Minecraft's Symbolism Analyzed! Analysis of the Ending

 Pages PREV 1 2
 

A couple points, mostly nitpicking. First off, I pretty much liked the entire video save a few things that seemed a bit of a stretch for me.

The main thing I did not like was that most of these ideas seem to be extrapolated from the ending text of Minecraft, rather than the gameplay itself. Note, this may be just because I played the game since the Alpha stage, before The End was a thing, but I and most of the people I ask about it seem to think that the ending "cinematic" was a contrived piece of crap that had very little bearing on what the game actually meant to us players at the time.

Majorly, I think the above is because there is not a single word of spoken or text dialog before the very end of the game, and then suddenly it gets all metaphysical and whatnot. While I don't disagree that there are some thought-provoking lines in there, I do disagree with the ending being that big of a part of the meaning.

Other than that, it's just a couple spelling mistakes, some badly sized annotation bubbles (text ran off the end and into the video), and some audio mixing issues -- namely where there was an electronic remix of one of C418's songs near the beginning that kinda drowned you out a bit.

Aside from all that, I thought it was all pretty enjoyable to watch, and I would recommend keeping it up, possibly making a series out of it and getting partnership down the road.

Steeveeo:
-snippity snip

That was one of the more helpful critiques I've gotten thus far, so thanks.

For the ending text well....I see it as hinting to the existing subtext. I just wanted to explain what I think Jeb and Friends were getting at.

I also thought it was just another time waster at first but even if that ending was thought of retro-actively (which I think it likely was), it still kinda makes sense. Subtext can be accidental, if that makes sense. I'm a writer and I make some subconscious symbolism that I only notice later all the time. But yes, it was most likely added AFTER the fact. But I still personally believe it all fits. Just my interpretation. I see it as a hint to what was there.

Thanks for the feedback and the encouragement. I'm halfway done with the next video as I type this, actually, so I'm definitely continuing the show. :)

(side note: Holy crap this forum post is now 2 pages long.)

Overusedname:

Steeveeo:
-snippity snip

-snip you too!

True, true. I guess we all get our own opinions off of it, but mine leans more toward Survival SSP from before The End. Essentially, I believe that there's a certain profoundness within the quiet desolation of Single Player (not sure if this can really ever apply to Multiplayer). The player is pretty much the only human on a nigh on infinitely expansive world, populated only by wild beasts and malevolent monsters (and now Squidward). The music by C418 does an incredible job of communicating the feeling of being alone, with nothing but your creations to keep you company.

But, well, I guess the subtext of the game evolves just as much as the game itself. Also, in writing this, I realize now how much I miss "simple" Minecraft, before NPCs, creative mode, gigantically advanced redstone circuitry, and Big Bad Bosses (that don't actually attack back, now there's gotta be some sort of subtext there).

I have removed my words from this site.

Steeveeo:

But, well, I guess the subtext of the game evolves just as much as the game itself. Also, in writing this, I realize now how much I miss "simple" Minecraft, before NPCs, creative mode, gigantically advanced redstone circuitry, and Big Bad Bosses (that don't actually attack back, now there's gotta be some sort of subtext there).

Makes me think of Shadow of the Colossus. Those titans never really DID anything to you, now did they?

The opportunity for introspection was always there, in my opinion. It just wasn't emphasized with words; just gameplay.

DeadpanLunatic:

Whether subtext is 'accidental' or in line with the authors intended reading is irrelevant, the creator of a text does not hold the keys to its meaning. Meaning is created through your own interaction with the text.

On that note, I also disagree that the end text was what added this level of introspection to Minecraft. Actually, I came to that realization 45 minutes into my first session, when I first got out of the hole I had been digging to look at my work and realized that I had been so wrapped up in figuring out the mechanics (since the game is tight-lipped in this regard) I was basically engaged in a form of play therapy for those old enough to only look at you funny when you hand them real toys.

Good point here. I guess I can also note that I joined right before the 'End' Patch was added.

Our own interaction with the work is always important; we take our own perspective into it, and that's taken to an even greater extent in videogames.

DeadpanLunatic:

Using space as an extension of the self is not new to me, being the core concept of Campbell's work, so I'm afraid I wasn't really blown away by your video. To be fair I probably wouldn't have stayed if I had reached the end 'credits' myself yet. But still, fairly good stuff you have there.

I don't expect to blow everyone away everytime, only people who never thought of it that way. That's why I also try to keep it funny and otherwise informative, and try to provide at least an alternative interpretation. And it seems we came to similar conclussions of the game's best element: Introspection, which I find interesting.

And thank you. If you still thought it was good despite the fact that I preaching to the choir, that's a good sign.

DeadpanLunatic:

If you ever want to do just text, let me know. How would you like to write for me?

I love to use audio, but I've written for quite a while. It could be cool to give it a shot. :D I'd love to get some more experience.

Also...I'm a little new to the community (Though I already love the discussion here). I see you're involved in the Community showcase, is that what you're referring to? Or something else?

I have removed my words from this site.

DeadpanLunatic:

Overusedname:

I love to use audio, but I've written for quite a while. It could be cool to give it a shot. :D I'd love to get some more experience.

Also...I'm a little new to the community (Though I already love the discussion here). I see you're involved in the Community showcase, is that what you're referring to? Or something else?

Something else. I'm trying to build an amateur gaming publication called Haywire Magazine, so I never skip an opportunity to find new contributors now. I can put you on the mailing list and forward our previous updates if you like, just send me your email address in private.

Kay, I sent the address. Thank you for the offer, I'll certainly consider it. :)

DeadpanLunatic:
I don't even agree that Minecraft didn't have an end before they added this one. The feeling of closure, and really that's all this new end can claim for itself since you are still sent back, is there everytime you finish a project and wonder "Now, what?". Sometimes I leave the game for a while then. Sometimes I dive right back into the next project. Point is, just as you always set your own goals in this game, there have always been your own personal endings.

I'd argue there's a difference between an ending offered by a feeling of closure and an ending actually offered by the game. I felt closure immediately after defeating Nyx in Persona 3, but the actual end of the game wasn't for another two months of in game calendar time, and this is in a highly structured (though incredibly poorly paced) JRPG. Come to think of it, that wasn't even the final ending given the existence of "The Answer" which picked up later on in Persona 3 FES, a later addition much like Minecraft's The End.

Overusedname:

I also thought it was just another time waster at first but even if that ending was thought of retro-actively (which I think it likely was), it still kinda makes sense. Subtext can be accidental, if that makes sense. I'm a writer and I make some subconscious symbolism that I only notice later all the time. But yes, it was most likely added AFTER the fact. But I still personally believe it all fits. Just my interpretation. I see it as a hint to what was there.

It's probably worth noting that Minecraft doesn't have a beginning, either, at least not in a terribly formal sense, and thus arguing about an ending strikes as a bit ridiculous. Let's go back in time to before The End was patched (along with NPC villages and regenerating health, etc), and you could only define your position within the world based on how much or how little you influenced your environment. In a way, patching in The End seems a bit like a betrayal. For all intents and purposes, the truest expression of sandbox design had an asinine Herculean challenge inserted into it which corrupted the world with outside forces. Suddenly your own private Eden isn't yours anymore, whether because of the fascinating traces of abandoned villages and deserted mineshafts, or because of the malarkey of strongholds and the ender zone.

Personally, it feels like an identity crisis, as if Minecraft is suddenly going through puberty. What I and (I think) many others liked the most about Minecraft was exploring, and given the fact that we share a tendency to generate ocean biomes and just sail away, I think you're with me on this. For that reason, updates that include new things to explore (jungles, ravines, etc) feel truer than the ones that include new things to do (kill a giant dragon).

To me, The End is meaningless. It puts into cheesy dialogue what it already effortlessly evokes in those who have been playing it for so long, so what's the point? I dig the Mark Twain quip (pun intended), but in the same way I dig those (de)motivation pictures and tumblr quote memes. It's interesting, sure, but not cleverly executed and more than a bit redundant.

As for the video, I'll pretty much be echoing the same sentiments: I liked it. I wouldn't suggest compromising on length, but do make an effort to tighten up the editing somewhat, and know when tangents are and aren't worth exploring. And yeah, I love C418 too, but the levels were a bit off and energetic remixes aren't the most complimenting tunes to play under your thoughtful voice, especially when the serene and introspective original tracks would do the job just fine.

I also want to say that I watched your Zelda videos too, and thought they suffered from the same problems (well, not so much audio mixing as much as sprawling over ambition). Personally, I'm not a fan of the whole "watch webcam footage of someone talk enthusiastically about a video game for 'X' minutes." Frankly, watching people contort their faces in exaggerated reaction to something causes me to cringe embarrassingly, but I do put up with it if I feel I'm actually getting something from it. Fortunately, your videos are worthwhile, but I can't help but feel that you're treading a fine line. In general, I'd advise to you to be careful about how you balance commentary and comedy, but so far I'd point MovieBob to your videos in an effort to remind him that this is what he should be doing with his Game OverThinker series. Hopefully we won't be seeing you sissy fighting yourself in silly costumes in a parking lot.

In conclusion, keep up the good work. Now how about a Persona 3 analysis? :D

I have removed my words from this site.

You are actually a pretty talented guy. Enjoyed the video, subscribed and so on, and I'm glad somebody actually took the time to make a reasoned and occasionally rather funny video about something that most people seem to have reacted badly to.

EDIT: Also, I like your voice. It's a sexy voice.

Maet:

In conclusion, keep up the good work. Now how about a Persona 3 analysis? :D

Thanks for watchin, and yes, I plan on tackling that game somewhere down the road.

snappydog:
You are actually a pretty talented guy. Enjoyed the video, subscribed and so on, and I'm glad somebody actually took the time to make a reasoned and occasionally rather funny video about something that most people seem to have reacted badly to.

EDIT: Also, I like your voice. It's a sexy voice.

Thanks a lot! You can expect a new episode tomorrow afternoon actually.

great vid man, funny intresting and that voice of yours is awsome

I like. I like very much. Very clever, very well done, very interesting. A cookie for you, dearest Prophet.

Or Prophit, I suppose.

blipblop:
great vid man, funny intresting and that voice of yours is awsome

SirPlindington:
I like. I like very much. Very clever, very well done, very interesting. A cookie for you, dearest Prophet.

Or Prophit, I suppose.

Thank ya both.

Very happy with the turnout here, and very surprised just how many people liked it :D 'tis an honor.

Overusedname:

blipblop:
great vid man, funny intresting and that voice of yours is awsome

SirPlindington:
I like. I like very much. Very clever, very well done, very interesting. A cookie for you, dearest Prophet.

Or Prophit, I suppose.

Thank ya both.

Very happy with the turnout here, and very surprised just how many people liked it :D 'tis an honor.

I watched the Ocarina of Time analysis as well. That was just as good. I love what I've seen of your videos.

SirPlindington:

I watched the Ocarina of Time analysis as well. That was just as good. I love what I've seen of your videos.

Glad to hear it :D Thanks again.

I have a few random questions. Will there be more Minecraft episodes? Is this is a series like you did with OoT? Also, just out of curiosity, have you done any promotion for your videos on other online forums like you have here?

Scrustle:
I have a few random questions. Will there be more Minecraft episodes? Is this is a series like you did with OoT? Also, just out of curiosity, have you done any promotion for your videos on other online forums like you have here?

I'd like to do a mini series of episodes were I play other people's creative files and analyze what it says about them. "Minecraft Musings", I like to call it. But there will be no continuation of the MAIN analysis for now.

I put them on Screwattack, no one watched them. This forum post is probably responsible for half my subscribers, honestly. :3 I haven't really spammed it much. I think my friends and fans have been sharing it though.

[EDIT: this was written before I read the entire thread, and I apologize for that. I was so busy writing that I didn't look entirely into replies. I hope this is still fresh and provokes thought despite that.]

I think that while this analysis is completely valid, you present it in such a way that you believe notch intended this symbolism. Notch isn't really an artist-- He's more of a guy who played with code and got what he got, then let the modding teams do the rest.
It gave insight into what could be thought about while playing, but it's really something you're perceiving. You're giving him more credit than he needs. He's just going to go 'Yup' and take any praise as truth because he wants more sales.

He took the concept of infiniminer further, and that's all his intent really was.

You're basically taking artistic meaning from a mandelbrot equation. It's definitely pretty, but the meaning isn't usually to express something. It's meant to be pretty without any philosophical meaning.

I love indie games (in fact, the majority of my steam list is humble bundle sales), but I have to disagree with the idea that minecraft's art.
It's a toy that's gotten more artistic praise than the renaissance period by people thinking so much about it and playing it because it's edgy art rather than enjoying it for what it is: A toy spawned from a seed-generated mess that notch said 'Oh fuck all of this, jeb can do the rest' to.
I love the guy, he's definitely pretty smart, but he's not an artistic genius of calibur with team ICO, to set an unreasonably-high standard.

Keep making reviews-- I look forward to completely justified analysis of majora's mask (Because philosophy actually was nintendo's intent with that title.)

Akigawa:
[EDIT: this was written before I read the entire thread, and I apologize for that. I was so busy writing that I didn't look entirely into replies. I hope this is still fresh and provokes thought despite that.]

Don't fret. But yeah, I've blamed Jeb and friends for adding more nods to the appeal of Minecraft. I've mentioned that before, and I assume that's what ya meant. But yeah, I don't think Notch meant to do all that stuff, the team just looked at the world, what people were using it for, and decided to make an explicit nod to the appeal and theme of the game.

Bare in mind that the game was always intentionally built around exploration from the get go. And Creativity. Introspection might have been a fortunate accident, but it's certainly present. I also have no idea how to explain all that in the video, cuz that's way to big to be an annotation....

Thanks for watching, anyway XD

I don't think that this kind of subtext was intended from the beginning. That's pretty safe to say. However, the idea that you can find this subtext and meaning based on your own experiences with the game fit within it's own themes of open ended, player driven gameplay. You get what you put into it, be it physical or metaphysical. I don't personally see the game as art, but art is subjective.

the monopoly guy:
I don't think that this kind of subtext was intended from the beginning. That's pretty safe to say. However, the idea that you can find this subtext and meaning based on your own experiences with the game fit within it's own themes of open ended, player driven gameplay. You get what you put into it, be it physical or metaphysical. I don't personally see the game as art, but art is subjective.

That's what the show's all about. Just interpretation and making people thinking about things from a new perspective. I'd say Metroid and Zelda's subtext is definitely more intentional.

Thoroughly glad I watched this. Just as good as your Metroid analysis.

I'm glad you're gonna keep making more.

Is this your channel?

Okay, I really hope you don't get flagged for self-advertisement, 'cause I'm quite glad you showed us this, thanks.

False Nobility:
Thoroughly glad I watched this. Just as good as your Metroid analysis.

I'm glad you're gonna keep making more.

Thank you. I'm glad you enjoyed.

Aerosteam 1908:
Is this your channel?

Okay, I really hope you don't get flagged for self-advertisement, 'cause I'm quite glad you showed us this, thanks.

Don't worry, I checked the forum rules and yes, we are allowed to post video reviews on the User Review page, as long as we're the ones who made them. I almost got in trouble for putting my Zelda review in Gaming Discussion, but on this section it's allowed.

And thank you! Glad you enjoyed.

 Pages PREV 1 2

Reply to Thread

This thread is locked