The Big Picture: The New Green

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For an "obscure" character, Alan Scott's appeared a LOT in the last couple of decades.

Almost monthly for the last ten years prior tio the reboot, in the pages of JSA, as a matter of fact.

Just putting that out there.

Nate Corran:
My thought was pretty much "Good for them, now why are they being so righteous about it?" Why not make it happen and not make a big deal about it? Because if they didn't they wouldn't get press out of it. Its not like people are going to go out and buy it because he is gay. Make a genuinely good character and it doesn't matter if they're black, white, gay, straight, man, woman, alien. A good character is a good character.
Also, WHY THE F*CK ARE YOU BRINGING BACK THE EARTH 2 BULL SHITE???
*adjusts tie*
It just seems foolish.

Because they only made him gay as a marketing stunt.

Vortigar:
Personally I'd say the whole 2 earths so they can have a different version of established characters to mess around with is a pretty good idea. It's just that DC can't help but do it in the most convoluted way possible.

DVS BSTrD:
As long as it wasn't Aquaman.

Ghah! Established canon? That's no way to appeal to the youth! Make everything new and 'hip' and make Power Girl's boobs bigger while you're at it. Hell, MAKE ALL THEIR BOOBS BIGGER!

Apparently Aquaman is pretty cool in the New 52. Also Wonder Woman is a good book for the first time in 20 years or so. What the hell is going on here?

PG's boobs have actually shrunk (and are covered up nowadays).

I rather like PG myself, she realizes people notice the rack so she just makes it into her thing. Basically every superheroine has this amazing body that is never really talked about in the comics themselves. Power Girl and Empowered are almost the only characters where they address this, making them more mature (in a way) than the ones screaming that it's pandering. Of course that's still going on, but that counts for basically every superhero comic out there.

tldr:
Buy Batwoman.
^_^

ps. A man, over 1000 posts, I've gone gonzo... I loved the pulitzer laureate tag...

I have to agree here.

It's kinda odd that a character like Cersei Lanister in A song of ice and fire is considered a good character (Nobody likes her, she's evil, and yadda yadda... but she is well written and realistic) when what she basically do is use her beauty and sexuality as her main weapon.

Yet have someone like PG around and all of a sudden it's pandering? Girls that look like the comic book super hero are usually movie stars or models and like it or not, their look is a big part of their life and the way society react to them and perceive them.

Which is kinda funny when you think about it - Martin's work is a lot more 'graphic' than any mainstream comic book ever will be... I guess it's all about the medium.

I don't know that the real problem is that character like PG panders... as much as comic book artists are unable to draw a female character that doesn't look like the most beautiful women in the world... and then the writers write entire world that totally ignore the super hot babe walking around in a costume that barely hide anything and leave nothing to the imagination.

I don't particularly care that Alan is gay. Only that ya know it's not Alan Scott in any way, shape, or form. But this registers right up there on the scale of Kyle Rayner being Latino. I.E. You'll probably never remember it after a few years.

Or worst comes to worst, it will be exactly like Terry Berg all fucking over again, and Alan Scott will abandon earth because his boyfriend got beat up. I'm not joking by the way.

Hey DC, do me a favor and make Kyle Rayners backstory make sense again, because with Donna Troy and Jade now existing in Limbo, his backstory beyond "Girlfriend died, shit sucks, became God a couple of times, was pretty cool" doesn't actually begin to make sense.

In a perfect world, this news wouldn't be seen a societal shock catching the attentions of dinosaurs who happen to have internet access, but a slight shock to his character, maybe even on par with


with how insignificant it really is in the big pict... in the general sense, with readers not rethinking about how said character looks at people of the same gender. Then again, perhaps it'd get readers more involved with how said character romantically interacts and would develop a gay-oriented kind of 'shipping in the fanbase, just as much as regular 'shipping. And gay 'shipping might show more people, inform them, that homosexual relationships, and relationships in general are all about people loving each other.

In other news, I am so glad this came out before Nintendo revealed New Super Mario Bros U, otherwise I'd be pelted every other fucking minute with Bob's biased fanboyisms, or worse, an entire episode about how great this totally original and not copying and pasting and maybe touching up the polygons on every graphical asset to make people who actually buy the system don't feel totally gypped game is going to be instead of actually insightful and interesting stuff.

DutchAssassin8:
And not a single mention of the fact that this was all planned to compete with the first superhero-gay-marriage by Marvel.

Earth-2 was planned, and would have been written, months in advance of Marvel's announcement of this.

Quiet Stranger:
I hope someone reads this and gives me an answer. Also if anyone could recommend some of the New 52 that'd be great because like I've said, I've only been reading Green Lantern stuff and Red Lantern also I heard The Flash had a hand in merging, WildStorm, Vertigo, and the DC universes together, in what comic book arc did that happen? I really need to catch up, still haven't read Flashpoint.

I really don't know where Bob is getting 'underwhelming' from considering the quality of the books I read.

A list of what I think are the New 52's best books:

The best:
Animal Man
Swamp Thing
Frankenstein: Agent of Shade
I, Vampire
Demon Knights

Also really good:
Justice League Dark
Resurrection Man
Batman
Batwoman
Nightwing
Wonder Woman
Aquaman
The Flash

Books I haven't read but are supposed to be good:
OMAC (cancelled now)
Voodoo
All-Star Western
Birds of Prey
Batwing
Supergirl

That's almost half of DC's main comic output that is seemingly of passing quality (I can't say for certain about the books I haven't read but reading peoples comments on them make them sound interesting). I don't see how 'underwhelming' is a description that could even be considered.

McMarbles:
For an "obscure" character, Alan Scott's appeared a LOT in the last couple of decades.

Almost monthly for the last ten years prior tio the reboot, in the pages of JSA, as a matter of fact.

Just putting that out there.

Yeah, being a main character in one of DC's biggest team books of recent times somewhat helps to shake the moniker of 'obscure'. Alan Scott is far from obscure is the comic book world. He isn't just the long-forgotten original Green Lantern that conflicts with the more modern version, he's an interesting character and concept in his own right. Describing him as a 'fake' Green Lantern or whatever is a disservice to the character.

Kinshar:

MrDeckard:
Good episode.

More or less my same thoughts on the matter.

Though I have to ask. LGBT..... Q? The hell is "Q"? Quadsexual? Quasarsexual?

Queer which is a umbrella term for the preceding LGBT.

I am very confused.

Isn't Queer a very derogatory term? Or has the meaning of the word changed again?

Even if it isn't, how does it refer to Transsexuals and Bisexuals? Isn't it a term for Homosexuals?

And if it DOES work, why say LGBTQ if the Q just means LGBT???

If it ISN'T considered redundant, why isn't it in the title more often?!?!?

I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT'S GOING ON.

Morbira:
If I may interject on something a little non-sequitur... Am I the only one who really hates the term "LGBT"? I mean if you spell it out it sounds atrocious and cumbersome ("algae-beaty"), and if you try to physically pronounce it you sound like a drooling invalid. Just a pet peeve...

And thus the term QUILTBAG was invented, by someone other than me:

Queer/Questioning, Undecided, Intersex, Lesbian, Trans, Bisexual, Asexual, Gay.

Pros: Humorous, Humorously Quicker to Say than LGBT (humorous, as it contains more components), All-Encompassing(ish), Everyone Knows How to Pronounce It.

Cons: Not Yet Universally Accepted, Sounds F**king Silly.

I'll leave the decision of which acronym to use to you.

Why doesn't anyone care about alternate realities? Marvel's been cranking out consistently high quality alternate reality stories for years- I still maintain that Ultimate Spider-man was in every way more interesting than 616 Spider-man.

Anyway. Props for the gay character. Incidentally "Buff dude who acts like a beefsteak and is also gay" was done with Colossus and Northstar, and it was pretty awesome. Y'all should read that too.

I'm waiting for the rule 34# between Alan Scott and Obsidian, with a speech bubble that reads, "Your not my son anymore, so this is totally not gay incest."

Quiet Stranger:
I would actually like to hear Bob's opinion on why the New 52 is "underwhelming" I've only been reading the Green and Red lantern single issues lately, everything I've found out about the New 52 just makes me want to not touch any of the rest (well the main ones anyways, like JLA and JSA and all the main super heroes we know) I mean I guess I'd touch the lesser known ones like Frankenstein Agent of SHADE AND JLA Dark JUST because of John Constantine (although is the John in JLA Dark the Hellblazer John or the original DC 1980s John?)

I hope someone reads this and gives me an answer. Also if anyone could recommend some of the New 52 that'd be great because like I've said, I've only been reading Green Lantern stuff and Red Lantern also I heard The Flash had a hand in merging, WildStorm, Vertigo, and the DC universes together, in what comic book arc did that happen? I really need to catch up, still haven't read Flashpoint.

EDIT: Also for on topic, I'm glad it's NOT the Allen Scott I know and love who's gay (not that there's anything wrong with it but I love the kick ass old man version)

I'll have a go...The New 52 sucks because they fucked up Suicide Squad. Does there need to be another reason?

It is one thing to remove the most iconic mustache in comics (that is bad enough on its own) but making The Wall just another comic book fembot is just downright insulting. I mean if you want to talk diversity why did DC change one of their strongest characters, a menopausal, African-American single mother who is also the most ruthless tactician and patriot, into just another skinny chick? Sure gay men get a voice but what about larger women? I call bullshit DC...Bullshit! Now hang you heads in shame, make Amanda Waller LARGE, and give Deadshot his mo back.

At least I still have the eighties.

EDIT:...and I didn't even start on what they did to Babs.

I haven't kept up with recent events of the reboot enitely. So is Earth two just a side story like the Ultimate Universe for Marvel, or is this the current main earth all stuff happens on? I was under the impression it was the main universe after the reboot. Which if that's the case, I don't have a problem with Alan Scott being gay, I have a problem with them bulldozing Jade and Obsidian out of existence with this nonsense and deaging him. It's basically Brand New Daying Alan scott's entire history out of continuity. That sucks if that's the case.

I'd rather they made existing character Gay (which could explained alot of the tension between him and his so.)than reboot his whole history away. I don't have a problem with Alan Scott being gay,(Or gay chaarcters in general as NorthStar has been Gay for as long as I could remember.) I have a problem with bulldozing continuity simply for the sake of change. If this just a side story to main universe, then whatever, as I didn't care that Ultimate collusus was gay. I mean they made Wasp Asian, Nick Fury black,Captain America is an A hole and the replacement for Peter Parker in the Ultimate universe Hispanic/Black mixed. They tweak the heck out of alternate versions of characters. (like there's whole evil versions of characters on earth 3.) I think it carry more weight then if it happened in the main continuity.

So yeah, no problem with them changing characters, I have a problem with it being done sloppy and drilling away characters history to do it.

weirdsoup:
In regards to the "why don't they come up with new heroes who are representative of this group or that group" it's probably a two-fold reason. 1. It's quite hard to come up with a brand new character in this day and age when pretty much every superpower you can think of has been used and 2. That new character would likely get a slating because of the people who'd see the new character as only being there just to fit that demographic gap.

Isn't that kind of what they did with Batwoman/Kate Kane and the Question/Renee Montoya? But they're great characters, so we let any pandering slide.

And on Power Girl: Have you guys been reading the relaunched World's Finest? It stars Earth-2's Supergirl and Robin, aka Power Girl and The Huntress. What's the big change to PG? The boob window is closed, gentlemen.

How would the fallout to Wonder Woman coming out as at least bi look I wonder.

Who's alan scott and why does anyone care? Something about an alternate version of the original 1940's green lantern is gay in DC's temporary reboot that doesn't actually reboot DC or its main continuity. So basically nothing important happened. Am I missing anything?

Are people really freaking out over this? Are there really people going "omg teh gays are coming!"? Am I going to be allowed to care less than nothing, because my ability to care about forced gender/race/sexuality role changes is non-existent. Mostly because comics are boring.

vxicepickxv:
Wasn't he actually dealing with his son coming out before the new reboot?

I think it's cause the son doesn't exist in the new 52, so they decided to fold over that quality into him.

Gatx:

vxicepickxv:
Wasn't he actually dealing with his son coming out before the new reboot?

I think it's cause the son doesn't exist in the new 52, so they decided to fold over that quality into him.

Congratulations, you are the first person besides me to NOT claim this is being done to compete with Northstar's marriage. Since James Robinson also wrote Starman (Mikaal version) it's really not too much of a stretch that this really was just positive re-inforcement. But the internet will be cynics. Especially people who don't even sodding read the comics any more >_>

Tanis:
Hasn't Moonknight been 'out' for like a decade?

I don't see what the big deal is anymore.

Somebody better tell Marlene. And Echo. And... actually, just read a Moon Knight comic, odds are 1/3 he sleeps with a woman in it.

Also backing up the new 52, Animal-man and Swamp Thing to ALL of the naysaying. And when he finally gets his own book Captain Marvel/Shazam! looks good imo.

Maybe some Teen Titans, not for the 90's tastic character designs but for Bunker a surprisingly well adjusted Gay teenager with a 3 dimensional personality who... nobody has even heard of because he was an original character. Hmmm.

Rocklobster99:

>dissing PG
>using the word "cisgender"

Why haven't I dropped this show yet?

Because its fun to hate on Moviebob?

I don't care about anything except to see One Million Moms flipping their shit, it's hilarious.

And suddenly I feel like a "not really fussed" rant. The most pointless of all rants...

Movie-bob mentioned that up until recently, it's been all white male oriented stuff. And in the last couple of decades the media has been trying really hard to undo that. And movie-bob isn't fussed about them doing so.

...I care even less...

I don't care what gender (mental or physical) the character is; its still more or less the same character. And save for a few situations, none of which apply to me except in ungodly rare circumstances; it seems purely cosmetic. (Why those circumstances are rare are bellow.)

I don't care what sexuality the character is; its a minor detail that I rarely notice until the question of romance comes up. And I don't bring it up often. And when I start thinking about the possibility; I begin to predict- or joke to myself, I can't tell- that any girl I get attracted to is going to have a higher chance of being lesbian than others; not good for me unless I can shape-shift, a dream as elusive as any other I have; possibly taken, which is what happened the last few times; or has no interest in people like me. But you know what happens most often? The girls I would be interested in don't seem to show up anywhere near me, they just seem to not exist at all... and so I gave up... And that, my fellows, is why sexuality doesn't matter to me: I never get close enough to a girl I might be attracted to for the possibility to even matter.

I don't care about race... Unless its a fantasy race like cat-folk, in which case that's just a mild turn on; but otherwise I'm not fussed as its a situation I'm not likely to get into in real life, and if I did I'd probably still give up on hopes of that because I've given up on those kinds of relationships (see above), and thus I'd end up no more fussed than with them than anyone else.

In short, I don't care; Because, ultimately, I feel like I will NEVER, EVER, end up in a situation where any of it even matters. And the only situation I feel it would matter, is the one thing that I KNOW, I will never get any kind of chance at. Cause i have seen not a single person in real life; male or female, or whatever, that has the kind of personality I am attracted to. It just! Doesn't! Happen! ANYWHERE! NEAR ME!

...I'm so alone...

As the possibly somewhat token Superhero fan who's entire experience of these characters (other than Batman) comes from either comes from the cartoons and movies (mostly the cartoons which is why I'm more familia with DC heroes) it really doesn't seem any less significant that this is a reboot of the original Green Lantern as opposed to Hal Jordan. I was introduced to Green Lantern through the Justice League cartoon and think of John Stewart as the "real" Green Lantern. Obviously Hal Jordan has appeared in Cartoons and so I'm familia with him through that, and the other Green Lanterns because of reading wikipedia after Bob's Going green series (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/the-big-picture/3390-Going-Green-Part-I). By and large though, I think of green Lantern as a super hero, not in terms of his secrete identity, which frankly only matters to the people who read comics. Most of the general public have heard of green Lantern, enough to justify a movie attempt, but don't know who his secrete identity is, and when they hear that Green Lantern is now gay they won't know to care which Green Lantern it is. I suspect the purpose of all of this was to send a message to the public at large about where comic books are in terms of diversity rather than speaking to comic fans. Comics have a bit of a PR problem in terms of diversity and this sort of thing will help to counter that (especially since they chose to have gay men).

actually they changed powergirls costume to be a litlle more... um practical...
new v----------------------------------------------------------------old v
image
improvment?

I agree with a lot of this.
Some points:
1 - Oh no! Things are becoming TOO DIVERSE! God help us all! <--People need to stop sounding like this. Some forced diversity beats an eternally whitewashed sausagefest. Well said Bob.
2 - I actually really like what they are doing with Earth 2. I'm actually preferring the idea of this new Justice League with Jay Garrick, Alan Scott and Hawk Girl than the current one in the real Earth. I also like how they are making the JSA characters young so we get to hear their stories again. I hope Sandman and stuff are in it.
3 - I think it's better remaking already popular characters as gay/racially diverse rather than introducing new ones. A lot of new characters these days just sink into the depths of diversity, and it's hard to get one well known. Plus it'd be cool to have a representative of homosexuality in the big leagues, you know? It means that story potential would be tapped into more often.

DVS BSTrD:
Ghah! Established canon? That's no way to appeal to the youth! Make everything new and 'hip' and make Power Girl's boobs bigger while you're at it. Hell, MAKE ALL THEIR BOOBS BIGGER!

image

Except they made them smaller and less provocative. Huh.

Nate Corran:
My thought was pretty much "Good for them, now why are they being so righteous about it?" Why not make it happen and not make a big deal about it? Because if they didn't they wouldn't get press out of it. Its not like people are going to go out and buy it because he is gay. Make a genuinely good character and it doesn't matter if they're black, white, gay, straight, man, woman, alien. A good character is a good character.
Also, WHY THE F*CK ARE YOU BRINGING BACK THE EARTH 2 BULL SHITE???
*adjusts tie*
It just seems foolish.

The main reason? Marvel just had the first comics gay marriage, using a minor character. That's really it in a nutshell.

The two companies are courting controversy for dollars, and for once, it seems to be to lead things in a good direction.

As for bringing back Earth 2, it's their prerogative, and it's a way to not get rid of characters that people a) love, and b) can potentially lose the copyright on.

lastjustice:
I haven't kept up with recent events of the reboot enitely. So is Earth two just a side story like the Ultimate Universe for Marvel, or is this the current main earth all stuff happens on? I was under the impression it was the main universe after the reboot. Which if that's the case, I don't have a problem with Alan Scott being gay, I have a problem with them bulldozing Jade and Obsidian out of existence with this nonsense and deaging him. It's basically Brand New Daying Alan scott's entire history out of continuity. That sucks if that's the case..

Sort of. Earth 2 is a reboot of the previous version of Earth 2 which allowed for the aging 1940's character's to exist today. The New 52 reboots that a la the Ultimate verse, with the exception that the two Earths regularly cross over and that makes the characters - at the very least - recurring.

idodo35:
actually they changed powergirls costume to be a litlle more... um practical...
new v----------------------------------------------------------------old v
image
improvment?

Too bad that it's a rip off of Alan Moore's "Supreme"

image

Mind you... It's not the first time she's had a costume change.

image

maybe they'll see the light.

image

Bob I love you and I will continue to quietly watch every video you make, and I know I'm one chirping voice among millions, but I have to say that every time I hear "X.... IS.... WEIRRRRRD" I cringe and/or roll my eyes. Others may like it but for me, it has become by far the worst part about your videos. It's to the point where if your videos represent a lifetime of whaling, the phrase is the white whale upon which I pile all of the hate and rage of my entire species etc etc.

Please, above all else create the content you'll feel best about, but if you're interested in fan feedback this is mine.

The Thinker:

Morbira:
If I may interject on something a little non-sequitur... Am I the only one who really hates the term "LGBT"? I mean if you spell it out it sounds atrocious and cumbersome ("algae-beaty"), and if you try to physically pronounce it you sound like a drooling invalid. Just a pet peeve...

And thus the term QUILTBAG was invented, by someone other than me:

Queer/Questioning, Undecided, Intersex, Lesbian, Trans, Bisexual, Asexual, Gay.

Pros: Humorous, Humorously Quicker to Say than LGBT (humorous, as it contains more components), All-Encompassing(ish), Everyone Knows How to Pronounce It.

Cons: Not Yet Universally Accepted, Sounds F**king Silly.

I'll leave the decision of which acronym to use to you.

Half the syllables... rolls off the tongue... fun to say...
You, sir, are a genius. If I may shake your hand.

Some very interesting points raised, and I'm glad that people who enjoy comics, and not just Bob, are willing to accept that a character is gay and are actually defending the move if not saying it should have been more of the more promonent characters.

Social acception will grow the more it is established as "normal" in that people are still people regardless of gender, sexuality, race etc.

idodo35:
actually they changed powergirls costume to be a litlle more... um practical...
new v----------------------------------------------------------------old v
image
improvment?

They just moved the window to somewhere the viewer can't see it. Now she has ass cleavage hidden beneath the cape. :P

Morbira:

Half the syllables... rolls off the tongue... fun to say...
You, sir, are a genius. If I may shake your hand.

You may, but you'll have to fit your hand through the internet-tubes, I take no credit for the acronym, and you have no idea where my hand has been. Again, your choice.

I'd give a lot more crap (and a crapton of rage) if they deliberately made a confirmed straight character to pull a "homosexual now" twist. Roy Harper, for example... it's bad enough that they killed off his daughter pre-reboot (destroying his identity as a single father figure), but then they made him younger in the reboot and wrote his daughter out of continuity (being "too young" and whatnot). Making him homosexual on top of all this (keep in mind, his daughter was biological of a straight coupling) would twist the knife even further.

Look, I don't really care if a character with few to no romantic interactions turns out to be homosexual, but randomly flipping the "gay" switch on someone with established straight preferences (especially without any buildup) is not cool with me.

On the downside, it is a version of Green Lantern that most people aren't familiar with that came out of the closet.
On the upside, he wasn't immediately re-named The Pink Flamer or anything to that effect.

Still, it won't cause anywhere near the uproar that Marvel outing Shatterstar and Richter(formerly of X-Force)caused since X-Force was at least big in the 1990s unlike that GL who had been supplanted by Hal Jordan and Jon Stewart by then.

Tanis:
Hasn't Moonknight been 'out' for like a decade?

I don't see what the big deal is anymore.

I've been reading Moon Knight since 2006 and I have no idea what you're talking about.
Maybe you're confusing him with his "sidekick" Frenchie?

I think you're over-using the "comics are weeeeiiiird" think. I like that whole shtik, i don't know why some people get bent out of shape about it. but really, that slogan was good for when you're describing the stories of characters or events from the comics. i mean, put aside those, this episode doesn't really make comics seem all that "weeeeiiiiird!"
i love your comic videos, but not all videos about comics needs to be a "comics are weeeeeiiiird" episode.

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