Jimquisition: Piracy - Trying To Kill It Makes It Stronger

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Sorry, double post.

Melon Hunter:

Jimothy Sterling:

getoffmycloud:
The simple reason they don't do more stuff like steam is look what happened with origin as soon as it was announced everyone came out and said they hated it and would never use it and just pirate EA games so I can see why publishers would be put off this kind of service.

The difference is, Origin didn't need to exist. Steam exists already.

That's how a competitive market works; one company sets up a business in a pre-existing market to try and get some of the profits from it. Should Microsoft not have bothered with making the Xbox, as it didn't need to exist, due to the Playstation 2 and Gamecube already existing? Of course not.

In a way, it should have been a good thing, as Steam hold a virtual monopoly over digital distribution for PC games. The problem is, Origin has nowhere near the level of good service and pricing that Steam offers currently.

QFT. THe main reason Origin failed, ignoring the EULA nonsense disconnects exclusives game etc etc, is that it has a bad lineup and nothing new or better to offer. Origin has nowhere near the games library that Steam does, and absolutely no new features that make it better. The Xbox worked because it was different, had new and interesting games, and wasn't trying to slot into the market 8 freaking years too late.

Wow..has it been 8 years since steam came out...wow..

OT: Love this video. I started off amongst most people as a bit of a hater, but Ive pretty quickly come around to these now. Very informative, now to send a link to every publisher on earth about this video.

and you forget that these buisinesses STILL make alot of money despite pirates.

Ok.... when did we get so ridiculously entitled that a company deserves to burn at the stake and have their property stolen from them... because they made us finger in a code that takes all of 45 seconds of your life to punch in. Really? Fucking really?

EA may not have won any favors with enforcing Origin for Battlefield 3... but I haven't seen them abusing their playerbase with it either. Newsflash: EA doesn't give a shit what porn you watch. As if Origin even scans for those kind of files...

But if you truly must condemn EA for their use of Origin... there's always the console version. No Origin on that, only a registration code. But apparently that's a crime against humanity as well.

I like ya Jim, but lately your crusade against registration codes is just getting old.

M.C.Dillinger:

JohnnyDelRay:

No, the best that could happen (according to you) is what's happening to megaupload right now, which is WHAT IS happening. So you actually have nothing to complain about, because no matter what people say and wish for here, is *not* happening. I also wish for the easing of DRM. But I also don't have faith in people trying to follow a moral code or societal pressure.

And I also don't think people would just turn and say "don't shop from those pricks" if they put people through excessive measures to prevent theft, because what corporations do through society even better is marketing, and peer pressure...every kid wants those shoes as much as they want those games, they will go through to get it. They believe they need it, as much as people need to fly on airplanes despite the extra crap we have to do to get on one nowadays.

Wait, what? Someone responded to something post on the Internet? This might seem more confrontational than I would like but you seem to be agreeing with me but your tone suggests you disagree. I believe that I've stated that megaupload's upcoming trial is part of a solution and you seem to share my pessimism towards the populace.

Please forgive any awkwardness. I'm not accustomed to people interacting with me, I usually observe society from a distance. I'm more accustomed to writing a blog to an imaginary audience (http://mcdillinger.blogspot.com/) and writing a piece of Warcraft fan fiction at the speed of a ice glacier.

No no, you got it the first time, I am also very pessimistic about people's self-reformation, but at the same time I disagree with the disbanding of Megaupload (not just the trial, which in itself could be a turning point). But, it could be part of a solution. See, if digital distribution platforms are the future, and this is what makes it convenient for people, then we should find a way that benefits who matter the most - the creators. Rather than lining pockets of old record labels and big greedy developers, if the creators and artists got more out of the deal rather than the ones who are already rich and desperately hanging onto this old model of distribution, then prices could go down at least. So what I'm getting at is something in between Megaupload and buying a CD off the shelf, more along the lines of iTunes (but without that DRM crap that forces you to use apple products, but iTunes is apple's platform so whatever).

And this goes back to Jim's video, where his vision of things being cheaper, and easier to obtain and enjoy. Heck, this would even wind down the "problem" of used sales a bit, because a)there would be less in this model, and b) you *should* be paying less without all the physical distribution factored in, or you could wait for sales.

Anyway, sorry also for the awkwardness, I was just trying to point out that while you were implying no one "here" is going to listen to you, it doesn't matter because what's going on in the wide world is nothing like what is going on "here" anyhow.

Coincidentally, I just saw the Game Overthinker's SOPA episode, where he, too, talked about Napster, iTunes, and the desire for individual songs over albums, as well as the need for the entertainment industry, specifically Hollywood and the gaming industry, to seriously look into digital distribution and NOT try to dictate terms.

By the way, Street Sharks FTW!

Jimothy Sterling:

getoffmycloud:
The simple reason they don't do more stuff like steam is look what happened with origin as soon as it was announced everyone came out and said they hated it and would never use it and just pirate EA games so I can see why publishers would be put off this kind of service.

The difference is, Origin didn't need to exist. Steam exists already.

Really, only having one sole provider for games online is a good thing, heck no, in fact origin should recive more support for trying to create some competion in the DD market, monopolies are not good.

This was the episode yet for the sole reason of Gitaroo Man.

Orks da best:

Jimothy Sterling:

getoffmycloud:
The simple reason they don't do more stuff like steam is look what happened with origin as soon as it was announced everyone came out and said they hated it and would never use it and just pirate EA games so I can see why publishers would be put off this kind of service.

The difference is, Origin didn't need to exist. Steam exists already.

Really, only having one sole provider for games online is a good thing, heck no, in fact origin should recive more support for trying to create some competion in the DD market, monopolies are not good.

There were already 3-4 competitors in the market that did things infinitely better than Origin did.

M.C.Dillinger:

JohnnyDelRay:

No, the best that could happen (according to you) is what's happening to megaupload right now, which is WHAT IS happening. So you actually have nothing to complain about, because no matter what people say and wish for here, is *not* happening. I also wish for the easing of DRM. But I also don't have faith in people trying to follow a moral code or societal pressure.

And I also don't think people would just turn and say "don't shop from those pricks" if they put people through excessive measures to prevent theft, because what corporations do through society even better is marketing, and peer pressure...every kid wants those shoes as much as they want those games, they will go through to get it. They believe they need it, as much as people need to fly on airplanes despite the extra crap we have to do to get on one nowadays.

Wait, what? Someone responded to something post on the Internet? This might seem more confrontational than I would like but you seem to be agreeing with me but your tone suggests you disagree. I believe that I've stated that megaupload's upcoming trial is part of a solution and you seem to share my pessimism towards the populace.

Please forgive any awkwardness. I'm not accustomed to people interacting with me, I usually observe society from a distance. I'm more accustomed to writing a blog to an imaginary audience (http://mcdillinger.blogspot.com/) and writing a piece of Warcraft fan fiction at the speed of a ice glacier.

Except you forgot to take in the fact that the government is already going to basically delete all the data that was saved on megaupload. If the government all of a sudden seized a storage company because a few people where selling cocaine out of the containers people would be up in arms and heads would roll. What the government has done to megaupload is TERRIFYING. The government before due process will destroy megaupload so if mr dotcom wins his day in court he would have to build up his business from the ground up.

Steam is convenient for a lot of people but it forces me to download patches and wouldn't let me play my physically bought Shogun 2 Total War, even after I installed it, untill it finished downloading the entire game again plus the patches, which was the next month since the download hit the limit and my home has better things to waste time on than downloading a game at a Psuedo Dial-Up paced internet.

this makes my copy COMPLETELY USELESS because it's not like I can lend it to anyone and it can't help me in any way what-so-ever.

I can only assume this doesn't happen all the time but it means that if a game on PC needs Steam then all the mods on the internet couldn't convince me to choose it over the Console version.

GeorgW:
I wonder if Diablo 3 will either not be pirated at all or pretty much exclusively, cuz given the way their DRM is heading that's the only 2 options I'm seeing.

Noone is going to pirate a game that is so online/coop focused. Still, not allowing the option to play your private offline session is a major inconvenience that they don't give a fuck about, just like they didn't care to add LAN to Starcraft 2, which turned most of the tournaments into lagfests just like every single member of the e-sports community had foreseen and warned them about. Blizzard make good games, but since WoW was released they turned into massive dicks.

Carnagath:

GeorgW:
I wonder if Diablo 3 will either not be pirated at all or pretty much exclusively, cuz given the way their DRM is heading that's the only 2 options I'm seeing.

Noone is going to pirate a game that is so online/coop focused. Still, not allowing the option to play your private offline session is a major inconvenience that they don't give a fuck about, just like they didn't care to add LAN to Starcraft 2, which turned most of the tournaments into lagfests just like every single member of the e-sports community had foreseen and warned them about. Blizzard make good games, but since WoW was released they turned into massive dicks.

Blizzard's decision to remove Lan from starcraft cost them at least 3 sales from me and two friends I game with. The decision to not have offline Diablo cost them at least 5 sales I can think of off the top of my head.

I know blizz probably doesn't care about a the few "antisocial" gamers left but I'm just throwing that out there.

rembrandtqeinstein:

Carnagath:

GeorgW:
I wonder if Diablo 3 will either not be pirated at all or pretty much exclusively, cuz given the way their DRM is heading that's the only 2 options I'm seeing.

Noone is going to pirate a game that is so online/coop focused. Still, not allowing the option to play your private offline session is a major inconvenience that they don't give a fuck about, just like they didn't care to add LAN to Starcraft 2, which turned most of the tournaments into lagfests just like every single member of the e-sports community had foreseen and warned them about. Blizzard make good games, but since WoW was released they turned into massive dicks.

Blizzard's decision to remove Lan from starcraft cost them at least 3 sales from me and two friends I game with. The decision to not have offline Diablo cost them at least 5 sales I can think of off the top of my head.

I know blizz probably doesn't care about a the few "antisocial" gamers left but I'm just throwing that out there.

The dioblo 3 losses are Torchlight 2 gains. I know myself and two friends are saying fuck that to Diablo and are picking up T2 on release day.

iTunes was great... Then I formatted my hard-drive and lost everything I bought. iTunes refused to let me re-download all my files from their server. What makes it even better is that I couldn't re-buy what I lost because "I had already owned these files".

So, while they provide convenience of buying they aren't exactly accessible in the acquisition of files (Unlike steam)

Korten12:
Also as for netflix... It's soo easy to get acess to it. Anroids, ipods, wii, ps3, xbox, pc, mac, and everything you can imagine plays netflix lately...

Sooo easy... if you live in the US. No such service in Australia!

Gather:
iTunes was great... Then I formatted my hard-drive and lost everything I bought. iTunes refused to let me re-download all my files from their server. What makes it even better is that I couldn't re-buy what I lost because "I had already owned these files".

So, while they provide convenience of buying they aren't exactly accessible in the acquisition of files (Unlike steam)

thats why itunes always asks if you like to backup the music you have downloaded on to a disc. i sure do that to be sure, since i had this experience that my HD suddenly broke down on me from one day to another.

It seems like both sides are to blame, people pirate games because the game companies can't put out games right... and so on and so forth *SIGH*

Aeonknight:
Ok.... when did we get so ridiculously entitled that a company deserves to burn at the stake and have their property stolen from them... because they made us finger in a code that takes all of 45 seconds of your life to punch in. Really? Fucking really?

EA may not have won any favors with enforcing Origin for Battlefield 3... but I haven't seen them abusing their playerbase with it either. Newsflash: EA doesn't give a shit what porn you watch. As if Origin even scans for those kind of files...

But if you truly must condemn EA for their use of Origin... there's always the console version. No Origin on that, only a registration code. But apparently that's a crime against humanity as well.

I like ya Jim, but lately your crusade against registration codes is just getting old.

look at what you're saying: 'well, EA has been scanning my personal files and invading my privacy, but at least they won't use it to tell people about all the porn i watch'

WHAT? WHAT?

Yes, we are entitled. Because we should be. Because we don't owe these companies ANYTHING.
They are not a charity. They are not a worthy cause. They are a company. It is their point and purpose to find a way to get people to buy their product.

If they fail to find a way to make it more attractive for to you buy the game instead of pirating it, then they are failing as a company.

EA wants to convince you that you have a moral obligation to choose their service. This is a lie. You as a consumer have no moral obligations. You choose what you feel to be the best option for yourself. If a company wants to make money, they must become the best option. If they don't, they go bankrupt.

This is the way of capitalism.

Aeonknight:
Ok.... when did we get so ridiculously entitled that a company deserves to burn at the stake and have their property stolen from them... because they made us finger in a code that takes all of 45 seconds of your life to punch in. Really? Fucking really?

You call it 'burning at the stake' and 'entitlement', I call it 'customer feedback' and 'angry and frustrated'.
Also, it takes a fuck load longer than 45 seconds to punch in a code. It took me half an hour to get Batman AA working with that DRM + my shitty internet connection. It took over four fucking hours to get the broken assed shitty DRM in Dragon Age to work properly. And I have it far better (and worse) than a lot of people out there. We, the customers, are not happy. My spare time is short. I don't get that much of it and I would like to spend none of that time on DRM bs!

Aeonknight:

EA may not have won any favors with enforcing Origin for Battlefield 3... but I haven't seen them abusing their playerbase with it either. Newsflash: EA doesn't give a shit what porn you watch. As if Origin even scans for those kind of files...

If that is what you think people are annoyed with then you have completely missed the point. I don't claim to talk for anybody else, but for me; I don't want anybody to scan my computer for any reason that is outside the fair use of their product. Origin has no opt out options for that level of invasion of privacy.

Aeonknight:

But if you truly must condemn EA for their use of Origin... there's always the console version. No Origin on that, only a registration code. But apparently that's a crime against humanity as well.

So you're saying that if I don't like Origin I should go out and buy a console so I can play a game I am interested in on a platform I would prefer not to use? Don't be stupid.

damn true i stopped playing xbox almost completely and moved to steam because these exact reasons!
thank god for jim... :D

Actually I think that you can fight piracy to a significant degree, and the key to it, I believe, is to shut down torrent sites that facilitate the practice. If that can be done consistently and legally, all the freeloaders out there will have no choice but to purchase the products they want rather than steal them. It's sort of like stopping drug-dealing. Yes, the cops can bust dozens of drug-users, but it's much better to get the suppliers, and move up the chain of command as far as you can, and in so doing cut off their customers. So, the title of the video doesn't make a lot of sense as it only applies to DRM rather than more practical solutions.

Further, the example provided by iTunes doesn't take into account a major difference between music and games. A song downloaded on iTunes can be very cheap to purchase, but a full retail game can go for about 50-60 bucks. That's the real problem with videogame piracy--it's not simply the inconvenience customers don't want to deal with (though said inconvenience, as pointed out by others, is SOLELY the fault of the pirates in the first place) but the PRICE. A game is a much harder investment to swallow. Why pay that much money when you can just torrent it? And I don't wanna hear anybody say that this isn't why people pirate. I know two people who openly admitted to me that they pirate games because they can't afford them, so spare me the excuses.

Thirdly, his position that the publishers themselves are stealing the IP's is ridiculous. Yes, it sucks that the creator of Metal Arms can't produce new games in the franchise, it sucks that Activision is just sitting on it, but without a big publisher to back his game would we have any Metal Arms games at all? Probably not, and that's why we have big publishers. Sorry, but that's how it works. And it's not like the pirates discriminate between games from big publishers and independent groups anyway!

Jim used to have a fairly good position on piracy, but the whole SOPA thing has seemingly derailed his thinking, like he feels a need to take out his anger on a bad decision on an entire industry. SOPA was a bad idea, sure, but seriously, it never would have occurred if not for the greed and complete absence of ethics on the part of the pirates. Sorry, Jim, but you're on the wrong side.

getoffmycloud:

I own the retail copy of battlefield 3 and all that stuff just logs in as soon as open battlefield 3 so its not really a problem and steam still does all that stuff and it does it to games that have nothing to do with them it really annoys me that I have to have a steam account to play stuff like shogun total war and deus ex for no reason

The typical answers I get to those problems tend to be around the lines of "Steam is the Good Guy in this", or "It isn't that big of a deal, just make your Steam account and enjoy" (of course that just ignores the problem altogether). At least with Origin it is just EA games (of that I think it really only covers those bought through Origin and not through retail).

Watching TV try to adapt to changing technology has got me thinking Jim is pretty spot on this time.

Some networks have looked at the changes in technology and decided it's best to be ahead of the curve instead of behind the curve. Instead of making it hard to find and watch their shows or requiring you to have cable to watch online they have made it simple and easy to find their shows online. You go to the site they get to advertise their other shows and the company makes a bit from ads as well. No need to deal with the hassle of a pirated copy of this week's Big Bang Theory if you can get it hassle free on the CBS website.

Things like Star Wars the Clone Wars is heavily pirated because you can't just go to the Cartoon Network site and watch it without a cable subscription. If you don't want to spend a load on cable and enter codes to watch a cartoon it's more convenient to just pirate the thing.

So I'm going to agree making the legal way the easiest and most hassle free way would be a better deterrent than punishing the people who are attempting to get something the legal way.

Kanatatsu:

Kwil:

Pandabearparade:

Yes. It. Is.

See, the pirate doesn't have any obligation to the customer, because he's not providing a service. The company is providing a service, and it isn't my problem if other people pirate games.

No, it isn't. It's the pirates fault. It's the companies fault if people don't buy. However that is an entirely separate issue from if people pirate.

People not buying is directly related to how many people pirate.

People pirating is directly related to how palatable the companies make buying over pirating.

See how this is connected?

Sorry, when people pirate the humble bundles, your argument is crap. People pirating is directly related to how palatable WE make piracy.

comando0110:
and you forget that these buisinesses STILL make alot of money despite pirates.

Kindly tell me, what does the net worth of a company or person have to be to make it legit to stop paying them for their services?

I'd really like to know, because my house could use a new deck, and I'm sure I can find a construction company out there that's big enough I'm completely justified in not paying them, but I don't want to do it if they're too small, you know?

So since you obviously have some value in mind, what is it?

RDubayoo:
- snip -

I'm sorry, but I beg to differ ... I'm just gonna quote some Industry opinions on publishers and their current standing:

[W]e ended up cutting out the publishers and went to publishing our own games. Of course, now we have published a few other teams' games, I'm not sure what that makes us :) But most of that comes down to the ability to be able to fund the development int he first place - by hook or by crook. Alan Wilson, Tripwire Interactive

I do think publishers have too much power. Dave Herod, CodeMasters Software Company

Most Publishers aren't about quality, which is a big issue in the gaming industry right now.. Developers don't NEED Publishers, but they can USE them if they choose too.

As long as a Developer doesn't mind the fact that their company/game will take longer to get out there and make them money, they can do it alone. But there are things a Developer needs to make sure they do right... Make a great game - Always consider and respect their consumers, etc. Buying and playing a game is meant to be FUN, not an annoyance.

As a quick example... look at Cliff Harris of Positech Games.. he Develops his own games, he publishes his own games, he does his own tech support, etc... So, it's possible to do it without Publishers, even later once you grow large and prosperous from doing it the right way.

Most Publishers don't have the consumers interests at heart, they push the Developers too hard to get a game out for release with the attitude of "to heck with if it's ready or not", (which is NEVER a good move) because they just want it out there so THEY can make money fast.

Quality and Respect are key factors in truly being successful, but sadly those qualities have been lost over the years.

Well, that's my opinion anyway. Lisa Pham, Reclaim Your Game

[P]ublishers are overrated and antiquated. The days of publishers running the show are numbered. The costs of distribution have reduced the point where that service is of no real value for any digitally distributed title. Now all they provide is marketing, well that can be bought as well, so really they provide nothing except capital. Well finiding capital is part of any business venture so in reality they no longer bring anything to the table.

This is true across most mediums. Publishers are just a relic of the past, but they wont go quietly. Peter Stirling, Fireflight Technologies

Of course, I picked my quotes. But there is this motion, and it is quite apparent. On the other hand, of course, publishers are still needed in one way or the other. But they have way too much impact as it stands.

As for the anti-piracy measures ... Need to be blunt: Plain wrong. Shutting down torrent sites is just as counter-productive as the shutdown of Mega has proven to be. The files still exist and can easily be moved somewhere else. And it caused a massive amount of collateral damage up to this day already, and will do so even more when the servers can't be paid for anymore to keep the data living for the time being.

BiH-Kira:
Guys, please stop blaming devs.
Yes, they are those who create and use DRM, but in the end, it's the decision of the publisher.
The publisher is ALWAYS at fault. Even if China nukes Russia, Russia -> Iran and because of that Iran -> USA, it's still the fault of EA. Trust me, I'm an expert.

No seriously, almost all problems with games come from publisher. Publisher are guys who have no idea how this medium works, don't want to learn about it jet they want to use the same business methods as with other mediums. That CAN'T work! You can't sell bread the same way you sell a Mercedes.

And of course, the developer have no saying in that.

"It is all the publishers fault", yes and no. The problem is that the publishers that are doing this (EA, Activision, Ubisoft, etc) are publicly traded companies so they are complete subservient to the share holders. From what I understand, if all shareholders withdraw all of their share, the company and any subsidiary are shut down. So this is mostly done to please the shareholders so as to avoid being shut down (or was to avoid such a legal proceeding in which the costs associated would shut the company down?)

getoffmycloud:
The simple reason they don't do more stuff like steam is look what happened with origin as soon as it was announced everyone came out and said they hated it and would never use it and just pirate EA games so I can see why publishers would be put off this kind of service.

This is you being pretty silly.

People didn't complain about Origin because it was a paid service.

They complained because Origin is spyware with additional games you sometimes can play. They complained because Origin is downright illegal where I live. Sorry, I'm not going to let a company snoop through all my files. As simple as that. Only fools think that's acceptable.

The only reason.. the *only* reason.. piracy is as prevalent as it is is because of people like you who turn a blind eye to it and let others get away with it without condemning it.

Wrong. Piracy exists regardless if people condemn it or not. Theft is generally heavily frowned upon. Theft still exist. Your argument is a logical fallacy.

The exact opposite is true. Piracy exists because of people like you, who defend terrible business models and consumer punishing. Heck, most people I know that still play "modern" games pirate games they bought. Because the games they bought are unplayable at start, and the pirated versions work.

This fact alone shows how ridiculous the whining from the companies really is: Many pirates AREN'T EVEN THIEVES. They bought the games! They just can't play them properly without pirating a working copy. Things are getting that stupid these days: If a game sells 100000 times, and is pirates 50000 times, a lot of these 50000 are also in the 100000, so pretending the company lost 50000 sales is ludicrous.

Personally, I don't pirate, but I barely participate in the "normal" gaming market, because these games are a hassle and if I want to play in the limited time I have, I want to play right away.
I tend to buy indygames (bought from several japanese sites), because these games are actually fun, and let me play when I want to, not when the company wants to allow me to.

(Plus, female characters playable, which many companies think is too modern, apparently)

zefiris:

getoffmycloud:
The simple reason they don't do more stuff like steam is look what happened with origin as soon as it was announced everyone came out and said they hated it and would never use it and just pirate EA games so I can see why publishers would be put off this kind of service.

This is you being pretty silly.

People didn't complain about Origin because it was a paid service.

They complained because Origin is spyware with additional games you sometimes can play. They complained because Origin is downright illegal where I live. Sorry, I'm not going to let a company snoop through all my files. As simple as that. Only fools think that's acceptable.

The only reason.. the *only* reason.. piracy is as prevalent as it is is because of people like you who turn a blind eye to it and let others get away with it without condemning it.

Wrong. Piracy exists regardless if people condemn it or not. Theft is generally heavily frowned upon. Theft still exist. Your argument is a logical fallacy.

The exact opposite is true. Piracy exists because of people like you, who defend terrible business models and consumer punishing. Heck, most people I know that still play "modern" games pirate games they bought. Because the games they bought are unplayable at start, and the pirated versions work.

This fact alone shows how ridiculous the whining from the companies really is: Many pirates AREN'T EVEN THIEVES. They bought the games! They just can't play them properly without pirating a working copy. Things are getting that stupid these days: If a game sells 100000 times, and is pirates 50000 times, a lot of these 50000 are also in the 100000, so pretending the company lost 50000 sales is ludicrous.

Personally, I don't pirate, but I barely participate in the "normal" gaming market, because these games are a hassle and if I want to play in the limited time I have, I want to play right away.
I tend to buy indygames (bought from several japanese sites), because these games are actually fun, and let me play when I want to, not when the company wants to allow me to.

(Plus, female characters playable, which many companies think is too modern, apparently)

Please read my comment again I never mentioned the spyware thing I was talking about the moment it was announced before all that happened people were criticising it before it even existed despite the fact at the time it was a way EA could have started putting DRM behind them and taking the PC market more seriously which lots of people always complain about publishers never do. But all that happened was everyone bitched and moaned as always about everything without looking at the bigger picture and any other publisher watching that probably would have gone fuck it they complain about everything so we shall just stick with normal DRM

Yopaz:

GeorgW:

bahumat42:

well you also have the option to play other games, especially in the case of D3 where T2 is a really high quality contender without the drm nonsense (and cheaper)

Simply not buying it is always an option, but isn't that worse for everyone (except the competition)? The gamer doesn't get the game they want and the publisher loses a sale. That's not exactly a solution.

Yopaz:

I know I would be willing to pay a convenience charge for my games. I use Steam even though I can get it cheaper from retail most of the time even with Steam sales because I like having my games collected in one place. Honestly I like the idea of a one time online activation made simple. It's easy for pirates to bypass it, but it's just slightly inconvenient for the honest customer. The sad thing is that those who are behind cracking games are quite smart even though I know several pirates who aren't. I think that fighting piracy is a lost cause and that we should fight it in a way that doesn't alienate those who actually are honest.

I agree. It's just sad how publishers never listen to the costumers. And people pirating humble bundles and the Witcher 2 isn't exactly helping our case either.

Yeah, pirating games where the money goes to charity or games that don't offer us any problems makes it hard to side against DRM. I actually think I would be OK with a game that had a crappy DRM if it actually did prevent pirates from playing it.

Too bad the GOOD DRM doesn't even stop the pirates from getting the games. Tats the whole bloody point of the argument! DRM doesn't work, and yet companies STILL insist on using them even though the only people it stops from playing the game are the freaking customers! I haven't been able to play Spore because the DRM it had only allows so many installations, and it won't install on anything anymore! I BOUGHT THAT FREAKING GAME LEGITIMATELY AND IF I HAD PIRATED IT I'D STILL BE ABLE TO PLAY!

Metalix Knightmare:

Yopaz:

GeorgW:

Simply not buying it is always an option, but isn't that worse for everyone (except the competition)? The gamer doesn't get the game they want and the publisher loses a sale. That's not exactly a solution.

I agree. It's just sad how publishers never listen to the costumers. And people pirating humble bundles and the Witcher 2 isn't exactly helping our case either.

Yeah, pirating games where the money goes to charity or games that don't offer us any problems makes it hard to side against DRM. I actually think I would be OK with a game that had a crappy DRM if it actually did prevent pirates from playing it.

Too bad the GOOD DRM doesn't even stop the pirates from getting the games. Tats the whole bloody point of the argument! DRM doesn't work, and yet companies STILL insist on using them even though the only people it stops from playing the game are the freaking customers! I haven't been able to play Spore because the DRM it had only allows so many installations, and it won't install on anything anymore! I BOUGHT THAT FREAKING GAME LEGITIMATELY AND IF I HAD PIRATED IT I'D STILL BE ABLE TO PLAY!

Thanks for informing me of what I have said in every post I have posted as a comment on this video except this one. I really didn't know that DRM that prevents customers from playing games or deletes save data while not preventing pirates in any way was a bad thing.
Read my post, does it say that I accept DRM because it prevents pirates or does it say I WOULD accept it if it did? Please refrain from snapping at me simply because you are unable to read my post properly. I am against DRM for the same reasons you are, but I would be willing to experience some inconvenience if there actually was a point to it. DRM punishes those who buy it and no-one else. So I repeat it, don't blow up when you see someone discussing what DRM should be rather than what it is.

Your exasperation at the idiocy of recalcitrate dinosaurs amuses me, Mr Sterling. It is also very much justified. Moar pl0x.

Kwil:

Kanatatsu:

Kwil:

No, it isn't. It's the pirates fault. It's the companies fault if people don't buy. However that is an entirely separate issue from if people pirate.

People not buying is directly related to how many people pirate.

People pirating is directly related to how palatable the companies make buying over pirating.

See how this is connected?

Sorry, when people pirate the humble bundles, your argument is crap. People pirating is directly related to how palatable WE make piracy.

I'm pretty sure peer pressure isn't going to get people to stop pirating, lol.

Waaghpowa:
Gabe Newell has been talking about this for quite some time...

I just realised... there are now 2 well known *ahem* "Generously proportioned" men talking about how restrictive DRM and online passes do the opposite of what they are intended to do and that offering a better service is better than locking your software down tighter than Alcatraz.

Maybe Jim knows something about HL3 that we don't!

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