Jimquisition: I Hate Videogames (Because I Love Them)

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AdmiralMemo:

Dragon Zero:
I thought this whole deal was already known, why am I seeing all of this stuff now? I could have sworn MovieBob posted about it on his blog at least a few months ago. Still eating there for reason's of my own (NO, I DON'T AGREE WITH THE ANTI-GAY VIEWS) but I understand why others will not and respect that.

It's never been a secret what they do with their money, but Dan Cathy's comments to an interviewer got it more press, and more of the public that didn't know about it now knows.

I suspect you're in the camp agreeing with Antoine Dodson, knowing that a boycott will hurt the local business owners and employees more than the corporation.

More or less. Plus my nephew is rather enamored with the place and arguing with a 5 year old high functioning autistic is like charging an armored division armed with your bare hands. However I do think if it's to be discussed, this isn't the right thread. I was just trying to understand why people are making such a stink recently.

Great video as always. This is stuff he's been saying for a long time, and it's kinda sad that he had to take a whole video just to spell it out.

It's hilarious because I thought this was going to be a slightly different subject than it is, but it's still in the same vein.

It's like people that hate Mass Effect 3 and won't shut the fuck up about why they hate it. But I guess Dumbledore would call it love. They love it so much that any minor amount of disappointment caused them to hate it. It's like Star Wars fanboys, and that's saying that as a Star Wars fanboy. The more we hate it, it means the more we love it.

Gamers are a vexing group. Sometimes we are so in love with something that we refuse to see the flaws, and some times, we magnify the flaws to the point where we don't have fun with it anymore. I love Transformers War for Cybertron, and while Fall of Cybertron's multiplayer demo isn't making me feel like the multiplayer is better, I will still be getting FoC and will merrily scrap robots for months to come.

It's okay to love or hate something. The trick is to not fool yourself. The point behind games is to have FUN. If you had fun, then wasn't that all that mattered? My favorite Final Fantasy title is VIII, but I could criticize that all day in a way that the Spoony One could only dream of; but it's because I love it that I am critical of it. And that's okay, you know?

Captcha: Riff-raff

Woot.

Dragon Zero:
More or less. Plus my nephew is rather enamored with the place and arguing with a 5 year old high functioning autistic is like charging an armored division armed with your bare hands. However I do think if it's to be discussed, this isn't the right thread. I was just trying to understand why people are making such a stink recently.

It's just the media, trying to stir up ratings by stirring up controversy. I guess nothing was happening last week, so someone thought "Hey! Let's go ask the conservative guy who runs a business that's not open on Sundays what he thinks about marriage! And we'll all be shocked by his answer!" It's all about ratings, and nothing more.

And I just love you for your support of autistic people. :-) They may have issues, but some of their gifts can more than easily compensate for that. :-)

Hatchet90:
How dare Chick-Fil-A support the idea that traditional marriage should be between a man and a woman, truly they are bigots of the highest order *sarcasm.

I, too, support traditional marriage! Marriage should be between a man and his 20 wives, all of whom are the man's property! The Bible says so!

Well, problem is that the only way to be taken seriously by commercial players is by and large to vote with one's wallet, which mean missing out on the games if you want to take an actual stand against the practises tied to them.

Or of course come up with alternate business practises that can ensure equal or greater revenue to the invasive ones, or more likely support those developers/distributors who do take a leap of faith with something like "No DRM" by buying their games. But unfortunately good business practises don't equal to good games.

sindremaster:

balberoy:

This is the wrong prespective.
If the developer doesn't produce the games we want (what the apparently don't do anymore)
and it's the publishers mistake, those developers will search a new publisher.

But you still buy games and so nothing will change.

For me noone who still buys from EA, Activision and Ubisoft is a Gamer.
Sry, those "customers" pay for destroying our loved hobby.

But they do produce the games I want, I just hate the publishers for different reasons.
I love Bioware games, but I hate what EA does with DLC.
I love Assassin's Creed, but I hate Ubisoft's DRM.
Bioware is owned by EA and Ubisoft makes AC, which means they can't find a new publisher. I love their games and want to support the devs so I buy their games.

In other words, you want things to change but you are not willing to make even the slightest sacrifice. Sorry, but that is just lousy thing to do and will not work.

I want million dollars but I will not move mu ass from the chair is not how things work.

I'm just a little curious what Jim meant about the PS3 being bad with high speed internet. I'm not trying to be a PS3 fanboy, I'm honestly just wondering if there's been some problems with it in the past I didn't notice with mine. Anyone know?

100% agree, thanks for bringing this to light. Critism is a very important part of fan feedback. It is one of the only ways that the industry gets direct feedback and it always bothers me when someone isn't willing to hear any criticism of a particular game or worse, game publisher.

Quiotu:
I've been saying this for a while, and it's nice to see someone make a video about this train of thought.

I bought SSX new because the online pass wasn't needed to play. I bought ME3 used with a free online pass I got from a friend because of the opposite practice. I'd like to think I can steer companies in ways I want by using my money as a carrot. You make your games in a way I like, and I give you a sale. If you don't, I'll fuck you over.

Same with Ubisoft. I bought Rayman Origins and Lumines for the Vita because they were awesome games, and I still might down the line get the latest Driver game because I really liked how it played. However, I refuse to buy ANYTHING Ubisoft makes for the PC because of their hideous online DRM practices. Bethesda's games I buy years later for cheap and only on the PC because it's only the modding community that makes their games playable, sometimes literally.

Again, you don't have to boycott an entire goddamn publisher because of what they do. Hell, boycotting EA or Activision is going to make you miss out on a lot of really good content. If you have that kind of dedication, then by all means. But don't have a cry and say you'll never buy anything from them, then break that promise a month later. Be selective... if a game was made with practices that you don't like, then don't buy it, but don't miss out on good games that were made with good intentions simply because you don't like the publisher.

Now if only I could do something to change a few other practices publishers are frequently using now through my wallet, but I don't see how I can. How do consumers change the practice of using MetaCritic or sales quotas to hold an IP hostage? Those are practices I really want to see die, but not sure how I can make a difference... which is a shame.

I like your mentality and approach. Unfortunately the publishers will just use it as proof that they're right in fighting piracy with bad DRM and fighting used games. Personally I loved the first two Mass Effects and bought all the content. For the third, I am waiting for a used one and then not getting any of the additional content. I just can't condone many of EA's practices. I get that the goal is to make money, but I think the way to make money is to treat your customers well instead of trying to milk them.

I love Dead Space, too. Yeah, EA's hanging around nagging at me because you marry the whole family, so to speak, but I love Dead Space and I want to keep playing it. As long as I don't have to deal with EA's shit every day, if the mother-in-law doesn't live with me and my digital bride, then I can tolerate it for the sake of love.

Azex:
Only a Sith deals in absolutes. Nice one Jim! :D

Interesting reference...and actually quite correct. Saying you love a company just because you love the games or hate a company just because of their business practices is definitely the absolutism that goes here. Personally...I'd like to see some of the better game series turned over to other companies with less shittier business practices just to see what happens.

Hmmm...I wonder if we can relate the "good products, bad business" idea to the Spiderman franchise as well...

Blade_125:

Hatchet90:
How dare Chick-Fil-A support the idea that traditional marriage should be between a man and a woman, truly they are bigots of the highest order *sarcasm.

They are against homosexual couples being allowed to benefit from the advantages of being married. Eg spousal medical benefits, insurance, etc.

Bigot : a person who is intolerant of any ideas other than his or her own

Sounds pretty accurate.

That's may be the definition of bigot. But sorry, just because you don't approve of gay marriage does not mean you are a bigot. Do tell me how believing in something means you are automatically INTOLERANT of the opposite. Maybe what you need is to learn what TOLERANCE means.

Tolerance: a fair, objective, and permissive attitude toward those whose opinions, practices, race, religion, nationality, etc., differ from one's own; freedom from bigotry.

I hate rap. Hate, hate, hate it. Think its crap that all sounds the same and I wish it didn't exist But guess what. Still tolerant of it. I let it exist because it has a right to. But that doesn't mean I have to like it.

But its ironic, the chicken guy has a view, and a belief, but you seem to be rather intolerant of it. That make you a bigot as well?

Say what you want about Jim Sterling as a columnist or opinion-haver, out of all the people with similar jobs he has the by far best comedy chops.

It's not necessarily all that cleverly written, it's pretty standard stuff, but his timing and delivery is priceless. I fins myself laughing out loud at things that I'd normally just sigh at. Case in point, today's intro and the "sometimes with my penis" line, I watched the video twice and laughed just as hard both times :D

carnex:

sindremaster:

balberoy:

This is the wrong prespective.
If the developer doesn't produce the games we want (what the apparently don't do anymore)
and it's the publishers mistake, those developers will search a new publisher.

But you still buy games and so nothing will change.

For me noone who still buys from EA, Activision and Ubisoft is a Gamer.
Sry, those "customers" pay for destroying our loved hobby.

But they do produce the games I want, I just hate the publishers for different reasons.
I love Bioware games, but I hate what EA does with DLC.
I love Assassin's Creed, but I hate Ubisoft's DRM.
Bioware is owned by EA and Ubisoft makes AC, which means they can't find a new publisher. I love their games and want to support the devs so I buy their games.

In other words, you want things to change but you are not willing to make even the slightest sacrifice. Sorry, but that is just lousy thing to do and will not work.

I want million dollars but I will not move mu ass from the chair is not how things work.

No I want thing to change, but I'm not willing to sacrifice a good developer to do it.

Congratulations on another successful episode, Jim. Too bad all anyone in the forum seems to be taking away is "Because he said something about the Chick-Fil-A/gay marriage thing this is now a Chick-Fil-A/gay marriage thread."

Just out of curiosity, how soon can we expect an episode on loving the games whilst hating the fanboys who support them?

Well said Jim, well said. Just this weekend I found a thread on one of my favorite forums where a guy was asking why people complain so much about things like Bethesda's crappy game engine and on-disc DLC, and stating that we should just shut up and get back to enjoying games like we used to. I was dumbfounded that anyone could think that not liking crappy business practices means I don't enjoy playing the games. Why people can't process this massively simple separation of the games themselves and the business practices surrounding the games is beyond me.

That said, I don't buy games from some companies anymore because they've gone too far for my tastes. EA, Capcom, THQ, screw you guys. There are plenty of other companies out there making games who treat their customers with respect (or at least fuck them up the ass far less violently; don't think I like you using online passes even I buy your games, Sony*), and their games are just as fun. My money and free time are limited, so I'm going to give both to those better companies and leave EA, THQ, and Capcom's games rotting on the shelf. I'm never going to be able to play every game that gets made anyway, so I might as well skip the ones by companies looking to screw me over.

*Oh shit, said something bad about Sony. Guess that means I hate them, but am I a Microsoft fanboy or a Nintendo fanboy? I'll let the idiots decide that one while I play with the brand new PSP I bought last week.

Hatchet90:
How dare Chick-Fil-A support the idea that traditional marriage should be between a man and a woman, truly they are bigots of the highest order *sarcasm.

You're probably sick of hearing this by now, but too bad! You said something incredibly dumb and deserve every single message you get calling you out on it.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bigot
big·ot
noun \ˈbi-gət\
Definition of BIGOT
: a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

Chick-Fil-A ARE bigots of the highest order. And fuck "traditional marriage" anyway. You know what traditional marriage really should be? Two people who really love each other getting married and STAYING TOGETHER. Not getting married after a few months of dating and getting a divorce another few months later after they've been cheating on each other like so many marriages these days are. If you want to complain about "traditional marriage" being ruined, go complain to all those straight couples who keep raising the divorce rate because they never should have gotten married in the first place.

girzwald:

Blade_125:

Hatchet90:
How dare Chick-Fil-A support the idea that traditional marriage should be between a man and a woman, truly they are bigots of the highest order *sarcasm.

They are against homosexual couples being allowed to benefit from the advantages of being married. Eg spousal medical benefits, insurance, etc.

Bigot : a person who is intolerant of any ideas other than his or her own

Sounds pretty accurate.

That's may be the definition of bigot. But sorry, just because you don't approve of gay marriage does not mean you are a bigot. Do tell me how believing in something means you are automatically INTOLERANT of the opposite. Maybe what you need is to learn what TOLERANCE means.

Tolerance: a fair, objective, and permissive attitude toward those whose opinions, practices, race, religion, nationality, etc., differ from one's own; freedom from bigotry.

I hate rap. Hate, hate, hate it. Think its crap that all sounds the same and I wish it didn't exist But guess what. Still tolerant of it. I let it exist because it has a right to. But that doesn't mean I have to like it.

But its ironic, the chicken guy has a view, and a belief, but you seem to be rather intolerant of it. That make you a bigot as well?

The founder actively funds campaigning against gay marrage. That is a little more than disliking it.

The real issue is that he is actively trying to prevent something that benefits others and doesn't hurt him, or anyone else. This is not tolerance. How can someone else getting married diminish the meaning of marrage? You might as well prohibit Rap from being allowed to be awarded at the grammies since it would dimish the meaning of music, based on your taste of the genre. (although I think the grammies themselves diminish the value of music, but that's another conversation).

Anyway I don't want to derail this thread so I don't plan to reply anymore, but you can feel free to PM me if you have anything else to point out.

See Jim. This is what happens when you add a little tidbit comment that is completly unrelated. How am I suppose to stop myself from responding :)

girzwald:
That's may be the definition of bigot. But sorry, just because you don't approve of gay marriage does not mean you are a bigot. Do tell me how believing in something means you are automatically INTOLERANT of the opposite. Maybe what you need is to learn what TOLERANCE means.

Tolerance: a fair, objective, and permissive attitude toward those whose opinions, practices, race, religion, nationality, etc., differ from one's own; freedom from bigotry.

I hate rap. Hate, hate, hate it. Think its crap that all sounds the same and I wish it didn't exist But guess what. Still tolerant of it. I let it exist because it has a right to. But that doesn't mean I have to like it.

But its ironic, the chicken guy has a view, and a belief, but you seem to be rather intolerant of it. That make you a bigot as well?

If you wish it didn't exist, guess what. That means you AREN'T tolerant of it. Wishing that something you dislike would stop existing isn't fair, objective, or permissive at all. You're saying "I don't like that thing, I wish it didn't exist. Fuck everyone who does like it because I do not like it and I am the only one that matters."

That's about as far from tolerating rap as you can get. :/

I don't think I wanted to see Jim fucking a Sonic plush. It was another good episode Jim and hopefully you can get the taste of hating gay people out of your mouth. Speaking of this episode, I love Legend of Zelda but I hated the DS games. I also hate how Wind Waker, Majora's Mask, Twilight Princess and, Skyward Sword take forever to 'begin'. Ocarina of Time threw you into the first dungeon within 15 minutes. You're not even properly dressed in that space of time for the others I listed above.

mjc0961:

The founder actively funds campaigning against gay marrage. That is a little more than disliking it.

The real issue is that he is actively trying to prevent something that benefits others and doesn't hurt him, or anyone else. This is not tolerance. How can someone else getting married diminish the meaning of marrage? You might as well prohibit Rap from being allowed to be awarded at the grammies since it would dimish the meaning of music, based on your taste of the genre. (although I think the grammies themselves diminish the value of music, but that's another conversation).

Anyway I don't want to derail this thread so I don't plan to reply anymore, but you can feel free to PM me if you have anything else to point out.

See Jim. This is what happens when you add a little tidbit comment that is completly unrelated. How am I suppose to stop myself from responding :)

First of, if you actively support your point of view, and gay marriage is strictly point of view issue, you are not bigot, you are activist.

If you look at the marriage in naturalistic terms, gay marriage is out of the question. If you look at the marriage at today's social values, that, why not. Marriage is a farce anyway.

Problem is, that for me, and throughout most of history, marriage was never about some undying love of some other romantic story, but about family. A safe environment for raising children between two people who can live together for most of their lives. It failed quite often mind you, but we are people, piles of meat with severely flawed control protocol. In that light homosexual marriage is highly problematic even if people have no problem with homosexuals themselves (like me).

To be bigot you have no rational reason to fight against something and do it out of hatred, ignorance or feeling of superiority.

Then, because I believe marriage has a certain purpose which homosexual marriage can not fulfill I am idiot, bigot or whatever label you want to stick on me? I'm afraid you have problem with people's opinions, not me.

mjc0961:
If you wish it didn't exist, guess what. That means you AREN'T tolerant of it. Wishing that something you dislike would stop existing isn't fair, objective, or permissive at all. You're saying "I don't like that thing, I wish it didn't exist. Fuck everyone who does like it because I do not like it and I am the only one that matters."

That's about as far from tolerating rap as you can get. :/

Wishing something, or someone doesn't exist doesn't mean you are intolerant. We all wish someone dead or something gone from this world. We are human beings, that's what we do. Wishing something and doing something is not the same.

I wish some music genres gone. And I know most of them will be gone in a while. Time does not tolerate bad stuff, for the most part. Am I a bad person because of that? I liked rap because of what it was, I hate what it's now and I wish today's rap was gone and I am against homosexual marriage. There, label me as you like, but consider for a second my point of view before you spit into the wind.

mjc0961:

girzwald:
That's may be the definition of bigot. But sorry, just because you don't approve of gay marriage does not mean you are a bigot. Do tell me how believing in something means you are automatically INTOLERANT of the opposite. Maybe what you need is to learn what TOLERANCE means.

Tolerance: a fair, objective, and permissive attitude toward those whose opinions, practices, race, religion, nationality, etc., differ from one's own; freedom from bigotry.

I hate rap. Hate, hate, hate it. Think its crap that all sounds the same and I wish it didn't exist But guess what. Still tolerant of it. I let it exist because it has a right to. But that doesn't mean I have to like it.

But its ironic, the chicken guy has a view, and a belief, but you seem to be rather intolerant of it. That make you a bigot as well?

If you wish it didn't exist, guess what. That means you AREN'T tolerant of it. Wishing that something you dislike would stop existing isn't fair, objective, or permissive at all. You're saying "I don't like that thing, I wish it didn't exist. Fuck everyone who does like it because I do not like it and I am the only one that matters."

That's about as far from tolerating rap as you can get. :/

I like how you highlighted and took out of context one part of what I said but obviously ignored "But I let it exist BECAUSE IT HAS A RIGHT TO" Meaning, I recognize that it has a right to exist and I have no right to make it not exist.

Sorry, that's not far from being tolerant. That's quintessential tolerance.

carnex:
Problem is, that for me, and throughout most of history, marriage was never about some undying love of some other romantic story, but about family. A safe environment for raising children between two people who can live together for most of their lives. It failed quite often mind you, but we are people, piles of meat with severely flawed control protocol. In that light homosexual marriage is highly problematic even if people have no problem with homosexuals themselves (like me).

Then, because I believe marriage has a certain purpose which homosexual marriage can not fulfill I am idiot, bigot or whatever label you want to stick on me? I'm afraid you have problem with people's opinions, not me.

Why can't gay people raise children? With adoption and in the future perhaps even the possibility to have children that are truely the sum of the two partners. Being able to biologically to reproduce shouldn't be a factor.

"cigar chomping"

Who chomps cigars....?

...You said Konami was horrible, now I have to declare some war because Metal Gear Solid is the best thing *ever.*

Joking, but Konami isn't pure horrible evil or something.

Edit: Dammit, guys, why did you have to take a video games thread and turn it into a gay marriage thread? >< I think I can sum this up as, "We're all 21st century liberals here, except those who aren't, and neither side will be convinced."

Jim Sterling:
I Hate Videogames (Because I Love Them)

Those who love videogames deeply enough will learn to hate them.

Watch Video

Oh my gosh Jim~ you're the best.

Loving Dead Space as much as I do, and yet hating how EA does it's business selling the game, it's DLC, and how crappy the multiplayer is overall (well, it is fun but really needs improvement). You're something, really something and I thank you for making this video. I highly can't believe you're able to make me admire your advise so much... but yeah thank you man. Truly. Wish everyone criticized civilly so we get the games we want improved.

I agree with almost everything said here, just one minor nagging issue: Just what is the 'problem' with the PS3/PSP's XMB? I think it's remarkably easy to follow and sorts everything how would sort them.

I don't understand the hatred behind Day one DLC, or even DLC in general. I've never seen DLC that was inherently necessary to something the game had to offer, so my opinion's always been, if you hate spending the money on it, don't buy it.

Before you bring up the analogy of "It's like if movies charged extra to see certain scenes", bear in mind they already do (extended edition dvds). Yet, movie fanatics aren't going, "Oh my god, this is an outrage, they're charging us more money to include scenes they already made." Because, and this is important, if the extra money is an issue, they don't spend it. They buy the regular version or whatever.

Jimothy Sterling:

Hatchet90:
How dare Chick-Fil-A support the idea that traditional marriage should be between a man and a woman, truly they are bigots of the highest order *sarcasm.

Who said that? I certainly didn't. I said their chicken tastes like hating gay people, and that the hating of gay people smells like fucking shit.

I stand by that claim. It has been lab-tested.

I just started watching Jim's videos retro actively because of this episode being recommended to me......and I think that he might be my Soul Caliber mate. Great ideas that few are willing to discuss with the people supporting this industry.

Goddamn, imagine how much better the game industry would be if everyone just listened to Jim.

Fucking Retro Goggles. Always raping your eyes with their large pixels and limited color palette.

Anyway - why is there a need to make a video, on a website that routinely criticizes video games, saying that video games are allowed to be criticized? That's obvious to anyone who isn't a complete moron. And why should we care about what complete morons think in the first place? Shouldn't we just ignore them and move on to more intelligent discussion?

This is kind of like if a flat-Earth proponent walked into a meeting of astrophysicists and the astrophysicists bothered to dignify the flat-Earth argument with a response other than simply calling for security to have the nutcase ejected.

balberoy:

carnex:
....

That means, as long as you buy games, they will continue to do what they do because they would lose money doing otherwise.

Sry Jim he is right.

Stop buying games is the only way to stop EA, Activision and Ubisoft.

Ubisoft even hacks into your browser, evidently.
Stop supporting those companies, do not buy their games.

Thats the only way to beat them,
if you Jim really love video games,
say that people shall stop buying them.

There just is no other way.

with regards

Yep Ubisoft hacks into you browser. They install a little UPlay plugin without you consent that thankfully isn't compatible with the latest firefox beta otherwise I would never have known it.

Stop buying games, even if they are good, when companies perform such horrible practices. They are literally spying on you without any notification or legal grounds, they simply just don't tell you. This isn't America I should not have to stand for that.

It's the same for me with comic books. I love them, which is WHY I criticize and call out the crap. We have a medium for telling great stories, yet we get bogged down in overblown events, stories that erase decades of continuity, the exploitation of great creators, and seeming to need to reboot their entire line every ten years or so. I roll my eyes at the fanservice and grumble at the fact that most comics are produced with an opposite political idealogy to my own. Yet for all this, I'm with Jim here. It's a medium I love, and that only makes the need to point out its shortcomings all the greater.

As always, I thank God for Jim Sterling.

Don't buy new, bypass any and all DRM= not buying them at all.

I hate most new games like I hate most new music, canned, cloned unimaginative crap I loath.

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