Pope Benedict XVI to resign

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http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013/02/11/pope-benedict-xvi-to-resi_n_2660624.html?icid=maing-grid7%7Cuk%7Cdl1%7Csec1_lnk3%26pLid%3D153508
Apparently he's the first pope to resign since 1415, and after 7 years as pope, he is too resign due to his failing strength leaving him unable to carry out his duties adequately.

Hm, this is interesting. I wonder if they'll be feeling brave enough to select someone a little more radical again. I know last time they didn't want to pick anyone who would try to "outdo" John Paul II, but perhaps it's been just long enough that they're ready for some new blood, so to speak (well as new as they can possibly offer). A lot has changed in 7 years and they need somebody who is willing to make tough decisions. Though the problem with that is the people who need something the most tend to be the last ones to see it.

Good, maybe they'll elect a less conservative one who actually cares about not killing millions of Africans next.

EDIT: Actually, no. I'm not going to step into R&P. Can a mod delete my post please?

Quaxar:
Good, maybe they'll elect a less conservative one who actually cares about not killing millions of Africans next.

The Catholic church can't say contraceptives work and aren't evil, it'd be like saying gay people aren't destroying the planet. Any Pope trying that would die in office within a week.

thaluikhain:

Quaxar:
Good, maybe they'll elect a less conservative one who actually cares about not killing millions of Africans next.

The Catholic church can't say contraceptives work and aren't evil, it'd be like saying gay people aren't destroying the planet. Any Pope trying that would die in office within a week.

The power of the Catholic church is unmatched. If they decree so, then it shall be truth, and homosexuals would no longer be what they are today in the eyes of Catholics. Hopefully. At least my friend would feel more comfortable around me then.

Glasgow:

thaluikhain:
The Catholic church can't say contraceptives work and aren't evil, it'd be like saying gay people aren't destroying the planet. Any Pope trying that would die in office within a week.

The power of the Catholic church is unmatched. If they decree so, then it shall be truth, and homosexuals would no longer be what they are today in the eyes of Catholics. Hopefully. At least my friend would feel more comfortable around me then.

The church as a whole, perhaps, and if the hierarchy all suddenly went down that road, maybe. I don't see any faction of any note getting in power with ideas like that though.

I'd say even if it did, it'd tend to split the church rather than change widespread attitudes, but it'd be a step in the right direction, certainly.

Something tells me there is a lot more to this then his health. No one just up and breaks a 600 year streak for that. But the Catholic Church is quite secretive at this level so I doubt we'll know for quite awhile.

thaluikhain:

Glasgow:

thaluikhain:
The Catholic church can't say contraceptives work and aren't evil, it'd be like saying gay people aren't destroying the planet. Any Pope trying that would die in office within a week.

The power of the Catholic church is unmatched. If they decree so, then it shall be truth, and homosexuals would no longer be what they are today in the eyes of Catholics. Hopefully. At least my friend would feel more comfortable around me then.

The church as a whole, perhaps, and if the hierarchy all suddenly went down that road, maybe. I don't see any faction of any note getting in power with ideas like that though.

I'd say even if it did, it'd tend to split the church rather than change widespread attitudes, but it'd be a step in the right direction, certainly.

Acknowledging the earth revolves around the sun (regretting that the church had condemned Galileo Galilee) in '92 didn't split the church. Now we have to hope that this change won't come in three centuries.

Glasgow:

thaluikhain:
The church as a whole, perhaps, and if the hierarchy all suddenly went down that road, maybe. I don't see any faction of any note getting in power with ideas like that though.

I'd say even if it did, it'd tend to split the church rather than change widespread attitudes, but it'd be a step in the right direction, certainly.

Acknowledging the earth revolves around the sun (regretting that the church had condemned Galileo Galilee) in '92 didn't split the church. Now we have to hope that this change won't come in three centuries.

It didn't split the church because it hadn't been remotely controversial within living memory. I seriously doubt many Catholics were shocked by that revelation, or had to rethink their worldview in light of it.

thaluikhain:
It didn't split the church because it hadn't been remotely controversial within living memory. I seriously doubt many Catholics were shocked by that revelation, or had to rethink their worldview in light of it.

Yeah, I agree with you there. I mean really, we were well into space travel by '92. I certainly hope it wasn't a great revelation for anyone.

The most I would hope for from the new pope is in some way acknowledging the sexual abuse to children. I think they can avoid a lot of criticism for their views on gays and contraception and maybe even women if only they would at least take care of the ones they don't believe have done anything wrong--the children.

I was also astonished that the Pope is about to resign...especially since it is a "God-given" office - so to speak. I hope that someone will be chosen who is able to unite the goundwork of the Catholic church with current debates. I think this is going to be an interesting topic to be discussed in the next weeks - internationally.

Cimble:
I was also astonished that the Pope is about to resign...especially since it is a "God-given" office - so to speak. I hope that someone will be chosen who is able to unite the goundwork of the Catholic church with current debates. I think this is going to be an interesting topic to be discussed in the next weeks - internationally.

Is it our place to advice the cardinals of the world on who to choose or what will the consequences of their choice be?

All that we can do is wait for the announcement. I suppose the talk of potential candidates will soon come to the news.

Quaxar:
Good, maybe they'll elect a less conservative one who actually cares about not killing millions of Africans next.

The two successors that are named as the most likely candidates are both from African countries. Turkson from Ghana, or Arinze from Nigeria, both countries and catholics from African countries as a whole are known to be vastly more conservative than western cardinals.

It's likely either of those will make even more steps backwards than emperor Pal... uhm, Ratzinger did.

On the other hand, electing an arch-conservative could well be pretty much the final blow to the catholic church in European countries, so maybe that's also a good thing somewhere, even if he'd make plenty of victims.

For one thing, with a record that mostly involved protecting child rapists, inviting back a crazy holocaust denier, renewed homophobia and little in terms of eucomenic cooperation, there's little doubt Ratzinger was a black page in clerical history.

I said it in the other post: I was totally expecting the Catholic Church to try and pull a "Golden Throne".

Quitting because of his advanced age? Makes sense. Protecting child molesters is a young man's game.

I really did not see this coming at all. The full text of his resignation speech is here. It's clear that this isn't a choice he made lightly but out of a sense of duty because he felt that he couldn't fulfil the role of pope properly anymore and it would be better for someone else to do it.

Really stunned and honestly quite sad but I respect his decision and wish him the best.

Good to hear. His history regarding the already mentioned child abuse cases was very, very problematic and awful. I don't really care whether it's that sort of pressure or his advanced age that really makes him leave; it's a good thing in either case.

Protects paedophiles.
Tells Africa that contraceptives are bad.
Welcomes back holocaust deniers.

I have more than a few hateful things to say about the man. Good riddance.

I'll admit, I haven't always supported some of his actions; yet Pope Benedict XVI was still decent pope, albeit one that had to live up to the legacy of one of the most beloved modern popes.

I wish his holiness luck and happiness in whatever path he takes. Though I'll admit, I hope the cardinals choose a more liberal successor; too much conservatism is driving people away from the church, not too it.

The prick. I lose $100 betting on the Papal elections and the bastard isn't even going to stay on the job?

Not a day too soon.

Though I wonder which homophobic old goat the Catholics will be herded by now. Quite possibly this one, Ratzinger's trusted theological ally.

Glasgow:

The power of the Catholic church is unmatched. If they decree so, then it shall be truth, and homosexuals would no longer be what they are today in the eyes of Catholics. Hopefully. At least my friend would feel more comfortable around me then.

Given Catholic teachings on infallibility, any change in teaching that radical would provoke schism. You'd split the Church right down the middle, there'd probably be antipopes, and we'd be back in the 1400's.

Aerodyamic:
I said it in the other post: I was totally expecting the Catholic Church to try and pull a "Golden Throne".

I would totally support this.

StashAugustine:

Glasgow:

The power of the Catholic church is unmatched. If they decree so, then it shall be truth, and homosexuals would no longer be what they are today in the eyes of Catholics. Hopefully. At least my friend would feel more comfortable around me then.

Given Catholic teachings on infallibility, any change in teaching that radical would provoke schism. You'd split the Church right down the middle, there'd probably be antipopes, and we'd be back in the 1400's.

Aerodyamic:
I said it in the other post: I was totally expecting the Catholic Church to try and pull a "Golden Throne".

I would totally support this.

I didn't say they should embrace homosexuality as a catholic way of life, I said that they could change their attitude towards it for the better. Baby steps, after all.

The last pope to resign was Pope Gregory XII, to stop the insanity of the Western Schism (three different people were all claiming to be pope).

I couldn't find an example of a pope who resigned do to poor health.

Blablahb:

Quaxar:
Good, maybe they'll elect a less conservative one who actually cares about not killing millions of Africans next.

The two successors that are named as the most likely candidates are both from African countries. Turkson from Ghana, or Arinze from Nigeria, both countries and catholics from African countries as a whole are known to be vastly more conservative than western cardinals.

Wait, wait, we are going to have a BLACK pope?
Oh, this is going to get interesting..(Unless said cardinals aren't from actual countries but just placed there as administrators).

Glasgow:
I didn't say they should embrace homosexuality as a catholic way of life, I said that they could change their attitude towards it for the better. Baby steps, after all.

Yeah, there is a lot of improvement that can be made in this department without them "accepting" it. Jesus spent most of his time hanging out with sinners and was able to not disparage them at every turn. He didn't "approve" of them, and whenever he could he told them to change their ways (such as when he saved the adulterous woman from being stoned and told her to go and sin no more). There is a fine line between not approving of someone's lifestyle and not respecting someone as a human being. Just because I don't like heavy drinking doesn't mean I'm going to avoid every person who even remotely seems like a drinker.

Also, I have heard of closeted priests who are either eaten up with the fear of coming out, or eaten up with self-loathing. But in both cases they are too terrified to do anything because they're afraid of what the church will do. That should never happen, no matter what the church wants to say about gay people. The church should be a place where people find healing and help when they have inner struggles. It shouldn't be a place where people are afraid to share their insecurities, it should be the opposite. But there's still something in that part of the Catholic church that keeps them from admitting their mistakes. This refusal to talk about problems openly is also why pedophilia has been allowed to fester within the church[1].

[1] Note: I am NOT in any way trying to compare homosexuality to pedophilia. I'm simply saying both are issues the church needs to approach with more clarity and honesty.

Realitycrash:

Blablahb:

Quaxar:
Good, maybe they'll elect a less conservative one who actually cares about not killing millions of Africans next.

The two successors that are named as the most likely candidates are both from African countries. Turkson from Ghana, or Arinze from Nigeria, both countries and catholics from African countries as a whole are known to be vastly more conservative than western cardinals.

Wait, wait, we are going to have a BLACK pope?
Oh, this is going to get interesting..(Unless said cardinals aren't from actual countries but just placed there as administrators).

Yeah, one candidate is from Ghana. Catholicism is pretty strong in Africa together with Islam, Anglicanism and indigenous faiths (which are varies, etc. etc.)

Realitycrash:

Blablahb:

Quaxar:
Good, maybe they'll elect a less conservative one who actually cares about not killing millions of Africans next.

The two successors that are named as the most likely candidates are both from African countries. Turkson from Ghana, or Arinze from Nigeria, both countries and catholics from African countries as a whole are known to be vastly more conservative than western cardinals.

Wait, wait, we are going to have a BLACK pope?
Oh, this is going to get interesting..(Unless said cardinals aren't from actual countries but just placed there as administrators).

they're more conservative, but they'll be black, so the liberals will accept them

Hammartroll:

Realitycrash:

Blablahb:
The two successors that are named as the most likely candidates are both from African countries. Turkson from Ghana, or Arinze from Nigeria, both countries and catholics from African countries as a whole are known to be vastly more conservative than western cardinals.

Wait, wait, we are going to have a BLACK pope?
Oh, this is going to get interesting..(Unless said cardinals aren't from actual countries but just placed there as administrators).

they're more conservative, but they'll be black, so the liberals will accept them

Accepting them or not is irrelevant, since the papacy isn't a democracy.
I just thought it was fun because all of the 'POPE IS THE DEVIL AND HERE IS THE PROOF!' the far-right will be throwing.

I think we're grossly misrepresenting how the system works. It's not as though the Council of Cardinals gets together and picks out who they want as a group. Everyone votes individually (and anonymously) for who they want as the next Pope by writing their name on a little piece of paper.

There's a tradition of voting who you like best in the first round and then politicking around for whoever's looking good at that point. That's how Benedict got in; a lot of Cardinals privately wished that, politics aside, this guy could be Pope. And then he was, kind of by accident.

Remember, there's no vetting system or legal requirements. Anybody can be Pope if he's got a lot of Cardinal friends. And Cardinal isn't a title that you work up to. Anybody can be a Cardianal if he's friends with the Pope, even if he doesn't otherwise have a Church rank.

Veylon:
Remember, there's no vetting system or legal requirements. Anybody can be Pope if he's got a lot of Cardinal friends.

Since 1378, the person elected to become the next pope has always been a cardinal.

He was a bit of a disappointing pope who kept the status-quo with regards to contraception and preceded over pedophile scandals in the catholic church. The Catholic Church is in dire need of reform if it wants to stay relevant in the Western world, but i don't expect the next pope they'll elect will be any different.

Hammartroll:
they're more conservative, but they'll be black, so the liberals will accept them


Seriously, guy. What the fuck is wrong with you that you can say shit like that in all seriousness?

OT: I'm keeping my hopes up for a new pope that's more like John Paul II. Loved that guy. Benedict XVI has been nothing but trouble ever since the child abuse scandal broke (and, unfortunately, became old news).

Realitycrash:

Blablahb:

Quaxar:
Good, maybe they'll elect a less conservative one who actually cares about not killing millions of Africans next.

The two successors that are named as the most likely candidates are both from African countries. Turkson from Ghana, or Arinze from Nigeria, both countries and catholics from African countries as a whole are known to be vastly more conservative than western cardinals.

Wait, wait, we are going to have a BLACK pope?
Oh, this is going to get interesting..(Unless said cardinals aren't from actual countries but just placed there as administrators).

They most definitely are. Poor racist Catholics. Although the Southern US as mostly evangelical Protestants aren't really that fond of popes as it is.

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