Rebecca Mayes Muses: Love Song for Yahtzee

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I was gonna comment on the song but...nah. It's got awkward lyrics "Is it ok, to be this way", maybe I love the song but not the singer.

@MaltesePigeon (cool handle, btw)

Sure, I'm troll baiting. :P

Also:

Calling me out for hyperbole when I was, indeed, being hyperbolic ('though sincere!) is surely not a 'ban-worthy' offense. Some of the -other- comments on this thread, are, of course, another altogether. And, yes, I know that a symphony usually involves more than one instrument...

Anyway. no offense taken.

Best wishes,

Mal.

P.S. So, like, you -don't- write your name on your underwear? You intimdating hipster, you!
I hope you don't push me into a locker on your way to the football field...

After watching that, I feel like I missed something important. xD Did Yahtzee do soemthing to piss him off? And it sounds rather... off for a love song. The ending sounded a bit like a threat o..o;

I found that quite hilarious, But is it meant to be ironic or is it just an attack?
Also I usually only use this site for ZP but I thought I'd see what's what.
What a beautiful women with a beautiful voice and talent to boot.

Wow...SEVENTEEN PAGES of mostly people flipping out on Yahtzee's behalf. Guess the song did its job! -:D

Maladjusted:
@MaltesePigeon (cool handle, btw)

Sure, I'm troll baiting. :P

Also:

Calling me out for hyperbole when I was, indeed, being hyperbolic ('though sincere!) is surely not a 'ban-worthy' offense. Some of the -other- comments on this thread, are, of course, another altogether. And, yes, I know that a symphony usually involves more than one instrument...

Anyway. no offense taken.

Best wishes,

Mal.

P.S. So, like, you -don't- write your name on your underwear? You intimdating hipster, you!
I hope you don't push me into a locker on your way to the football field...

Ha Ha! It's always a good day when a fight doesn't happen! I always preferred to have my underwear be anonymous. Who I was wasn't my underwear's fault.

I'm thirty years old and a teacher(unemployed) so I won't be pushing anyone into a locker anytime soon. I don't want to argue about this song anymore 'cuz I like arguing, but I'll say one thing more:

This conversation between you and I could make a far better song than the one that everyone here is talking about.

Best song she has done since Batman!

Riven Armor:

huckleberryhound:

GBM:
Do you seriously think that the majority of world homophobes are American? Try being gay in Uganda or rural China, or anywhere in the middle east for that matter. Outside of the west, homophobia is the rule, not the exception. (Note that I am not endorsing homophobia, merely pointing out that your perspective on the US & England is myopic at best.)

Seriously...do you have any idea how a homosexual would be treated in rural China, or did you just think adding China would get you extra kudos? Have you any proof of homosexuals being hurt in any way in rural China...?

No....i thought not.....doofus.

I don't make a business of keeping tabs on anti-gay agendas around the world, but I know Uganda had a law floating around that would have given homosexuality the death penalty. Iran has a similar code, and the rest of the Middle East is about the same - including areas ruled by Hamas and Hezbollah.

As for China, a quick google worked...

Beijing, Dec 12 (AFP) - "David" is a 23-year-old Chinese politics student. Few friends know he is also a homosexual looking for a lover in a society where even fellow gays are disgusted by their own behaviour. While in awe of the handful of gays who are daring to speak openly in order to promote awareness in a hostile society, the student, like most Chinese homosexuals, has little intention of joining them.

"Coming out publicly would be a disaster for an ordinary person - he would be fired and ostracised," said David, who was willing to speak on condition that his Chinese name not be used. "Most just care about their own lives, they just want to try to be happy."

http://academic.brooklyn.cuny.edu/core9/phalsall/texts/c-gays.html

Anyone thinking the majority of homophobes are concentrated in the first world is living a real sheltered existence.

I did a quick google search myself...

Population of China....1,338,330,000. And you quote one guy in Beijing.

I'm not saying that there isn't homophobia in China, but that you singled them out not because there is any great proof of gay bashing (which there isn't), or tht there is any calls by amnesty international on China's stance on Gay rights (which there's not)...it's because China is the whipping boy of choice for the uneducated forum poster who want's to beat down on a race with little or no comeback.

I'm just saying that your choice was interesting in that it was based on little or no actualy facts to speak of...

A notable change occurred during the late 1990s and early 2000s with the removal in 1997 of "hooliganism" from the criminal law, a de facto decriminalization of homosexuality. In April 20, 2001, the Chinese Classification of Mental Disorders formally removed homosexuality from its list of mental illnesses.[42][43]

One of the first Hong Kong gay rights activists and writers to study the history of homosexuality in China was Xiaomingxiong (also known as Samshasha), author of the comprehensive "The History of Homosexuality in China" (1984).[44] By the mid-1980s Chinese researchers on the mainland had begun investigating same-sex relationships in China. Some of the most notable work was conducted by sexologist Ruan Fangfu, who in 1991 published in English Sex in China: Studies in Sexology in Chinese Culture.[45].

An Internet survey in 2000 showed that Chinese people are becoming more tolerant towards homosexuality: among the 10,792 surveyed, 48.15% were in favor, 30.9% disapproved, 14.46% were uncertain, and 7.26% were indifferent.[43] Gay bashing is rare in modern China. Some scholars complain that the government is too indifferent on this issue, doing nothing to promote the situation of homosexuality in China. During the 2002 Gay Games, only 2 persons from the mainland were sent to take part, and apart from gay websites the media gave little coverage to the event. The authorities still refuse to promote either gay issues or gay rights in China. Although there is no explicit law against homosexuality or same-sex acts between consenting adults, neither are there laws protecting gays from discrimination, nor are there any gay rights organizations in China. It is believed that the Chinese policy towards the gay issue remains the "Three nos": no approval, no disapproval, and no promotion (不支持, 不反对, 不提倡).

A 2008 survey by sexologist Li Yinhe shows a mixed picture of public attitudes towards gays and lesbians in China. 91% of respondents said they agreed with homosexuals having equal employment rights, while over 80% of respondents agreed that heterosexuals and homosexuals were "equal individuals". On the other hand, a slight majority disagreed with the proposition that an openly-gay person should be a school teacher, and 40% of respondents said that homosexuality was "completely wrong".[46]

The number of homosexuals in China remains unclear. One statement based on Chinese government documents and academic studies states that the figure is 15 million. An official statistic, as quoted in a news report in China Daily, put the figure for mainland China at "approximately 30 million" (2.3% of the population), though it admitted many Chinese would not openly declare their sexual orientation.[47] Compared to the higher proportions of homosexuals in other countries, many find these figures unconvincing.[48]

The loosening of restrictions on Internet use has resulted in a blossoming of gay websites in mainland China, even though the police sometimes intervene and shut down such websites. The Internet has been very important to the mainland Chinese gay community. Although there are no gay organizations in mainland China, there are some organized Internet sites that function as advisory institutions.

The mainstream media sometimes cover notable gay events abroad, such as pride parades. Some critics charge that the purpose of the media is mostly to smear homosexuality. Lacking a film rating system, the Chinese government forbids gay movies to be shown on TV or in theaters because they are "inappropriate". Despite having received much attention in Taiwan, Hong Kong, and other places, the gay-themed movie Lan Yu is still forbidden in the mainland China (the film also features references to the Tiananmen Square protests of 1989) although the actors are all Mainlanders, and the story is based on a quite popular Internet story written by a mainland netizen (a heavily edited version of the film was released on DVD for the mainland). New Western films like Brokeback Mountain in 2006, were denied release in the mainland, even though there was an overall public interest as the film was directed by Ang Lee.

Although more prominent in first-tier Chinese cities like Beijing, Shanghai, Guangzhou, and Shenzhen, gay clubs, bars, tea houses, saunas, and support centers are also becoming more widespread in second-tier cities like Xi'an, Dalian, and Kunming. Occasionally, these locations are subject to police harassment. Similar to the development of the gay scene in other countries, other less formal 'cruising spots' exist in parks, public washrooms, malls, and public shower centers. Being gay is particularly difficult in the countryside; in China this is especially severe as the vast majority of people live in the countryside with no Internet access and no possibility to move to a city. Country dwellers do not often speak of homosexuality, and when they do, it is usually considered a disease.[49]

Many cases show that gay people still have to endure prejudice from the justice system and harassment from police, including detention and arrest. In October 1999, a Beijing court ruled that homosexuality was "abnormal and unacceptable to the Chinese public",[50] which was the first time this official attitude was stated openly. Another notable case happened in July 2001, when at least 37 gay men were detained in Guangdong. In late April 2004, the State Administration of Radio, Film, and Television (国家广播电影电视总局) initiated a campaign to clear violence and sexual content from the media. Programmes related to homosexual topic, scene, or language are considered to be "going against the healthy way of life in China", and are banned.

As early as 2004 and having seen rapid rises in HIV infection among gay and bisexual men in other Asian countries, provincial and city level health departments began HIV related research among men who have sex with men (MSM). In January 2006 the State Council of the People's Republic of China issued Regulations on AIDS Prevention and Treatment. The document specifically mentioned MSM as a population that is vulnerable to HIV infection and directed officials and organizations on every level to include MSM in HIV prevention activities. In April 2008, under the direction of the National Center for HIV/AIDS, 61 cities in China initiated community based studies of MSM and their potential risk for becoming infected with HIV. Concurrent to these studies, HIV prevention programs were initiated in those same cities using a peer led intervention model.[51]

The Ministry of Health estimated there were five to 10 million gay people in the Chinese mainland, aged between 15 and 65 in 2006 but sociologist Li Yinhe estimates it is between 36 and 48 million.[52]

From wikipedia.

link the site {link}http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_China(/link}. No one trusts wiki. wikipedia still isn't all knowing.

I wanted to check the credibility of your wiki reference so I checked up on ya. Next time type {link } without the space before the website you want to refer to. Then {/link ) again without the space to end it. That way everyone can check the references of the wiki site and judge whether those references are credible or not.

That said, the argument was that America wasn't very homophobic compared to other countries.
That said, we argue about gay rights here while some countries punish homosexuality.
That said, we argued for slavery after most countries had abolished it.

Get your coat Miss Mayes, you've scored :P

Loved the song, delighted you were misleading us with the love song tone for the build up. That always felt a bit iffy to me, good job on the sucker punch :)

Please don't stab Yahtzee though, he is entertaining.

daltonlaffs:
Ohhhhh, that was so close to being great...

This one *almost* made me change my mind... it started out so damn strong, and it was hilarious, clever words and rhyming on par with Yahtzee himself. BUT THEN, you started into the chorus. "Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?... Is it ok?..." (repeat)

Please, please, stop doing that to your songs. You would be a pleasure to listen to if it weren't for the repetition.

I think you are just a bit oversensitive about that? I mean, yes, she does the repeating lyrics thing a lot, and yes she probably does it too much. But to be fair the chorus goes "Is it okay. Is it okay, to be, the way, the way that I am".

If you honestly liked the song, but the fact that she repeats two different lines twice, makes you dislike it, I'd say you have a very weird way of reviewing music.

MaltesePigeon:
link the site {link}http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_China(/link}. No one trusts wiki. wikipedia still isn't all knowing.

I wanted to check the credibility of your wiki reference so I checked up on ya. Next time type {link } without the space before the website you want to refer to. Then {/link ) again without the space to end it. That way everyone can check the references of the wiki site and judge whether those references are credible or not.

That said, the argument was that America wasn't very homophobic compared to other countries.
That said, we argue about gay rights here while some countries punish homosexuality.
That said, we argued for slavery after most countries had abolished it.

I made and took part in no such argument, sorry.

Nautical Honors Society:
This is the best song I have heard from her.

I'd like to see a Yahtzee response XD

only thing runnin through my head would be "i wonder what yahtzee will do now."

NickIsCool:
whats with the screwdriver at the end though?

That's in the lyrics:

Bloodhound:

I would rather stab myself in the eye/
Than go out with your misogynist mind

this song was just plain shit

Never seen a Rebecca Mayes video based solely on the grounds of I hate the overuse of "Muse", "Muses", "Musings", etc. and the presumed cleverness of "Mayes Muses": But I do watch ZP so I felt compelled (like many did, I'm sure) to give it a shot.

One minute later (literally) I felt conflicted. Happy because I was right to hate without giving a chance, but sad that I did.

This is just one asshole's opinion though, I'm sure she's very talented at... whatever it is she does on this website. Using a Yahtzee crossover should have been golden, a great way to sway new viewers but if the ball could be dropped here, I don't wanna see how far down it goes before I hear the bounce.

Ha.
I expected to be disappointed by this, honestly, but that was pretty good. Actually, it's probably the best song Miss Mayes has ever written.

Granted, I prefer Yahtzee's show by a wide margin, but still, from a musical perspective, this was a triumph.

wow, this is really good. I've listened to it 3 times in a row and cant stop singing it to myself, its very clever and made me laugh. Well Done :D

gally912:

El pup:

Skarlette:
I shouldn't be surprised at the depths that people will go to diss and insult creative works, but... I just should not have been surprised, and it makes me very sad.

I think most of those commenting have just missed the point; they don't watch her other videos, they don't get what started the idea for this video, and they've missed how her fans have been quite excited for this. Were they expecting some fan-boy diatribe to validate their love of Yahtzee? Were they expecting a professional? (read: Artist with a multi-million dollar record deal) A pro song writer, an established singer, with a full expensive sound recording studio, animation team, and fully backed orchestra to produce this song?

She made this entirely herself. Wrote, sang, played each instrument herself, recorded herself, edited it all together HERSELF. I think it's amazingly creative, and 99.9% of those who commented could not do such a thing. She's not 'jumping on the Yahtzee bandwagon', she makes videos about video games and video game culture, and as Ben Croshaw has established himself within that culture and within the Escapist community, it is an extension of what she has been doing all along. (And only with a bit of fan service but to her own fans, not to Yahtzee's.)

I would love to have Yahtzee comment, because personally I think he would tear into all the fan-boy flamers who have commented in this thread, and not actually insult Rebecca herself. You all provide much more fuel for his hate than she ever could.

I miss when her video threads were 200 posts long, and full of comments to boost self-esteem, praise the effort, and encourage creativity.

Rebecca, I hope you can shake off the negativity here, and focus on all the good. Your fans are still here, and will be long after all the Yahtzee fanboys go back to where they come from.

It's not the fact that she is not on the Yahtzee band wagon. Hell, hating Yahtzee videos on youtube is hillarious

I used to think of Rebecca as sort of above stooping to cheap ploys to get attention. Above that, I thought of her as above as above trying to shove every feminist opinion in her veiwers faces. The things she complains about are hardly even note worthy, and its a bit extreme to blame Yahtzee (or any guy for that matter) for pushing misogyny and homophobia on society.

She also made a HUGE deal about this. Had she of not made a big deal about it, this would of been a witty cute song. It's just not very classy to make a huge stink about wanting to ask him out just so you can have an audience when you put someone on blast... Especially needlessly on blast seeing as it was totally unprovoked. It feels like she was trying to drag everyone in on HER problem.

She wanted the attention, she got it... and unfortunately not all of it is good.

As for my thoughts on Yahtzee's take on this, I don't think he cares very much... No ones really white knighting for the guy since he can hold his own and yeah, he probably doesn't take it personally because after all it's just business.

I've watched all of rebecca mayes videos and songs (my favorite being the eluring case of Kyle Hyde on her Gamepeople page. I was a big fan, and I do like her music still... just not her so much anymore), I've loved her stuff since she first came on the escapist. It's just it was such a pointless thing to do. She didn't really help any case of proving women are equal, its was a cheap shot based on deception, and it came off like a VERY desperate plea for attention.

This sorta just proves the point that feminists go out of their way to be offended and stoop to any low to get people to hear them out... Something I used to think she was better than.

I'm hoping I hear that this was all an elaborate (or not so elaborate) joke in a week... But that's unlikely

I'd like to reiterate that the song's contents are NOT *literally* a feminist critiquing and being offended- its humor is SUBTLE IRONY. Again, Yahtzee's criticisms are rips on everything, sometimes often with crude or offensive humor. So a "love song" towards Yahtzee would be a critique of him, to tear him down. (And thus, win his affection in an aphid sort of way)

It is not dirty laundry, a personal grudge, or whatever else you could assume taking the lyrics at face value.

See, I WANTED to think that... The only problems are it just doesn't add up to funny or ironic because:
-She did straight forward tell Yahtzee that she feels he drives misogyny and homophobia via twitter
-Yahtzee himself said on his website (fuly ramblimatic) he didn't get if she wanted to kill him or date him. Meaning if it was a joke, the she failed at getting the target audience to understand it since it was FOR him.
-Nothing about any of those things is really the ideal thing to do if you are trying to ask someone out.

Add to that all the feminist posts on HER blog and the last 2 videos and it leaves me doubtful. Its one of two things, either she sucks really badly at ironic humor, or she was doing this for attention (which is makes me lose the respect I had for her as an artist).

Which is why I'm hoping to hear in a week that this was a planned out joke and I fell for it like they intended.

But once again... that is extremely unlikely

Normalgamer:

El pup:

Skarlette:
I shouldn't be surprised at the depths that people will go to diss and insult creative works, but... I just should not have been surprised, and it makes me very sad.

I think most of those commenting have just missed the point; they don't watch her other videos, they don't get what started the idea for this video, and they've missed how her fans have been quite excited for this. Were they expecting some fan-boy diatribe to validate their love of Yahtzee? Were they expecting a professional? (read: Artist with a multi-million dollar record deal) A pro song writer, an established singer, with a full expensive sound recording studio, animation team, and fully backed orchestra to produce this song?

She made this entirely herself. Wrote, sang, played each instrument herself, recorded herself, edited it all together HERSELF. I think it's amazingly creative, and 99.9% of those who commented could not do such a thing. She's not 'jumping on the Yahtzee bandwagon', she makes videos about video games and video game culture, and as Ben Croshaw has established himself within that culture and within the Escapist community, it is an extension of what she has been doing all along. (And only with a bit of fan service but to her own fans, not to Yahtzee's.)

I would love to have Yahtzee comment, because personally I think he would tear into all the fan-boy flamers who have commented in this thread, and not actually insult Rebecca herself. You all provide much more fuel for his hate than she ever could.

I miss when her video threads were 200 posts long, and full of comments to boost self-esteem, praise the effort, and encourage creativity.

Rebecca, I hope you can shake off the negativity here, and focus on all the good. Your fans are still here, and will be long after all the Yahtzee fanboys go back to where they come from.

It's not the fact that she is not on the Yahtzee band wagon. Hell, hating Yahtzee videos on youtube is hillarious

I used to think of Rebecca as sort of above stooping to cheap ploys to get attention. Above that, I thought of her as above as above trying to shove every feminist opinion in her veiwers faces. The things she complains about are hardly even note worthy, and its a bit extreme to blame Yahtzee (or any guy for that matter) for pushing misogyny and homophobia on society.

She also made a HUGE deal about this. Had she of not made a big deal about it, this would of been a witty cute song. It's just not very classy to make a huge stink about wanting to ask him out just so you can have an audience when you put someone on blast... Especially needlessly on blast seeing as it was totally unprovoked. It feels like she was trying to drag everyone in on HER problem.

She wanted the attention, she got it... and unfortunately not all of it is good.

As for my thoughts on Yahtzee's take on this, I don't think he cares very much... No ones really white knighting for the guy since he can hold his own and yeah, he probably doesn't take it personally because after all it's just business.

I've watched all of rebecca mayes videos and songs (my favorite being the eluring case of Kyle Hyde on her Gamepeople page. I was a big fan, and I do like her music still... just not her so much anymore), I've loved her stuff since she first came on the escapist. It's just it was such a pointless thing to do. She didn't really help any case of proving women are equal, its was a cheap shot based on deception, and it came off like a VERY desperate plea for attention.

This sorta just proves the point that feminists go out of their way to be offended and stoop to any low to get people to hear them out... Something I used to think she was better than.

I'm hoping I hear that this was all an elaborate (or not so elaborate) joke in a week... But that's unlikely

Are you pants-on-head retarded? It's a joke, she doesn't actually hate him, it's just a fun thing to do. The interwebz are no srs bsnz.

Sigh...
It's sad when someones argument is "YOUR STUPID! IT'S NOT SRS LULZ LULZ LULZ"

I don't care how she feels about him or how she doesn't feel about him... Hell, had she of not made such a HIGE STINK about writing a "love song" for yahtzee and just came out with this song one week, I would of loved it.

My point is that for someone who said HERSELF she wishes to be taken as a serious artist, that it is a lame thing for her to make a spectical of her self for something she completely mislead everyone on.

I also have my doubts it was an Ironic love-song because

-If it was Ironic, he target audience (Yahtzee) didn't get the joke (Which he acknowledged on on fully ramblamatic.)
-She said after all was said and done via twitter that she HONESTLY feels like He's making Misogyny and Homophobia socially acceptable (which is a little extreme).
-Also she's been trying to make a bunch of feminist statements the past month (hence the armpit hair in the heavy rain video and the ENTIRE blog about it, the videos on the escapist) which is fine, but there isn't much integrity in lying to EVERYONE for the purpose of a song so you can get attention for something that is the opposite of what you were going for.

It's either she sucks at irony (which I doubt because she CAN be funny), or she's an attention whore for the way she mislead people in to hearing her point of view (which isn't very respectable for someone who hopes to be taken seriously)

And no I don't think she seriously hates him... But I believe she is seriously offended by him and wants people to seriously take Yahtzee as a mysogynist Homophobe, Which is her opinion she is entitles to have... but don't try and TRICK everyone in to hearing out your opinion.

And yes "teh interwebz is not teh srs bsnz", which is why I will no longer take Rebecca Mayes seriously as an artist... especially when she eventually tries to give up her gimic, and starts trying to write whiny bitch rock.

Rebecca you are stunning.
Great voice aswell!
I will probably download your album when it appears on Piratebay - sorry for that but I'd prefer to take you out for dinner with the cash instead.
Yahtzee I like you, I do. We had our differences when you had nothing good to say about Oblivion but I'm over it now.

Keep up the good work you two!

Wow, that wasn't really a love song... more like a hate song. I want to see what Yahtzee thinks.

Good job, and good luck dealing with him...

rebecca, that was so freakin' awesome. i hope you and yahtzee do have that drink someday...but please don't stab him. lol.

Not to give a backhanded complement, but as of now I feel you have three songs that are worth listening to. (Sims 3, Overlord 2, This song). I just find it kind of sad that your "final" song is one of the few good ones.

funny...
the LAST word of this song starts with "IMP".

Ehhh... I'd do her.

Maybe I'm missing the point, but I really didn't enjoy that song very much. Is she trying to make us laugh? Were the references in the song meant to be funny? If so then the song failed in that respect for me. I guess it succeeded in what it was meant to do for her though, the views must be through the roof.

I liked it. Well. Almost.

I quite liked the "Are you asking if it's ok to be the way I am?" thing you read into Yahtzee's very personal style. Not sure if it's true or not. Probably isn't. Might be.

Some of it just didn't quite click. Maybe it's not supposed to, but I felt that the bloodhound was a big lipped alligator, and many of the other lyrics also felt wedged in, to the point that they actually made me wince a bit.

I liked that you were brave enough to directly link your stance to feminism. Few people would be, on this site. Or in real life, for that matter - I'm not sure why feminism seems so contentious when true parity has clearly not been reached in cultural or economical terms in most societies (I believe some Scandinavian countries are close, though I could be wrong - even underestimating them).

I think I just realised why your song annoys me though. It reminds me of Tim Minschen, all rambling quasi-philosophical, quasi-sensitive bullshit delivered in a very boring, 'easy', digestible song-form, with no attempt to match style to content. The healthy dose of self-righteousness didn't help much either (another Minschen-esque quality) - I don't know the backstory, and I don't care to, but some of this was like listening to flatmates falling out over the milk.

In conclusion, yes it's absolutely fine to be the way you are. Your views are, from the sounds of it, not insane, barring a little involuntary ocular re-adjustment with a screwdriver now and then. None of your lyrics were very strong though, and there were many occasions where the right metaphor or simile would have made me laugh out loud or sympathise more strongly with your message, but you messed up or backed out, or just didn't want to end up sounding like a Yahtzee wannabe (You seem very aware of your audience, for good or ill). The tone sorta shifted about strangely, too, and I felt you were trying (dunno if it was conscious or not) almost to hide your hate, for fear of the backlash you'd provoke. It made the song much less enjoyable, and much more uncomfortable, than if you'd straight ripped into him. Maybe that was the point, but you sing songs for a gaming website - bit pretentious to eschew that kind of satirical bite in favour of subtlety on this platform.

Also, god-damn I hate Tim Minschen. I probably am biased against you just because your song reminded me of the uninspired over-rated affected poser. But overall, I still quite liked it.

huckleberryhound:

I did a quick google search myself...

Population of China....1,338,330,000. And you quote one guy in Beijing.

I'm not saying that there isn't homophobia in China, but that you singled them out not because there is any great proof of gay bashing (which there isn't), or tht there is any calls by amnesty international on China's stance on Gay rights (which there's not)...it's because China is the whipping boy of choice for the uneducated forum poster who want's to beat down on a race with little or no comeback.

I'm just saying that your choice was interesting in that it was based on little or no actualy facts to speak of...

[snip]

From wikipedia.

I'm not sure which side you're coming down on. Posting the wiki quote without analysis doesn't say anything either way. If the excerpt is accepted as evidence, the Chinese history of tolerance of homosexuals is at best checkered compared to the US.

CZS PublicEnemy:
Ehhh... I'd do her.

Despite her armpit hair?

Armpit hair?!? Is this true??

True enough, check her blog, there's a whole ideological theme about it there. Featured in her Heavy Rain video. From what I remember she finds hair on male-butts repulsive and armpit hair is supposed to be somehow connected to that matter, thou I didn't really understand the logic behind it.

The song was quite good. Although, she should realize that most guys have male butt hair.

Riven Armor:

I'm not sure which side you're coming down on. Posting the wiki quote without analysis doesn't say anything either way. If the excerpt is accepted as evidence, the Chinese history of tolerance of homosexuals is at best checkered compared to the US.

I have no opinion on the treatment of homosexuals in America, i'm sure they can stand up for themselves on that matter. I just thought China was an odd choice of meter in this specific argument. It just seems like the "go-to" whipping boy of the modern uneducated.

GET BACK TO THE KITCHEN NOW.

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