Frankly I think its a good thing, now they just need to put more of a tax on alcohol. I do admit that I think everyone should have the right to do what they wish with their own lives. However when dealing with something like smoking that generally causes discomfort and sometimes even adverse reactions in the rest of us a fee of some sort should be paid. Even if the whole 'second hand smoke' thing is trumped up (Which I doubt it is, at least not much) I still know that it smells bad, triggers peoples asthma and can lead to nausea or other issues.
So long story short if you guys are going to insist on a habbit that not only kills you faster but makes the rest of us uncomfortable to be around you the least you guys can do is help fund schools and road reconstruction a tiny bit more than the rest of us. Consider it Karma for making us hang around people who smell like smoldering diapers.
kaiZie: your moaning about 6 dollars!? thats what, about 4 quid or something, and I guess this is for a pack of 20? thats cheap! try about £5.50 in the UK! so nearly 10 dollars or something around that figure! Plus we get pictures like Canada do on their smokes! except ours are very Bristish so no messed up lungs, just a picture of a bendy cigarette saying "smoking causes impotence"
5.5 British pounds = 8.1136 U.S. dollars - so says magical google.
About right for my area, West Coast of the States.
We bitch about $2 dollar gallons of gasoline here, as well. So, £1.34 for 3.79 liters? What do you guys pay for that?
TerraMGP: Frankly I think its a good thing, now they just need to put more of a tax on alcohol. I do admit that I think everyone should have the right to do what they wish with their own lives. However when dealing with something like smoking that generally causes discomfort and sometimes even adverse reactions in the rest of us a fee of some sort should be paid. Even if the whole 'second hand smoke' thing is trumped up (Which I doubt it is, at least not much) I still know that it smells bad, triggers peoples asthma and can lead to nausea or other issues.
So long story short if you guys are going to insist on a habbit that not only kills you faster but makes the rest of us uncomfortable to be around you the least you guys can do is help fund schools and road reconstruction a tiny bit more than the rest of us. Consider it Karma for making us hang around people who smell like smoldering diapers.
With that logic, can we tax women wearing perfume? That triggers allergic reactions to quite a few people, and arguably stinks just as bad.
Or, also tax babies, they smell more like smoldering diapers than smokers do.
I say, send all the smokers in-doors to establishments that are willing/wanting to deal with the smoke. Then, people can choose to be near smokers or not.
Last I checked, it's an addiction. Not a habit, rather large difference.
TerraMGP: Frankly I think its a good thing, now they just need to put more of a tax on alcohol. I do admit that I think everyone should have the right to do what they wish with their own lives. However when dealing with something like smoking that generally causes discomfort and sometimes even adverse reactions in the rest of us a fee of some sort should be paid. Even if the whole 'second hand smoke' thing is trumped up (Which I doubt it is, at least not much) I still know that it smells bad, triggers peoples asthma and can lead to nausea or other issues.
So long story short if you guys are going to insist on a habbit that not only kills you faster but makes the rest of us uncomfortable to be around you the least you guys can do is help fund schools and road reconstruction a tiny bit more than the rest of us. Consider it Karma for making us hang around people who smell like smoldering diapers.
With that logic, can we tax women wearing perfume? That triggers allergic reactions to quite a few people, and arguably stinks just as bad.
Or, also tax babies, they smell more like smoldering diapers than smokers do.
I say, send all the smokers in-doors to establishments that are willing/wanting to deal with the smoke. Then, people can choose to be near smokers or not.
Last I checked, it's an addiction. Not a habit, rather large difference.
Babies no, but perfume should have some sort of legal restriction yes.
Bottom line is that if you want to kill yourself that is your choice, but smoke carries from smoking sections, clings to cloths, and overall irritates alot of people especially with respiratory problems. So we are still talking about something that leaves the smell of smoke, wrings the health care system dry and causes discomfort or in some cases serious problems for others. I think in that case its only fair that smokers should have to pay more, especially those who know what they are getting into going into it. If you choose to start yourself on an addictive substance that you know will damage yourself let alone others then you should not be surprised when people get ticked off or ask you to pay more.
And yes its an addiction, but you know what? They know its one getting into it and they CAN quit. Its hard, and it sucks, but it CAN be done. This is not an issue of equal rights this is a matter of choosing to do something with a measurably harmful effect and then having the price of the item raised to compensate. They cost society more and cause more discomfort for others so that makes up for it.
well, i have to say that it goes both ways, the tobacco company makes cigarettes pricey to get more money in their pockets, and to stop people from smoking the state government puts a high tobacco tax on them. if you notice in states where smoking is more acceptable the price of cigarettes is around 3 dollars a pack and other places about $6.
here is a link that shows the tax on cigarettes in different states
then again would you really want to be smoking a cigarette while riding kingdom ka. Though i think that smoking in pbulic places is very annoying. For my birthday one time I went to restaurant for dinner, the meal was completely ruined by the amount of people smoking and my clothes smelled for a week. I think that smokers shouldn't have to smoke in a restaurant, they can just smoke after or before. If they really badly had the urge to smoke i don't see the problem in stepping outside. I see it as a common courtesy.
Why'd you go to a restaurant that has a lot of smoking if you knew it'd bug you? I'm assuming there are places where you're from that smoking isn't allowed...why not go to another place if your birthday meal would be ruined by people doing something that is/was legal?
If it bugs you, go somewhere else. There, simple fix.
If anyone is going to counter with, "why should I have to go somewhere else?" Think about that, then think about what it's like to be an adult, and then realize "why should they have to go somewhere else, when I'm unhappy?"
This world would be a better place if people stop pushing their own opinions and ideals on others.
Common courtesy should be a factor outside, where people that are walking past have no control of being near cigarette smoke. Your solution will force more people to deal with cigarette smoke then before.
Well the restaurant usually isn't filled with smokers, I guess only at night, also it'd be better to be outside because the smoke doesn't build up and hang in the room instead it dissipates and people don't have to breath half of there air as smoke. Besides everyone ahs to deal with a little smoke outside because of cars. Also if you can make peopl more comfortable why be an asshole and smoke when it ruins people meals. It's not that hard to wait or smoke before you go. You're also being a hipocrite saying that people push their opinions on others when you're telling people it's there fault they can't deal with you so fuck 'em.
Why'd you go to a restaurant that has a lot of smoking if you knew it'd bug you? I'm assuming there are places where you're from that smoking isn't allowed...why not go to another place if your birthday meal would be ruined by people doing something that is/was legal?
If it bugs you, go somewhere else. There, simple fix.
If anyone is going to counter with, "why should I have to go somewhere else?" Think about that, then think about what it's like to be an adult, and then realize "why should they have to go somewhere else, when I'm unhappy?"
This world would be a better place if people stop pushing their own opinions and ideals on others.
Common courtesy should be a factor outside, where people that are walking past have no control of being near cigarette smoke. Your solution will force more people to deal with cigarette smoke then before.
Well the restaurant usually isn't filled with smokers, I guess only at night, also it'd be better to be outside because the smoke doesn't build up and hang in the room instead it dissipates and people don't have to breath half of there air as smoke. Besides everyone ahs to deal with a little smoke outside because of cars. Also if you can make peopl more comfortable why be an asshole and smoke when it ruins people meals. It's not that hard to wait or smoke before you go. You're also being a hipocrite saying that people push their opinions on others when you're telling people it's there fault they can't deal with you so fuck 'em.
Smoking is part of their meal and they're at a location that allows smoking. To me, it's silly to be mad at them ruining your meal, when you decided to go to a place that allows smoking. That should have been a factor in your decision if you knew that it would have been an issue. They're not being assholes by smoking in a smoking establishment. It ruins your meal, but you suggesting they smoke before or after ruins their meal - if that's how they choose to eat.
Also, I'm not being a hypocrite. You go into a fast-food restaurant you should expect fast-food, go into a bar - expect drunks and alcohol. Go into a place that allows people to smoke and expect smoking. It's real easy to restrict other people's rights when it's something that bugs you - but, it's even easier to go somewhere else, if you know that smoking will bug you - and smoking will be around - go somewhere else.
I'd be a hypocrite if I said smokers should go into non-smoking places and complain that they can't smoke there, because the clean air is ruining their meal.
Babies no, but perfume should have some sort of legal restriction yes.
Bottom line is that if you want to kill yourself that is your choice, but smoke carries from smoking sections, clings to cloths, and overall irritates alot of people especially with respiratory problems. So we are still talking about something that leaves the smell of smoke, wrings the health care system dry and causes discomfort or in some cases serious problems for others. I think in that case its only fair that smokers should have to pay more, especially those who know what they are getting into going into it. If you choose to start yourself on an addictive substance that you know will damage yourself let alone others then you should not be surprised when people get ticked off or ask you to pay more.
And yes its an addiction, but you know what? They know its one getting into it and they CAN quit. Its hard, and it sucks, but it CAN be done. This is not an issue of equal rights this is a matter of choosing to do something with a measurably harmful effect and then having the price of the item raised to compensate. They cost society more and cause more discomfort for others so that makes up for it.
I'm glad we can agree on perfume...most of that stuff is foul and I'm a smoker.
Oddly enough, we can't kill ourselves outright - we have to pay an arm and a leg to do so. You are correct about the byproducts of smoking: poor ventilation makes smoke carry, it sticks to clothing, irritates a lot of people especially with respiratory problems, among MANY other issues. Let's not forget about the litter, the massive financial drain on millions of people, the mega-corporations that lie, steal and cheat their way into killing their customers, etc etc. Smoking is bad.
However, it's legal. If smokers are allowed indoors, then you have alternatives as to if you choose to be around smokers or not. It's when they're outdoors, like most laws are forcing them to be now, then you - as a random bystander - will probably get smoke in the face. Smokers are magical beings, but they can't control the wind.
I think being overweight wrings the health-care system dry more, smokers put a lot of money into that system - then, they use that system. Most likely, more money is put into whatever health-care system by smokers than they use. Fat people just eat a lot, and most food is not taxed like the rest of things (that just might be in the US).
While I'm not arguing if smoking is bad (it obviously is) - you are part of a culture that keeps it legal, whatever the reasons, you have to accept the responsibility of being one in that culture. If it's that bad, then by all means, try to make it illegal. You'll save tons of lives, by restricting their rights.
But, nickel and diming them is not beneficial. It's a downward spiral of restricting the rights of those that aren't 'one of us'. Next, it's let's tax cake-munchers, cause they're utilizing our health-care system and who wants to look at overweight people? Let's tax meat-eaters cause cows are destroying our environment, let's tax the chronically sick - cause they're a downer. Retarded people? They're going to be a drain on society for the rest of their lives, let's tax them, too. (The previous sentences are not my opinions. Our humanity is wrapped up in how we help the needy.)
As for your addiction paragraph. This is coming from someone that studies brains and how they work, albeit I'm not too terribly far into my courses...
All of these arguments about smoking is bad, raise taxes, etc - actually increases the chance that a certain population will start to smoke. You even did it yourself, classifying it as a 'habit', instead of a death sentence (addiction), might make someone that is on the fence slightly more likely to do it. Odd, how the brain works. "They know its one getting into it and they CAN quit." <- That is a sentence that makes it more okay to smoke, because everyone thinks they are one of those that CAN quit. You, and smokers, are just your brain - the body goes along for the ride - when you, the brain, needs something (addiction, for example) it tries to get it. Breaking addictions is one of the hardest things someone can do, and I'm sorry, but the average person on the street avoids hard-work like it's the plague.
When people get all pissy about smokers, essentially saying, "take their money!" or act like assholes to them, ridicule them, etc - they're going to keep smoking. A support structure and education, is what is needed to stop the smoking scourge on mankind. Or, an all-out ban on it, but that just treats everyone like babies.
whoops1995: No, this isn't about the novel.(which if you havn't read, you should definitly check it out.) This thread is about the increasing price of cigarettes. I'm not sure about other places, but where I live, I've noticed how incredibly expensive cigarettes have gotten. It's about 6 dollars for a pack. Why is it so high? Is it to discourage smoking? or is it because the state knows that people can't stop smoking and are trying to squeeze as much money as possible out of them? Is it right? On one hand your over charging people who can't help the fact that they're addicted, but on the other hand, in theory this should be helping smokers quit and help themselves, while helping the community and bringing more money to the town. I personally say it's not right. I've never smoked and probably will never, but from what i've seen, it looks incredibly addicting. In my eyes it's like taking candy from a baby.
I think it is both to discourage smoking and get more money. On the one hand it is not right, come to think of it I can't think of when it is right but taking advantage of people always makes you rich. However by smoking people are screwing themselves anyway, there are so many more creative and exciting ways to die,
It's more than twice that for a pack of smokes where I come from. I don't care either way, scotch is my poisen and tastes a crapload better than cigarettes.
kaiZie: your moaning about 6 dollars!? thats what, about 4 quid or something, and I guess this is for a pack of 20? thats cheap! try about £5.50 in the UK! so nearly 10 dollars or something around that figure! Plus we get pictures like Canada do on their smokes! except ours are very Bristish so no messed up lungs, just a picture of a bendy cigarette saying "smoking causes impotence"
5.5 British pounds = 8.1136 U.S. dollars - so says magical google.
About right for my area, West Coast of the States.
We bitch about $2 dollar gallons of gasoline here, as well. So, £1.34 for 3.79 liters? What do you guys pay for that?
A little more than double that down under, was a lot worse a few months ago (About $1 a L now, or ~50P, but for ages it was like $1.40 ~80P
weee double post. Don't know why I had to seperate posts going in tabs in one topic :S
kaiZie: your moaning about 6 dollars!? thats what, about 4 quid or something, and I guess this is for a pack of 20? thats cheap! try about £5.50 in the UK! so nearly 10 dollars or something around that figure! Plus we get pictures like Canada do on their smokes! except ours are very Bristish so no messed up lungs, just a picture of a bendy cigarette saying "smoking causes impotence"
5.5 British pounds = 8.1136 U.S. dollars - so says magical google.
About right for my area, West Coast of the States.
We bitch about $2 dollar gallons of gasoline here, as well. So, £1.34 for 3.79 liters? What do you guys pay for that?
Yeah, in the UK for the last 2 years its been over £1 a litre, at one point it hit about £1.30 petrol, £1.80 diesel. Recently it's been dropping down to around 0.85p ish. But even still, we always pay more than the US no matter what it tends to be, and usually a hell of a lot more
Bourne: The newest law they are attempting to pass is no smoking in your vehicle with children in said vehicle.
I know i'm taking you out of context here so bare with me. I don't see whats wrong with this law. Second hand smoke isnt very good for children and watching their parents smoke will probably make them more likely to smoke themselves(no sexual references intended) also it's really not safe to drive and smoke, not only do you not have two hands on the wheel but, everytime you exhale smoke, your temporarily blinded. not to mention it's a distraction.
*SNIP*
Now that I come to think about it, if I'm not mistaken, it's actually illegal to smoke and drive here in the U.S I don't if it was passed yet, but i think it has. As you said though, other people arn't as good drivers as you and some lack good judgement( example of bad judgement: well the roads are slick with snow...lets light up while driving!) I see this sort of bad driving and judgement alot in new jersey. I'm guessing they have better drivers in europe because if not how could you have the autobahn. I think this law is appropiate in the states because of the lack of driving skills, but in Europe, I don't know maybe you guys can ahndle smoking and driving.
I have not heard of any law of that nature in the United States and would be astonished if it were passed, although since I am not a smoker myself it would not bother me. Some people are indeed better multi-taskers however I will never agree with idiots who attempt to text message while driving. There is multi-tasking (drinking and driving (non-alcoholic beverages), fiddling with the stereo and etc.) yet certain things such as the aforementioned are pushing the limits.
Also mate, I am Canadian just to note which is why it would surprise me if this law existed. Glad I never took up smoking for yet another reason to say the least.
Frankly I think its a good thing, now they just need to put more of a tax on alcohol. I do admit that I think everyone should have the right to do what they wish with their own lives. However when dealing with something like smoking that generally causes discomfort and sometimes even adverse reactions in the rest of us a fee of some sort should be paid. Even if the whole 'second hand smoke' thing is trumped up (Which I doubt it is, at least not much) I still know that it smells bad, triggers peoples asthma and can lead to nausea or other issues.
So long story short if you guys are going to insist on a habbit that not only kills you faster but makes the rest of us uncomfortable to be around you the least you guys can do is help fund schools and road reconstruction a tiny bit more than the rest of us. Consider it Karma for making us hang around people who smell like smoldering diapers.