Wars after the prequels.

I don't think that his arguments stand up against the gaming medium. I'm tired of hearing the same auteur theory inspired bullshit. Games are written in teams and team writing is so full of compromise that artistic integrity is a red herring. On top of that, if AAA studios see fit to shovel in DLC as a business practice now, they'd damn well better start pushing shit that people want to see.

Well I've always had really big problems with MovieBob before this so all I can really say is that Bob being immensely ignorant about a position and throwing around hyperbole is not a new thing for him, it's kinda how he acts all the time. So nothing new.

Really Bob does have the occasional gem of a good opinion or idea but it is so often buried under arrogance, derision, ignorance, a victim complex, crusading zeal for some topic, pictures of women in sexual poses, etc. that for myself it isn't worth it.

Mydogisblue:
Words I never want to hear again:

Artistic integrity

Video games as a medium

Retake

Entitled

Consumer Rights.

Oh I hear you. Man do I hear you.

They eventually just became 5 more entries for my Forum Buzzword Bingo pool.
Right along classics like "Used Game Sales", "Piracy", "DRM" and "CoD4.x", and "Origin".
(Previous buzzwords included Anonymous, Lulzsec, and Geohotz. They finally managed to rotate off into obscurity!)

Man, I got a LOT of horizontal wins this month alone, let me tell you!
It's almost as if there was NOTHING ELSE anybody wanted to talk about besides ME3!

EDIT: Watched his video. Ugh...my head hurts.

Bob is arguing in part from a point of presumption, and is wielding the word "precedent" like an ignorant, angry fool. His central point, the one that attempts to justify all of his ad-hominems and flagrant insults to the people at large is a giant Slippery Slope fallacy.

Whether or not ME3 needs "retaking" is irrelevant when it comes to the issue of "precedent". Why? Because "precedent" in this sense ultimately means the establishment of enabling POTENTIAL, and NOT guarantee.
It astonishes me how he missed the painfully obvious truth:
FAN BACKLASH AND OUTCRY HAS ALWAYS EXISTED AS AN OPTION FOR ANY ENTERTAINMENT MEDIUM/CULTURE AT LARGE.

When the Supreme Court overturns a ruling, it establishes precedent. It is now legal/illegal for something to occur; the potential for new rulings (or exploitation of such) exists at that moment. The important part to take away from this is that THE POTENTIAL DID NOT EXIST (or an inverse, if they are closing a loophole, but for the sake of the argument, I'm assuming he means the establishment of options he doesn't want).

By MovieBob's logic, there was NEVER any potential for companies to listen to fan outcry and backlash, when that simply isn't true. The choice to actually LISTEN to their demands is still firmly in the hands of the artist/creator (to use his term) and theirs alone.

"Pandora's Box" was open the entire time.

Terminate421:
Bob is and always has been a hypocrite on the internet, his poisonous opinions have led to the idea that since he was "bullied in school", he can bully everyone else....

Then comes his arguments against the ending, even though he hasn't played the damned thing. This is like attempting to ban Coca-cola without actually tasting it.

Holding us back?! HA! When we, as a community, are loud enough, developers listen, this is a good thing, why do you think that MW3 held onto its "quick-scoping"? Because people asked for it (As wrong as it was) Bethesda also changed the ending to Fallout 3!

I also love how he ignored that fans wanted the ending to the original Sherlock Holmes changed so they litterally picketed the author until he wrote more of the famous detective

Another point is, its like there are three people on this site when it comes to the issue:

For the movement: Jim Sterling
Neutral Either Way: Yahtzee
Against the movement: Moviebob

You forgot the Totalbiscuit line of thinking: "Realize that the whole thing is ultimately meaningless and that the real issue is closer to publishers cutting out a chunk of the main story so they can charge you extra for it."

I agree with a lot of what he said in the video.
But a lot of what he said in the video had nothing to do with the Retake ME3 movement.

I don't want to go all "he hasn't played it so he can't understand" but it seems like he has completely missed the point.

I thought we were past where people thought we were annoyed with the ending because we didn't get to have a some cold ones with Garrus and have blue babies with our waifu.

Moviebob strategy

1. Proclaim dislike of fox news/Right wing extremists in general

2. Rely on the same basic tactics to support your argument, including but not limited to:

Ad hominims

Straw man arguments

Using the extreme minorities actions as justification for the condemnation of an entire group

Hyperbole

Hypocrisy

Did I do it right?

My favorite part was when he thought that watching Youtube video's of the endings without the slightest hint of context made him completely clued up on the matter...

Okay, to be fair, it's not like he doesn't have any kind of a point. I know I don't want a games industry where fans can take creative control and substitute anything they didn't like about a game with their own fan-fiction, if enough of them decide to make enough of a fuss. Also yes, the 'I Am Legend' thing is a good example about how this sort of thing could become harmful (even though the reasons the 'revised' ending to 'I Am Legend' sucked were very similar to what's wrong with the ME3 ending now, something Bob failed to pick up on). I want a medium where writers feel that it's ok to take risks if they genuinely believe what they are doing is the right move.

Here's the thing though, this hinges on the assumption that the ending to Mass Effect 3 was the ambitious creative vision of Bioware, which it wasn't. The real creative vision of Bioware was leaked, forcing the writers to hastily put something together in time for the launch date to please EA. I repeat, this isn't just an ending that the fans didn't want, this is an ending even Bioware didn't really want! So why should it be defended as sacred?

Yes, it was Bioware's choice to release the game with that ending. However, if they decided to change the ending some point down the line, that would still be their choice would it not? Why would a second re-write have any less 'artistic integrity' than the first re-write, because the fans had a rage fit? Fans have rage fits all the time, about everything. That's pretty much what fans exist to do. Whether or not Bioware actually do anything about it would still be their decision, and theirs alone. Yes, fans are angry, but no-one's suggesting we storm Bioware's offices, grab all their pens and re-write the ending ourselves according to our own specific vision.

I think probably the most sensible thing that has been said about this whole saga came from Jim on this very site. "For me, the best thing about art, is that it has no rules". For Bob to claim that this has "unquestionably set the medium back", implies that anyone really has the authority to unilaterally dictate which way is forward. This undermines the whole ideal of 'creativity'.

I don't entirely disagree with him. Retake Mass Effect ave made themselves look damn silly at points. Casey Hudson did not technically 'lie' to anybody (he was about as economical with the truth as it is possible to be, but that is still not the same as lying), and overall I think that yes, the way gaming fans often choose to conduct themselves does not do any favors to the image of a 'serious' industry (I mean really guys, would it kill us to clean up our act just a little?). However, what sense he is talking is getting lost in all his unnecessary hyperbole, and (the worst part) making such scathing assumptions about people's motivations, when he hasn't even had the journalistic 'integrity' to play the bloody games that the debate revolves around! Seriously Bob, you're better than this. If you want gamers to be more mature, how about you start leading by example?

>.>

well his acting needs work that's for sure.

but if your talking about that 're-take' non-sense. yeah ... flame me all you want, but i always thought, and still do think to a degree, 're-take mass effect' was more or less nothing but whining over something that dose not matter.

like
AT. ALL.

granted, this is still my opinion after hearing most the reason for the shit storm in the first place. doesn't matter. still don't care. games have been ending poorly, and with plot holes FOR YEARS now, so i fail to see why this shit ending should matter any more then the shit ending of any other game.

but more over, i just don't care, i've never cared about Mass Effect, so having to put up with this Bull Shit over the last month or so has done little to nothing to endear your "noble cause" to me, if anything it's pretty much ensured i regard it with contempt from not only having to listen to people talking about something i never cared about to begin with, but bitching about it as well.

anyway. I'm just glad its over, well. till the DLC comes out and we getta whole new shit storm on how THAT ending, or expansion, or what ever, fails to met any expectations of what a good ending should be for the over hyped bore feast that is Mass Effect

SadakoMoose:

Mydogisblue:
Words I never want to hear again:

Artistic integrity

Video games as a medium

Retake

Entitled

Consumer Rights.

From me or Bob?

Captcha: there once was
A man from Nantucket, who's...

This. Can we PLEASE just drop it?

Oh Boy.

It is an opinion about something that ultimately does not matter anymore. It stopped being an issue when Bioware and EA are taking time out of their lives and DLC release schedule to make a free enhancement for the games. I personally do not agree with that decision, but it was not mine to make. My involvement with the whole process ended the moment I paid 60 dollars for my copy of the game. I did not contribute a dime before that.

The argument is over. If MovieBob wants to keep spinning his wheels about it, let him. You are doing the worst thing you could think of right now. Be more mature and let him have his tantrum. Do not have a tantrum yourselves and claim that yours is somehow better.

SadakoMoose:
http://gameoverthinker.blogspot.com/2012/04/episode-69-aftermass.html?spref=tw
Oh god Bob, find something else to talk about...

Re Take Bob Chimpman!

He never cared about Mass Effect until the ending controversy started. Should stick to movies and comic books, things he actually has some understanding of. He is easily the most insulting of all the people who have spoken on this issue.

Jim: Originally saying we should be glad that video-games have become such an important part of so many people's lives (Not the best thing to say at the time) Later went back and researched the subject and admitted that we HAD in fact gotten a raw deal.

Yahtzee: Admitted that while the ending wasn't very good, he didn't have NEARLY as much invested in the Mass Effect series or his own Shepard to begin with. Understandable given that he really rushed through every game and didn't get a real appreciation for the characters. Could have done without that little bit at the end "Are you sure you're not just angry BECAUSE it's over fanboys?" but that's Yahtzee 4 you

Graham: "You're asking Bioware to do the same thing to Mass Effect that you hate George Lucas for doing to Star Wars" Yes Graham, because we all remember those petitions demanding the sequels include pedophilia and trade disputes. The ending for Mass Effect 3 exists for EXACTLY the same reason that Gredo shot first: the Director high jacking his own creation to see what he could get away with. Here's^ your REAL fanboy Yahtzee.

Movie Bob: OMG ALL OF A SUDDEN I THINK I KNOW WHAT 'ARTIST INTEGRITY' MEANS AND I WANT TO DEFEND IT! ONLY I HAVE THE RIGHT TO BE OUTRAGED WHEN GREEDY CORPORATIONS TRAMPLE ON CHERISHED STORIES AND CHARACTERS! LEAVE POOR BIOWARE ALONE! LEAVE THEM ALONE! YOU KNOW I'M RIGHT BECAUSE HIGH-SCHOOL WAS HORRIBLE FOR ME AND NONE OF YOU CAN RELATE TO THAT!

Devoneaux:
You forgot the Totalbiscuit line of thinking: "Realize that the whole thing is ultimately meaningless and that the real issue is closer to publishers cutting out a chunk of the main story so they can charge you extra for it."

That's other half of the problem.

Slayer_2:

SadakoMoose:

Mydogisblue:
Words I never want to hear again:

Artistic integrity

Video games as a medium

Retake

Entitled

Consumer Rights.

From me or Bob?

Captcha: there once was
A man from Nantucket, who's...

This. Can we PLEASE just drop it?

Yeah I'm sick of those fucking capchas

Mydogisblue:
*Snip*

Me to.

Lunar Templar:
>.>

well his acting needs work that's for sure.

but if your talking about that 're-take' non-sense. yeah ... flame me all you want, but i always thought, and still do think to a degree, 're-take mass effect' was more or less nothing but whining over something that dose not matter.

like
AT. ALL.

granted, this is still my opinion after hearing most the reason for the shit storm in the first place. doesn't matter. still don't care. games have been ending poorly, and with plot holes FOR YEARS now, so i fail to see why this shit ending should matter any more then the shit ending of any other game.

but more over, i just don't care, i've never cared about Mass Effect, so having to put up with this Bull Shit over the last month or so has done little to nothing to endear your "noble cause" to me, if anything it's pretty much ensured i regard it with contempt from not only having to listen to people talking about something i never cared about to begin with, but bitching about it as well.

anyway. I'm just glad its over, well. till the DLC comes out and we getta whole new shit storm on how THAT ending, or expansion, or what ever, fails to met any expectations of what a good ending should be for the over hyped bore feast that is Mass Effect

It was probably done intentionally o overshadow the fact that EA just managed to get away with releasing an incomplete game you have to pay extra for with on Disk "DLC"

*Tinfoilhat*

Terminate421:

Another point is, its like there are three people on this site when it comes to the issue:

For the movement: Jim Sterling
Neutral Either Way: Yahtzee
Against the movement: Moviebob

Yes Shepard, this is the choice you must make. If you choose Jim Sterling you will wipe out all synthetics, including the internets, but the peace won't last. Soon your children will create internets, and then the chaos will come back.

Or do you think you can control it? Yahtzee could never have taken control, because he already controlled the hate. You will die, you will control the internets, but you will lose everything you have.

There is another solution. Moviebob. Add your energy to the Escapists, everything you are will be absorbed and then sent out. The chain reaction will combine all synthetic and organic life into a new artistic integrity... a new videogame medium.

The paths are open, but you have to choose.

Hero in a half shell:

Terminate421:

Another point is, its like there are three people on this site when it comes to the issue:

For the movement: Jim Sterling
Neutral Either Way: Yahtzee
Against the movement: Moviebob

Yes Shepard, this is the choice you must make. If you choose Jim Sterling you will wipe out all synthetics, including the internets, but the peace won't last. Soon your children will create internets, and then the chaos will come back.

Or do you think you can control it? Yahtzee could never have taken control, because he already controlled the hate. You will die, you will control the internets, but you will lose everything you have.

There is another solution. Moviebob. Add your energy to the Escapists, everything you are will be absorbed and then sent out. The chain reaction will combine all synthetic and organic life into a new artistic integrity... a new videogame medium.

The paths are open, but you have to choose.

*Picks renegade and shoots in the head*

I'm tired of your disingenuous assertions!

*sigh* Bob seems to have gone from being an insightful (if aggressive) commentator to an internet troll... It's actually kind of sad

dalek sec:

Lunar Templar:
*Epic Snip*

Can I hug you? :D

This post pretty much sums up my whole feeling about that damn game and a bloody poor ending. God's I really wanted to try this series out but the constant banging on about the ending as killed it and any hope of me actually caring for the "Re-take Mass Effect" cause.

OT: Nice avatar by the Templar, what episode is that from?

*internet hugs!!* nice to have some one agree with me on this for once :3
and my Avatar is from the last few moments of "Luna Eclipsed" (season 2 ep 4) just after Luna punks Rainbow Dash. i liked how she look sitting on the cloud so i screen capped and edited!

Devoneaux:

Lunar Templar:
self snippage

It was probably done intentionally o overshadow the fact that EA just managed to get away with releasing an incomplete game you have to pay extra for with on Disk "DLC"

*Tinfoilhat*

it's EA, so i wouldn't be surprised in the least. though dose seem a bit excessive just to cover for disk locked content.

I lost my train of thought so I don't have anything to add. >.<

Game Overthinker? More like the Game Overeater!
Anyways, I am so sick of hearing about his opinion on the ending. He's done like 12 videos over it, fuck off already.

I don't always agree with Moviebob (or anyone for that matter) and don't agree with everything he's said. I, for some reason I can't quite put my finger on, manage to still enjoy a personality/character despite disagreeing (sometimes strongly) with them. It happens. That being said I agree with a lot of what he's said about this nonsense. Not so much the sky is falling, setting back the medium stuff, but a lot of it.

1. It's a funny thing about hyperbole. People only complain about it, when the disagree with what it's about (or they are super into proper debating). I'm noticing some hyperbole on your own post even.

People who take obvious hyperbole literally, though, they're pretty dumb.... which is why GOT used more hyperbole to double insult those people.

2. Marketing is full of lies, yeah. That's not a good thing, no, but it's the name of the game really. It's a very thin line between "false advertising" and "misleading advertising." And "misleading advertising" is redundant. Bob doesn't say you shouldn't complain about getting burned by marketing.

4. BBB thing wasn't a victory. Cool beans I suppose, but at this stage in the game, doesn't mean a whole lot.

6. I trust Bob to know what he's talking about with older movies. That's kind of his thing. Sources would be nice, but he's not writing his dissertation.

I don't think ME3 will end up being seen as "good" by the masses years from now in the same way that other things have, but it's a valid point at least. It happens for all new, or progressive, or whatever description you want things. New kinds of music continuously go through that gauntlet. Jazz used to be the devil's music. Rock and Roll used to be the devil's music. Heavy Metal used to be the devil's music.

7. You don't see the possibility that something bad might come out of the Retake thing? I can see it. That doesn't mean I think it's likely to go down nearly as badly as he's saying, but I can see it. Just like I can see some of the good that could come out of it.

Possible good things: developers start putting more care into their endings, maybe marketing becomes a little less like.. marketing (ha!).
Possible bad things: developers take less risks, developers trust fan feedback more than they should (cuz we aren't always as right as we think we are)

Also possible none of those things happen.

Hero in a half shell:

Terminate421:

Another point is, its like there are three people on this site when it comes to the issue:

For the movement: Jim Sterling
Neutral Either Way: Yahtzee
Against the movement: Moviebob

Yes Shepard, this is the choice you must make. If you choose Jim Sterling you will wipe out all synthetics, including the internets, but the peace won't last. Soon your children will create internets, and then the chaos will come back.

Or do you think you can control it? Yahtzee could never have taken control, because he already controlled the hate. You will die, you will control the internets, but you will lose everything you have.

There is another solution. Moviebob. Add your energy to the Escapists, everything you are will be absorbed and then sent out. The chain reaction will combine all synthetic and organic life into a new artistic integrity... a new videogame medium.

The paths are open, but you have to choose.

Actually, the destory synthetics option is one big lie.

Fusioncode9:
Game Overthinker? More like the Game Overeater!
Anyways, I am so sick of hearing about his opinion on the ending. He's done like 12 videos over it, fuck off already.

You are horrible but I can't stop laughing. God I'm like a child.

He has good points every now and then, but he's a preachy, over-indulgent fuck that thinks the 80's were great, but the 90's were awful.

That's beyond fucking retarded.