Jimmy Page, What's Your Problem?

 Pages 1 2 NEXT
 

Jimmy Page, What's Your Problem?

Why are rock stars so old fashioned when it comes to games like Rock Band and Guitar Hero?

Read Full Article

It does seem stupid. A game will never be a replacement for getting your backside to a place and rocking out to your favourite band, screaming along. Well, until we get to the whole VR thing. Even then, probably won't be the same.

Great article, and I agree, both series now have gotten me into music, and Rock Band itself got me to buy a guitar (Albeit I don't practice at all).

Not all musicians take this old fashioned approach to music video games; actually, I think Jimmy Page is the first musician I've heard take this stance. Still, he is completely and utterly wrong. I'm guessing that he saw a picture of someone playing a color, plastic guitar and thought to himself "parody" rather than "tribute" or "innovation." What the people who think this don't understand is that imitation is the best form of flattery; and in a way, it's kind of an advertisement for the source object.

You make an excellent point about reaching the next generation. However, I tend to think of music games as the first shock wave in the aftermath of the initial "ogod napster, our monies are gone now!" freak out that happened years earlier. Artists, including legends, are getting pissed off that the music itself isn't what draws people anymore.

Why would you buy a CD that only works in a CD player, when you can get an MP3? Why would you download an MP3 for $.99, when you can download it on Rock Band and play along?

It's all about cash flow, unfortunately. When the sense of propriety goes away from an art form like music, the art loses a bit of its meaning (and hence value). Like how a chef's recipe doesn't taste the same when you make it at home, or how your oil-paint landscape will never look quite as good as the one Bob Ross is showing you how to make. (Note: I'm not trying to say that Rock Band is teaching people music. Just that Rock Band devalues the original art in a way.)

Because it's their opinion.

good article. my thoughts exactly, except more well thought out and expressed lol.

shophius:
Because it's their opinion.

But we don't agree! We're entitled to whine!

Lithran:
It does seem stupid. A game will never be a replacement for getting your backside to a place and rocking out to your favourite band, screaming along.

I do that while I play Guitar Hero.

To an extent, I do agree with the rockstars. I mean, really, if you can 100% "Through the Fire and the Flames" on expert then you really need to start learning a real guitar.

Other than that, I agree near fully with you.

I know a bunch of people who play in a band and also like playing GH/RB. I've asked some of them if the games actually help them in any way, and aside from the furious strumming that comes along with the higher difficulties, there is really notheing to gain. The expriences are nothing alike, and the people who are good at it are also the ones who play games anyways. (It is kind of funny to see a band's lead guitar player fail horribly on easy)

I wonder how many of the musicians that are against GH/RB don't play videogames anyways.

The whole argument is ridiculous, and I really don't want to say anymore on the subject than this: Page and the Gallagher brothers feeling threatened by Rock Band has as much weight as Scorsese and Spielberg feeling threatened by YouTube.

A great article, and I agree with what you're saying. I suppose change is just a hard pill to swallow.

Great article, but consider this: These people are part of a rather older generation of music (Nickelback obviously excluded) The way they see it, is that the fact that more people are playing a music game controlled by a plastic guitar and a MIDI drum kit is essentially going to make them lazy to the extent they won't bother to get music lessons, hence the amount of musicians will slowly die out.

I know it sounds like a Chicken Little Sky is Falling scenario, but that's my two cents anyway.

Nobody ever had any complaints about Led Zepp stealing music, why does he feel entitled to whine about this? Yes Jimmy, we get it! This generation sucks and this used to be all fields. Now stop waving your cane and go back to bed.

If anything, the games will make people crave real instrument playing instead... You know, for people who aren't actually brain dead, like me. When I play GH, it makes me wish I played a real instrument and I'm thinking of taking lessons.

You do feel a different connection to music through music games, but Jimmy Page is so good at guitar that he probably doesn't have the ability to come down to a mortal's level and realize how we feel while playing a song.

Maybe someone should go to Jimmy Page and get him involved in making a music game that gets more and more complex with a real guitar plugged into it so you do actually learn how to play. Then he will have even more money and be able to buy the rest of castles in england.

Much as I was a huge Zeppelin fan in high school, and still respect Page & crew for all their contributions to rock music (on stage, in the studio, behind the console and the business side of things), this is hardly surprising.

Zep have always been album-oriented: they barely released any singles during their career (most notably, they never released "Stairway to Heaven"), they released one concert film of dubious quality while they were active, and they were notorious about not licensing songs for television, movies or commercials until very recently. So it took them over 30 years to get to that stage--they'll probably all be dead before their estate starts licensing songs for video games.

Fantastic article.

Also I thought it should be said (if it wasn't already) that not all old rockers are against Rock Band / Guitar Hero.

Joe Perry of Aerosmith supports it, if that wasn't obvious with the GH game.

I wonder if it's just that these musicians are not in touch with what it is these games are and how they operate. A lot of these people are very busy in their own personal world of music and money and being famous, and I get the feeling they really don't play or care for video games to begin with. Even if they're not that old, they get very stereotypically "parental" about games: they think they're a waste of time, ruin your social life, and drain you of energy you could be spending on something they consider more valuable.

Unless they stop disliking games in general, they're going to keep disliking music games. Especially music games, because these step on the boundaries of their own insular worlds. If they regarded games more highly, they'd be hard pressed to find complaints, as the article clearly points out.

Well, its insulting to guitarists that people who play these games actually think they can keep up (let alone play) real guitars with those who have already mastered them.

..imo, Jimmy Page hates GH because there isn't one single Led Zeppelin song that would sound.. or play well if it's supposed to fit a steady beat, or be broken into pseudo- grips. Even if you stripped it of all the things that happen in between the notes and the bars. So.. if it was made into a GH track anyway, it would be so horribly bad that some of the really, really, really bad tracks (that really do poison the minds of the youth :p - I mean, I enjoy GH, but I literally cringe at some of the reproductions of the original tracks in World Tour) would seem like a tribute to the artist next to it. Really - it would just be best to make covers, and not pretend that you're playing the real song. Thought that was some of the charm with the first GH - that you're a garage band, just playing covers (badly). :D

I personally really dislike Guitar Hero and Rock Band for the same reasons as Jimi Page and the rest of them. I agree with them also.
Besides, it's their opinion, why whine about it? I love vanilla ice cream and if someone else doesn't I'm not going to put him/her in the spotlight and execute them.

great article mr Endo, pretty aggressive at the start.

Its funny that while musicians also whinge and moan about these games, ever heard a friend say "i'll play real guitar thank you", high brow snotty nosed brat, moaning about the encroachment of us casual types into their medium and blah blah and how its below par because its not the real thing.

I've never heard a murderer bemoan manhunt because its not real. Funny that.

Draculafreak:
Well, its insulting to guitarists that people who play these games actually think they can keep up (let alone play) real guitars with those who have already mastered them.

Exactly.

Idiots who think they are good at a game think they can play a real guitar.

Same like people who play too many FPS games and think they can handle a real one.

Everyone complains about people thinking they can play guitar/drums for real because of their GH/RB skills, but you know I've never met anybody who actually thought that? I'm sure that they are out there, simply because if you look close enough at any group you'll find your unsavory characters, but it's not like they're so prevelant that real musicians have to constantly listen to a 14 yr. old who can 100% "Master of Puppets" on Expert call himself an "awesome guitar player."

Guitar Hero and Rock Band are games. The people who play them realize that they are games, and they are okay with that. Maybe they don't have time to learn to play a real instrument (that's why gaming is a hobby; you do it when you're not working for a living), or maybe they just don't want to learn how to play an instrument; it doesn't matter.

You don't hear the US military having hissy fits over Call of Duty do you? No. In fact, they capitalize on the fact that kids that love to play these games might want to shoot terrorists for real; it's time musicians followed suit and instead of whining about how these games are destroying music embraced them as a way to get people into music.

I think Jimmy Page takes offense because lately it seems that pretending to actually play music has taken a backseat to actually playing music.

Its just a bunch of stuck up elitists getting angry at people having fun, hah ironic that's basically the general feeling that most adults had to rock and rock when it first emerged.

I like singers who embrace guitar hero like Amanda Palmer.

Fursnake:
I think Jimmy Page takes offense because lately it seems that pretending to actually play music has taken a backseat to actually playing music.

I'm sorry, that's an utter load of bull. People play GH/RB for the same reason they go to Karaoke bars, concerts, clubs and music festivals: to have fun with friends, while finding some connection to the music they love, whether that's singing/air-guitaring along, or just listening and nodding their head along to the beat.

Show me one instance--just one--of GH players displacing the band who actually made the song, and I might start to take you seriously.

Halbyrd:

Fursnake:
I think Jimmy Page takes offense because lately it seems that pretending to actually play music has taken a backseat to actually playing music.

I'm sorry, that's an utter load of bull. People play GH/RB for the same reason they go to Karaoke bars, concerts, clubs and music festivals: to have fun with friends, while finding some connection to the music they love, whether that's singing/air-guitaring along, or just listening and nodding their head along to the beat.

Show me one instance--just one--of GH players displacing the band who actually made the song, and I might start to take you seriously.

I don't take me seriously most of the time, so you shouldn't either heh.

I still havent played any Guitar Hero or rockband games :D Nor do I think they are in any way a threat to music (whatever that means)

But that said, while we can harp on about these games being this generations walkman or napstar etc, at the heart of them is not a musical distribution system, but a colour matching rhythm game. You are not listening to music, you are playing a game. When viewed that way, the songs that are chosen are incidental, there to add a level of immersion to the game. Some musicians may not like the fact their their music has effectively been reduced, in the context of the game, to simply a series of alerts that help you push the right button at the right time.

If you take the walkman, napstar, radio etc & remove the music; what do you have left? Nothing.

If you take Guitar hero, & remove the classic rock music; what do you have left? A game that functions just as well but just doesnt have that pedigree edge to it. That is one reason I can see some musicians getting defensive about Guitar Hero & Rockband being championed as the future of musical consumption; the music is incidental & the game is the focus. The songs make the game better, but they dont make it work. Artists dont like to see the value or significance of their work diminished, which they perhaps see these games doing.

The infamous SCAMola:
Nobody ever had any complaints about Led Zepp stealing music, why does he feel entitled to whine about this? Yes Jimmy, we get it! This generation sucks and this used to be all fields. Now stop waving your cane and go back to bed.

Your post made me smile. Well said, sir.

Abedeus:

Draculafreak:
Well, its insulting to guitarists that people who play these games actually think they can keep up (let alone play) real guitars with those who have already mastered them.

Exactly.

Idiots who think they are good at a game think they can play a real guitar.

Same like people who play too many FPS games and think they can handle a real one.

I have never heard anyone make the claim that playing GH/RB means you can play the real thing. The only people I have ever heard voice that opinion is musicians claiming that gamers think that.

Comparing music games to real life music and instruments is like comparing Call of Duty to real life war.

Maet:
Page and the Gallagher brothers feeling threatened by Rock Band has as much weight as Scorsese and Spielberg feeling threatened by YouTube.

Brilliant! And well thought out point

Although as an aspiring musician I wouldn't be caught dead with a plastic guitar in my hands, thats just me though. I rather play a game, or practice guitar, not wasting time with a fake guitar in my hands, pretending.

Wait, Johnney Rotten is against RB/GH for wanting to learn to play real instruments. A guy who was accidentally hired for a band(whose bassist didn't know how to play) that influenced an innumerable amount of musicians in a genre know for angry teens who couldn't play their instruments.

Does this seem really ironic, or am I missing something?

 Pages 1 2 NEXT

Reply to Thread

Log in or Register to Comment
Have an account? Login below:
With Facebook:Login With Facebook
or
Username:  
Password:  
  
Not registered? To sign up for an account with The Escapist:
Register With Facebook
Register With Facebook
or
Register for a free account here