Petitions for secession in 15 states

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NameIsRobertPaulson:
Have people always been this crazy?

Pretty much, yeah. Sure, it ebbs and flows and the locations and 'reasons' change but most societies aren't all that far away from triggering their own mass hysteria.

spartan231490:
A supermarket might go out of business without customers, but without the supermarket customers starve.

Problem: The US is the supermarket. Texas is the customer.

NameIsRobertPaulson:

Have people always been this crazy?

Given witch hunts and the behavior of countries in the name of religion, I would say yes.

spartan231490:

It's one of the few states that doesn't consume more than it produces, also the oil refining ability is key. It's too big of a resource for any block of trade. It's not amount of oil, it's the ability to refine it that is important. All the oil in the world won't run a single car or furnace until it's turned into gas or fuel oil. Also, winter is coming, so demand is on the rise. Gas prices are already too high and are crippling the US and global economy, if half of the refining capability of the US is completely isolated from all trade, those prices would further skyrocket, damaging many economies. The increase increase in oil prices would cause support for independence in the UN, and massive discontent in the US, pushing any borderline states to follow and eroding support for a war. It would be even worse than Iraq, and Iraq is still fresh in our minds. Also remember that Texas produces a lot of beef and seafood, which are already expensive and in high demand, if we cut off texas those prices will further increase, also increasing discontent, all while providing food for texas. I'm not saying it would be easy, but thinking that it is impossible is naive, just about anything is possible.

Globalization is actually an ally of Texas in this case, because the global community, especially the US, is just as dependent(possibly more so) on Texas as Texas is on the world. Globalization is a two way street. A supermarket might go out of business without customers, but without the supermarket customers starve.

First off I would like to know where you are getting the number for Texan oil refinery capacity from. The numbers I have found say its around 25% of US refining. It is still a significant number, but it is something that can be over come quite easily.

I am not saying Texas leaving the US would not hurt the US, I am saying that Texas would not be able to maintain developed world standards of living in the event they left the US and had to face the likely scenario of economic sanctions.

A state such as Texas leaving the US would hurt the US in the short term, but it is something that an economic power such as the US could over come with relative ease. Texas on the other hand would never be the same while economic sanctions remained.

We know the results of economic sanctions, it is why they are used against countries with brown people in them who are not cooperating as part of the international community.

Texas can supply itself with plenty of resources and what not...but it cannot turn those resources into products, it simply does not have the manpower left to do so. No country in the modern world can do everything to sustain the standards of living we expect, it is why globalization occurred.

farson135:

much the US would now have to pay to build new refineries (or to have another country refine its materials), how much trade would be lost with Mexico, all of the ports lost, etc.
...
Right, if Texas actually does leave then there would have to be one hell of a crisis. If the government will not significantly scale back spending now they will not do it then.

Well, no. That uses many unsafe assumptions.

The almost certain reality is that an independent Texas and the USA would continue to be good friends. Texas would simply become part of NAFTA or some other form of free trade association, and economic life will for the most part continue very much as normal. The USA would continue to use Texan oil refineries, Texan ports, and at negligibly (if at all) different cost. Besides, the future of oil production is oil shale - most of which is well outside Texas - and oil is likely to become a diminishing percentage of energy generation.

I can find that according to the Texas governor's office, Texas exported $251 billion in 2011. Its imports from the 10 highest source countries was $281 billion; so that's a deficit. In terms of Mexico, it's about $90 billion out, $175 billion in, meaning Mexico sells about twice as much to Texas as Texas does to Mexico.

What we'd really want to know however is the biggie: Texas' trade situation with the rest of the USA. It's hard to work out what the trade situation would be given that it's unlikely there are records for interstate trade. I would guess offhand it's probably healthy, simply due to oil if nothing else. In general terms, Texas has about 8.5% of the population of the USA, and about 8.5% of the economy. Which suggests it's pretty average.

Look, don't get me wrong, I'm not knocking Texas: I think it would have a good chance of going it's own way successfully if it chose. I'm just pointing out that the USA would get along fine too. Texas might be an economically valuable part of the USA, but it is surely not vital.

pyrate:

spartan231490:

It's one of the few states that doesn't consume more than it produces, also the oil refining ability is key. It's too big of a resource for any block of trade. It's not amount of oil, it's the ability to refine it that is important. All the oil in the world won't run a single car or furnace until it's turned into gas or fuel oil. Also, winter is coming, so demand is on the rise. Gas prices are already too high and are crippling the US and global economy, if half of the refining capability of the US is completely isolated from all trade, those prices would further skyrocket, damaging many economies. The increase increase in oil prices would cause support for independence in the UN, and massive discontent in the US, pushing any borderline states to follow and eroding support for a war. It would be even worse than Iraq, and Iraq is still fresh in our minds. Also remember that Texas produces a lot of beef and seafood, which are already expensive and in high demand, if we cut off texas those prices will further increase, also increasing discontent, all while providing food for texas. I'm not saying it would be easy, but thinking that it is impossible is naive, just about anything is possible.

Globalization is actually an ally of Texas in this case, because the global community, especially the US, is just as dependent(possibly more so) on Texas as Texas is on the world. Globalization is a two way street. A supermarket might go out of business without customers, but without the supermarket customers starve.

First off I would like to know where you are getting the number for Texan oil refinery capacity from. The numbers I have found say its around 25% of US refining. It is still a significant number, but it is something that can be over come quite easily.

I am not saying Texas leaving the US would not hurt the US, I am saying that Texas would not be able to maintain developed world standards of living in the event they left the US and had to face the likely scenario of economic sanctions.

A state such as Texas leaving the US would hurt the US in the short term, but it is something that an economic power such as the US could over come with relative ease. Texas on the other hand would never be the same while economic sanctions remained.

We know the results of economic sanctions, it is why they are used against countries with brown people in them who are not cooperating as part of the international community.

Texas can supply itself with plenty of resources and what not...but it cannot turn those resources into products, it simply does not have the manpower left to do so. No country in the modern world can do everything to sustain the standards of living we expect, it is why globalization occurred.

You don't realize how big states are do you? Texas has the 15th largest economy of countries if you consider it to be one, big enough to handle itself. I'll post sources later, if I do it now I'll be late for my test, I get done with classes in 9 hours.

spartan231490:

pyrate:
[quote="spartan231490" post="528.393597.15921589"]

snip

You don't realize how big states are do you? Texas has the 15th largest economy of countries if you consider it to be one, big enough to handle itself. I'll post sources later, if I do it now I'll be late for my test, I get done with classes in 9 hours.

The size does not matter. In 25 years China will in all likelihood have an economy exceeding $25 trillion, they will still be heavily dependent on trade with other countries around the world to maintain their economy and standard of living.

The only way a US state could sustain itself is if it left peacefully and maintained a majority of the trade relationships it had when it was a part of the US.

One other aspect that should not be ignored, the will of the people. How many people in Texas would move to the US and how many people from the US would move to Texas? Depending on the way a state leaves they could face a massive net loss of population. How do you think Texas would go if it lost 10% of its population, 15%, 20%?

The entire 'State X would be fine leaving the US' argument is akin to the 'government doesn't do anything for me' argument. Many people simply do not have a grasp of how entangled the system is with day to day life. You cannot tear away from the system in place and expect things to be all fine and dandy, there is going to be a considerable period of things going to shit while a new system is implemented.

Witty Name Here:
The patriotic conservatives! The last to join the union, the first to leave, and now they're trying it all over again.

I don't have any real problem with conservatives, but when anyone acts so crazy that they want to, I don't know, remake the confederacy, I usually consider that justification to laugh at them.

Which is ironic considering I'm directly related to a Confederate general, one who fought against Sherman (and became his friend later in life).

That's an amazing story: Sherman had friends!?!

RhombusHatesYou:
This amuses me even more than the silly fucks who say they want to move to Australia to 'escape Obama's socialism'...

Whenever people say Obama is a socialist or communist, I feel bad that they have obviously never seen The Princess Bride:
image

pyrate:

spartan231490:

pyrate:
[quote="spartan231490" post="528.393597.15921589"]

snip

You don't realize how big states are do you? Texas has the 15th largest economy of countries if you consider it to be one, big enough to handle itself. I'll post sources later, if I do it now I'll be late for my test, I get done with classes in 9 hours.

The size does not matter. In 25 years China will in all likelihood have an economy exceeding $25 trillion, they will still be heavily dependent on trade with other countries around the world to maintain their economy and standard of living.

The only way a US state could sustain itself is if it left peacefully and maintained a majority of the trade relationships it had when it was a part of the US.

One other aspect that should not be ignored, the will of the people. How many people in Texas would move to the US and how many people from the US would move to Texas? Depending on the way a state leaves they could face a massive net loss of population. How do you think Texas would go if it lost 10% of its population, 15%, 20%?

The entire 'State X would be fine leaving the US' argument is akin to the 'government doesn't do anything for me' argument. Many people simply do not have a grasp of how entangled the system is with day to day life. You cannot tear away from the system in place and expect things to be all fine and dandy, there is going to be a considerable period of things going to shit while a new system is implemented.

If the secession is peaceful and orderly, then the new country should be able to survive on its own. However, things like that can easily turn antagonistic and then all bets are off. There will be groups in Texas who will oppose secession and if violence erupts, the US government might be pressured into sending in troops to protect US citizens who live in Texas but do not want to secede. Things like that get messy really quick and you cannot be sure which way public opinions swings if people start dying.

RedFeather1975:
Texas has experience with being a separate country with it's own government.

Did you mean, a lot of people who are dead now had experience running Texas as a separate country?

Last time the Texan governor talked about secession, it was only a few weeks later when he started begging the federal government for help with the swine flu outbreak. There are no words for how shameful, cowardly, and opportunistic that was. Even though I was living in Texas at the time and swine flu was being detected miles from where I lived, part of me wanted to see the federal government say something along the lines of "You talk about secession and then ask for federal aid? You guys can just fuck right off."

In all fairness, secession should be acceptable in a country founded on that basis. It's incredibly idiotic and pointless, but if any state does manage to secede, the majority of the people living there would probably not be any great loss to the USA, and the ones who are will probably move back into it.

Besides, if you only lose one, and let Puerto Rico join, you won't even have to change your flag.

What the world needs is more theocratic, desert-states with lots of oil!

I don't even think this debate should focus on Texas so much. While I don't think they would succeed on their own, either, there are much clearer examples of Southern states sucking on the federal teat, being at the low range of education, abortion, teen pregnancy, healthcare, life expectancy, productivity etc.. Unless the conservative ideology is more clearly distanced from the extremely harmful social conservatism, I can't help but predict utter disaster for anybody unfortunate enough to leave the union and follow their ideology fully.

Texas has over 90,000 signatures on their petition.

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/peacefully-grant-state-texas-withdraw-united-states-america-and-create-its-own-new-government/BmdWCP8B

I am in no way saying I want a war or anything like that. I don't think people realize how awful they are and can be.

I just think it's very interesting that this is happening and really should be addressed. And no, not just a sit down and shut up comment. This country is divided. People should take something as serious as succession, well, seriously.

edit: More than 15 have petitioned too. Just taking the list off of the site where the original first petition done by Louisiana was done.

I'll try and keep the list updated as States are added in and 25k marks are reached.

1. Wisconsin
2. Utah
3. Ohio
4. South Dakota
5. Virginia
6. Nebraska
7. Pennsylvania
8. Kansas
9. Oklahoma
10. Wyoming
11. California
12. New York
13. Delaware
14. Arizona
15. Arkansas
16. South Carolina
17. Georgia ***
18. Missouri
19. Tennessee ***
20. Michigan
21. Oregon
22. New Jersey
23. North Dakota
24. Montana
25. Indiana
26. Mississippi
27. Kentucky
28. Florida ***
29. North Carolina ***
30. Alabama ***
31. Texas ***
32. Louisiana ***
33. New Hampshire
34. Illinois
35. Rhode Island
36. Idaho
37. West Virginia
38. New Mexico
39. Minnesota
40. Nevada
41. Colorado
42. Maine
43. Iowa
44. Washington
45. Connecticut
46. Maryland
47. Hawaii
48. Massachusetts

*** = 25,000 mark reached

Total States having reached and/or exceeded 25k = 7

DVS BSTrD:

RhombusHatesYou:
This amuses me even more than the silly fucks who say they want to move to Australia to 'escape Obama's socialism'...

Whenever people say Obama is a socialist or communist, I feel bad that they have obviously never seen The Princess Bride:
image

It's not Obama's imagined political leanings that amuse me (not in this particular case)...

It's Australia as a destination to escape socialism that makes me laugh.

"I'm terrified that the President is going to introduce the outward trappings of a Social Welfare State... so I'm fleeing to an actual Social Welfare State."

bleys2487:

I just think it's very interesting that this is happening and really should be addressed. And no, not just a sit down and shut up comment. This country is divided. People should take something as serious as succession, well, seriously.

You just had a succession attempt on November 6th, the incumbent won ;)

Sorry. Serious you say...

I think it extremely unlikely a secession attempt would end in war. Or at least, not in the reasonably foreseeable future, not least because secession isn't even close to a likelihood.

Divisions would need to be both huge and bitter to induce a civil war. For all the right v left hostility, it is not a shadow of the huge, polarising differences and moral issues in society (particularly slavery) that existed between North and South in the mid-19th century. Whether government should be about 25% or 35% of GDP just doesn't cut it. Without something much more severe emerging, if a state did vote to secede, I think everyone would just calmly think about and discuss it, and work something out.

bleys2487:

8. Kansas

You see this. Look what you have done. You done gone and ruined my day now. And here I thought that my state was smarter than that. God damn it! On a side note: Its up to 32 states out of 50 now....and its not limited to Republican strongholds, there are some Democrat locations on there. I need to bookmark this thread. Shits gettin real.

RhombusHatesYou:

DVS BSTrD:

RhombusHatesYou:
This amuses me even more than the silly fucks who say they want to move to Australia to 'escape Obama's socialism'...

Whenever people say Obama is a socialist or communist, I feel bad that they have obviously never seen The Princess Bride:
image

It's not Obama's imagined political leanings that amuse me (not in this particular case)...

It's Australia as a destination to escape socialism that makes me laugh.

"I'm terrified that the President is going to introduce the outward trappings of a Social Welfare State... so I'm fleeing to an actual Social Welfare State."

I suspect it's probably because people that stupid are only aware of three English speaking countries besides the US (God forbid they should try to learn another language), and to them, Canada is the country of Socialist Commie Nazis, and the UK is the country that hates liberty and freedom.

farson135:
Why? If you believe that the other system has failed you then why should you wait to succeed?

Here's the problem; it has absolutely damn all to do with them thinking the system has failed. It's about them throwing a childish tantrum over the other guy winning the election.

If they really thought the system sucked, they would've been petitioning to secede when George W. Bush won. Oh, right, they didn't, because all this comes down to is that the only problem that they see with the system is that it's legal for people who disagree with them to actually win the election.

bleys2487:
Texas has over 70,000 signatures on their petition.

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/peacefully-grant-state-texas-withdraw-united-states-america-and-create-its-own-new-government/BmdWCP8B

I'm from South Carolina. I'm a daughter of the Confederacy. I had family serve the C.S.A.

I am in no way saying I want a war or anything like that. I don't think people realize how awful they are and can be.

I just think it's very interesting that this is happening and really should be addressed. And no, not just a sit down and shut up comment. This country is divided. People should take something as serious as succession, well, seriously.

edit: More than 15 have petitioned too. Just taking the list off of the site where the original first petition done by Louisiana was done.

1. Wisconsin
2. Utah
3. Ohio
4. South Dakota
5. Virginia
6. Nebraska
7. Pennsylvania
8. Kansas
9. Oklahoma
10. Wyoming
11. California
12. New York
13. Delaware
14. Arizona
15. Arkansas
16. South Carolina
17. Georgia
18. Missouri
19. Tennessee
20. Michigan
21. Oregon
22. New Jersey
23. North Dakota
24. Montana
25. Indiana
26. Mississippi
27. Kentucky
28. Florida
29. North Carolina
30. Alabama
31. Texas - 25,000 mark reached
32. Louisiana - 25,000 mark reached

As a cynical Internet user, I really do not have much faith in petitions like this. Singing a petition is a very non-binding way to express your disapproval. It is pretty much a given that the petition will be ignored by the government. Are the people who signed the petition actually willing to do anything 'real' about it? Will they form a secession party and run their own candidates in the next election? Are they going to push for a referendum on this? Or maybe even go as far as blow up some federal buildings to prove they are serious?

At this point there does not seem to be much more weight behind this than a petition to save a TV show from cancellation.

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/wh-petition-calls-stripping-citizenship-and-exile-anyone-who-signs-petition-secede_663282.html

A new petition has been made, saying that anyone who signs a state succession petition should be stripped of their citizenship.

I really wish I was kidding on that one.

Bentusi16:
Texas wasn't part of the confederacy. Pretty sure new jersey wasn't either, I'll have to check my history books.

I agree this should be taken seriously. I have little doubt there are people who would gladly spill blood over this. Imagine if someone were to emerge from politics, akin to an Obama type speaker, just with the opposite message. Obama rose from relative obscurity to the highest office in the country almost solely on his speaking skills and his overarching message. There's your recent example, to say there is no way this could happen is ignoring our history, past and present.

Nielas:

bleys2487:
Texas has over 70,000 signatures on their petition.

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/peacefully-grant-state-texas-withdraw-united-states-america-and-create-its-own-new-government/BmdWCP8B

I'm from South Carolina. I'm a daughter of the Confederacy. I had family serve the C.S.A.

I am in no way saying I want a war or anything like that. I don't think people realize how awful they are and can be.

I just think it's very interesting that this is happening and really should be addressed. And no, not just a sit down and shut up comment. This country is divided. People should take something as serious as succession, well, seriously.

edit: More than 15 have petitioned too. Just taking the list off of the site where the original first petition done by Louisiana was done.

1. Wisconsin
2. Utah
3. Ohio
4. South Dakota
5. Virginia
6. Nebraska
7. Pennsylvania
8. Kansas
9. Oklahoma
10. Wyoming
11. California
12. New York
13. Delaware
14. Arizona
15. Arkansas
16. South Carolina
17. Georgia
18. Missouri
19. Tennessee
20. Michigan
21. Oregon
22. New Jersey
23. North Dakota
24. Montana
25. Indiana
26. Mississippi
27. Kentucky
28. Florida
29. North Carolina
30. Alabama
31. Texas - 25,000 mark reached
32. Louisiana - 25,000 mark reached

As a cynical Internet user, I really do not have much faith in petitions like this. Singing a petition is a very non-binding way to express your disapproval. It is pretty much a given that the petition will be ignored by the government. Are the people who signed the petition actually willing to do anything 'real' about it? Will they form a secession party and run their own candidates in the next election? Are they going to push for a referendum on this? Or maybe even go as far as blow up some federal buildings to prove they are serious?

At this point there does not seem to be much more weight behind this than a petition to save a TV show from cancellation.

I wonder how eager all those signature owners will be if someone turns up and says "Youre part of the secession army now, heres your rifle, lets fight for succession you put your name down afterall?." I imagine the list will shrink a great deal.

This is silly. The MAJORITY of the state needs to want it before it becomes an i. Which is why democrat strongholds are part of the list. Anyone can START a petition. When one hits the 50% mark let me know, THATS news. I could start a petition now to declare war on france. It means very little.

BiscuitTrouser:

Nielas:

bleys2487:
Texas has over 70,000 signatures on their petition.

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/peacefully-grant-state-texas-withdraw-united-states-america-and-create-its-own-new-government/BmdWCP8B

I'm from South Carolina. I'm a daughter of the Confederacy. I had family serve the C.S.A.

I am in no way saying I want a war or anything like that. I don't think people realize how awful they are and can be.

I just think it's very interesting that this is happening and really should be addressed. And no, not just a sit down and shut up comment. This country is divided. People should take something as serious as succession, well, seriously.

edit: More than 15 have petitioned too. Just taking the list off of the site where the original first petition done by Louisiana was done.

1. Wisconsin
2. Utah
3. Ohio
4. South Dakota
5. Virginia
6. Nebraska
7. Pennsylvania
8. Kansas
9. Oklahoma
10. Wyoming
11. California
12. New York
13. Delaware
14. Arizona
15. Arkansas
16. South Carolina
17. Georgia
18. Missouri
19. Tennessee
20. Michigan
21. Oregon
22. New Jersey
23. North Dakota
24. Montana
25. Indiana
26. Mississippi
27. Kentucky
28. Florida
29. North Carolina
30. Alabama
31. Texas - 25,000 mark reached
32. Louisiana - 25,000 mark reached

As a cynical Internet user, I really do not have much faith in petitions like this. Singing a petition is a very non-binding way to express your disapproval. It is pretty much a given that the petition will be ignored by the government. Are the people who signed the petition actually willing to do anything 'real' about it? Will they form a secession party and run their own candidates in the next election? Are they going to push for a referendum on this? Or maybe even go as far as blow up some federal buildings to prove they are serious?

At this point there does not seem to be much more weight behind this than a petition to save a TV show from cancellation.

I wonder how eager all those signature owners will be if someone turns up and says "Youre part of the secession army now, heres your rifle, lets fight for succession you put your name down afterall?." I imagine the list will shrink a great deal.

This is silly. The MAJORITY of the state needs to want it before it becomes an i. Which is why democrat strongholds are part of the list. Anyone can START a petition. When one hits the 50% mark let me know, THATS news. I could start a petition now to declare war on france. It means very little.

I wish I had the answers for you. I'm simply saying that what is occurring, at least to me, is very interesting. That may not be the case for you. That's perfectly fine.

Also, I believe it's just an example of how divided the country is/is becoming. I think that's a rather serious topic. I'm not proposing anything.

Sorry for all the edits :PP Damn iPad

This is no different than the liberal jack-wads on Twitter calling for "civil war" if Romney won. Six of one, half a dozen of the other.

http://www.examiner.com/article/liberals-on-twitter-call-for-civil-war-if-romney-wins-election

I think it would be great. Here's an snippet a Texas friend sent me:

Texas is the only state that used to be its own country. It is also the only state to join the Union through treaty, rather than annexation - which means that the Texas flag can legally fly at the same height as the United States flag. Now that's cool.

Texas has mountains and deserts, fields and forests. There are lakes and rivers, and we even have our own mini-Grand Canyon (Palo Duro).

All four of the poisonous snakes in North America live in Texas, which always makes our woods more exciting than a romp through a northern forest. There is very little lyme disease and CWD (Chronic Wasting Disease) still hasn't affected our deer.

Texans fought a revolution to make their own Republic. Texas is the only state with a legal right to secede from the Union (per the Texas-American Annexation Treaty of 1848) (Since debunked).

Texans have a love-hate relationship with the United States. Down here we are Texans first and Americans second (for those of you who are scoffing at this, it is probably the same in NY City - admit it!). Things are definitely heading down hill for the US, and if it gets too bad, we Texans might consider taking matters into our own hands.

So what does Texas have to do to survive as a Republic?

1. NASA is just south of Houston, Texas. (we will control the space industry).

2. We refine over 85% of the gasoline in the United States.

3. Defense Industry. (we have over 65% of it) The term "Don't mess with Texas," will take on a whole new meaning.

4. Oil - we can supply all the oil that the Republic of Texas will need for the next 300 years. Yankee states? Sorry about that.

5. Natural Gas - Again we have all we need and it's too bad about those northern states. Someone will figure a way to keep them warm....

6. Computer Industry - we currently lead the nation in producing computer chips and communications: Small places like Texas Instruments, Dell Computer, EDS, Raytheon, National Semiconductor, Motorola, Intel, AMD, Atmel, Applied Materials, Ball Semiconductor, Dallas Semiconductor, Delphi, Nortel, Alcatel, Etc, Etc. The list goes on and on.

7. Health Centers - We have the largest research centers for Cancer research, the best burn centers and the top trauma units in the world and other large health planning centers.

8. We have enough colleges to keep us going: UT Texas, A&M, Texas State, Texas Tech, Rice, SMU, University of Houston, Baylor, UNT, Texas Women's University. Ivy grows better in the south anyway.

9. We have a ready supply of workers. (just open the border when we need some more)

10. We have control of the paper industry, plastics, insurance, etc.

11. In case of a foreign invasion, we have the Texas National Guard and Texas Air National Guard. We don't have an army but since everybody down here has at least six rifles and a pile of ammo, we can raise an army in 24 hours if we need it. If the situation really gets bad, we can always call Department of Public Safety and ask them to send over a couple Texas Rangers.

12. We are totally self sufficient in beef, poultry, hogs, several types of grain, fruit and vegetables, and let's not forget seafood from the gulf. And everybody down here knows how to cook them so that they taste good. Don't need any food.

This just names a few of the items that will keep the Republic Of Texas in good shape. There isn't a thing out there that we need and don't have.

Incidentally, if Texas were to become it's own country, I would seriously consider moving there.

Hop-along Nussbaum:
This is no different than the liberal jack-wads on Twitter calling for "civil war" if Romney won. Six of one, half a dozen of the other.

I'd say there's quite a big difference between tens of thousands of people who want to secede just because a Democrat is in the White House, and a few morons on Twitter being idiots.

Hop-along Nussbaum:

So what does Texas have to do to survive as a Republic?

1. NASA is just south of Houston, Texas. (we will control the space industry).

I would think that if Texas secedes, the US would take all the NASA tech with it and leave the new nation with empty buildings.

In any secession, a major issue will be what happens to federal property in the state. The Civil War was triggered because the Confederacy got pissy about the Union not wanting to relinquish Port Sumter.

bleys2487:
Texas has over 70,000 signatures on their petition.

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/peacefully-grant-state-texas-withdraw-united-states-america-and-create-its-own-new-government/BmdWCP8B

I'm from South Carolina. I'm a daughter of the Confederacy. I had family serve the C.S.A.

I am in no way saying I want a war or anything like that. I don't think people realize how awful they are and can be.

I just think it's very interesting that this is happening and really should be addressed. And no, not just a sit down and shut up comment. This country is divided. People should take something as serious as succession, well, seriously.

edit: More than 15 have petitioned too. Just taking the list off of the site where the original first petition done by Louisiana was done.

I'll try and keep the list updated as States are added in and 25k marks are reached.

1. Wisconsin
2. Utah
3. Ohio
4. South Dakota
5. Virginia
6. Nebraska
7. Pennsylvania
8. Kansas
9. Oklahoma
10. Wyoming
11. California
12. New York
13. Delaware
14. Arizona
15. Arkansas
16. South Carolina
17. Georgia
18. Missouri
19. Tennessee
20. Michigan
21. Oregon
22. New Jersey
23. North Dakota
24. Montana
25. Indiana
26. Mississippi
27. Kentucky
28. Florida
29. North Carolina
30. Alabama
31. Texas ***
32. Louisiana ***
33. New Hampshire
34. Illinois
35. Rhode Island
36. Idaho

*** = 25,000 mark reached

Virginia....

Should have known. I better start packing and get north, FAST. This place will go Christian taliban faster than Texas will left unchecked....

Hop-along Nussbaum:
Incidentally, if Texas were to become it's own country, I would seriously consider moving there.

You don't come off as a Christian fundamentalist variety of conservative. You likely would not be welcome.

The former politics student in me wants to see a petition gain enough widespread support to make it newsworthy, just to see what would happen.

GunsmithKitten:

Hop-along Nussbaum:
Incidentally, if Texas were to become it's own country, I would seriously consider moving there.

You don't come off as a Christian fundamentalist variety of conservative. You likely would not be welcome.

you should stop being so prejudice

The thing that confuses me about liberals is that they think impossible things can happen, like spending yourself out of debt, but the possible things that would simply require a good amount of hard work and sacrifice, like making an independent Texas successful, are impossible.

I'll tell you what Texas, if you can succeed peacefully, I'll strongly consider moving there. What a grand experiment it would be, I'd love to see if it would work.

GunsmithKitten:
You don't come off as a Christian fundamentalist variety of conservative. You likely would not be welcome.

That is a total lie.

I know countless liberals, and just as many Atheists, that no one gives a crap about. Myself included.

Having lived in Texas my entire life, I can safely say that the vast majority, and I do mean VAST majority, of people I know, don't give a flying fuck about how you are aligned politically, or religiously.

SajuukKhar:

GunsmithKitten:
You don't come off as a Christian fundamentalist variety of conservative. You likely would not be welcome.

That is a total lie.

I know countless liberals, and just as many Atheists, that no one gives a crap about. Myself included.

Having lived in Texas my entire life, I can safely say that the vast majority, and I do mean VAST majority, of people I know, don't give a flying fuck about how you are aligned politically, or religiously.

So who's electing all these fundies, pray tell? SOMEONE'S gotta be doing it, they didn't fall from the sky.

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