265: Punching the Baby Seal of PC Gaming

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Danny Ocean:

Nuke_em_05:
I want to play games, not be a desktop support specialist.

Strangely, due to some sort of bug, I couldn't beat the last boss with full settings. No joke, I had to run the bastard at 800x600 with all the settings at min for it to render a part of the boss that I needed to shoot. WTF?

Also, 64-bit windows doesn't like Riva Tuner, so I have to "allow" it on startup every time. A part of the problem was that the nvidia console and other settings don't actually show core temp. Need third party for that as well.

1. But it's not that difficult. I've never had any training in any of these things and I'm very competent with computers. Certainly competent enough to deal with any problems.

2. Ah that's because it's maaaaaasssiiiivveee. It's just a lot of movement and particles and mesh to render.

3. Turn off UAC?

It's true that there are problems with PC gaming of course, but they're not really hard to deal with. At least, they've never been for me. Just a quick google and follow the step-by steps. In the worst case scenario, just reformat. Cheaper than sending it in for repairs, that's for sure.

1. I haven't had any training either, though I grew up building PCs with my dad. My point was more that your "average" gamer doesn't necessarily want to deal with that. Further, it shouldn't be a requirement. There are still a lot of people who aren't comfortable with, and probably have no business in, the control panel even. Let alone msconfig, drivers, firmware, or (God forbid) the registry. Some people just want to kill internet dragons, or space marines or what-have-you, without having to deal with that kind of stuff. Though gaming isn't the worst culprit, I've had my DVD-RW drive just up and disappear after an Adobe install; those have been fun fixes.

2. I understand that this particular boss is larger than your average console map, in the middle of the ocean, with a full carrier, three battleships, an island, and about 20 dogfights going on in the background. However, for a machine and game that handled the rest of this just fine, you'd think maybe the shields (or whatever it was) could have made it higher on the priority list of things to make sure are there. You'd think dropping some settings would work, or the resolution a little, but no, it only showed up at 800x600 with everything low.

3. I don't see what the corporation that opened a portal to Hell on Mars has to do with this conversation... oh, that UAC; User Account Control, which is marginally worse than the other UAC, yes, I suppose I could, actually, I really should... why haven't I? My issue is more that even with the hardware/software itself, you need third party applications to diagnose and correct. Nvidia recently had a driver release that essentially turned the fans off in their cards with some applications. The people who noticed were using third-party temp monitors and fan controllers, those with the tools provided by the manufacturer had no way to know. Riva Tuner is essentially an third-party registry tool for overclocking and other such "advanced settings", and I use it to force my video card into not melting itself while running at stock settings.

PC Gaming is indeed much "better" in many respects; but it shouldn't be because the user has to learn more about computers and invest more time in making it work just to play the game. Yes, you could say that increased benefits require increased investment. I would say the cost of the equipment would be that. A "good" gaming graphics card is about as expensive as a console at this point. Yes, you use a PC for other things, but the cost difference from a productivity PC to a "gaming" PC is already greater than the cost of a console.

As for repairs; I bought an Xbox 360 at launch. It has played every game released for it just fine out of the box. I've sent it back for RROD once. The whole box is covered under one warranty. I've gone through two desktop PCs and three laptops in the same amount of time, plus upgrades. Though I've only had to RMA the one video card. Each install has been a new adventure into my configuration. With a PC, each part is from a different manufacturer under a different warranty. Unless you buy pre-manufactured, Dell etc... which seems to be a bad as console to most PC folks.

I play on PC, I prefer PC, and I'm okay with dealing with the challenges that come with it. The problem I see is that most "PC Elitists" believe that because they accept it, everyone else must.

PC gaming, as you mention, can be a very frustrating experience. Early adopters tend to be the hardest-hit with problems; I'm among the people who bought ARMA 2 at launch, and well, it took a fair few months for some of the missions to be patched to a state where they could be completed. Similar problems existed with Empire: Total War and the mentioned Fallout 3, both of which I purchased on the release date.

That said, those people most willing to persevere, who are steadfast - and stubborn - enough to keep trying when a game refuses to work, are the people who get rewarded the most from their games. The potential graphics quality from a PC platform easily outperforms that which can be obtained by a console. We have a variety of genres which never make it onto console or handheld platforms, and the peripherals - steering wheels and HOTAS joysticks - to play them properly. I can understand why people may want to choose an easier variant, but I'm just too attached to some PC games to give up the more difficult option.

I disagree with this article , sure I cant buy anything without going through hurdles to get it to run. I game pc though, because there are some things consoles haven't done well yet (RTS/MMO), also I dont like to shell out for parts and waste hours every few months to fix my Xbox. PC has hurdles, but I would argue that they're the smallest of any modern gaming medium. And if my coffee maker shot java at my balls i would troubleshoot it, because making your own coffee is significantly cheaper than say starbucks.

Honestly, most problems stem from two things:

1.) People being too cheap, as with about anything else... if you buy cheap you buy twice... or in some cases don't buy at all cause it will just frustrate you to no end.

2.) Systems not up2date, you need to constantly run Windows Updates, install the newest drivers (like graphics cards, for some games newest Visual C++ Redist, newest .NET Redist and of course DirectX etc.)...

Most of the times if you regard those things you will have a (more or less) flawless experience and your PC won't break down once a year like most XBoX360'ses used to do or have to play games at choppy 15-20FPS at or below 1280x720...

Also, in case of games like Fallout 3 or Oblivion, where the games themselves don't exactly seem very "finished" or "polished" the PC is the only place where you can install Mods that can actually fix the gameplay that remains broken on the consoles...

I think this article is made to test out PC gamers limits and decide to bring their fuel tanks.

Anyway, I can sympathize Chuck for his PC problems and why he wants to go into the easy lifestyle. And yes, PC enthusiasts consider this a hobby, others consider it time waster from ordering parts that they have little to no knowledge much to the likes of Intel v. AMD processors and nVidia v. ATI graphic cards, to see if their PC is outdated to play their games, to having bugs and installation problems.

Since I was age 10, I was tampering PC parts and see which part goes which and I didn't have a manual. I ordered a gaming PC premade and it sucked. Years later, developing a knack for certain PC games, I did research on PCs and maybe build one day if I have loads of time.

I certainly know that PCs are more powerful than the consoles, but they come at a price, both costly and time consuming. If anyone can ignore those two factors, anyone can make a PC out of scratch.

I can respect that Chuck.

nofear220:

wadark:
I love seeing all these people saying "the problem is you"

Because it is...

wadark:

Typical story of a person who doesnt know much about computers, first off don't buy a dell XPS that is your first problem. Build your own gaming computer, so that you arent over charged, and dont have BIOS restrictions and a bunch of BS programs and on your pc that only slow it down. Second, (again with the dell trash) their cases have poor airflow and you probably have a bad heatsink, dust the inside of your case with compressed air and get a better cooler. Excess heat probably causes most of your lock ups in the first place. Lastly disable processes that have probably accumulated through using different programs, and use CCleaner to clean up the crap floating around on your drives. Hell, Defragmenting your drives would help too. Problem solved, you learned something and baby seals dont have to be punched.

Again, why is the first response "build your own computer"? Please, read what I'm about to type, understand it and stop being so prejudiced:

1) Building a PC is still expensive.
2) I DON'T KNOW HOW to build my own PC.
3) I don't have the time between a job, school, and a child, to learn how to build one. I barely have enough time for the hobby that I enjoy so I'm certainly not going to waste what little time I have by trying to navigate the internet labyrinth to learn what I need to know.

1) building a PC is less expensive then buying a prebuilt one
2) A 5 year old could do it, its not hard
3) The time you waste on the internet in one day or less you could be done your pc

My only response is thank you for proving my point. I'm done with this discussion.

It's interesting to see how much hate this is inciting, very little of it getting beyond the "Learn to troubleshoot" variety the article alluded to (or, to be more accurate, "Stop overclocking")

Treblaine:
"My PC was robust: a Dell XPS"

Well THERE is yer problem!

Pre-built PCs are the DEVIL! Seriously, any problems you may have BUILDING a PC are completely offset by you knowing exctly what is on there. Pre-built PCs are loaded up with so much secret and hidden crapware, my god, the only real solution is to format your hard-drive and start from scratch with a fresh install.

Plus, they may give superficially good specs but they screw you in the details.

PCs are DESIGNED to be built with minimal skill, and the most basic equipment and facilities. They are DESIGNED to be built ON a desk by anyone who has the competence to assemble Ikea furniture or change a busted fuse without electrocuting themselves.

"Of course, nobody can seem to get their microphones to work"

This is almost entirely down to people buying cheap mics and not configuring them correctly. Usually people use a cheap mic that is so weak it only picks up anything if you mouth is practically touching the receiver and you carefully pronounce each word. I used to get terrible mic performance, then I got a decent mic... then it was as clear as radio 4.

I have found the same terrible mic-receiving on 360 as well: because Microsoft uses cheap mics.

But the thing is Consoles games don't "just work" as their performance is utterly miserable half the time, settling for 24-30 frames/sec. Dedicated servers, they just aren't bloody well there! Console solution is not to make it work, but simply eliminate the things that DON'T work. It's a cop out.

But mainly "Team frotress 2: works fine" "Left 4 dead 2: works great"

Then "Fuck PC gaming, I give up"

Say WHAAAAAAAAT!?

Why give up on ALL PC games just because the Games-for-Windows-Live version sucks? Why? Huh? Why?

More bullshit absolutist arguments, either 100% PC gaming or none at all. You have some serious anger issues, PC gives you problem for SOME games now you hate it for ALL games. Pure illogical prejudice. I hope you don't apply the same logic to other things, like against people.

I'm sorry if I'm an idiot that DOES have trouble putting furniture together.
I built a PC, thinking along the lines that it will be better for cheaper.
Guess what? I've had more issues with it than my premade PCs.
I've had every single issue he talked about in his article.

And the second part is this, should you have to build it from scratch?
Imagine you set on premade furniture and it snapped. Or imagine that buying a premade car was crap and people told you you should have just built one on your own.
What would you think?

I think you are missing the point because you are EXACTLY the kind of PC elitist of the "read the manual" type.
I play PC games and hate consoles, but the reality of the headache that is PC gaming is reality.
Whether its dealing with unnecessary bugs, installing various superfluous software, or building the hardware itself; PC gaming makes you want to punch a seal.

But its still better, still more customizable, still has a better interface (I will never trade a mouse and keyboard for a controller). As he said at the end of the article, games like Civilization V remind us that for a true gamer the PC is king.
But like the scorned Progressives in the Democratic Party (yes, I'm crass enough to use politics as an analogy to gaming) we are expected to shut up about the issues because "where else would we go"?

chuckwendig:
I go buy a rod and some bait, I can start to fish.

What? No beer? Fishing without drinking is like sex without the midget.

Bellvedere:
The only real trouble I have is playing a game for several hours at a time, it starts to run very slowly. I chalk this more up to the age of my computer then PC games in general being of bad quality. Still my Xbox doesn't do this. But getting Dragon Age on console seems practically criminal.

Depending on your set up, it could be heat build up slowly knackering performance (common for extended gaming sessions on notebooks) OR a poorly coded game. Dragon Age was/is terrible for it on the PC, even after they released a patch for the issue. Save, Exit Game, Run Game, Load, Play does the trick but it can be a pain in the arse.

LordSphinx:
And I don't know if I'll be able to resist Civ 5...

You won't.

Sid owns your arse. Admit it and be liberated.

RAKtheUndead:
PC gaming, as you mention, can be a very frustrating experience. Early adopters tend to be the hardest-hit with problems; I'm among the people who bought ARMA 2 at launch, and well, it took a fair few months for some of the missions to be patched to a state where they could be completed. Similar problems existed with Empire: Total War and the mentioned Fallout 3, both of which I purchased on the release date.

Despite that, one of the beauties of being a PC gamer is you can often find work-arounds and 3rd party patches when there is a problem rather than waiting for the developer to both admit there IS a problem and then actually pull their thumbs out of their arses and patch it. On a console you're stuck with game breaking bugs or suboptimal performance until the developers deign to notice the issue.

maxben:
Or imagine that buying a premade car was crap and people told you you should have just built one on your own.
What would you think?

I'd think it was Friday... because I usually see at least one of my petrolhead nephews on Friday.

Or I'd think I was at a family barbie, with my all petrolhead nephews and their petrolhead Dad, in which case I'd be thinking ways to get the biggest share of the potato bake.

Perhaps he is conflating these things, but taking care of one's computer is not really any different than taking care of gear involved for any other hobby. And yes, the care does take some effort. His analogy is not without some merit, you should have given him that.

chuckwendig:

PaulH:

Games for you seem to be a cheap thrill ... but would you also take the same attitude to picking up a new sport you've never had the chance to invest physical effort in like tennis or fishing? How about billiards?

All require patience, all require organization, all require time, all require effort. This culture of instant gratification in gaming reduces the complexity of experiencing videogames as a medium for the exchange of ideas and art. You're not helping the fact with your incessant diatribe against problems for which my personal experience informs me is but a base defamatory attack on a cultural medium that is both fallacious and grievous.

You're conflating "learning the rules of a game" with "creating the effort necessary to get the game to a stable starting point."

Learning how to fish = learning how to play a game.

Learning how to fish does not *require* building your own rod, your own pond, troubleshooting the reel, adjusting pH levels, updating the fish drivers, or any other hundred errors.

I go buy a rod and some bait, I can start to fish. Maybe not well, but I can fish. I don't have to study the discipline. I don't have to be a rabid hobbyist. I can just... fish.

And, I can choose to master the discipline if I want to.

But I can do it as a beginner without worry.

PC gaming is difficult for the amateur, average gamer. It's becoming increasingly marginalized, and I suspect some actually *like* that it's marginalized.

-- Chuck

The_root_of_all_evil:

danpascooch:

Sure emulators are fine if you want to play the SNES,

Or the BBC, Electron, Spectrum, C64, Amiga, PS1, PS2, DS, Gameboy, GBA, Arcade, Pinball, C16, Dragon, Oric, etc.

but show me a nice 360/PS3 emulator that works.

Sort of tough to do that without breaking forum rules, doncha know.

I like how you placed FPS in the realm of PC exclusive genres, when most FPS players play on console.

Well, Micro$oft seems to put FPS squarely in the realms of PC.

Personally, I don't have much of a problem playing PC games, but lots of people do, and it's a big annoyance when you paid for the thing!

This is up there with "it costs too much" and "it always breaks down". Lots of people die from being stung by a bee each year (around 53) but that's hardly a reason to go on a bee vendetta.

Also, don't talk about "watching videos" and "writing letters" just because I play games primarily for the console doesn't mean I don't own a PC, this is about their relative merits as gaming platforms.

One of the relative merits being that I can switch between game/video/music/letter with a few key presses.

Another thing, it's harder to cheat online with consoles.

It's also impossible (legally) to mod anything. Or upgrade it. Or...lots of other things.

I'm not saying Consoles are bad, I'm just saying that PCs aren't that bad.

First off, many emulators barely work, and very few if any work for all games of their platform, DS emulators can't even get the sound right for half the games. Don't try to pull that "forum rules, so I can't show you" thing, 360 and PS3 emulators do not exist, and if they do, they don't work, if you find one, by all means post it, it's not the emulator that's illegal, and it's legal to even USE the emulator with ROMS provided you own the game.

Secondly, what was with that shot at Microsoft? That article was just showing that they weren't doing cross play, it doesn't support your implied belief that FPS's are primarily as computer gaming affair (because you lumped them in with RTS's and MMO's), it was totally irrelevant, and it's not true that FPS's are more popular on Computer's than on Consoles at all, quite the opposite actually. It was completely irrelevant flamebait, I am sick of that stupid $ replacement in Microsoft's name when it's A$$pple that's been doing to money grabbing policies lately. Not allowing PC gamers to play online with Xbox gamers in no way "puts FPS's squarely in the realms of PC".

Lastly, you talking about the relative merits of being able to switch between video/game/music/letter (which the 360 can do ALL of except email, so it's really just email) is idiotic because it saves maybe 3 minutes a month, as opposed to the hours spent troubleshooting glitchy PC titles.

It's also impossible (legally) to mod anything. Or upgrade it. Or...lots of other things.

Seriously? I don't mean to be rude, but "Or...lots of other things" isn't really a proper argument, basically what you're saying is "let's write off that PC gaming problem...because lots of other things have problems and stuff"

I respect PC gaming for the people it works for, but I don't think PC gaming is superior to consoles, or vice versa, I think they both have distinct advantages that mean each individual person will favor one over another.

for example:

Console:
1.) Less time Troubleshooting
2.) Ease of use
3.) Gamepad by default
4.) Harder to cheat because files cannot be edited or loaded directly
5.) Less intrusive DRM

PC:
1.) Modding (surprised you didn't mention this, it's the single biggest merit PC gaming has over consoles)
2.) Centralized media
3.) Slightly Cheaper
4.) Money invested improves both gaming capabilities AND other computer capabilities.

danpascooch:

PC:
1.) Modding (surprised you didn't mention this, it's the single biggest merit PC gaming has over consoles)

The_root_of_all_evil:
It's also impossible (legally) to mod anything. Or upgrade it. Or...lots of other things.

Yeah, if you're paying that much attention to what I wrote, I'm not really that surprised.

Then just referring to my points as idiotic before repeating the same things I said. Not really a case for continuing this discussion.

The_root_of_all_evil:

danpascooch:

PC:
1.) Modding (surprised you didn't mention this, it's the single biggest merit PC gaming has over consoles)

The_root_of_all_evil:
It's also impossible (legally) to mod anything. Or upgrade it. Or...lots of other things.

Yeah, if you're paying that much attention to what I wrote, I'm not really that surprised.

Then just referring to my points as idiotic before repeating the same things I said. Not really a case for continuing this discussion.

Actually, I didn't repeat the same thing you said.

There are two types of modding, there are game mods (like the Oblivion gore mod) which are perfectly legal, and in many cases (Like in Valve's Left 4 Dead series) modding is actively encouraged by the developer.

Then there are hardware mods, cheating chips and the like, these are OFTEN (NOT ALWAYS) illegal.

Now, if you were talking about hardware mods, then I didn't repeat the same thing, because I was talking about game mods.

If you were talking about game mods, than you are dead wrong, because they aren't illegal at all, and the misunderstanding on my part was completely understandable, because the statement causing the misunderstanding, is false, and was placed in context that would lead any reasonable person to assume it was Hardware mods.

I assumed you were talking about hardware mods, because I assumed you knew what you were talking about, and didn't say something that wasn't true (that all game mods are illegal).......did I made a mistake in giving you the benefit of the doubt, and assuming you knew what you were talking about?

I am also inclined to believe you meant hardware mods, because the next thing you said was "upgrade" which implies some sort of hardware upgrade when it comes to gaming.

So either way, I didn't do anything wrong here, since you didn't specify which type of modding you were talking about, I assumed it was the one that made the most sense in its context, and didn't make you look like an idiot. Care to address the other points?

danpascooch:
If you were talking about game mods, than you are dead wrong, because they aren't illegal at all

That's true when a developer releases modding tools but not always true when the modding community goes in and combs over the game code itself to find what they can mod... if they start decompiling code then in several countries they're committing a criminal offense (like, under the US's DMCA).

I can't help but wonder, you've been playing PC games for so long, and you STILL have issues often enough to be worth ranting about? I had tons of issues for my first 5 years or so of being a PC user, but I figured out what I was doing wrong and right and better methods and now I might have a slight bug or glitch every couple months that I clear up in a day. What have you been doing this whole time? If you knew how to set up and maintain your OS in the first place, you wouldn't need to troubleshoot so often.

Besides, I'd rather have good games on sometimes-faulty hardware than being stuck with terrible games with no options on limited hardware. Yes, my computer crashes as well. I just had two graphics card crashes the other day playing Starcraft 2, but I identified the problem and stopped running the program that was causing the crashes when I played. This is no more than an inconvenience, like standing in line is an inconvenience before going on an awesome roller coaster. No pain, no gain, but I wouldn't expect a society that invented drive-thru fast food to put quality over convenience.

Now maybe here's your problem:

chuckwendig:

Treblaine:
"My PC was robust: a Dell XPS"

Well THERE is yer problem!

Pre-built PCs are the DEVIL! Seriously, any problems you may have BUILDING a PC are completely offset by you knowing exctly what is on there. Pre-built PCs are loaded up with so much secret and hidden crapware, my god, the only real solution is to format your hard-drive and start from scratch with a fresh install.

PCs are DESIGNED to be built with minimal skill, and the most basic equipment and facilities. They are DESIGNED to be built ON a desk by anyone who has the competence to assemble Ikea furniture or change a busted fuse without electrocuting themselves.

But the thing is Consoles games don't "just work" as their performance is utterly miserable half the time, settling for 24-30 frames/sec. Dedicated servers, they just aren't bloody well there! Console solution is not to make it work, but simply eliminate the things that DON'T work. It's a cop out.

But newsflash: I don't have time to build a PC. I don't have time to build a television, a blender, a fridge, a car. I don't sew my own clothes. I do not slaughter my own cattle. I buy something, I personally would like it to work with minimum frustration.

You don't have these problems? I'm not suggesting you do. I wrote an article. It's full of True Things. People seem hell-bent to dispute my experiences, as if my experiences must be also indicative of their experiences.

He's absolutely right. You don't have /time/ to build a PC? Building one would have taken LESS time than it probably took to write this article. Did you have drafts? Did you proofread? If you just typed it out and submitted your first draft I could see it taking maybe an hour. It usually takes me less than 3 hours to put a PC together from an empty case and parts. You're talking about building a PC like it's building a car. You don't have a single afternoon to put together something that will last you 2 years minimum?

ALL PC GAMERS KNOW PRE-BUILTS ARE CRAP. It's a fact because no pre-built manufacturer can afford to make their PCs good. They would never be able to beat the price of custom PCs by matching their performance, so they go for the cheap stuff and they advertise like crazy and spread lies about how great they are so the masses will buy their crap. Then they have to fill up your computer with adware and programs you don't want so they can get paid by those companies so they can continue selling their junkboxes to ignorant TV-shoppers. Some console gamers spread lies about custom PCs for personal reasons instead of business ones: they know they don't know anything about building or maintaining a PC, they don't want to make the effort to learn, but they don't want anybody to see them as incompetent so they exaggerate the PC's faults to make it look like they "know better." All this adds up to a big stigma over a hobby with a high entry point because nobody wants to admit they don't really know anything about it.

Don't blame the nature of PC gaming for your issues, blame Dell. You wandered into the forest and ate the red berries and now you're complaining that the forest made you sick when anybody living there could have told you the berries were bad for you.

RhombusHatesYou:

danpascooch:
If you were talking about game mods, than you are dead wrong, because they aren't illegal at all

That's true when a developer releases modding tools but not always true when the modding community goes in and combs over the game code itself to find what they can mod... if they start decompiling code then in several countries they're committing a criminal offense (like, under the US's DMCA).

I see, so you did mean game mods, I just thought you meant hardware mods since the next thing you specified was "upgrades" and the statement that all modding is illegal is wrong when applied to game mods.

danpascooch:

RhombusHatesYou:

danpascooch:
If you were talking about game mods, than you are dead wrong, because they aren't illegal at all

That's true when a developer releases modding tools but not always true when the modding community goes in and combs over the game code itself to find what they can mod... if they start decompiling code then in several countries they're committing a criminal offense (like, under the US's DMCA).

I see, so you did mean game mods, I just thought you meant hardware mods since the next thing you specified was "upgrades" and the statement that all modding is illegal is wrong when applied to game mods.

I'm not the same person you were talking to before.

'Sides, where I live most hardware and software modding for consoles is perfectly legal*... although against EULAs and void warranties, etc. For example, I could go out today, buy a 360 or PS3, crack open the case, gut it, and fill it with venomous snakes and it would be perfectly legal as long as I had a permit for the snakes.

*Well, not perfectly... if they can prove the mod solely exists as copyright protection circumvention it's bad juju.

I hate this kind of article. I'm rather ashamed that The Escapist would authorize something that's ostracizing an entire branch of Gamers like this. I can see the author's problems but I do not sympathize. I've had a number of issues and I've worked through them. Besides, occasional failures are EXPECTED, both on Console and PC. I spent aprox. 2 hours on 3D dot game heroes not realizing there was no auto-save, and bam, Lock at the loading screen entering the 2nd dungeon. (At least I saved my custom model).

Also, I was wondering if he was just unlucky, or if it was his rig. I got the answer about half-way through at the word "Dell". Complaining about a mainstream computer company's gaming capabilities is like saying you got an N-gage instead of an iPhone because they're both gaming phones. Don't buy a computer from the "mass appeal PC" makers if you don't want to deal with sub-optimal gaming experiances (Yes, even they're gaming models. It's all just Marketing).
Furthermore, "Age" is not the main consideration with PCs. I love it when people say "But it's not even that old!", As if every computer component of a certain year was made the same (I guess like Consoles are. Hm.). Just like cars, and, well, everything, there are high end and low end parts that are made at the same time.

Finally, I strongly dislike how the Author disregarded the specifics about developer and circumstances that the game ended up on the PC. As someone pointed out, GFWL is basically a steaming pile of shit and it generally ruins every game it touches, no surprise there if the game breaks so badly you rage-quit. However, the Valve games ran perfect. Again... Duh. Valve makes great games, the are a premium publisher. Most other publishers have inexperienced coders or at least sloppy management/QA.

Point is, I hate reading this type of thing because it just states "Stop playing PC, only play console", when what he SHOULD be saying is "Developers, Stop being dumb and L2CODE!".

This is why I stick to light pc gaming. I know my machine isn't a powerhouse, it's decent for it's time. So, I buy old games, and the steam games I know I can run. Then again, I was a console gamer from age 5 because we didn't have a pc until 1998. Not to mention that my pc is full of games that I never play. This was a great article, it kept me hooked until the end and I agree with it just about every inch of the way.

Console gaming is not immune to locking up, Fallout 3 has died on me many times. Even Smash Bros Brawl has goen kaputzen on me a time or two.

PC gaming is better than consoles for most genres, mostly because of mods. But you have to be able to run something. You can't play Crysis on a Genesis for example, so you can't blame teh hardware for software issues. I don't think its the PS3's fault Fallout 3 has some terrible programming, because it isn't.

RhombusHatesYou:

danpascooch:

RhombusHatesYou:

danpascooch:
If you were talking about game mods, than you are dead wrong, because they aren't illegal at all

That's true when a developer releases modding tools but not always true when the modding community goes in and combs over the game code itself to find what they can mod... if they start decompiling code then in several countries they're committing a criminal offense (like, under the US's DMCA).

I see, so you did mean game mods, I just thought you meant hardware mods since the next thing you specified was "upgrades" and the statement that all modding is illegal is wrong when applied to game mods.

I'm not the same person you were talking to before.

'Sides, where I live most hardware and software modding for consoles is perfectly legal*... although against EULAs and void warranties, etc. For example, I could go out today, buy a 360 or PS3, crack open the case, gut it, and fill it with venomous snakes and it would be perfectly legal as long as I had a permit for the snakes.

*Well, not perfectly... if they can prove the mod solely exists as copyright protection circumvention it's bad juju.

whoops, didn't realize you were a different person.

But seriously, it's pretty funny how when I start making some good points, he attacks something I said in a way that makes it so there are two possibilities for interpretation, and in both of them, he's wrong, lol.

Reading the article and first two pages of comments I can summarize it and everything between the lines in a few simple words:

Dell, Bethesda, Games for Windows LIVE, Crysis, ATI.

Granted to all your ATI fanboys out there that ATI isn't crap, but I just bought a laptop with an ATI dedicated card, and it just behaves odd for no explainable reason. As for the rest, combining one or more of those other issues listed above is just spelling disaster for your average PC user. I'm lucky enough to have avoided most of those above and therefore have been lucky enough to have the best running PC I can ask for. Even the laptop runs fine despite its inferiority. There is undeniable virtue in having your machine and its programs just work when asked, but there is so much lost when it comes to customization and flexibility when you use a closed platform like the Xbox or iPhone.

Signa:
I just bought a laptop

There's your problem. Laptop GPUs are underpowered and prone to overheating which can make them act really fucking strange. That's one of the main reasons most publishers and developers categorically state their games don't support laptop GPUs... not because they won't work with the software but because laptop GPUs can act really fucking random and they don't want to have to deal with it.

Signa:
Reading the article and first two pages of comments I can summarize it and everything between the lines in a few simple words:

Dell, Bethesda, Games for Windows LIVE, Crysis, ATI.

Truth. All 5 of those things always have more issues than an episode of Maury. Crysis, when I played it for a while, was always buggy as hell. I'm running a fairly good machine, but I would still have issues.

I know people who constantly complain about ATI's drivers and support. Having had the good fortune to always use nVidia, I really don't know what to say about that, but I will say the the chipset companies are not equal. My dad's laptop and my laptop are exactly the same, save for the chipsets. His is the ATI equal to the 7150m on my laptop. My laptop has just a little bit better graphic output on games. Just a bit, not alot.

Windows Live is always kinda a funny system. It took me about 5 hours to try to patch the Windows Live version I was using with some game I bought. I ended up giving up, and then I got a game for Windows Live on Steam, and it worked great. Its weird like that.

Every time I try to play a Bethesda game, I always have an issue. Oblivion glitches with my game pad and joystick, Fallout 3 had a random crash when I used a certain door to leave a building, and Morrowind had its own set of issues. The games are still fun, and play easier on PC I would say, but I can see where some of those issues might be annoying.

Now, I know more people who have been screwed over by their consoles then computer owners. I have a friend who's xbox hard drive was formatted after some glitch with Fable 3 DLC. Someone else who had connection issues with their PS3 while trying to play MW2. The Red Rings anyone?

MaxPowers666:
-snip-

I had the same vista whatever screen pop up when I first installed sc2... I said,yeah ok, and clicked proceed anyway. Game works like a charm despite that warning. In fact, it has given me the least problems compared to other games, and I too am running on a computer that meets the minimal.

The only problem I had was some loss of frame-rate, but one quick stop at the options menu fixed that perfectly. If you returned the game without attempting this, then I doubt that it was the game's fault at all.

Trebort:
-snip-

Creating an entire article ending in Fuck PC Gaming because you had a few problems with some games is a bit extreme. I read this crap and as such wasted 4 minutes of my life. Fuck this stupid article, how's that?

Don't like it? Don't read it, you have no one to blame but yourself for the loss of your precious 4 minutes...

It was a display of his frustration with the problems he had, so for you to be offended by this is a bit silly. If he were to say "Fuck PC GAMERS" Then you'd have an argument. It's amazing how easily offended people can get these days.

Instead of lashing out, why not be a good member of the pc community by offering some tips or incite on how to fix his computer/gaming problem?

If my pc fails or breaks ... I can get a friend to fix it if I can't ... and usually I can pay them with a burger or some such foodstuff. I can't do that with xbox ... they just fail and fail and when you think they won't fail again they fail .... and each time instead of having the opportunity to buy m$ a burger to fix my hard earned piece of (shitty) machinery, I have to take weeks out of my gaming life, send them the garbage and have them fix it. And you're up shit creek if you're outta warranty.

I'm a ps3 and pc guy. I don't plan to change unless I get screwed. Tit for tat.

RhombusHatesYou:

Signa:
I just bought a laptop

There's your problem. Laptop GPUs are underpowered and prone to overheating which can make them act really fucking strange. That's one of the main reasons most publishers and developers categorically state their games don't support laptop GPUs... not because they won't work with the software but because laptop GPUs can act really fucking random and they don't want to have to deal with it.

It's not your standard affair of problems though. I think updated drivers help since I've not seen anything odd for a while, but when I loaded Borderlands for the first time, some textures were just plain not rendering. Also, it's almost good enough to be called a gaming laptop, so the standard laptop stereotypes do not apply to this one. Maybe overheating might be an issue at some point, but in the case of those instances, it more than likely was not. I've got a nice sheet of lexan beneath it, so it always has maximum in/outflow for air.

I used to be a HUGE ATI fanboy, because I didn't trust all the off-brand 3rd party makers of Nvidia cards, and I tried 2 Nvidia cards that just didn't work at all (probably weak power supply). However, my last card from them was the X800 and shortly after that I just stopped getting good vibes from them. Coincidentally, that's around the time that AMD took them over, and I've always got poor vibes from AMD. I'm not biased enough to recommend Intel over them when some one is trying to build a cheap, dedicated gaming machine, but something about them just reeks of being cheap and shoddy to me. Maybe it's the way they present their "charts" for the advertisements and the lame names they come up with their patented technologies. It's like they are trying to sound and look cool and hip when they should be just presenting the facts of why it's a good choice to buy them. Those words will speak loudly to me instead of looking like snakeoil bullshit.

But I digress. That's not what this thread is about, and nothing I just said above has anything to do with anything more than just opinion.

"punching baby seals"... wow...
Well this is just about one of the biggest masturbatory rants I ever read (the other being a professor of economics ranting about jeans on TED). 4 pages worth of ranting you hate PC games, and why? mainly cause you have faulty hardware. Did it really need to be 4 pages long? couldn't you waste our time with a non informing rant in fewer pages?

Enjoy Civ V.

There's clearly a hardware problem if half his games crash

This is sacrastic right?

If not, please just get a console because you obviously aren't smart enough to figure out what "update drivers, run dxdiag and error reports" is.

RhombusHatesYou:

RAKtheUndead:
PC gaming, as you mention, can be a very frustrating experience. Early adopters tend to be the hardest-hit with problems; I'm among the people who bought ARMA 2 at launch, and well, it took a fair few months for some of the missions to be patched to a state where they could be completed. Similar problems existed with Empire: Total War and the mentioned Fallout 3, both of which I purchased on the release date.

Despite that, one of the beauties of being a PC gamer is you can often find work-arounds and 3rd party patches when there is a problem rather than waiting for the developer to both admit there IS a problem and then actually pull their thumbs out of their arses and patch it.

Which reaches its logical extreme when you consider Frontier: First Encounters.

image

image

These are pictures from the same game, one with a fan-made graphical update.

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