Magic the Gathering Tactics Review

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Magic was always about dropping $$$. No surprise that the game hasn't changed.

domicius:
Magic was always about dropping $$$. No surprise that the game hasn't changed.

Early on, MTG was a game of strategy. You could win with $20 worth of cards, total, even when facing people who seemed to have a substantial advantage in card power.

But, yes, the entire reason I stopped playing a decade ago was because it went from "You can win with raw strategy and mediocre cards" to "He who can spend the most automatically wins."

There was nothing wrong with giving a slight tactical advantage to rarer cards, but there's a point where "slight advantage" becomes "This Card's Controller Wins the Game on His or Her Next Turn"

domicius:
Magic was always about dropping $$$. No surprise that the game hasn't changed.

If you want Magic fun without the cashgrab, get Duels of the Planeswalkers from XBLA. You don't have a whole lot of freedom in deck construction but at least you know the guy with the fattest wallet won't automatically curbstomp you either. You can then shell out for the expansions if you'd like a couple more decks available to you.

Captcha: orispa kalgebra - sounds like the incantation for a spell that does my math homework.

Sorry, but the last Magic:The Gathering game for xbox got me so disappointed that I will never, EVER buy another one, unless they actually provide around 2k different cards and let you play virtual M:tG online.
Either give me a deck of cards, or stop making these games. Horrib, evil things -.-

Edit:

If you want Magic fun without the cashgrab, get Duels of the Planeswalkers from XBLA. You don't have a whole lot of freedom in deck construction but at least you know the guy with the fattest wallet won't automatically curbstomp you either. You can then shell out for the expansions if you'd like a couple more decks available to you.

Captcha: orispa kalgebra - sounds like the incantation for a spell that does my math homework.

Holy crap, I did not know this. Thanks for the info. Might even pick up my old Xbox Live subscription just for this.

i just stay with my old duels of the planeswalkers on my old laptop
image
quite limited in cards and damn hard, but really fun

Digital "booster packs".
Brilliant idea. No thanks, I prefer games that aren't sold in hundreds of random pieces.

RvLeshrac:

domicius:
Magic was always about dropping $$$. No surprise that the game hasn't changed.

Early on, MTG was a game of strategy. You could win with $20 worth of cards, total, even when facing people who seemed to have a substantial advantage in card power.

But, yes, the entire reason I stopped playing a decade ago was because it went from "You can win with raw strategy and mediocre cards" to "He who can spend the most automatically wins."

There was nothing wrong with giving a slight tactical advantage to rarer cards, but there's a point where "slight advantage" becomes "This Card's Controller Wins the Game on His or Her Next Turn"

Sure, WOTC and Hasbro need to make money to keep the game afloat. If you want a way to play MtG with a low buy-in, do a draft or play a free online program like Cockatrice or Magic Workstation. As a matter of fact, Booster Drafts are probably some of the most skill-testing events in the Magic experience, and are always a flat rate of 10-15 bills.

For the record, Kuldotha Red is a Standard (Type 2) deck that can cost less than 40 bucks. It has one of the strongest matchups against the "super expensive" decks of the format.

Card prices are driven by player demand, not the company that makes them. Sure, mythic rares have driven up the price-curve, but there will always be a "budget" deck. That's how it's always been.

tl;dr: Magic really doesn't have to be that expensive, and it definitely isn't all about the most expensive cards.

All "collectible"/gambling games should be considered a form of gambling and should be regulated by state gaming commissions, including prohibition against selling them to anyone under 18.

I'm pushing 50 hard, and that's how baseball cards were sold when I was a little kid. You got your bubblegum and your random assortment of cards, and you hoped to get the ones you really wanted. It's a little late in the game to start banning this now.

It's not just Mythic Rares, since they stopped printing cards like Lightning bolt and Rancor, then slowed the game down to enforce multi colour strategy it's been a while since you could do a deck with more than dozen uncommon/common cards, lands included. People really need to switch to Warhammer Invasion, if someone would do an online version of that then I;d really take notice.

Edit: So I'm pretty out of date after giving up Magic in disgust a few years ago with how money driven it had got. Seeing as how they have Rare dual lands that are just better than basics even in mono it's got a long way to go before it's not quite the money game it was in the day, but they have started printing usable commons.

I decided I wouldn't play Tactics when I heard them say, "It has more strategy and depth than the actual card game." No, just no. That was a slap in the face to all the dedicated players of the game, and whoever green lit that should be demoted to janitor. Anyway, I'm off to play a tournament of real MtG, tra-la-la-la-la...

Or you can go play "Heroes of Might & Magic 5".
I wonder why you said nothing about it. I mean the fights are pretty similar looking + better grapics and a free to play campaign (after you bought the game ;-)

Man I really dont like these card games anymore, but still got some Magic and Yu-Gi-Oh cards at home... So much wasted money.

btw. I believe that was my first post so I should say: "Hello Forum"
or what?

I still play MTG online for free with my friends and all of us decided to use cards that are only prior to 8th edition (or when the artwork changed and cards became way to powerful). We have a ton of fun but it is hard to find others who play the game before it got out of hand

gusplaysmagic:

RvLeshrac:

domicius:
Magic was always about dropping $$$. No surprise that the game hasn't changed.

Early on, MTG was a game of strategy. You could win with $20 worth of cards, total, even when facing people who seemed to have a substantial advantage in card power.

But, yes, the entire reason I stopped playing a decade ago was because it went from "You can win with raw strategy and mediocre cards" to "He who can spend the most automatically wins."

There was nothing wrong with giving a slight tactical advantage to rarer cards, but there's a point where "slight advantage" becomes "This Card's Controller Wins the Game on His or Her Next Turn"

Sure, WOTC and Hasbro need to make money to keep the game afloat. If you want a way to play MtG with a low buy-in, do a draft or play a free online program like Cockatrice or Magic Workstation. As a matter of fact, Booster Drafts are probably some of the most skill-testing events in the Magic experience, and are always a flat rate of 10-15 bills.

For the record, Kuldotha Red is a Standard (Type 2) deck that can cost less than 40 bucks. It has one of the strongest matchups against the "super expensive" decks of the format.

Card prices are driven by player demand, not the company that makes them. Sure, mythic rares have driven up the price-curve, but there will always be a "budget" deck. That's how it's always been.

tl;dr: Magic really doesn't have to be that expensive, and it definitely isn't all about the most expensive cards.

HAHA, have you even played in the last year, or do you just read the tournament reports. Yes, Kuldotha red is cheap, for the time being. But Goblin Guide and warzones are on the rise. Also, more importantly, the deck is not as good as you think it is. It does have the potential to win on turns 2 or 3, but this is with the god hand. Mediocre hands can sometimes get there, and crappy hands net you with 5 0 power creatures and nothing to do. So the deck's high variance will prevent it from ever becoming a good deck.

Enter Jace, the Mindsculptor, the poster boy of what Magic has become. 100 dollars for 1 of these bad boys, and most decks that play the color Blue play 4. If you play blue and don't play this card, you lose to blue decks that do. This card dominates the format, along with such other pricy mythics like Primeval Titan, and Tezzeret 2.0.

It is ridiculously expensive to make decks. You need to have access to at least 600-800 dollars to make a deck that will consistently win tournaments these days. This game is not going to change that in any way, since everyone would just rather play for free than spend that much money on cards that lose their value in a years time.

Blazingdragoon04:

It is ridiculously expensive to make decks. You need to have access to at least 600-800 dollars to make a deck that will consistently win tournaments these days. This game is not going to change that in any way, since everyone would just rather play for free than spend that much money on cards that lose their value in a years time.

This is why I only ever play booster draft tournaments.

Am i the only one having trouble with theses videos? the sound isnt sinc with the video and the video is choppy. i have no problems with ZP, MB, and Extra credit.

Blazingdragoon04:

gusplaysmagic:

RvLeshrac:

Early on, MTG was a game of strategy. You could win with $20 worth of cards, total, even when facing people who seemed to have a substantial advantage in card power.

But, yes, the entire reason I stopped playing a decade ago was because it went from "You can win with raw strategy and mediocre cards" to "He who can spend the most automatically wins."

There was nothing wrong with giving a slight tactical advantage to rarer cards, but there's a point where "slight advantage" becomes "This Card's Controller Wins the Game on His or Her Next Turn"

Sure, WOTC and Hasbro need to make money to keep the game afloat. If you want a way to play MtG with a low buy-in, do a draft or play a free online program like Cockatrice or Magic Workstation. As a matter of fact, Booster Drafts are probably some of the most skill-testing events in the Magic experience, and are always a flat rate of 10-15 bills.

For the record, Kuldotha Red is a Standard (Type 2) deck that can cost less than 40 bucks. It has one of the strongest matchups against the "super expensive" decks of the format.

Card prices are driven by player demand, not the company that makes them. Sure, mythic rares have driven up the price-curve, but there will always be a "budget" deck. That's how it's always been.

tl;dr: Magic really doesn't have to be that expensive, and it definitely isn't all about the most expensive cards.

HAHA, have you even played in the last year, or do you just read the tournament reports. Yes, Kuldotha red is cheap, for the time being. But Goblin Guide and warzones are on the rise. Also, more importantly, the deck is not as good as you think it is. It does have the potential to win on turns 2 or 3, but this is with the god hand. Mediocre hands can sometimes get there, and crappy hands net you with 5 0 power creatures and nothing to do. So the deck's high variance will prevent it from ever becoming a good deck.

Enter Jace, the Mindsculptor, the poster boy of what Magic has become. 100 dollars for 1 of these bad boys, and most decks that play the color Blue play 4. If you play blue and don't play this card, you lose to blue decks that do. This card dominates the format, along with such other pricy mythics like Primeval Titan, and Tezzeret 2.0.

It is ridiculously expensive to make decks. You need to have access to at least 600-800 dollars to make a deck that will consistently win tournaments these days. This game is not going to change that in any way, since everyone would just rather play for free than spend that much money on cards that lose their value in a years time.

Bro, if we're going to get specific, I'm pretty sure Cawblade is dominating the format. So yeah, Jace, but mostly Gideon, Stoneforge and Feast/Famine. But whatever, you seem to have an iron grasp of what a "metagame" is.

Honestly though, if you need to spend a grand to win your local FNM, you're doing it wrong, not to mention, you're probably a netdecking scrub with no building skills. Be creative. The sweetest answers to Jace are commons and uncommons. Also, not literally everyone would rather play for free, or they would... and the game would stop getting published.

So, yes, to play professional caliber Magic, it takes a certain monetary investment, much like... anything... professional... but you need to keep in mind that 98% of people who shuffle Magic decks daily don't play on the Pro Tour.

Last, I'd like to ask, lol why you mad tho?

I just downloaded it and gave it a shot. I dunno what's with tactical card games and early-game challenges but I almost got my ass handed to me on like the first 3 levels. Summons an invincible creature that deals 40 damage per turn, what the hell??

It's definitely fun, but I still love Yu-Gi-Oh Duellists of the Roses, and hands-down prefer it over this. It just sucks that it's completely offline.

gusplaysmagic:

Blazingdragoon04:

gusplaysmagic:

Sure, WOTC and Hasbro need to make money to keep the game afloat. If you want a way to play MtG with a low buy-in, do a draft or play a free online program like Cockatrice or Magic Workstation. As a matter of fact, Booster Drafts are probably some of the most skill-testing events in the Magic experience, and are always a flat rate of 10-15 bills.

For the record, Kuldotha Red is a Standard (Type 2) deck that can cost less than 40 bucks. It has one of the strongest matchups against the "super expensive" decks of the format.

Card prices are driven by player demand, not the company that makes them. Sure, mythic rares have driven up the price-curve, but there will always be a "budget" deck. That's how it's always been.

tl;dr: Magic really doesn't have to be that expensive, and it definitely isn't all about the most expensive cards.

HAHA, have you even played in the last year, or do you just read the tournament reports. Yes, Kuldotha red is cheap, for the time being. But Goblin Guide and warzones are on the rise. Also, more importantly, the deck is not as good as you think it is. It does have the potential to win on turns 2 or 3, but this is with the god hand. Mediocre hands can sometimes get there, and crappy hands net you with 5 0 power creatures and nothing to do. So the deck's high variance will prevent it from ever becoming a good deck.

Enter Jace, the Mindsculptor, the poster boy of what Magic has become. 100 dollars for 1 of these bad boys, and most decks that play the color Blue play 4. If you play blue and don't play this card, you lose to blue decks that do. This card dominates the format, along with such other pricy mythics like Primeval Titan, and Tezzeret 2.0.

It is ridiculously expensive to make decks. You need to have access to at least 600-800 dollars to make a deck that will consistently win tournaments these days. This game is not going to change that in any way, since everyone would just rather play for free than spend that much money on cards that lose their value in a years time.

Bro, if we're going to get specific, I'm pretty sure Cawblade is dominating the format. So yeah, Jace, but mostly Gideon, Stoneforge and Feast/Famine. But whatever, you seem to have an iron grasp of what a "metagame" is.

Honestly though, if you need to spend a grand to win your local FNM, you're doing it wrong, not to mention, you're probably a netdecking scrub with no building skills. Be creative. The sweetest answers to Jace are commons and uncommons. Also, not literally everyone would rather play for free, or they would... and the game would stop getting published.

So, yes, to play professional caliber Magic, it takes a certain monetary investment, much like... anything... professional... but you need to keep in mind that 98% of people who shuffle Magic decks daily don't play on the Pro Tour.

Last, I'd like to ask, lol why you mad tho?

Hold on i just had a look at "Jace, the Mind Sculptor" I've been away from the game for a bit and i'm not very familiar with Planes Walkers and Exile. Namely Exile though, I looked up the rules for that and it looks like for 12 (counters?) Jace removes the opposing players ENTIRE library from the game? They don't come back over the a period of time or anything, and theres no way to get them back? That sounds incredibly broken for something you can do 5 turns after the card comes into play. But maybe there are rules with the Planes Walkers i don't know about that balances it.

In any case, i'm not exactly stoked about having to buy individual spells or even boosters to be competitive in MTG Tactics. It just seems silly to add in the card collecting aspect to a TBS game. It just doesn't make much scene to me to limit the players abilities to how much they're willing to spend + a random factor.

Idk i absolutely LOVE MTG TCG, but i always felt like i could do just as well with a bunch of commons and uncommon (and a few rares) put together in creative ways as i could if someone gave me an infinite budget to spend on cards. But in Tactics you don't even get the joy of crafting your deck. But then i haven't tried tactics yet, so maybe i'm wrong, but then i'm not planning on spending money on it when I do, so maybe i'll never know.

One last thing though, i've seen multilayer TBS done before, maybe it was just poorly done, but the game took FOREVER if it had more than 2 people, and still a long time if it was just 2, but magic could be long too so IDK.

Yeah I'll check out what's free.

What I learned from Playing Duels of the Planeswalkers is that M:TG is just an okay game. Why the exorbitant popularity? I'm not sure but I think is due to the card collecting and social aspect of it. It's way too random; usually in the first 5 draws I know which side is going to win, based on the random element of drawing the right mix of lands, spells, and summons. Sometimes there were turnarounds based on a change of luck and my skillful play, but those were in the considerable minority.

The random element is good because it means that not-so-good players with not-so-good decks still have a fighting chance to win if they draw all the right cards and their opponent draws all the wrong ones. I think this is for the best in an actual social gathering--particularly a small one with a wide range of abilities and decks. But for a computer game it feels cheesy.

Plus charging nearly the same for virtual decks as real ones? Sony... WTF?

Eye of Judgment tried to get people to pay hundreds of dollars to unlock the full game, by buying all the cards, and look how that one turned out. Personally I though EOJ was better balanced and less random than M:TG, and at least as fun, but mixing a collectible card game with a virtual playing field just didn't fly. Also BattleForge? Anybody remember that one? Same thing, it was a well done game but failed because it tried to pry hundreds of dollars out of us to fully unlock an ordinary strategy game--and gamers, to their credit, just didn't bite.

I don't understand games like these, just charge $60, give us the full campaign and some booster packs. After people get a real feel for the game they'll shell out even more for more booster packs. By releasing just a piece of a piece of a game for free and telling us to buy to unlock the rest just pushes the customers away.

I tried the game a couple of weeks ago, and found it... jarring. The cards I am familiar with had a different wording, and creatures that in normal Magic would live for turn after turn (e.g. the unblockable Phantom Warrior) were killed immediately after attacking (making them seem expensive for their effect).

The added 'battlefield', which should add strategic depth, for me felt weird. I don't want to spend turns moving creatures around obstacles, I wanted them attacking (or defending me).

tl;dr: Creatures felt weird, combat felt weird, didn't play much.

I really hate the concept of paying for electronic versions of cards.

If an M:TG game is to be made, I wish it would be a remake of the fantastic 1997 game Duels of the Planeswalkers (not to be confused with the recent game of the same name, which is mediocre and limited).

Rey Bangs:
Or you can go play "Heroes of Might & Magic 5".
I wonder why you said nothing about it. I mean the fights are pretty similar looking + better grapics and a free to play campaign (after you bought the game ;-)

Man I really dont like these card games anymore, but still got some Magic and Yu-Gi-Oh cards at home... So much wasted money.

btw. I believe that was my first post so I should say: "Hello Forum"
or what?

Yeh i was like wtf? the entire bloody layout was almost a homm5 clone

So I gave this whirl when the preview was put up. My experience was pretty sour. The missions were easy enough, but the online play was purely pay to win. I tried to create some sort of weenie party that could do something, but after two matches it was clear that one trick ponies (stasis deck back in the day) would win. My first match was against a player that would summon a creature that would let him draw another card if he happen to cast an enchantment. Okay...then he used that trick to pull out a card that would double his health and another card that would increase his attack at the cost of health. I remember when you would only be allowed by normal rules to have like one of those in your deck. So he had over a 1000 health and 280 attack or 28/108 for the trading card people. I would tell you the outcome, but I used best spell for that game Alt+F4. I had a few more matches that were clear losses because I had a blue/black weenie patrol. I went blue because I thought I could get interrupts easily to throw off the other players, maybe if I dump $100 into it. Basically, you can grind forever and just be wasting your time it seems.

Fearzone:
Yeah I'll check out what's free.

What I learned from Playing Duels of the Planeswalkers is that M:TG is just an okay game. Why the exorbitant popularity? I'm not sure but I think is due to the card collecting and social aspect of it. It's way too random; usually in the first 5 draws I know which side is going to win, based on the random element of drawing the right mix of lands, spells, and summons. Sometimes there were turnarounds based on a change of luck and my skillful play, but those were in the considerable minority.

Stop right there, I can't vouch for the Xbox one but in the actual game skill and planning make a much greater impact than luck, though I will admit that luck can play a huge part.
There's no greater feeling than winning in one blow from behind when they were dominating you and were one move away from victory, wether by luck or design.

OT: I'm not gonna pay the same price for a virtual boodter deck that I would for a pysical object, I'll stick to real cards thanks.

As someone who first picked up Magic in 1995 and has never played a "tactics" game before, I had no difficulty with the concepts that were different, like mana. So it surprises me when I see reviews saying that's hard to learn. Just approach Tactics as a different game with enough similarity to be familiar. or better yet, don't, because it has serious problems.

The interface was frustratingly clunky. I often found it hard to move the display to the battlefield area I cared about. And it lacked consistency: to get info on a creature or spell you right-click it. To get info on a spell the opponent cast, first find the combat og and then double-left click it. (Right does nothing.) This was unintuitive and frustrating.

And then as the review says, there's the cost. Magic has always been expensive, but about 3 years ago it turned a corner into picking customers up by the ankles and shaking them. Tactics is clearly following that style, with little for free and not much value from what you get. Early on some "sharks" had dreams of building a good spellbook early and then "going infinite" in tournaments. But there just aren't enough fish throwing down money and enough EV to the tournaments to make that happen. There's enough people to play if you want to play, but there's no chance of it developing the way Magic: the Gathering has.

Advice for people who want to play Magic cheap
Duels of the Planeswalkers for XBox, PS3, and Steam is a pretty good deal if you want nice graphics and a non-laughable AI. It costs something like $10 for the base game and then $5 for each expansion (sometimes sold for $2.50) which is perfectly good. I have it on my laptop if I ever want to kill time without wifi.

Alternatively, Magic: Online is actually not that badly priced if you don't get into the Limited (draft and sealed deck) scene. Many people draft regularly ($12+ per session) and then sell the proceeds to draft again. If you're not one of them, you can buy most singles pretty cheaply. Certainly enough for a casual deck. Furthermore, the game has a very active "Pauper" community (see: www.pdcmagic.com ), which means playing with commons only. You can make a top tier deck for $1-2 and face even the toughest competition.

So in review: Tactics sucks. Duels is good for just learning or playing solo, and MTG:O is pretty cheap for pauper competitive or anything casual.

I'll never ever ever ever in a million years spend any money on these damn WOTC games that think it's OK to charge full price for a booster pack when I could go to target and get 15+ psychical cards for the same price. How could they possibly think that's acceptable? Not to mention I have a chance to then sell those cards for a profit and buy even more boosters... Or lunch. At least in MTG Online they can justify it with the card trade in system to get real ones, but there is NO excuse here at all. This game will fail because of the crazy cost to play seriously, comparable to tabletop Magic but without the actual value of things your purchasing.

Not to mention the arbitrary addition of a Zero behind every creature's power and toughness gets under my skin in horrible ways. It reminds me of yugayoh and thats the very LAST thing I want to think of when I'm playing Magic.

The lack of a balance system for pairings made me no longer interested in playing MTGT.

That;s why, these days i'd rather play simplistic, VB/Java fan made M:tG simulators for free that have card lists constantly updated by the fans and are fully free to fool around wtih. Sure the AI aint amazing, sure the graphics are not there, but the core of the gameplay works and spending 20$ just so i can go through rather crappy campaign (played the free content, was not amazed) is not really worth it. There are better and cheaper games out there.

Just tried the game. I found some decks quite superior to others especially from starter decks and would not recommend starting as a red planeswalker.

Though you will get your ass handed to you agaisnt higher lvl opponents that have points in talent trees and way better spells then you and x4 of each of them.

Harbinger_:
The lack of a balance system for pairings made me no longer interested in playing MTGT.

completely agree. They need to really put low lvl vs low lvl opponents and not have a lvl 6 go against someone who is over lvl 30 and guarantee you will lose.

Yeah i just actually tried the game and it is as bad as it could have been.
Let me explain that, i felt like the "skeleton" was actually solid. But then they fleshed out that skeleton with shit. Maybe it's because my laptop is slow, but the interface was clunky, clumsy, and slow. Games that should have taken 10 min took me half an hour or more. Moving creatures, especially large ones was a bit hit or miss at times, and though i now understand how to attack from a chosen direction, it's still not the best way to do it. The attack order is something i would have to get used to but i can think of a way it could have been done better. If there was simply a countdown above every creatures head, that showed how many turns before it gets its next turn, then it would be much easier to properly plan my moves. As it is, I am often caught off guard, especially by creatures who decide that they're going to attack twice before i get my next turn. And when multiple copies of the same creature are in play i don't know how you're meant to tell them apart in the turn order.

Maybe i'm just used to advance wars (i very much wish i hadn't lost both my copies of the game right now) and fire emblem (maybe that's due for another replay... yeah lets go do that). But this thing needs a major interface overhaul before i'd be happy to play it. Also why can't i see how many cards my opponent has in their hand and how much mana they have now and will have next turn?

Oh yeah, advance wars and fire emblem, in both of them, selecting any unit would show you it's movement range, and its attack range on the borders of that by highlighting tiles in blue (move range) and orange (attack range) (in fire emblem ranged units could move and attack on the same turn, advance wars was more like this game with ranged units, you either move or attack).

Mysnomer:
I decided I wouldn't play Tactics when I heard them say, "It has more strategy and depth than the actual card game." No, just no. That was a slap in the face to all the dedicated players of the game, and whoever green lit that should be demoted to janitor. Anyway, I'm off to play a tournament of real MtG, tra-la-la-la-la...

lol, i'd have to agree with that, (especially after playing the demo) if i had to guess then i'd say that the person who wrote that wasn't very good at magic.

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