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Gone Gonzo  Posts: 1139 Joined: 26 Nov 2008     | |
Gone Gonzo Posts: 1139 Joined: 26 Nov 2008 | Edit - One big detail I would like to scold though, is the editing. Was George purposely trying to put mistakes in certain scenes or what? Anakin/Obi-Wan/Dooku fight: Anakin leaps to save Obi-Wan from Dooku's blow. Talk. Obi-Wan throws him his second saber... Anakin does his twirl thing but now he's on the complete opposite side of the hangar. Just small editing things such as that he pulled. I know there was twelve seconds of footage taken out where Anakin fights Dooku sword to sword before he gains the second one, but that doesn't change the fact that George didn't care about the edit. |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 1589 Joined: 28 Aug 2008    | George Lucas is a tosser. Fuck George Lucas. |
Gone Gonzo Posts: 1139 Joined: 26 Nov 2008 | If you watch Star Wars as the Star Wars universe and honestly try to look past "how Hayden sounds" you'll see that he did a very good job in portraying Anakin. |
On the Record  Posts: 5945 Joined: 7 Feb 2008    | I dunno, I sort of accept it and sort of don't. Personally I LIKED Revenge of the Sith but there are 2 things that I find COMPLETELY unforgivable about the New Trilogy... 1. No Wild West Elements, where are the SCUM AND VILLAINY, no Jabba's and no Han Solo's, some of the most popular elements of the Original Trilogy was the whole Gangster, Bounty Hunter, Smuggler side of things. 2. Very Few "Star Wars", remember all the awesome SPACE BATTLES in the original trilogy, where were they? They were completely replaced by lame ass gungans and flashy lightsaber duels. When I watch Star Wars I want to see War in the Stars. EDIT: I saw Return of the Jedi when I was 10, hence I really hold no hatred for the Ewoks. |
Gone Gonzo Posts: 1139 Joined: 26 Nov 2008 |
I'll give you that for the first one, the universe did become somewhat tame during that time period. |
Red Guard  Posts: 3457 Joined: 18 Sep 2008    |
Ahh, nothing like a well worded rebuttal to a well worded opinion on some movies. Oh wait. I share the feelings of the OP for the most part. I enjoyed the prequels, though the end of Episode 3 was what made me roll my eyes in a fairly significant 'ugh' moment. What I find really, genuinely funny is that people get so upset by stuff like this. Take a look at the guy I quoted. Those are personal, verbal attacks because he didn't some movies. That's nuts! Or, to quote a movie: THATS a lot of NUTS! (Cookie to the one who can name the movie) |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 1768 Joined: 18 Nov 2008     | I don't have that many qualms with prequel trilogy. The CGI and action is of a high standard. I don't spot minute continuity errors and it is fair to say it would never have lived up to the hype. That said Portman can't do blue screen acting and the actors who play Anakin are all terrible, but at least that's consistency. The dialogue too is questionable: I never want to hear the word 'younglings' again or hear Yoda trash talk. ...oh and never say a bad thing about Samuel L Jackson... |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 1735 Joined: 29 May 2008   | If.... and i stress this immensely, the Star Wars prequels had started at the Clone Wars, without the stupid retardation of the first one entirely, and allowing Anakins descent to take most of the three films instead of #1 Murder Sandpeople, feel guilt If it had been spread, so it was a gradual decline... how he SHOULD have been seduced by the Dark Side, rather than a rather instant swap in the third. Just imagine how awesome three Clone War basic movies would have been, compared. |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 3924 Joined: 23 Apr 2008   | I found both the actors for Padam and young Dark Vader (can't remember his name - and yes, the kid too) to be very wooden and forced, especially in the painfully done romantic scenes. The 'sand' conversation would have worked well if it have been written and handled by another Director. Contray to what I believed, very few of these actors are normally bad, but given a) they had to work with green-screen 90+% of the time, and given George clearly can't direct things well, they were pretty much doomed to mess up. Still... pissed off Vader (the killing Samual Jackson scene) was better! Less pointless moaning and angst. And I did like the space battle above the capital world, opening scene of the 3rd episode. Basically, I just think the elements where available to make them good, but George screwed it up by, well, getting old and forgetting what made the first 3 movies he did so good. |
On the Record Posts: 5945 Joined: 7 Feb 2008 |
It's true, who was the most popular character in the Original Trilogy... Han Solo, what was completely lacking from the new trilogy, a badass hero who isn't a Jedi or a Princess (I think Amidala fills this role) and brings the others down to earth. It has always been an important character type to include in Starwars stories, look at all the best ones in the Extended Universe and you'll always find this type of hero. |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 1094 Joined: 11 Oct 2008     | I never had any fascination for any movie or TV series that has the word Star in it and has a billion parts. Star Wars, Star Trek, Star Gate... |
Gone Gonzo Posts: 1139 Joined: 26 Nov 2008 |
Another portion you made me realize was this: OT - Archetype characters. Each the embodiment of one great aspect or quality. THAT is why most people couldn't connect to the PT. |
Gone Gonzo Posts: 1735 Joined: 29 May 2008 | The slapstick funny was gone mostly from the Prequels... the banter in empire, that kind of stuff. I miss that. |
Pulitzer Laureate  Posts: 837 Joined: 8 Nov 2008     | I really liked The Phantom Menace ,but mainly because I thought Darth Maul made an interesting bad guy. Also Count Dooku seemed less of a badass and more of your school principal. Which is kinda of an interesting idea ,but not as much as a total badass. |
Pulitzer Laureate  Posts: 983 Joined: 21 Feb 2008  |
Thats how evil people start out. Hitler was a bad emo painter before he was a Nazi. |
Gone Gonzo Posts: 1139 Joined: 26 Nov 2008 |
Christopher Lee cannot play a bad role... EVER! |
On the Record Posts: 5945 Joined: 7 Feb 2008 |
Agreed, Dooku was fine. Also The Clone Wars Shorts by Gendy Tartovski make the Prequel Trilogy much more palatable. |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 1054 Joined: 14 Dec 2007   | Eh, I can forgive the PT for how bad it is (midi-what now?), if for no other reason then how badass this dude is. Besides, it's not all the actors fault. For the most part, all they had to work with was a green-screen behind them. Think about it this way: You're an actor in a play. Only instead of being on a stage with set peices, it's empty. All you have to work with is your costume, and maybe one other actor. Oh sure, the people watching the play see everything, but you can't. Kinda makes it hard, huh? |
Gone Gonzo Posts: 1589 Joined: 28 Aug 2008 |
I stand by it. Lucas needs someone to slap his wrists and say "NO!" I'm sure the artists and muso's would understand, you just know when you've finished a painting or a song. You know, inside, that anything else you add to it would be too much. Would ruin all the hard work you've done. |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 1092 Joined: 31 Mar 2008    | I found the diolgue was what ruined the first three movies. I wince every time a character opens their mouth. "Only a Sith deals in absolutes!" (Said by someone who is not a Sith) |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 2578 Joined: 27 Sep 2008   | I don't like the prequels, but without them there would be no Clone Wars.(the series, not the cg fail.) It redeems the films a little. It was one of the only things that Lucas didn't touch so maybe that had something to do with it's brilliance. |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 3183 Joined: 1 Nov 2007    | No. Your wrong. South Park put it best. Goerge Lucas raped Star Wars. He raped Indiana Jones. He should be hung for it. |
BANNED  Posts: 938 Joined: 14 May 2008  | I would have forgiven Hayden Christiansen for his dead acting if it wasn't for one line in Episode 2. You all know what ONE LINE I am talking about. User was banned for: A boss encounter one may never forget.... (Permanent) |
Pulitzer Laureate  Posts: 863 Joined: 20 Dec 2007    |
"He just left!.......With Nuts!" It's Kung Pow: Enter the Fist. |
Pulitzer Laureate  Posts: 977 Joined: 26 Jun 2008    | I think your initial point sums it all up. What many people forget is that Star Wars is a lighthearted adventure movie, and even though it appeals to adults as well, it's essentially a (very well done) kids movie. But it has over the years grown out of proportion, and the audience that fell in love with it back in 1977 has grown older and is demanding more, noticing the flaws. Sure, the prequel is not as well crafted as the original, but it keeps to the formula: adventure in space In the end, if you just see it for what it is it's very far from the bag of puke many people consider it.
I do agree with you, the Clone Wars is actually pretty damn decent (who would have believed it?), shame most people will look it over. However Lucas does touch it, he just works with a whole team of writers, the same way he did with the original Star Wars. |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 2768 Joined: 18 Sep 2007  |
No... the reason I couldn't get into the prequel trilogy is that original trilogy used archetypes reasonably well, while the prequel trilogy used stereotypes poorly. Jar-Jar Binks = bad blackface comedy and the Trade Federation = lame Yellow Peril ripoff. And that's even leaving alone the awful woodcarving that was supposed to be the Aniken/Padme romance. It also used technobabble even more poorly than the Star Trek franchise ever did. -- Steve |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 2441 Joined: 12 Jul 2008  | I liked Revenge of the Sith, but I didn't like one or two. Even so, 4, 5, and 6 will always be better in my eyes. |
Red Guard Posts: 3457 Joined: 18 Sep 2008 |
Ahh, well played worthy adversary. |
Press Junketeer  Posts: 405 Joined: 25 Nov 2008  | the prequel trilogy did create some cool characters edit: Mace Windu was first intended to be the narrator of the original trilogy. |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 1455 Joined: 6 Feb 2008  | "Anakin. Your Breaking my heart" |
Gone Gonzo  Posts: 1066 Joined: 3 Apr 2008   | Too much romance/politics, not enough lasers/explosions. |
Pulitzer Laureate  Posts: 772 Joined: 25 Jun 2008   | I'm sorry but I can in no way shape or form agree with you. Lucas managed somehow within the span of three movies to ruin the force, ruin the image of Darth vader by portraying him as far too young in the beginning, Make the sith look rather incompitent and much less frightening, totally shatter the desperate cowboy feel of the first movie and worst of all disrupt much better Canon written by writers who actually had an idea of how to make a good story. They are non-Canon Fan fiction and I refuse to accept otherwise. |
Pulitzer Laureate  Posts: 784 Joined: 12 Aug 2008   | I do agree that Sam Jackson didn't play very well, but I don't blame him for that; I blame George Lucas for casting him in a role that isn't really suited to him. Jackson is a very passionate actor, good at playing the extremes of various emotions. Put him in the role of a nearly all-powerful meditative Zen knight who's supposed to stay calm at all times and I'd expect a bit of sloppy acting on his part. The only reason I watched the prequels were for giant ship battles and lightsaber duels anyway. You know, violence. I skip everything else. |
Press Junketeer  Posts: 381 Joined: 18 Jan 2008  | The only thing good that came out of it was the clone wars cartoon (but one can say it's awesomenees is so great, it justifies the prequel trilogy). |
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To be honest, the Prequel Trilogy is very good. I believe one of the reasons this view is so hampered is for the following reasons:
1. The age basis of the older fans. I believe that Episodes I - III contained many elements that the majority of adults could not connect with. I will admit that if I would have watched RotJ now instead of having the privlege to watch the movie back when I was nine, there is NO WAY I could have gotten into the Ewoks. That's one key elements a good amount of Star Wars fans of the older days forget, it's an action/adventure movie for all ages.
Plus I still think RotJ is the best movie in the entire series, hence the light hearted fight scenes mixed with the serious nature of the other three battles.
2. The complaints of the acting. To be honest, the only actors I found bad in the entire movies were Portman and Jackson. She has a good role in the first movie, acted very well, but there's a certain "tyoe of acting" that can only work in the Star Wars universe. Sam Jackson, though voicing his role very well, had some extremely awkward moments with the lightsaber.
In terms of Hayden's acting I will say this: It's not Al Pacino in the Godfather Part II. In comparison to many other peformances in greater movies he might not have had the greatest voice to portray Anakin, BUT one thing people are forgetting was that the way he portrayed Anakin in AotC was exactly how Anakin needed to be portrayed. He was a kid who was taken away from his mother, was raised by people who carelessly spoke of him "as the chosen one", told him he couldn't feel emotion or love....
In other words, he portrayed him THE way he was meant to be. Unconfident yet arrogant within the same mindset.
3. The only piece...the ONE.SINGLE. piece I cannot defend in the entire prequel trilogy...was the cook in AotC. I have to WTF that harshly.
But all in all, I think the PT was damn fine. Although you could tell more towards the last movie that George stopped giving a shit about certain things and just wanted to finish the project.