Dead Space 2 Is No Resident Evil 4

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Dead Space 2 Is No Resident Evil 4

The necromorphs in Dead Space miss the point of horror.

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Good rant, Yahtzee.

But i must say, i think the fold-up thingy is quite cool. I mean, sure, it isn´t espcially REALISTIC or BELIEVABLE, but it looks damn cool and like you said yourself, we don´t need realism in every game, right?

all good points. still, i do feel like giving the game a try, just for the hells of it (there aint much of anything else insteresting coming out).
also, i kind wish you would have reviewed Vanquish. ;~;

I know exactly what you mean. The bit in Iron Man 2 where the entire Iron Man suit fits into a briefcase just made me say, "Really?" That thing can't possibly stop bullets AND make you super strong AND fold into a tiny briefcase. I think you'd have trouble fitting a suit and a pair of shoes into a briefcase.

Shout outs to American Werewolf In London! Great film.

The section with the straight jacket did remind me of RE4 in the village at the start.

The sections with Isaac's dead girlfriend showing up or deranged people were the most horrific though giving off a F.E.A.R. vibe("we're going to burn for what we did to you, Isaac", exploding baby, etc)

As for the helmet, would you honestly turn down something that cool, simply because it doesn't obey the laws of science...?

Wow, I never thought about those foldy-up helmets like that. I'm usually good at noticing subtle stupid things like that but definitely not this time. I always just thought they looked cool. But now it's going to be one of those things like "Once you've seen it you can't un-see it".

I don't care much for horror games in general though, especially not ones like Dead Space 2 that try too hard. If I'm going to ever play a horror game or watch a horror movie, it has to win me over with subtlety and grace. I know it's a weird thing to suggest, but the haunted mansion level in Super Mario 64 was probably the most fun I'd ever had being frightened, just because the environment and atmosphere were well-placed and things were good at startling me.

Its called bad project management... They wanted to be THIS and THIS and THIS and THIS.. oh and THAT and THAT and THAT... I agree in 90% with what Yahtzee says, but then again we need to ask ourselves who they are selling the game to: To us, people who expect a complete package in our game (most of us being "Oldschool" players) or people who are all about graphics and don't care - if its dark and full of gore, its scary (something, what in my mind a Halo fanboy would think).

hawk533:
I know exactly what you mean. The bit in Iron Man 2 where the entire Iron Man suit fits into a briefcase just made me say, "Really?" That thing can't possibly stop bullets AND make you super strong AND fold into a tiny briefcase. I think you'd have trouble fitting a suit and a pair of shoes into a briefcase.

He was supposed to be IRON man, but he became Artificial Spiderman... my bro had the same reaction as you did, and all I had to say to him "u jelly?". You know, I think it wasn't supposed to be a serious movie (unlike the comics, which came across quite so) but Dead Space 2, yeah that is really trying hard at being serious.

Two slight points of disagreement.

First, the fact that people argue over the intention or meaning of something doesn't mean that it did a poor job of getting its meaning across. There are whole college courses taught in literary analysis, and not a single one of them consists of a whole group of people trivially going through every work agreeing on what it was trying to say or do.

Second, regarding the helmet thing, it's true that it would offer less protection, but modern engineers wear plastic hardhats on site. How much protection do you really need? And you're not going to misplace it, so that's nice. The fact that it's used in combat is sort of an unhappy turn of events that they probably weren't planning for when they designed the thing.

'Well, is Dead Space 2 even trying to be a horror?'

It's a fair argument.

From what I saw it said pretty clearly 'I'm a great action shooter with some creepy parts!' The box says it's 'gruesome', not scary.

The tone throughout is action shooter with creepy elements. Yeah, if shifts from time to time, that's true.... but I would have thought Yahtzee would have an appreciation for pacing and dynamics, it would be boring to have the same tone through the whole game.

People argue over the meaning of Citizen Kane. Does that make it a bad film?

Judge it on what it's trying to achieve and doing well - being a great action shooter - not on what a Resi 4 did or what your expectations were.

.

I can't wait to see how many people missed the sarcasm in the last paragraph *makes popcorn*

On the subject of the necromorph crying out in pain or for death,

I'm afraid i have to resort to the canonical explanation for it. After beating the first game you unlock some secret text logs in a new game+. One of theese logs explains that the virus recombines dead flesh and repurposes it to a specific role or for reproduction. Also another log describes how in a recombination process for 'stingers' and 'infectors' how thier heads split open for some reason.

All in all, if the reanimated corpse still has its former self-awareness, too much brain would have been lost or recombined to remember anything or maybe even to be sentient.

And yes i do agree with one thing Yahtzee said (or wrote), the game is just inconsistent in its messages. Gameplay is a sci-fi/gore fans dream and the story just feels like it was just stapled in then revelant cutscenes added afterwards.

I think the helmet thing basically comes down to the "Rule of Cool." I agree it's dumb, but guys like Iron Man have a heart-sized nuclear reactor that can outdo the military's best toys.

A Curious Fellow:
I can't wait to see how many people missed the sarcasm in the last paragraph *makes popcorn*

It's still serious to me!

Wait, wait...

You did play Vanquish? Where's the god-damn review? You reviewed Fable 3 and A Shadow's Tale while having a perfectly good Shinji Mikami game you could have reviewed? I'm sure I don't need to remind you that Shinji Mikami is the man behind Resident Evil 4, no less.

Forget all this Dead Space 2 nonsense, we already know you didn't like it and we know why. Go review Vanquish.

Dr. Salvador and his chainsaw. That was genuine horror. As for DS2 I've only played the demo, and it was entretaining. "te voy a matar!" Vroom, Vrooom, nyeeeeeeeeeeee!!!

Im not sure that arguing over what Dead Space is suppose to be is a bad thing, considering people argue over the meaning of literature.

As for the helmet... I think the idea of compacting anything is just wierd. My main problem with Iron Man and Vanquish is the armor being several hundred parts that fit together, and it works perfectly. Go back and watch the scene in Iron Man 1, where Tony tries the suits flight abilities for the first time, right before he does it, the suit adjusts itself.

Here is the clip, but the uploader edited himself into it (Im assuming,) but it still shows what im talking about.


Just watch from the start till 1:40.

I hate the idea of all these little parts fitting together, just seems that making a power armor thats two or three (counting the helmet as seperate piece) is more practicle than a suit of armor that reqiures hundreds of small components being assembled by half a dozen robotic arms, and basically cant be removed or equiped in the field. I let it slide for the Space MArines from SC, simply because they only do it once (before meeting a untimely, but predictable, death).

I would've thought being able to climb a ladder backwards while loading two handed weapons would be the more damning fact about Half-life.

Why those fold-able futuristic helmets exists?

For the same reason a lot of stuff exists. The same reason a sword can cut through a tank, why people are toughest the less armor they wear and why most martial artists prefer to flip from point A to point B instead of just walk from point A to point B: Rule of Cool. http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/RuleOfCool

Extra points if the folding/unfolding process makes some sound... Something no material would do when folding.

Really, your suspension of disbelief must be really low if that is considered a reasonable rant about the game.

Huh, I was gonna mention the zombies from Half-Life that sounded disturbing when you were close and then he goes and throws in that series in the end.

Touché, herr Yahtzee.

Labcoat Samurai:
Two slight points of disagreement.

First, the fact that people argue over the intention or meaning of something doesn't mean that it did a poor job of getting its meaning across. There are whole college courses taught in literary analysis, and not a single one of them consists of a whole group of people trivially going through every work agreeing on what it was trying to say or do.

Second, regarding the helmet thing, it's true that it would offer less protection, but modern engineers wear plastic hardhats on site. How much protection do you really need? And you're not going to misplace it, so that's nice. The fact that it's used in combat is sort of an unhappy turn of events that they probably weren't planning for when they designed the thing.

Books leave far more to the imagination and consequently create far more varied interpretations. Most films and games don't, they, in far more direct way, project an idea/theme/emotion etc. in order to create a specific response in a viewer.

There may be some interpretation as to the meaning of certain things, but themes/maturity/seriousness would not be one of them, especially in an EA game with heavy reliance on cliché's to develop itself (nothing wrong with clichés mind you, as long as they are done right). The game tries, like its predecessor to be deep and engaging, but as yahtzee said, fails to avoid wanton gore and scares, when it should have focused on the context of said gore and scares.

Personally I don't mind folding helmets... but it doesn't always need to be folding helmets. As far as I can tell, it's just another trend purely for flash. The context (yet again) is rarely considered.

Actually, the intro to Dead Space 2 is the fastest a transformation has ever occurred in the games. Usually, the person has to be dead for a fair amount of time before the flying vagina has its way with the it and even then it takes anywhere from ~5-10 seconds of sinew snapping and bone exploding before the shambling monstrosity is battle ready. Hell, I think that's literally the only occurrence where life->death->necromorph was so fast. I really believe Yahtzee is grasping for straws with that scene...granted, the fast-pass transformation is one of the first things you see in the game, but still.

Oh, and don't tell me the Stalker necromorphs didn't freak you out with their bloody bone dog faces quizzically peering out behind corners before they blind sided you and took 1/2 of your health.

gigastar:
And yes i do agree with one thing Yahtzee said (or wrote), the game is just inconsistent in its messages. Gameplay is a sci-fi/gore fans dream and the story just feels like it was just stapled in then revelant cutscenes added afterwards.

That is a pretty serious problem in most games, even the good ones.

Some of the examples I can think of include Niko Bellic (troublesome, angsty past vs running over hookers and shooting cars with a bazooka), Chuck Greene (concerned parent of his motherless daughter vs riding on a tricycle over zombies wearing a bra) or even Bioshock's Jack (all the deep, intellectual conflicts can be solved with a hand that shoots bees and a wrench to the face)

I believe the main problem is that designers have a hard time marring a relatable character (which most confuse with troubled and angsty) with a badass force of nature most designers want to evoke. One of the best characters in that sense was Kratos in God of War 1, until the new directors make him extra angsty and extra badass at the same time for no good reason.

Why does everything have to do one job? In the example of Dead Space 2, it is a mixture of psychological and action horror, with both done in moderation to achieve something in the middle. True, I never felt scared, but the point of the necromorph's, like zombies, is that they make a risky encounter with them more tense than a similar situation with mere human opponents. I thought it was pretty well paced and enjoyable, and applaud the small humorous event on the Ishimura.

"Isaac, they're coming through a hole in the Medical Bay"

"Good thing I'm not going through there then"

EMERGENCY TRAM SHUTDOWN. TRACK AHEAD BLOCKED. WELCOME TO THE MEDICAL BAY.

"Oh, great"

Those helmets really fold away into trouser space, much like the stuff you used to pick up in adventure games.

DeliciousCake:
Actually, the intro to Dead Space 2 is the fastest a transformation has ever occurred in the games. Usually, the person has to be dead for a fair amount of time before the flying vagina has its way with the it and even then it takes anywhere from ~5-10 seconds of sinew snapping and bone exploding before the shambling monstrosity is battle ready.

You think 5-10 seconds is a long time?

Tangentially, I don't know why the zombies' wailing in Half Life 2 was scrambled or played backwards or whatever. "Oh, God, help me!" is a lot scarier than "Yabba! My icing!"

Fronzel:

DeliciousCake:
Actually, the intro to Dead Space 2 is the fastest a transformation has ever occurred in the games. Usually, the person has to be dead for a fair amount of time before the flying vagina has its way with the it and even then it takes anywhere from ~5-10 seconds of sinew snapping and bone exploding before the shambling monstrosity is battle ready.

You think 5-10 seconds is a long time?

The point is they've been dead for a while before the actual transformation. I'll concede the actual transformation is rather quick, but the point is that the first transformation you see in Dead Space 2 is not a common occurrence.

I haven't played the game, so I can't be sure how good a point he's actually making. Maybe he's right about the tone being inconsistent, I mean those little baby necromorphs I've seen in some videos looked kinda funny to me and that's probably not what the developers were going for. I don't know, maybe I should rent it.

And I am so glad that I'm not the only one who has a problem with the damn folding helmet!

Ah, folding helmets. Trying to find the balance between making a character more personal and showing practicality means lots of games sit on the fence.

Would Master Chief be a more human and personal character if he took off his helmet and you could see his face? Or even if his visor did that ODST fade in/fade out thing? If you could see his face move when he talks? It would be easy to picture it trapped inside that helmet during gameplay sections. The same goes for Isacc, if we never see his face we don't have a connection, he could be difficult to identify with. Also, he must have taken his helmet off at some time, just like Gordon Freeman must have spoken at least one word at some point in his life. Or he might be the most socially awkward person ever.

A characters head is its most defining feature. In RPGs the opportunity to customise a characters appearance is very head centric, a helmet (especially a full face one) takes this away. In games where the option to wear a helmet is there, both myself and everyone I know shuns the added protection that could make the difference between victory and defeat in favour of seeing their characters face. Even ones that don't cover the full face get left behind. They make a player character, the special chosen one destined to be awesome in some capacity, a RANK AND FILE. Exactly the opposite of what is wanted.

Theres no proble with taking off a full face helmet in a properly safe and secure place, however, in the middle of a necromorph attack is not the best place to show what the character looks like.

Ragsnstitches:

Books leave far more to the imagination and consequently create far more varied interpretations. Most films and games don't, they, in far more direct way, project an idea/theme/emotion etc. in order to create a specific response in a viewer.

Books leave more to the imagination, but that doesn't mean that they don't intend to elicit a particular response. Not all of them do, but then neither do all films.

Edit: to add to this, I would point out that a work of literature may have more varied interpretations among amateurs not familiar with the work and its context than they have among those who are well versed. So it doesn't only matter *that* there's disagreement, but it also matters *who* is disagreeing.

There may be some interpretation as to the meaning of certain things, but themes/maturity/seriousness would not be one of them, especially in an EA game with heavy reliance on cliché's to develop itself (nothing wrong with clichés mind you, as long as they are done right). The game tries, like its predecessor to be deep and engaging, but as yahtzee said, fails to avoid wanton gore and scares, when it should have focused on the context of said gore and scares.

Sure, I don't tend to think that Dead Space is something that's hard to interpret, though I personally don't have a problem with it having gore and startle tactics on its toolbelt. Really, my point was just that disagreement isn't a clear indicator of messy thematic development and unclear direction. I personally think it *is* clear that the game is meant to be serious.

The first trandformation of the game is pretty stupid to be honest. While I can live with the idea that the necromorphes can take over dead tissue and use the biomass to essentially great new life it should be somewhat harder when done to an essentially living organisem (as in someone just killed so that the whole body hasn't died yet). The immune system should be fighting back or someothing. Then again a procces that can revive and transform a body to the degree we see in the game might be able to overwhelm the immune system I suppose.

As for the helmet I might be able to live with it if it was just the front part that folded up a bit. Maybe having it being in 3 or 4 parts. As it is I must agree it is kinda silly.

Ultimately I like the game. I think it tells little stories well. Walking through the unitology residential area is really disturbing. Seeing text on the walls calling death a necesary step and then running across all the suicides. Walking into appartments and finding text on the wall saying "I don't want to die" - in the childrens room. A personal favorit moment is when 2 people are running from a room or rather one is dragging the other as the other is trying to return, evidently to get someone who is obviously doomed. Then after going in to the appartment they came from you fight... something (can't remember)... then as you leave a necromorph shows up. Inspection of it shows that it has the same hair cut and clothes as the second of the 2 people that "escaped".

Incidentally I can say that it was the Zero Punctuation review of the first game that made me buy that one and my enjoyment of it, that made me buy the second one.

Dead Space is way scarier than RE4 if you ask me, not counting the Regenerators, but totally agree on the helmet-rant.

I remember that scene in Iron Man 2 where he takes out the suit. I thought, man Stark has been working out cuz that thing must weigh at least a hundred pounds.
Still though, if I'm not on the job, it'll be a real pain in the ass carrying that helmet around everywhere. Knowing me I'll be in the cantina when the necromorphs show up and I'll have left my helmet on my bunk.

Rule of Cool Yahtzee, Rule of Cool.

A page dedicated to a badass helmet? Blasphemy, I say!

In Dead Space: Extraction, they actually did pull of their helmets and set them down (RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE WALKWAY. Inconsiderate jerks.) and it took painfully long. I prefer the automatic fold-down helmets, if only for the aesthetics.

Anyway, I agree with the above posters, Yahtzee. If you played Vanquish, it must be reviewed! (I thought the game could have been better if 99.9% of the enemies weren't RUSSIAN and robots. So...I don't even know how to describe it. 'Hey, we beat the Russians!' 'Yeah, about that...' 'I bet we killed all them dirty, dirty commies!' 'Well...no. They were all robots. They lost enough metal to build a city and a few billion dollars.' 'Well, we lost less, right?' 'Weeeeeell...we lost most of our fleet, and pretty much 95% of the army. But hey, we still have Sam Gideon! Oh. Wait. This report says he died of lung cancer. Well FFFFFFFFFF-'

...I lost my train of thought.

I'm sorry Yahtzee i really appreciate your work and you are one of my role models,but i have to disagree with you on this one.So..let's cut straight to the chase: the helmet in dead space 2.Yea well... you see plot holes like this are in any sci fi game and even in other fantasy games and resiliently defending the opinion that it just cracks up the game because it is a major plothole is just silly to me.I can give you a trillion examples of plotholes like this for mass effect 1&2(great games btw), deus ex,or any star wars game(/movie) in fact.
Reducing plotholes to zero can only be done by hiding technological details in such great depths,stuff that ordinary people cannot explain(im reffering here to stuff like worm holes,transportation at the speed of light,hell even circuits are a fucking mistery to me :P ).And i'm not saying that they should exist,but i'd rather put my dev team to focus on more important stuff like character development or storyline progression,stuff like this.

p.s: i think that the dead space 2 helmet is fucking awesome and it actually acts like a trademark for the game.As a gamer i say that,fuck me if it's not bulletproof or air-sealed,it looks fucking cool! :)

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