Something I wanted to say to christians about the Bible

 Pages 1 2 3 NEXT
 

Just my opinion, and i know im about to get a shitload of flak for this.

Elfen Lied taught more about the need for love and caring people and treating people how they should be treated far better than christianity ever did.
No contest.
Elfen Lied was a metaphore better than anything every said by Christ and his followers.

Lucy Nana Kohta and Yuka set a far better example for humanity than christ and his apostles ever did.

And before you jump to conclusions, and start asking me things, Here:
Ever read the bible?
Yes I have.
more times tnat i wanted to.
I grew up a in a christian family, ive read the bible cover to cover before, when i began to question the "word of god"
after learning and furthering my education i realized how dispicable the bible really was, and how much it harmed people.

Dude How old are you?
Im 22 years old

Get away from anime, you looser
I dont watch anime. Now, I've been around japanese culture and i am shintoist, i used to speak almost fluent japanese, but anime wasnt really my thing. I was to far into cosmology and science and trying to learn about physics and human evolution(which is what I study now a days), its been a life long obsession, animne was a minor intrest when i was younger, but Elfen Lied is a work of art that trancends its medium
Infact its almost insulting to call elfen lied anime becuase of the reputation of illegetitmacy that anime has in the western world.

Wrong forum dude, this belongs in Religion and Politics.

I too grew up in a christian family. I have read the bible and i completely agree with you. To me, The bible is just a mechanism to control people. I grew up in a catholic background, I'll admit not a strict one. However i did attend mass every week until i was 19 years old. I then stopped as I slowly began to question some of the things in the bible (and "word of god"). I found that i would be criticised about "my loyalty to god" when i asked certain questions. I may be going off on a tangent, but personally, i believe that your own personal faith is all you need to get through life. No matter what religion anyone believes in, faith is individual to you. Therefore, you do not need to live life by a book that was 1700 years old. If you have a good moral compass and have good values, then your sorted.

To be honest I have never seen Elfen Lied, so I can't comment on that.

I have been coming to the conclusion that religion and by extension the bible is nothing more than a twisted form of self medication.

I doubt you will get much flak for disliking the Bible, this is the internet after all. You might get shouted at for comparing whatever Elfen Lied (lets say my opinion on anime isn't as high as it could be) actually is to it but meh.

Playing devil's advocate I will point out that different people learn things in different ways and so gain better understanding when things are portrayed in certain ways over others, that doesn't make the bible less meaningful. It simply makes it not the right thing for you to learn from, nothing can speak to everybody all of the time.

Edit: I reported this so that it can get moved to the correct forum and nobody else can get stressy.

Comparing the Bible to Elfen Lied...

Oh dear.

I've seen Elfen Lied, it's a good show (if I ignore how much unecessary nudity of young girls there is), but I don't quite understand how you could even compare Elfen Lied to the Bible.

I mean, the Bible is book of stories with a variety of messages.

Elfen Lied is...

Well, it's Elfen Lied. It's not trying to spread a Christian message...

I think Jesus Christ was a fictional character anyway, and he never said all that stuff. No-one could be that perfect, or so people like to think. I mean, yeah, perhaps there was a guy named Jesus Christ in the past, but chances are he was just some insane scholarly manipulator who got villagers to worship him because they were primitive, superstitious fools.

I just briefly searched Elfen Lied on Wikipedia, but it looks interesting, to say the least. Saying the Bible is overrated would be a gross understatement.

I'm don't know whether or not you've been to a church or assumed all Christians were like the Westboro Baptists.

I'll clear this up for you. Jesus was one of the greatest men who ever lived, and he did as much good as he could until he sacrificed himself for all of us, so that we may be able to sin without having to kill a goat.

And this man you showed us is a good person, but there have been MANY good people over the millennia. However, there is no religion being formed around these people, only due to historical significance.

As much as this site is great for discussion, I am appalled at the number of people who assume Christians are some sort of problem.

Terminate421:
Jesus was one of the greatest men who ever lived, and he did as much good as he could until he sacrificed himself for all of us, so that we may be able to sin without having to kill a goat.

I really don't like people who say "Jesus died for our sins". Our sins? "Sins" (which, IMO, don't exist; the society of humans invented morality) are subjective. Don't speak for all of us, especially the people who don't even believe in him or these "sinners" in the first place.

Do you have any actual, concrete evidence that he did all this "pure", goody-two-shoes bullshit? It was, like, thousands of years ago that these supposed events happened, but they can be misconstrued, twisted to suit one's beliefs, to suit one's zealotry, lost in translation, etc. I'm sorry, but this is one of these extreme cases of "it's too good to be true". No-one is that selfless. All humans are flawed and/or have a bit of bad in them, because it's embedded in our human nature. Hypocrisy, greed, prejudice, etc.

Jesus is nothing more than a glorified Mary Sue; the imagination of the perfect man.

Relish in Chaos:
Jesus is nothing more than a glorified Mary Sue; the imagination of the perfect man.

I'm curious - does that mean that his teachings of basically "Try to be less of dicks to each other and maybe even do good stuff for your fellows" are bad?

Relish in Chaos:

Terminate421:
Jesus was one of the greatest men who ever lived, and he did as much good as he could until he sacrificed himself for all of us, so that we may be able to sin without having to kill a goat.

I really don't like people who say "Jesus died for our sins". Our sins? "Sins" (which, IMO, don't exist; the society of humans invented morality) are subjective. Don't speak for all of us, especially the people who don't even believe in him or these "sinners" in the first place.

Do you have any actual, concrete evidence that he did all this "pure", goody-two-shoes bullshit? It was, like, thousands of years ago that these supposed events happened, but they can be misconstrued, twisted to suit one's beliefs, to suit one's zealotry, lost in translation, etc. I'm sorry, but this is one of these extreme cases of "it's too good to be true". No-one is that selfless. All humans are flawed and/or have a bit of bad in them, because it's embedded in our human nature. Hypocrisy, greed, prejudice, etc.

Jesus is nothing more than a glorified Mary Sue; the imagination of the perfect man.

image

There has not been any way to truly disprove this as well. So as far as I'm concerned, you've only dug yourself a hole
In this aspect.

It's called a belief, the bible tells us what happened in that point in time and what I should follow. Needless to say I follow the aspect of "hate the sin, love the sinner" in which I give respect to all people until they prove themselves wrong.

Now telling me that Jesus was some sort of hypocrite is wrong as well. There is no proof that we has done terrible things, why? Because we don't know of he did anything worth mentioning that can be considered evil! Desire is a powerful weapon in man, and can make them do anything, of that is one of mans flaws, than Jesus was one who desired his beliefs more than himself.

I may be coming off as a prophet, but I am not, I just get angry when people think less of a religion because they need an explanation for every aspect that cannot be covered by a book written nearly 2000 years ago. As stated from Angels and Demons - "Religion is flawed because man is flawed"

Why would you post things like this? Is it to try to pick a fight with Christians, or do you figure they'll be ashamed of themselves for following a holy text that you consider inferior to a cartoon?

FranBunnyFFXII:

Elfen Lied is a work of art that trancends its medium
Infact its almost insulting to call elfen lied anime becuase of the reputation of illegetitmacy that anime has in the western world.

I love it when people say something 'transcends the medium', it's such a brilliantly pretentious way of saying 'it's really good' (especially as anime isn't a medium).

Now aside from being unnecessarily annoying, I don't really understand your point. You may well have found some meaning in a show, people find meanings in lots of stuff, it's not that amazing to happen really. Christians surely, are not going to agree that Elfien Lied is a better role model than the bible because their beliefs are based around the bible. So if christians aren't going to agree, and it doesn't matter to anyone else, this seems like a slight waste of time.

Besides, a lot of the stuff taught in the new testament I can kinda agree with, love thy neighbour and all that. Christianity isn't completely evil because there's a lot of stuff you disagree with it, the core teachings of christianity are basically, 'don't be a dick'.

Daystar Clarion:
Comparing the Bible to Elfen Lied...

Oh dear.

I've seen Elfen Lied, it's a good show (if I ignore how much unecessary nudity of young girls there is), but I don't quite understand how you could even compare Elfen Lied to the Bible.

I mean, the Bible is book of stories with a variety of messages.

Elfen Lied is...

Well, it's Elfen Lied. It's not trying to spread a Christian message...

I think they are similar in that they are both really boring. What? I'm a Catholic. We don't read the bible! You kidding?!

Also, this topic is insulting to my brain.

I learned more from TriGun about violence and the proper application thereof than I ever learned from the bible (not religious but of course I've read it. It's one of the greatest work of fiction ever I just had to know what the fuss was about.)

According to the Bible it's one or the other. Either:

'They have a different opinion/religion/society than us. Kill it with God's Holy Vengeance' (Old Testament)

Or

'No violence. Ever. Not even in the face of armaggedon.' (New Testament)

When your old theologists and philosophers have spent nearly two thousand years trying to find some wiggle room in that so you could go on your holy crusades or fight the Nazis, I'm thinking maybe your religion needs a little work.

FranBunnyFFXII:

Elfen Lied taught more about the need for love and caring people and treating people how they should be treated far better than christianity ever did.
No contest.

image
wait.....WHAT?

maybe you could say 'I fucking ADORE/LOVE Elfenlied, alsdazhgdowvbxlcjhpy *love apoplexy*

but even compare the two....what?
-------------------------

DoPo:

Relish in Chaos:
Jesus is nothing more than a glorified Mary Sue; the imagination of the perfect man.

I'm curious - does that mean that his teachings of basically "Try to be less of dicks to each other and maybe even do good stuff for your fellows" are bad?

the 'don't be a douche' teaching exist in every religion


plus jesus had some major freakouts/go ape shit insane moments in the bible.
----------------------

Daystar Clarion:
Comparing the Bible to Elfen Lied...

Oh dear.

I've seen Elfen Lied, it's a good show (if I ignore how much unecessary nudity of young girls there is), but I don't quite understand how you could even compare Elfen Lied to the Bible.

I mean, the Bible is book of stories with a variety of messages.

Elfen Lied is...

Well, it's Elfen Lied. It's not trying to spread a Christian message...

this ^.

its like saying Batman taught us more about the need for love and caring for people and treating people how they should be treated far better than christianity ever did.

because if you bully someone as a kid you might create the penguin or scarecrow.
image
batmanism

Well, that's religion for you. The bible doesn't really have anything going for it other than being "the word of god", and it was written back when people were gullible and impressionable, so it's basically like the list of rules you get in elementary school but in collection-of-stories form. But instead of the punishment being time out or something it's spending an eternity in hell.

rhizhim:

DoPo:

Relish in Chaos:
Jesus is nothing more than a glorified Mary Sue; the imagination of the perfect man.

I'm curious - does that mean that his teachings of basically "Try to be less of dicks to each other and maybe even do good stuff for your fellows" are bad?

the 'don't be a douche' teaching exist in every religion

Mostly every. All major ones, at least.

But I felt Relish in Chaos was trying to discredit the beliefs in something based on one unrelated thing.

Oh look, already its turning into an argument over the basis of christianity.

I swear, when i invent time travel the first thing im going to do is go back and see who or what Jesus really was.

Anyway, OP's basic point, the Bible is flawed, since cynicism started being a uncontrollable part of the human psyche this has been becoming more obvious.

Also Elfen Lied is a manga too.

FranBunnyFFXII:
Just my opinion, and i know im about to get a shitload of flak for this.

Elfen Lied taught more about the need for love and caring people and treating people how they should be treated far better than christianity ever did.
No contest.
Elfen Lied was a metaphore better than anything every said by Christ and his followers.

Lucy Nana Kohta and Yuka set a far better example for humanity than christ and his apostles ever did.

And before you jump to conclusions, and start asking me things, Here:
Ever read the bible?
Yes I have.
more times tnat i wanted to.
I grew up a in a christian family, ive read the bible cover to cover before, when i began to question the "word of god"
after learning and furthering my education i realized how dispicable the bible really was, and how much it harmed people.

Dude How old are you?
Im 22 years old

Get away from anime, you looser
I dont watch anime. Now, I've been around japanese culture and i am shintoist, i used to speak almost fluent japanese, but anime wasnt really my thing. I was to far into cosmology and science and trying to learn about physics and human evolution(which is what I study now a days), its been a life long obsession, animne was a minor intrest when i was younger, but Elfen Lied is a work of art that trancends its medium
Infact its almost insulting to call elfen lied anime becuase of the reputation of illegetitmacy that anime has in the western world.

To be honest, I haven't seen/read/whatever form of media those things are any of what you said.

I also respect your opinion. The Bible can be difficult to understand. Heck, my girlfriend whom I love and cherish has a hard time accepting the fact the Bible says only those who believe in Jesus can go to Heaven. In her own words, "I don't want to think about that. It means my mom and dad won't be there."

And to be honest with you, from an anthropological standpoint, it's extremely interesting what you're saying. It typically comes from people who don't have the need for a rigid moral system to guide them. Saying the Bible is a mechanism to control people is a bit harsh. But there's no denying that having a complex moral system likely developed in human societies due to moral chaos errupting around the development of the first civilizations. It seems that with certain groups, the need for such a system seems to be irrelevant because they find similar answers through other means. Further, many in America find their freedom of expression strand by such a document, causing them to view it in a harsher light out of fear of judgement, betrayal, and denial of who the Bible could "Force" them to be.

JUST OUT OF CURIOSITY. I won't judge or say anything else on the matter and I'm not trying to belittle you. I'm honestly just curious. But, are you: A white male from an upper middle class background who was raised in the suburbs of one of the large cities in the US or western Europe, and have you been to college/university?

At any rate, I'd add that the Bible teaches more about what it is to be righteous and just than to love. Love is often a pseodonym for those things, and I appreciate the hard lines the Bible takes on particular issues. It's not hard for me to see the correlation between God's love and his justice. Between his mercy and punishment. It strikes me as awe-inspiring and powerful, and dare I say I appreciate it. It's a pitty you don't know my God like I do, but he's not for everyone sadly.

At any rate, I hope you don't get too much flak. I hate Americanized Christianity. That's the real problem most people have with it. I often wonder what Americans would think of Christianity if the aggressive, hard-line, patriotic twist Americans have put on it were taken out.

gigastar:

Anyway, OP's basic point, the Bible is flawed, since cynicism started being a uncontrollable part of the human psyche this has been becoming more obvious.

HAHAH, considering the Bible and Christianity rose to prominence during an era when Greek philosophy was at its height, and the entire modern idea of cynicism comes from said philosophy, I find your statement both ironic and horrifically wrong.

*Looks at original post*

My, what a bold and risky statement to say on the Escapist......much like the last 3 million topics from Escapists on the subject of Christianity.

Mimsofthedawg:

gigastar:

Anyway, OP's basic point, the Bible is flawed, since cynicism started being a uncontrollable part of the human psyche this has been becoming more obvious.

HAHAH, considering the Bible and Christianity rose to prominence during an era when Greek philosophy was at its height, and the entire modern idea of cynicism comes from said philosophy, I find your statement both ironic and horrifically wrong.

I could also point out that greek philosophy never really caught on in Western Europe, which is where christianity had its power base.

Terminate421:
I'm don't know whether or not you've been to a church or assumed all Christians were like the Westboro Baptists.

I'll clear this up for you. Jesus was one of the greatest men who ever lived, and he did as much good as he could until he sacrificed himself for all of us, so that we may be able to sin without having to kill a goat.

And this man you showed us is a good person, but there have been MANY good people over the millennia. However, there is no religion being formed around these people, only due to historical significance.

As much as this site is great for discussion, I am appalled at the number of people who assume Christians are some sort of problem.

Only the orthodox ones. Fundamentlists of any sort usually tend to go too far because of blind faith and it's never a good idea no matter what you believe in. The worst things have been brougth about by the best of intentions etc.

OT: Personally i just view the Bible as a collection of stories. Fairy tales meant to serve as a moral guideline for the time it was written in, based on good samaritans who were driven by their own sense of "good" which the author sought to personify in "God".

But the point about "for the time it was written" is important to me because no single form of guideline can remain eternal and that's why i can sort of understand the more liberal religious people because they can adjust their faith to a way that makes sense. Like how gay marriage isn't a sin, and some jews will allow for the use of a car or ambulance in case of an emergency during the sabbath.

There is so much more to religion, and even Christianity, than the bible. I feel pity for the people who can't see that, which is kinda surprising because I don't feel pity for much of anyone. The bible has a great many positive things to teach us. I've never read it cover to cover, but the few parts I have read have all been positive and good for people to read, but that's not why I am religious. I am religious because I see God's hand in the world all around us.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwD7fk6QSDQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEmYUsDOhaE&feature=related
And I am religious because nothing I have ever heard/seen/learned in my life, including what I've learned in pursuit of a bachelors degree in chemistry, has ever offered even the slightest bit of evidence against the existence of God.

Just bleh

don't talk about religion especially Christianity they win with numbers and 'it can't be disapproved',best to just deal with it and agree to disagree plus you end up the prick of the conversation

Terminate421:

Now telling me that Jesus was some sort of hypocrite is wrong as well. There is no proof that we has done terrible things, why? Because we don't know of he did anything worth mentioning that can be considered evil!

You can accept the fact that he exists and has done magic without any sort of proof, but as soon as someone comes and tells you he's done bad things, your infallible argument is "you have no proof!"? I guess that would be unscientific.

I don't know who the hypocrite is here, but it's not Jesus.

gigastar:
Oh look, already its turning into an argument over the basis of christianity.

I swear, when i invent time travel the first thing im going to do is go back and see who or what Jesus really was.

Anyway, OP's basic point, the Bible is flawed, since cynicism started being a uncontrollable part of the human psyche this has been becoming more obvious.

Also Elfen Lied is a manga too.

this person kinda gets exactly whwat im talking about.

There are just so many things wrong with this thread it's hard to know what to comment on.

Firstly Elfen Lied is not a very good show, going by the series, not the manga. I found it gratuitous and rather hollow and it clearly pandered to a teenage boy tits-and-violence demographic. It has VERY little to say in the way of human decency or morality and in the end it was completely asinine.

Secondly, I don't believe in any religion or god, and all theist arguments can be easily deconstructed with logic and scientific evidence. When talking about The Bible, there are some seriously questionable morals being expressed by the Judeo-Christian God, and why anyone would WANT to worship him is beyond me. I will also point out that Christ himself declares that he has not come to renounce the old religion (ie. The Old Testament) but to ENFORCE it. So Jesus therefore also says that genocide and claiming young girls as captives is ok, a la Old Testament God.

And just because it's a point that I can easily point out as misleading:

Mimsofthedawg:

gigastar:

Anyway, OP's basic point, the Bible is flawed, since cynicism started being a uncontrollable part of the human psyche this has been becoming more obvious.

HAHAH, considering the Bible and Christianity rose to prominence during an era when Greek philosophy was at its height, and the entire modern idea of cynicism comes from said philosophy, I find your statement both ironic and horrifically wrong.

Greek philosophy was at its height in the 5th Cen BC. Obviously there were other philosophers all around the world before and after that but the 'height' would be in Classical Greece, well before the time the Roman Emperor Constantine converted to Christianity around 300 AD. Constantine's conversion and implementation of Christianity throughout the Empire as the state religion is why it is so prevalent today.

You are wrong.The doctor is the best god.
image
http://www.cracked.com/blog/how-dr.-who-became-my-religion

Dude if you're going to make a thread like this for the love of Christ elaborate on your point. You just said "Elfen Lied is better than the Bible" and left it at that. I never watched that show, you could be completly right or talking out of your rear for all I know. How is it better?

P.S. You want the R&P Forums

You know what annoys me about the Bible? It's got a really, really lazy name. Literally, it means "book". Not book or anything or anything book, just book.

Oh, and yeah, Jesus didn't write any of it himself, and some of it is just collected bits and pieces that don't seem relevant to anything that was even going on when it was collected. IMHO, given that it was put together by human beings, there should have been some review system to add or subtract parts over the millenia to keep the most relevant stuff. Older, less relevant stuff can be kept in an extended version if necessary, but the idea that no humans since have come up with stuff equal or more worthy than the humans back then seems very unlikely.

Having said that, I'm not a Christian, and even if I was I couldn't really tell people what bits were important and what weren't, but if I had my splinter group, some procedure for reassessments would be included.

I'm not really sure about the books(?) the OP is referencing but I'm an atheist anyway. I don't really see why this needs arguing about. There's plenty of equally valid places to go that give you genuinely good advice about love and caring - following the assumption that love and care is really beneficial/desirable. :)

Oh boy. Just wait until God reads this. You're in trouble man, He's gonna smite you one!

Really? Elfen Lied is the greatest thing ever? And not anime? You're totally serious about that one...right? lol

I can kinda agree, but only because Elfen Lied doesn't carry things that can be interpreted as anti-gay propaganda.

Disclaimer: I don't think the bible IS anti-gay propaganda, but I do think it can be interpreted as such.

 Pages 1 2 3 NEXT

Reply to Thread

This thread is locked