Are there any conservatives on this forum?

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Many would describe me as being a fairly solid conservative, though I try not to attach labels to myself. I am just aware if there are any other people such as myself on here who share some similar views, I am still fairly new here and so far it seems like I'm "the only one" so to speak, this does not bother me in and of it's self as most people around here have been very polite.

However I would like to get in touch with the more conservative base on here, if such a thing even exists. So far it seems that this is a pretty liberal hang out, which is how most gaming forums seem to be.

Anyway not hating on liberals or anything, I just feel a bit outnumbered so to speak in the debate sections on here. But hey somebody has to tout the opposite opinion right?

We have some, but they don't last too long. It honestly has more to do with how this is an international community rather than how liberal gaming sites are, as we have many members who would be called conservatives within their own nations, though even considering that we have a somewhat significant liberal slant. Personally I am a left leaning Libertarian, so while I may be closer to conservatives on a few issues, I am definitely not one of them.

I'm a left leaning authoritarian. Whatever that means.

Close enough, yeah?

Who counts as conservative anyway?

I believe that traditions, social "etiquette" and ethnic homogenity can often (but not always) be benificial to the social cohesion in a nation and that a large degree of social cohesion and "loyalty" to your people and country can in turn be benificial in many areas of running a country. I believe that because of this individual choice should by society (not by law) be considered to a lighter to be ranked lower than previously mentioned traditions and social etiquette. I believe it is worth the compromise.

Those are all pretty conservative values.

However, I also believe in a strong safety net. In the value of a relatively classless society and a system that allows social mobility to anyone and at any point in life, for example a universal tax funded educational system. I believe that a great degree of re-distribution of wealth from the top down is necesarry to make sure that our collective progresses benefits everyone and not just the lucky few.

Those are pretty left wing views.

Often it seems self-styled conservatives are in reality liberals. Believing in a small as possible state and little to no social rules.

This is why I miss Seekster. As for me I'm kinda split, I'm pro-choice, anti-gay marriage, anti-military, pro-guns, pro-most entitlement programs, anti-illegals, I'm a real mixed bag politically.

I would argue that there are no such things as "liberals" and "conservatives." There are people. And people aren't two-dimensional cardboard cutouts. They are complex.

I think that people are conservative or liberal, not in general, but on specific issues. And that people are liberal on some issues and conservative on others, each issue to a different degree. How strongly a person may lean on any specific issue depends on that person, their upbringing, the social structure they live in, the cultural norms they are generally exposed to, and so on.

Are there people who lean conservative on a significant number of issues who are on this forum? Of course, quite a few as far as I've seen. In general, I suppose the perception that more people on this forum tend to lean more liberal on more issues isn't totally inaccurate. But I still have to rail pointlessly at the idea of people as single-concept defined cartoon characters. We are not video game NPCs, after all. :)

I'm generally a conservative. Right wing classical liberal, as much as it would blow your mind away. Although I'm not too objectionable to hammering the fuck out of criminal oligarchs, throwing them in jail, taking their money and build some new railways and airports.

Revnak managed to hit the nail on the head, so to speak. However, I would like to expand on what he said to help explain my overall point (though I apologise to the gentleman for a certain amount of repetition).

Revnak:
We have some, but they don't last too long. It honestly has more to do with how this is an international community rather than how liberal gaming sites are, as we have many members who would be called conservatives within their own nations, though even considering that we have a somewhat significant liberal slant. Personally I am a left leaning Libertarian, so while I may be closer to conservatives on a few issues, I am definitely not one of them.

Yup, the international base can be a significant problem. What passes as "conservative" in one country is "liberal" in another. For example, a British moderate Conservative (note the capitalisation) would be nearer to an American Democrat or liberal/left-wing - but is quite right-wing when it comes to European political views.

There is another point that sort-of ties into the above but not quite. This is that often this site may appear very anti-Republican, rather than anti-conservative, as even some/many of the conservative-aligned posters have issues with some/many of the Republican stances (be it on a single important issue, like gay marriage; or class thereof, such as social conservatism as a whole; or because they have more of a Libertarian bent they feel the Republicans fail to represent). This is without counting the international shifts detailed above, given that I have seen many comments along those lines from US conservative posters.

Then there is a related, but again separate, factor: differences of views in particular topics that get discussed more than others. For example, on many issues I would have classified Blab as being quite "conservative", certainly by British standards, yet I get the feeling many American posters will remember him as being quite "liberal" - probably because of how outspoken he was when it came to the issue of gun control, a subject which not only will his remarks certainly linger, but also comes up very frequently on the forum. What I am trying to get at is that if over a particular time period certain topics come up more than others, then a greater amount of conservative/liberal (depending on the issue) weighting will appear in the forum. More often than not it is certainly "liberal" weighting, but that can be put down to the above international demographics issues. The two do link together.

Compounding this issue is a certain trend I have noticed, that the most...out-spoken...conservatives tend to get banned (at varying speeds). This is not to claim that there is some sort of bias/conspiracy from the users or staff. Rather, when it comes to some very contentious issues (such as gay marriage, climate change and gun-control to name relatively recent examples) or just the sheer difference in perspectives (particularly with regards to Socialist/Communist/Liberal as a catch-all derogatory insult), for whatever reason (deeply held personal convictions, feeling that they are being out-numbered and jumped on, that the other side just "do not get it and must be idiots") they tend to be...less than polite...and rack up sufficient infractions that see them banned. Mind you, I can think of far more left-wing posters that have been banned in the last year than right-wing ones, but without all the drama that was caused the forums seem like a more left-leaning place as a whole - because after all, we rarely remember the various pleasant debates that occur daily and remember the fireworks-and-popcorn antics of the really crazy threads.

I could of course be completely wrong, but when I think back to how some posters acted, such as the infamous XpowderX as the premier example, I think the above rambling has some merit (then again I would, given that I wrote it!).

As to whether this forum trends "liberal" or "conservative", well I think it is a mix. Many of the posters will certainly be left/centre of American political scales (which I believe are the largest single group of users, though I may be wrong) and will also create a wider range of topics (having international issues/perspectives on events) thus the forum will seem more "liberal", yet when I think as to how some topics relating to sexuality/gender/feminism go down (most notably in the Off Topic section) I certainly would not classify most of the responses as being particularly "liberal".

But then again, is that merely my own cultural filter at work, given what is discussed above?

Xan Krieger:
This is why I miss Seekster.

Yeah, me too. I remember several excellent debates with him (and several that felt like I was trying to push water uphill when it came to some issues). However, in the wake of some of the more...outspoken..."conservatives" (see above) I definitely miss him, and a few other posters like him, all the more.

Yo.

Less laws and taxes, please. We have enough of those.

Superbeast:
Compounding this issue is a certain trend I have noticed, that the most...out-spoken...conservatives tend to get banned (at varying speeds).

This is because the staff deem certain conservative views to be bannable offenses. For example, here's one I got suspended for a long time ago (my forum health was red when the forum health bar first started). There was a thread asking people the first law they'd pass if they ruled the world. I said I'd ban gay marriage and I said it that way, not in some offensive manner. That law would be like many US states so I didn't see the problem with it. Other people said they'd allow gay marriage. I got suspended for my conservative viewpoint while the liberals didn't even get a warning.

And I, like other here, find myself agreeing with Revnak. Relative to most gaming forums, this one is surprisingly international, with less than half our populaation from the US. Hell, if I remember, we just had an Iranian join us.

So yeah, it seems more a problem with how one would define a conservative/liberal in different area. A British Conservative would be considered to be a little more liberal than the Democrats in the US. Our Liberal Democrats would be thought of as almost radical.
If you really want an headache, the Liberal Party in Australia is actually the resident conservative party, thanks to historical things.

We also have different issues that decide elections. Gay marriage, abortion, anything religious and such are essentially non-issues over here, while EU membership and the like are the big hitters.

Da Orky Man:
Our Liberal Democrats would be thought of as almost radical.

Not so much. The Liberal Democrats are the combination of two older parties, the Social Democrats and the Liberals (although if I recall right it was the Liberals who had social democratic policies and the social democrats who has more traditionally liberal policies).

They are a very conflicted party but at the moment the Orange Bookers are dominant. This name comes from the Orange Book, a Liberal Democrat policy book released a few years back. It essentially sets out the goals for the more libertarian free-market side of the party; including things like the privatisation of healthcare. One of the contributors is Nick Clegg and it's this side of the party that is dominant in terms of MPs and policies, even though the majority of members are (although this headcount is merely anecdotal) more traditional pro-government Social Democrats.

Beyond their view of religion which would make pretty much any UK party extreme compared to the US, I think pro-market anti-government stance would fit in rather well with the USA's libertarian streak.

we dont get many conservatives here these days (im saying this an old english farmer accent) they come and go but you'll see never 'em stickin around too long

I miss Pro Family Lover, any one remember him? I hated him but man when i was having a crap day i could come on here point at him and say "At least im not as stupid as him"

I wouldn't call myself conservative by American standards but I hold a lot of Conservative positions. Though by European standards I'm a raving right wing nut. So theres always that.

spartandude:
I miss Pro Family Lover, any one remember him? I hated him but man when i was having a crap day i could come on here point at him and say "At least im not as stupid as him"

I do kind of wish our conservatives would stick around longer. Not to make fun of them, but because I honestly believe that if they were forced to face how indefensible their positions were day after day after day, they might actually change their point of view. It is easy to show up, echo a bunch of inflammatory talking points, and end up getting banned. Much harder to push past those points and face an actual conversation with your own words.

Actually, yeah, I'd like to see some actual conservatives on here, in the sense that they want to stick to tried and true methods, not reactionaries. There's a big difference between "it's not too broken, let's not tinker with it" and "we must protect society from the evils of X, and go back to some imaginary version of the 50s when everything was perfect".

Da Orky Man:
If you really want an headache, the Liberal Party in Australia is actually the resident conservative party, thanks to historical things.

They are actual conservative, though, not particularly reactionary (mostly). They can be liberal (to some degree) and conservative at the same time, depending on how society is set up.

Like other posters have mentioned, international community yadda yadda yadda. Also conservatives usually get banned when the fur starts to fly. Just how it goes on the internet. On a liberal site the conservatives are bullied out, and vice versa on a conservative site. Go on a site with X community ideology, expect a bias.

Im thankful im not a conservative, they get treated worse here than nerds back in high school, ironically usually by the people who were actually bullied in high school.

Course, being in the middle between far left and right wing people isnt fun either.

Da Orky Man:
And I, like other here, find myself agreeing with Revnak. Relative to most gaming forums, this one is surprisingly international, with less than half our populaation from the US.

Yeah, I need to find another forum.

What is about Europeans to obsess about America anyway? I have US/Italian dual citizenship and I have been to Europe enough to no longer look forward to going there.

My first visit was in 1987 when I was 5, and jesus christ were the other children all so jealous and so rude. Americans aren't indoctrinated to bad mouth Europeans from a young age. Americans don't care about Europe. The average American only even considers what is happening in Europe when they are thinking of going somewhere for a vacation.

Why is the reverse not true? Why are they so quick to tell you what is wrong with your country- but if you even mention anything about theirs they will instantly dismiss your stupid American opinion because what could what could you possibly know about it? -and it never seems to dawn on them how hypocritical this is.

I just have better things I should be doing.

xDarc:
Why is the reverse not true? Why are they so quick to tell you what is wrong with your country- but if you even mention anything about theirs they will instantly dismiss your stupid American opinion because what could what could you possibly know about it? -and it never seems to dawn on them how hypocritical this is.

The US is more important on a global scale than any individual European nation. If there's an economic problem in the US, it can affect the rest of the world. Nobody is too worried when, say, Italy's government is incompetent, but anything that happens to the world's leading military and financial power (and the West's cultural power) affects everyone else.

EDIT: Having said that, there's lots of issues outside the US that don't get any attention. For example, he Queen of England is going to sign a human rights charter for the Commonwealth, which is great news for gay people, as it says they can't be discriminated against.

This is rather odd, since it very deliberately makes no mention of gay people, to avoid upsetting the hordes of bigots in the Commonwealth (homosexuality being illegal in 40 odd out of 50 something nations).

People would probably think of me as a "liberal", but I hate that label myself and I don't consider myself a liberal (or a conservative for that matter). There probably are more left-of-centre people here than right-of-centre, but if I had a dollar for every time I've seen someone here accuse everyone who disagrees with them of being liberal or say something along the lines of "I'm the only conservative here!" I'd have at least enough money to buy me a few new videogames.

I guess you could chalk me up......in a way. I usually end up with the same results on every political test I take (internet or otherwise), and 9:10 I am Center-Right, Socially Moderate. For instance, I am all for a flat tax, think corporations should have less regulation then they do now, the military is the most important item in the (federal) budget, the welfare/entitlement state should be left up to the individual states to pay for and not the Feds, and I am all for loose gun laws. And for social issues, I am pro-life (with a very specific critria that would allow it under this but make it completely illegal after another), kind-of-sort-of in favor of the death penalty, think drugs should remain illegal, believe that humanities effect on climate change is negliable and not worth worrying about (this being said, I have no problem with keeping the environment clean for the sake of keeping the environment clean, so long as we can afford it), etc.

However, that gets swung backward where I think education should be inexpensive and subsidized by the state (although states should choose thier own funding, the Fed sets education critera, so no anti-evolution), ok with a safetly net for the poor (but ONLY for the poor. That is my problem with the current safetly net), I am open to semi-socialized healthcare (like, have the government pay for those who cant afford it, but others have to pay), am all for funding science projects like NASA and other research instiutes, and on social issues I am pro-gay marriage, I believe in evolution (dispite being religious), and afew others that escape me right now.

Thus: Center Right, Socially Moderate

Aris Khandr:

I do kind of wish our conservatives would stick around longer. Not to make fun of them, but because I honestly believe that if they were forced to face how indefensible their positions were day after day after day, they might actually change their point of view. It is easy to show up, echo a bunch of inflammatory talking points, and end up getting banned. Much harder to push past those points and face an actual conversation with your own words.

I am quite conservative, everytime this thread shows up I am assured that there are plenty of us, it just so happens that a quality political debate in a conservative vs liberal format doesn't usually get very far when half the community holds ^^^that^^^ position.

Off-topic- To those reminiscing of fun conservatives who got banned, I do the same thing in reverse. I do miss my shouting matches with Stagnant.

I am a conservative, but an Australian one, so I am a bit further right than most Euros and a bit further left than most yanks .

In case if anyone is bored here is a simple chart to determine how liberal, conservative, libertarian or statist you are.

http://www.nolanchart.com/survey.php

According to the thing aelreth posted, I'm a libertarian. Whatever that means. Um...sorry?

Also normally, I don't put my political beliefs under one label because they tend to contradict each other if you go by American parties.

aelreth:
In case if anyone is bored here is a simple chart to determine how liberal, conservative, libertarian or statist you are.

http://www.nolanchart.com/survey.php

It says that I'm a Statist. I've never even heard of the term before.

statist: the marriage of liberal and conservative aspects of big government. Supports both the conservative "family" agenda and the liberal "social" agenda. Supports both major diplomatic and military involvement abroad.

Whelp, I agree with that.

According to the Nolan Chart, I'm a pure Centrist, almost dead center of the graph. Interesting. I find myself more liberal than most.

If I was strictly for gay marriage, yet wound up in the middle, I wonder what pushed me the other way?

According to that Nolan chart I fall under 'Libertarian'. However I don't particularly think that I am, I think the questions boxed me in a little bit.
People have called me conservative though.

Of course I am a conservative, I already made it obvious that I am and why on my other thread that the liberals had to drag into the gutter.

Kopikatsu:

aelreth:
In case if anyone is bored here is a simple chart to determine how liberal, conservative, libertarian or statist you are.

http://www.nolanchart.com/survey.php

It says that I'm a Statist. I've never even heard of the term before.

statist: the marriage of liberal and conservative aspects of big government. Supports both the conservative "family" agenda and the liberal "social" agenda. Supports both major diplomatic and military involvement abroad.

Whelp, I agree with that.

A bit creepy but this is a more expansive essay about it.

http://www.nolanchart.com/article1418-what-is-a-statist.html

As a radical libertarian (recently drifted from the conservative side) this scared the heck out of me.

aelreth:
In case if anyone is bored here is a simple chart to determine how liberal, conservative, libertarian or statist you are.

http://www.nolanchart.com/survey.php

The questions asked in that survey are few (only 10, whereas most I've seen are at least 25), highly US oriented, and are more rhetorical views than substantive policy preferences.

This doesn't cover the somewhat... sketchy... nature of the site, which appears to be a web magazine where anyone can author an article...

On topic: There are a few American conservatives in the forums, but it can be hard to separate the conservatives from the reactionaries. And Superbeast's explanation for the relative dearth of conservatives on this forum I would say is pretty much spot on for what tends to happen to many on this forum. If you say "gays are the same a pedophiles and necrophiliacs" or "poor people shouldn't have the right to vote" (both of which have been said by conservative-aligned posters who were subsequently banned), then you can expect moderation action against you.

This, in turn, tends to do the second thing that accelerates the process to the banhammer regardless of your political affiliation: The persecution complex (or, rather, the acting out of it). While writing offensive posts will get you a warning, claiming there is a deliberate assault against you, your political party, or your particular brand of ideology instead of, say, outright offensive and ToC violating posting patterns is generally viewed as attacking the moderation team. If you think there's an issue of bias in the implementation of a moderation action, use the appeals system and do not make a scene in the forums or the moderation user groups.

aelreth:

Kopikatsu:

aelreth:
In case if anyone is bored here is a simple chart to determine how liberal, conservative, libertarian or statist you are.

http://www.nolanchart.com/survey.php

It says that I'm a Statist. I've never even heard of the term before.

statist: the marriage of liberal and conservative aspects of big government. Supports both the conservative "family" agenda and the liberal "social" agenda. Supports both major diplomatic and military involvement abroad.

Whelp, I agree with that.

A bit creepy but this is a more expansive essay about it.

http://www.nolanchart.com/article1418-what-is-a-statist.html

As a radical libertarian (recently drifted from the conservative side) this scared the heck out of me.

Ha! I agree with him on all points, and had a few good laughs along the way.

And so, I have to ask you now. You disagree with the ideology, but can you deny the truth behind his assertions? Your rights are only guaranteed by power alone. Say you have a sandwich, that you've bought with your own money. You claim you have a right to that sandwich, and it is yours. I can walk up, punch you in the face, and take that sandwich. You can still say that I have no right to the sandwich and it's yours...but unless you can physically take it back from me, then it has become mine. Words with no strength to enforce them are empty. But, this is why walled city-states and government itself came to be. People banded together to protect themselves from the roaming gangs of bandits.

The idea that the whole is greater than the sum of it's parts, that society is more important than the individual, is a very Eastern belief. Unfortunately. The things they accomplish are really quite amazing. When the Fukushima Nuclear Plant suffered a critical meltdown and had distributed a large amount of radioactive material around the land and sea, a large number of people volunteered to help with the cleanup, despite knowing that they would be heavily irradiated in doing so. Shortly afterward, over two hundred 60+ year old retirees, mostly Engineers, asked to be replaced with the younger volunteers, because the younger people still have their entire lives ahead of them, but having a few years shaved off what little they have left wasn't a concern for the seniors.

That, to me, was beautiful. Simply stunning. The sheer selflessness of the Japanese people was truly moving. I only wish I could say the same about the US. The closest I ever came to being proud of the US was shortly after 9/11, but that's pretty much it.

TheLycanKing144:
Many would describe me as being a fairly solid conservative, though I try not to attach labels to myself. I am just aware if there are any other people such as myself on here who share some similar views, I am still fairly new here and so far it seems like I'm "the only one" so to speak, this does not bother me in and of it's self as most people around here have been very polite.

However I would like to get in touch with the more conservative base on here, if such a thing even exists. So far it seems that this is a pretty liberal hang out, which is how most gaming forums seem to be.

Anyway not hating on liberals or anything, I just feel a bit outnumbered so to speak in the debate sections on here. But hey somebody has to tout the opposite opinion right?

I guess I've been leaning more conservative since spending some time away from this site, but I generally think following the "Left-Right" political spectrum to a large degree is ignorant as all hell.

Hardcore_gamer:
Of course I am a conservative, I already made it obvious that I am and why on my other thread that the liberals had to drag into the gutter.

To be fair that topic was already in the gutter the moment you posted it. I mean "Slightly less disgusting than..." when describing left leaning ideologies isn't really gonna spark a lot of interesting discussion.

Da Orky Man:
And I, like other here, find myself agreeing with Revnak. Relative to most gaming forums, this one is surprisingly international, with less than half our populaation from the US. Hell, if I remember, we just had an Iranian join us.

This. In Belgium for instance i'm as right wing as they get but that still makes me a liberal to US standards.

Conservatives do tend to get dog-piled here. But lets be honest, its no fun just agreeing with each other over everything, so when someone comes along with opposing thoughts you think "ah, there's an argument I can really sink my teeth into!" and unfortunately so does every other leftwinger, resulting in the conservative getting overwhelmed.

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