Zero Punctuation: Medal of Honor Warfighter & Doom 3 BFG Edition

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You could really feel the hatred in his voice this time, this wasn't just criticism for the sake of the review, it felt like he was very genuinely angered by the whole concept of Warfighter.

Funny, I just downloaded Painkiller* today and holy hell it is fun. Combine the game with Sepultura/Misfits and you get something better than most realistic shooters combined. The SGWW's are low on all that "fun" thingy anyway so it's not very fair.

It doesn't have to actually be like that all the time but you can expand on it. It's hilarious how games from 8 years ago (or very well 20 years ago, if you count Doom) can kick the crap out of most mainstream FPS that have come out recently. Battlefield 3 may look good, but so does Half-life 2 and at least HL2 has competent design. It's almost as funny as the word Warfighter.

*(I own it, the Triple Dose actually, but my dvd drive's busted and I can't be bothered to buy another one)

Funny review Yahtzee.

I had no reason to get another MMS since I'm waiting to see how Blops 2 will turn out.

Regarding the BFG Edition I had no reason to try it out because I bought the old game and I liked it the way it was.Now I'm waiting patiently for Doom 4.

I love Yahtzee's reviews of military shooters. They're always his funniest reviews. XD

erttheking:
Funny review I admit that, but I am getting a little tired of people who like games like COD being accused of not being "real" shooter fans.

I think he might be refering to people who have only played COD-Like shooters. If a "real" shooter fan happens to like CoD he doesn't instantly become a "fake" shooter fan. I actually know some people who would qualify as "Real" shooter fans that actually like CoD a bit.

Man, he actually sounds angry when referring to the Spunkgargleweewee players, when he said "Ignorant little bastards" I heard some genuine rage there.

It's good that Yahtzee now likes Doom 3, it's always nice to see that he likes games that I like. I say this because that doesn't happen often enough (Borderlands 2).

Is it too late for this?

image

No, that's still funny and accurate.

OT:

CleverNickname:
You know, after seeing the opinions of first that biscuit-youtube-person and now Yathzee, I'm starting to think Warfighter was specifically made to be as ridiculously horrible as possible, so that the entire industry just stops making them. The makers of Warfighter must love (real) shooters as much as Yahtzee, because I don't believe you can make something that bad if you don't know what's good. Accidentally bad only ever ends up blandly mediocre; complete terribleness requires true effort.

... at least that's what I'm hoping.

In a similar vein, that sounds so ridiculous that it actually makes sense! No seriously, it'd be really great if what you were saying was true. SS3 had something similar at the start, where it mocked modern shooters by imitating their gameplay to show just how boring is. Problem is, that was a joke that covered about 1/4 of the game, so it was basically a joke that cost 10 and took 4 hours to tell. Putting it for one level would have been better.

Hatchet90:
You know it's a good day when Yahtzee calls COD players, "Ignorant little bastards." I can't remember the last time I laughed that hard at a Zero Punctuation.

I loved it. He should really bash on his detractors more. There's little I've ever found more pleasurable that the schadenfreude that can be found when Yahtzee takes on his detractors directly. Not to mention the comments section afterwards!

Since the acronym for "Modern Military Shooter" overlaps with "Massive Multiplayer Shooter" I propose to use the name "Present-day Military Shooter."

Shadowstar38:

Sylveria:

erttheking:
Funny review I admit that, but I am getting a little tired of people who like games like COD being accused of not being "real" shooter fans.

They're not real shooter fans. They're wall-hugging simulator fans and wouldn't survive a single level in a game where they didn't have a barricade of sand to hide behind while waiting for their health to regenerate.

Uh. No.

When I got into the shooter genre, I started out with Call of Duty. Then I went to playing Half Life and Painkiller later on and did just fine.

Each of these types of game are shooters, there is just different tiers of shooter.

The very fact you are on this website means you are above average gamer

Most console gamers couldn't hit a shit without autoaim
The very fact of existence of "quickscope" technique proves it (don't aim, computer will aim for you)

My sad experience with auto-aim started with Halo:CE
I couldn't figure out why my aim is so off
Then I realized that computer is "correcting" my shots
For those who don't know, aim in Halo is "put-enemy-here-and-shoot" area (circle to be more precise)- that might be how it works on consoles, but it's totally useless on PCs
And that makes automatics nearly unusable for those experienced in games without aim correction
So I ended up using only scoped weapons (pistol, sniper rifle and rocket launcher) and shotgun

Only place where auto-correcting is acceptable is in RPG-FPS games
For example in MassEffect or Fallout3, where the skill represents how well your character can aim with particular weapon

Why do you even bother playing them, you just don't get spunkgargleweewees Yahtzee.

C117:
I don't know why, but this is probably one of the best reviews lately. Not that the other recent once have been bad, this one was just funnier.

The combination of an insultingly bad game, and a critic that thrives of scornfully flaming games to hell and back make for good entertainment. Whenever Totalbiscuit or Yahtzee review games like this you just know you're in for a treat.

Sylveria:

erttheking:
Funny review I admit that, but I am getting a little tired of people who like games like COD being accused of not being "real" shooter fans.

They're not real shooter fans. They're wall-hugging simulator fans and wouldn't survive a single level in a game where they didn't have a barricade of sand to hide behind while waiting for their health to regenerate.

That's interesting*.

You know, I was actually going to respond to this post in a normal manner but I made the unfortunate decision of reading some of your older posts and I have to slooowly step back from this reply. Ever so slowly. Still facing you.

In all seriousness. You sir (or madam) seem to have some serious issues that I think require some professional attention.

*and by "interesting* I mean narrow-minded and prejudiced.

Yahtzee is always funnier when he's angrier.

Captcha is "Follow Me", so in using "captchas as orders" meme, my twitter is @DJSHIRE

Hatchet90:
You know it's a good day when Yahtzee calls COD players, "Ignorant little bastards." I can't remember the last time I laughed that hard at a Zero Punctuation.

haha it lightened up my day as well. what i found exceedngly funny was after such a scathing review there are numerous you can by this crap here buttons under the video haha

i hereby call this genre foreigner murder simulators !

he does make a good point though you do basically play the evil stormtroopers now in these games :-|

I'm happy he mentioned Resistance 3 as a proper shooter. That game was fantastic.

I like that there's an unofficial subgenre for those games. MMS. Sure, it means "modern military shooters", but it could mean "mixed, minced sausages" for all I care as long as it stays the hell away from Doom.

Incidentally, Yahtzee should try Brutal Doom. I'd like to see/read/hear his opinion of that.

Glad he found a good time in the BFG Edition. Here's to hoping that Painkiller: Hell and Damnation will prove just as good for him, should he choose to review it.

C117:
I don't know why, but this is probably one of the best reviews lately. Not that the other recent once have been bad, this one was just funnier.

I feel like he put real emotion into this one, not his usual smug detachment. I like smug detached Yahtzee, but genuinely irritated to the point of rage Yahtzee is even better.

MacNille:

erttheking:

Neiloken:
ok since ol ZP is making a comparison between COD and real shooters (thank ronswanson) i now call he must play Halo 4... After years of being subjected to "i'll just sit here and wait for my team to kill everything" shooters I decided to start Halo4 on heroic (used to finish every halo on legendary) and oh crikey did I get my cheeks served to me on a silver platter...

Being el solo once more has proven to be very difficult and VERY exciting!! Ok mind I've only played the first few missions but I have high hopes this game will continue kicking my ass...

Oh ya, and to put the whole xbox vs ps3 on graphics thing to rest. All u PS fanboys, organize an HDTV, Xbox 360 Slim, and Halo 4... it is honestly prettier than anything I've ever seen on a screen in my entire life...

Peace x 3

Yeah, if you're expecting to let your teammates in Halo do anything you're going to let yourself get laughed at by any experienced Halo player. UNSC marines on any difficulty higher than Normal tend to have a life span of 20 seconds, and letting them drive is just suicidal. Incidentally I'm not a fan of COD style shooters myself and it's why I like Halo...I just don't like people who jump on the people that like them and says that they're not real shooter fans. Just rings as "no true Scotsman"

QFT brother.I'm so fucking tired of video game nerd hating on COD. Just ignore COD then if you hate it so fucking much!

I'm not hating on COD, COD is a good Multiplayer deathmatch game, and yes there were moments in COD MW1 that got the ol pulse racing (see sniper mission) but I do believe they should've toned down the AI support kick ass level...

To use an example, imagine playing Rainbow 6 and right as the main mission kicks in where its supposed to be you and some all ass kicking device like an Apache helicopter mono-e-mono (yes i dunno the real term) and you've survived through all the scripted missile launches and stuff and then all of a sudden, woosh! up pops random faceless nameless teammate A with a frikkin Deagle (desert eagle) and he gets in the final hit and the chopper goes kaboom... You did all the work, you did your best, you restarted like 60 times, but Sir WhatsHisFace over there blew up the chopper and you didnt. He's the hero, he gets all the loose women and you get a thanks for playing complimentary voucher to hooters.

The feeling is similar to Diablo suffering a fatal heart attack mid battle. Its a victory but the victory is dead and empty...

Barbara Romanowski:
Since the acronym for "Modern Military Shooter" overlaps with "Massive Multiplayer Shooter" I propose to use the name "Present-day Military Shooter."

image

Oh, crap. I'd better add something so I don't get banned....

O.K., here's a thought: I thought the video on if quake was done today pointed out the whole obnoxious presence of objectives markers quite nicely. Once you take a look at them, it becomes obvious just how silly they are. A good dev should make it obvious where to go without the need for such tomfoolery.

Spunkgargleweewee, does it come in Cherry?

Barbara Romanowski:
Since the acronym for "Modern Military Shooter" overlaps with "Massive Multiplayer Shooter" I propose to use the name "Present-day Military Shooter."

So PMS it is then? Funnily enough, it also stands for (P)issing (M)e (S)Off, as in "This genre of shooters really pisses me soff."

Hmm...it doesn't really flow right off the tongue exactly. Spunkgargleweewee it is then.

F'Angus:
I'm happy he mentioned Resistance 3 as a proper shooter. That game was fantastic.

Really the standout among the series, mainly because it's the only one where you aren't serving in the military and a lion's share of the experience is spent on your own. I think that's what made it better, in my humble opinion.

M'kay, Yahtzee's criticism of how games like these are dull and boring due to regenerating health taking about a huge chunk of the challenge and cover mechanics making the fights tedious, this I can get behind (no pun intended). I can definitely see how having to fight while wounded helps ramp up challenge for a game and taking that away makes it less of a challenging game and more of a chore to do between cutscenes. Cover mechanics make good sense, especially if they were PAIRED with non-regenerating health, because in the event you're bleeding out you'd like the option to be more cautious I'd bet, but you need a smarter AI that will do stuff like try to flank you when you duck behind cover or will attack you with weapons that get around the cover, like grenades. Otherwise if you keep using the same brain dead kamikazi troop AI's that seem to plan to just move slowly towards you in the hopes their dead bodies will give you some kind of fatal illness, there's no challenge at all.

On Yahtzee's criticism of the story setting; yes, it's a bit of smaller audience that these games are trying to appeal to, mostly the type that like Tom Clancy novels. The modern military isn't exactly a thrill-a-minute subject because it's largely got to do with modern politics, and virtually everyone these days finds -that- particular subject nauseous. So I can't blame anyone for not finding this particular setting appealing, but neither would I blame other people for liking it; it's all a matter of preference.

Now, Yahtzee's criticism of the pro-U.S. military feel of these games. Oh please, give me a fucking break. It's one thing to criticize a game for failing to explain the reason you have to shoot an enemy (which he did), it's another thing to say the more advanced military force is the bad guy just because the enemies in a game aren't white or members of a 1st world nation (which he also did). Whether a fighting force is using a state-of-the-art, remote controlled kill-bot or a Cold War-era AK-47, if they're using said weapons to enact ethnic cleansing, religious genocide or politically motivated mass murder they're STILL THE FUCKING BAD GUYS. The Al Queda and the Taliban, for example, aren't sitting around in Armani suits, sipping Starbucks and watching flat screen tvs, but that doesn't make them any more justified for bombing department stores and markets or broadcasting videos of cutting kidnap victims' heads off.

Failing to give a proper explanation for player actions is a serious fault in a game. But being poor or a minority doesn't give anyone a free pass, either.

One good thing about the 'brown locations' in Warfighter.
I live in Karachi, and the chase scene where it is shown is a kind of good recreation of it. I used to live 10 minutes from Empress Market shown in that scene and I actually recognized some of the buildings, like the KMC building and (I think) the Memon Masjid which were part of the scenery. And those people hanging on behind the bus does happen sometimes(they are the conductors, usually and they do it mostly to guide the bus through traffic jams like the one in that scene and they usually hang from the door, not at the back).
The street vendor part of Empress Market is something I have not seen and could be fake. It is actually a big building named after Empress Victoria and made in colonial times.

And no one here wears Arabic clothing, most people wear western clothing in Karachi. The game showing Arabic clothes looked like it was saying, look how different they are from us. A significant part of Karachi even speaks English as a second language(I am right now) and Dawn, an English newspaper, is one of the most popular newspapers in Karachi, probably just behind the Urdu, Jang newspaper.

But EA should have known one dirty secret about Empress Market, right next to it is the biggest pirated DVD hub in Asia, Rainbow Center. Strangely that was not in the game. And I think a lot of people here bought the game from that very place. The actual games costs Rs. 6000, and salaries and allowances are mostly too low to afford them, in Rainbow Center the game would have sold for Rs. 400 for PC or Rs. 500 for Xbox 360.

So, I actually really liked MoH: Warfighter... It was a well crafted modern shooter. If it's not your thing, great! Good for you! But I feel like this game, like CoD and other "modern shooters" get undue hate just because they aren't something else. Something they're not trying to be. Just my two cents, though.

Bottom line: If you like CoD or Battlefield, you'll probably really like this. If you don't, you probably won't.

Funniest review in a long time! Seriously, I rewatched it three times.

I thought "Warfighter" was a joke when I read it in this episode's title. Guess the sequel will be "Gunshooter".

Doom 3 wasn't much of a circle-strafing type of game with its' tight corridors. It wanted to be closer to survival horror with every encounter as a jump scare.

It's a shame Id, the original standard-bearers of shooters, have been surpassed by stuff like Human Revolution and Bioshock. Rage did some cool things with its' simple classes, item creation, and minigames. Hopefully Doom 4 will have some new mechanics to make it an experience different from other shooters rather than a slightly prettier version of games you've already played.

Much of Yahtzee's complaint about this game (and others) was that you play a white man killing non-whites. He needs to grow out of his white guilt.

Mike Fang:

Now, Yahtzee's criticism of the pro-U.S. military feel of these games. Oh please, give me a fucking break. It's one thing to criticize a game for failing to explain the reason you have to shoot an enemy (which he did), it's another thing to say the more advanced military force is the bad guy just because the enemies in a game aren't white or members of a 1st world nation (which he also did). Whether a fighting force is using a state-of-the-art, remote controlled kill-bot or a Cold War-era AK-47, if they're using said weapons to enact ethnic cleansing, religious genocide or politically motivated mass murder they're STILL THE FUCKING BAD GUYS. The Al Queda and the Taliban, for example, aren't sitting around in Armani suits, sipping Starbucks and watching flat screen tvs, but that doesn't make them any more justified for bombing department stores and markets or broadcasting videos of cutting kidnap victims' heads off.

Failing to give a proper explanation for player actions is a serious fault in a game. But being poor or a minority doesn't give anyone a free pass, either.

Oh dear. Someone believes Fox News, don't they?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_casualties_in_the_War_in_Afghanistan_(2001%E2%80%93present)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War

However "good" the reasons for the U.S. to enter these countries, they've lost the moral high ground by now.

3 types of shooters modern ww2 and fun aka sci fi ones

Sylveria:

Yopaz:
It's funny how people accuse him of not liking shooter when some of the games he give the most praise (Half-Life and Painkiller) are shooters.

I'm going to accuse him of not liking survival horror games for the bad review he gave Resident Evil 5.

I guess none of the titles he reviewed seems appealing to me. I guess I like modern shooters a tad more than he does, but only because he really, really hates them. Hilarious as always though.

He doesn't like dudebro-shooters where you, as a player, are largely unnecessary. Doom 3, Painkiller and Serious Sam were made for people who want to play shooters. COD and BF and MOHFloorfighter were made for people who want to hide behind sacks of sand and scream racist terms in to their head-sets.

You don't really know what you're talking about. The Battlefield fanbase is by and large far more mature than the Call of Duty fanbase - not surprising, since the Battlefield franchise has always demanded more skill from its players. I would recommend anyone to try out Battlefield 2 and its realism mod Project Reality - then you'll find out just how different they are from Call of Duty. (I do wish that Battlefield 3 could have been a lot more like Battlefield 2, though - maybe that'll be fixed with Battlefield 4?)

While I don't agree that "realistic shooters" need to go away completely, I absolutely agree that developers need to stop it with regenerating health, extremely linear level design, stupid AI and 4-5 hour campaigns. True, the Battlefield series didn't even have campaigns until the first Bad Company, but if you're going to put a campaign in your game, it should probably be better. As for the regenerating health, it takes away a lot of the tactical thinking (and a lot of the teamwork in multiplayer). I'd like to see a military shooter whose health system is based not on taking cover to regenerate health or even on finding health packs, but on not ever getting shot AT ALL.

I've got some awesome ideas for a military shooter! I just wish there was a way for me to implement them in an actual game ... :(

WaitWHAT:

Mike Fang:

Now, Yahtzee's criticism of the pro-U.S. military feel of these games. Oh please, give me a fucking break. It's one thing to criticize a game for failing to explain the reason you have to shoot an enemy (which he did), it's another thing to say the more advanced military force is the bad guy just because the enemies in a game aren't white or members of a 1st world nation (which he also did). Whether a fighting force is using a state-of-the-art, remote controlled kill-bot or a Cold War-era AK-47, if they're using said weapons to enact ethnic cleansing, religious genocide or politically motivated mass murder they're STILL THE FUCKING BAD GUYS. The Al Queda and the Taliban, for example, aren't sitting around in Armani suits, sipping Starbucks and watching flat screen tvs, but that doesn't make them any more justified for bombing department stores and markets or broadcasting videos of cutting kidnap victims' heads off.

Failing to give a proper explanation for player actions is a serious fault in a game. But being poor or a minority doesn't give anyone a free pass, either.

Oh dear. Someone believes Fox News, don't they?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_casualties_in_the_War_in_Afghanistan_(2001%E2%80%93present)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War

However "good" the reasons for the U.S. to enter these countries, they've lost the moral high ground by now.

Oh, I do love it whenever someone is accused of watching Fox News just because they don't despise the US military.

Also, I'm willing to bet that you couldn't be arsed to look into which side has caused the majority of the civilian casualties in Afghanistan and Iraq, huh? I'll give you a hint: it's not the Americans! ;)

I just came to say I loved the use of the Golden Axe "Go" marker :)

Well Yathzee you could call Doom, Painkiller, Team Fortress and all those games >>>FUN<<< Shooters and the rest is just .........unrealistic realism crap or whatever you called it.

I like fun shooters as well, because I like having fun....

Great how that fits together huh?

Markunator:

Also, I'm willing to bet that you couldn't be arsed to look into which side has caused the majority of the civilian casualties in Afghanistan and Iraq, huh? I'll give you a hint: it's not the Americans! ;)

Congratulations you're marginally better for not killing as much as the fucking radicals on the ground! Let's disregard the torture and all the things done during the last few unjustified wars. One the greatest sacrileges seems to be to say that Americans aren't liked, no matter what they're doing, no matter where they are.

The shooter genre gets flack for almost always being some paranoid American power fantasy. The cold war is over and it's actually sickening for something which encourages a Calvinistic us vs them, black and white view of the world.

I though the Vietnam war would be a lesson to how pointless and bloody military action without justification is.

Shooters can be good fun I guess, but I would like it if was something else then some American soldier committing genocide, while you're called a hero for it. At least be more self aware, or just go the team fortress route and be silly.

This is why I love the Crysis series as a whole, it mixes the best aspects of MMS with the best aspects of FPS. And Crysis 3 is looking damn promising judging by what I've seen in the alpha.

Why did I know that this review will get many comments??? :D
Sooo... it was a little bit unclear: Doom 3 BFG is actually good? Nice!

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