Jimquisition: Why the Wii U May Have Already "Won" Next-gen

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Dear Mr. Sterling,

The escapist updates its site with new content around lunch time everyday (if on the US east coast or on EST/EDT). This means the first people to see your videos in this region are likely to be eating while watching. Now as entertaining as your videos are, seeing zoomed in pictures of piles of fecal matter is not conducive to keeping down lunch.

I'm in no way asking or suggesting you censor anything. Only asking that in the future instead of using a picture of fecal matter consider using an alternative such as: a photoshoped picture of a cow standing in a pie a crust, a picture of a toilet or a zoomed out picture of a landfill. Trust your viewers to get the meaning without showing us something that induces gagging.

Thanks for your time.

Good episode.
I have yet to stumble into a next gen argumentation but this is a nice point.
I hope success for Nintendo, not that I wish PS or Xbox do bad either, I've just always had a Nintendo.

Lex Darko:
Dear Mr. Sterling,

The escapist updates its site with new content around lunch time everyday (if on the US east coast or on EST/EDT). This means the first people to see your videos in this region are likely to be eating while watching. Now as entertaining as your videos are, seeing zoomed in pictures of piles of fecal matter is not conducive to keeping down lunch.

I'm in no way asking or suggesting you censor anything. Only asking that in the future instead of using a picture of fecal matter consider using an alternative such as: a photoshoped picture of a cow standing in a pie a crust, a picture of a toilet or a zoomed out picture of a landfill. Trust your viewers to get the meaning without showing us something that induces gagging.

Thanks for your time.

I would like to sign this petition.

I have some distasteful memories involving me eating curd and unsuspectingly opening a video with Jim dressed in drag.

I'm hardly pressed to yet see one good reason to buy a WiiU, but don't get me wrong, lately there have been lots of interesting news about the console itself, but I'll wait for a year or two after it gets released to decide if it's for me or not.

Also, crazy high prices in my country.

I'm not buying a Wii-U this year; I want to see if Nintendo can pull through with the promise of being a better partner in getting third-party games on the shelves, and using the tablet controller in ways that aren't just gimmicky or (worse) intrusive. And I've said as much elsewhere.

But what I haven't said as much is that the Wii-U is thus far the only console of the next generation that I'm giving serious consideration. Sony has been bobbling the Move controller like some kind of drawn-out slapstick comedy routine for more than a year, now, and Microsoft's Kinect, while it has its points, also requires a very particular kind of space to be accurate- a space I'm not terribly interested in re-arranging my living room to accommodate. Other than that, what do Microsoft and Sony have to offer?

...Their invasive desire to push into other aspects of our lives, spun as a "feature"... And more computing power.

That's not really an argument "for"; it's more of a bad joke.

I'm the local prophet of doom as far as the computing power thing goes. Short version: more power= greater costs to develop games that leverage that power= more risk, more risk aversion, more company consolidation and studio collapses. On the same line, the Wii-U, with allegedly only (only!?) twice the power of the XBox 360, may well hit a sweet spot that looks one hell of a lot more attractive to devs vs. trying to spend more developing for a console with a higher price point and less market penetration.

I think there's a good chance that the future will see people paying an extra $200 or more for a console that gives them fewer, more expensive games. Oh, and the somewhat specious notion that they're far more "hardcore" than all the widdle babies with their Wii-Us.

Said widdle babies will roll their eyes and go back to playing Bayonetta 2.

Jim expressed my views on the Bayonetta debacle more eloquently than I ever could.

Also: LALALALALALALALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU! THE WII WAS A CONSOLE FOR STUPID CASUALS AND OLD PEOPLE! WIIU IS MORE OF THE SAME!!! PEOPLE WHO DEFEND THE WIIU ARE BAD AND THEY SHOULD FEEL BAD! NINTENDO IS A STUPID COMPANY FOR STUPID CASUAL PEOPLE! THE WII WAS A STUPID GIMMICK AND THE WIIU IS A STUPID GIMMICK! LALALALALALA!!!!>>>:(((((

This seems to be the mindset for most "h4rdc0r3 g4mrzzzz" when they hear of the WiiU. It's rather annoying. Sure it doesn't have the best launch titles, but we should give it a little bit of time because I've never seen a console who's launch line-up consists solely of truly groundbreaking games. Seriously, Why do so many "hardcore" gamers Poupon Nintendo?

What about the new Steam thing! WHAT ABOUT THE NEW STEAM THING, JIM?!

Nintendo is and always has been (since the mid 70's anyway) all about the games, and it's nice to see them stick to their guns and keep their focus on games, even though they're also dabbling in a bit of other media. For that, I applaud them.

The innovation of playing a console game without having to hog the TV... that may be the key innovation that wins them this generation. I mean, there were already ways to hook something like that up, but to do it effortlessly, with the click of a menu item, on a feature that's already built in and advertised for? Most of us geeks have no idea how much difference that makes to the average market.

Now, what we need to do is convince third partiers to port over their 360/PS3 exclusives from last-gen over to the Wii-U. There are probably some bureaucratic obstacles, but it makes a great deal of business sense, getting some extra cash from a slice of the market that missed them last time around.

Of course, that makes me wonder what the next gen after this coming one will be like. MB and others have predicted that the console wars as we know them will end entirely after the Wii U/PS4/Xbox 720 have run their course. Because by then, smart-TVs and phones will have grown capable of playing any form of media including triple-A games, and third-party developers will start porting their games to those as well and draining the market share of consoles, so Sony and Microsoft and even Nintendo won't be able to justify a ninth gen of proprietary gaming hardware to their accountants.

Nintendo will probably drop out of hardware and become software-only, at which they'll do great thanks to the Mario/Zelda/you-know-the-list/&c. lineup. Sony and Microsoft will probably stick to making TVs, or they might drop out as well and leave the ninth gen with precisely two competing platforms: The Apple platform, and the bunch-of-other-companies-collated-under-the-flag-of-Google platform.

Jeremy Monken:
Smart TVs still aren't very close to providing a real hardcore gaming experience. They will, at most, have minigamey little app type games along the lines of Angry Birds or all the cheeseball Kinect games. That's the kind of gameplay the WiiU is likely to offer with a lot of its titles.

So how can the WiiU "win" when it's competing with the Smart TVs while the next entries from MS and Sony will be the hardcore traditional consoles we've come to know and love?

WiiU is trying to take on tablets, consoles and smart TVs all at once while doing nothing to appeal to someone that wants all three. Not to mention the buyers remorse it has to overcome with millions of dusty Wiis out there.

I'm betting on Microsoft in this round.

Lot of great points. This video was the first time in memory that someone pointed out the danger smart TV poses to consoles and I'm down with that. If the TV gives you access to something like Onlive, real trouble could be brewing.

The video was good in pointing out that Nintendo, bless them, is trying. That's interesting but.. you nailed my feelings on your next to last paragraph. I had a chance to pre-order a Wii U and didn't for exactly the reason you state: buyer's remorse as my Wii gathers dust. It's had its purposes (I brought it to a company party and people bowled) but, what a disappointment for the original gamer. Give me a proper controller any day!

Who cares about all this superfluous bullshit? Consoles live and die by software, not by what other services they provide. Nintendo can't provide the experience I want out of a console, and I won't be buying from them.

Wait, what? Jim has a wife? When do we get the pleasure of seeing Mrs. Sterling in a show?

My thoughts. The real issue is AAA is becoming unwieldy... sorry IS unwieldy. There are only three or four franchises that can claim the AAA money needed to turn profit and break even. Now those names HAVE shifted- in the last year, even- but its always a crap shoot. Its not so much, as investors may have wanted, games are expanding so much as the top performers are performing at new heights.

Now comes the threat of cheaper consoles eating up the real electronic winners in terms of profitability (the casual games and apps and so on) whether its the Ouya, Steambox, SmartTv, cheap PC with TV HD hook up, Roku, what have you. So where does that leave those at the edge? Funny thing is if they doubled all the stats on their current consoles the Video game consoles would still be lagging like cripples behind middle PC gaming rigs. Competing with them is just a losing game, if the PS3 is to be a lesson,. It won every battle it set out for itself and still managed to lose the war. It helped set the new next media standard but afterwards streaming took up and most are sticking with DVDs as they still consider them new and affordable. Most couldn't master programming for the Cell or the cost of putting out the level of polish and game was too much for scaling down or intricately advancing. And so in practice and then in theory the PS3 was outclassed by cheaper PCs people already had they were price competing with. That or due to similarity and third party and other factors the PS3 and 360 pretty much ended up resembling each other too much with only minor key differences (free online service or paid with lots of features and updates and matchmaking and etc)

The WiiU is Nintendo going sideways yet again. Its decent but its more features with an eye to the gamer who's an adult with kids if not the whole family, but not leaving behind the family. More importantly there is the issue of price. People are balking at the WiiU's price and then comparing its value/features, what's the PS4 or Nextbox going to cost and what can it offer to compete and what will those features cost? Sony can't afford the PS3 to be less than 200 dollars still. MS is experimenting with subsidized payment plans ala the cellphone. Even if they are the same price as the WiiU they'll have to be more powerful and offer significantly improved experiences because of it at launch. The PS3 has some AWESOME game experiences... but it took I'd say two to three years for it to really be anything but shiny PS2 and it still hasn't met its potential but its still outmoded in the ebusiness as a blurayer and online service provider and gaming device.

Now to be fair the real cool thing is Nintendo has left themselves a lot of room here. What happens say in a year they put out a SKU that has no gamepad and can slash their price and then sell the gamepad seperately. What if they can in three or four years put out a new upgraded box but let you keep the rest of your rig/gamepade and its more comparable to the PS4 of Nextbox?

The main thing is that for likely less, if not similar cash, as new console the hardcore gamer seems to have their heart set on the economic market of Steam and the App store with their computers that will already be guaranteed to be more powerful than the Ps4 and Nextbox or at least more economical. Sony tried the highest end emachine, it backfired on them in numerous ways. MS is more a service and entertainment hub provider Why bother with the highest end of tech?

I guess I'm seeing the WiiU as doing good with first to the next gen market. And MS and Sony in a weird place of at best eclipsing Nintendo but not putting out a higher end product. Not pushing the limit, so much as further raising the ceiling as Nintendo is doing. Depending on how the third party relations work that might not be much of a change as Warren Spector noted. Its time for developers to develop for the most popular console and then scale up than for their private supercomputers and only go down as far as they dare let their vision be compromised.

- Consoles are slowly evolving into PCs

- PCs will always be more convenient to do multitasking than consoles

- Sony will go for 5K as it's differentiating feature, which will fail because it's too far advanced to be of practical use

- In the end it will come down to console exclusives, which Nintendo has always done better then both Microsoft and Sony put together

- Wii U has a 1 year head start, which proved to be quite an advantage for the Xbox 360

- Nintendo will finally get online multiplayer right, which will be huge since it has so many potentially amazing first party multiplayer games

- Microsoft has next to no big first party games anymore and has proved it by announcing a whole new Halo trilogy and another GOW

- Xbox Live still costs $60 a year and now there are 3 free alternatives

- Sony has retired most of it's series' and they now literally have 1 big exclusive coming up

Nintendo will win. They have the advantage and the right mindset. You can see with the recently announced exclusivity of Bayonetta 2 on Wii U that they're going for exclusive content, which at this point is the only thing that matters in the console wars anymore.

I think the Wii U is the console actually putting in effort to be different than the one before it. With the stats we know of the PS4 and the nextbox, we can pretty much agree that those are just the PS2.75 and the Xbawcks1.3

While I see Jim's point, I think the wolf he's crying isn't as bad as we think. Sony & Microsoft have a strong line of IP's that will keep the next gen nicely justified in the living room. I agree that the whole "entertainment hub" side of consoles are under threat from smart TV's that integrate such apps in there; but, realistically, I wonder exactly how much of an overall threat that poses to next gen's viability.

BWAHAHAHA, I've been saying, "Wait for it... the WiiU may yet win next gen" for MONTHS now. They all said I was crazy, yes they did, crazy, yes, but now I have Jim Thank-God-For-Him Sterling on my side.

Validation... it smells like napalm in the morning.

kuolonen:

Lex Darko:
Dear Mr. Sterling,

The escapist updates its site with new content around lunch time everyday (if on the US east coast or on EST/EDT). This means the first people to see your videos in this region are likely to be eating while watching. Now as entertaining as your videos are, seeing zoomed in pictures of piles of fecal matter is not conducive to keeping down lunch.

I'm in no way asking or suggesting you censor anything. Only asking that in the future instead of using a picture of fecal matter consider using an alternative such as: a photoshoped picture of a cow standing in a pie a crust, a picture of a toilet or a zoomed out picture of a landfill. Trust your viewers to get the meaning without showing us something that induces gagging.

Thanks for your time.

I would like to sign this petition.

I have some distasteful memories involving me eating curd and unsuspectingly opening a video with Jim dressed in drag.

Um, am I the only one remember the gay erotica? After that, I'm not sure Jim can do anything that will make my stomach turn. I'm told that The Escapist video age-gate system was specifically built for that video.

I just watched this video (fecal matter and all), and now I'm off to make some lunch.

gardian06:

See the thing is it has been said [By who?] that about 40% of people buying an XBox360 do so for XBLA,[citation needed] [clarification needed] and then later realize "I have this system, and I can buy game disks for it",

Yeah, could you address those above issues?

and if they can get the same, or similar experience on just their tv that means that Microsoft loses 40% of current market share,

Assuming people are quick to shift away. Of course, with so much content already tied to Microsoft, that's not likely to be the case. Hooray specious reasoning.

Microsoft, or Sony back away from the thing that gives them more profit then the selling of their consoles, and with more consistency.

If almost half of their base comes from people they sold on other things, it's hard to say that they're backing away from the thing that gives them more profit. Especially since that's direct money, and especially since they were getting that money directly.

Again, assuming your own number is true.

"ergh nurgh nurgh neerrgh neeeurgh!", Jim Sterling

I can respect that.

Jimothy Sterling:
snip

Incidentally, I'm surprised you haven't jumped on the premium user custom title thing to declare yourself God's Present to Gaming, or Nathan Drake's Waifu or something.

Glad to have met you too Jimmy my boy.

So how was the drink during the shindig? I never thought I would share a cheers with Jim Sterling.

P.S. Oh God, my sides.

Interesting argument, Jim. Ultimately I juts want to see lots of good games for the console.

Dammit, stupid living in Europe, do an expo over here dammit.

Anyway, yeah I think the WiiU is probably realistically the best console. I'm a console gamer, I have a PS3, a 360 and a Wii, and a pc that has a shit graphics card so I need to get on that. But Consoles are becoming more and more PC-esque with each generation. Only no0t able to do as much. They need to cut the crap and just make consoles straight up gaming machines and then charge less for it. I don't want to pay like 500 quid for a machine that plays blu ray, has a browser or whatever else. My PC and my tablet do all of that better. Hell next gen I'll probably just upgrade my PC and buy a WiiU. Maybe wait a few years and buy a console for any exclusives I missed.

I like what Nintendo is trying to do with the Wii U, but I don't think it's going to be as focused for gamers as we'd like to think. Many of the hardcore scene do prefer to have a controller, but a good many I know of don't seem to be very fond of touch screens. Especially touch screens that are required to play the game. That being said, I'm all for it. I play on my android like crazy, and I've been playing my DS for years. I recall being skeptical of being able to enjoy Metroid Prime: Hunters, but was pleasantly surprised at how natural the controls became after about 10 minutes of play.

It's a mixed field, but I expect the same, if not more success that the Wii had. While motion controls and touchscreens are nice, we all know that buttons respond much better, and they are what have been the deal breaker for many potential Wii customers in my opinion.

Was that the telebugs cartoon? Wow. :-) Im old fashioned, i want a phone to be a phone, a console to be a console and a tv to be a tv. I game on my console, i have a dvd player for dvds and a pc for everything else.

The WiiU will suck cos the only games worth buying are Mario, Zelda, Pokemon and Metroid. Only games people buying a Ninty console give a shit about. Everything else is crappy time killer stuff.

Obligatory; You may think Erick Erickson is almost as much of a bigoted homophobe as I, nevertheless I think even the most hardened atheist (*cough* Jim Sterling *cough*) will agree with him on this point:

It has become so cheap to mass produce so much electronic, plastic crap that no thought seems to go into the actual function of the device beyond loading it up with every damn option imaginable. Advertising all the bells and whistles on the device may make for a plethora of advertising options, but it makes actual use of the device crap.

And here's the thing, (this also applies to non-android phones in general but Windows Phone/Windows RT in particular; proud owner of a Nokia 900 btw) remember your computer from the late 90's? With a fresh instal of NT4 or 98se and a midrange voodoo or ati Rage, remember how responsive it could be? How much you could do with it? The TV you currently own in all likelyhood has a builtin ARM SOC computer about as powerful, and it certainly has more memory and much more memory bandwidth if it does have a full-fledged SOC, but it is needlessly locked down.

I was thinking Nintendo might "win" the next generation because there might not be a next generation. Neither Sony nor Microsoft have even announced new systems yet, the economy is still fairly crummy, and hardware is still pretty expensive. I could see it being another 2 or 3 years until we get new systems. I imagine WiiU's biggest competitor is not going to be Sony or MS, but rather, the Ouya. It has similar hardware, Android OS already has more games, and it's less than half the price. Sell a tablet with that (not out of the question at some point) and a WiiU could be hard sell compared to it.

Oh i forgot..Bayonetta sucked. The game was a piece of shit. It was rubbish and will never be missed. :-)

Jimothy Sterling:
Why the Wii U May Have Already "Won" Next-gen

Reactions to the Wii U among hardcore gamers have been mixed at best, downright cynical at worst.

Watch Video

Love the fresh perspective! its the good,bad and ugly wrapped up in a nice package, and its something to put in the back of the mind going forward. Nintendo has survived this long for a reason and I feel that sometimes not fallowing the band wagon might just prove to be the difference between fallowing the rest of the lemmings off the cliff and ending up where you want to go. Thanks again and keep up the good work.

zelda2fanboy:
I was thinking Nintendo might "win" the next generation because there might not be a next generation. Neither Sony nor Microsoft have even announced new systems yet, the economy is still fairly crummy, and hardware is still pretty expensive. I could see it being another 2 or 3 years until we get new systems. I imagine WiiU's biggest competitor is not going to be Sony or MS, but rather, the Ouya. It has similar hardware, Android OS already has more games, and it's less than half the price. Sell a tablet with that (not out of the question at some point) and a WiiU could be hard sell compared to it.

You sure? The WiiU has specs comparable to the X360 while my old, old gaming laptop defeats the Ouya.

OT- I'll wait and see as I'm going PC next gen and I haven't seen the video yet. Come on Escapist, just let us see the videos on iPhones already!

Rather accurate depiction of the people complaining about Bayonetta 2, I must say. Like I said in another forum (albeit mostly about the Pokémon fandom) this is why the video game communities need an enema to get rid of those who are making the rest of us look bad.

As for the WiiU...definite props for picking up on that point, Jim. I remember back when MovieBob talked about how new forms of what could be considered a PC changed the way we look at PC gaming. SmartTVs are definitely going to change the gaming market for the very reasons you mentioned as well as for the points MovieBob said as well.

Still waiting for occular implant gaming, though...

Well the solution is obvious then, isn't it? The next Xbox/Play Station(s) need to be tvs, that can play video games.

Urh:
Holy shit, that spaz-out at the end was funnier than the one he did in the Operation Rainfall ep. I would've had no problem with Jim doing that for a full 5 minutes.....does that make me a horrible person?

If it's wrong I don't wanna be right LOL. God I sure hope Jim's wrong. Let me ask you this jimmie? How many people have smart tvs?

Christ I'm pretty happy with a hdtv. I don't even know what un Godly some a smart tv goes for. I have a computer. I have an I phone. I go watch tv to get the fuck away from my computer LOL.

Still brilliant as always.

zelda2fanboy:
I imagine WiiU's biggest competitor is not going to be Sony or MS, but rather, the Ouya. It has similar hardware... and it's less than half the price.

A system with a decently clocked 128bit wide GDDR3 backing its SM4.0+ gpu will easiy outclass any system with a 64bit wide low voltage mDDR2, and the WiiU could be sporting a GDDR5 bus, or even an XDR2 bus.

I'm actually slightly excited about the WiiU, but I'm sticking to my PS3 until I hear of a Metroid game coming out for the WiiU...that's when I save the money to hop on the bandwagon. The system does seem kind of awesome though...and anyone complaining about Nintendo suddenly getting rights to less casual games...you're an idiot...sorry but you are! I bet you're the same people crying out because the Wii was too casual...though that's just my assumption and opinion

And I couldn't find a video of it without posting the entire hour of love, but for those who saw that panel, the ending made me think of Jim and his depiction of drinking animations...cause it just seemed so natural.

Jimothy Sterling:

DVS BSTrD:
I could have guessed Jim would think much of the outrage over Bayonetta 2, but I didn't think he'd condim ent so strongly.

I ... oh God ... oh fucking God.

You know shit just got real when Jim Fucking Sterling himself is lost for words.

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