It feels like people around my age are falling through the cracks of society

 Pages PREV 1 2 3 4 5 NEXT
 

nexus:
Same old story.

If you have problems then you're just "complaining" and boy you should be lucky you weren't in your great-grandparents generation, because they had it bad!

Besides, stop trying to get a 1% job, you should be getting a trade.. that's your problem you're just a snob!

(Despite the fact blue-collar/labor jobs are in very short supply too.)

In short, it's not society's problem, it is *your* problem.. so just go to a therapist and get dosed with high-potency psychotropic medication. In other words, be quiet so no one ever acknowledges the problem. Haven't you heard, the stock market is doing awesome!! So shut your face and know your place!

This comment deserves to be plastered to the wall of this thread, with big spangly neon arrows pointing to it.

The standard response to someone pointing out how shitty they system is, is to ignore them and hope they go away so we don't have to aknowledge it.

Sutter Cane:
it really feels like college degrees are barely worth the paper they're printed on nowadays,

I fail to understand this notion.

What degree are you getting?
Where?
What do you want to do?

These are the questions that matter. Almost every single person I know who went to the university I went to with a goal in mind got a good job. Yeah, if you take a bachelor's in English and don't bother going to graduate school, or fail to realize that such a degree is essentially "street cred" for authors, then yes there will be problems. Going to a community college beyond your first three semesters is not a great idea either.

If you feel that you are not learning anything, change universities. If you don't care about what you are learning, change majors.

There are a lot of people advocating trades here, and that's fine. Just know that you really are not going to be earning very much. I live in a decent neighborhood of individual homes. Pretty much everyone here has some sort of STEM or medical degree or a grad level Business degree. You seriously need to begin exploring your options.

Sutter Cane:
It really feels like the only choices right now are between "career that will make you miserable for your entire working life" or "not being able to support yourself."

And you think this is somehow unique to our generation? Rofl. Welcome to the past 10,000+ years of history, most people hate their work. But they soldiered up and did that shitty work because they preferred it to death. We aren't special or unique and reality isn't just going to take a break because you're disappointed with your job prospects.

Find something you do enjoy, that people will pay for and figure out how to do it. Or get a shitty job that makes money and then make yourself as happy as possible in your downtime. Or just give up on life. Choice is up to you.

thaluikhain:

I think you're supposed to totally ignore the reality of the situation...that's why they call it "the dream".

Oh hey, whats up George Carlin? Didn't realize you had an account here, and aren't dead.

RJ 17:
When a president is up for re-election and half the people polled while leaving the voting booth say they still believe the problems with the economy are the fault of the president that left office 4 years ago, you know there's something wrong with society in general. If they refuse to hold the people currently in charge responsible for the current mess we're in, then nothing will ever change and things are likely to get worse.

I don't know about you, but my copy of the constitution says that Congress controls economic policy, and not the President.

Fatboy_41:
Essentially what I'm saying is that yes, people do still look at the tradesman and labourers as the working class. However, that working class is earning a hell of a lot more than most office workers. In Australia, trades people are the biggest spenders in the country.

The unskilled labour market has pretty much dried up for the moment (be a few years before the current crop start getting physically knackered by their jobs and have to quit) but yeah, except for motor mechanics there is always a lot of work for tradies because there's a national shortfall of qualified tradesmen in almost every area (the main exception being land vehicle mechanics).

The hardest thing with the trades is getting an apprenticeship, although with the amount of cash and work coming in, that's been getting better over the past 5 or so years. The 90s were terrible for people wanting to get into a trade - the main hirers of apprentices (state and fed govts were the #1 source of apprenticeships back then) had shut down most of their apprenticeship programs which is what ended up causing the trades shortfall. Now with private businesses having enough cash in-flow and work to make taking on apprentices feasible as well as the federal government actually pulling their finger out their arse and making it easier for businesses to actually take them on it's addressing part of the shortfall.

There is one group of degrees that service professions that are always in demand - Engineering degrees. Never enough Engineers to go around, especially in the more traditional areas of Engineering, such as Mechanical, Electrical and Civil Engineering. Of course, those are professions where you will encounter dirt, grime and tradies on a regular basis. ;)

Don't give up and keep trying to find something you enjoy. You can only master something you enjoy, and if you become a master someone will be willing to pay for your services. Don't be afraid to take what you're given though, if the opportunity arises.

Mycroft Holmes:
I don't know about you, but my copy of the constitution says that Congress controls economic policy, and not the President.

You'd be surprised the shits he's pulling. We're not saying it's completely his fault, just a good chunk of it is.

Sutter Cane:
As someone who is currently 20 and looking to finish up his college degree in the next couple of years, it feels like people around my agre are really ending up on the short end of society's stick. I mean based on what I'm hearing, it really feels like college degrees are barely worth the paper they're printed on nowadays, an that unless you are looking to go into certain very-specific fields, you're just going to end up back at Walmart indefinitely anyway. It really feels like the only choices right now are between "career that will make you miserable for your entire working life" or "not being able to support yourself." I mean when it feels like those are your only two choices, how am I supposed to stay motivated? How am I supposed to remain optimistic? What is a person like me even supposed to do?

England here and I am in the same boat. I am 22 and our government seems quite happy to screw me and everyone else my age as much as possable. While unemployment is going down over here, youth unemployment is going up. My training is in IT, but for evry job I apply for, 15-20 other people are also applying and due to the resession there are people with 10/15/20 years worth of experience and I just cannot compete with that. One of the main problems is that the party that currently has the majority in our parliment (conservative party) knows that it has no votes with people my age, so they seem to be quite happy to concentrate on people over 35.

They are planning on slashing unemployment benefits for people my age while offering no help with finding work. I get 53 a week that is about $80 and while I share my place with a roommate and one of my sisters many peoplel are not as lucky as me. I have to goto the jobcenter every week and they are ment to help but all they ever do is look at what i have been doing, pat me on the head, call me a good boy and send me on my way.

Sutter Cane:
As someone who is currently 20 and looking to finish up his college degree in the next couple of years, it feels like people around my agre are really ending up on the short end of society's stick. I mean based on what I'm hearing, it really feels like college degrees are barely worth the paper they're printed on nowadays, an that unless you are looking to go into certain very-specific fields, you're just going to end up back at Walmart indefinitely anyway.

Part of the problem is called 'educational inflation'... the long and the short of which basically says the more people who have a degree the less value that degree has and becomes problematic when the employment opportunities normally associated with the degree are insufficient to absorb the majority of graduates.

In Australia the textbook example of this is a Law Degree. Australian universities are pumping out so many Law graduates that a majority of them will not find work anywhere within the Legal field... and the ones who went into Law thinking they'd be making Mad Cash are laughed at by the people they went to high school with that became tradespeople and are now making cash by the fistful.

RhombusHatesYou:
There is one group of degrees that service professions that are always in demand - Engineering degrees. Never enough Engineers to go around, especially in the more traditional areas of Engineering, such as Mechanical, Electrical and Civil Engineering. Of course, those are professions where you will encounter dirt, grime and tradies on a regular basis. ;)

Oh, god yes. If you're one of those "engineering" fellas, you'll want to avoid us dirty tradies like the plague. ;)

Absolutely agree with you though. Getting into an apprenticeship and surviving the first 2 years is hard. I was very lucky with mine. I met my boss when he came over to my old mans place looking at buying a motorcycle to rebuild. Random chit-chat led to him mentioning he was "thinking" of gettin an apprentice and that I was "thinking" of an apprenticeship. He called me 2 days later and asked if I wanted to start on the Monday. :)

These days, most employers won't even look at you without a pre-voc course which is essentially your first few modules of trade school and some time of the tools getting job experience. This is usually done unpaid too, and even then there is no promise you'll land an apprenticeship. As you say, it has gotten better lately with govenment incentives to both employers and apprentices. Tool allowances and bonuses from the government definitely make it easier on the first and second year apprentices. During my first year, I was on $6.50 an hour. It's very hard to live on that. And unfortunately, I was 1 year before the bonuses got raising significantly so I missed out on that too.

Sutter Cane:
As someone who is currently 20 and looking to finish up his college degree in the next couple of years, it feels like people around my agre are really ending up on the short end of society's stick. I mean based on what I'm hearing, it really feels like college degrees are barely worth the paper they're printed on nowadays,

College degrees under a masters are worthless. The whole point of college is just to make connections. It's not just your generation, every gen has gone through those periods.

nexus:
Same old story.

If you have problems then you're just "complaining" and boy you should be lucky you weren't in your great-grandparents generation, because they had it bad!

Besides, stop trying to get a 1% job, you should be getting a trade.. that's your problem you're just a snob!

(Despite the fact blue-collar/labor jobs are in very short supply too.)

In short, it's not society's problem, it is *your* problem.. so just go to a therapist and get dosed with high-potency psychotropic medication. In other words, be quiet so no one ever acknowledges the problem. Haven't you heard, the stock market is doing awesome!! So shut your face and know your place!

I seriously hope you are joking, because that is bad advice.

The therapist part is okay, because it does seem like the OP needs someone to lift him up, but not because he needs to face that it is his fault.

It is not the OP's fault.

If you really think it is his fault then you really have never faced a recently graduated from college with no field experience situation.

It is a real thing that degrees mean shit about getting a job these days. Back in the day(oh yes I used that phrase), degree's were the proverbial golden ticket. Employers then would look at a fresh college graduate and say, "Look at this person with all that knowledge and training fresh in his mind." They would hire the college grad right off the bat. It didn't matter if the other applicants had experience working in a previous similar job, if they didn't have the degree, they didn't get the job.

Fast forward decades to now. Employers look at a fresh college grad and say, "Aaaannnd, I'm suppose to be impressed? Have you held a job exactly like this one for at least 3 to 5 years? No? NEXT!"

College degrees went from being a sure thing to get a job to the shitty icing on the cake that nobody wants to eat.

This is the way the hiring works(at least in the US):

1.) Inside connections: If you have a buddy on the inside to get you in, golden. From plenty of witnessing experience, I would say 99% of the time if you have an inside connection, it doesn't matter if you have experience or anything else, you are in.

2.) 3 to 5 years of experience. For the first 1 to 2 years, employers think that all you did at your previous similar job was that you were twiddling your thumbs and pissing on the bosses desk/workspace. So 1 to 2 years don't count.

3.) Internship.

4.) The degree that has the least leftover debris from wiping with it, get's the position if the applicants are tied with all the things from 1 to 3.

A friend of mine went to college and got an engineering degree. His job positions in order after graduation were, Target stocker(Had inside connections, minimum wage), technician at an oil refinery(had inside connections, over 14 dollars an hour), cashier at a grocery store(had connections, slightly above minimum wage).

Right out of college, 90 percent of employers in his field outright told him, "your degree means nothing when trying to get a job, if he didn't have 3 to 5 years of experience he shouldn't apply because he is wasting their time."
The other 10% told him, "your degree is important, as a deciding factor if you have the 3 to 5 years of experience and they need a tie breaker."

He was able to get that job at the refinery only because a friend of his worked there, told him outright, "So and so says you are a hard-worker and know your stuff, you are hired." He only got to work there for less than a year because supply talks for the refinery went badly and they had to lay off most of their workforce.

After that, again employers told him his degree meant nothing and then on top of that, since his experience wasn't at the 3 to 5 year level, that refinery technician experience meant nothing.

As for me, it took me two years to find even a basic retail stocking job, because the only previous work experience I had was 6 months as a grocery stocker.
Applying for jobs on my own didn't work. I didn't want to, but a year and ten months into looking for work, I had to actually make a big deal of my social anxiety disorder to get combined help from a government work agency and a private work searching firm for "disabled" people. After dealing with all the paper work, two months later I got a part-time job as a stocker at a home improvement store(only because the firm I was using had deep connections with sending workers to that store).

So in the end, it is society's fault for the most part, for mixing up and turning the hiring process upside-down. Degrees have about 0.05% influence on getting a job. The only time degrees work is if the job you are trying to get is one where you absolutely can't get experience outside of degree training, like becoming a teacher/professor.

at the risk of sounding like a stereotypical immigrant father "you be doctor or engineer(mechanical or electrical (masters, Beng is useless))" but seriously if you want job security and good salary its the way to go, because those two high paying vocations are always going to be in demand by society no matter where in the world you live.

albeit i have very little experience in the US job market, all i know is that its hard to get hired, and easy to get canned.

I can relate. My master's is probably going to be utterly useless - but I'm not working at it for the sake of a job. I'm working at it because I'm just that much of a Lit geek. After it, I can look forward to a shitty entry-level job somewhere and then to a good six months spent applying at just about every school I can find.

Failing that, onto the Communications certificate bandwagon I go, so I'll become someone else's PR nerd. I'm 29 and I'm still in the "Yay, two hundred bucks in my pocket!" phase.

So don't stress out, OP. Times are tough for everyone, and never forget that the rosy decades of the fifties and sixties are dead and gone. It used to be you lied to get a job before turning sixteen and plugged at it until retirement. Nowadays, it's all about being overqualified and underpaid.

Just try to live on, and to find something that makes you happy. I'm managing okay, considering.

Fatboy_41:

RhombusHatesYou:
There is one group of degrees that service professions that are always in demand - Engineering degrees. Never enough Engineers to go around, especially in the more traditional areas of Engineering, such as Mechanical, Electrical and Civil Engineering. Of course, those are professions where you will encounter dirt, grime and tradies on a regular basis. ;)

Oh, god yes. If you're one of those "engineering" fellas, you'll want to avoid us dirty tradies like the plague. ;)

I've actually known a few older tradies who, once their own businesses were up and running and turning a nice profit, decided to go and study Engineering. They said they didn't end up earning more but consulting was a fuck of a lot easier, had better hours, and was something they could do when their knees clapped out.

Absolutely agree with you though. Getting into an apprenticeship and surviving the first 2 years is hard. I was very lucky with mine. I met my boss when he came over to my old mans place looking at buying a motorcycle to rebuild. Random chit-chat led to him mentioning he was "thinking" of gettin an apprentice and that I was "thinking" of an apprenticeship. He called me 2 days later and asked if I wanted to start on the Monday. :)

Nice one. Yeah, from what my nephews have told me about getting their apprenticeships knowing/meeting the right people is the best chance you'll get. If you don't have that you're down in with everyone else looking for a chance.

As for surviving the first 2 years... yeah, not a time you really want to move out of home. Not on those wages. Really hurts when your other mates have gotten office or factory jobs and are relatively cashed up compared to 1st/2nd apprentice pay (that happened to my oldest nephew. he hated it).

These days, most employers won't even look at you without a pre-voc course which is essentially your first few modules of trade school and some time of the tools getting job experience. This is usually done unpaid too, and even then there is no promise you'll land an apprenticeship. As you say, it has gotten better lately with govenment incentives to both employers and apprentices. Tool allowances and bonuses from the government definitely make it easier on the first and second year apprentices. During my first year, I was on $6.50 an hour. It's very hard to live on that. And unfortunately, I was 1 year before the bonuses got raising significantly so I missed out on that too.

Yeah, there are also a few high schools with excellent trades pathways. Some even offer the equivalent of doing prevoc and job placement training as an alternative to 'year 12'... and the workshops are fucking amazing. I remember tech studies workshop(s) at my old high school using barely better than hobbyist level kit (if that) while these schools have professional level kit. I was dead jelly when I first found out... then I remembered tech was only of mild interest to me at school.

The 1st year Tool Allowance has been a massive help for apprentices. Although, in my youngest nephew's case, he finds it a bit annoying because he's actually got better tools than any of the mechanics at his work (not surprising as he got himself about $3k worth of tools with his allowance via a mate of his Dad's) so the other blokes are always borrowing his tools. Of course, if I ever need to borrow a tool, I go visit his place. Him and 2 of his brothers all got apprentice tool allowances (although one brother lost his apprenticeship during the GFC), and even though the oldest brother moved out of home, a lot of his apprenticeship time tools are there... LOTS of tools, not even mentioning their Dad's collection... but it can get a bit violent when a needed tool is missing.

BiscuitTrouser:
I know people who turn their lives around WAY past university age.

As a 39 year old first year Uni student, I'm not sure I like the implication that there's a 'university age'. :P

edit:
Hey, how did I manage to post before the post I replied to? Spooky... Bickie, are you fucking about with that time machine again?

Study history, you will find that the case for every group since ww2, and several before it. The only thing that changes is the years of their lives they feel it.

The fact is society's interconnecttivity has grown to the point that individuals don't matter anymore...at all.

That is what you are feeling, corporations growing, people becoming faceless. Oh...and repetition of the past.

Nothing is as new as it seems, learning that is just part of growing up.

Ive chosen medicine as a career path. Honestly it seems like my only viable choice. I get to feel good about what i do. And i get to make enough money to live by. Also its a field where hard work and dedication is proportional to the amount of demand you receive. Skilled physicians, researchers and pharmacists are sought after by private hospitals and companies meaning becoming GOOD at what i want to do is basically totally proportional to how successful i am. This is not always the case. Especially in the arts.

To fund this insanely expensive degree i took a year out to work as much menial labor as i could to save up for the crushing debt. Ive taken precautions and reviewed my family assets to work out what i will and wont be able to do in my adult life. I have things insanely easy relative to a lot of people. Im EXTREMELY fortunate to be inspired and totally drawn to an area that both pays well and gives me reason to be happy. Im also fortunate to have the talent to be able to reach such a career. In these things i am likely extremely lucky. Im always thankful. I just cant wait to get started. Chin up OP. I know people who turn their lives around WAY past university age. Its never too late to start something new at our age and even in 10 or 20 years time. Do some exploring and decide what sounds good for you.

America produces more college graduates than it needs.

Somebody has to haul trash, drive buses, and cook our meals....and it ain't gonna be this guy:
image
Service jobs aren't going away; it's the good jobs you can't get.

I look around at the jobs available in my community and I see two types: 1) Menial labor a trained monkey could do; 2) Things requiring technical expertise you can't get at the local colleges.

I'm fortunate to have a family business to take over (though for anyone who thinks that is a free ride, I assure you it is not, I work overtime, I buy my shares of stock at the same price John Q would pay if it were public, I work or have worked at every aspect of the business from scrubbing the floors up through customer service right on up to choosing a new health insurance plan for the company in the wake of ObamaCare and now know more about how it all ties together than anyone else there).

You are not unique. I felt like the system was failing me all through public school. I was a smart kid, which meant everything was geared for people who weren't me: I suffered through Phys Ed but the jocks didn't have to take Physics; new uniforms for the soccer team but the science room could make do with equipment installed in the 1940's; not enough computers for every student in keyboarding class; and so forth.

Johnny Impact:

Somebody has to haul trash, drive buses, and cook our meals....and it ain't gonna be this guy:

Funfact: The garbage men in my district get paid $22/hr, plus have plenty of bonuses and insurance. They get paid significantly more than our teachers.

From what I hear, plumbing is pretty lucrative, too. Apparently public service jobs are where the money is at.

RhombusHatesYou:

BiscuitTrouser:
I know people who turn their lives around WAY past university age.

As a 39 year old first year Uni student, I'm not sure I like the implication that there's a 'university age'. :P

edit:
Hey, how did I manage to post before the post I replied to? Spooky... Bickie, are you fucking about with that time machine again?

What the hell kind of sorcery is this?! I was about to apologize and correct myself by saying "Traditional university age, by which i mean in the UK pretty much all students are Sheparded into uni at 18/19" but now youre some practitioner of foul magics.

BiscuitTrouser:

RhombusHatesYou:

BiscuitTrouser:
I know people who turn their lives around WAY past university age.

As a 39 year old first year Uni student, I'm not sure I like the implication that there's a 'university age'. :P

edit:
Hey, how did I manage to post before the post I replied to? Spooky... Bickie, are you fucking about with that time machine again?

What the hell kind of sorcery is this?! I was about to apologize and correct myself by saying "Traditional university age, by which i mean in the UK pretty much all students are Sheparded into uni at 18/19" but now youre some practitioner of foul magics.

Oh sure, try to hide your time travel antics by shifting suspicion on to me...

Anyway, yeah, same sort of thing happens here. Lots of pressure and expectation for kids to do post-secondary study, with university being seen as the most desirable/important.

It's mental that society expects kids to have their entire lives planned out by the time they're 18 when you consider that the same society barely trusts teens to be able to tie their own shoelaces without getting pregnant or killing someone.

Kopikatsu:

Johnny Impact:

Somebody has to haul trash, drive buses, and cook our meals....and it ain't gonna be this guy:

Funfact: The garbage men in my district get paid $22/hr, plus have plenty of bonuses and insurance. They get paid significantly more than our teachers.

From what I hear, plumbing is pretty lucrative, too. Apparently public service jobs are where the money is at.

I'm in the wrong field....

aba1:

While this is true I really really wouldn't recommend it I am in those fields and I can tell ya it is extremely apparent who went through school and who didn't because the people who didn't have the worst portfolios that look extremely amateur and they tend to have really bad habits and are just over all extremely underqualified..

just out of interest can you give me some specific examples?

Sonic Doctor:
[snip.

I'm pretty sure they were joking....

RhombusHatesYou:

It's mental that society expects kids to have their entire lives planned out by the time they're 18 when you consider that the same society barely trusts teens to be able to tie their own shoelaces without getting pregnant or killing someone.

yeah, I remember back in highschool everyone acted like it was the biggest thing that was going to determine the rest of their lives FOREVER (the ones doing tertiary path that is)

you dont know what the fuck you want in school....and you probably dont know what you want at 18...

I was having a chat with my sister some time ago and she mentioned how they changed the Medicial path for university over here in WA, bascially you can't go straight from school into medicine, you have to get a degree first then sit the test (I dont even think it has to be related but I gues the Idea is you take a degree in somthing that will help you with that)

I think it was because they wanted graduates with more real life experience...or they just werent getting good graduates

as for me I know its not quite like america but I really do wonder if teritary education is worth it...but then I doubt I get anywhere on the work experience I have now alone...

Sutter Cane:
As someone who is currently 20 and looking to finish up his college degree in the next couple of years, it feels like people around my agre are really ending up on the short end of society's stick. I mean based on what I'm hearing, it really feels like college degrees are barely worth the paper they're printed on nowadays, an that unless you are looking to go into certain very-specific fields, you're just going to end up back at Walmart indefinitely anyway. It really feels like the only choices right now are between "career that will make you miserable for your entire working life" or "not being able to support yourself." I mean when it feels like those are your only two choices, how am I supposed to stay motivated? How am I supposed to remain optimistic? What is a person like me even supposed to do?

It's a changed job market. Employers don't really care about simply being employed or college degrees anymore. It is all about having an established portfolio demonstrating that you are skilled in what you applying for or being number one consistently on the job. Retail jobs and front office jobs might get you some immediate cash but only one person really gets to succeed in terms of advancing their career. There is a reason why entry level jobs now have in their description "X years of similar job experience". Even volunteer experience has transformed into shitty mundane tasks and while you are certainly giving back most volunteer jobs won't really teach you how to do the jobs that people do on location.

If you feel shafted, try being the generation before yours where employer standards increased to these requirements but didn't have the online resources like youtube, deviantart, linkedin, or facebook or the ability to buy a website easily to promote oneself.

Best thing to do is to start learning how to promote yourself and start attaining the skills or certifications that prove to employers that you know how to do the job you want to do. Figure out what you want to do and start researching and being active in what you want to do. Build a website and a brand that has your resume and list of achievements and certifications. If you are a person of the arts then use and abuse youtube, deviantart and linkedin promoting professional works. Creative writing get your arse involved in writing groups and start publishing group works. Stop making fancy forum topics and start posting them on your website telling the stories and let people comment from there.

You just gotta start being active and utilize what resources and skills you have to build more skills. You gotta do what you want to do on the side and the shit job during those primary hours.

Vault101:

Sonic Doctor:
[snip.

I'm pretty sure they were joking....

I kind of figured, though I don't think I wasted my time.

It was important information that will let the OP know that he isn't alone and that it all isn't his fault.

Vault101:

aba1:

While this is true I really really wouldn't recommend it I am in those fields and I can tell ya it is extremely apparent who went through school and who didn't because the people who didn't have the worst portfolios that look extremely amateur and they tend to have really bad habits and are just over all extremely underqualified..

just out of interest can you give me some specific examples?

I could but I won't for 2 reasons:
1). It would be extremely unprofessional
2). A couple of the examples would be friends and I am not about to bad mouth any person directly friend or not.

aba1:

I could but I won't for 2 reasons:
1). It would be extremely unprofessional
2). A couple of the examples would be friends and I am not about to bad mouth any person directly friend or not.

unprofessional? I dont know...it sounds like some fairly useful advice/information

also if we didn't badmouth the likes of Rob Liefeld then some people might not have picked out his total disregard for anatomy, or saw what can seperate good from bad art and in turn get motivated to draw and again and get better (or dare I say good) at it

I mean if there is a chance that one of those freinds you mentioned might be on the forum then ok...but otherwise I think it was yahtzee who said "the worst thing you can do is tell an artist their work is great when it isnt"

Its not the same as petty badmouthing/insults if it leads to improvment..for anyone

Sutter Cane:
As someone who is currently 20 and looking to finish up his college degree in the next couple of years, it feels like people around my agre are really ending up on the short end of society's stick. I mean based on what I'm hearing, it really feels like college degrees are barely worth the paper they're printed on nowadays, an that unless you are looking to go into certain very-specific fields, you're just going to end up back at Walmart indefinitely anyway. It really feels like the only choices right now are between "career that will make you miserable for your entire working life" or "not being able to support yourself." I mean when it feels like those are your only two choices, how am I supposed to stay motivated? How am I supposed to remain optimistic? What is a person like me even supposed to do?

Well, to be honest, you're still a noob.

In video game terms, college is just the tutorial phase. You only have your beginner equipment, maybe some slightly shinier sword, and have just worked out the basics of the interface. You've got a long hard grind before you reach max level, or even complete your character's build plan. So get to grinding that exp, and be smart about what you grind.

On the other hand, if you're still disillusioned with life back home, go take a 4 week CELTA course, and join us in foreign countries teaching English. I started just 3 years ago, and already run my own school, living a life that my friends back home can only dream of.

Vault101:

aba1:

I could but I won't for 2 reasons:
1). It would be extremely unprofessional
2). A couple of the examples would be friends and I am not about to bad mouth any person directly friend or not.

unprofessional? I dont know...it sounds like some fairly useful advice/information

also if we didn't badmouth the likes of Rob Liefeld then some people might not have picked out his total disregard for anatomy, or saw what can seperate good from bad art and in turn get motivated to draw and again and get better (or dare I say good) at it

I mean if there is a chance that one of those freinds you mentioned might be on the forum then ok...but otherwise I think it was yahtzee who said "the worst thing you can do is tell an artist their work is great when it isnt"

Its not the same as petty badmouthing/insults if it leads to improvment..for anyone

As a friend I will give constructive criticism as a professional I stay neutral. Telling people they terrible at their job is just is unprofessional from my position and can't lead to anything good.

Like I said before, going through college for these things makes a huge difference it means years of training from other professionals. You can learn anything of the net that doesn't mean you understand things on the same level as a professionally trained pro.

Also worth saying design and fine art and not the same thing. They have some shared principles sure but they are very different over all. Even fine art and design are very broad there are tons of different types of fine artists and designers who specialize in very different things.

Just want to throw my two cents in, even though I'm sure that what I'm about to say has already been said. Hooray for skimming!

Anyway, there are several things wrong with the mentality you have. Hear me out here, don't just dismiss me thinking that I've already dismissed you. It's a common mistake most people around our age make (21 here) in thinking that a degree is either completely worthless or the end-all-be-all. It is neither. Degrees are worthless because everyone has one. This goes doubly for people in high-demand fields or people who have "fun/dream" degrees (liberal arts, philosophy, acting, etc; things that don't have a direct impact on improving society, as opposed to medicine, engineering, etc), everyone already has a degree. What a lot of people don't have is experience in anything at this point.

What I'd recommend to you is go find a job that has nothing to do with your field. Go work in food service, or tech support, or something with the absolute bitchiest customers you can find. Now hold this job for at least a year. And no bouncing, every time you get a new job, you double how long you have to stay there before the damage from leaving your old job is done. You see, with 3 years of McDonald's experience under my belt, employers in the tech business know that I can deal with the worst of both customers and management, and that I'm able to stick with the job and put in a lot of hard work. All of these are ideal qualities in any employee, and being able to prove with work history, ANY work history, that you have them will do more for getting you a job than your degree could ever hope to.

All that being said, however, don't discount your degree completely. While you need the experience and blah blah blah, before you can enter ANY field, you need to prove that you have learned the basics to doing your job. Any degree you can get shows that you've learned some basic knowledge, and the more specific and related to the desired career you can get, the better. Also the higher the degree, the better. I see you said you're 20? Associates' degrees have never been worth the paper they've been printed on, you need to pursue a Bachelor's or Master's before you can get anywhere. Or, as has been said many times before, go to a trade school. Get something so ridiculously specific, that you'll be a sure-in for whatever career you want.

Now, for a general feel of things, not just education/job related...

Please understand that these economic times happen. Most people our age can't remember all that well, but the DotCom bubble bursting at the turn of the millennium was seen at the time as an incredibly devastating event that we would never be able to recover from. And, despite the terrible economy, the stock market is either close to or already setting new records again. People see what they want to see. Right now you want to see desolation and you're the victim, but that's not really the case.

Let's keep things in perspective. We'll use the Republican's pessimistic numbers and say that 18% of Americans are un- or under-employed. That means that you walk by 5 people on the street, 4 of them are gainfully employed. That's still a massive overwhelming majority of Americans employed at this time. Just remember, you have to have something to offer, a slip of paper is the bare-minimum for entry these days.

Also bear in mind that the young have always been shafted before. Not even a century ago it would have been a miracle for you to have even lived as long as you have. And without a lifetime's experience, you don't know what it's really like to be shafted terribly, so even minor things tend to get to you. You also haven't had the opportunity to see the cycles that this takes, so this one downturn, the only one you remember, is the worst thing you've ever known.

So chin up, get out there, and make something of yourself. After all, a rolling stone gathers no moss; a moving person gathers no cobwebs; any other way you want to look at it. The only way to make something of yourself is to get out there and do it. Sitting, whining, and complaining has never done anything for anybody. All the great leaders and heroes of the world got there by hard work, determination, and admittedly a little luck. But none of them got anywhere by sitting on their asses saying "woe is me".

aba1:

Like I said before, going through college for these things makes a huge difference it means years of training from other professionals. You can learn anything of the net that doesn't mean you understand things on the same level as a professionally trained pro

yeah...I supose....

Also worth saying design and fine art and not the same thing. They have some shared principles sure but they are very different over all. Even fine art and design are very broad there are tons of different types of fine artists and designers who specialize in very different things.

I knew that (more or less) I was just curious as to how much of a differnece going the teritary education route made...

Well, I'm 35 and I'm all but employable. I guess I have to blame my laziness. Despite that I've been doing custodial work forever. I'm not saying that I'm too lazy to make something of myself, but I've tried going to school off and on. I found it to be quite frustrating trying to go to school and still work 40 hours. I'm at the point where I've got to do something. Right now all I have is part-time job making 8/hour and there no way anyone can live off that.

I don't need anyone reminding me that I'm a failure at life. I just need to find a way to move forward so I can support myself again. Despite my lack of a formal education I've had periods in my life where I was making GREAT money. So maybe I'll go learn a trade. I've already amassed 10k in loans thanks to ITT tech. What's a little more to learn a trade?

Australia? Seems everyone is getting jobs there these days. So long as you can survive every animal/plant trying to kill you, it seems like the answer.

There are still jobs around. They're damn hard to find but they still exist.

I'm actually quite surprised by the amount of people saying they need 3-5 years of experience to get a job. Over here that's not necessary at all, heck many (paid) trainingship programs even refuse people with more than 3 years experience. And my lack of experience was never being said to be a reason why i wasn't given a job (but than again i didn't apply for that many jobs yet)

 Pages PREV 1 2 3 4 5 NEXT

Reply to Thread

This thread is locked