Come Together. Right Now.

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Come Together. Right Now.

The L4D boycott is seemingly over, but Sean Sands wonders if it was a step in the right direction, or a step back.

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I wish I could read this, but I get a nice 404 error.

Edit: And somehow I have the first post.

404, to bad, the tag line made me curious and the 404 made me wanna hunt down sean just so he could tell me what it says in person.

Is the first post scrolling down? Very weird.

Yeah, 404 has got me too. I'm curious about the article, though.

Sean's post seems to be dated tomorrow afternoon so something odd must be going on. First time I've found a 404 on this website...

kukuku ^^:
Sean's post seems to be dated tomorrow afternoon so something odd must be going on. First time I've found a 404 on this website...

That means he is in the future! Great scott do you know what this means? We've got to go back! Back to the future!

Edit: also every post just pushes down the article post. haha.

I think someone should pm a moderator. I would, but I don't know any.

Edit: It's a conspiracy I say!

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah :)

It's obviously a step back.. you can see by how the post is going further and futher back as we reply.

I guess we really aren't meant to know the future after all.

But while we're on the subject, I have no time for the L4D 2 boycotters. But seeing that the boycott is now apparently over, does that mean all the boycotters have decided that maybe they do want the game after all. Though perhaps all will become clear once we get to read this article.

MarsProbe:
I guess we really aren't meant to know the future after all.

But while we're on the subject, I have no time for the L4D 2 boycotters. But seeing that the boycott is now apparently over, does that mean all the boycotters have decided that maybe they do want the game after all. Though perhaps all will become clear once we get to read this article.

No, and it seems people really didn't understand what was going on at all.

Currently L4D is incredibly buggy. Very, very buggy. Versus, coop, survival, all buggy. There are game crushing and ending bugs that have persisted since launch that are most certainly not features. There are severe balance issues in all game modes. On top of this, there has been very little in terms of support or content for the game compared to TF2 after one years time.

Then, we find out some time later, that everything that they promised word for word (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQWylFmqnwM) that would be in L4D is not only going to be in L4D2 (a full priced game), but they promised the exact same things.

Note about the above youtube video. Both L4D and L4D2 are being talked about there, just at different times.

None of this would have been started if any of the following were true:

1. Promised content was being worked on for L4D instead of L4D2. I.E. Weapons, infected, and levels (they've given us two three levels in total).

2. L4D2 came out two years after L4D instead of one year after.

3. They fixed any of the numerous bugs that have existed in L4D since launch.

If any of these things were true, then people wouldn't have reacted in such a way about L4D2.

Well, if I know one thing it's that this article is not about the L4D2 boycott. It's about the ability to rally the gaming community to a cause they cared about, and to achieve a goal with a developer giant like Valve. The obvious question is: If we can achieve this as a gaming community, what else can we do? And why did this ability only display itself by discontent about a game, a game no one wanted because it seemed like the other game was Left 4 Dead. (Am I the first one to make that pun?)

Sorry if I'm spoiling your article, Sean, but I wouldn't want to see this going in the direction of pro-L4D2 versus anti-L4D2.

Perhaps the article will be available tomorrow at 8? Maybe we've entered a place where no light or sound can escape and the internet only barely reaches it by use of "pwnage". Perhaps it's just a mistake.

Hahahaha this is awesome. Best thread ever.

lets see if we can get sean's post on to the second page! that would be great!

LTK_70:
Well, if I know one thing it's that this article is not about the L4D2 boycott. It's about the ability to rally the gaming community to a cause they cared about, and to achieve a goal with a developer giant like Valve. The obvious question is: If we can achieve this as a gaming community, what else can we do? And why did this ability only display itself by discontent about a game, a game no one wanted because it seemed like the other game was Left 4 Dead. (Am I the first one to make that pun?)

Sorry if I'm spoiling your article, Sean, but I wouldn't want to see this going in the direction of pro-L4D2 versus anti-L4D2.

What goal did they achieve? Valve has done pretty much exactly what they said they would before the boycott even started. The only thing they managed to achieve is Valve, a company known for it's friendliness toward it's target consumers, took the time and money to bring the whiner leaders out to their company and show them, "See? Just like we said.. the day after the announcement"

Meanwhile, the second game has more preorders than the first. Yeah, massively effective boycott there.

So really, the boycott proved nothing. Get the same kind of response out of EA or Activision, then you will have proved something. All this did is waste a lot of people's time and give gamers a bad name.

I suggest we boycott Valve until they release Episode 3.

Cliff_m85:
I suggest we boycott Valve until they release Episode 3.

since i never really bothered to follow the l4d2 boycott i was wondering, do these boycotts include steam or is it only valve produced games?

swaki:

Cliff_m85:
I suggest we boycott Valve until they release Episode 3.

since i never really bothered to follow the l4d2 boycott i was wondering, do these boycotts include steam or is it only valve produced games?

Why not both? *shrugs*

Sean Sands:
Come Together. Right Now.

The L4D boycott is seemingly over, but Sean Sands wonders if it was a step in the right direction, or a step back.

Read Full Article

Report-Report-Report.
As humorous as this fail might be, the mods still need to know about it.

It's fantastic to see opinions are afoot before the actual article is even read; apparently all we need to start a conversation is a more or less ambiguous message on what the article is supposed to be about.

Credge:

Currently L4D is incredibly buggy. Very, very buggy. Versus, coop, survival, all buggy. There are game crushing and ending bugs that have persisted since launch that are most certainly not features. There are severe balance issues in all game modes. On top of this, there has been very little in terms of support or content for the game compared to TF2 after one years time.

Game crushing huh? I must admit I didn't get Left 4 Dead from it's launch; I bought it just when survival mode was introduced, so I can't really comment on bugs before that. However, I have played all three modes quite a bit since I bought it, and I have yet to notice any bugs that could be considered "game-crushing", or even half noticeable for that matter. There are a few hacks that my friend has shown me, but nothing that would make me turn my nose up at Valve in disgust. I'm not entirely sure where the line that distinguishes "balanced" and "challengin" begins and ends, but I've found overall that either side has a fair chance if they work together and strategically.

Actually, now that I think about it, the only bug that even comes close to to being called game crushing that I've encountered recently is one in Team Fortress 2, where the payload reached a certain point and wouldn't move after that. It only happened once, so I'm really not all that bothered by it.

OPT (On Probably the Topic): I actually do think Valve should have introduced all the new concepts they had announced to Left 4 Dead, rather than make a whole new game. While Valve has said that they intend to continue supporting L4D, they can't really expect to cater for two whole communities for both games; why would they continue to support the earlier (and arguably to-be-obselete) Left 4 Dead, when they could focus all resources on the supposedly superior sequel?

The boycott was supposed to draw attention to the fact that these are exactly the routes Valve intended to take all along, and should never have begun work on a sequel when they promised to support the original game which, I do admit, was largely ignored. In this sense the boycott, while a little overly-zealous in their condemnation, was a good way for the community (or a certain majority of it) to express their feelings in the matter. Valve has said that they like to listen carefully to the community, so the boycott was certainly the best way to get this message across.

There will, of course, be two factions in the impending war; the Left 4 Dead "Purists" ('There's only one real Left 4 Dead game!') and the Left 4 Dead 2 "Defenders" ('Left 4 Dead 2 is by far the better of the two, and anyone who says otherwise is just a Valve hater!').

Expect flame wars.

awesomepanda:
lets see if we can get sean's post on to the second page! that would be great!

even though i'm just a quiet observer mostly. i just gotta do my part. down you go!

Andronicus:
I actually do think Valve should have introduced all the new concepts they had announced to Left 4 Dead, rather than make a whole new game.

They have actually covered this issue in an interveiw, stating that the news weapons, maps and infected aren't the only changes, and that they are completely overhauling the A.I. to be more affective, and having worked on procedurally reacting A.I. myself, I understand that any major changes to these types of A.I. generally require a rework of the whole system, but such changes can drastically improve the way the system works.

Andronicus:
While Valve has said that they intend to continue supporting L4D, they can't really expect to cater for two whole communities for both games; why would they continue to support the earlier (and arguably to-be-obselete) Left 4 Dead, when they could focus all resources on the supposedly superior sequel?

They're already supporting 3 communities, not to mention the biggest digital retail/game community market available. Why would you not expect them to be willing/able to support the biggest retail/game community market available and 3 1/2 communities? (I say half because the support of L4D and L4D2 could be easily crossed over, not saying that they will release the same DLC for both, but that any significant advances can be copy/pasted where needed)

Andronicus:
There will, of course, be two factions in the impending war; the Left 4 Dead "Purists" ('There's only one real Left 4 Dead game!') and the Left 4 Dead 2 "Defenders" ('Left 4 Dead 2 is by far the better of the two, and anyone who says otherwise is just a Valve hater!').

Expect flame wars.

The same could be said of any sequel, and yet we don't have flame wars over whether Halo 3 or Halo ODST is better. Instead what we have are people who are willing to put money into ODST because they enjoy the franchise and trust the company to have put a good effort into it, and we have a community of those who are satisfied with their experience in Halo 3, and none of them have decided to boycot either to put it out of production just because they prefer the other. Somehow the Halo fans have become, in public caracateure, more mature than the Valve fans, and I find this deeply dissapointing. It's Valve. They've yet to let us down. Just put a little more trust in them.

EDIT: Whoa, my post is below Sean's... Does this make me first? o.O

As perhaps the first person to comment who's read the article... you'll never ever seen anything remotely like this from Activision. They just don't care enough, and they're sufficiently above it all.

That's right, they've above their customers. The consumer-base for them is so massive, that it just doesn't matter if what they do is "right" or "wrong". It's only seen as "gouging customers who expect better" by those customers - everyone else just says "Hey, this is kinda cool! New stuff! Only $10? Sweet!" Activision can and possibly will afford to lose the traditional, hardcore gaming market. And this is -only- an issue because they own a lot of companies and IP's we love.

That's my opinion, anyway, based on the market's shape right now, Kotick's personal behavior, and the mutilation of StarCraft 2 and Modern Warfare 2's PC multiplayer components.

--Fen

Edit: Oh, and regarding the example given - Left 4 Dead, I doubt I'll be purchasing L4D2. Not because of any sort of principle or as any kind of subvertive action, but just because I expect more of the same that was L4D1's gameplay. That, and it'll probably be censored to hell where I am, and I refuse to support a local industry which just lays down and accepts that kind of shit. Instead, I'll support some other nation's industry, if at all.

Cliff_m85:
I suggest we boycott Valve until they release Episode 3.

You're still complaining about Episode 3?

Hmm, I didn't really catch the point the author was trying to get across. Anyone care to give me a Reader's Digest version?

If games are art ... complaining about the product before its finished or that its too similar to any other product is kinda like telling Mozart that his songs wrong & he needs to drop the cannon.

If games are mechanisms for play ... then complaining about a reiteration of a successful mechanism is kinda like saying dont make Halo 2 or 3 Or Doom 2 or 3, Or Far Cry 2 or ...........

Fenixius:

That's my opinion, anyway, based on the market's shape right now, Kotick's personal behavior, and the mutilation of StarCraft 2 and Modern Warfare 2's PC multiplayer components.

What they doing to MW2's multiplayer ?

This thread seems a bit tits up..

All I can say is, ever heard of the Sims? It's one of the most popular PC games and they do that sort of thing ALL THE TIME. Yet no one boycotts it. I think the rest of the world just needs to take a huge chill pill because economically speaking, if you like the game... what's wrong with more of the same?

So the article is in the centre of the page, and time travelling Scot has given a vague title..and I'm now stuck in the FUTURE

HALP...SARAH CONNOR!

OT: Intresting...But I don't get what the article's about...you don't like Boycotts? What's that got to do with Coming together (Bowchicka wow Wow!)?

Hithlain:
All I can say is, ever heard of the Sims? It's one of the most popular PC games and they do that sort of thing ALL THE TIME. Yet no one boycotts it. I think the rest of the world just needs to take a huge chill pill because economically speaking, if you like the game... what's wrong with more of the same?

The thing is, The Sims 2 wasn't announced less than a year after The Sims. Yes, there were expansion packs up the wazoo, but a full-blown sequel didn't occur until a few years later. The fact that there's a sequel to Left4Dead so soon after the original is one of the major factors that caused the boycott.

I don't really know a whole lot about this boycott, so I may be wrong here.

GrinningManiac:
OT: Intresting...But I don't get what the article's about...you don't like Boycotts? What's that got to do with Coming together (Bowchicka wow Wow!)?

Yes, it's a bit misleading, isn't it? I thought he was referring to the new downloadable content for The Beatles Rock Band.

awesomepanda:
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah :)

That my freind is a 40fail

Come Together. Right Now. Help Me Move Furniture.

Well, at least some boycotts work, or whatever. Still don't like the idea of getting a game and having a better version come out a year later for $60 more.

"Whether the boycott efforts actually affected release schedules for Left 4 Dead's DLC or Valve's internal pricing plans can be a point for later debate, but this ordeal has either laid a productive groundwork for future developer/fan interactions and dispute resolution or become the exception that proves the rule."

That does not mean what you think it means.

"The exception that proves the rule" applies to situations like this:
"Medium armor proficiency allows a rogue to wear medium or lighter armor without a dexterity penalty".

This exception proves that there is a rule that a rogue without medium armor proficiency that wears medium armor will suffer a dexterity penalty.

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