The Big Picture: Maddening

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Sorry Bob, I have to disagree.
I don't like Vick, but yes. They're just dogs. Sorry.

I'm not simply the type of christian who thinks we're above animals or what have you; I simply don't think they deserve this much respect. Until they get thumbs and start building shit, I never will.

Look, I had a cat for the first 15 years of my life. He was there when I was born and he definitely possessed some intelligence and memory. I got that. But I didn't cry when both our cats had to be put down due to sickness and then depression (Yes, our cat suffered depression after the first one died). While I can understand some of the concepts that many animals are just barely a couple steps down from us... They're still just that. Below us.

Sorry.

Susan Arendt:

boeingguy787:
Seriously, guys? NOBODY believes in second chances? I thought that the justice system was designed to rehabilitate people, and Vick seems to be rehabilitated (unlike countless others who have not changed their ways).

He got his second chance - he's still playing professional football and getting paid obscene amounts of money for it. He's been given the opportunity to make a living off his athletic prowess. Anything other than that? He was a millionaire who got his jollies torturing and killing innocent animals. He can die in a damn fire.

Are the moderators allowed to say that? Because I'm sure that if a user did, he'd get punished. Just sayin'...

I agree that it is bad taste of EA to give him the chance appear on the cover Hell, I don't think he should be allowed to play in the NFL but people here are way to harsh, it seems like the support for Death Penelty just increased more then is healthy.

I fear you might have just earned the wrath of 4chan's power to spam votes.

They hate the escapist already, and they certainly don't give a fuck about animals.

Good video, though.

I can completly agree with Bob.

It's anyones business if they forgive him and want him on a gamecover, but in my books running a dogfighting ring is prety much one of the lowest things you can do.

AvauntVanguard:
Sorry Bob, I have to disagree.
I don't like Vick, but yes. They're just dogs. Sorry.

I'm not simply the type of christian who thinks we're above animals or what have you; I simply don't think they deserve this much respect. Until they get thumbs and start building shit, I never will.

Look, I had a cat for the first 15 years of my life. He was there when I was born and he definitely possessed some intelligence and memory. I got that. But I didn't cry when both our cats had to be put down due to sickness and then depression (Yes, our cat suffered depression after the first one died). While I can understand some of the concepts that many animals are just barely a couple steps down from us... They're still just that. Below us.

Sorry.

^ #1 reason I'm an atheist.

Also,

and

and dolphins make their own toys.

Father Time:
"not saying those guys shouldn't be denied a madden cover either."

Gah. Too many double negatives.

There's one.

Susan Arendt:

boeingguy787:
Seriously, guys? NOBODY believes in second chances? I thought that the justice system was designed to rehabilitate people, and Vick seems to be rehabilitated (unlike countless others who have not changed their ways).

He got his second chance - he's still playing professional football and getting paid obscene amounts of money for it. He's been given the opportunity to make a living off his athletic prowess. Anything other than that? He was a millionaire who got his jollies torturing and killing innocent animals. He can die in a damn fire.

Saying he could "die in a damn fire" sounds like something we regular plebians could get put on probation/suspension for. Damn shame you guys can abuse the system any way you feel like it.

Well said bob. Honestly I'm sickened that Vick is even allowed to play football. Someone that deranged has no right to be a professional anything outside of a psychological case study

Did you ever think Vick has such a high rating on the polls because people are trollin'?

Bob, you're doing exactly what you hate. You hate it when people make blanket statements about things near and dear to you, so why are you doing it with Madden? Madden is its own subculture. You're obviously not a part of it, and that's fine. Just like it's fine that some people are not into what you are. Madden is not a "60 dollar roster update." It just isn't. And since you're not part of that scene, you also shouldn't be telling that scene what its place is. Football fan or not, you're obviously not a Madden fan. So who are you to say who they can or can't use for their cover? Football players don't get propped up for their great moral integrity. What Vick did was sick. No one will argue that point. But his punishment is over. It's of course fine for people to say "I'm no fan of that man and I won't encourage him with my money." But to make it a moral crusade, to say "this man did things that make ME sick, so he shouldn't be on the cover."..? You're not a guy just having an opinion, anymore. You're doing exactly what every anti-video game person does. If people want Vick, they should have him. It's not your fault if society swings towards celebrating him. Many of us think he's a shitheel, too. But don't do what every politician does to every other game. If he wins, it's because people chose him, and it doesn't mean that EA is advocating dog murder. And if their sales suffer because of a man on a box, they'll deal with it.

Great episode Bob, I really agree with everything you said, about people buying Madden annually and about Michael Vick

I really don't see the big deal. (About the cover, not the fighting ring.) I also don't respect the derision towards professional athletes. In the pantheon of society, they've always been held in high regard. Why? Because they're the pinnacle of athletic achievement. It takes a lot more skill play a sport at the highest level, than it does to spit paint on a canvas and call it expressionistic art.

In fact after watching this video, I went and voted for Vick (and Peyton Hillis).

Di'kut:

Susan Arendt:

boeingguy787:
Seriously, guys? NOBODY believes in second chances? I thought that the justice system was designed to rehabilitate people, and Vick seems to be rehabilitated (unlike countless others who have not changed their ways).

He got his second chance - he's still playing professional football and getting paid obscene amounts of money for it. He's been given the opportunity to make a living off his athletic prowess. Anything other than that? He was a millionaire who got his jollies torturing and killing innocent animals. He can die in a damn fire.

Saying he could "die in a damn fire" sounds like something we regular plebians could get put on probation/suspension for. Damn shame you guys can abuse the system any way you feel like it.

It could be considered defense of a third person (or... Animal), since he could very well go back to it.

Congrats I stopped watching your video.

I particularly stopped watching when you mentioned that what Vick did was worse than violent crimes against people.

Sorry, but to me, murdering a dog is NEVER worse than murdering a human.

Now none of this should have ANY bearing on whether or not he ends up on the cover anyway, because the cover is an honor only within the context of football. Being on the Madden cover was never in any way meant to say that "X" is a good person. Being on the Madden cover was meant to convey that "X" is REALLY GOOD AT FOOTBALL. Which Vick IS.

Gunnyboy:
I really don't see the big deal. (About the cover, not the fighting ring.) I also don't respect the derision towards professional athletes. In the pantheon of society, they've always been held in high regard. Why? Because they're the pinnacle of athletic achievement. It takes a lot more skill play a sport at the highest level, than it does to spit paint on a canvas and call it expressionistic art.

In fact after watching this video, I went and voted for Vick (and Peyton Hillis).

image

Spitting paint on a canvas.

I hope by "Go SOX!" you mean the White Sox!

But, seriously. Fuck Vick. Eating meat, wearing leather, and animal testing all serve a viable purpose in society. Nutrition, clothing, medicine.

But what Vick was doing was sick and, more importantly, served no purpose further than his own sick amusement.

Agreed, Vick should not be given any slack, but I also think that ANYONE who commits those types of crime should be seen as pontential bad news they are. I say this with the thought that if a person deems that as okay, then there's something wrong with them. I this because it isn't normal, heathy or very sane behaviour.

Also no matter how smart a person or what good they could do, if they commit a crime like this then they should not be given any slack. Sorry Moive Bob, I believe you are wrong in saying that the law should excuse someone because their smart or creative, and I say this with Roman Polanski in mind. Please note that I am note comparing the two crimes, just giving an example of how this logic fails.

KorLeonis:
I am firmly convinced that any and all professional athletes are useless sacks of flesh who are a drain on humanity and should be shot and dumped in an unmarked mass grave somewhere. Vick is despicable enough to deserve the first bullet, but I say they all get one.

If i were you, i would think about avoiding generalisations.

Let's take the NBA, for one. It's basically filled with pro athletes, right? ok.
So many of the guys there are good-hearted, fun-loving, respectable people. Many of them actively engage in different charities as they had a hard childhood and want to keep others from suffering in the same conditions.
I'm not too familiar with athletes from other fields of sport, but you can take my word on this one: these people are anything but "useless sacks of flesh".

OT: Bob makes a good point. EA having a dog torturing maniac, who also happens to be a good football player, as their representative might not be the most sensible choice.
Also, those who compare Vick to McDonalds or even different labs for testing on animals, there's a huge difference: One is having animals kill each other for money (also count in the psychological trauma these dogs are going through as they're made that unstable), the other is either going for food or advancing science as we know it.

While I'm not saying animal fighting are a good thing,are very far from it,people's reaction here are pretty damn intense.I mean,really?"He can go die in a fire"?
Look,what he did was bad,but he got punished(although he should have gotten a few more years).No,he should not get the honor of having his picture plastered on game boxes,but wishing him more harm?Even death?
You don't wish the same fate onto robbers,who can ruin a family's life for few years,and maybe cause children to suffer,but as soon as something cute gets hurt,shit gets real it seems.
And please don't give me the "dogs are defenceless" argument,someone getting robbed is just as defenceless as a dog being forced into fighting.

In conclusion,no Vick on the cover,animal torture is very bad,but stop wishing he would suffer more you bloodthristy psychos.

Didn't think you were that much of a sports fan nice to see the Pats logo drop. Every one in america knows something about football even if you hate the sport you still know something about it, you know who tom brady is or you know who peyton manning is. While I think what vick was dispicalbe he did serve his time and I have no issue with him playing in the NFL. I will say that it would be a major black eye for EA. I am a rabid nfl fan and Vick is a good player but the dog thing will always come first. He shouldn't be on the cover. People will say more often than not something about him being a dog killer. There is the curse to consider so maybe the more adiment haters of Vick will vote for him. But overall I gotta agree.

What in all fuck?

You have a hunting license but OH NO YOU MUSTN'T HURT THE CUTE LITTLE DOGGIE WOGGIES!

Here here Bob!

I'm casting my vote for anyone else

The Plunk:
What in all fuck?

You have a hunting license but OH NO YOU MUSTN'T HURT THE CUTE LITTLE DOGGIE WOGGIES!

I think it's less about the hurting of dogs and more about the torturing of them.

i don't agree.

He's repented.That's all that matters, not how much blood you want from him.

JoJoDeathunter:
Sorry Bob, but I don't agree with a lot of this, there are much worse crimes this man could have done; murder, rape, child abuse etc than simply making dogs fight each other. Sure, it's cruel alright and I wouldn't do it personally, but just as bad things go on in nature every day. Also I didn't like in your video how you dismissed a lot of the oppositions potential arguments without even explaining why you did so. I happen to believe that morals don't apply in the same way to animals as they do to humans, I don't see an issue here.

Perhaps it's time to forgive and forget, he's done his time and if he says he's sorry, then I'll accept that. Anyway, just being on the front of what quite frankly is an unimportant video game cover for just one year is hardly worth being worked up about.

Read:

Susan Arendt:
He got his second chance - he's still playing professional football and getting paid obscene amounts of money for it. He's been given the opportunity to make a living off his athletic prowess. Anything other than that? He was a millionaire who got his jollies torturing and killing innocent animals. He can die in a damn fire.

When this guy was at the apex of life, living the dream, he was entertaining himself by inflicting extreme pain on creatures. That kind of disturbed behaviour doesn't disappear overnight, nor is it even forgiveable in my eyes - there is no way someone could plead ignorance. Yes rape etc is seen as worse, but it's not a case of comparing to the worst possible act, it's looking at the act itself - getting dogs to rip each other to pieces for entertainment and profit. Sorry really isn't good enough.

Huh... Honestly, I never thought Bob would devote and entire episode jumping the throat of a single individual. I mean, I never heard about the guy, and now I do, sure, I dislike his guts!

But I guess I just hadn't thought Bob could get so personal and extreme in his shows (I mean, yeah, he's had his share of calling people out, put those were just smaller inserts in a larger statement).

Not angry, not pleased, just... surprised.

Soo....

-Bob specifically states that he does not care about the actions the US justice system towards Vick and repeatedly states what Vick has done to the "helpless animals"
-Lots of comments about how Vick "should die in a fire" and the like

quite impressive demonstration of mob justice you have there Bob :)

dunnace:
Honestly, I think you guys should put Master Chief on the cover. Apparently he sells a lot of games.

or they could release grifball 2012!

Gunnyboy:
I really don't see the big deal. (About the cover, not the fighting ring.) I also don't respect the derision towards professional athletes. In the pantheon of society, they've always been held in high regard. Why? Because they're the pinnacle of athletic achievement. It takes a lot more skill play a sport at the highest level, than it does to spit paint on a canvas and call it expressionistic art.

In fact after watching this video, I went and voted for Vick (and Peyton Hillis).

I just have to say that the cover is somewhat of a deal. It shows that EA is willing to use a man who has shown, by actions no less, that he has no ethical standing as a person representing their product. He is ethical, and likely following that morally, bankrupt. If he wasen't a sportstar, but a normal bloke he would be shunned from society. When we're in that area: Are you saying sportstars are more important in/for our culture than abstract art?

The Plunk:
What in all fuck?

You have a hunting license but OH NO YOU MUSTN'T HURT THE CUTE LITTLE DOGGIE WOGGIES!

Go back a page and read my previous post. You might learn something.

Mazty:
When this guy was at the apex of life, living the dream, he was entertaining himself by inflicting extreme pain on creatures. That kind of disturbed behaviour doesn't disappear overnight, nor is it even forgiveable in my eyes - there is no way someone could plead ignorance. Yes rape etc is seen as worse, but it's not a case of comparing to the worst possible act, it's looking at the act itself - getting dogs to rip each other to pieces for entertainment and profit. Sorry really isn't good enough.

This. I have a hard time believing it's possible to really be sorry for what he did, given what his willingness to do it in the first place says about his state of mind. That plus the fact that he was reinstated makes me very suspicious that he was just feigning repentance because his career was at stake. Tell a guy he's finished no matter what he says and then see how willing he is to say he's "turned over a new leaf".

Di'kut:

Susan Arendt:

boeingguy787:
Seriously, guys? NOBODY believes in second chances? I thought that the justice system was designed to rehabilitate people, and Vick seems to be rehabilitated (unlike countless others who have not changed their ways).

He got his second chance - he's still playing professional football and getting paid obscene amounts of money for it. He's been given the opportunity to make a living off his athletic prowess. Anything other than that? He was a millionaire who got his jollies torturing and killing innocent animals. He can die in a damn fire.

Saying he could "die in a damn fire" sounds like something we regular plebians could get put on probation/suspension for. Damn shame you guys can abuse the system any way you feel like it.

It's not against the rules. She is not flaming anyone on this site, a group of people or a content creator. This goes the same for the person who would like to "shoot him (Vick) in the head".

Exocet:
While I'm not saying animal fighting are a good thing,are very far from it,people's reaction here are pretty damn intense.I mean,really?"He can go die in a fire"?
Look,what he did was bad,but he got punished(although he should have gotten a few more years).No,he should not get the honor of having his picture plastered on game boxes,but wishing him more harm?Even death?
You don't wish the same fate onto robbers,who can ruin a family's life for few years,and maybe cause children to suffer,but as soon as something cute gets hurt,shit gets real it seems.
And please don't give me the "dogs are defenceless" argument,someone getting robbed is just as defenceless as a dog being forced into fighting.

In conclusion,no Vick on the cover,animal torture is very bad,but stop wishing he would suffer more you bloodthristy psychos.

Every time there is a crime story, half the posters wish the criminal would suffer acts much worse that those he commited.
A rich source of irony.

righthanded:
i don't know why you're so hung up on the money aspect of this. do you think an animal cares if it's being slaughtered for food or if it's being slaughtered for fun?

Yes I do.

Wow Bob. Calm down. Dont get me wrong, I love animals, and I certainly dont approve of dog fighting. I'm even willing to agree with you that Vick shouldnt be on the cover of Madden. Though I will say this, on an ethical level, I have a hard time seeing the difference between killing a dog for gambling and killing say a deer for sport. There's of course a whole other factors to concern, a deer gets to spend his life in the woods while the dog is kept in deplorable conditions. But all other factors the same, I dont see any ethical difference between killing a dog and killing a deer, and if your going to make the argument of ethics on the conditions these animals live in... well I would recommend you go visit a slaughter house some time and see the conditions the meat you buy at the super store is kept in.

Dont get me wrong, I get why people are so pissed off at Vicks, people love dogs, I love dogs, but I also eat non-certified humanly killed beef, so I'm not going to get sanctimonious about it. I wish it werent so, but this is one issue we're all hypocrites on.

This episode gave perspective on a surprisingly small picture. Might as well start calling the show "Bob's opinions"...

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