What’s What in Thor

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Therumancer:
*snip*

I'm familiar with the Marvel Superheroes game, although I'm not sure it's supposed to be canonical. Even if it is, I don't see any mention of him being a mutant in your link.

Logan Westbrook:

Therumancer:
*snip*

I'm familiar with the Marvel Superheroes game, although I'm not sure it's supposed to be canonical. Even if it is, I don't see any mention of him being a mutant in your link.

Fair enough point, I'll concede this one. I only brought that up because I've had the discussion before, and remembered that as one possible source given all of the stuff surrounding the RPG when it was in print.

The point though is that in the write up, they listed his vision as a power, not as the result of equipment as was specified for his arrows and so on. That means it's being defined as an innate trait, and since we can pretty much rule out his being an alien, mystically empowered, or so on, that doesn't leave a heck of a lot of options. But it's neither here nor there since as I said, I'm conceding the point. Knowing my luck I'll probably find something six months from now though, because I'm pretty sure he was defined as having a vision power beyond an RPG appearance.

death525:
A friend of said that the black guy Thor was fighting might be Luke Cage since he was pretty much able to hold his own against Thor for a while.

You would need a whole movie's worth of backstory and setup to make me believe that Luke Cage would ever take orders from the government. At least three kidnapped loved ones.

pdgeorge:
Bob, you made a mistake with Hawkeye/Bullseye.

Unless I've missed a bunch of weird-ass developments (which I do not discount out of hand. Comics are weird, after all), Hawkeye, the Avenger, is not Bullseye, the Kingpin's sometime assassin.

pdgeorge:
Anyone else strongly believe Deadpool has to be involved in the avengers? Or atleast there will be a nod to him.

Fox still owns the rights to Deadpool, I believe.

i was actually disappointed when i saw the cube. I mean it's nice and all but i always thought of the cosmic cubes as a really lazy storytelling device. Then again, this could make for some surreal scenes in the Avengers movie so i am game.

Therumancer:
Bob, Hawkeye isn't just "really skilled with a bow and arrow", he's also a mutant with incredible eyesight similar to that of a Hawk if I recall (hence the name) letting him see things miles away. On top of this he's a gadgeteer who creates arrows for that bow of his that pretty much do anything the plot demands. He needs an arrow that's non lethal, short circuits robots, freezes someone in a block of ice, lets out a massive sonic burst to hurt the ears or whatever, this guy pretty much has it. He's pretty much the quintessential "power pool" character from certain Super Hero RPGs, because like Batman's Utility belt, despite pretensions of realism, this guy by definition always has exactly the right gizmo the plot requires.

It's already been addressed by someone else, but Hawkeye is not a mutant, nor does he have any powers (excluding the period he was Goliath via pym particles). But like Bullseye he does posess an insane amount of accuracy that defies realism. There's no in universe explaination other then he trained very hard.

His gadgets do make sense though unlike some of Batman's. He keeps normal arrows in his quiver and a few ready to go trick arrows. But his pouches contain all the different trick-heads and he screws them over the arrow. So it's not like he has an arrow for every occaison, but an arrow-head. A tiny bit more believable.

MovieBob:
...as realistically, it doesn't make much sense that "I'm reasonably skilled with a weapon that's been obsolete since the 1400s" stacks up all that much next to...

But that's of course the fun thing about the Avengers. They're more of a ragtag group of different power levels than the pantheon of god like beings the JLA is.

MovieBob:
Hawkeye being a vital member of the proposed team is one of those things Avengers viewers will presumably just be asked to accept, as realistically, it doesn't make much sense that "I'm reasonably skilled with a weapon that's been obsolete since the 1400s" stacks up all that much next to "I'm the perfect physical specimen," "I'm wearing a robot," "I'm a literal god" and "I'm The Hulk" in terms of power sets.

Seeing as how they showed Hawkeye in a mostly Ultimate Universe inspired version, I think the audience will do more than simply accept him.

Lazarus Long:

pdgeorge:
Bob, you made a mistake with Hawkeye/Bullseye.

Unless I've missed a bunch of weird-ass developments (which I do not discount out of hand. Comics are weird, after all), Hawkeye, the Avenger, is not Bullseye, the Kingpin's sometime assassin

The time when it's most obvious is in Darkreign: Deadpool. Hawkeye flat out tells Deadpool what's going on with him making the change from Bullseye to Hawkeye and then *blah blah blah* (I can't remember exact details and those that I can I don't want to spoil)
http://www.brokenfrontier.com/userfiles/images/lowdown/2009/may/MWOM29deadpool10_0510.jpg
^^ Picture of bullseye wearing Hawkeye's uniform

Also in previous Deadpool series, it was shown that Deadpool was originally gunning for the 'contract' to be Kingpins assassin but he lost out to Bullseye. They have a lot of history that I find interesting.

edit: Just found this -
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Gd8NBIma-zo/SkbMMkmdmEI/AAAAAAAAI1k/KBkhy-JfSeQ/s400/DarkReignElektra4+-+godilovewatchingyoubleed.jpg
It's apparently from DarkReign - Elektra, but I never read it and have no plans on reading anything with Elektra in it.

pdgeorge:
The time when it's most obvious is in Darkreign: Deadpool. Hawkeye flat out tells Deadpool what's going on with him making the change from Bullseye to Hawkeye and then *blah blah blah* (I can't remember exact details and those that I can I don't want to spoil)

Yeah I see what's caused the confusion here. During Dark reign Bullseye pretended to be Hawkeye on Norman Osborn's Avenger team. He was not the only one, Daken pretended to be Wolverine, Moonstone to be Ms Marvel, Venom to be Spiderman, etc.

That said the original Hawkeye is a completely seperate character who doesn't know deadpool, he at that point was going by the name of Ronin. He's back to being Hawkeye now. Two different characters with similar abilities and names.

WolfThomas:

pdgeorge:
The time when it's most obvious is in Darkreign: Deadpool. Hawkeye flat out tells Deadpool what's going on with him making the change from Bullseye to Hawkeye and then *blah blah blah* (I can't remember exact details and those that I can I don't want to spoil)

Yeah I see what's caused the confusion here. During Dark reign Bullseye pretended to be Hawkeye on Norman Osborn's Avenger team. He was not the only one, Daken pretended to be Wolverine, Moonstone to be Ms Marvel, Venom to be Spiderman, etc.

That said the original Hawkeye is a completely seperate character who doesn't know deadpool, he at that point was going by the name of Ronin. He's back to being Hawkeye now. Two different characters with similar abilities and names.

Ahhh I didn't know that.
Then again, not really interested in a Hawkeye that isn't Bullseye. Bullseye is just an awesome character along with Deadpool

What immediately occured to me upon reading the point that Hawkeye's skillset doesn't stack up very well with "I'm literally a god" is the parallel situation in the Justice League.

How does "I'm a normal human trained in the martial arts and have some pretty cool gadgets" stack up as a power when compared to "I'm invulnerable, can fly, see through walls, etc", "I have a magic ring that can create anything I can possibly imagine", and so on? Having said that, which one member of the Justice League do you least want to piss off? Which one would emerge victorious if the whole Justice League went Battle Royale on each other?

Point is, it's not the skill set you've got, it's how much of a badass you are. Hawkeye's no Batman, admittedly, but the problem isn't so much that he's underpowered as that he's just way less cool than Iron Man.

(Mind you with Joss Whedon doing the Avengers, I'm sort of hoping for Iron Man, Captain America, Thor, and Moist...)

FilmRobert:
"Didn't that guy used to be played by a totally different actor?" "Cosmic Cube!"

haha I can't wait for people's reactions to the new Hulk. My disappointed phase has passed and now I'm looking forward to the misspelled buffalo playing Dr Banner.

Mr. Chipman:
Hawkeye being a vital member of the proposed team is one of those things Avengers viewers will presumably just be asked to accept, as realistically, it doesn't make much sense that "I'm reasonably skilled with a weapon that's been obsolete since the 1400s" stacks up all that much next to "I'm the perfect physical specimen," "I'm wearing a robot," "I'm a literal god" and "I'm The Hulk" in terms of power sets.

hahaha good one. Made me lol.

Holy fuck, I've been waiting for someone to explain to me what all this hoopla about the setup to the Avengers is, and people are like 'oh I don't want to spoil Thor' or whatever. I don't care about the actual movies, but I'm interested in the concept of creating a multi-movie continuity.

THANK YOU BOB, for finally giving me the Cliff's notes with commentary.

Sebz:
Which one would emerge victorious if the whole Justice League went Battle Royale on each other?

Fanwank aside, there are several contenders for that crown: Plastic Man, Wonder Woman, Martian Manhunter, and Batman are the ones that spring to mind.

Logan Westbrook:

Therumancer:
Bob, Hawkeye isn't just "really skilled with a bow and arrow", he's also a mutant with incredible eyesight similar to that of a Hawk if I recall (hence the name) letting him see things miles away.

Nope. He's never been a mutant. Ultimate Hawkeye had had his vision enhanced, but he was never a mutant.

probably been said already but...

saying someone is a mutant in the marvel universe is a very tricky thing. There are mutants, those who make up the X-men/X-factor/Murlocks, the mutated, Fantastic 4/the Hulk/spiderman, and the more different mutants, people with special powers akin to mutants but aren't ostracized because of it daredevil/moonknight/ironman. hawkeye is in the second mutants has superhuman abilities but isn't consider a "mutant".

the marvel universe is weird.

rayen020:
hawkeye is in the second mutants has superhuman abilities but isn't consider a "mutant".

The group of powered people who don't have the x-gene and are not therefore "mutants", are generally called "mutates". But Hawkeye isn't a "mutate", they frequently make reference to his complete abscence of powers (except when he used a suit as goliath). It's just that in the marvel universe people can train themselves to that level awesome, just like Batman in DC can do all sorts of crazy stuff.

That said developements in New Avengers have possibly hinted at something going on with Hawkeye post House of M ressurrection.

They've gotta get Thor back to Earth somehow for the Avengers...

Also, I spotted the Eye myself, and if Dr. Strange makes an impressive enough splash to the film I'll actually wee.

Thanks for the insider info Bob. I really appreciate these since i have no idea what any of the lore of the Marvel universe is outside of the most common of common knowledge.

Always good to put in the Ultimate Plot Device for a project like this XD

The link to Leader is broken in the text, it needs another ")" in the link.

The Cosmic Cube sounds an awful lot like a PlayStation 3 in that "It Only Does Everything". Wait a minute...Sony Pictures is using the Avengers Movie as one massive PS3 commercial!

Nice try, Sony, but it'll take more than that to win everybody back over after this whole mess with the hackers and the PSN downtime!

I actually had no freaking clue what I was looking at in the post-credits scene, and I know Marvel lore pretty well. I thought it looked like a time bomb or something.

Hawkeye looked awesome... for a comics fan, these movies are just getting better and better. I just hope they won't start to alienate the casual audience

Verlander:
Hawkeye looked awesome... for a comics fan, these movies are just getting better and better. I just hope they won't start to alienate the casual audience

I'm only peripherally versed in comics (my knowledge comes from old cartoons, and I'm far more vested in DC than Marvel), and they haven't managed to alienate me yet. Iron Man, Iron Man 2, and Thor all still worked for me (haven't seen Hulk yet, though it's on my list.)

krellen:

Verlander:
Hawkeye looked awesome... for a comics fan, these movies are just getting better and better. I just hope they won't start to alienate the casual audience

I'm only peripherally versed in comics (my knowledge comes from old cartoons, and I'm far more vested in DC than Marvel), and they haven't managed to alienate me yet. Iron Man, Iron Man 2, and Thor all still worked for me (haven't seen Hulk yet, though it's on my list.)

That's relieving to hear. I see a lot of comics fans bang on about how they want more and more geeky stuff from the books, but they don't seem to realise that it's the casual audience that makes these films happen in the first place.

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