Trumps HUD Secretary plan to increase Homelessness by increasing rent on Low Income Families

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Abomination:

Saelune:

Abomination:
No. 8 more years of corruption and lobby groups holding the real sway over the country.

8 less years of Nazis marching freely, 8 less years of no healthcare for tons of people, 8 less years of Russian sway, 8 less years of a rapist in office, 8 less years of working towards a fascist government, 8 less years of hopelessness. Well, 4. I took Trump's election hard enough the first time. I honestly think I will kill myself if he somehow not only makes it to a second election, but wins it.

If you really appreciated how bad Trump and Republicans are, you would not be wasting so much effort bashing Clinton and Democrats. Save it for when they actually are the problem.

They will continue to be a problem while they're also corrupt at the same time. It's a lot easier to not have any scandals when you're not dirty.

Just because the Republicans are shit doesn't make the Dems less bad.

What if I told you that the reason why the Republicans are so horrible is because of the same thing the Democrats suffer from?

The Republicans are bad because they are corrupt as well. Both parties are corrupt and it's the reason why they make stupid decisions or take half-measures to resolving genuine issues with the country.

The Democrats are less (at least I think) corrupt than the Republicans. If the Republicans were somehow able to remove their corruption I'd prefer them over the Democrats.

I've already established that the Democrats would be better than the Republicans, but they're still both bad.

Corruption and lobbying is why the United States is in such a shit place. That's the root of all its present problems. Neither party is showing any genuine interest in removing that cancer, so both are complicit in the state of things.

Should the Democrats push hard for the removal of corruption the Republicans will be forced to do so as well. But both are happy with this race to the bottom.

See, you keep saying you think Republicans are worse...but then you say all the other stuff you say. It is like when people say they are moderates but only ever criticize Democrats. It gives the impression that you dont actually want to fix anything, you just want to poo poo everyone and let things stay bad.

Yeah, I want better than Democrats, but we can't cut the line. We first need to do better than Repbulicans. I would have loved if once the US was founded, they gave everyone full equal rights, but no, slavery persisted, and that sucked, but that does not mean that being under the foot of the British was helpful. And yeah, it would have been nice if when the North beat the South, we got true equallity, but there was still tons of racism...but there was LESS! And then the country moved to improve from even that situation!

What if Gay Rights activists in the 70's did not fight for legalizing gay sex because we did not also get gay marriage? It sucked that it took an extra 40 years, but atleast between then and now, eventually just being gay did not get you arrested!

Stepping stones!

But apparently if we cant skip to the ending, we apparently should not even bother, and that is what is pissing me off here.

Saelune:
See, you keep saying you think Republicans are worse...

They are.

but then you say all the other stuff you say. It is like when people say they are moderates but only ever criticize Democrats. It gives the impression that you dont actually want to fix anything, you just want to poo poo everyone and let things stay bad.

To fix ANYTHING corruption needs to stop. Everything else is just kicking the can down the road. Remove the corruption and the nation can finally start making roads towards functioning in a sane manner.

But apparently if we cant skip to the ending, we apparently should not even bother, and that is what is pissing me off here.

The first step is to not stab the first chance you get to resolve the corruption issue in the back and paint your party as diametrically opposed to stamping out corruption.

8 more years of Obama? How about 8 years of BETTER THAN Obama?

No, can't have that. Got to keep them lobbyists happy.

That's the absurdity of the situation.

The best party for the job had the first chance in forever to genuinely take a stand against the cancer infecting US politics and they murdered it in the crib.

The Republicans is the same concentrated flavour of toxic they have always been. But the Dems had a chance. And they fucked it up. They actively pushed back what would have been genuine societal progress in the most open and corrupt way possible, spitting in the face of their own fucking vote base.

I expect the Republicans to be monsters, but when the Dems show that there isn't even a chance of redemption it's sickening.

The world looked on and screamed "NO!" when Hillary was made nominee. "NO! You were SO CLOSE and you FUCKED IT UP!"

Abomination:

Saelune:
See, you keep saying you think Republicans are worse...

They are.

but then you say all the other stuff you say. It is like when people say they are moderates but only ever criticize Democrats. It gives the impression that you dont actually want to fix anything, you just want to poo poo everyone and let things stay bad.

To fix ANYTHING corruption needs to stop. Everything else is just kicking the can down the road. Remove the corruption and the nation can finally start making roads towards functioning in a sane manner.

But apparently if we cant skip to the ending, we apparently should not even bother, and that is what is pissing me off here.

The first step is to not stab the first chance you get to resolve the corruption issue in the back and paint your party as diametrically opposed to stamping out corruption.

8 more years of Obama? How about 8 years of BETTER THAN Obama?

No, can't have that. Got to keep them lobbyists happy.

That's the absurdity of the situation.

The best party for the job had the first chance in forever to genuinely take a stand against the cancer infecting US politics and they murdered it in the crib.

The Republicans is the same concentrated flavour of toxic they have always been. But the Dems had a chance. And they fucked it up. They actively pushed back what would have been genuine societal progress in the most open and corrupt way possible, spitting in the face of their own fucking vote base.

I expect the Republicans to be monsters, but when the Dems show that there isn't even a chance of redemption it's sickening.

The world looked on and screamed "NO!" when Hillary was made nominee. "NO! You were SO CLOSE and you FUCKED IT UP!"

An old white man who can't make up his mind on guns was a shitty choice too.

Bernie Sanders was just as bad as Clinton.

Saelune:
An old white man who can't make up his mind on guns was a shitty choice too.

That's another problem, the guns situation in the US is a red herring, touted out and obfuscating the genuine issues.

That people think civilian possession of guns is more important than systematic political corruption shows the United States gets the presidents it deserves.

Abomination:

Saelune:
An old white man who can't make up his mind on guns was a shitty choice too.

That's another problem, the guns situation in the US is a red herring, touted out and obfuscating the genuine issues.

That people think civilian possession of guns is more important than systematic political corruption shows the United States gets the presidents it deserves.

It is at this point I no longer think you understand US issues.

Saelune:
It is at this point I no longer think you understand US issues.

It is at this point you need to reflect on how the US doesn't understand its own issues.

There is systematic corruption in the highest levels of politics and they care more about if an AR15 is considered an assault rifle, battle rifle, fighting rifle, shooty rifle, hobby rifle, or some other completely arbitrary classification.

Politicians are bought and paid for by weapons manufacturers and the concern is on what the laws involving firearms are more than the fact that WEAPONS MANUFACTURERS CAN USE MONEY TO BUY POLITICAL CLOUT IN THE COUNTRY.

Anywhere else that would be considered madness. In the United States it's a fucking Thursday.

Abomination:

Saelune:
It is at this point I no longer think you understand US issues.

It is at this point you need to reflect on how the US doesn't understand its own issues.

There is systematic corruption in the highest levels of politics and they care more about if an AR15 is considered an assault rifle, battle rifle, fighting rifle, shooty rifle, hobby rifle, or some other completely arbitrary classification.

Politicians are bought and paid for by weapons manufacturers and the concern is on what the laws involving firearms are more than the fact that WEAPONS MANUFACTURERS CAN USE MONEY TO BUY POLITICAL CLOUT IN THE COUNTRY.

Anywhere else that would be considered madness. In the United States it's a fucking Thursday.

You know Democrats want stricter gun laws right?

If you were just criticizing Republicans, I would agree with you, but you aren't. You are condoning both sides for one sides faults.

Saelune:
You know Democrats want stricter gun laws right?

... did you not read a thing I said?

RED

HERRING

The gun debate would not exist if lobbying was illegal, like it is in most sane democratic nations.

Abomination:

Saelune:
You know Democrats want stricter gun laws right?

... did you not read a thing I said?

RED

HERRING

The gun debate would not exist if lobbying was illegal, like it is in most sane democratic nations.

You really underestimate American gun nuts.

Saelune:
You really underestimate American gun nuts.

They are a minority. But they have economic influence.

Again - though - red herring.

Wasting precious political resources arguing about a symptom rather than a cause.

Saelune:
You know Democrats want stricter gun laws right?

Some of them do, especially when there is no threat that any such legislation could actually be passed. But anyway, Abomination is right: the cause is corruption. The sorry state of our laws is a symptom of that corruption.

Seanchaidh:

Saelune:
You know Democrats want stricter gun laws right?

Some of them do, especially when there is no threat that any such legislation could actually be passed. But anyway, Abomination is right: the cause is corruption. The sorry state of our laws is a symptom of that corruption.

Seanchaidh:

Saelune:
You know Democrats want stricter gun laws right?

Some of them do, especially when there is no threat that any such legislation could actually be passed.

The same could easily be said about politicians such as Sanders and their economic proposals.

Avnger:

Seanchaidh:

Saelune:
You know Democrats want stricter gun laws right?

Some of them do, especially when there is no threat that any such legislation could actually be passed.

The same could easily be said about politicians such as Sanders and their economic proposals.

Yes, saying things is really easy. Good insight.

Seanchaidh:

Avnger:

Seanchaidh:

Some of them do, especially when there is no threat that any such legislation could actually be passed.

The same could easily be said about politicians such as Sanders and their economic proposals.

Yes, saying things is really easy. Good insight.

Yes, saying things is really easy.

Saelune:

Seanchaidh:

Avnger:

The same could easily be said about politicians such as Sanders and their economic proposals.

Yes, saying things is really easy. Good insight.

Yes, saying things is really easy.

Yep.

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/115953-despite-promises-obama-dem-congress-have-been-gun-friendly

Democrats are going to disappoint and walk all over you as long as you don't demand better.

Seanchaidh:

Saelune:

Seanchaidh:

Yes, saying things is really easy. Good insight.

Yes, saying things is really easy.

Yep.

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/115953-despite-promises-obama-dem-congress-have-been-gun-friendly

It is difficult to take hard stances on issues when 1) Getting more votes doesnt get you the Presidency and 2) People like you who siphon votes and support away that only strengthens support for Republicans.

And sure, maybe too many Dems dont really fight guns, but some do. Do ANY Republicans support gun control? I only found 1, and he lost his seat last election.

Abomination:
I never said both were equally bad, I said one was just less shit than the other.

But both are corrupt, and as long as both remain corrupt it doesn't matter who is in charge

The second statement contradicts the first. If it doesn't matter which of them are in charge, then they are both the same.

Saelune:

Seanchaidh:

Saelune:
Yes, saying things is really easy.

Yep.

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/115953-despite-promises-obama-dem-congress-have-been-gun-friendly

It is difficult to take hard stances on issues when 1) Getting more votes doesnt get you the Presidency and 2) People like you who siphon votes and support away that only strengthens support for Republicans.

And sure, maybe too many Dems dont really fight guns, but some do. Do ANY Republicans support gun control? I only found 1, and he lost his seat last election.

This wasn't directed at me, but I think the overall point is that we need to vote new Democrats in that are actually pushing good policy. A lot of current Democrats seem to think that staying in the middle of the road is the way to go, while only giving nods towards progressive issues. They don't want to rock the boat at all, which is causing a massive amount of apathy in their voter base. They need to go after the people who don't vote, the people they drove away, the people who think "it doesn't matter who wins, it's all the same bullshit". We need new blood in the Democratic party, and there's plenty of it running campaigns right now. They just need to be voted in. Out with the old, in with the new. There's already been success on that front, it just needs to keep on happening.

Saelune:
Bernie Sanders was just as bad as Clinton.

Personally, I think they should have run together on the same ticket as President and VP and it would have been better. There are things I agree and disagree with both of them about, but looking at who else we had to choose from, they both looked better than any of our other viable options. I am very concerned the Democrats will not come up with viable candidates due to in fighting and it will result in another GOP win and the poor and most vulnerable in the US cannot survive another GOP controlled term. A person an only live so long without access to food, water, shelter, and medicine needed to stay alive. Those with serious breathing problems will not even last a day ( hell it can be minutes) without access to their medication. I am worried the longer the GOP holds on, the more people will die due their polices.

The more people harp on about the "dems" being a problem, the more people will actually die in the US due to the GOP gaining strength. It is like your leg is chopped off and you are bleeding out and the people standing around are worried about that pimple on your nose instead of helping you.

ON Topic:
Did anyone Notice the part of Carson's plan that shows he wants to not only raise their rent, but at the same time remove their medical deductions as well? Seriously, how is a poor person who cannot breathe supposed to survive losing their home? Many of those with Breathing issues are also temperature regulated and have to have access to an air conditioner or they can die in minutes.
Just take a look at some of their monthly expenses..
( the more serious their condition, the more it costs:
https://www.goodrx.com/lonhala-magnair?drug-name=lonhala-magnair
https://www.goodrx.com/trelegy-ellipta
https://www.goodrx.com/breo-ellipta?drug-name=breo
https://www.goodrx.com/combivent?drug-name=combivent
https://www.goodrx.com/proair?drug-name=proair

This is not even including costs of things like Oxygen services or Oxygen Concentrators, numerous other medications they may have to take or any other health conditions they may have in addition to breathing issues. For some people, just to breathe is too expensive and they are now going to be at risk of losing what little government help they have.

So while we have Trump taking away their access to doctors and medication, and access to the foods they are able to eat, we also have Trumps Housing secretary taking away their homes at the same time.

Thaluikhain:

Abomination:
I never said both were equally bad, I said one was just less shit than the other.

But both are corrupt, and as long as both remain corrupt it doesn't matter who is in charge

The second statement contradicts the first. If it doesn't matter which of them are in charge, then they are both the same.

Sure, you'll get some "progressive" social policy while the Dems are in office, but the primary issue of the American government will not be resolved while the party in charge is corrupt.

They can be bought, they will be bought. You will get fucked, just more softly by the Dems. You'll be so used to being fucked by the Dems that you'll start to enjoy it, not realising how fucked you've been getting.

Abomination:

Thaluikhain:

Abomination:
I never said both were equally bad, I said one was just less shit than the other.

But both are corrupt, and as long as both remain corrupt it doesn't matter who is in charge

The second statement contradicts the first. If it doesn't matter which of them are in charge, then they are both the same.

Sure, you'll get some "progressive" social policy while the Dems are in office, but the primary issue of the American government will not be resolved while the party in charge is corrupt.

They can be bought, they will be bought. You will get fucked, just more softly by the Dems. You'll be so used to being fucked by the Dems that you'll start to enjoy it, not realising how fucked you've been getting.

You gotta be careful though, otherwise you get stuck with a fractious majority that sacrifices all progress towards a goal in the name of seeking a mythical level of perfection or purity and the unified minority cements control, so instead of being fucked softly you get fucked with a spiked dildo and you can't get enough people to participate to change the system because everyone is too busy whining about getting fucked at all to bother even trying. so then the options become less about how hard you want to be fucked and more about which flavor of lube you want.

Also gonna say there is no system where a politician can't be bought, you can make it harder, and we should be pushing for that constantly because any democratic system requires an informed populace to stay vigilant and push back against the tide of corruption that will always attempt to worm its way into a system as open and chaotic as democracy. You can disincentivise but there will always be buyable politicians, those with power will always be bought to an extent the advantage of voting is the ability to limit it, but it will always be true to an extent.

Not that I'm saying you must vote for Democrats, just that letting dissatisfaction with both parties turn into apathy is itself dangerous and can backfire into having the choice of how hard you want to be fucked being made for you, potentially by someone with a serious case of masochism.

Abomination:

Saelune:
Clinton? Oh, you mean 8 more years of Obama?

No. 8 more years of corruption and lobby groups holding the real sway over the country.

Because that's CERTAINLY not what's happening now. The NRA's cock is so far down the administration's throat it's shitting bullets.

Lil devils x:
The more people harp on about the "dems" being a problem, the more people will actually die in the US due to the GOP gaining strength. It is like your leg is chopped off and you are bleeding out and the people standing around are worried about that pimple on your nose instead of helping you.

Electing lesser evil Dems will reduce pressure on the Dems to change, and prolong the state of affairs in which we have no good and viable choices. People die under Trump policy, people were dying under Obama policy and Bush policy and Clinton policy and the elder Bush's policy and Reagan policy and Carter policy. There is one way to get out of this, and that is to produce a party (either the Dems or something else) that is not beholden to the wealthy interests who actually influence policy.

If the Republicans are a hacked off leg, then the Dems are not a pimple, but another hacked off leg-- just at the knee instead of the pelvis.

Seanchaidh:

Lil devils x:
The more people harp on about the "dems" being a problem, the more people will actually die in the US due to the GOP gaining strength. It is like your leg is chopped off and you are bleeding out and the people standing around are worried about that pimple on your nose instead of helping you.

Electing lesser evil Dems will reduce pressure on the Dems to change, and prolong the state of affairs in which we have no good and viable choices. People die under Trump policy, people were dying under Obama policy and Bush policy and Clinton policy and the elder Bush's policy and Reagan policy and Carter policy. There is one way to get out of this, and that is to produce a party (either the Dems or something else) that is not beholden to the wealthy interests who actually influence policy.

If the Republicans are a hacked off leg, then the Dems are not a pimple, but another hacked off leg-- just at the knee instead of the pelvis.

No, because the dems were proposing INCREASING support for those most vulnerable and likely to die rather than removing it. The results are what determine whether or not one is considered a hacked off leg. Increasing support means to reduce the number of poor that perish rather than increase it. Simply taking money or support from wealthy does not equate to removing support from the poor, that is a platform issue. The current GOP policy of removing the support that their lives depends on directly results in immediate deaths, that policy does not exist among the DEMs. Who gives them money honestly is irrelevant as long as they are saving lives once they get elected as a whole.

Of course any party can be subjugated to lobbies, in the end however it is what policies are voted on and implemented under the party while they have control. Democrats voted to give more people health care when they had control, Gop votes to take it from those people. The dems voted to give more people food when they had control, the GOP means to take that from the too. The GOP instead of solving homelessness and saving more lives does the exact opposite and is kicking poor families out of their existing homes and taking away their only means of survival. The bottom line is the number of poor, sick and elderly residing in the US who will die as a direct result of their policies, and it is not even comparable at the moment as the Lobbyist for those most cruel to the most vulnerable and at risk of death have not just bought off the GOP, they are in office themselves.

BTW, Bush INCREASED MEDICAID AND MEDICARE, not decreased it so this was not always the case. That saved many lives, just as Obamacare has done and the increased funding Obama gave to the unemployed and those in poverty. Trump, however, is trying to remove all of that which will directly result in a large increase in deaths. The Dems current policy is to increase the tax on the wealthy and increase the support directly resulting in less deaths.

Who receives funding from who is pretty irrelevant, their actions are what matter here.

Lil devils x:
No, because the dems were proposing INCREASING support for those most vulnerable and likely to die rather than removing it.

Band-aid on a gunshot wound.

Seanchaidh:

Lil devils x:
No, because the dems were proposing INCREASING support for those most vulnerable and likely to die rather than removing it.

Band-aid on a gunshot wound.

No, not a band aid, it saves lives immediately and prevents more from falling into despair and it is one step closer to Basic income, which most of the civilized world is already moving closer to. The sooner we accept the realization that the future is automated and involves less menial labor allowing people more time to enjoy their lives and less time struggling for survival the farther ahead we will be when it gets here. The easier we make the transition, the more people will survive. At least the Dems are doing something to move the US towards the future, unlike the GOP who is investing in coal and killing off their own people. While the US Middle class is collapsing due to GOP greed, China's is exploding.

China is going to leave the US far behind very soon.
https://inhabitat.com/china-plans-its-first-forest-city-to-fight-air-pollution/
http://www.bbc.com/news/business-40341833
http://www.businessinsider.com/chinas-middle-class-is-exploding-2016-8

Trump is scum.
He doesn't care about non-white rich people.

Feature, not a bug.

Now that federal housing assistance has decreased, keep an eye open for tax-paid hostile architecture projects targeted towards homeless people in your local area.

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