Escape to the Movies: The Phantom Menace 13 Years Later

 Pages 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 NEXT
 

The Phantom Menace 13 Years Later

The Phantom Menace isn't nearly as bad as you think it is.

Watch Video

Phantom Menace is probably the one I disliked the least, until a few years later, I kinda liked it. What really killed the SW prequels for me was Anakin becoming Vader mostly because he acted like 12 year old on the internet who couldn't find any rational reason behind his actions and statements, so he started to throw tantrums, threats and called everyone a Nazi... then he killed a bunch of kids for the fun of it.

I could stomach JarJar, he was sometimes funny, I could stand little Any, I could overlook the plotholes, but making that wuss Vader was just painful. That retroactively poisoned the prequels for me, to the point where all I feel for them is apathy.

Mother of god. Someone who is not bitching about the Phantom Menace? What sorcery is this!? MO of the movie is that is a halfdecent movie with a great duel at the end. Attack of the clones sucks more (except for Chirstopher Lee)

Yeah... it doesn't suck as much on it's own, but I'm still not gunna go see it in 3D.

One thing that always bothered me about Phantom Menace was that it never felt like a Star Wars movie. The visual style was nice and flashy and that kept me re-watching it for a little while. The lightsaber fights and the Pod-racing were great (even if the latter was a little redundant). Sure it could never recapture the the original feeling of discovery and wonder of the originals but still, too shiny and smooth and over the top. The originals were so much simpler and reserved in appearance. The two headed announcer didn't bother me at all though.

As for attack of the clones:
It's not so much that Jar Jar's screen time got reduced, but that I finally got to do something right on purpose (especially after his shenanigans at the battle of Naboo).

Hooray, This horribly forced romance between Padme and Anikin is finally starting to progress.

Jango's appearance, while unnecessary, did at least give a little back story to an "inexplicably" popular side character. I actually thought it was kinda cool how it turned out Boba was created from the template that was the foundation for the entire Imperial army.

The whole problem with the prequels is that we spend the whole time waiting for it to reach a foregone conclusion. Anikan's transformation to the Dark side is handled atrociously with little serious motivation that is given a back set to all the action that keeps popping up. What the fuck does he really have to be angry at the Jedi over? They gave him all the power he has. Obi Wan never tried to hold him back (except at the battle of Genesis) and he let him go find his mother with hardly any hesitation. The only reason Anikin wasn't able to save her was because he did ask to go home sooner. At the end of the last movie he turns into a complete fascist simply because he a reoccurring nightmare about his girlfriend dying. And He doesn't talk about with the man who's been raising him for half his life. No he goes strait to his "real mentor" who tells him to turn to the dark side and just goes along with it. The real motivation behind it is that he HAS TO transform in Darth Vader because that's who he is in the original Trilogy.

I hope even more people watch the Plinkett reviews now thanks to you :)

I never did think it was all that bad. I do however think the re-releasing it 3D is entirely superfluous though.

I actually disliked Revenge of the Sith the most. Because in the end it all just didn't pan out. You got to watch the whole sloppy thing drag its way past the finish line, and it just made the prior 2 worse. If Revenge of the Sith was a wonderful and engaging film, the first 2 would have been pardoned of their weakness in an effort to justify the greatness that was the 3rd film. Buuuut, they didn't and the 3rd film was god awful.

Return of the Jedi is a pretty lousy film but its ok because the first 2 are so good.

In the end its the fans fault. They begged and pleaded George to make more who was reluctant and wanted to hand off the new ones to a new director (which he should have done and just produced it). But its bridge under the water, though I believe that if Knights of the Old Republic does well, they're maybe films in that setting. Lucas won't direct them, but it has fan appeal, and I think the Phantom Menace 3D is a litmus test for seeing how the public takes to Star Wars nowadays considering Clone Wars was such a hideous bomb. Just a theory.

Movie Bob, you have convinced me. Tonight I shall go see it with my 3 little ones and give it another chance. Also, Return of the Jedi isn't as good as everyone remembers.

I never thought the film was that bad, and i maintain hat the lightsaber duel at the end is the finest one from the entire saga

I was never that angry about the Phantom Menace and when i started hanging out on the internet i was surprised at all the hate, i didn't grow up watching the star wars movies, my parents were Trekes, so i watched TNG and DS9 with them. But when phantom menace was announced they bought the original trilogy and let me and my sister watch it. I enjoyed it and considered it a fun movie series, then i watched Phantom, and was entertained for a few hours like any 12 year old was with a fun colorful action movie, i didn't find Jar Jar particularly offensive or entertaining, i just considered it a fun if rather brainless sifi movie and i carry that opinion to this day.

said Plinket Review, was Remade in 3d- and a Commentary was put out too

Amen brother. I feel the same way about the Hobbit movie that is about to come out. I was 14 when the last LOTR was released and now I'm 22. I'm going to have to steel myself to the fact that it's not going to feel the same as last time, no matter what.

Granted, it still looks like an awesome movie.

Star Wars has sort of the same issues, as you've said.

*shrug*

I never hated Phantom menace. It wasn't amazing, but it wasn't bad either.

The only star wars movie I outright hated was the last of the prequel movies. I mean...really? The way anakin does his about-face doesn't feel realistic (he goes from "WHAT HAVE I DONE?!?!" to "LETS MURDER THE KIDDIES!" in the span of five minutes), the whole padme-anakin dynamic feels like it doesn't work at all, etc etc etc.

Oh, and I actually don't mind Jar Jar at all.

Phantom Menace wasn't exactly good, but it wasn't an atrocious pile of dung heap, either. Yes, it's rife with poor attempts at comedic displays or supposedly quirky one-note characters to amuse the kiddies and everyone is fairly wooden - but beyond that?

Go back and watch the first trilogy. You'll realize PM is textbook Star Wars, in that it's just lukewarm, in terms of acting and overall conceptualization. I don't know at which point people started turning the first three movies into some sort of untouchable trifecta of concentrated godliness - but the core universe stuff is about as good as your average middling fanfic.

I think the whole "JAR JAR BINKS, HNNNNG!" thing has largely turned into a self-deprecating joke. If it hasn't, some people are likely to be investing themselves far too much in the series, to begin with.

Bob's right. Maintaining so much hatred is the path to the Dark Side. It doesn't mean we have to start loving the heck out of the second trilogy, but anyone maintaining a sanctimoniously hateful attitude needs to wake up and realize the entire thing has never been meant to be anything more than silly, actiony popcorn flicks. If anything, blame anyone who's worked on the Expanded Universe for making the intricacies of Star Wars matter so much to so many people.

I was shocked to agree with all of your points. by themselves.

As right as you are however, Phantom Menace doesn't exist in a vacuum. (even if half of its action scenes do)

As a followup to the film series that brought Sci-Fi to the realm of legitimacy and attracted an entire generation of film artists to their true calling, Phantom Menace was in a (completely unfair but still completely true) position where it had to wow. It had to be what the community had come to expect. It had to be made of the same magic. But it wasn't. And while it was only a mediocre film, due to its position in the culture of the world, being pretty good but not great indeed made it, beyond any shadow of a doubt, the most disappointing thing since my son.

To live with it, I've simply written Star Wars off. It's for others now. The magic is never coming back. The last time I was excited for Star Wars was at the beginning of a trailer for The Old Republic, but it died all at once when some guy started fighting with three lightsabers. At that moment I realized that what I loved about the series wasn't in it or in me any longer. The mysticism had been replaced with flash and the high thoughts replaced with one liners. The entire mythos is either corrupted or was never really what I thought it was. I don't know which, but they're both awful options. So, goodbye. No more dreams about a galaxy far far away.

TL;DR It was never going to be just another movie to be judged on its own merits. It was supposed to be a grand homecoming. It wasn't. That is the failure. But either way, even if I'm wrong about that, it's time for us to move on. Star wars isn't for us anymore. That's all there is to it.

erf why did you mnention the eragon movie that was a special kind of bad... but yeah phantom menace I actualy didn't mind to quite liked in places though I do beleive it dosn't hold a candle two to the first three.

A few months ago I watched the entire series again from beginning to end, and I came to the same conclusion about the prequels: they weren't horrible, they were mediocre to average and the only reason they were hated is that they were part of Star Wars and didn't live up to that legacy.

I look at it this way: if we never had the original trilogy and instead Phantom Menace came first, what would it have been? I think it would've ended there and barely been remembered as a mediocre sci-fi movie.

Also, good to know I'm not alone in hating Attack of the Clones, but I hate it mostly because the romance is awful and takes up too much of the movie. That just killed the entire movie for me.

Go moviebob go, like you i am sick of all the star wars hate, and because i grew up on the prequels i like them more though the orgianls are still good though. Droids are awesome.

unacomn:
Phantom Menace is probably the one I disliked the least, until a few years later, I kinda liked it. What really killed the SW prequels for me was Anakin becoming Vader mostly because he acted like 12 year old on the internet who couldn't find any rational reason behind his actions and statements, so he started to throw tantrums, threats and called everyone a Nazi... then he killed a bunch of kids for the fun of it.

I could stomach JarJar, he was sometimes funny, I could stand little Any, I could overlook the plotholes, but making that wuss Vader was just painful. That retroactively poisoned the prequels for me, to the point where all I feel for them is apathy.

I think that the point of the prequel movies is that people who you set up as some long sought Messiah type character often as not end up being either a disappointment, or end up with entitlement issues and seriously screw over everyone around them.

As for Anakin/Vader, the general consensus about his prophecy of The Chosen One WAS fulfilled in the overall narrative, since by the end of Episode III, the Jedi HAD started an inexorable slide into fascism and what technically does amount to a form of theocracy. The evidence trotted out most often is when Mace Windu declared that Palpatine had to die, because he was too dangerous. In the context of the Light Side/Dark Side ethos, that would have pushed Mace Windu to the Dark Side, and the cycle would have simply repeated all over again.

Enlightening stuff Bob. I'm still not going to go and see it, but your point was well made.

Oh, I just have to say this though. Jango Fett? He may have been 'unnecessary' but he was way more badass than Boba Fett.

I have my likes and dislikes with the Phantom Menace as much as anyone else, so I think the real question here is: Is the 3D conversion worth a movie trip, or should I just stick with the Blu-Rays if I absolutely must watch it again?

Personally i think the problem is that A) the movies got worse and worse through the trilogy and B) they bear the unfortunate cross of having to be compared to the original star wars, hailed by many as one of the best sagas of all time (and by many others as just really really good)

I liked the Phantom Menace. Retrospectively, yeah, it wasn't all that great. But it wasn't horrible and on it's own doesn't deserve over a decade of hate.

I was rooting for the Patriots too.

I do think that It is better than Attack of the Clones, I'll give you that.

But if we're talking about the worst Star Wars film, that easily goes to this turd.


By god was this movie bad.

You said it yourself Bob.

Hate for PM would be strong, but disappointment was definitely the case when it came out.

However I'm taking my 5 year old son this weekend who has become obsessed with the movies (5 of them [haven't shown him this one yet, waiting to see it in the theater]) Seeing the series with fresh eyes (through him) has been refreshing and I'm excited to see it this weekend. I don't expect greatness.

Funny thing, my son thinks Jar Jar is stupid.

While I do believe that The Phantom Menace is as bad as I think it is, it isn't any different from myriad other films I enjoyed when I was younger that don't hold up today. It certainly isn't worth dwelling on (though I do love the Plinkett review for how funny it is).

Hey Bob, do you know where the Hulk comes from in that clip of The Avengers? He's clearly not there, then the camera rotates and suddenly he is! CG goof? It might be something they can fix in post, but there doesn't seem to be any room between Iron Man and Hawkeye for him to stand anyway.

CronoT:

unacomn:
Phantom Menace is probably the one I disliked the least, until a few years later, I kinda liked it. What really killed the SW prequels for me was Anakin becoming Vader mostly because he acted like 12 year old on the internet who couldn't find any rational reason behind his actions and statements, so he started to throw tantrums, threats and called everyone a Nazi... then he killed a bunch of kids for the fun of it.

I could stomach JarJar, he was sometimes funny, I could stand little Any, I could overlook the plotholes, but making that wuss Vader was just painful. That retroactively poisoned the prequels for me, to the point where all I feel for them is apathy.

I think that the point of the prequel movies is that people who you set up as some long sought Messiah type character often as not end up being either a disappointment, or end up with entitlement issues and seriously screw over everyone around them.

As for Anakin/Vader, the general consensus about his prophecy of The Chosen One WAS fulfilled in the overall narrative, since by the end of Episode III, the Jedi HAD started an inexorable slide into fascism and what technically does amount to a form of theocracy. The evidence trotted out most often is when Mace Windu declared that Palpatine had to die, because he was too dangerous. In the context of the Light Side/Dark Side ethos, that would have pushed Mace Windu to the Dark Side, and the cycle would have simply repeated all over again.

Lending a sort of emotional and moral complexity to a kids movie YES IT'S A KIDS MOVIE DEAL WITH IT and a movie by George Lucas I think just doesn't exist. Windu had to kill Palpatine because Anakin had to kill Windu because Anakin had to take that step from mere pyschological dissidence to outright murdermurdermurderface, and Windu provided the foil for that. It wasn't the Jedi themselves who were corrupt - their sin was probably at worst being completly out of touch and ignorant, which is by no means a minor thing - but that the entire system of the Republic was corrupt - which made the ham fisted democracy good, monarchy bad! nonsense of the third act of ROTS all the more facepalmy.

In my opinion the best Star Wars material produced in the last decade or so is and remains Genndy Tartokovsky's Clone War's shorts, which 'coincidentally' consist primarily of dramatic action sequences with little to no characterization or dialogue - with the exception of materials dealing with Anakin which demonstrate a far better descent into angst and pride fueled rage far better than the movies did (it also provides a far superior characterization of General Greivous and frankly just makes him awesome and menacing as opposed to the comedic charicture of a menacing villain we're provided with in ROTS without any leadup or introduction)

I'll admit the animations are poorly voiced, drawn, and animated, yet their choreography still conveys an impact on par or exceeding the movies.

It also provides interesting context for your claim that Windu was slipping to the darkside (it's worth noting that Windu's particular saber style and practices require aggression and 'enjoying fighting' which have historically claimed everyone who utilized the Style to the darkside) because, when confronted with the then far more menacing Greivous, rather than tangling with him or trying to rescue Chancellor Palpatine, Windu -crushes his chest cavity with the force-, the equivilant of a force choke at least if not outright crushing someones heart with the force.

This scene was added in by Tartokovsky to make Grievous match up to the wheezing invalid we're presented with in the movies, by the way, not the other way around - work on the Cartoon was done under an info blackout from Lucas arts (because many details were still in flux at that time).

And finally just for Funsies, here's Mace Windu soloing an army.

I'm fine with not hating it anymore (not that I really did to begin with, at least not compared to the other two... shudder), but these crappy rehashes don't deserve a big box office when truly good stuff like Scott Pilgrim isn't successful.

So yeah, I won't rant about it (nor will I encourage others to do so), but neither will I go see it (and I encourage others NOT to do so.)

Not to mention, if it succeeds it'll get all of Hollywood on the REMADE IN 3D! bandwagon where they can rerelase decade-old footage at premium prices just for the privilege of giving the audience migraines.

Damn Bob. You read my mind before I went into this video. You see, I wanted to like and be biased for the Star Wars fanbase for having valid points, but recently I took a few steps back and realized that they were letting their childhood fuel their anger over a couple ****ing movies.

I'll admit with the rest of you that the prequels are nowhere near as good as the original trilogy, because it's hard enough to follow them up. Still, I see no reason to hate the prequels aside from being goofy and straying slightly from what was grounded before.

Well since I was born in 1995 this was the first Starwars movie I actually ever saw, and I loved it. Then I watched the original 3 and I was like "meh". Personally I love the prequels more than the originals just because that was my childhood. I loved the action scenes in the first one. Loved Jarjar and the whole Naboo ordeal. When I watch them now I still think the original just aren't as good, and why? That was what I grew up watching man.

I agree with most of Bob's points here, BUT the fact of the matter is The Phantom Menace was basically the start of the Skywalker saga and it could/should have been better. Simple as that.

Okay, you raised a lot of valid points. The Phantom Menace is a mediocre movie. I hear you mention that the CGI aged. I don't think that's going to help the 3d any? Is the 3d any good?

My only main beef with the prequel trilogy was that they went almost exclusively for big ticket names to star in it and you can practically see the egos rise up throughout the movies. The only real exception to this (in my eyes at least) being Samuel L. Jackson who actually gave a solid performance. The rest though? Practically calling it in and dull as dishwater.

Compare this to the original trilogy where nearly everyone was an unknown and the trilogy gave them their big ticket start off. You saw determination to give a good performance there because their livelihood relied on it.

That said, I've seen each prequel movie precisely once, noted that at best they were an average summer blockbuster (which when you think about it puts it on par with the original trilogy though not as memorable but that's because it's been done before) and walked away.

And of course roll my eyes at any ragers who feel like their childhood has been asked to point on the doll at the spot the bad movie touched it.

Duffeknol:
I hope even more people watch the Plinkett reviews now thanks to you :)

I tried too, but just like Jar Jar, I could not stand his fucking voice... oh by spongebob, I could not stand his awful, awful, stereotypical voice.

I listened to at least 7 minutes, and he made sense... But that could not keep his voice away. :(

Please do a cover of it, haha. ^^

So... Hardcore fanboys are basically just big, whiny kids.

"No shit Sherlock", comes to mind.

On a side note, I never really cared all that much about the Star Wars universe. Any of it. Just like Dragonball Z or well-known 80's horror flicks, I've noticed that watching carefully thought out spoofs of those works are often more entertaining than the original works. For me at least.

 Pages 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 NEXT

Reply to Thread

Log in or Register to Comment
Have an account? Login below:
With Facebook:Login With Facebook
or
Username:  
Password:  
  
Not registered? To sign up for an account with The Escapist:
Register With Facebook
Register With Facebook
or
Registered for a free account here