Convert me

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Damien Granz:

Not G. Ivingname:

I was meaning pro-freedom in the terms of "freedom in all areas, not just some and not others." As for Libertarianism working or not, that is a debate for another thread. THIS thread is about showing the OP your political ideology and showing why s/he should become what ever you are. Proving me wrong has doesn't prove your position right.

No such a thing. Some freedoms are mutually exclusive. Your freedom to murder mars my freedom to live. Your freedom to pollute waterways for a buck mars my freedom to enjoy clean water.

There's no such a thing as a 'totally free' society, at least again of more than like 50 people. It's great to have the ideal of freedom guide you, but taking an ideal and slamming on the gas until you fly off a cliff is what makes people call libertarians childish.

Proving you wrong might not prove me right, but it sure as shit should make you stop making the same wrong claims over and over. But you don't.

Ok, let me clarify, you can do what you want as long as it doesn't hurt another. Your freedom to murder or freedom to pour atomic sludge is harming me, thus breaking my freedom.

Esotera:

Please stop using English to communicate your opinions - the language was formed through billions of its speakers contributing their own ideas to form words. If you want to communicate effectively you'll have to derive your own language.

OT: What are the issues you care about?

I...What? No. Just...no.

OT: Access to healthcare, socialism, and social individualism. I think that people should be allowed to be whoever they want to be, but that everyone should be willing to give up some of their own prosperity for the greater good. I believe that people should be kind and take care of each other, and that the world would be a better place if everyone worried about their responsibility to others rather than just thinking about their own rights. Politics, egoism, capitalism, they have no place in my world. I am an idealist. You don't need to tell me my world is impossible, I know. I know.

Zekksta:

You know, it's people like you that are making it extremely hard to kick off my own religion.

Keep your "opinions based on fact" nonsense to yourself.

I know, right? And then there are the unhelpful opposites, who don't form opinions on fact, but are already part of their own thing.

P.S. Want to have a holy war? Seems like the thing to do.

Not G. Ivingname:

Damien Granz:

Not G. Ivingname:

I was meaning pro-freedom in the terms of "freedom in all areas, not just some and not others." As for Libertarianism working or not, that is a debate for another thread. THIS thread is about showing the OP your political ideology and showing why s/he should become what ever you are. Proving me wrong has doesn't prove your position right.

No such a thing. Some freedoms are mutually exclusive. Your freedom to murder mars my freedom to live. Your freedom to pollute waterways for a buck mars my freedom to enjoy clean water.

There's no such a thing as a 'totally free' society, at least again of more than like 50 people. It's great to have the ideal of freedom guide you, but taking an ideal and slamming on the gas until you fly off a cliff is what makes people call libertarians childish.

Proving you wrong might not prove me right, but it sure as shit should make you stop making the same wrong claims over and over. But you don't.

Ok, let me clarify, you can do what you want as long as it doesn't hurt another. Your freedom to murder or freedom to pour atomic sludge is harming me, thus breaking my freedom.

Your ability to use your money to buy up all the schools so you can tank all but the ones your kids are in to get them better jobs than my one hurts me, thus breaking my freedom, too.

See where I'm going with this?

There's no easy one simple rhetorical line that divides things like 'freedom to do anything but 'harm' people'.

Silvianoshei:

Esotera:

Please stop using English to communicate your opinions - the language was formed through billions of its speakers contributing their own ideas to form words. If you want to communicate effectively you'll have to derive your own language.

OT: What are the issues you care about?

I...What? No. Just...no.

OT: Access to healthcare, socialism, and social individualism. I think that people should be allowed to be whoever they want to be, but that everyone should be willing to give up some of their own prosperity for the greater good. I believe that people should be kind and take care of each other, and that the world would be a better place if everyone worried about their responsibility to others rather than just thinking about their own rights. Politics, egoism, capitalism, they have no place in my world. I am an idealist. You don't need to tell me my world is impossible, I know. I know.

Sounds like you want a moderate, mixed economic government between socialism and capitalism, one that allows for growth an innovation, but doesn't fuck the all of mankind so a few lucky people can grow.

Economically you'd want a political party to the left of what we have in America, so no party's going to do it for you.

You'd probably be slightly left of center though by the world's recognition, where they have ACTUAL socialism and not just "He doesn't want poison in the baby formula, he's a communist!" 'socialism' we have in America.

I can't really evaluate where you are on the 'social' side of government. Social individualism suggests to the left on that axis too, but that's.. very vague. You can be socially conservative and economically liberal, and vice versa, and so that one tiny tidbit isn't enough to say. For all I know you could be very socially conservative.

Edit: Nevermind, for some reason I thought you were the original poster that wanted people to guess what he wanted for him, so I was taking what you said you wanted and trying to evaluate where it'd be 'closest' to.

The Thinker:

Zekksta:

You know, it's people like you that are making it extremely hard to kick off my own religion.

Keep your "opinions based on fact" nonsense to yourself.

I know, right? And then there are the unhelpful opposites, who don't form opinions on fact, but are already part of their own thing.

P.S. Want to have a holy war? Seems like the thing to do.

I wouldn't lower myself to the level of muck and shit to deal with you heathens.

I'm too self righteous for that.

Also, implying I'd consider your lies "holy" enough for me to partake in a holy war.

Zekksta:

I wouldn't lower myself to the level of muck and shit to deal with you heathens.

I'm too self righteous for that.

Also, implying I'd consider your lies "holy" enough for me to partake in a holy war.

Bah! I'm twice as self-righteous as you! And I use more hyphens!

In fact, I wouldn't call it a "holy war" either! I'd call it a holy curb-stomp, with my holy army wholly destroying you! Then we would pillage your temples, melt down your idols, and be exceptionally poor house-guests all around! Bring it!

The Thinker:

Zekksta:

I wouldn't lower myself to the level of muck and shit to deal with you heathens.

I'm too self righteous for that.

Also, implying I'd consider your lies "holy" enough for me to partake in a holy war.

Bah! I'm twice as self-righteous as you! And I use more hyphens!

In fact, I wouldn't call it a "holy war" either! I'd call it a holy curb-stomp, with my holy army wholly destroying you! Then we would pillage your temples, melt down your idols, and be exceptionally poor house-guests all around! Bring it!

All of those things you plan to do are considered tenets in my religion.

Thanks for the worship brah.

Damien Granz:

Not G. Ivingname:

Damien Granz:

No such a thing. Some freedoms are mutually exclusive. Your freedom to murder mars my freedom to live. Your freedom to pollute waterways for a buck mars my freedom to enjoy clean water.

There's no such a thing as a 'totally free' society, at least again of more than like 50 people. It's great to have the ideal of freedom guide you, but taking an ideal and slamming on the gas until you fly off a cliff is what makes people call libertarians childish.

Proving you wrong might not prove me right, but it sure as shit should make you stop making the same wrong claims over and over. But you don't.

Ok, let me clarify, you can do what you want as long as it doesn't hurt another. Your freedom to murder or freedom to pour atomic sludge is harming me, thus breaking my freedom.

Your ability to use your money to buy up all the schools so you can tank all but the ones your kids are in to get them better jobs than my one hurts me, thus breaking my freedom, too.

See where I'm going with this?

There's no easy one simple rhetorical line that divides things like 'freedom to do anything but 'harm' people'.

Umm... that example is so illogical, I doubt any nation has actually makes that illegal just because their is no logical reason to do that. For a better of 18, a father would buy up hundreds of schools, taking an enormous personal cost to keep each and every one of those running with the express purpose to make sure each and every one of the students besides his child fail to make sure his child has a job? If he is that rich, why would he even ever need to worry about his child "getting a job," he could just hire his son. You don't think none of the thousands or even millions of parents and their children won't just move their children to other schools or homeschool them if it is so clear that the school is intentionally failing their children? You think none of the staff will complain or anybody will take the chance to found their own schools and getting massive waves of children?

Proof by example already is a logical fallacy, it is an even worse one that doesn't make any sense in any way, shape or form. Prove me wrong with actual evidence, and prove to me why your position is better.

Zekksta:

All of those things you plan to do are considered tenets in my religion.

Thanks for the worship brah.

Really? Maybe... we don't need a holy war, then. Maybe... the war was inside us all along! Team up on Scientology, friend?

P.S. What's the name of your religion?

The .50 Caliber Cow:
Convert Me

Fine; in metric you're a 12.7mm Cow. Happy?

*b'dum-tish*

The Thinker:

Zekksta:

All of those things you plan to do are considered tenets in my religion.

Thanks for the worship brah.

Really? Maybe... we don't need a holy war, then. Maybe... the war was inside us all along! Team up on Scientology, friend?

P.S. What's the name of your religion?

It seems we have reached a gentlemen's accord.

The name of my religion is the least edgy, most mature one I could think of.

"The Church of Apathy Floundered in the Abyss of Eternal Darkness."

Where do you live? What matters most to your actual life?

All I can say is "don't vote against your own best interests". Unless you're already quite wealthy and privileged, the right is probably working against your interests.

Most voters vote on emotion (I'm reading a pretty good book from a neurologist explaining exactly why this is) and are influenced first by the way the candidate and their party relate to their emotional neural network (e.g. why George W. Bush appealed to people while Al Gore did not, they felt they could relate to him better than the standoffish, stiff Gore, even if Gore's policy positions would have been more helpful to most voters) and only secondarily by what the candidate actually advocates. If you're actually completely neutral on this question, you have a chance to go completely on how their policies would better/worsen your life-- that's a comparative rarity, so you'd be best off doing the research yourself.

Zekksta:
It seems we have reached a gentlemen's accord.

The name of my religion is the least edgy, most mature one I could think of.

"The Church of Apathy Floundered in the Abyss of Eternal Darkness."

It's not often I see a religion, the title of which doubles as a complete sentence.

I like how people are assuming I'm going to actually be converted by this thread. I just made it to see how people present their ideologies.

Hazy992:
Believe whatever makes sense to you. Don't let a bunch of people on the Internet dictate what you believe in.

Although listening to my advice means you should ignore my advice, thus creating a paradox

Rest easy, it was the plan all along. No paradox here.

Bassik:
Smoke some pot, see how your mind changes, and then report back to me.

Pot does close to nothing for me.

Katatori-kun:

The .50 Caliber Cow:
I have no political inclinations whatsoever. Call me apathetic. You're going to have to win my vote for your cause. So why should I go right, left, center, whatever? What works? Tell me internet.

We're not dancing monkeys here to entertain you. If you're apathetic, then you should really just stay out of the way of people who have bothered to inform themselves. It's not our job to just make you care.

I never said it was your job. You came here on your own. Curiosity and boredom moved me to make this thread out of randomness. Who's to say if someone will say something that actually makes me think differently about politics? Without the asking the question (and I'm certainly not getting any political insight by the hicks who live around here) I would likely never care more about politics. So let's just hear what people have to say about their views here. Hell, if you care about it, this thread can just be a +1 to post count thread.

Right, I'll be back in a bit to see if this goes any further.

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