The Big Picture: Skin Deeper

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Batsamaritan:

The Gentleman:
I'm surprised you didn't bring up the Mandarin when you were talking about "yellowface" racial acting. Hell, just us responding to that article had an interesting conversation on how to adapt the character to the modern hair-trigger racial response...

Ben kingsly is asian BTW, just a bit further west than china is all (india)

While I was referring to the Mandarin character in general, this actually pisses me off a lot more than it should. "Asian" is a really troubling concept for me, mainly because it merges several distinct cultures that each maintain a single identity but historically exchanged key cultural elements (such a Buddhism) while maintaining their separate identities. Hell, what is commonly referred to as "the Chinese" is actually an amalgamation of several ethnic groups that were unified every few centuries under an emperor. Hell, ever noticed that the northern half of the continent is Russia?

But the thing that really infuriates me is the idea that Indian is close enough to Chinese that they can be effectively swapped. It's not. Minus a small handful of similarities (hey, there's Buddhism again), they are very, very different cultures and people. Even their traditional ideas of time itself are starkly different from each other. The traditional Chinese take was that was more objective and could be cataloged, which was the reason behind a surprisingly accurate and complex bureaucracy and historical record system, where as the traditional Hindu concept of time was more fluid and that humans had been living the same cycles of life and death meant specific moments in time were less important than the people travelling through it (truthfully, it's been a while, so some of the specifics may be inaccurate, but the macro points are there). And this is one of the elements that distinguishes the two cultures. Nor does this get into the modern history of the last 200 years and how the west had drastically different approaches to the two cultures.

Wow... that was probably more of a rage post than I anticipated. My point is not to say that Ben Kingsly is a bad actor or pick because he's of Indian heritage, as he's probably one of the best actors in the modern era, but rather the idea that "hey they're both Asian; who's going to notice?" is okay...

I don't really see how this is a issue if anything this movie proves that ethnicity really is not a thing as much anymore. Now directors can hire the best actor for the part and if need be use some makeup to change there race if it is even relevant. Now we can have actors who are just best for the part.

Yet again Bob applies double standards by claiming that its okay for non-whites to play white roles but that it's immoral for whites to play non-white roles. You can't have true equality while blatantly discriminating against one group of people, you have to treat them all equally.

Bob also shows his arrogance and close mindedness by saying that anyone who doesn't agree with him is an idiot. No Bob if people aren't convinced by your argument then it's your fault for not having a better argument, not their fault for not agreeing with you. Get off your high horse.

Finally making an exception because you liked a movie where whites played non-white roles is just hypocrisy. Either it's acceptable for whites to play non-white roles or its not; you can't introduce a cop out by saying that it's unacceptable unless you like the movie for whatever reason.

brazuca:
So to americans latinos are not white?

It depends. For census/demographic purposes, there are actually two separate categories for white and non-white (and sometimes you see things like "non-hispanic black" too, depending on what you're looking at). A lot of Puerto Ricans have mostly Spanish ancestry which makes them largely white/European, for example, while there are other groups in Central/South America that mixed much more extensively with the existing cultures and have much less European ancestry proportionally, in some cases relatively little. And then you have other people, like many Dominicans or some groups in Brazil, who have substantial African ancestry. Basically it varies a lot and it's too complicated to say that they, as a group, are or are not any one thing, but yes, many of them are not considered to be (and don't consider themselves to be) white.

brazuca:
French, italians, polish, spanish and portuguese are all not white.

My initial response to this was, "wat." I'm not even sure what it has to do with previous sentence unless wherever you're from considers "latino" to mean what we (rarely) use something like "Latin peoples" to describe, which is something very different (and also has nothing at all to do with Poland). In the western hemisphere, latino/hispanic tends to pretty much exclusively refer to people from the Spanish-/Portuguese-speaking countries of the western hemisphere. Europeans are not included in that. And Europeans are white. My parents are from two of those countries (my mom was born and grew up in one of them before coming here), and it would be hard to find someone considered whiter than I am. Heh.

theSteamSupported:
I'm getting what you're trying to say, but one has to ask the question: why was the context ignored in the first place?

Mainly because the issue was primarily raised by people who had no context. They saw Jim Sturgess in Korean make-up in the trailer and reacted without knowing anything about the story. "Never let facts interfere with a good righteous indignation."

I and MANY of the racial complainers have a much more targeted issue with the issue of racebending casting. There are STILL limited dialogue, roles, examples, and just narratives in the current culture outside of some narrow even demeaning ones.

The issue of whitewashing a cast of actual real life diversity is to remove the voice, issues, pressence and contribution that ethnic group and people have given to the culture, the stories they have had and tell, and etc. You keep bringing up Tyler Perry as sorta embarassing but at least he's not just casting the people but putting something on the issue and in a way that isn't quite about telling for the comfort of white people mainstream even if it is for cross media of religious and middle class black and white and so on people with a favoring to women (the dudes are usually handsome and the subject matter romance of drama women are not adverse to) Which is strike one on the anti-woman thing. Some women like it and some hate it. so ya know.. big thing. Just like some black people like it and some black people hate it but its still valid art and production.

I know representation can get a major eye-roll but take all the nerd insecurities and frustrations of dumbing down or cleaning up the message the feel you have to personally be responsible for all the actions within the group as culture and imagine it isn't defined by personal predilections, hobbies, or intellectual direction and affectations. But the ethnic group you are born into.

This is why people should get pissed when a story about asian american college students with math degrees is just too unmarketable lets make them white. How the overwhelmingly Hispanic filled military can get white washed (and is ALways led by an average sized dark haired everyman with his most distinguishing feature likely being southern (where did all those ne, midwestern, etc soldiers go). At the very least taking from the diversity and vigor of life and revitalize and avoid some cliches and stock things.

Now personally as this feels more stagey than most movies I'm giving the race thing a pass and EVERYONE gets to play as different roles in different times along different events I agree. The point is "same character/soul/essence different situation" and using the unique circumstances of acting to convey these things. But I would imagine a discussion is to be had because the idea they couldn't have done this with actors cast alike.. anyways.

I take issue with the 21 stuff. I do remember people complaining that the main character wasn't Asian in the film, but I also recall the person he was based on being a Russian. As such it wasn't a major complaint. Also, some Asian characters remained (although they were secondary characters).

uanime5:
Yet again Bob applies double standards by claiming that its okay for non-whites to play white roles but that it's immoral for whites to play non-white roles. You can't have true equality while blatantly discriminating against one group of people, you have to treat them all equally.

Context is everything. Historically within the movie industry it is a bad thing due to the unsettling history of blackface. In the present it sucks because there are few enough roles for minorities already, taking away more is just silly.

Bob also shows his arrogance and close mindedness by saying that anyone who doesn't agree with him is an idiot. No Bob if people aren't convinced by your argument then it's your fault for not having a better argument, not their fault for not agreeing with you. Get off your high horse.

I don't think he did that at all here. Maybe you should learn to listen.

Finally making an exception because you liked a movie where whites played non-white roles is just hypocrisy. Either it's acceptable for whites to play non-white roles or its not; you can't introduce a cop out by saying that it's unacceptable unless you like the movie for whatever reason.

Only a Sith deals an absolute. ONLY A SITH.

brazuca:
So to americans latinos are not white? French, italians, polish, spanish and portuguese are all not white. Kind remembers me an episode of Family guy.

No, central and south Americans are not White, indigenous people from Europe are White.

theSteamSupported:
I'm getting what you're trying to say, but one has to ask the question: why was the context ignored in the first place?

It's simple the same people who ignored the context and thus are all in an uproar about the film are also the same people who think that this..

image

Is quality entertainment.

Milanezi:

canadamus_prime:
Funny you should choose this particular topic 'cause I was just thinking about how ridiculous all these race issues have gotten. It seems to be that creative people need to walk on eggshells and broken glass for fear of being accused of being racist, sexist, or whatever. Heaven forbid these groups have to endure the same criticism and cultural commentary that everyone else does. And by "everyone" I mean the white heterosexual anglosaxon male because it seems that anyone who doesn't fit that description is some sort of minority and therefore immune to criticism and/or cultural commentary . ¬___¬
And since I, myself, am a white heterosexual male, I'm sure someone's going to accuse me of being racist or sexist or whatever just for pointing that out.

That. THAT. THAT AGAIN. I fear saying my mind sometimes, simply because it could be considered racism (in Brazil you don't have to take a racist ACT to commit the crime, simply stating a racist comment would be enough). But it's funny how, when YOU accuse certain groups of something, or simply state a belief, no matter how stupid and unfounded, then they say it's merely their religion, and we're all human and then you get sued and maybe even arrested. But when it comes to THEIR opinion, they DO see themselves as a better RACE, and whenever some shit falls on them they attack with past traumas, past traumas that were horrible and are now the very basis of their international (shotgun)politics with the rest of the WORLD.

Yeah i'm sick of people playing race cards. It's gotten to the point where people don't even know why they have a race card to play but they play it anyways. I mean, I saw a guy in Edmonton (Canada) claiming he was being thrown out of a bar because of racism. He and the bouncer were the same race. Other people were going "dude, you can't really play that particular card in this Country..." Sigh.

Revnak:
Context is everything. Historically within the movie industry it is a bad thing due to the unsettling history of blackface. In the present it sucks because there are few enough roles for minorities already, taking away more is just silly.

So what. Just because white and black actors blacked up their faces in the past doesn't justify racial discrimination in the present.

Bob also shows his arrogance and close mindedness by saying that anyone who doesn't agree with him is an idiot. No Bob if people aren't convinced by your argument then it's your fault for not having a better argument, not their fault for not agreeing with you. Get off your high horse.

I don't think he did that at all here. Maybe you should learn to listen.

You're the one who needs to listen. Bob clearly stated that in a "perfect world" he wouldn't have to explain to people why he was right and they were wrong. This shows just how arrogant Bob is and how little he thinks of the opinions of others.

I simply can't bring myself to care about this. There are plenty of studios around the world that use actors almost exclusively of the race of that country. If you want to see Asians in movies, there are lots of asian movies, some even getting subed or dubbed releases here. If you want Indians in movies, there's Bolly Wood. It's not the same with those of African descent considering there's no black country currently capable of supporting a large film industry in the same way.

So, cries of Race bending when it comes to Asians just comes off as whiny. There are lots of studios in Asia capable of producing their own 'Last Air Bender' or 'dragon ball' and I wish one of them would do so. For kicks, put a white face guy in there. That way people can start crying about asian films history of prejudice and we can all be united in our offence.

uanime5:

Revnak:
Context is everything. Historically within the movie industry it is a bad thing due to the unsettling history of blackface. In the present it sucks because there are few enough roles for minorities already, taking away more is just silly.

So what. Just because white and black actors blacked up their faces in the past doesn't justify racial discrimination in the present.

Note how I quoted your whole post and argued against all your points. Note how you quoted the easiest parts of my post to deal with and ignored half of my points. Go back and notice the other point I mentioned in that paragraph then get back to me.

Bob also shows his arrogance and close mindedness by saying that anyone who doesn't agree with him is an idiot. No Bob if people aren't convinced by your argument then it's your fault for not having a better argument, not their fault for not agreeing with you. Get off your high horse.

I don't think he did that at all here. Maybe you should learn to listen.

You're the one who needs to listen. Bob clearly stated that in a "perfect world" he wouldn't have to explain to people why he was right and they were wrong. This shows just how arrogant Bob is and how little he thinks of the opinions of others.

Yeah, no insults, no belittling, just noting that in a perfect we wouldn't have these issues, which could be interpreted to say that in a perfect world (one without the current inequalities) it would be the same, or that people would think contextually and already understand why it is an issue. If that is your standard for arrogance you must know some painfully humble people. In fact, I wouldn't call such people humble even. That's a bit too insulting to those who make humility a virtue rather than a character flaw. I'd say such people are spineless.

I didn't like the cross-race makeup, not because of racial sensitivity, but simply because it didn't work and broke immersion. The "same actors in each story" worked in a few cases but when they tried to go too crazy with the cross-race and cross-sex makeup it just became woefully noticeable and didn't add anything. The only one that was believable was Halle Berry, and she's already light-skinned and bi-racial anyway. I think they sacrificed a certain amount of enjoyability and believability in the name of trying to make some kind of ham-fisted racial point. Jim Sturgess didn't look like an Asian and neither did Hugo Weaving (who just looked like Spock). It just looked like they pulled their eye skin back a bit and called it a day. And yeah, they probably could have hired actual, good Asian actors (or just play Sturgess/Weaving as white, as white people existed and were everywhere apparently in Neo Seoul) and it would have added to the story without breaking immersion.

I didn't even know that Cloud Atlas was being attacked for those things? Are you seeing ghosts Bob?

Why the hell should the fictional context of the films narrative trump the real life context of Hollywood's racist casting choices?

Simply put, it doesn't. Cloud Atlas doesn't get a pass on this just because you think it's a good movie, and it doesn't get to pull racist stunt casting just because it ostensibly delivers an anti-racism message. Context counts for a lot, but a film's context isn't just what makes it onto the screen, it includes the industry and society that produced it, and the one hand cannot wash the other.

If a famous actor can play a mentally handicapped person instead of a mentally handicapped person playing themselves I am perfectly fine with that.

As such, I am perfectly fine with black face, white face, whatever face a good actor puts on to play his/her role. Who cares if a minority doesn't get a role because of it? As long as they had the equally denied opportunity that your average white actor had when applying for it.

PunkRex:
I know this is a little off topic but concidering just how badass Idris Elba was in Thor and Rock'n'Rolla im surprised he's not bigger state side... or here in the UK actually. Seriously, I thought he was gonna be the next BIG black actor.

Considering that there are alot of rumors suggesting that they want him as the next Bond, you might well turn out to be right.

Who was complaining about Cloud Atlas? I'm struggling to think of any communities THAT desperate to be offending by something outside of Tumblr. Or maybe Fox News if you're looking at the other end of the spectrum...

Still not on board with the double standard there Bob, even if I sympathize. It's never the correct long term solution to a problem.

(Besides, I'd rather just see some NEW characters and ideas as opposed to constant rebooting and "reimaginings" of older ones.)

My response to all this is: Who the fuck gives a shit?

I mean honestly, why is this an issue? Yeah, I know historical context with black-face and yadda yadda yadda but come on, why are we arguing about this?

"They made a white person have asian/black makeup!" So what? Honestly. SO. FUCKING. WHAT?
Why is this a problem? Yeah, it takes away roles from the minorities, but if the casters want that particular person for that role, why should it matter if the role is black, asian or white? If they wanted >insert minority actor here< for the role instead of Brad Pitt or whoever, why does it matter? And in reverse, why does it matter if they want Brad Pitt? The only argument I´ve seen for why the minorities should get the role(s) is "because they´re minorities."

That shouldn´t give you a special privilege, just like being white shouldn´t give you a special privilige.

To qoute a wise man: "I think not being racist is the new racist."

Only a few months now until it hits the theatres.

Unfortunately, there's a lot more keeping people from liking Cloud Atlas than just the way casting is portrayed. Shame, really, because it's an amazing movie, easily one of the most ambitious I've ever seen, and it handles so much more than just the idea of race. Critical panning and audiences not paying attention are cutting the feet from beneath it, and that's really unfortunate.

Arakasi:
If a famous actor can play a mentally handicapped person instead of a mentally handicapped person playing themselves I am perfectly fine with that.

As such, I am perfectly fine with black face, white face, whatever face a good actor puts on to play his/her role. Who cares if a minority doesn't get a role because of it? As long as they had the equally denied opportunity that your average white actor had when applying for it.

I realize there are bigger issues here, concerning changing times and trying to all at once change minds, change world viewpoints and just generally try to steer public perception towards a more 'equally-respective global community' or what have you... And I agree with the concept, because clearly we still, as a species, have a lot of freaking ground to cover before we reach some unknowable Utopia where everyone is equal, regardless of race, gender, sexuality, social status and all the rest...

...

BUT, I can't help but feel that you nailed it, right there. Because, at the end of the line, an actor is playing a role. And if an actor, whatever his/her gender/race/aforementioned status and blahblahblah is just the right person for the job and has exactly the skills that the directing team wants and his or her presence on screen is just RIGHT for the role and people watching the auditions all collectively get that little delicious frisson of 'ooooooooh, he/she's the one, Goddamn', then why on earth should anything else matter?

If it works, it works. Like you said, if nobody else was actually denied opportunity, then everything seems golden to me. And, by and large, the cast of Cloud Atlas seems pretty damned diverse.

This is a no-brainer, in my opinion. I see no problem here.

Shouldn't it just come down to the abilities of the actors themselves when playing the role? In this day and age, when most (I'd like to say all, but unfortunately that's not the case.) parts of the world are trying to move past racism and make the world a better place, why can't films just have actors in them for a role that the actor had proven to do well in.

So long as no one was denied a part due to their race, just their acting ability, then I do not see the bigotry in that. I thought equal rights is what everyone wants, you can't make some things exclusive to certain people over others, because that doesn't seem very equal at all.

Arakasi:
If a famous actor can play a mentally handicapped person instead of a mentally handicapped person playing themselves I am perfectly fine with that.

As such, I am perfectly fine with black face, white face, whatever face a good actor puts on to play his/her role. Who cares if a minority doesn't get a role because of it? As long as they had the equally denied opportunity that your average white actor had when applying for it.

I couldn't agree more.

Father Time:
So Bob since the past is unchangeable and that historical stigma and blackface will always be around in the past, isn't those double standard justifications going to be eternal?

Seriously how would we know when we can drop the double standard altogether? I really want to know.

The answer's probably going to be more non-white roles but roughly how many do we need?

its gonna be a while, slavery wasn't that long ago, i know that's like 200 or so years, but in comparison to the life span of the planet , and humans, 200 years isn't that long.

and then civil rights, those things still have effects on our culture, like in this case people not liking to cast people with color for lead roles.

until enough time has passed where as the cultural balances can be tipped in a way that non white male can get fair say, you gotta deal with the double standards

I've never really understood all this racism stuff. I just see people as people. I make my judgements on how they act, not how they look, with the exception of what people do to their base appearance, such as growing a beard.

Serious question, is that strange, or do other people think that way, too?

Right, well the first thing that should have been noted at the start of this video is: I'm Going To Spoil The Plot Of Cloud Atlas! Some of us have not been watching anything to do with this movie as we want to go into the film fresh faced

-M

Malisteen:
Why the hell should the fictional context of the films narrative trump the real life context of Hollywood's racist casting choices?

Simply put, it doesn't. Cloud Atlas doesn't get a pass on this just because you think it's a good movie, and it doesn't get to pull racist stunt casting just because it ostensibly delivers an anti-racism message. Context counts for a lot, but a film's context isn't just what makes it onto the screen, it includes the industry and society that produced it, and the one hand cannot wash the other.

How are the casting choices racist?

SonOfVoorhees:
Did you say its ok for a black person to play a white character, but not the other way round? Look Bob, no one gave a crap that the guy in Thor was played by a black actor, what annoyed them was that the character in the comic was white. These same fans would also complain if you made a Blade movie with a white guy playing Blade.

To be honest, if its original content then who cares what colour the actor is and whom they are playing. Have a black guy made up to look Chinese or a white guy made up to look black. A man in female make up. No one cares. Its just the PC crowd that jump on this stuff and paint it as a racial thing when its not and as usual its aimed more at the white people than other races.

Also as Bob seems to really love the Cloud Atlus movie im guessing the next few Big Pictures will be all about how amazing it is.

There was some issue since in both the comic, and assumably the mytholgy that inspired it, he was white, but I was more concerned for how hilarious the casting choice was in light of who Heimdall was in the mythology. He was nicknamed "The White Aesir" (also "Golden Teeth") making him the most hilarious to cast as black.

Akio91:
So.....this is the first I've heard of this. Bob, are you making up issues for views? Or is this some Hollywood insider mad that the rest of us have missed out on?

No, he's right, it exists. Bob's own politics and white guilt have predictably slanted it though. The issue isn't quite as mainstream as your used to seeing from other outcries because the basic issue isn't coming from sources the left wing likes to acknowlege existing.

Basically "Cloud Atlas" is a movie that has seriously invoked the ire of so called "reverse racists". Equality actually being a forgone conclusion in most of the western world (despite what politicians and left wingers like to say and believe) your rapidly seeing those that are minorities within the western world embracing a "pro (insert race here)" stance, the old "I'm not anti-white, but am proud to be black" or "I'm pro-black" attitude which is pretty much the same thing as white supremacy conveyed through other words and carefully avoided by the left wing. A lot of the outcry you see here is not so much because of old school comedic "race play" by white actors, but because you have minorities offended by what they see as a lesser people playing them. I ran into this issue not so much as white vs. black as most people like to focus on, but more in terms of white guys playing Koreans in the final sequence, which was seen as an affront to ethnic superiority... as is the entire idea of soul reincarnation which can be an issue to those who see themselves superior for reasons having to do with who or what they are inherantly.

I actually tried to find a link to it again (though I can't, I think it was taken down) I was reading a fairly racist article someone put up ranting pretty much about asian superiority and how offensive this movie was on those levels.

I pretty much take the opposite position from Bob on most of these issues even if it goes to the same place. I believe in human equaliy, but I feel within the western world that's embracing it the current problem is not with the "white majority" which has done a good job of adapting on those principles, but for minorities themselves to adapt to equality, do away with their counter cultures, and desires for social vengeance. Or in simple terms, when dealing with things like the white vs. black conflict, white guys freed blacks and supported all of this civil liberties stuff, it wasn't done to give blacks the tools needed to avenge this injustice, and indeed exactly the kinds of movements and attitudes you see now were exactly what was promised wouldn't happen by the people promoting that equality agenda. Globally I also think the rest of the world is very racist, except it's a situation where whites are one of the smallest minorities there are (ironic on a lot of levels). The eastern world in paticular needs to be given a serious kick in the teeth if we ever plan to see racism dealt with. Bob Chipman style guilt and self-judgement doesn't really solve anything, especially seeing as anything we do is only affecting a relatively small percentage of humanity. When you considered that roughly 1/3rd of the population is in India, 1/3rd is in China, Africa is overcrowded, hundreds of millions of Muslims, etc... you begin to realize that what happens within the borders of the USA or Europe affects a very small percentage of humanity.

As a result I take the opposite track from Bob, rather than being an apologist I believe on brutal crackdowns on minority counter culture, reverse racism, and similar things. Someone who identifies as Pro-Black, Pro-Asian, and says "[insert minority here] Power" is just as bad as a KKK member, they are actually the same thing (especially nowadays where the KKK is itself mostly verbal and political as well) and deserves to be hammered as a divisive influance that is working against tolerance and co-existance. I also believe very much in doing things like forcing information into countries like China through their censorship policies and refusing to help them, or let anyone else help them with censorship. I for example believe a search engine that censors itself for other countries to filter outside political ideals like tolerance needs to itself be on the receiving end of a brutal crackdown.

Or in short I pretty much believe the new motto should be "Live Free Or Die" and acceptance at this point still needs to be fought for. The ideas are out there, but need to be enforced through the barrel of a gun, and the striking surface of a truncheon. Even if unherard of numbers of people die, it's one of those cases where anything worth having comes at a high cost. I think we planted the seeds, but gave up far too soon, and fell into lethargy and hand wringing where we let all the same problems continue, just from the opposite direction they were coming from before. The counter culture that was one a champion of civil liberties as become the enemy of those same civil liberties.

The casting choices are definitely racist:

Jim Sturgess is always good.

Hugo Weaving is always evil.

Halle Berry is always good.

NAMs(Non-Asian minorities) are, whenever possible, smarter, more human, and superior to WAAs(Whites and Asians), despite the fact that the latter have built pretty much everything of civilizational value on earth.

Incidentally, the central message of Cloud Atlas is incredibly dumb: "Boundaries are meaningless!"

No, you idiots, those boundaries were established for a very good fucking reason (keeping the peace, confining responsibility for one's own actions to one's own people, ensuring a common culture from people with common characteristics, allowing people to go through emotional/sexual/cognitive development in a safe and understanding common format, increasing social and national trust) by people in an age that was far less distracted and far more informed by common general observations than yours. The only people who seriously WANT to believe that social boundaries mean nothing are named Lana Wachowski. Here's what actually happens when those boundaries are crossed.

Testify you wonderful man!
I've always been frustrated by the ignorance of context too. Not just in this, but in everything.

Canadish:

PunkRex:
I know this is a little off topic but concidering just how badass Idris Elba was in Thor and Rock'n'Rolla im surprised he's not bigger state side... or here in the UK actually. Seriously, I thought he was gonna be the next BIG black actor.

Considering that there are alot of rumors suggesting that they want him as the next Bond, you might well turn out to be right.

Who was complaining about Cloud Atlas? I'm struggling to think of any communities THAT desperate to be offending by something outside of Tumblr. Or maybe Fox News if you're looking at the other end of the spectrum...

Still not on board with the double standard there Bob, even if I sympathize. It's never the correct long term solution to a problem.

(Besides, I'd rather just see some NEW characters and ideas as opposed to constant rebooting and "reimaginings" of older ones.)

Idris Elba = James Bond... I am completely okay with this.

Akio91:
So.....this is the first I've heard of this. Bob, are you making up issues for views? Or is this some Hollywood insider mad that the rest of us have missed out on?

No he's not making it up. For a while after his review of Cloud Atlas went up, Bob himself on his Twitter feed was accused of supporting "yellowfacing" because he liked the artistic appeal of the movie by people who just did not get the point.

Malisteen:
Why the hell should the fictional context of the films narrative trump the real life context of Hollywood's racist casting choices?

Simply put, it doesn't. Cloud Atlas doesn't get a pass on this just because you think it's a good movie, and it doesn't get to pull racist stunt casting just because it ostensibly delivers an anti-racism message. Context counts for a lot, but a film's context isn't just what makes it onto the screen, it includes the industry and society that produced it, and the one hand cannot wash the other.

...did you even watch this in it's entirety or did you get post this half way through? In case you haven't noticed, the casting for Cloud atlas was actually very diverse and the makeup was done to convey feelings of transient spirits and reincarnation, not just of people but of ideas. The whole point of the movie, from casting all the way through post production is meant to say that yes, racism is a problem and it needs to be fixed. Not later, now. To accuse it of racism is really missing the point of the movie.

Also let me note that Rza's Man with the Iron Fists was about 9,000 times better than Cloud Atlas in tone and watchability for being openly and proudly about race differences in China's visitors and clan differences in China's natives. Those who aren't fighting for their own personal advancement are either fighting for the honor of their own clans or fighting for abstract boundaries like law, social order, and justice. The differences between clans are actually celebrated and actually respected.

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