Excessive swearing just comes across as low brow. It's almost as if people can't find anything powerful or meaningful to say so they use expletives to add shock value.
As corporate_gamer just mentioned, what makes swear words more invalid adjectives than other words?
They're no less valid, they just make you sound like you have the vocabulary of a ten year old. It's like when you're reading a book and the author keeps using a certain word or phrase over and over and you feel like calling them up and telling them to buy a thesaurus.
Yes I generally to enjoy some moderate swearing from time to time. I only consider swear words as a strong way to express you self. Tough swearing just to swear is something I leave to other people. I remember one time in High school were a used a "swear word" to described a person. My teacher got really upset and told me too stop, we broke hell lose and started a month long discussion about freedom of speech. I was essentially backed by my old teacher which was more old and wise than the new one. He told me that the word i used wasn't even a swear word but a recognized adjective.
J-Man: Is it just me, or is swearing awesome? And I don't get those people who snootily say "How vulgar!" Words are just sounds and shapes that we use to communicate, how the fuck can they offend you?
That's a very close minded point of view you put forth there. You're basically saying that because of your upbringing, you can't understand why anyone would find swearing offensive. You fail to acknowledge that people are brought up differently, so to others what you deem unoffensive is offensive. And no it isn't up to them to not be offended by what you are saying, it is up to you to acknowledge that some people won't like what you're saying and to watch what you say.
On another note I personally don't mind swearing, but I never swear unless I'm angry or I really want to get a point across. I find that if you swear too much and you're annoyed with someone and want to let them know about it, when you swear it has nowhere near the same effect as it would coming from someone who never/rarely swears.
Something else I just thought of aswell is that, overall, the ladies don't tend to like swearing. It's not an attractive quality.
Where the fuck did I mention my fucking upbrining? I can, in fact, acknowledge people's perceptions of swear words, and like I've repeated a dozen times, it is my intent to notify people they ARE JUST WORDS. It is usually only insecure people who worry or are offended by swear words (sorry for any generalisations).
I know you didn't mention your upbringing, but it's because of your upbringing that you maintain your point of view that swearing can't be offensive seeing as they're just words. Other people's upbringings will be different, and a lot of people would have been taught that swearing is offensive. I don't think you got the point of what I was saying.
As for the insecure part, I'd agree that some people who find swearing offensive might be insecure. But I'd also say that people who constantly swear are often percieved to be insecure aswell, if not more so.
Oh, and regarding the first series of quotes, please don't assosciate me with Mr. Ollivander.
Haha that made me chuckle. Its nice to see that you're actually wanting to debate this topic properly, rather than just trying to annoy people like Mr. Ollivander here.
Mr0llivand3r: if you took the time out of your day to try to combat the topic of this thread to argue your point you were obviously offended.
Oh that's right! Thank you SO much for telling me how I feel. Oh wait.
No, I'm not offended. I joined in the topic because I agreed with a previous poster, and decided to voice my own opinion (Like everyone else in this thread...and that's the 'opinion' part, not technically the 'agreeing with a previous poster' part).
At least we're both smart enough individuals to not drop to low levels and flame each other.
So, onto the debate.
Yes, calling someone an idiot when they do something stupid is valid, but not because they can't express themselves, that's just a lack of vocabulary.
No, swearing doesn't ooze maturity. Neither does elitism.
If people swear a lot, it becomes just another thing they say, and so you can in fact understand the central message. If I'm having a conversation with someone and they swear a lot, I don't stand there with my mouth gaping open and vacant gaze on my eyes think "sheesh he swears a lot"
Once again, I didn't know the English language had dregs. It's not a beer, it's a language. All words are valid. Yours are, mine are, even David fucking Cameron's are. It's your choice as to how to interpret or perceive them.
You know what I like about this post? You were articulate! You only swore once, and it was completely unnecessary!
Look, I'm not saying that all swearing should cease immediately. It can be very fitting when you're angry, upset, hurt, etc. But in regular conversation, it's just flat out not needed.
Like I said earlier, we more then likely won't be convincing each other of anything in this thread. I don't think you're an idiot, or a 'bad person' or anything like that, and I think we really will have to agree to disagree. I don't want to progress these quote threads into a flame-war, or personal attacks (Even though we've already dipped our toes in THAT pool a little bit).
Mr0llivand3r: they're just words, and words don't hurt.
You sir, are incredibly naive. That is a ridiculous thing to say. Words hurt all the time.
It is your choice whether they could hurt or not.
Except the N word. Anyone saying such a word (including black people) should be punched in the face by the nearest person.
I'm sorry, but that bullshit about "You can choose whether or not to be offended by something someone does or says" is ridiculous. If someone does something to offend you, you have every right to be offended.
Mr0llivand3r: they're just words, and words don't hurt.
You sir, are incredibly naive. That is a ridiculous thing to say. Words hurt all the time.
no, they don't, you pussy. it's just a collection of organized sounds interpreted by the brain of the individual who hears it.
words DON'T hurt. and if you think they hurt, how about you call a hardened muscle-head U.S. Marine a "douchebag fucking pansy faggot shithead cockless bastard".
then after he knocks your fucking lights out, then you can evaluate who was hurt more.
Get off the roids, jackass. You're a moron, and your posts constantly reflect that.
Ionami: [quote="Mr0llivand3r" post="18.82636.1132657"]they're just words, and words don't hurt.
You sir, are incredibly naive. That is a ridiculous thing to say. Words hurt all the time.
It is your choice whether they could hurt or not.
Except the N word. Anyone saying such a word (including black people) should be punched in the face by the nearest person.
What a delightful double standard!
You won't use the 'N' word because it's offensive (And it makes you sound like an uneducated waste of time). BUT, using your own logic, black people are choosing to be offended, right? So it should be a free-for-all!
if you took the time out of your day to try to combat the topic of this thread to argue your point you were obviously offended.
It's not a question of being offended. The point of this thread is to merely debate different points of view, and if someone sees a point of view that conflicts with their own then they are entitled to argue their case. Stop trying to annoy people.
Mr0llivand3r: if you took the time out of your day to try to combat the topic of this thread to argue your point you were obviously offended.
Oh that's right! Thank you SO much for telling me how I feel. Oh wait.
No, I'm not offended. I joined in the topic because I agreed with a previous poster, and decided to voice my own opinion (Like everyone else in this thread...and that's the 'opinion' part, not technically the 'agreeing with a previous poster' part).
J-Man: [quote="Baby Tea" post="18.82636.1132721"] At least we're both smart enough individuals to not drop to low levels and flame each other.
So, onto the debate.
Yes, calling someone an idiot when they do something stupid is valid, but not because they can't express themselves, that's just a lack of vocabulary.
No, swearing doesn't ooze maturity. Neither does elitism.
If people swear a lot, it becomes just another thing they say, and so you can in fact understand the central message. If I'm having a conversation with someone and they swear a lot, I don't stand there with my mouth gaping open and vacant gaze on my eyes think "sheesh he swears a lot"
Once again, I didn't know the English language had dregs. It's not a beer, it's a language. All words are valid. Yours are, mine are, even David fucking Cameron's are. It's your choice as to how to interpret or perceive them.
You know what I like about this post? You were articulate! You only swore once, and it was completely unnecessary!
Look, I'm not saying that all swearing should cease immediately. It can be very fitting when you're angry, upset, hurt, etc. But in regular conversation, it's just flat out not needed.
Like I said earlier, we more then likely won't be convincing each other of anything in this thread. I don't think you're an idiot, or a 'bad person' or anything like that, and I think we really will have to agree to disagree. I don't want to progress these quote threads into a flame-war, or personal attacks (Even though we've already dipped our toes in THAT pool a little bit).
Fair enough?
Hey, this is why I love the escapist. It's basically online bohemia.
Can I make my side clear? I appreciate swearing at suitable times (not around children), and when it can be used to fit in with a dialogue. Other times, it can be used for humorous effect (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=XdJAgjOLLYw), and finally it can be repetitively used showing a lack of vocabulary (Ollivander). Most importantly, it is people's choice how to perceive words.
Ionam your right .. But you can choice. I choose to not get offended but that does not mean I can swear against other people(too offend them, or just joke.).. They might not made the same choice.
Uhh...you just proved the other guys point. If words were merely 'words', as you suggest, then the Marine in question would simple laugh it off, or walk away! But he would be offended! Upset enough, even, to beat someone to a pulp. So either you need a better example, or words aren't just words.
uhh... actually no i didn't. the marine dude would probably be offended, but he would no doubt brush it off as nothing after a little while. verbal insults are easy to discourage because they have no lasting effect (that is, of course, if the person being insulted is strong enough to realize that it was just words) but when he gives you a black eye and a broken jaw, you're the one who ended up hurt.
have you ever heard the phrase "sticks and stones can break my bones but your words will never hurt me" ?
Oh for the love of...Ok, I'm going to explain this one more time, and if you don't get it then I don't care anymore. Read carefully.
IF words were just words, then the Marine would NOT attack the guy! After all 'Words never hurt me!'
However, if the Marine beat someone because they said something rude to him, then words ARE offensive (Even if for only a short while) and you have made NO point.
We are obviously not talking about PHYSICAL pain when it comes to words. That's silly. Unless you're using 'Power Word: Pain'...but DnD doesn't really work here.
I only swear while playing 2 games: - Zombie Panic Source - Mario Cart Double Dash (Its more of a love spat, I really so enjoy feeling my blood pressure rise till I can hear anymore)
Hey, this is why I love the escapist. It's basically online bohemia.
Can I make my side clear? I appreciate swearing at suitable times (not around children), and when it can be used to fit in with a dialogue. Other times, it can be used for humorous effect (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=XdJAgjOLLYw), and finally it can be repetitively used showing a lack of vocabulary (Ollivander). Most importantly, it is people's choice how to perceive words.
Non-offensive for me:
fuck shit twat etc.
offensive for me:
n word kike paki etc
Fair enough! I understand your position a bit better now. I think I wrapped up what you're saying with Mr.Ollivander's shining example.
While I stick by that swearing isn't really needed for the 90% of the time I hear it used (Admittedly, mostly on Xbox Live), I think we both agree that there is a time and place where it is fine (That is, at least not offensive) and a time and place where it is not fine (around children, etc).
Hey, this is why I love the escapist. It's basically online bohemia.
Can I make my side clear? I appreciate swearing at suitable times (not around children), and when it can be used to fit in with a dialogue. Other times, it can be used for humorous effect (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=XdJAgjOLLYw), and finally it can be repetitively used showing a lack of vocabulary (Ollivander). Most importantly, it is people's choice how to perceive words.
Non-offensive for me:
fuck shit twat etc.
offensive for me:
n word kike paki etc
Fair enough! I understand your position a bit better now. I think I wrapped up what you're saying with Mr.Ollivander's shining example.
While I stick by that swearing isn't really needed for the 90% of the time I hear it used (Admittedly, mostly on Xbox Live), I think we both agree that there is a time and place where it is fine (That is, at least not offensive) and a time and place where it is not fine (around children, etc).
I love the Escapist. Hugs all around!
*hugs*
Oh, and for the love of god if I ever left the relative safety of PC for Xbox Live I think I'd probably hang myself.
Mr0llivand3r: if you took the time out of your day to try to combat the topic of this thread to argue your point you were obviously offended.
Oh that's right! Thank you SO much for telling me how I feel. Oh wait.
No, I'm not offended. I joined in the topic because I agreed with a previous poster, and decided to voice my own opinion (Like everyone else in this thread...and that's the 'opinion' part, not technically the 'agreeing with a previous poster' part).
At least we're both smart enough individuals to not drop to low levels and flame each other.
So, onto the debate.
Yes, calling someone an idiot when they do something stupid is valid, but not because they can't express themselves, that's just a lack of vocabulary.
No, swearing doesn't ooze maturity. Neither does elitism.
If people swear a lot, it becomes just another thing they say, and so you can in fact understand the central message. If I'm having a conversation with someone and they swear a lot, I don't stand there with my mouth gaping open and vacant gaze on my eyes think "sheesh he swears a lot"
Once again, I didn't know the English language had dregs. It's not a beer, it's a language. All words are valid. Yours are, mine are, even David fucking Cameron's are. It's your choice as to how to interpret or perceive them.
You know what I like about this post? You were articulate! You only swore once, and it was completely unnecessary!
Look, I'm not saying that all swearing should cease immediately. It can be very fitting when you're angry, upset, hurt, etc. But in regular conversation, it's just flat out not needed.
Like I said earlier, we more then likely won't be convincing each other of anything in this thread. I don't think you're an idiot, or a 'bad person' or anything like that, and I think we really will have to agree to disagree. I don't want to progress these quote threads into a flame-war, or personal attacks (Even though we've already dipped our toes in THAT pool a little bit).
Fair enough?
Alright I'll take over for Baby Tea then :p. Nah I just wanted to comment on one of J-man's points.
You're saying that people can choose whether or not to be offended by swearing or by what people say, but bringing me back to my other point, it can be largely due to that person's conditioning aswell. They might not have the ability to choose whether or not they find what you're saying offensive or not, since they have been taught to solely believe that swearing is wrong/offensive.
Though to be honest, I don't think people would get too offended by swearing, it just affects the way they percieve you as a person. If a person who has been conditioned to believe swearing is offensive is listening to you to swear all the time, they'll simply think you're just rude. I guess then it just comes down to whether or not you would be bothered by that.
Mr0llivand3r: if you took the time out of your day to try to combat the topic of this thread to argue your point you were obviously offended.
Oh that's right! Thank you SO much for telling me how I feel. Oh wait.
No, I'm not offended. I joined in the topic because I agreed with a previous poster, and decided to voice my own opinion (Like everyone else in this thread...and that's the 'opinion' part, not technically the 'agreeing with a previous poster' part).
At least we're both smart enough individuals to not drop to low levels and flame each other.
So, onto the debate.
Yes, calling someone an idiot when they do something stupid is valid, but not because they can't express themselves, that's just a lack of vocabulary.
No, swearing doesn't ooze maturity. Neither does elitism.
If people swear a lot, it becomes just another thing they say, and so you can in fact understand the central message. If I'm having a conversation with someone and they swear a lot, I don't stand there with my mouth gaping open and vacant gaze on my eyes think "sheesh he swears a lot"
Once again, I didn't know the English language had dregs. It's not a beer, it's a language. All words are valid. Yours are, mine are, even David fucking Cameron's are. It's your choice as to how to interpret or perceive them.
You know what I like about this post? You were articulate! You only swore once, and it was completely unnecessary!
Look, I'm not saying that all swearing should cease immediately. It can be very fitting when you're angry, upset, hurt, etc. But in regular conversation, it's just flat out not needed.
Like I said earlier, we more then likely won't be convincing each other of anything in this thread. I don't think you're an idiot, or a 'bad person' or anything like that, and I think we really will have to agree to disagree. I don't want to progress these quote threads into a flame-war, or personal attacks (Even though we've already dipped our toes in THAT pool a little bit).
Fair enough?
Alright I'll take over for Pedro then :p. Nah I just wanted to comment on one of J-man's points.
You're saying that people can choose whether or not to be offended by swearing or by what people say, but bringing me back to my other point, it can be largely due to that person's conditioning aswell. They might not have the ability to choose whether or not they find what you're saying offensive or not, since they have been taught to solely believe that swearing is wrong/offensive.
Though to be honest, I don't think people would get too offended by swearing, it just affects the way they percieve you as a person. If a person who has been conditioned to believe swearing is offensive is listening to you to swear all the time, they'll simply think you're just rude. I guess then it just comes down to whether or not you would be bothered by that.
You present entirely valid points. I swear in moderation (limiting myself to one "fuck" for every 2 sentences).
Uhh...you just proved the other guys point. If words were merely 'words', as you suggest, then the Marine in question would simple laugh it off, or walk away! But he would be offended! Upset enough, even, to beat someone to a pulp. So either you need a better example, or words aren't just words.
uhh... actually no i didn't. the marine dude would probably be offended, but he would no doubt brush it off as nothing after a little while. verbal insults are easy to discourage because they have no lasting effect (that is, of course, if the person being insulted is strong enough to realize that it was just words) but when he gives you a black eye and a broken jaw, you're the one who ended up hurt.
have you ever heard the phrase "sticks and stones can break my bones but your words will never hurt me" ?
Oh for the love of...Ok, I'm going to explain this one more time, and if you don't get it then I don't care anymore. Read carefully.
IF words were just words, then the Marine would NOT attack the guy! After all 'Words never hurt me!'
However, if the Marine beat someone because they said something rude to him, then words ARE offensive (Even if for only a short while) and you have made NO point.
We are obviously not talking about PHYSICAL pain when it comes to words. That's silly. Unless you're using 'Power Word: Pain'...but DnD doesn't really work here.
It's useless Baby Tea. I don't think he'll ever understand...
Mr0llivand3r: if you took the time out of your day to try to combat the topic of this thread to argue your point you were obviously offended.
Oh that's right! Thank you SO much for telling me how I feel. Oh wait.
No, I'm not offended. I joined in the topic because I agreed with a previous poster, and decided to voice my own opinion (Like everyone else in this thread...and that's the 'opinion' part, not technically the 'agreeing with a previous poster' part).
At least we're both smart enough individuals to not drop to low levels and flame each other.
So, onto the debate.
Yes, calling someone an idiot when they do something stupid is valid, but not because they can't express themselves, that's just a lack of vocabulary.
No, swearing doesn't ooze maturity. Neither does elitism.
If people swear a lot, it becomes just another thing they say, and so you can in fact understand the central message. If I'm having a conversation with someone and they swear a lot, I don't stand there with my mouth gaping open and vacant gaze on my eyes think "sheesh he swears a lot"
Once again, I didn't know the English language had dregs. It's not a beer, it's a language. All words are valid. Yours are, mine are, even David fucking Cameron's are. It's your choice as to how to interpret or perceive them.
You know what I like about this post? You were articulate! You only swore once, and it was completely unnecessary!
Look, I'm not saying that all swearing should cease immediately. It can be very fitting when you're angry, upset, hurt, etc. But in regular conversation, it's just flat out not needed.
Like I said earlier, we more then likely won't be convincing each other of anything in this thread. I don't think you're an idiot, or a 'bad person' or anything like that, and I think we really will have to agree to disagree. I don't want to progress these quote threads into a flame-war, or personal attacks (Even though we've already dipped our toes in THAT pool a little bit).
Fair enough?
Alright I'll take over for Pedro then :p. Nah I just wanted to comment on one of J-man's points.
You're saying that people can choose whether or not to be offended by swearing or by what people say, but bringing me back to my other point, it can be largely due to that person's conditioning aswell. They might not have the ability to choose whether or not they find what you're saying offensive or not, since they have been taught to solely believe that swearing is wrong/offensive.
Though to be honest, I don't think people would get too offended by swearing, it just affects the way they percieve you as a person. If a person who has been conditioned to believe swearing is offensive is listening to you to swear all the time, they'll simply think you're just rude. I guess then it just comes down to whether or not you would be bothered by that.
You present entirely valid points. I swear in moderation (limiting myself to one "fuck" for every 2 sentences).
Well if that's not moderation at a reasonable level, then I don't what is. Thanks again for not developing this into a flame war. It's been a while since I've had a good debate :)
EDIT: I just realised I quoted the wrong name in my quote above :S. It was directed at Baby Tea, though I guess that was kind of obvious anyway.
I find nothing offensive about swearing, it shows mere emotion. That's about it. Unless you're actually aiming it at someone. And if i'm swearing at them, they deserve it.
Esades: Swearing is like chili. You can use it to spice up the conversation, but swearing too much is just stupid. People will not take you seriously if you use swear words as punctuation marks.
Couldn't have put it any better myself. Kudos to you, sir.
I have never used a swear word in my entire life - except repeating what other people have said - and I don't particularly feel the loss. There are plenty of more creative words to describe what I am thinking.
Robyrt: I have never used a swear word in my entire life - except repeating what other people have said - and I don't particularly feel the loss. There are plenty of more creative words to describe what I am thinking.
Really!? Never!? Not even when you're angry, or you stub your toe? Kudos to you good sir.
Meh, since its so many threads here, Im as usual to lazy to check this hasnt brought up before(even though I this time tried to read everything, but it didnt work, sorry).
Swearing/cursing whatever you like to call it, is, like all other words, used to express yourself and communicate. I do swear alot when Im angry, dissapointed, annoyed, or even when I experience something good. If I were to guess, I think many people(atleast swedish ones), are familiar with using sentences like this; "Hahaha, that was so fucking genious/hilarious!", I personally use it when I watch funny TV-shows or clips(Zero Punctuation for example, and the swedish show Parlamentet if you've ever heard of it). But its more common that I use swearwords when Im angry or annoyed, which some people close to me seems to like to trigger.
And back to the whole reason of this thread, are you the only one who like swearwords, do I like them? The answear is clearly yes, but I dont favor swearwords over other words, but since I am a teenager, and teenagers swear alot, I probably would say "You damn pile of shit!" than "You big pile of poo!", since its something I more commonly hear and now use.
Also this "hurts people" and "is rude" thing is true, but seriously, if you complain about swearwords hurts people, then I can complain about how FUCKING annoying and rude it is when people blow cigarette smoke in my face when Im waiting for the bus, it hurts people to, and I think that is a bigger issue than people using swearwords.
Ubuntus: Ionam your right .. But you can choice. I choose to not get offended but that does not mean I can swear against other people(too offend them, or just joke.).. They might not made the same choice.
Right. That's what I'm saying. That logic only holds up for so long. No matter what, there will always be people who will be offended or hurt by certain things, and the best you can do is try to accommodate those people's feelings. It's called being considerate.
And for the record, I swear on a regular basis. My girlfriend hates swearing. So I try my best to keep it to a minimum around her. And at work. However, I swear with my friends and family, as long as it remains appropriate. That's all there is to it.
Ubuntus: Ionam your right .. But you can choice. I choose to not get offended but that does not mean I can swear against other people(too offend them, or just joke.).. They might not made the same choice.
Right. That's what I'm saying. That logic only holds up for so long. No matter what, there will always be people who will be offended or hurt by certain things, and the best you can do is try to accommodate those people's feelings. It's called being considerate.
And for the record, I swear on a regular basis. My girlfriend hates swearing. So I try my best to keep it to a minimum around her. And at work. However, I swear with my friends and family, as long as it remains appropriate. That's all there is to it.
The best strategy with swearing is not to, unless you're around people who don't give a shit. oops.
Ubuntus: Ionam your right .. But you can choice. I choose to not get offended but that does not mean I can swear against other people(too offend them, or just joke.).. They might not made the same choice.
Right. That's what I'm saying. That logic only holds up for so long. No matter what, there will always be people who will be offended or hurt by certain things, and the best you can do is try to accommodate those people's feelings. It's called being considerate.
And for the record, I swear on a regular basis. My girlfriend hates swearing. So I try my best to keep it to a minimum around her. And at work. However, I swear with my friends and family, as long as it remains appropriate. That's all there is to it.
The best strategy with swearing is not to, unless you're around people who don't give a shit. oops.
Is that you trying to get a rise out of me? Or are you just trying to mess with other folks? Because if you're messing with me, I just finished saying how I don't mind swearing. I just think there's a time and a place. And I'm willing to respect other people's sensibilities or beliefs.
I don't mind people swearing ... but i do hate the ones that swear every other word or emphasize the swear word. It's like having cucumber in tuna sandwiches: when the cucumber slice is thin, sure it's noticeable , but hey. But if you put half a cucumber in it, well done, you've spoiled the sandwich. I admittedly swear a fair bit, but i blame the fact i work in what effectively is a workshop that never has any visitors or female presence.
Oh and to all those people that say words don't hurt ... just wait till your misses/fella comes out with "I've been seeing someone behind your back" or "I don't love you anymore". And don't forget kids, wars have been started over words.
They're no less valid, they just make you sound like you have the vocabulary of a ten year old. It's like when you're reading a book and the author keeps using a certain word or phrase over and over and you feel like calling them up and telling them to buy a thesaurus.