Escapist Podcast: 053: Ouya Kickstarter and Michael Fassbender

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053: Ouya Kickstarter and Michael Fassbender

This week, this talks about movies, egg slicers and super hero films.

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I was very suprised to hear Susan telling not to ask more from superhero movies. I mean I get it. We are seeing the greatest Comic Book movies ever made right now, but still. Are we wrong to ask for more sophisticated movies?

The last 3 dress shirts I bought were french cuffs i.e. requiring cufflinks, although it is very much a personal choice.

Draken the Ancient Gate was a good game but it had more than one game breaker unfortunately. Every now and again my copy decided to just wipe my saves. :(

I wanted to hear more about tape, tape stories and improper applications of expensive tape...

What? I was entertained.

Michigan looks like a mitten. And we know from It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia that kittens love mittens. Therefore Michigan is the cat capital of the world. That's why it makes sense for it to host a cat film festival.

Having Batman be about something would go over much better with me if both Frank Miller and Christopher Nolan weren't just downright evil people in their personal lives. Either one of them could qualify as villains in the marvel universe if their attitudes were placed into super-humans.

Buying hardware on the basis of it enjoying the attention of Jeff Minter - baaaah. :)

I. Need. An. Egg. Cuber.
Now.

Totally going to get one on Monday.

Thank you Escapist podcast team for making me laugh RIGHT in the middle of cutting out price tags for work.... (reprints tags).... no seriously the wedding bits and the whoopi goldberg thing had me rolling.

Cheers to you for mentioning Drakan: The Ancient's Gates. It's one of earliest PS2 games. Slightly flawed, but overall good. I understand what you mean when you say you don't want to go back and finish it. It took me a few years to get around to doing that. Still, it's a decent game.

Long quote of the day....

Susan: "Guys your being....eh ...we should be happy that they are even making super hero movies!". "We should be happy that they are willing to spend millions of dollars on super hero movies". "These are characters that we have cherished and loved and they are doing it well". "Their trying to do the combined universe of the Avengers so that we have this build up of Thor...and Iron Man...and Captain America..and finally they all come together to become the Avengers and its all GOOD!". "Its really well done and because they actually give a damn about making the characters true to their sources and making them actually representative of their comics...and they are treating them with respect....THAT'S HUGE!. And we are bitching that they have to fight the bad guy at the end...Really?!?

Seriously..../round of applause...thank you! for keeping it all in perspective. I was yelling the same thing at my computer through that whole segment and I'm glad someone said it lol.

You guys really do have some of the most entertaining podcasts out there and really it's these long conversations that I look forward to hearing each week, but you guys have to turn your brains off for movies sometimes...and enjoy them for what they are...pure, fun entertainment. With so much over analyzing everything can be broken down into "meh" but if you look at the big picture its amazing that people went as far as they have with the whole super hero genre and made it work.

Nunchucks can cube an egg.

Coreless:
Long quote of the day....

Susan: "Guys your being....eh ...we should be happy that they are even making super hero movies!". "We should be happy that they are willing to spend millions of dollars on super hero movies". "These are characters that we have cherished and loved and they are doing it well". "Their trying to do the combined universe of the Avengers so that we have this build up of Thor...and Iron Man...and Captain America..and finally they all come together to become the Avengers and its all GOOD!". "Its really well done and because they actually give a damn about making the characters true to their sources and making them actually representative of their comics...and they are treating them with respect....THAT'S HUGE!. And we are bitching that they have to fight the bad guy at the end...Really?!?

Seriously..../round of applause...thank you! for keeping it all in perspective. I was yelling the same thing at my computer through that whole segment and I'm glad someone said it lol.

You guys really do have some of the most entertaining podcasts out there and really it's these long conversations that I look forward to hearing each week, but you guys have to turn your brains off for movies sometimes...and enjoy them for what they are...pure, fun entertainment. With so much over analyzing everything can be broken down into "meh" but if you look at the big picture its amazing that people went as far as they have with the whole super hero genre and made it work.

Yes I agree. One day when comic heroes are out of fashion we will be looking back at this decade and missing it, kicking ourselves for bitching.

Thrashgrinder:
I was very suprised to hear Susan telling not to ask more from superhero movies. I mean I get it. We are seeing the greatest Comic Book movies ever made right now, but still. Are we wrong to ask for more sophisticated movies?

Wrong, no, but it seems like there isn't appreciation for what we've been given before we're turning around and saying "Yeah, that's swell...but you should've done better." Superheroes are defined by their relationship with villains...to have a superhero movie that doesn't end with a confrontation with the bad guy seems mildly absurd. Can they be more than just popcorn movies? Well, sure, I think Christopher Nolan proved that pretty well. But to criticize superhero movies for giving people what they want - which is to say having the good guy go toe-to-toe with the bad guy and win - seems unfair.

I'm looking at this from a place of practicality. These movies are expensive, and need to recoup a lot of cash in order for studios to continue considering them sound investments. In order to increase the ticket sales, there needs to be a satisfying climax to the story arc. People who are more well-versed in comics will undoubtedly consider more subtle things "satisfying" than the general audience, but there's really nothing wrong with a well-done fight in the third act.

If you were never a fan of superhero movies, or didn't have to suffer the previous attempts at superhero movies (the 80s were a bad, bad time), then I understand not being more appreciative of the simple fact that we have truly well-done films starring people in capes and cowls. If you're just looking at these as movies, not superhero movies, then yes, I understand the inclination to think they could be a bit deeper. I'm frankly just thrilled that someone with talent and a big budget is treating comic books with appropriate respect.

Susan Arendt:

Wrong, no, but it seems like there isn't appreciation for what we've been given before we're turning around and saying "Yeah, that's swell...but you should've done better." Superheroes are defined by their relationship with villains...to have a superhero movie that doesn't end with a confrontation with the bad guy seems mildly absurd. Can they be more than just popcorn movies? Well, sure, I think Christopher Nolan proved that pretty well. But to criticize superhero movies for giving people what they want - which is to say having the good guy go toe-to-toe with the bad guy and win - seems unfair.

I'm looking at this from a place of practicality. These movies are expensive, and need to recoup a lot of cash in order for studios to continue considering them sound investments. In order to increase the ticket sales, there needs to be a satisfying climax to the story arc. People who are more well-versed in comics will undoubtedly consider more subtle things "satisfying" than the general audience, but there's really nothing wrong with a well-done fight in the third act.

If you were never a fan of superhero movies, or didn't have to suffer the previous attempts at superhero movies (the 80s were a bad, bad time), then I understand not being more appreciative of the simple fact that we have truly well-done films starring people in capes and cowls. If you're just looking at these as movies, not superhero movies, then yes, I understand the inclination to think they could be a bit deeper. I'm frankly just thrilled that someone with talent and a big budget is treating comic books with appropriate respect.

I completely agree with you that we are so lucky that we are in a time where millions upon millions of dollars can be spent upon comic book movies. But I know they can make comic book movies that can go away from the traditional format. There aren't many examples that exist of this being true (Watchmen and Sin City being the only ones that comes to mind). But, on the whole, I think that they are just being held back by the perception that Superheroes are meant for kids. Sure the perception is slowly being changed (in part thanks to Christopher Nolan), but until we get that superhero movie that wins the Oscar for Best Picture then I do not think Hollywood will be willing to go away from the traditional hero movie structure. Of course, that doesn't mean we cannot take them seriously, or support movies that try to move the genre in that direction.

Though curiously, the only people that I know that complain about not having "deep" comic book movies are those that were previously into comics. Which may just be another form of the "Hardcore gamer hating the casual gamer" syndrome.

Out of curiosity, is there a particular Superhero, story line, or villain that you or the rest of the escapist staff would like to see make it to the big screen?

MANIFESTER:

Out of curiosity, is there a particular Superhero, story line, or villain that you or the rest of the escapist staff would like to see make it to the big screen?

Matter-Eater Lad?

Also, the Avengers civil war stuff seems really interesting, problems with translating that screen at present withstanding.

wizzy555:

Coreless:
Long quote of the day....

Susan: "Guys your being....eh ...we should be happy that they are even making super hero movies!". "We should be happy that they are willing to spend millions of dollars on super hero movies". "These are characters that we have cherished and loved and they are doing it well". "Their trying to do the combined universe of the Avengers so that we have this build up of Thor...and Iron Man...and Captain America..and finally they all come together to become the Avengers and its all GOOD!". "Its really well done and because they actually give a damn about making the characters true to their sources and making them actually representative of their comics...and they are treating them with respect....THAT'S HUGE!. And we are bitching that they have to fight the bad guy at the end...Really?!?

Seriously..../round of applause...thank you! for keeping it all in perspective. I was yelling the same thing at my computer through that whole segment and I'm glad someone said it lol.

You guys really do have some of the most entertaining podcasts out there and really it's these long conversations that I look forward to hearing each week, but you guys have to turn your brains off for movies sometimes...and enjoy them for what they are...pure, fun entertainment. With so much over analyzing everything can be broken down into "meh" but if you look at the big picture its amazing that people went as far as they have with the whole super hero genre and made it work.

Yes I agree. One day when comic heroes are out of fashion we will be looking back at this decade and missing it, kicking ourselves for bitching.

I suppose that, for me, this just isn't enough. It's the same reason I feel comfortable hating Indiana Jones 4. I love Indiana Jones; he's one of my favorite characters of all time, but I'm certainly not thankful that Lucas & Co. invested in bringing him back to the big screen. Why? Because they did a terrible job of it. I won't compare even the worst superhero flick I've ever seen to the unspeakable horror that was IJ4, but it's the same idea. Now, if you like the way they currently make hero films, and enjoy their build to an inevitable climatic clash ... groovy! And I don't think you have terrible taste or are some kind of knucklehead because of it. You, like zillions of movie-goers are all on the same page. But if I personally don't like that aspect, I'm not sure why I should feel obligated not to mention it simply because someone in Hollywood greenlit the production.

I also don't like the idea that having issue with a solitary component of any movie (superhero or otherwise) is somehow snobby or elitist, or that finding a repetitive narrative idea dull is only because I'm "unwilling to enjoy it." It's possible to really like films like this (and I do) while still taking issue with some of their components - movies, like games, don't always have to be graded on a binary system. How many games have you played that you loved, that weren't 10/10? This is really no different, and no one is sneering. It's a movie. It doesn't matter what genre it is. There are things that work for some people that don't work for others. Same goes for drama, comedy, indie, foreign, action, and everything in between. As far as my taste goes, superhero movies get no bonus points or subtractions just for being superhero movies.

Okay, why don't you guys even mention that Ouya want to put the same AAA games that are on 360/PS3 on the Ouya? The whole discussion seems to revolve around the fact that they are only making it so people can play Android games on the TV..which isn't true.

Also Michael Fassbender was never nominated for an Oscar(and Waltz, in fact, won an Oscar), and you missed a great opportunity to talk about Fassbender's involvement in the AC movie!

*puts on hipster glasses* I've been in love with The Fass since before he was cool. Though only for about 6 months. I blame X-Men for that. And he wasn't nominated for an Oscar, just a Golden Globe, for Shame. He deserved that nom, though! His penis most likely scared the committee. Nom... penis. Oh lord I've let my brain get into that territory again. I am so sorry, Escapist, but this wouldn't happen if Michael Fassbender would stop being... everywhere.

Heh, after I typed in "penis" it asked me for a Captcha. I swear, I'm not spamming enlargement pills, system.

AstylahAthrys:

Heh, after I typed in "penis" it asked me for a Captcha. I swear, I'm not spamming enlargement pills, system.

System here, I'll believe it when I see it.
...uh, the spam that is, not the uh... other thing...yeah >.>

That comic Steve was talking about sounds really good, but I typed in Squadron Supreme on Google and what I came up with didn't sound anything like what he was describing. Where can I find it?

That game with the game breaking bug Susan mentioned was Drakan: Order of the Flame, you played as Rynn who wanted to save her brother. Never ran into any bugs myself at the time, but you're not missing out on much, Susan, the ending was utterly anticlimatic, a major letdown! (and a bit of a "wtf" moment) Flying around on your dragon was loads of fun, though, I loved that.

newdarkcloud:
Cheers to you for mentioning Drakan: The Ancient's Gates. It's one of earliest PS2 games. Slightly flawed, but overall good. I understand what you mean when you say you don't want to go back and finish it. It took me a few years to get around to doing that. Still, it's a decent game.

Pretty sure it was its predecessor, Drakan: Order of the Flame, but I could be wrong. Susan will need to confirm, I guess.

On the whole, "we should be grateful they're even making superhero movies", I agree, but that doesn't deter that we should also keep pushing for more sophisticated plots. Sure, it's awesome that we have movies like the Avengers now, but if we don't keep pushing our limits, and asking for more, we'll never evolve beyond what we have now. So I think the points Susan and Mike made aren't mutually exclusive.

The whole Ouya thing intrigues me as there are two radically different sides to it.

The positive side says it's the new wave of innovation. A console that will let you make what you want and do what you want without all the hoops and rules that a major company will make you jump through. A place for innovation and new ideas VS the stagnation of modern consoles.

The negative side says this will never succeed. That it will cost too much in licensing and parts and construction. Look at all the failed consoles of the past, and many of those had multi-million dollar companies behind them. And even if it does succeed it wont get any game companies behind it. Android is too buggy, the games would be too easily pirated. And we can already do this same thing on computers.

I honestly don't think it will be either of those two extremes. I think it will be the Linux of consoles. A console for game/tech enthusiasts but not widely accepted by the general populace or companies.

Eleima:
That game with the game breaking bug Susan mentioned was Drakan: Order of the Flame, you played as Rynn who wanted to save her brother. Never ran into any bugs myself at the time, but you're not missing out on much, Susan, the ending was utterly anticlimatic, a major letdown! (and a bit of a "wtf" moment) Flying around on your dragon was loads of fun, though, I loved that.

newdarkcloud:
Cheers to you for mentioning Drakan: The Ancient's Gates. It's one of earliest PS2 games. Slightly flawed, but overall good. I understand what you mean when you say you don't want to go back and finish it. It took me a few years to get around to doing that. Still, it's a decent game.

Pretty sure it was its predecessor, Drakan: Order of the Flame, but I could be wrong. Susan will need to confirm, I guess.

On the whole, "we should be grateful they're even making superhero movies", I agree, but that doesn't deter that we should also keep pushing for more sophisticated plots. Sure, it's awesome that we have movies like the Avengers now, but if we don't keep pushing our limits, and asking for more, we'll never evolve beyond what we have now. So I think the points Susan and Mike made aren't mutually exclusive.

It's Drakan: The Ancients Gates, I assure you. I still have it.

Jedisolo75:
That comic Steve was talking about sounds really good, but I typed in Squadron Supreme on Google and what I came up with didn't sound anything like what he was describing. Where can I find it?

What you want is the Mark Gruenwald SQUADRON SUPREME. It's really good stuff, though Steve did get one minor aspect of it wrong; he said the reason they didn't use the real Justice League is because they didn't want to take a risk, but the most obvious reason is that Marvel is the one that published the book, not DC, and Marvel was willing to play a bit more fast and loose with characters that were obvious knock-offs of the Justice League in stories that weren't even in the same continuity as their regular books.

Fun fact: after he passed away, Gruenwald's ashes were mixed into the ink on the first printing of the collected edition.

Wait wait wait.

You managed to discuss Viggo Mortensen and Michael Fassbender in the same podcast and neglected to mention the movie in which they starred together?!
I am disappoint.

A Dangerous Method. Sure, it's "one of those Cronenberg films that noone saw". Except for me, obviously. But I think it's a brilliant movie, the two guys, as, wait for it, Sigmund Freud and Carl Jung, flamig each other in letters.
Then again, I'm a shrink and a fan of those two guys and so it's doubly relevant to my interests...

Mike Kayatta:

MANIFESTER:

Out of curiosity, is there a particular Superhero, story line, or villain that you or the rest of the escapist staff would like to see make it to the big screen?

Matter-Eater Lad?

Also, the Avengers civil war stuff seems really interesting, problems with translating that screen at present withstanding.

You know what we could make Matter-Eater Lad to be the Superhero film to win that Best Picture Oscar. We make the movie about him getting over an eating disability. Set it in World War 2 . And give him a daughter to have a heartwarming relationship with. It will be a heartwarming inspirational historical Drama. If only Chris Farley was alive to portray him.

Completely agree on the Civil War stuff though. Marvel would probably need to get back the other licenses though, huh.

I would also want a Deadpool Movie, just because the comedy and the tone of Deadpool would just go so far away from the huge epics of some other Superhero movies.

One thing i hope Marvel starts doing is using movies about more popular heroes, like a Captain America 2 or The Hulk 4 and using them to introduce other characters.

For example:

Captain America goes to defeat a terriorist cell in Dakota and runs into Static Shock, who has made limited headway into defeating the threat on his own. when the two of them team up and compare notes, their combined force is enough to defeat the force neither could have taken on there own.

or a new X-Men movie where the US government starts actively hunting the X-Men for some stuff they were framed for. the hunt gets so intense they have to flee the grasp of the US... which leads them to Wakanda, where the Black Panther, Storm's husband, takes them in and provides a safe base of operations for the team to clear there name.

Doing this would allow Marvel to see how popular certain characters are without the risk of loosing millions on a feature.

Susan Arendt:
It's Drakan: The Ancients Gates, I assure you. I still have it.

I stand corrected!! I guess the "flying around on a dragon named Arokh" principle applies to both installments anyhow. ^_^

Son of Songhai:
Captain America goes to defeat a terriorist cell in Dakota and runs into Static Shock...

Static Shock belongs to DC, or at least Warner Bros.



I had a Nuon DVD player, it was our first DVD player. Didn't have the controller for it. Just as well, it had a grand total of 8 games with such blockbusters as... slight variants of Space Invaders and Tempest.


I can't speak for the Avengers movie, but Bruce Banner does not have control when he's the Hulk, even when he changes on perpose. It's just that the persona of the Hulk is basically a good guy that want's to be left alone (possibly autistic). He'll help fight monsters, but when there isn't a clear enemy, he doesn't know how to deal with fellow heroes.

I'd be interested in seeing Grey Hulk aka. Mr. Fixit in movie form.

I'm with Susan on the whole OUYA thing here....who's going to buy this besides people who are absolutely in love with tinkering, hacking, freeware and open source stuff? That's a really small population in relation to other audiences.

I have another Christoph Waltz movie to recommend: Carnage.

And I'd also like to mention another use of the Game Genie: actually being able to beat a game that's Nintendo-Hard. God mode is boring, but I can tell you that even with the code for 9 lives, I still found "Zelda 2" to be a hard game as a kid. Last year I replayed the game without the help of cheat codes, and the final palace took me about 3-4 hours to beat, cause I kept having to start over.

Oh yeah, what's wrong with the Build Team?

Loethlin:
Wait wait wait.

You managed to discuss Viggo Mortensen and Michael Fassbender in the same podcast and neglected to mention the movie in which they starred together?!
I am disappoint.

A Dangerous Method. Sure, it's "one of those Cronenberg films that noone saw". Except for me, obviously. But I think it's a brilliant movie, the two guys, as, wait for it, Sigmund Freud and Carl Jung, flamig each other in letters.
Then again, I'm a shrink and a fan of those two guys and so it's doubly relevant to my interests...

They did though, however they hated the movie so you may have blocked that part out subconsciously or something.

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