Zero Punctuation: Left 4 Dead 2 & New Super Mario Bros Wii

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Bowser vs tank: Bowser--Tanks susceptible to repeated firing from normal bullets, while Bowser more or less requires Lava, bombs, and turtle shells flying up and knocking his flying bucket thing to fall into lava. And even then he doesn't die, just comes back after a few tries and does it all over again. (Unless a horde of Mr Game and Watch come around, then Bowser is screwed. Cookies for reference.)

The L4D2 bit was way off base honestly. That's how the game would seem if you were never really into the first one. And if you weren't, why do you care about the second? L4D2 is about appealing to the fans of the first game. If you liked the first game, you'll buy 2 and never go back to 1, because the changes are too far reaching as to make the first game feel unplayable again. Environment design is better, the SI add a whole new array of mechanics to deal with and play as in versus, the two new modes (Realism and Scavenge) are a blast, and the melee weapons change a lot of the game that you don't initially realize.

The only downer to L4D2 is that Rochelle is the worst character Valve has ever created. Ellis is adorable, Nick is awesome, Coach is kinda funny, and Rochelle has the character depth of a thimble.

Slaingod:

thecaptainof:

I have to admit that I'd be tempted by the Mario thing if it were possible to control it with the proper control pad instead of the waggle stick, but otherwise no.

Actually you just turn the "waggle stick" sideways and use it like the old school Nintendo controllers.

Ehhh, that's not really a lot better. They could at least give the option. I've got a Virtual Console game (something from the Master System) that can be controlled by turning the waggle stick horizontally like that, but it's a bit too narrow to hold comfortably so I just use the control pad.

I don't mind the TF2 extra, yes where is Episode 3!!

I have yet to play L4D2 as I played L4D and didn't like it.............. and this review didn't convince me to change my mind.

On the other hand, as much as I dislike me Wii, I loved Super Mario Bros on my Gameboy and actually want New Super Mario Bros.

achilleas.k:
Wow. Yahtzee's certainly mad at Nintendo. Mad enough that I didn't quite get if L4D2 is actually good or not. I've been on the fence for buying it for a few weeks. I played the demo, it was fun. I didn't own the first one but I was already under the impression that they are very much alike.
So for someone who didn't have the original, is L4D2 worth buying? Yahtzee played a multiplayer game so I guess that's at least a few points+.

I'd say it is worth buying. But you should probably read the reveiw of it here on the Escapist. Or look up some reviews from other websites.

i think one of my major problems with L4D2 is that it came out only a year after the original. normally a sequel comes out 2-3 years after the first game. It has better graphics, new maps, new gameplay etc and revives that games community. But i also thought L4D was overpriced considering what you got.

Bowser.
He got them spikes.

Alfador_VII:
Nice ep, but I think L4D2 is better than he says, definitely worth buying, on PC of course :)

It sounded like he played the 360 version playing with a kid from Alaska and the lag issue and yes it's definitely worth buying on PC.

Hahaha, a cheeseburger spider! \o/

It's been three years since the Wii was released, and I think the number of actually good games for it can still be counted on fingers.

Maybe it's made Nintendo accountants happy, but it's going to come off as a damp fart in the history of video games.

response to the bowser vs tank thing I think bowser would win, how many times has mario shoved bowser to his doom in magma? HE KEEPS COMING BACK!

Boswer vs Tank?
Better question, "who fucking cares?"
Why don't you just ask "Campbell's Soup vs a Porcupine".

Change the titles to:
L4D: melee weapons edition
Super Mario Bros 3..... o wait that already exists.

1) Much more detailed review than I was expecting for a video on two games in the same time budget, and I welcome back Yahtzee's voice. Good insight, especially on the overworked numbers deal.

2) L4D2 does not rely on online multiplayer to be any more or less worth playing. You get the same stuff as in co-op with the extra benefit of being able to be an asshole to some prepubescent hobo in Alaska, and then get him killed by feeding him to zombies. It's like a watered-down hybrid of Saw and 30 Days of Night.

3) Bowser would win because he has way cooler toys and can make basically anything explode.

4)I'd be as mad as Yahtzee, too, for the same dual reasons of having to review Nintendo's 20 years of wasted potential and for having to review a game that's been censored exclusively in his part of the world just because the government decides to treat zombies like sentient, self-aware people and not just extremely lively punching bags with gangrene (which is a major driving part of their marketability in today's post-Shaun-of-the-Dead social context). Besides, Yahtzee's vitriol is the main thing fueling his comedy, which in turn fuels his analysis of video games.

Yeah. my whole post here doesn't really say anything new and interesting. Just my 2c on an excellent review.

Aulwynd:
I can't agree any more. L4D2 is just an L4D expansion, nothing more. Its just a a bunch of new maps, a few useless melee weapons and thats it. And about New Super Mario Bross Wii, well, its a ripoff from New Super Mario bross DS wich is a ripoff from Super Mario 3, so its not a big surprise that it dont have anything new(as the title says, btw)

I'm assuming you have actually played L4D2, correct? Because over 20 maps, melee weapons that are anything but useless, a completely new setting, 2 new game modes and an improved AI director would tell me that you probably played for 5 minutes before realising that either A: You aren't very good at it, B: You don't have any friends to play with, or C: You aren't very good and don't have any friends to play with.

Also, how can a Mario game possibly rip off another Mario game? It makes no sense. It's called a sequel, they sometimes do them to extend a series. It's a very complex idea that I'm not sure you completely understand.

I was actually a little worried that that was going to be the case with L4D2v3 - that is would simply be more like an expansion than an actual game. After playing the demo months ago I felt pretty much the same way; new campaigns, new weapons and characters with new(but ultimately unimportant)back stories. It was new and shiny and made my processor work hard but there wasn't really any distinguishable upgrade from the original (except, I guess, the new melee weapons, which could have easily fit into an expansion), and by that merit I don't feel that it's worth the price of a full game. I felt the same way about Rainbow Six Vegas 2, Assassin's Creed 2, and (this one especially)Modern Warfare 2. The graphics are updated a lot but gameplay remains relatively untouched. Nothing particularly new is added that warrants an entirely new game besides the graphical enhancement that couldn't just be stapled on as an addon.

GTAIV, as much as I ignore it in favor of it's much better little brother, Saints Row 2, actually does expansions correctly. Rockstar made two expansions to their game that, combined, are close to the size of the original campaign, but instead of releasing them as an entire new game, they remained expansions - They don't add enough new content to call for a whole separate game. And when I think about, I believe Rockstar did slightly touch up the graphics for The Ballad of Gay Tony.

So thanks for confirming my suspicions, Yahtzee.

cball11:
Huh. You know, i don't usually like when he does two games in one review, but there was a surprising amount of useful information in this one. I'm actually interested in New Super Mario Bros. Wii now.

My buddy owns a Wii and bought Mario. I must say, it is the most fun I've had with a Wii since, um, Wii Sports. 4 player is hard at first (as Yahzee points out), but, as you get better, you can start playing as a team and bounce off of each others heads to reach high places (to collect big coins).

And as for the pit complaints well, this is the easiest Mario game for that as far as I'm concerned. If in multiplayer and you're about to fall into a pit, press the 1(?) button to turn into a bubble and float gently to safety.

And I'd say it's a cross between Mario 3 (best Mario ever) and Mario World (which was okay).

To answer your question at the end of the credts: "Bowser vs. Tank: Who Would win"

It's a tough choice. Bowser has fire which would kill the Tank at some point without question. But the Tank is probably faster and stronger and would probably infect Bowser turning him into an infected as well. Tough call... but I'm going with Bowser if he's using the magic he has in some games and I'm going with Tank if Bowser is not using any magic from whatever games he does have magic.

I loved the new names for L4D; nearly wet myself when I heard "Left 4 Dead Springfield 30 ought 6." Great episode, reviewing two games in a single go is a nice change. Can't always happen, obviously, but it's a nice way to tack off two games that weren't large enough for their own review. Bravo, Yahtzee.

Great review. Got a chuckle out of the end credits as well.

Interesting...Yahzee hates multiplayer (Modern Warefare 2) but will happily sit down and play Left 4 Dead 2. Ah well, I liked it but then I never played the first game.

L4D2 look like an add-on?

Where is HL3?

SMB Wii is the same old game?

Whats this? The audio version of Reddit? Bravo Yatzee, not only do you not review games anymore, but you do it in pairs now.

I don't get all the New SMB bitching. Galaxy 2's on the way, as is a second Zelda and a second Metroid. That's quite a bit more than a nintendo system's seen in the last 2 generations. The 2 Toads corner-cutting was of course cheap, but I've spent about a half an hour with the game and I've walked away with 2 things: it's awesome and it's bitch-ass hard.

As for the Left 4 Dead sequel, I couldn't tell ya. It's been a while since I was interested in a 4-level video game. Like 24 years.

Bogulmon:

I'm assuming you have actually played L4D2, correct? Because over 20 maps, melee weapons that are anything but useless, a completely new setting, a new game mode and an improved AI director would tell me that you probably played for 5 minutes before realising that either A: You aren't very good at it, B: You don't have any friends to play with, or C: You aren't very good and don't have any friends to play with.

Also, how can a Mario game possibly rip off another Mario game? It makes no sense. It's called a sequel, they sometimes do them to extend a series. It's a very complex idea that I'm not sure you completely understand.

good to know that 5=20, each section of a map is not a map. 20 weapons, a few new enemies and some minor AI and graphics improvements and one new game mode. I dont see how this justifies a $50 game.

Dude, Google is ALWAYS on the ball!

R
www.web-anonymity.se.tc

As unfocussed as his rants often turn out to become as of late, I have to agree with his opinion on the Mario game. "This shit will not fly!" is about as perfect as it gets regarding a summary of a game from a company that's deleted the words 'innovation' and 'creativity' from its vocabulary.

funguy2121:
I don't get all the New SMB bitching. Galaxy 2's on the way, as is a second Zelda and a second Metroid. That's quite a bit more than a nintendo system's seen in the last 2 generations. The 2 Toads corner-cutting was of course cheap, but I've spent about a half an hour with the game and I've walked away with 2 things: it's awesome and it's bitch-ass hard.

As for the Left 4 Dead sequel, I couldn't tell ya. It's been a while since I was interested in a 4-level video game. Like 24 years.

"The 2 Toads corner-cutting was of course cheap,"? Why? The princess has been kidnapped, who did you expect Nintendo to use? Create new characters? Use Luigi's elusive girlfriend?

He didn't really complain about L4D2, so doesn't that mean he liked it?
I'm glad he tossed in that bit about Episode 3, though. I've been saying that for the last 9 months: where the hell is it? At least Episode 2 had a trailer a year after Episode 1; now it's been two years and we can't get even a measly screenshot?

Sonicron:
As unfocussed as his rants often turn out to become as of late, I have to agree with his opinion on the Mario game. "This shit will not fly!" is about as perfect as it gets regarding a summary of a game from a company that's deleted the words 'innovation' and 'creativity' from its vocabulary.

If you want a different game than Mario, well then... play a different game than Mario.

I like the new Mario Bros Wii better than the old Nintendo games for a few reasons, the biggest of which being better control. I have no trouble getting Mario to do what I want him to (other than throw stuff upwards *sniff*), and the ability to recover via wall jumps is excellent. I don't like that I have to waggle the Wiimote to do certain things, but beyond that, I have no complaints regarding control.

It's mostly more of the same, but it's a sameness that is welcome and has been improved upon. Level design is excellent and the boss battles are some of the most fun I've had in a game in years. They easily put previous Mario boss fights to shame.

I have not tried the multiplayer yet, and don't really feel compelled to do so. It's a nifty feature that might be interesting, but Mario seems like it should be single player given its format. It feels like they'd just get in each others way, and reviews of the game seem to support this.

cordeos:

good to know that 5=20, each section of a map is not a map. 20 weapons, a few new enemies and some minor AI and graphics improvements and one new game mode. I dont see how this justifies a $50 game.

In any other game, each map would count as a map. Just because they run into each other, doesn't make them one map.

Why was it cheap to use 2 pallet-swap characters for players 3 and 4? The same reason it was cheap to use pallet-swap characters in the Mortal Kombat games and give all the characters the exact same fighting moves except for specials and finishers.

Relax, take a deep breath, and realize that I was actually defending the game.

As for lag; I'm sure the Yahtzee's computer, being a big black monolith built by dwarfs from middle earth, has enough mushroom and star power to actually be a dedicated server while gaming on it. I'm also sure that there are options to filter people out by ping and location.

funguy2121:
I don't get all the New SMB bitching. Galaxy 2's on the way, as is a second Zelda and a second Metroid. That's quite a bit more than a nintendo system's seen in the last 2 generations.

The problem is that it's been seen already. Your post is suicidal.
As in, it kills it's own point by containing the words "second" and the number 2 in it.

Imagine Valve or someone working like this. Now imagine 20 Left 4 Dead titles that have minor improvements like L4D2. Maybe even less so.

How long could it go on before someone finally bitchslaps them? And someone should slap Nintendo, while I'm at it. Maybe even find a hobo who has the balls to be creative and insert a cheeseburger-spider into a game.

Good review, Yahtzee. I really like New Super Mario Bros Wii, but you made some excellent points. The character selection could have been much better. Then again, since I'm almost always player 1, I'm usually stuck playing as Mario instead of Luigi. Also, the game does take most of its content from previous Mario titles. Also, the co-op makes the game a lot harder. Players can sabotage each other without even trying. As a matter of fact, I think the single player mode was too easy. Super Mario World was much harder. However, the game is not bad. I guess some people like things that are familiar, though.

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