Kratos

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Kratos

Kratos is like a car wreck you just can't look away from.

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You weren't supposed to relate to the Young Ones?

And here I thought Vivian and I shared so much in common...

And I guess the explanation for Kratos' being a dick is that he feels resentment towards the Gods for not ridding him of his nightmares. He's still angry at himself, but he projects that anger on his surroundings, always looking for a reason to kill.

Then of course, not only is this a bit weak, but they try to rub it away by constantly trying to make the gods seem like bigger douchebags. And then it comes to debate: Are the Gods the bigger douchebags because they act out of selfishness to gain whatever they want, oppressing humans and titans alike (even other gods in some cases) if they disobey, or is Kratos the bigger douchebag for trying to find reasons to kill as many people as possible?

My opinion is that the Gods are bigger douchebags. You don't blame a mad dog for killing your family, you blame the guy who let the dog loose (A reference I'm sure many will understand)

I still don't like it how they try to force it down our throats that the gods are the biggest douchebags though.

No comments reply? Sadface.

Never played the God Of War series, that's the problem with console exclusives. So most PlayStation fans have probably never played the Gears Of War series.

Yeah... this is why the people Kratos and Batman want to Rip out intestains/beat the crap out of all are much more interesting then the people we are suppose to root for. Zues is a power hungry king that wants to avoid the mistakes of his father to mantain his power. The Joker is a insane clown who insanity is only matched by his randomness in his actions. This might be why they decided to

LordCuthberton:
No comments reply? Sadface.

Never played the God Of War series, that's the problem with console exclusives. So most PlayStation fans have probably never played the Gears Of War series.

I own a 360 and I think I'd prefer having God of War over Gears of War.

I really do like Extra Punctuation. It helps flesh out Yahtzee's points of view, for one, and adds some suspense for the next day's ZP.

I'm with furburt here: the Gods are big ol' d-bags. kratos just wants revenge on them and will stop at nothing - including killing women, innocents, etc - to get there. Granted, this is selfish, but the gods royally screwed him over, and most people would be miffed if they did to them what they did to Kratos.

from all the trailers Ive seen of god of war 3 Ive started rooting for the gods, I played the hell out of the first god of war but never got around to the 2nd since my ps2 looks like shit on my hd set. Kratos really seems like just insanity incarnate by this point, altho I am looking forward to seeing him eat baby jesus in god of war 4... or maybe it will turn out that one of the woman he has sex with in the mini game is mary and hes really jesus's father. The next game could be a buddy picture type game, with jesus being all pussy trying to keep kratos from killing the world because it stubbed his toe.

HollywoodH17:
I really do like Extra Punctuation. It helps flesh out Yahtzee's points of view, for one, and adds some suspense for the next day's ZP.

I'm with furburt here: the Gods are big ol' d-bags. kratos just wants revenge on them and will stop at nothing - including killing women, innocents, etc - to get there. Granted, this is selfish, but the gods royally screwed him over, and most people would be miffed if they did to them what they did to Kratos.

.....

HollywoodH17:
I'm with furburt here

.....

HollywoodH17:
furburt

I must say that I am deeply offended.

I generally agree with this article, but feel that the Gods get off rather easily in the whole ordeal. They're the ones who recruited Kratos to kill Ares (why they couldn't do it themselves, who knows..) and then basically said, "Yeah, we said we'd wipe away those nightmares, but actually we can't. Thanks anyways!" Then he becomes the God of War, and they realize "Oh shit, the God of War may be a little too ambitious (what a shock!) and now we have to strip him then kill him!" He has every right to be pissed and want revenge, and I'm not sure if Spartans are trained in anything OTHER than killing everyone in their way.

Still, Kratos did start to become a parody of himself in GoW2 and it was cemented in GoW3. He seemed a little too-eager to kill and seemed to lose sight of why he started on this crazy journey (from GoW) in the first place. It was nice to see how the trilogy ended, but I was in no hurry to play through the game again once I was done and promptly mailed my copy back to Gamefly.

Man, i love the Young Ones.
OT: Kratos is awesome, but i do question his motives sometimes. I mean, he got revenge, great, but did he have to continue beign a dick to everythign in GOW2? He should of been happy as a God. Sheeesh talk about power hungry.

HollywoodH17:
I really do like Extra Punctuation. It helps flesh out Yahtzee's points of view, for one, and adds some suspense for the next day's ZP.

I'm with furburt here: the Gods are big ol' d-bags. kratos just wants revenge on them and will stop at nothing - including killing women, innocents, etc - to get there. Granted, this is selfish, but the gods royally screwed him over, and most people would be miffed if they did to them what they did to Kratos.

Its a bloody good thing they screwed him over because he was being stupid. If you see at the start of God of War 2 because Kratos was a former Spartan he was helping them win every single battle they were in thus making them an unstoppable force which would take over the world given time and leave only Spartans, Zeus didnt want this to happen and so killed Kratos to stop him being a dick to everyone but his own country. So in retrospective Kratos is a selfish dick and deserved to be drained off all his power in my opinion.

This does not however stop me from enjoying his adventure to destroy all of Mount Olympus like the manical son of a bitch he is.

Very good points about Kratos. I'd never tried to compare him to Batman before, fearing some sort of universal nerd-driven quantum collapse. But it's a valid comparison, and well-put.

I agree there's not much left to develop on Kratos now except for how much blood he can splatter onto the screen.

Off-Topic: Damn Hub you've gotten shafted on the deal there i say you kill him.

Hubilub:

HollywoodH17:
I really do like Extra Punctuation. It helps flesh out Yahtzee's points of view, for one, and adds some suspense for the next day's ZP.

I'm with furburt here: the Gods are big ol' d-bags. kratos just wants revenge on them and will stop at nothing - including killing women, innocents, etc - to get there. Granted, this is selfish, but the gods royally screwed him over, and most people would be miffed if they did to them what they did to Kratos.

.....

HollywoodH17:
I'm with furburt here

.....

HollywoodH17:
furburt

I must say that I am deeply offended.

Oh Christ. That's what I get for hastily reading a few posts and trying to remember which of the forum Gods that I try to emulate posted something. Sorry >.<

But surely this is the fate of every (anti-)hero character that doesn't die once they have achieved the aim of their initial motivation for going down their path (& by die I mean in a finite way not going to the underworld only to kick more ass on the way out again)? It's the message of pretty much every revenge story I can think of that once redemption/revenge etc is complete, the world keeps spinning and leaves the protagonist unable to do anything but carry on, since there is no other path open to them. The blind desire for vengeance, or fighting crime by criminal acts etc, leading us to become the monster we hunted. Resolution only comes with death, because until then there will always be another day, always another opponent, always another excuse to use as a reason for continuing, even if continuing is the excuse. So while it's unfortunate to see Kratos etc become parodies of themselves as their saga is forced to continue, that's the fate of every character for whom the world does not end with the conclusion of the first story arc.

I've never played through much of any God of War game enough to derive any of the story out of it (a consequence of which results in my mind always linking the name Kratos to Tales of Symphonia before remembering "oh yeah he's the God of War guy).

Anywho Yahtzee's analysis seems pretty accurate but games have proved us time and again that you don't really need a great story and characters to make a game interesting. It certainly helps and in some games you really do need to have good characters and story for it to work. I've only played a little of the first two and the combat was fun enough that I'm happy with Kratos being Batman with an effection for overkill.

Hubilub:

HollywoodH17:
I really do like Extra Punctuation. It helps flesh out Yahtzee's points of view, for one, and adds some suspense for the next day's ZP.

I'm with furburt here: the Gods are big ol' d-bags. kratos just wants revenge on them and will stop at nothing - including killing women, innocents, etc - to get there. Granted, this is selfish, but the gods royally screwed him over, and most people would be miffed if they did to them what they did to Kratos.

.....

HollywoodH17:
I'm with furburt here

.....

HollywoodH17:
furburt

I must say that I am deeply offended.

HA! Thats hilarious.

Back on topic: I agree. I can't really look at Kratos seriously anymore. All while playing the games, the same thought of "why is he doing this if he already kind of got his revenge" kept poping into my mind. I know he had nightmares, but is that really a reason to murder everything that ever lived, and in some cases re-murder dead things?

Torque669:

HollywoodH17:
I really do like Extra Punctuation. It helps flesh out Yahtzee's points of view, for one, and adds some suspense for the next day's ZP.

I'm with furburt here: the Gods are big ol' d-bags. kratos just wants revenge on them and will stop at nothing - including killing women, innocents, etc - to get there. Granted, this is selfish, but the gods royally screwed him over, and most people would be miffed if they did to them what they did to Kratos.

Its a bloody good thing they screwed him over because he was being stupid. If you see at the start of God of War 2 because Kratos was a former Spartan he was helping them win every single battle they were in thus making them an unstoppable force which would take over the world given time and leave only Spartans, Zeus didnt want this to happen and so killed Kratos to stop him being a dick to everyone but his own country. So in retrospective Kratos is a selfish dick and deserved to be drained off all his power in my opinion.

This does not however stop me from enjoying his adventure to destroy all of Mount Olympus like the manical son of a bitch he is.

Well remember that they tricked him into killing a freaking god in the first game by making him think they would take away his guilt. Being gods they must have fully known that it was because of that Kratos wanted to kill Ares and nothing else.

And I don't know about you, but that would have made me pretty dang passive aggressive myself.

Hubilub:
[snip]

Didn't you hear? You and Furburt are officially all one entity due to a little scientific mishap.

OT: Very good as usual, I seem to prefer the Extra Punctuation to the Zero Punctuation probably because Yahtzee gets more realm to explain his opinion shown in the Zero Punctuation episode further. Admittedly, I haven't actually played any of the God of War games, but I liked the article nonetheless.

HollywoodH17:
snip

Don't worry, we all make mistakes.

You better watch your back tonight...

Interesting the way you compared him to Batman. And of course you are right.
I haven't played any of the God of War series myself, but having just looked up the plot for all three games just now, it definitely seems that Kratos has hit a brick wall in terms of character development- he's more of a cliche now he has no real purpose (aside from the whole killing thing).

Torque669:

HollywoodH17:
I really do like Extra Punctuation. It helps flesh out Yahtzee's points of view, for one, and adds some suspense for the next day's ZP.

I'm with furburt here: the Gods are big ol' d-bags. kratos just wants revenge on them and will stop at nothing - including killing women, innocents, etc - to get there. Granted, this is selfish, but the gods royally screwed him over, and most people would be miffed if they did to them what they did to Kratos.

Its a bloody good thing they screwed him over because he was being stupid. If you see at the start of God of War 2 because Kratos was a former Spartan he was helping them win every single battle they were in thus making them an unstoppable force which would take over the world given time and leave only Spartans, Zeus didnt want this to happen and so killed Kratos to stop him being a dick to everyone but his own country. So in retrospective Kratos is a selfish dick and deserved to be drained off all his power in my opinion.

This does not however stop me from enjoying his adventure to destroy all of Mount Olympus like the manical son of a bitch he is.

I have to slash-disagree. If you know that there's a dude somewhere in the bar with a pistol and a bad temper, don't you go out of your way to be nice to everyone in the bar that night? Or do you anger everyone to find out who has the pistol? I submit the former is more reasonable. Zeus knew what he was getting into when he shook up that hornets' nest.

HollywoodH17:
I'm with furburt here: the Gods are big ol' d-bags. kratos just wants revenge on them and will stop at nothing - including killing women, innocents, etc - to get there. Granted, this is selfish, but the gods royally screwed him over, and most people would be miffed if they did to them what they did to Kratos.

Not played GoW (don't own a PS3, and never truely entered my radar), but I'd just like to point out that the gods always were total douches. Dionysus was probably the best, but that was because he was pretty much drunk all the time. If you ever look at Hera and Zeus, then you'll notice that Zeus goes around and sleeps with anything that moves (though not always a requirement) and Hera punishes them for Zeus' actions. Heracles went through all kinds of rubish because of just this.

There's a line in the Iliad which has Zeus saying that the mortals blame the gods for all the wrongs that happen to them, which just goes to show that, in Greek times, they didn't seem to get on too well. Sure, some were more protective than others (Athene was halfway-decent, and Aphrodite was rubbish at fighting but got blamed for all the troubles romance and love caused), but most of the time they just seemed to never get on with mortals, and vise-versa.

Besides, according to myth, without the titan Prometheus, we would never have gotten fire, and Zeus punished him for giving us it. /Greek lesson-slash-opinion.

OT: Interesting article. Always nice to see opinions on characters (something I feel a game really needs to explore to be truely great).

I wonder how his space game is coming along?

Oh, and this may be better fodder for a new thread, but I feel it has a basic connection to the subject matter at hand.

Isn't God of War, as a trilogy, supposed to explain the connection between the end of Greek mythology, and the beginning of Western religion? When Kratos kills literally everyone, and then releases hope to the people, isn't he slaying the Greek idea of polytheism and allowing people to form their own religious system, outside of the reach of the now-dead asshole Gods?

I've always gotten that gist since the first game, when viewing the tapestries in the Temple of Pandora.

Irridium:
snip

You know how some people drink to forget their problems?

Killing is Kratos' alcohol.

HollywoodH17:
Oh, and this may be better fodder for a new thread, but I feel it has a basic connection to the subject matter at hand.

Isn't God of War, as a trilogy, supposed to explain the connection between the end of Greek mythology, and the beginning of Western religion? When Kratos kills literally everyone, and then releases hope to the people, isn't he slaying the Greek idea of polytheism and allowing people to form their own religious system, outside of the reach of the now-dead asshole Gods?

I've always gotten that gist since the first game, when viewing the tapestries in the Temple of Pandora.

There is a theory about that.

Namely that Kratos becomes ruler of the earth.

Then Jesus kicks his ass.

World saved.

I watched the GoW 3 video walkthrough series on youtube, just so I can see how the story will develop, or rather, if it will take any direction other than the knee-jerk start, and I was thoroughly disappointed. I wasn't familiar with the first or second game in this series prior to the third coming out and the escapist thus mentioning its predecessors, so here's the deal. Those sitcoms Yahtzee mentions have been successful because they're a mockery of existing shows. Because the audience doesn't take the characters seriously. Thus the only way I could enjoy a story like GoW 3's is to just eat popcorn and watch all the blood and guts getting spilled left and right mindlessly and the beautifully rendered scenery. I'm not saying that's beneath me, or that I've never done it, what I'm saying is, not taking Kratos seriously just doesn't work, hence why GoW3 doesn't work for me.

HollywoodH17:
Oh, and this may be better fodder for a new thread, but I feel it has a basic connection to the subject matter at hand.

Isn't God of War, as a trilogy, supposed to explain the connection between the end of Greek mythology, and the beginning of Western religion? When Kratos kills literally everyone, and then releases hope to the people, isn't he slaying the Greek idea of polytheism and allowing people to form their own religious system, outside of the reach of the now-dead asshole Gods?

I've always gotten that gist since the first game, when viewing the tapestries in the Temple of Pandora.

You're reading way too much into it. You were just supposed to ogle at the scenery and the gore.

Mr. Croshaw, I have to disagree with you. The Kratos of the first and the Kratos of the second game are two quite different characters. Same person, yes, but different characters. The Gods of the Greek mythologies were static in character themselves, displaying nothing at all by way of personal growth. They were what they were and it couldn't be changed. Only the human characters ever showed any variability, due of course to their mortality. You tend to evolve and adapt a lot better when you aren't immortal, or worse, tied to and forced to embody a concept. And yet, there were plenty of characters who started human in the myths and later became gods themselves. These characters lost that evolving potential as soon as they attained godhood. See Heracles and Ganymede.

Kratos then. Kratos was a dude and Ares, god of being a royal fuckhead, tricks him into killing his family. Why? 'Cause he's a dick. Kratos, now suicidal, wracked with guilt, sad, and vengeful, like any human would be, kills him and takes his place. Thus ends the life of Kratos, the human male. Thus begins the existence of Kratos, the God of War. If Kratos were still human, this wouldn't have done anything for the guy. His family would still be dead. You get revenge by killing blokes, but not closure. But, being a god, and now tied to the essence of war, the flimsy human concepts of loss and mourning have been entirely overwritten with the unbending and irrational godly concepts of posturing and fucking around so he doesn't try to end himself out of boredom. Now, when Zeus gets all bent and tells Kratos to fuck off, Kratos the human would no doubt have just fallen back and accepted it since he would have been hollowed out and unfulfilled, but as a god, his only rational response is indignant outrage and an entirely shortsighted explosion of "fuck you dad, I'm going Titan on your Olympian ass!" Makes perfect sense in context.

As to why he stopped caring about all the mortal people? Dude. Since when do gods give a flying golden chariot pulling shit about mortals? You say incongruous character development, I say most sensible possible character development.

And, shit, I've never even played the bloody games. All I know about them is what you've said about them.

Haven't played any of the God of War series, so can't really comment on Kratos, but one of the things that keeps Batman interesting is that sometimes, under some writers, you get hints that he realizes he's a dick, that he's as crazy as the Joker in his own way, and that's part of what keeps driving him -- because so long as he's the Batman, he's got some self-justification. Once he gives that up, well.. he's just a dick with money. I mean, you don't see it often. Usually the self-righteous, puritanical armor is so thick you could bust Superman's fist on it. But every one in a while....

"I'm the god-damned Batman!"

That was really good info Liked the young one referance.

raaa my family's dead now you dieee
raaaaaa i'm still angry about that graaahhh
aaaaaarrrgh i'm still so...angry...so now everyone must diiie

hey i think we can all relate to that =} it's straight from the core human instinct

Cannot say I am not with Yahtzee on this one. Kratos has truly become single minded but that is not a bad thing. And true, not every game character has to be related to an every day average joe but there are sometimes when I WANT to be a dick. Kain from the Legacy Of Kain series completely buttfucked his universe from the first game and he wasn't someone you relate to.

If you ask me, the Gods brought this to themselves. They convinced Kratos to kill Ares and then they go 'Thank you but the nightmares won't go away'. They told him 'go get this and that and this

and then it blew in their face, if you know what I am talking about. So, the Gods are idiots twice.

LordCuthberton:
No comments reply? Sadface.

Never played the God Of War series, that's the problem with console exclusives. So most PlayStation fans have probably never played the Gears Of War series.

Gears of War isn't quite unique, ME or Halo would be a better example to make your point :P. If you want a grey and brown macho chest high wall shooter, there's plenty of games to get your fix like Army of Two or Killzone.
If on the other hand, you want a Brutal Hack&Slasher, all you can find is pussified versions of it.

I think the reason Kratos kills everything that is alive (or undead at least) is that he is able to do so, without any kind of punishment.
Tempted to link Penny Arcade, but I think you know what I mean.
(am looking at you, internets)

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