How can I tell if this girl likes me or not?

Sorry for this wall of text, but you have to read all of it to understand any of it. I'm very tired but I will try not to make any mistakes.

I'm 15 living in England and I just finished year 11 4 days ago. My 16th birthday is in 12 days. After school finished, most of us went to the park and got drunk. I went too, but me and my 2 friends who I was with most of the time didn't drink any alcohol. After about 2 hours, 2 girls walked up to us and one of them started talking to me, saying we should be friends and the other girl said that she fancies me and I should be friends with her. This girl who was saying we should be friends is the topic of my question. She's called Ellie and there are 5 girls called that in our year group of ~250 people (important detail later on). Quite a few girls have told me I'm handsome, but I suppose that is just personal opinion which rests only on the eye of the beholder. Me and Ellie are both white and I'm taller than her.

In year 8, we got put into sets in maths based on ability. Me and her were both put in the top set. I don't think I ever spoke to her in year 8 because we didn't sit near each other and I've never been a very sociable person. I had no reason to talk to her. We weren't in any other classes together.

In year 9, we got put into sets in science as well as maths, and we were both put in the top set for that subject too. I didn't speak to her at all until we got a new seating plan and we had to sit at the same table opposite each other after a few months. She likes to talk to people much more than I do and at the beginning she tried being friendly with me when it was convenient. She would start conversations with me about things not related to science work. Gradually, we started talking more and more, but only in science lessons, and she was very helpful even though I never returned any favours for her and she was normally the one who started our conversations. We still didn't talk outside of science lessons.

One science lesson, half of the groups go outside to do some experiment and we wait for them to return before we go and do it. They all leave their tables with all their books and pens out. Our crazy teacher tells me, Ellie and the other guy at our table to go and sit at the vacant table at the front of the room for some stupid reason I still don't understand. Ellie and the other guy go and sit there without bringing their things with them. I pick up all my things in a pile, book open and pens out of their case, like it's a dying child and I walk carefully to my new temporary seat. The other guy sees me carrying everything like this and points and laughs because he's a fucking dickhead and always has been. Some people find my situation hilarious and join in with him. Ellie sees me and pushes all the stuff at the position next to her out of the way for me to sit down. She does that really quickly so I can sit next to her and someone's book falls on the floor. She doesn't laugh at me like other people are even though that is something she would definitely do to anyone else. I thought this was nice of her so I started being friendlier to her for the next few weeks...

... And then we got a new seating plan after having that one for about 3 months and I had to sit next to a bitch for the rest of year 9 science. I mainly stop talking to Ellie because it is not convenient and we've never talked outside of lessons before. We were always in completely different social groups and only had a few mutual friends. She still says hello if she sees me in a maths or science lesson sometimes.

Our head teacher decided we should start doing our GCSEs a half term early to improve GCSE results. I get put into lots of new classes with lots of people I've never met before. I choose to study French at GCSE (and eventually do very well in it). In this last half term before the summer holiday of 2010, I get into an argument with a boy at the other side of the French classroom over something silly and it lasts for a few seconds. Immediately afterwards, a girl who I've never met before lifts up her head and says to me "I know someone who fancies you" and gets back to work. I don't think about it or say anything because I knew instantly that you can't pursue things like that. This girl is very good friends with Ellie but I didn't know that at the time.

Over the next 2 years, me and Ellie are both in the top maths and science sets but in opposite halves of the year group, and we have no other lessons together, so we never get to see each other in lessons. It doesn't matter to me, me and her both had our own groups of friends. She very rarely says hello to me in the playground but I never greet her unless I feel obliged too (ie because she has said hello). Over these 2 years, she goes from being 14 to being 16 and becomes one of the more slutty girls. There are a lot of photos of her on facebook making out with boys at parties while drunk, nothing too serious though, I'm almost certain she's still a virgin now. She hasn't actually had any boyfriends yet.

Near the end of 2010, Ellie sent me a friend request on Facebook but I deleted it because I don't like having lots of unnecessary friends on Facebook (I only have 32 now). I mainly just look at the funny pictures some pages post instead of using Facebook to interact with people.

In February 2011, in a maths lesson (without her because we are in opposite halves of the year at this point) one of our few mutual friends taps the shoulder of the girl sitting in front of him to get her attention and she turns around. He says "guess who Ellie fancies...", she says "who?" (she is also friends with Ellie) and he says my name which I will not reveal to you. I have exceptionally good hearing and I'm certain this is how the conversation went. I asked him about that in October 2011 and he giggled a lot and said he couldn't remember it.

A few months ago or about a year after the event I just mentioned, every year 11 in my school who applied at a certain sixth form had to go there at the same time and queue up for interviews before getting places there. I sat at the back of the waiting room by myself and all the popular kids were gathering at the front. Ellie is one of the popular kids. She walks in and sees us sitting there and walks towards me a little bit away from the popular kids at the front and very quietly says "hi" to me. I was daydreaming, it was a noisy place and I wasn't looking at her but I heard the whisper and looked around. It took me a few seconds and I saw her standing there looking at me smiling a little bit and I said "hi" back, very quietly too. She keeps standing there watching me for about 20 seconds but then goes and sits at the front with the popular kids and keeps looking back at me every now and then.

I hadn't thought there was anything unusual about her until Friday last week when we finished school and went to the park. I was chilling out with 2 of my friends and Ellie and one of her friends who I vaguely know from a long time ago approached us and started talking to us. They were only a little bit drunk. Ellie was talking to me really calmly and looking deep at my eyes. She said she missed when we sat together in science and we should become friends again. She asked me why I didn't become her Facebook friend (which was a year and a half prior) and I said that there was no reason for me to accept it because we would undoubtedly never talk on Facebook. I asked her why she didn't speak to me for 2 years in the playground and she said "I was scared you would reject me" which is unusual for someone to use in that context. The fact that I had deleted her friend request over a year ago hadn't reached her and she told me again to accept it so we could be friends and I said there was just no point. Then her friend said "[Oolong] She fancies you!" but I took no notice of it because she had been drinking and you can't trust someone in those circumstances. Ellie clearly heard it but didn't stop making eye contact with me and didn't say anything. She asked me what sixth form I was going to and it turned out we were going to different sixth forms. I said to her that I have nothing against being friends with her but we can't realistically be friends because we will probably never see each other again. A boy in our year group who is friends with her and all the girls walked up to us, listened for a few seconds and said "you two should make out now" and walked away but we both ignored him. Ellie said she understood my reasoning and her and her friend walked away.

I went over to one of my friends who had stood a few feet away watching the whole conversation develop. He shouted at me "you fucking idiot!" and I asked what I did wrong. He said that I should not mind what I did wrong because it could achieve nothing at this point. I thought about it and realised I was going to delete my Facebook account in 3 weeks anyway so I should have agreed to be her Facebook friend. I told my friends I was going to go and speak to Ellie and say that we can be friends on Facebook if she sends me a request. He said I should wait a little while because Ellie was in front of all her popular friends and they will tease me, even though I get along well with most of them. I ran up to her later and sat in front of her (she was laying down) and I said very quickly that if she sends me a friend request I will accept it and I ran back. She was screaming, shouting about how I was going to accept her friend request for a few seconds for everyone to hear. Later I went home without talking to her again.

The next day, I sent her a friend request instead and she accepted it a few hours later. The day after that I tried to have a conversation with her about what happened at the park but I didn't know how well she remembered it because she was intoxicated to a degree at the time. I opened Facebook chat and asked her if she still wanted to be my friend. She said yes and sent a smiley face. I asked her again why she hadn't spoken to me for 2 years. She said she never got to see me because we moved to different halves of the year group and had no lessons together, whereas before she said she was scared I would reject her. Both answers are plausible though when taken together. I pointed out that we weren't going to the same sixth form so her situation is even less ideal than it had been over the last 2 years and she had forgotten what sixth form I was going to. I told her where I was going and she said we should stay friends on Facebook just to stay in touch (or to check if I get a girlfriend at sixth form?). I asked her if she thinks we would be friends if we had lessons together and she said yes. The conversation lasted about 1 hour and 30 minutes, just because I was taking a long time to respond to her. She was responding to my messages very quickly.

A little while after she went offline, I sent her a message saying that I was going into school on Wednesday (tomorrow) to finish my IT coursework and she could meet me there after I finish it and have a conversation with me if she was going to school for any of the revision sessions (we have a few tests next week). She went online the morning of the next day (yesterday) and added a friend but didn't answer my message. I haven't seen her online at all and I spent most of yesterday at my computer with Facebook in the background, occasionally checking to see if she's online. Now it's 9:01, 2 days after I sent it and still no response.

The reason I care if this girl likes me is because I would love to have a girlfriend as beautiful, nice and clever as her, but only as long as she agrees not to do anything sexual with other boys. I also don't want her to be upset that she has possibly liked me for nearly 3 years and not even got a hug from me.

Honestly, it sounds like she likes you.

There's little more to it.

Spartan1362:
Honestly, it sounds like she likes you.

There's little more to it.

I don't have very much experience with girls so what do you think I should do to get Ellie to be my girlfriend?

OolongThePig:

Spartan1362:
Honestly, it sounds like she likes you.

There's little more to it.

I don't have very much experience with girls so what do you think I should do to get Ellie to be my girlfriend?

This is a little (a lot) like the blind leading the blind, but just talk with her and hang out as much as possible (assuming she recipricates).

Then, after a while if it seems like it'll go anywhere ask her to a movie or something.

hmm it sounds like she's interested but it seems your pretty interested in her too.
If that's the case you need to do something about it.

if I was you I would ditch the Facebook, messages n texts can come across in a way they aren't supposed too and an accidentally missed reply to something adds to the mind games and paranoia of the 'do they like me? Don't they?' part of a relationship

take the bull by the horns and be direct get her phone number and just ask do you like me?
or at least call her n set up a time to hangout.

also tell your friends to stop drinking they are too young :p

carlsberg export:

if I was you I would ditch the Facebook, messages n texts can come across in a way they aren't supposed too and an accidentally missed reply to something adds to the mind games and paranoia of the 'do they like me? Don't they?' part of a relationship

I know, that is why I offered to meet her in person.

Spartan1362:

OolongThePig:

I don't have very much experience with girls so what do you think I should do to get Ellie to be my girlfriend?

This is a little (a lot) like the blind leading the blind, but just talk with her and hang out as much as possible (assuming she recipricates).

Then, after a while if it seems like it'll go anywhere ask her to a movie or something.

I don't see how I can go and hang out with her when she doesn't answer my message, I have no other way of contacting her, and we don't go to the same school any longer, except for revision classes this week and some exams next week. Unless she turns up at school tomorrow and we can establish more contact.

OolongThePig:

carlsberg export:

if I was you I would ditch the Facebook, messages n texts can come across in a way they aren't supposed too and an accidentally missed reply to something adds to the mind games and paranoia of the 'do they like me? Don't they?' part of a relationship

I know, that is why I offered to meet her in person.

Spartan1362:

OolongThePig:

I don't have very much experience with girls so what do you think I should do to get Ellie to be my girlfriend?

This is a little (a lot) like the blind leading the blind, but just talk with her and hang out as much as possible (assuming she recipricates).

Then, after a while if it seems like it'll go anywhere ask her to a movie or something.

I don't see how I can go and hang out with her when she doesn't answer my message, I have no other way of contacting her, and we don't go to the same school any longer, except for revision classes this week and some exams next week.

keep trying mate, maybe ask one of her friends to pass a message along?

OolongThePig:
Sorry for this wall of text, but you have to read all of it to understand any of it. I'm very tired but I will try not to make any mistakes.

This was a lie. I did NOT have to read all of that to understand it. Your ability to filter necessary information from pointless noise is seriously lacking, my friend.

So...does Ellie like you? It seems painfully obvious that she does. She did, anyway, at one point. Given that you've spent the better part of three years faffing about and ignoring her eminently obvious come-ons, there's a very real possibility that ship has sailed.

Just ask her out. If possible, get a time machine, and ask her out two years ago when the iron was hot.

FOR GODS SAKE MAN. STOP STALLING.

BloatedGuppy:

Just ask her out. If possible, get a time machine, and ask her out two years ago when the iron was hot.

FOR GODS SAKE MAN. STOP STALLING.

This, I read the whole thing and a lot of it was pointless information. It seems painfully obvious she likes you or at one time did. To the point where she was basically smashing you over the head with this fact.

OolongThePig:
Then her friend said "[Oolong] She fancies you!" but I took no notice of it because she had been drinking and you can't trust someone in those circumstances. Ellie clearly heard it but didn't stop making eye contact with me and didn't say anything.

seriously man, when her friends are flat out telling you she likes you (even if they've had a few) it's a pretty big green light. She approached you and talked about how she wanted to talk to you/spend more time with you it's pretty clear.

But you're focusing on the wrong parts, you're so worried about interpreting her signals that you are getting way too worked up about it. If you're going to invite her out go someplace fun but casual. Avoid asking her to dinner or anything too 'serious' but a coffee/tea might be ok. Don't question her constantly to try to determine her feelings for you. Don't put too much pressure on her by asking her to be your girlfriend the second you spend time with her or show up at her door with flowers and chocolates.

Talk to her about what interests you or find out what interests her, It'll give you something to talk about other than "Why didn't you add me on facebook?". You're seriously over thinking things just Relax!

It wasn't obvious in any way until Friday when someone finally said that Ellie fancies me, that is without leaving me to guess between 5 different ones like when someone said that Ellie fancied me before. Bare in mind, we went to that sixth form interview in March this year. I basically hadn't spoken to her for 2 years before that, except for maybe 2 or 3 times she said hello to me in the playground. For 2 years, I saw no evidence that she liked me except for her friend request to me and when someone mentioned that one of the 5 girls with her name fancies me, but he could have been joking.

What if all her friends knew she liked me but they all thought I knew as well so they didn't tell me, thinking I'd noticed her behaviour and I didn't like her?

I'm not going to stall. I might see her tomorrow. If not, I'll find some other way to contact her somehow.

Just ask her at gunpoint, if she says no, kidnap her family and threaten to off them if she doesn't comply, if she says yes, all is well!

...works everytime...

OolongThePig:

Spartan1362:
Honestly, it sounds like she likes you.

There's little more to it.

I don't have very much experience with girls so what do you think I should do to get Ellie to be my girlfriend?

4 years of the perpetual romantic failure known as high school taught me something very important about the whole dating game:

If you go into it with the objective of her being your girlfriend, you WILL fail because things NEVER go exactly the way we want them and you WILL be disappointed. You really have to abandon that black and white "she is my girlfriend/she isn't my girlfriend" way of thinking.

Think about your non-relationship friends. Did you 'get' them to be your friends? Of course not. Those are just people with whom you have a mutual interest in spending time with.

Right now, just content yourself with being just friends. In fact, treat her no differently than you would one of your normal friends. And then if the feelings are mutual (and there is no magic way or technique of making someone have feelings for you. She does or she doesn't) you will feel yourself being 'pulled' closer, so to speak, rather than you moving closer on your own.

Just a few pointers while I'm at it:
1.) Take care of yourself. No one, and I mean NO ONE likes a slob and you're at the age where it does matter. And maybe I don't need to tell you this but it was amazing to me in high school how many people hadn't grasped basic hygiene.

2.) Be funny but watch yourself. You don't yet know where she draws the line of where appropriate becomes inappropriate. I'm not saying a single off-color joke will make her hate you the rest of your life but if you accidentally offend her she will give you 'the look'. And it doesn't mean she hates you but 'the look' will hurt your confidence and put you on the defensive, and you don't want that. So just be careful what you joke about.

3.) Be interesting and be your best. Don't use out of the can chatter like 'how are you doing?'. Talk about yourself and ask her about herself. Don't worry about looking like a geek either. One of the biggest mistakes I made was assuming girls wouldn't like it if I talked about my hobbies (video games, war games, MIDI music, etc.) or my work as an independent game developer. And you know what? They eat that stuff up. Any girl worth your time will see the good in whatever you have to say about yourself.

3b.) But don't be a poser. No one likes a liar, and you will only makes things hard on yourself if you try to be someone you're not. Oh, and if you're an athlete do not talk about your work out routine. I am continually amazed by how many guys screw that up. If you talk about how much you bench you will look like a tool, period.

4.) Beware friends and ESPECIALLY parents. You do not want these people to not like you. Maybe you don't need to be best friends with them, but don't be a jerk and avoid them, but DO NOT get too friendly with them. You do not want her thinking her friends are competing with her for your attention. And especially since you guys are young, you need to get the parents on your side. It's natural to be a bit intimidated, but you need the send the message that you are a mature and good-natured young man with their daughter's best interests at heart, not a boy who just wants a date.

5.) Personal space. You wouldn't want someone just appearing in your life one day, and now they're trying to monopolize your time and sending you constant text messages and you're never not on the phone with them. A healthy relationship absolutely needs personal space. You're way too young to be doing the whole 'committed' thing anyway. And you do not want to look clingy or needy, that's just unattractive on so many levels.

6.) Finally, make sure you actually want her to be your girlfriend. Do you find yourself getting bored when she talks? Are you finding you have nothing in common? Do you get the sense you need to force yourself to stay interested in her? If any of that is true, you may need to examine your relationship and consider ending it.

Oh, and watch The Love Guru. Not completely relevant but this reminded me of that movie and it's funny as hell.

And it might work out, or it might not. Either way, you're only 15 and there are more women than men in the world and you have PLENTY of life ahead of you to find someone you truly enjoy being with.

Ahh... To be 15-16 again. And to re-do my GCSE's again.

OT: I have never. EVER seen such a golden opportunity. Then again, I'd act exactly like you if it were me in your shoes at your age.

Captcha: puppy love. Somewhat suitable.

Ask her out. Simple. But don't go expecting everything to change if she becomes your ladyfriend, it takes a bit of time to get from where you are now to being comfortable around each other totally. I only mention this because a lot of relationships don't last when you're young, because you expect more out of them than is really possible in the first few months.

So...ask her out, what have you got to lose? A teeny tiny bit of pride? It will grow back if she rejects you. Just go for it, and good luck with it man.

Seriously ask her out and try and be a little bit more considerate with how you word things. She seems to like you but maybe ask her to hang out together some time and see how it goes you are still young so serious commitment is a bit much to ask upfront.

Broady Brio:
Ahh... To be 15-16 again. And to re-do my GCSE's

I agree. I should never have chosen to do art. Ellie actually chose art as well and we got put in different art groups but we had art at the same time. There was a 50/50 chance we would be put in the same group, and it didn't happen.

Galletea:
what have you got to lose? A teeny tiny bit of pride?

That didn't even cross my mind, because I might only see her 3 more times if at all. The problem is getting into contact with her at this point. I didn't see her at school but she went back online Yesterday. I will try to talk to her when I see her next week, if I see her. If not, I will get the guy who said that someone with her name fancies me to pass a message along to her.

Here is something you don't need to read: Throughout year 7, 8 and 9, I was bullied and I didn't have many friends, especially in year 7 and 8. Things did get better in year 9, but I still bitterly detested going to school. As soon as I started year 10, I completely forgot about the girl I had a crush on for the previous 1.5 years, lost most of my friends, met lots of new people and generally became happier. My mind sort of blocked out what happened between year 7 and year 9 so I could reinvent myself and it worked very well in general. That is the real reason I totally forgot about Ellie as soon as we stopped having any lessons together. The reason I wouldn't be the one to say hello first if I saw her was because I didn't want to affiliate myself with things that would make me remember my previous experiences. I had only thought of her as someone I used to do science with in my bad times. From what I've seen, Ellie's friends are pretty much the same as before and she was as happy then as she is now. She didn't undergo the same emotional change I did. Maybe if she had done, she would have forgotten about me just as I forgot about my crush. She obviously saw me as more than someone she had done science with in the past.

OolongThePig:

Spartan1362:
Honestly, it sounds like she likes you.

There's little more to it.

I don't have very much experience with girls so what do you think I should do to get Ellie to be my girlfriend?

If there's one thing 23 year old me would tell 15 year old me, nut the hell up and talk to her face to face about it. Nothing shows your confidence like taking a situation by the balls. If anything, she'll appreciate your belated honesty about things. Not only that, but once it's all resolved, better or worse, you know where you stand. Just go for it.

Griffolion:

OolongThePig:

Spartan1362:
Honestly, it sounds like she likes you.

There's little more to it.

I don't have very much experience with girls so what do you think I should do to get Ellie to be my girlfriend?

If there's one thing 23 year old me would tell 15 year old me, nut the hell up and talk to her face to face about it. Nothing shows your confidence like taking a situation by the balls. If anything, she'll appreciate your belated honesty about things. Not only that, but once it's all resolved, better or worse, you know where you stand. Just go for it.

Pretty much this. The OP is going to have to ask out a girl sometime, why not do it now over a girl he likes and seems to like him back. Besides even if she says no, the OP has at least asked a girl out, he knows it is nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be and that he can do it in the future.

mate just go for it and see wat happens. otherwise nothing will happen. dont make my mistake

I think you should ask her out but only because you are both white and you are taller than her.

She is the good things out of everything bad in your past. If she is beautiful, nice and clever, I don't see why you're holding out.

1) I did not need most of that information to understand the story. Seriously, the fact that you had maths together but didn't interact during year 8? Completely irrelevant.

2) If you're still not sure if she likes you after that incredible diatribe concerning every interaction you've had for the past three years... just ask *her*. Not us, her. She is most likely to know the answer. Or, if you don't want to have that admittedly tacky conversation, just ask her to start dating you, or be your girlfriend, or whatever the preferred phrasing is amongst English teenagers these days.

The worst thing that can happen is she says no, and you might feel embarrassed for a minute. But then the question is answered, and for better or worse, you can move on.

Ask her.

*Turns. Leaves.

Okay. More seriously, ask her out or something. Until you do you will never know unless she asks you.

For those of you who actually care, I met her again on Wednesday and discussed things with her in the school library after our test (she had another test a few hours later) and things seem to be going very well, but not as quickly as I would have hoped and I haven't received a clear confession yet. I'm going to her house later today.

I don't want or need any more replies to this thread. Some of you have been very helpful, some have been useless such as the guy who said I should threaten her at gunpoint.

If you haven't receive a clear confession, why not be the first to do it? Clearly you like the girl anyway, it's not bad to drop the pride a bit for the girl you like.

Good luck and best wishes to the both of you.

you are in man!

Krois:
why not be the first to do it? Clearly you like the girl anyway, it's not bad to drop the pride a bit for the girl you like.

I don't have anything in particular to confess to her... I don't know if you've read my original post, but I'll give you a summary of it: she has possibly liked me for about 2 and a half years and wanted to be my girlfriend and I only just realised and I think it would be a good idea to be her boyfriend.

Evil Smurf:
you are in man!

Lol thanks. When I went to her house earlier, we just talked and hugged a little bit so it didn't feel like I'd achieved very much, but we will see how things develop.

Ok before you read the rest of the post lets establish one thing: I didnt read all previous posts, sorry if the following has been said and sorry if i've missed anything.

I'll give you the advice i give everyone:

When you are considering what to do and are overwhelmed by the possible ramifications, dismiss the consequences and have faith in your instincts.

Even if you make a mistake its better to fail on your own terms than to be subjugated to your paranoia.

Appologies for the rather dry phrasing, not sure how harsh the profanity rules are enforced.

OolongThePig:
snip

Ask her out.

If she says yes great, if she says no. You'll be crushed for a short but don't stop being her friend.

Also, try watching her feet. This is going to sound mad but just pretend I'm making sense.

If she has a very open stance with you, she's into you. People are good at masking all of their body language but they don't concentrate on how their feet and legs are, if she sits cross legged with you, then don't do anything, or if she stands with her feet together same thing, if their is distance though she's comfortable around you and probably intereted, also judging by your relationship description, I'd say you've already been given all the signs you need to not feel bad about mentioning the possibility.

Ask her to go somewhere with you, don't outright say it but try to let her know that you want a date not just to hang out as friends. Ask her questions but not too personal and go from there.

 

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