Zero Punctuation: MadWorld

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j_meister:
My Dad now has a Wii. He's the kind of person who wouldn't touch a serious games console unless it held the key to immortality, so this goes to show what a pile of crap the Wii must be.
Five minutes with the motion control bollocks and I'm ready to throw it out the window.
Death to nintendo.
Oh, good "review" Yahtzee. Let's see more anti-nintendo rants! Just pick any random Wii game and use it as an excuse to piss all over the big N.

I can't tell what your point is. Surely if it's a console that appeals to people who haven't bought consoles before, that's a GOOD thing for the gaming industry, right? But then you say that you hate it and want more rants.

Acrewsyx:
Great review as always Yahtzee :D

Wut a Yazi

On that note, I thought the review was decent. Nice Clockwork Orange reference. And lol I'm not tired of the Wii bashing. Its REPETITIVE, admittedly, but it is so in a greatly entertaining and, at the best of times, unique.

About the Wii... I don't own one on grounds of Nintendo hating my country's guts and thus it costing about US$ 600,00 (and it's not all taxes, PS3 and 360 are about US$ 800,00 each... more expensive, sure, but at a different proportion). However I did get the chance to play one. More than once. In a friend's house. (EDIT: Both Nintendo and Sony didn't bother to officially launch their consoles in my country, making it even technically illegal to own one... and not having tech support for either. So I may be partial to Microsoft... but I don't care about the 360 either)

So... first off. The Wii really sucks really hard. After all the praise I got from my friend and from the industry about it's motion sensor technology: It just doesn't work. Precisely as Yahtzee said. Not only it captions your movement very poorly, it does so about a second after you prompt your command, so basically it's just like you're the one doing the movements, if you needed precognition to know what is about to happen because you're 1 sec out of sync with everything.

People say the Wii appeal to non-gamers to introduce them to gaming. I say this is bullocks, bullshit, and whatever more you want to call it. The vast majority of Wii owners only have one game: Wii Sports, the one that came with it. And they're very happy to have only that. From the ones who own more than one game, most still only owns two or three, because they took a shot, got another game, probably saw how absolutely worthless it was (more likely than not, considering it is the Wii and only a handful of Wii games are even tolerable) and completely disassociated themselves with games forever (save Wii sports). Finally, the sloppy controls are only giving these people the impression that games are still the same as 25 years ago... when they weren't that great and the controls were sloppy.

Bottom down, as much as the Wii is helping the gaming industry, it is harming much more the gaming COMMUNITY, giving argument to the mentality that games are only for children (and retarded children at that).

Henriksen:
Why dont you just stop reviewing games for Nintendo if you hate them so mutch. Its getting pretty boring to listen to you wine about Nintendo all the time. It seems like nomather what comes out for it you will hate it.

Because of reviewer obligation. It's no fun if everyone is sucking on the tit of nintendo or anyone else. If there is no discourse, no dissent, how do we know if a game is truly good? How do we recognize ass kisser and yes man from genuine review? We should encourage a difference of opinions and we should encourage people to share them. That's how opinions can be formed and ideas spread.

lol

nice work mad world never looked good for me from the begining but anyway good review =)

yourbeliefs:

Knowing the old style, I doubt he would have used "Mad World" for the theme. The only time the opening theme was the same as the game title was "No More Heroes" and Yahtzee stopped it in mid-song and said, "No No, that's a little too obvious."

You're right, it would probably have been too obvious. Nevermind though, I think footage of the game with 'Mad World' would be even nicer. ;)

j_meister:
My Dad now has a Wii. He's the kind of person who wouldn't touch a serious games console unless it held the key to immortality, so this goes to show what a pile of crap the Wii must be.
Five minutes with the motion control bollocks and I'm ready to throw it out the window.
Death to nintendo.
Oh, good "review" Yahtzee. Let's see more anti-nintendo rants! Just pick any random Wii game and use it as an excuse to piss all over the big N.

He doesn't even need a Wii game, last week he did it with a DS game.

I love Yahtzee's metaphors ... "The game repeats itself more than an amnesiac in an ear hospital" ha ha. Great stuff. That's why Yahtzee is so well received. Weather he actually knows anything about games is irrelevant. He's a great writer and there is always room in people's lives for great writing.

SandroTheMaster:

So... first off. The Wii really sucks really hard. After all the praise I got from my friend and from the industry about it's motion sensor technology: It just doesn't work. Precisely as Yahtzee said. Not only it captions your movement very poorly, it does so about a second after you prompt your command, so basically it's just like you're the one doing the movements, if you needed precognition to know what is about to happen because you're 1 sec out of sync with everything.

Maybe this is a regional thing, or a setup problem. I've not had this happen.

People say the Wii appeal to non-gamers to introduce them to gaming. I say this is bullocks, bullshit, and whatever more you want to call it. The vast majority of Wii owners only have one game: Wii Sports, the one that came with it.

Marketing data indicates that the Wii has an attach rate of 6.94 games per console sold. I think the XBox360 still leads this particular race, but when you consider the volume of hardware sales for the Wii it still translates to good numbers.

Bottom down, as much as the Wii is helping the gaming industry, it is harming much more the gaming COMMUNITY, giving argument to the mentality that games are only for children (and retarded children at that).

Right, that's why nobody over the age of 30... oh, right.

Face it, the most successful console right now is not aimed at the "hardcore" audience, and THANK GOD. When everyone is chasing after the same audience, you get stagnation. When there are multiple targets on the board, things are mixed up. Nintendo makes mad bank going after the casual market, providing quirky gameplay experiences in unusual contexts, while Sony and Microsoft can still release the latest sci-fi war epic and make a handsome profit from that.

I loved the Clockwork Orange referances.

I grow tired of you Yahtzee...

This game is on the Wii mainly because its made by the same team as Okami - they don't seem to like other platforms that much :P

I really enjoyed the game, but maybe thats because I have been starved of violent games on the Wii - which are now growing in number - New Silent Hill, The Conduit, HotD:Overkill, Resident Evil Wii-makes.

The lock-on system really is terrible, but once you get past that, I think the game is really good fun to play, if getting repetitive after time. The controls are used rather well in my opinion, but hey, thats my preference.

But anyhow you look at it, it's a great stress reliever.

Okay, I know the Wii isn't perfect, and I know there is a ton of shovelware crap on it nowadays...I am a Wii owner and I hate going into a store and going bad...bad...bad...bad...bad...Could be good...Bad...Good...Bad...You get the picture

But I have a few questions...
1. Why is a game getting ripped on because of other games on the system? Each game is its own. It doesn't matter if the other games are bad. What matters is this game.
2. Do people want hardcore games on the Wii or not? When shovelware comes out, I see on the boards statements like this. "Har Har, the Wii has no good games. It abandoned the hardcore audience. It sucks! Har Har." Then a good game comes out and I see this. "Why are they releasing this on the Wii! This is clearly for a hardcore audence."

I know this is getting long, but Basically my point is to look at a game based on the game. And then finally decide if you will actually let the Wii have hardcore titles, or you just want to assume that all it gets is shovelware.

Thank you for your time...

I own this and HOTD:OK with my previous Wii games sold. Those to are the most violent things on it (screw Manhunt 2, a game surpassed in violence by 10 games off the top of my head!). Another I own is Deadly Creatures which is good enough but the main draw being a different concept. The best Nintendo games for my personally at least are on the DS.

HOWEVER I think more violent games should come out on the Wii, its almost like SEGA who were once their rivals is trying to change the Wii's image... doing a good job thus far but will need more 10 fold.

I too wish this was on another console. It would look and play so much better.

This episode was well worth the wait.

I was requested to do a comic on this game but I don't know nearly enough to do so. And I don't steal jokes so I can't exactly base a comic off this review :/

Evan Waters:

Face it, the most successful console right now is not aimed at the "hardcore" audience, and THANK GOD. When everyone is chasing after the same audience, you get stagnation. When there are multiple targets on the board, things are mixed up. Nintendo makes mad bank going after the casual market, providing quirky gameplay experiences in unusual contexts, while Sony and Microsoft can still release the latest sci-fi war epic and make a handsome profit from that.

The question then will be, in which sense the gaming industry is getting a benefit from the sucess of the wii? What kind of new ideas, new concepts and so on are the wii games establishing right now? What does something like Wii sports brings to the medium? Seems that the short answer to this is: a wii sports sequel. Because you might to blame developers for not "trying hard" to make different games and what not for the wii, but you can't blame them when they're making money with so little effort put. In the same way something like the Madden games sell well even if they are more of the same.

Good for the wii users who are not soccer moms to have something like Madworld to finally have some diverse titles, a shame you'll have to wait weeks or months to have another game on that vein.

Noticing how all the bad posts got cut and the users banned, I'd guess I'd have to give a shiny two cents - not that I wouldn't anyways, you know... *cough

Anyways, I'd have to agree that using the Wii can get pretty straining, bad responses, and it's really a matter of opinion on how you swing it as well as having large electronics near it makes it go haywire.

I'd also have to agree that Madworld was special in the sense that there are rarely any violent games out for the Wii. The Wii has a fairly soft opinion from people, not being helped by the commercials with the two little Asian girls playing with it all the time. Trying something new, failed yet again. Yahtzee's dub "Spectacle Fighter" really sums the game up pretty well, where the whole point is to kill your enemies in as creative a way as possible, not really an image that Wii has been trying to push for the past few years.

-Alan

Huh. I think this might be the first review I don't like.

Sure, the game review part was funny as always, but the Wii bashing seemed a bit excessive. I can understand not wanting this game to be on the Wii because the controls are less-than-ideal (read: handle like shit), which I can easily see by trying to imagine playing DMC on it. However, the whole (for lack of a better word) moralistic objection to this game being on the Wii made absolutely no sense. Because the console is marketed more towards casual gamers, I can see that as a consequence more casual games for the thing will be made, but insisting they be the only games made for the system seems pretty damned absurd.

I enjoyed the comment at the end involving feeding children dogfood.
I also have to agree with the whole rant at the beginning about how releasing "Mature" games on the Wii is a big deal.

Not as funny as some of the ones previous, but still enjoyable.

NeutralDrow:
Huh. I think this might be the first review I don't like.

Sure, the game review part was funny as always, but the Wii bashing seemed a bit excessive. I can understand not wanting this game to be on the Wii because the controls are less-than-ideal (read: handle like shit), which I can easily see by trying to imagine playing DMC on it. However, the whole (for lack of a better word) moralistic objection to this game being on the Wii made absolutely no sense. Because the console is marketed more towards casual gamers, I can see that as a consequence more casual games for the thing will be made, but insisting they be the only games made for the system seems pretty damned absurd.

They're pretty much the only type of games being made for the Wii. So, that comment is really not that far from reality.

Oh come on, Yahtzee, this is getting stupid! I don't have an opinion on the game as I haven't played it, and a mostly negative opinion on the Wii (a few excellent games but not enough of them) but if you're going to review a Wii game you review the game, not the console it's on. Saying a game is stupid because the console is stupid makes no sense (AvP on the Jaguar says hello).

Less hating on the console, more hating on the game itself. Come on Yahtzee, I know you're better than this.

Also,

ElTigreNegro:
They're pretty much the only type of games being made for the Wii. So, that comment is really not that far from reality.

That in itself is also moralistic snark.

that review was great x) I kinda want to give the game a try
but probably only for about 3 hours or so

he said at the written word part during the credits this game isnt related to the song mad world of gears of war trailer fame but the band tears for fears didnt do the trailer, that was the gary jules cover he did for donnie darko. just saying, i really like that song. yay i pointed out a yahtzee mistake, that wont happen often im sure...

"Calloo callay, oh frabjous day!" I'm going to say that until my friends do me bodily harm from now on.
Also, the balloon analogy was one of the greatest things I've ever heard.
I'll still probably check this out, though, because I own a Wii. If a game has enough ideas for 3 hours, that's a hell of a lot better than any 3rd party title has had on this platform for quite some time (other than HOTD, I guess... haven't played that one, either). Last good 3rd party title was the RE4 port... of a last generation game.

ElTigreNegro:

The question then will be, in which sense the gaming industry is getting a benefit from the sucess of the wii? What kind of new ideas, new concepts and so on are the wii games establishing right now? What does something like Wii sports brings to the medium?

Well, I'm tempted to be snarky and ask back what does something like GEARS OF WAR 2 bring to the medium, but:

It's a way to present games that more people can jump into. The idea that you don't have to simulate every minor nuance of a sport to convey the basic feel- it's good to have dedicated golf games where you can try different courses and design your own and the distinction between 3W and 2W is vital, but it's also good to have a game where people who don't want to bother with all that can just shoot a few holes and try to improve their score. The actual movement can be exhausting but can also be fun.

And it's not just that your grandpa can jump into Wii golf and not suck, but that he could actually, potentially, do better than you. It changes the playing field, so that it's not just the same set of hand-eye coordination skills being tested over and over in slightly different ways. What the Wii brings is gameplay that can work based on gross movement, large sweeps and turns and such (you don't actually have to stand up and flail around like an idiot for the Wiimote to work, at least depending on your settings, but it's hard not to.)

It's a different experience. You move around more, get a bit tired out, let someone else have a go or just sit back and egg them on, it's a bit more fun to watch- it's not a superior experience to other types of console play, but it is different enough that developers can start to explore and exploit it differently. Most of the good reviews for Wii games I hear have a similar line- it's not something you end up playing for 6 hours on end because it's that damn compelling, but it's something you can pick up every now and then and have some fun playing golf/blasting zombies/doing whatever the Hell it is you do in Wario Ware. In some ways it's returning to the older model of games that are less about playing to completion and more about playing off and on.

Good for the wii users who are not soccer moms to have something like Madworld to finally have some diverse titles, a shame you'll have to wait weeks or months to have another game on that vein.

The console could use more diversity, but it's not like Madworld is the first ever non-casual Wii game. And frankly, the whole casual/hardcore divide perplexes me on a basic level. Truly if you're really a hardcore gamer, a fan of video games as a medium, that should mean you're capable of appreciating a well made game in any genre, even the minigame collection genre or the rudimentary sports simulator genre. It's not what a game is about that makes it good, and though we all have our preferences, it's silly for hardcore gamers to insist that their preferences actually translate into aesthetic superiority.

ElTigreNegro:

NeutralDrow:
Huh. I think this might be the first review I don't like.

Sure, the game review part was funny as always, but the Wii bashing seemed a bit excessive. I can understand not wanting this game to be on the Wii because the controls are less-than-ideal (read: handle like shit), which I can easily see by trying to imagine playing DMC on it. However, the whole (for lack of a better word) moralistic objection to this game being on the Wii made absolutely no sense. Because the console is marketed more towards casual gamers, I can see that as a consequence more casual games for the thing will be made, but insisting they be the only games made for the system seems pretty damned absurd.

They're pretty much the only type of games being made for the Wii. So, that comment is really not that far from reality.

Doesn't mean exceptions should be axed simply for being exceptions.

Evan Waters:

ElTigreNegro:

The question then will be, in which sense the gaming industry is getting a benefit from the sucess of the wii? What kind of new ideas, new concepts and so on are the wii games establishing right now? What does something like Wii sports brings to the medium?

Well, I'm tempted to be snarky and ask back what does something like GEARS OF WAR 2 bring to the medium, but:

It's a way to present games that more people can jump into. The idea that you don't have to simulate every minor nuance of a sport to convey the basic feel- it's good to have dedicated golf games where you can try different courses and design your own and the distinction between 3W and 2W is vital, but it's also good to have a game where people who don't want to bother with all that can just shoot a few holes and try to improve their score. The actual movement can be exhausting but can also be fun.

And it's not just that your grandpa can jump into Wii golf and not suck, but that he could actually, potentially, do better than you. It changes the playing field, so that it's not just the same set of hand-eye coordination skills being tested over and over in slightly different ways. What the Wii brings is gameplay that can work based on gross movement, large sweeps and turns and such (you don't actually have to stand up and flail around like an idiot for the Wiimote to work, at least depending on your settings, but it's hard not to.)

It's a different experience. You move around more, get a bit tired out, let someone else have a go or just sit back and egg them on, it's a bit more fun to watch- it's not a superior experience to other types of console play, but it is different enough that developers can start to explore and exploit it differently. Most of the good reviews for Wii games I hear have a similar line- it's not something you end up playing for 6 hours on end because it's that damn compelling, but it's something you can pick up every now and then and have some fun playing golf/blasting zombies/doing whatever the Hell it is you do in Wario Ware. In some ways it's returning to the older model of games that are less about playing to completion and more about playing off and on.

Good for the wii users who are not soccer moms to have something like Madworld to finally have some diverse titles, a shame you'll have to wait weeks or months to have another game on that vein.

The console could use more diversity, but it's not like Madworld is the first ever non-casual Wii game. And frankly, the whole casual/hardcore divide perplexes me on a basic level. Truly if you're really a hardcore gamer, a fan of video games as a medium, that should mean you're capable of appreciating a well made game in any genre, even the minigame collection genre or the rudimentary sports simulator genre. It's not what a game is about that makes it good, and though we all have our preferences, it's silly for hardcore gamers to insist that their preferences actually translate into aesthetic superiority.

You're not alone in that confusion. I've yet to figure out how, say, Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn is less hardcore, say, Assassin's Creed (unless you measure in terms violence...and even that's questionable).

I was wholly expecting another Wii game to be reviewed, but not MadWorld... possibly because I was unaware of it's existence.

But what the Hell, good review.

Now I understand last week's joke ^-^

At least the game was fun for a while.

I've played it, and it's not the bad. I was almost going to defend the controls on the wii, but then I remembered all those times playing Resident Evil 4 when I'd swing the remote to break a crate, and Leon wouldn't swing so I'd swing again, and just as I'd give up and try to walk away, it would swing the knife twice into the midair. Of course, an enemy would always use the control-less opportunity to try to kill me.

So... I'd probably agree that no games that require the motion sensor should actually be on the wii.

To anyone who's still on the fence about this game: don't let Yahtzee's review influence you into not getting it. I've never even considered posting a comment about one of his videos before (because usually he sums everything in my head up just right and there's nothing left to be said) but this most recent one has been nibbling on the back of my brainstem all day because I can't figure out what was wrong with Yahtzee's copy that he was getting such a shitty performance from it. Oh, wait, that might just be the bias that's as obvious as a murder taking place in your room. And you're the one being gutted.

Yahtzee's biggest complaint with the game he outright stated at the end; it's on the Wii. Seriously? What the hell kind of a complaint is that? The Wii may be the weakest system this generation in terms of graphics and titles, but is that supposed to be some kind of excuse to not make games for it or something? The whole premise of the game was to produce a super stylized, over the top, entertaining blood fest where you get to use motions to feel more involved in the insane action. The whole purpose would be lost on any other console.

If you own a Wii and you don't see the incredible amount of exaggeration in Yahtzee's statement that you can eat a whole bowl of...whatever it was...in the time that it takes for the Wii to read a motion with the remote, then you're just being silly. In MadWorld especially the Wiimote's motions feel very responsive (except in some cases where you need to make a quick motion with the remote to accomplish one of the power struggles with bosses, those can be a bitch).

From the beginning I could not understand how people could look at the screenshots and videos for this game and wonder what is happening when the black and white color scheme is pulled of so well. I'll admit sometimes I'd be brutalizing an enemy and would run off to grab an item to stab him in the eye with and then I'd turn around and lose him, but this was rare and aside from that it wasn't confusing at all.

The only two things that even made me go, "heh, that's true" was when he mentioned the strategy used for taking down bosses and the whole idea of the spectacle fighter, but even this was entirely right. He entirely left out the boss power struggles that mix up the battles and he also didn't mention that the game has a hard mode which, as it implies, is harder. Much harder.

I don't understand how Yahtzee could take a super flawed game like No More Heroes (which I also enjoyed) and say that he really liked it because it was different when really MadWorld is more or less No More Heroes but 10 times better. It stands out from the rest of the crowd 10 times more, it's more violent, more stylized, more over the top, has better controls, more unique bosses...I just don't understand it at all. He says MadWorld is childish and immature and then you watch his Saints Row 2 review and he says how much he likes it because of how mindless, crazy and childly fun it is.

Good stuff, but other than the clockwork orange reference the movie references were a little too obscure for me :P

Evan Waters:

Well, I'm tempted to be snarky and ask back what does something like GEARS OF WAR 2 bring to the medium, but:

Oh, i actually really don't care about "hardcore" or "casual", they are just labels that hardly describe well something. Not to mention i don't care about Gears of War D:

It's a way to present games that more people can jump into. The idea that you don't have to simulate every minor nuance of a sport to convey the basic feel- it's good to have dedicated golf games where you can try different courses and design your own and the distinction between 3W and 2W is vital, but it's also good to have a game where people who don't want to bother with all that can just shoot a few holes and try to improve their score. The actual movement can be exhausting but can also be fun.

And it's not just that your grandpa can jump into Wii golf and not suck, but that he could actually, potentially, do better than you. It changes the playing field, so that it's not just the same set of hand-eye coordination skills being tested over and over in slightly different ways. What the Wii brings is gameplay that can work based on gross movement, large sweeps and turns and such (you don't actually have to stand up and flail around like an idiot for the Wiimote to work, at least depending on your settings, but it's hard not to.)

It's a different experience. You move around more, get a bit tired out, let someone else have a go or just sit back and egg them on, it's a bit more fun to watch- it's not a superior experience to other types of console play, but it is different enough that developers can start to explore and exploit it differently. Most of the good reviews for Wii games I hear have a similar line- it's not something you end up playing for 6 hours on end because it's that damn compelling, but it's something you can pick up every now and then and have some fun playing golf/blasting zombies/doing whatever the Hell it is you do in Wario Ware. In some ways it's returning to the older model of games that are less about playing to completion and more about playing off and on.

Yes, it's an accesible way for many people to play games, no doubt there, but here's the thing: all the people that started to play games thanks to this are really not playing any other games that are not these type of mini-games that use the wii mote. Put them a traditional controler and they may start to feel weird once more. In other words, it's a self contained market with no chance of expanding beyond that, Nintendo's way of "expanding" this is not by making a different type of game, is just by making a sequel to Wii sports, more of the same in other words. Other developers are jumping in the same bandwagon right there.

The console could use more diversity, but it's not like Madworld is the first ever non-casual Wii game. And frankly, the whole casual/hardcore divide perplexes me on a basic level. Truly if you're really a hardcore gamer, a fan of video games as a medium, that should mean you're capable of appreciating a well made game in any genre, even the minigame collection genre or the rudimentary sports simulator genre. It's not what a game is about that makes it good, and though we all have our preferences, it's silly for hardcore gamers to insist that their preferences actually translate into aesthetic superiority.

True to what you say about how stubborn some people are. I played wii sports and it is fun, but it's lasting appeal doesn't last that long. Also, it's way more fun to play it with more people, and not everyone has the time for that. Also, some of us truly just prefer to play games the traditional way, not to mention that many games build around a gimmick, in this case the use of the wii mote, sacrifice good gameplay for the sake of using this gimmick. If they really don't know how to put it for good use they should not use it at all.

And yes, Madworld is not the only non-sovelware title out there, but the fact that these titles are the very rare exception can't be denied. Don't blame others for pointing out this, blame Nintendo and other publishers for not caring about bring different games to the console. You also can't really blame some developers for ignoring the wii thanks to it's dated technology. Good graphics don't make a game good, but when the lack of proper tools end up breaking your game (Dead Rising for the Wii and it's limited ammout of enemies) then yeah, something is not right.

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