The Big Picture: Worlds Within Worlds

 Pages PREV 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 NEXT
 

See. Where every single thing of it falls flat is that an autistic child still could incorporate parts of real world glimpsed by him into his own fantasies.

Instead of simply having comic book writers care less about continuity why not consider the implications of throwing continuity out the window. It is basically saying why not stop caring if the story makes sense which is moronic.

I don't think even if these shows crossed over it means they are imaginary too, only that interaction would be imaginary as long it isn't mentioned in other episodes.

So, many shows in one autistic mind.
How does he have room for all of that!?

I kind of think, that was partly overacting in terms of "this stuff is connected with this". For example, the whole "Simpsons/X-Files" thing noted in the episode, that was more of a reference or joke than an actual crossover. Hence, they don't have to be set "in the same universe" and X-Files might be not part of that long chain of flowcharts from reaching "Simpsons". Same with a lot of other things, too, I assume.

And if we kick out the reference/jokes as connections and go only with the actual crossover/spin-off, then the whole thing probably shrinks down from the 300 series to probably about a dozand or two...
I could even go further and say that cameos can also be taken out when not acknoledged within the show the character originated from as that could then just be one something that guy quickly thought up in terms of "I like that shows character I saw recently on TV, why not let it appear there in my mind as well?".

So, depending on how tolerant you are, that whole "300 and counting connected shows" isn't true. I exclude references and jokes from such an idea myself, to be honest.
Final line: Mind not blown. Sorry.

There is a flaw in the entire theory though. What if Tommy was incorporating stuff into St. Elsewhere from people and places that really existed in his world, not just his imagined world.

just by touching the simpsons it spread to about a million other shows anyway, without needing a lot of crossovers.

...I think I just went crosseyed. Seriously, I had no idea so many shows were interconnected... someone oughta write a story or something base off that...

Seriously, this Tommy Westphall kid has a hell of an imagination to come up with all that!

videocrazy:
Here's a creepy thought: The Mythbusters did a cameo on an episode of CSI. Adam Savage and Jamie Hyneman are real people. Ergo, we are also imaginary.

(Cue Twilight Zone theme)

Ok, someone has waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too much time on his hands and not enough to do. Incidentally, that gave me a headache.

Mind = Blown.

Law & Order, CSI, Firefly (and in extension Castle, with the reference to the coat), Buffy/Angel ... I believe I just lost two thirds of my lifetime's worth of series to this. o.o

This may put Tommy in the same universe as everything but I'm not sure he made it all up. I mean what if he just saw other shows and then referenced them in his fantasies?

Ickabod:
There is a flaw in the entire theory though. What if Tommy was incorporating stuff into St. Elsewhere from people and places that really existed in his world, not just his imagined world.

Hmmmmmmm, that's a point too. What if all the shows that St. Elsewhere ever did crossovers with were also TV shows in Tommy's world and thus Tommy watched them and incorporated them into the world of St. Elsewhere. Suddenly Tommy's imaginary world shrinks back down to just being St. Elsewhere.

Is it really valid to include the Yoyodyne connection in this extrapolation?

Even if we accept that crossovers with characters actually occurred and result in the nullification of their respective series, a reference to a corporation in another work is not necessarily the same corporation. At least with actors we can visually confirm that they are the same person. Of course without that assumption this whole thing becomes sketchier. If the characters don't make reference to their adventures in St. Elsewhere (or wherever they happen to intersect with Tommy's incredibly prodigious imagination) at some point it might not actually be canon in their respective series. People tend to assimilate elements of the works that they have experienced into their imagination (Or am I the only one to be chased by a ravenous Pac-Man?). Perhaps the inclusion of some of the cameos in this series are not canonical, and merely imagined by Tommy Westphall.

In short, the situation might be less 'your favorite show never existed' and more 'your favorite show might be the deranged ramblings of a diseased mind'.

Now that I think of it... even without St. Elsewhere you run that risk. Enjoy your fiction, you never know when it will turn out you've been listening to a crazy person for years while defending their vision.

Hylke Langhout:
That was pretty damn awesome. I looked up the site and was surprised to find The A-Team or Columbo do not fall in Westphall's Mind. I haven't done extensive reason, nor have I seen all of the episodes, but you'd think that with how long those series ran, that they'd have some crossovers at some point.

Not sure if he would count it, but if The Simpsons is allowed as a connection, anything goes:

There is an easter egg in the A-Team movie, when they bust Murdoch out of the looney bin. If you watch the credits for the conjured film The Greater Escape (featuring old-school A-Team theme music), the stars of the film are:
Reginald Barclay (Dwight Schulz played this character in addition to Murdoch)
Thomas Banacek (George Peppard played this character in addition go Hannibal)
G.F. Starbuck (Dirk Benedict played this character in addition to Face)

So there you go. Through the Barclay/Star Trek link I just gave you The A-Team, Banacek, and the entire Battlestar Galactica universe.

Most fun I've had with TV/movie connections since Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon.

I had to pause at 4:30 to deal with my first nosebleed. My head hurts.

Oh my god, every show I enjoyed, shows I planned to watch, my entire life of television is now just the imagination of an autistic child...

Wait, Enterprise never happened?

canadamus_prime:

Ickabod:
There is a flaw in the entire theory though. What if Tommy was incorporating stuff into St. Elsewhere from people and places that really existed in his world, not just his imagined world.

Hmmmmmmm, that's a point too. What if all the shows that St. Elsewhere ever did crossovers with were also TV shows in Tommy's world and thus Tommy watched them and incorporated them into the world of St. Elsewhere. Suddenly Tommy's imaginary world shrinks back down to just being St. Elsewhere.

Haven't I just mentioned that?

CommanderKirov:
See. Where every single thing of it falls flat is that an autistic child still could incorporate parts of real world glimpsed by him into his own fantasies.

I wondered the same but I guess that just makes too much sense?

MY MIND!!

Though I understand the point of this theory, I'm a little wary to include other shows just because they shared some actors within them, or am I reading this the wrong way?

Mind Blown.
Also Fox New has appeared in the Simpsons, chew on that for while.

obviously star trek, aliens, red dwarf, and doctor who are all different universes in this kids head which means its actually a multiverse or at least based on the fact that several shows have referenced and visited other universes. In my opinion he might even have dreamed up the very universe he exists in.

That doesn't necessarily follow. Just because Weyland-Yutani are mentioned in Tommy's imagination does not mean he thought them up he could have simply seen Aliens and now that is influencing his imagination.

Friv:
In fact, since Boston exists in our world, I assume that anything that takes place in our world or references it is part of Tommy Westphall's imagination. Two degrees of seperation for every piece of media based around Earth, problem solved.

Indeed.
But even if you don't take things that far, it still is rather simple to connect everything because the theory, as it is presented and as far as I am aware, is not limited by anything in default because it is not limited to tv program.
Besides, even a show like Simpsons already has millions of shows in it mentioned at one time or another.

CrazyGirl17:

videocrazy:
Here's a creepy thought: The Mythbusters did a cameo on an episode of CSI. Adam Savage and Jamie Hyneman are real people. Ergo, we are also imaginary.

(Cue Twilight Zone theme)

Ugh...as if this theory couldn't get any goofier!

I think I better play my trump.

"What if everything we see as works of fiction are actually images we have seen of other realities through latent psychic talent that allows certain talented individuals to tune into specific realities much like we tune into certain radio stations?"

This might disprove the hypothesis. Once we throw alternate realities into the picture, the theory falls apart. Just because we saw St. Elsewhere charcters on certain other series doesn't necessarily mean they are the exact SAME characters. Consider:

TheSchaef:
Not sure if he would count it, but if The Simpsons is allowed as a connection, anything goes:

There is an easter egg in the A-Team movie, when they bust Murdoch out of the looney bin. If you watch the credits for the conjured film The Greater Escape (featuring old-school A-Team theme music), the stars of the film are:
Reginald Barclay (Dwight Schulz played this character in addition to Murdoch)
Thomas Banacek (George Peppard played this character in addition go Hannibal)
G.F. Starbuck (Dirk Benedict played this character in addition to Face)

So there you go. Through the Barclay/Star Trek link I just gave you The A-Team, Banacek, and the entire Battlestar Galactica universe.

Most fun I've had with TV/movie connections since Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon.

Only problem is, those are not the SAME Barclay, Banacek, and Starbuck as their Star Trek, Banacek, and Battlestar Galactica counterparts. Same names...but technically different characters.

So...mind not blown. The theory has a bit of a flaw.

(BTW...the stuff in quotes I said earlier is actually the premise for my fanfiction. I am QUITE familiar with the goofiness of crossovers...)

CAPTCHA: game is up

Yes...yes it is. And now everyone here has lost it.

Geeksplosion Nerdgasm...
S'like, "6 degrees of Kevin Bacon" gone nuclear.

Apocalooza... 0_0 !

Friv:
As entertaining as it is, the connections get a little... flawed... after a while.

I mean, you might as well say that St. Elsewhere takes place in Boston, therefore any show, book, or media that includes Boston is part of Tommy Westphall's imagination.

In fact, since Boston exists in our world, I assume that anything that takes place in our world or references it is part of Tommy Westphall's imagination. Two degrees of seperation for every piece of media based around Earth, problem solved.

videocrazy:
Here's a creepy thought: The Mythbusters did a cameo on an episode of CSI. Adam Savage and Jamie Hyneman are real people. Ergo, we are also imaginary.

I think I can explain these, you see parts of "our world" can influence Tommy's world(s). After all when you dream there's a chance that something you've seen or read will appear in said dream. So it's possible that say watching American Idol could have conjoured him in The Simpsons in Tommy's mind.

Jumplion:

MY MIND!!

Though I understand the point of this theory, I'm a little wary to include other shows just because they shared some actors within them, or am I reading this the wrong way?

Not actors - characters.

Trust Bob to make the difference...

That was weird and cool finding out all those shows link together. You'd think there would be all kinds of copyright bollocks stopping people from randomly putting a character from a completely unrelated show into their show.

Mind = Blown

Well, I guess the jig is up. I admit it, I'm actually two squirrels and a raccoon stuffed inside a man shaped balloon.

I have to assume that all of that was some parallel to the way comic books try to maintain everything all at once and end up stepping on each other and then having to create alternate universes, which is something I'm really only familiar with though having watched other things by Movie Bob, not being big into to comics myself. That didn't get the time it should have in explanation, which makes this seem slightly disconnected and a thing I don't know why we should care about in this episode. Just saying - the 'degrees of separation' thing is old hat unless you're talking about something specific, which you didn't quite manage to do here because of the lack of link up dialog and the assumed knowledge. I'm guessing comic book fans get a lot more out of this episode simply because they already know that, but it's a video game fan site not a comic book fan site and while the two cultures enjoy considerable overlap... explanation still required for other viewers.

Meanwhile, I'm on the road to forgiving the ME3 ending attitude simply because enough time is passing that I'm back to being curious about what you're up to with these vids. Just saying.

I knew about the Law and Order, X files connection. And a few of the other ones such as the Red Dwarf, Weyland Yutani and Tardis thing.

But the scope of all the crossovers and nods to each other.... insane.

Bindal:

Snip.

My thoughts are quite similar, plus the whole thing is just a "what if" hypothesis, to illustrate the point of continuity in comics being too rigid. So the whole theory may come off as interesting or mind-blowing to some people because of how many shows can be linked, although if we do take out the references/jokes just like Bindal mentioned it's not even that impressive. But even then, the whole idea that everything originates from the kids mind is kind of lame in my opinion.

When did the kind of cop-out things like: it was all imagined, or it was just a dream supposed to be good again?

Maybe I'm in the minority here, but this wasn't that mind-blowing.

Now the "purple carrot fact", mentioned at the end of a Big Picture episode, was more mind-blowing, maybe because it is actually a real thing, not many people may know about.

Wait, Aliens is in Star Trek Canon? I demand a cross over right now!!!

I knew as soon as I saw the title, somehow, that this was going to be about Tommy Westphall. And I never thought I'd see St. Elsewhere mentioned in TBP. But I'm pretty glad it did, because the whole idea (both the Mind Screw ending and the teasing-out of the suggestion) is just so much fun to mess with. Thanks for this one.

If there was a weakness in this video, honestly I'd have liked to hear more of Bob's conclusions at the end. The five-minute tracing of the Westphallverse was excellent, don't get me wrong, but the conclusion felt a bit rushed. I'd like to hear more of what Bob thinks about Westphall's effect on continuity philosophy. But still, great fun.

 Pages PREV 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 NEXT

Reply to Thread

Log in or Register to Comment
Have an account? Login below:
With Facebook:Login With Facebook
or
Username:  
Password:  
  
Not registered? To sign up for an account with The Escapist:
Register With Facebook
Register With Facebook
or
Register for a free account here