Okay, this is an issue that's been building up in my head for a while now, so I'm going to open it up for discussion to try and get some catharsis.
There's a word we need to talk about. "Taboo" words have been around since forever, and our current crop is (admittedly admirably) largely racial or bigoted slurs. But we seem to have missed one off the list. Or rather, due to differences in language culture, the bigger country of English Speakers sees the word differently and this is affecting our own perception.
The word in question is retard.
My dad works in social services, specifically in the dealing with abuse of people with learning disabilities. As such, the word has always been a bad one for me. I have been brought up to an extent that I feel immensely uncomfortable even typing it, as goes for other derogatory words.
But I see it in use all the damn time.
I know the word doesn't carry the same level of taboo in the States, and to be honest in most places over here too, but why is that? It means the same doesn't it? I'm certain there's no difference in definition, so why the hell is the word thrown around so casually? Hell, even TV shows and Videogames that I respect and adore use it in the context of calling people stupid. So Escapists, my question is twofold: Do you personally use the word? What's your opinion on the use of the word? Discuss.
3quency: Okay, this is an issue that's been building up in my head for a while now, so I'm going to open it up for discussion to try and get some catharsis.
There's a word we need to talk about. "Taboo" words have been around since forever, and our current crop is (admittedly admirably) largely racial or bigoted slurs. But we seem to have missed one off the list. Or rather, due to differences in language culture, the bigger country of English Speakers sees the word differently and this is affecting our own perception.
The word in question is retard.
My dad works in social services, specifically in the dealing with abuse of people with learning disabilities. As such, the word has always been a bad one for me. I have been brought up to an extent that I feel immensely uncomfortable even typing it, as goes for other derogatory words.
But I see it in use all the damn time.
I know the word doesn't carry the same level of taboo in the States, and to be honest in most places over here too, but why is that? It means the same doesn't it? I'm certain there's no difference in definition, so why the hell is the word thrown around so casually? Hell, even TV shows and Videogames that I respect and adore use it in the context of calling people stupid. So Escapists, my question is twofold: Do you personally use the word? What's your opinion on the use of the word? Discuss.
"Retarded" is one of those words that its polite not to say around someone who actually is one of those (in this case retarded) but if you get offended and you arent retarded nor are you friends or relatives with someone who is then you need to go and change your panties. To be honest though I don't use the word much, too many syllables and it doesnt sound that great off the tongue.
I've always preferred fucking stupid. Retarded is just something you are and you can't really change that. Everyone is capable of being fucking stupid and a lot of people have a phase in their life where it's their defining characteristic, generally anywhere from early teens to mid 20's, and it's a curable condition thankfully.
"Retarded" is one of those words that its polite not to say around someone who actually is one of those (in this case retarded) but if you get offended and you arent retarded nor are you friends or relatives with someone who is then you need to go and change your panties. To be honest though I don't use the word much, too many syllables and it doesnt sound that great off the tongue.
Okay, that's fair enough. Couple of points though, My Uncle is Bi-polar. Does that fit your definition of retarded? Would that justify my feelings of offence?
Two, "you need to go change your panties". Fifty years ago, wouldn't we have said the same about certain other words? Certain racial ones? I'm no psychologist but it's a fair assumption to make that casual use of derogatory terms will just make it easier to say them around the people they're aimed at. So not saying it "out of politeness" feels like a kind of week justification, sort of along the lines of hey, I didn't say it whilst the spastic was around, so that's okay isn't it? No. It's not.
But hey, just my opinion. Like I said, I understand the word doesn't quite hold the same stigma everywhere. I'll stop commenting for a while now to leave the thread open.
WouldYouKindly: I've always preferred fucking stupid. Retarded is just something you are and you can't really change that. Everyone is capable of being fucking stupid and a lot of people have a phase in their life where it's their defining characteristic, generally anywhere from early teens to mid 20's, and it's a curable condition thankfully.
I would agree, and would add that I think "fucking stupid" has a wonderfully percussive sound. It's very cathartic to me. "Retard" and "retarded" don't seem to roll off the tongue in quite the same way.
WouldYouKindly: I've always preferred fucking stupid. Retarded is just something you are and you can't really change that. Everyone is capable of being fucking stupid and a lot of people have a phase in their life where it's their defining characteristic, generally anywhere from early teens to mid 20's, and it's a curable condition thankfully.
I would agree, and would add that I think "fucking stupid" has a wonderfully percussive sound. It's very cathartic to me. "Retard" and "retarded" don't seem to roll off the tongue in quite the same way.
I'm a bit more fond of calling someone "dense". It's because I put a lot of emphasis on the "d" sound and it just is so fun to say.
As for that word, it was taboo growing up for me, so I never really use it. I have quite a few friends with mental disabilities, so it's not something I like to say.
Can't say that I have a problem using the word retarded. Its just a word. That said, I don't go up to people who are mentally handicap and shout the word at them and rub it in their face about their condition.
In before everyone who is madly all about dat dere free speech crying, "IT'S JUST A WORD!" and everyone who is or knows someone who actually is mentally handicapped in some way going, "NO ITS NOT! :["
Yeah, I use the word. "Mentally retarded" (or rather the German phrase, "mental/geistig retardiert") is a clinical term that comes up every now and then in my field. It does not carry the same stigma that "retarded" carries near Sarah Palin, since she decided that parading around her children, including her child with Down's syndrome, and getting mad at the attention at the same time was a sensible thing to do. Instead, we have a whole slew of other insensitive terms to refer to the mentally retarded, which I tend not to use, though. I'm kind of boring in my swear words, except for turning the German word for "fuck" into a participle that I apply to various things, albeit mostly when I'm alone (I don't really swear in public). So instead of calling things "retarded" or "gay" (another bigoted swear word) or whatever, I tend to say "shitty, crappy, stupid, dumb, idiotic"... nothing too special.
Zekksta: Free speech and shit it's just a word but I know someone retarded so no it's not.
I see what you did there and I appreciate that you refrained from using that font.
I say retarded a lot, I think. I generally don't concern myself with offending people, though. This feels like one of those things where we're protecting other people and I've never been a huge fan of that. Pretending that calling someone moron, imbecile, idiot, or feeble minded is any better than retarded also makes no sense. All of those words originated in psychology to refer to people that were mentally retarded.
My point of view is that we have words for things for a reason. The reason is identification of a concept. "Retard" is not a slur against them, simply a word created to identify a concept. In much the same way that you could insult a man by calling him a retard, you could equally be insulting by calling him a girl. Does that mean that we should not use the word "girl" to identify what clearly is one? People will find ways to insult each other, no matter how many words we rope off.
3quency: Okay, this is an issue that's been building up in my head for a while now, so I'm going to open it up for discussion to try and get some catharsis.
There's a word we need to talk about. "Taboo" words have been around since forever, and our current crop is (admittedly admirably) largely racial or bigoted slurs. But we seem to have missed one off the list. Or rather, due to differences in language culture, the bigger country of English Speakers sees the word differently and this is affecting our own perception.
The word in question is retard.
My dad works in social services, specifically in the dealing with abuse of people with learning disabilities. As such, the word has always been a bad one for me. I have been brought up to an extent that I feel immensely uncomfortable even typing it, as goes for other derogatory words.
But I see it in use all the damn time.
I know the word doesn't carry the same level of taboo in the States, and to be honest in most places over here too, but why is that? It means the same doesn't it? I'm certain there's no difference in definition, so why the hell is the word thrown around so casually? Hell, even TV shows and Videogames that I respect and adore use it in the context of calling people stupid. So Escapists, my question is twofold: Do you personally use the word? What's your opinion on the use of the word? Discuss.
"Retarded" is one of those words that its polite not to say around someone who actually is one of those (in this case retarded) but if you get offended and you arent retarded nor are you friends or relatives with someone who is then you need to go and change your panties. To be honest though I don't use the word much, too many syllables and it doesnt sound that great off the tongue.
Now explain how Retarded is different than Gay, Jew, Pussy, or any other number of words that are not accepted in public use.
3quency: Okay, this is an issue that's been building up in my head for a while now, so I'm going to open it up for discussion to try and get some catharsis.
There's a word we need to talk about. "Taboo" words have been around since forever, and our current crop is (admittedly admirably) largely racial or bigoted slurs. But we seem to have missed one off the list. Or rather, due to differences in language culture, the bigger country of English Speakers sees the word differently and this is affecting our own perception.
The word in question is retard.
My dad works in social services, specifically in the dealing with abuse of people with learning disabilities. As such, the word has always been a bad one for me. I have been brought up to an extent that I feel immensely uncomfortable even typing it, as goes for other derogatory words.
But I see it in use all the damn time.
I know the word doesn't carry the same level of taboo in the States, and to be honest in most places over here too, but why is that? It means the same doesn't it? I'm certain there's no difference in definition, so why the hell is the word thrown around so casually? Hell, even TV shows and Videogames that I respect and adore use it in the context of calling people stupid. So Escapists, my question is twofold: Do you personally use the word? What's your opinion on the use of the word? Discuss.
"Retarded" is one of those words that its polite not to say around someone who actually is one of those (in this case retarded) but if you get offended and you arent retarded nor are you friends or relatives with someone who is then you need to go and change your panties. To be honest though I don't use the word much, too many syllables and it doesnt sound that great off the tongue.
Now explain how Retarded is different than Gay, Jew, Pussy, or any other number of words that are not accepted in public use.
what do you mean> people say those words all the time with little to no repercussion(in the US at least). i often hear people say "stop being so Jewish" or "dont be a pussy", or "thats gay". im sure using language like that on this forum would have consequences but i never see people get mad about it IRL. well i do but thats rare and usually by people who are not gay, jewish or female.
"Retarded" is one of those words that its polite not to say around someone who actually is one of those (in this case retarded) but if you get offended and you arent retarded nor are you friends or relatives with someone who is then you need to go and change your panties. To be honest though I don't use the word much, too many syllables and it doesnt sound that great off the tongue.
Now explain how Retarded is different than Gay, Jew, Pussy, or any other number of words that are not accepted in public use.
what do you mean> people say those words all the time with little to no repercussion(in the US at least). i often hear people say "stop being so Jewish" or "dont be a pussy", or "thats gay". im sure using language like that on this forum would have consequences but i never see people get mad about it IRL. well i do but thats rare and usually by people who are not gay, jewish or female.
Facinating, culture must be very different where you live. As a bi Jewish woman let me say I'd have a problem with those comments, especially the Jewish one as its a direct sterotype and not even an alternate use of the word.
Context matters quite a bit for insults or profanity!
This is true. It's why PMS jokes from a random man come off differently then if a bunch of women are sitting around making the same jokes to each other.
I don't share that taboo. Heck, it even pisses me off. You have these fresh from school social workers who are totally indoctrinated with whatever political correctness their tutors came up with. Heard one trying to correct the other when he talked about someone being mentally disabled (and we're talking about someone who's dumber than a stump and prone to all kinds of crazy behaviour like thinking he heard you say a racist insult while you've never spoken to the guy in your life yet) and the other corrected him saying it wasn't that, but 'he had possibilities'. Apparently being bonkers today means you've 'got possibilities' these days.
It annoyed both me and that other guy, but apparently after renaming addicts into patients, patients into 'help askers', 'help askers' into clients, this is the newest in political correctness land.
Having a lot of possibilities immediatly became my favourite swearword for retards both actual and those trying hard to act like them, but all in all I don't see all the fuss. You have to call it something. People will talk of it. Some hypersensitive characters will always be offended, and people will always on occasion try to insult eachother. Welcome to humanity.
Now explain how Retarded is different than Gay, Jew, Pussy, or any other number of words that are not accepted in public use.
what do you mean> people say those words all the time with little to no repercussion(in the US at least). i often hear people say "stop being so Jewish" or "dont be a pussy", or "thats gay". im sure using language like that on this forum would have consequences but i never see people get mad about it IRL. well i do but thats rare and usually by people who are not gay, jewish or female.
Facinating, culture must be very different where you live. As a bi Jewish woman let me say I'd have a problem with those comments, especially the Jewish one as its a direct sterotype and not even an alternate use of the word.
yeah well we don't have large Jewish population, i think I've met maybe 3 Jewish families my whole time where i live and they didn't mind the jokes and stereotypes when other people said them, they actually engaged in them themselves as well. The LGBT community here is well just there, a lesbian couple got cutest couple in the yearbook and the high-school i went to was predominantly Christian with a heavy red-neck identity, but no one gave them any shit except for the more hardcore fundies and even then they were just upset that the les couple won that award. here pussy= wimp usually, and its used when a bunch of guys are in a group trying to get another guy to to do something stupid, like cliff jumping into a lake. so i dont really know whats going on here.
I'm thinking of 'Spastic' right now in Britain. It started out innocent enough, and people began using it to call someone who's stupid or awkward. Then it got a negative connotation. Why? Because when people act stupid, sometimes beyond belief, others will consider that behavior borderline retarded. I don't see the issue here.
Now explain how Retarded is different than Gay, Jew, Pussy, or any other number of words that are not accepted in public use.
Its different because the exact definition of retard doesn't refer to being mentally handicap. Actually the word retard is like the word gay, both words are used in a way that isn't part of their original definition.
Context matters quite a bit for insults or profanity!
This is true. It's why PMS jokes from a random man come off differently then if a bunch of women are sitting around making the same jokes to each other.
Okay I just wanted an excuse to post that...[/quote]
Thank you for that. I still can't stop laughing. Someone went through an awful lot of trouble to synch all of that up correctly and that just makes it that much more hilarious.
Are you familiar with the phrase; "walking on egg shells?" When you consider it from a practical perspective; it's rather pointless isn't it? Some dare say, even retarded. I will continue my amazement at specific people's issue with specific words while taking the emphasis off the intentions behind it.
If I call you stupid, it's because I think you're stupid. If I call you retarded, it's because I think you're stupid. If I call you a moron, it's because I think you're stupid. If I call you idiotic, it's because I think you're stupid.
The real irony here is that if my intention is to insult you, you will provide me the most atrocious word I can use which offends you more than the others, because you apparently didn't understand my intentions clearly enough to first time.
Taboos, like language, simply evolve to remain offensive, regardless of context it seems. Retarded is like Atheist. It can mean a simple definitive term, or an insult depending on the circumstances involved. Does that mean that every should stop using the term Atheist simply because some random people in the south use it negatively? Should I avoid asking a stock boy where I can find a cracker when I'm around white people? Should I avoid discussing chinks in armor when around Asian folk?
This is the same unreasonable shit people are using to justify removing Nigger from Huck Finn. Funny, I get exceedingly infuriated when people start suggesting I should avoid using various words in the English language for whatever reason or when they start blanking out words. Seems like trying to dilute the intentions behind it.
I felt like demonstrating with two distinctively different responses, but every time I typed it out it just kept getting longer and more insulting. Trying my best to avoid rants...
Captcha: Tylenol. How appropriate, because this pussy footing always gives me a headache.
keiskay: what do you mean> people say those words all the time with little to no repercussion(in the US at least). i often hear people say "stop being so Jewish" or "dont be a pussy", or "thats gay". im sure using language like that on this forum would have consequences but i never see people get mad about it IRL. well i do but thats rare and usually by people who are not gay, jewish or female.
Facinating, culture must be very different where you live. As a bi Jewish woman let me say I'd have a problem with those comments, especially the Jewish one as its a direct sterotype and not even an alternate use of the word.
yeah well we don't have large Jewish population, i think I've met maybe 3 Jewish families my whole time where i live and they didn't mind the jokes and stereotypes when other people said them,
And black people used to put up with nigger jokes and pretend they thought they were funny because they knew what would happen if they didn't play along.
Now explain how Retarded is different than Gay, Jew, Pussy, or any other number of words that are not accepted in public use.
Its different because the exact definition of retard doesn't refer to being mentally handicap. Actually the word retard is like the word gay, both words are used in a way that isn't part of their original definition.
When you call a person retarded, which part of the definition list you gave applies? It would seem you must mean the insult one, but I'd be happy for you to clarify otherwise.
Facinating, culture must be very different where you live. As a bi Jewish woman let me say I'd have a problem with those comments, especially the Jewish one as its a direct sterotype and not even an alternate use of the word.
yeah well we don't have large Jewish population, i think I've met maybe 3 Jewish families my whole time where i live and they didn't mind the jokes and stereotypes when other people said them,
And black people used to put up with nigger jokes and pretend they thought they were funny because they knew what would happen if they didn't play along.
yes well, nice false equivalence, since im assuming your talking pre-civil rights. jews are not going through the same thing in any way and i dont think anyone would mind if they spoke up about it. but i guess the world is still a close minded back water place.
Now explain how Retarded is different than Gay, Jew, Pussy, or any other number of words that are not accepted in public use.
Its different because the exact definition of retard doesn't refer to being mentally handicap. Actually the word retard is like the word gay, both words are used in a way that isn't part of their original definition.
When you call a person retarded, which part of the definition list you gave applies? It would seem you must mean the insult one, but I'd be happy for you to clarify otherwise.
The definition isn't an insult, so when I say that a person is acting retarded, I mean that they are acting slow.
There will always be people who are offended by random words that mean nothing in the larger picture.
There will always be people who use those words for exactly that reason.
And there will always be people like myself that want to yell at the above categories, telling both groups to grow the hell up, although for different reasons.
keiskay: yeah well we don't have large Jewish population, i think I've met maybe 3 Jewish families my whole time where i live and they didn't mind the jokes and stereotypes when other people said them,
And black people used to put up with nigger jokes and pretend they thought they were funny because they knew what would happen if they didn't play along.
yes well, nice false equivalence, since im assuming your talking pre-civil rights. jews are not going through the same thing in any way and i dont think anyone would mind if they spoke up about it. but i guess the world is still a close minded back water place.
No, I'm not just talking "pre civil rights". You don't have to go back far to hear such jokes...and in fact you still hear them in some places now.
You self identified as being in a red neck location. I don't think you understand what hearing all that stuff does to the minority. It's very uncomfortable and intimidating. You don't when the majority to start thinking of you as "them" and "different".
And black people used to put up with nigger jokes and pretend they thought they were funny because they knew what would happen if they didn't play along.
yes well, nice false equivalence, since im assuming your talking pre-civil rights. jews are not going through the same thing in any way and i dont think anyone would mind if they spoke up about it. but i guess the world is still a close minded back water place.
No, I'm not just talking "pre civil rights". You don't have to go back far to hear such jokes...and in fact you still hear them in some places now.
You self identified as being in a red neck location. I don't think you understand what hearing all that stuff does to the minority. It's very uncomfortable and intimidating. You don't when the majority to start thinking of you as "them" and "different".
i understand that very well. but i have to disagree. i've seen minorities defend themselves just fine here with no repercussions. just because i said red-neck i didnt mean ignorant, intolerant, racist ass-hat's. but i guess its fine to propagate a stereotype as long as that group is also a majority right? when i said red-neck i meant that they love big trucks, hunting and sipping on whiskey. not that everyone is intolerant and racist.
the gay people here get a long just fine with the redneck population, so i dont see why the few Jewish people couldnt as well.
Aris Khandr: My point of view is that we have words for things for a reason. The reason is identification of a concept. "Retard" is not a slur against them, simply a word created to identify a concept. In much the same way that you could insult a man by calling him a retard, you could equally be insulting by calling him a girl. Does that mean that we should not use the word "girl" to identify what clearly is one? People will find ways to insult each other, no matter how many words we rope off.
Yes, but at the same time, Negro and its variations was considered the scientific term for black people, there's more to it than that. When these words were coined, they specifically referred to people who were considered "subhuman" on some level. Which let's face it, is pretty offensive. I'm not opposed to free speech, and I'm not that easily offended (I don't think. I may well be wrong). But I still think there are terms that should be avoided, if only for their connotations. I don't get this whole "political correctness gone mad" concept, it seems a very odd perspective. But then language is weird I guess.
I see no problem in using it, as it accurately relays an opinion that one finds something to be stupid, inane, unintelligent, and/or not at all thought through. So if that's what I wish to express, I'll use it.
Should someone feel offended that I use the word in that sense - and thus obviously not in a sense that's directed against mentally handicapped people - then I'll certainly call them retarded, along with a whole other host of things, of which even the most polite do not bear mention here. There's nothing so annoying as Hyperbolic Hypersensitives, though performing lots and lots of what they'd probably call verbal violence on them offers some compensation.
Surprisingly, neither as weird or creepy as the actual show itself can be...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
Okay, this is an issue that's been building up in my head for a while now, so I'm going to open it up for discussion to try and get some catharsis.
There's a word we need to talk about.
"Taboo" words have been around since forever, and our current crop is (admittedly admirably) largely racial or bigoted slurs. But we seem to have missed one off the list. Or rather, due to differences in language culture, the bigger country of English Speakers sees the word differently and this is affecting our own perception.
The word in question is retard.
My dad works in social services, specifically in the dealing with abuse of people with learning disabilities. As such, the word has always been a bad one for me. I have been brought up to an extent that I feel immensely uncomfortable even typing it, as goes for other derogatory words.
But I see it in use all the damn time.
I know the word doesn't carry the same level of taboo in the States, and to be honest in most places over here too, but why is that? It means the same doesn't it? I'm certain there's no difference in definition, so why the hell is the word thrown around so casually? Hell, even TV shows and Videogames that I respect and adore use it in the context of calling people stupid.
So Escapists, my question is twofold: Do you personally use the word? What's your opinion on the use of the word?
Discuss.