Jimquisition: Fake Nerd Girls

 Pages PREV 1 . . . 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 NEXT
 

BiscuitTrouser:

Astro:

Yes, the context of gaming conventions is one of fun and light-hearted amusement, not intentional sexual displays of breasts and buttocks.

There's a difference between someone who's attractive and someone who's intentionally showing off how attractive they are in a male dominated space like gaming for the expressed purpose of reaping sexually-charged attention.

No, I'm not comparing myself to a pedophile, I haven't stated that I'm personally attracted to manipulative women. I'm implying that ignoring the fact that sexual attraction happens and it's acted upon is foolish and naive.

Most of our laws surrounding rape depend on the idea that men can and will totally control how they act on their sexual attraction. its not difficult to control. I see no issue with breasts and buttocks in a costume as long as its canonical and in the spirit of video games. Why not? Express your love of that game freely and without restraint i say.

Youre comparing men in general to people who physically cannot stop themselves doing immoral things due to sexual attraction. Thats hardly a strong argument. You can ignore sexual attraction. Its not hard. Im not saying ignore it. Im saying accept it as part of life and dont make a big deal out of it. Im attracted to people sometimes. Its just a thing you feel in your head and go "That person looks attractive" and get over it by going about your day. If you fawn over a person or give them unnecessary attention thats the DUDES failure rather than the person they become infatuated over based entirely on appearance.

Laws are based on functional moral guidelines, that doesn't make them fair or useful in every context.

I have an issue with breasts and buttocks presented in such a way that's intentionally siphoning attention and mental energy from an activity for the gain of one selfish individual.

What? Why do you think that pedophiles "physically cannot stop themselves" from having sex with children? It's known and documented that many pedophiles choose not to have sex with children.

Okay, a hypothetical fawning male has agency for what he's doing, and a hypothetical attention-seeking female has agency for how she's presenting herself. On one hand you have a demographic of typically (or rather they're seen as) needy and sexually starved men, and on the other you have a singular woman who's exploiting that, coincidentally or not. Hmm, I wonder which would be more likely to change.

The thing that gets me is why do many people think that it's only girls who do this? No one likes a poser, be it male or female. I'm a girl and yes I have had to justify my gaming choices on more than one occasion and it's bloody ridiculous that I have had to. At the same time I shouldn't be forced to cover up my gender just to appease stupidity, I tend to pick feminine names and female characters, that doesn't make me a poser, it just means I want to play a female character. I'm not going to throw the fact that I'm a girl out there for all at all times, the only times I'd mention I'm a girl is if someone asks or if someone just thinks I'm a guy then I will correct them. I'm not going to deny it, I find fake gaming people annoying on the very rare occasion I come across them,but I just ignore them and get on, it really is not hard to do.

Should these fake people be given such a hard time? Not really, unless they become emotionally manipulative. There are plenty of girls out there and fake nerd girls and guys are a bit of a rarity. The way some people spout about it you'd think they were an everyday occurrence and that all females must be the same way.

Skyweir:
did you just compare "geek" culture with high order mathematics?

By the way, most people at scientific conventions do not quiz each other on what they know.

Thats because they don't have too... Because Higher Order Mathematics hasn't been made currently popular, by entry level non geekdom. Nor is it plagued by trendies. An please, lets not pretend that geek culture is not currently plagued with trendies, due to the current popularity of shows like Big Bang Theory.

God golly gosh, the more I look at this thread, the more I hate both sides.

EDIT: Also, Astro, what do sexy cosplays have ANYTHING to do with fake geek girls? It's like you're going completely off topic with your arguments.

CaptainChip:
God golly gosh, the more I look at this thread, the more I hate both sides.

EDIT: Also, Astro, what do sexy cosplays have ANYTHING to do with fake geek girls? It's like you're going completely off topic with your arguments.

A 'fake nerd girl' is presumably not feigning interest gaming for no reason. Girls with a primary interest in cosplay and a secondary interest in gaming are fairly common, and it touches on the larger issue.

Astro:

CaptainChip:
God golly gosh, the more I look at this thread, the more I hate both sides.

EDIT: Also, Astro, what do sexy cosplays have ANYTHING to do with fake geek girls? It's like you're going completely off topic with your arguments.

A 'fake nerd girl' is presumably not feigning interest gaming for no reason.

... And? Just because a cosplayer chose a sexy costume does not mean s/he's not a fan of the show. That's what this whole thing is about. Being a geek, being a fan.

Here's the thing, fake geeks usually pretend to like something for attention, right? But that doesn't mean everyone who likes attention is a fake geek.

And even if they picked a sexy costume, does that mean they're doing it for attention? No! Has it NEVER occurred to you that maybe, just maybe, they really like the character? Because that's what most cosplayers do, cosplay characters they like. Even if the outfit is revealing.

So my final stance on your argument is that it's completely irrelevant to the matter at hand.

CaptainChip:

Astro:

CaptainChip:
God golly gosh, the more I look at this thread, the more I hate both sides.

EDIT: Also, Astro, what do sexy cosplays have ANYTHING to do with fake geek girls? It's like you're going completely off topic with your arguments.

A 'fake nerd girl' is presumably not feigning interest gaming for no reason.

... And? Just because a cosplayer chose a sexy costume does not mean s/he's not a fan of the show. That's what this whole thing is about. Being a geek, being a fan.

Here's the thing, fake geeks usually pretend to like something for attention, right? But that doesn't mean everyone who likes attention is a fake geek.

And even if they picked a sexy costume, does that mean they're doing it for attention? No! Has it NEVER occurred to you that maybe, just maybe, they really like the character? Because that's what most cosplayers do, cosplay characters they like. Even if the outfit is revealing.

So my final stance on your argument is that it's completely irrelevant to the matter at hand.

If that's your reasoning then you haven't read most of my argument.

Astro:

CaptainChip:

Astro:

A 'fake nerd girl' is presumably not feigning interest gaming for no reason.

... And? Just because a cosplayer chose a sexy costume does not mean s/he's not a fan of the show. That's what this whole thing is about. Being a geek, being a fan.

Here's the thing, fake geeks usually pretend to like something for attention, right? But that doesn't mean everyone who likes attention is a fake geek.

And even if they picked a sexy costume, does that mean they're doing it for attention? No! Has it NEVER occurred to you that maybe, just maybe, they really like the character? Because that's what most cosplayers do, cosplay characters they like. Even if the outfit is revealing.

So my final stance on your argument is that it's completely irrelevant to the matter at hand.

If that's your reasoning then you haven't read most of my argument.

Most of your argument is "they cosplay as sexy characters because like wearing sexy costumes" and "they could be wearing different costumes" and "they're doing it for attention". Basically, your whole argument from what I've read is based on a ton of assumptions. And it's very, very weak.

And still off-topic.

CaptainChip:

Astro:

CaptainChip:

... And? Just because a cosplayer chose a sexy costume does not mean s/he's not a fan of the show. That's what this whole thing is about. Being a geek, being a fan.

Here's the thing, fake geeks usually pretend to like something for attention, right? But that doesn't mean everyone who likes attention is a fake geek.

And even if they picked a sexy costume, does that mean they're doing it for attention? No! Has it NEVER occurred to you that maybe, just maybe, they really like the character? Because that's what most cosplayers do, cosplay characters they like. Even if the outfit is revealing.

So my final stance on your argument is that it's completely irrelevant to the matter at hand.

If that's your reasoning then you haven't read most of my argument.

Most of your argument is "they cosplay as sexy characters because like wearing sexy costumes" and "they could be wearing different costumes" and "they're doing it for attention". Basically, your whole argument from what I've read is based on a ton of assumptions. And it's very, very weak.

And still off-topic.

What you've read meaning only part of my argument because I've already addressed what you brought up.

Care to explain the flaws in my argument instead of just alluding to their existence? And how is discussing a subset of girls feigning an interest in gaming in order to reap attention irrelevant to the topic?

Astro:

CaptainChip:

Astro:

If that's your reasoning then you haven't read most of my argument.

Most of your argument is "they cosplay as sexy characters because like wearing sexy costumes" and "they could be wearing different costumes" and "they're doing it for attention". Basically, your whole argument from what I've read is based on a ton of assumptions. And it's very, very weak.

And still off-topic.

From what you've read meaning only part of my argument because I've addressed what you brought up?

How is discussing a subset of girls feigning an interest in gaming in order to reap attention irrelevant to the topic?

Oh, also, "Because they are dressing up as sexy characters in a convention usually filled with men, it's because they want attention!" Still weak.

And still irrelevant because sexy cosplayers =/= fake geek girls. This is what I'm hammering on. You can still have a sexy Samus costume, genuinely enjoy nintendo games and metroid games in particular, and be a real geek. You can have a not sexy Samus costume, chose it only because she's popular, and be a fake geek.

The sexiness of a cosplay is entirely irrelevant to whether or not a person genuinely enjoys gaming

CaptainChip:

Astro:

CaptainChip:

Most of your argument is "they cosplay as sexy characters because like wearing sexy costumes" and "they could be wearing different costumes" and "they're doing it for attention". Basically, your whole argument from what I've read is based on a ton of assumptions. And it's very, very weak.

And still off-topic.

From what you've read meaning only part of my argument because I've addressed what you brought up?

How is discussing a subset of girls feigning an interest in gaming in order to reap attention irrelevant to the topic?

Oh, also, "Because they are dressing up as sexy characters in a convention usually filled with men, it's because they want attention!" Still weak.

And still irrelevant because sexy cosplayers =/= fake geek girls. This is what I'm hammering on. You can still have a sexy Samus costume, genuinely enjoy nintendo games and metroid games in particular, and be a real geek. You can have a not sexy mario costume, chose it only because he's popular, and be a fake geek.

The sexiness of a cosplay is entirely irrelevant to whether or not a person genuinely enjoys gaming

Why would anyone cosplay if not for attention? The entire issue with scantily clad cosplay is that it's the wrong kind of attention, but there can be no question of intent.

I'm not disputing that, it just doesn't make what I'm saying off-topic. Maybe what you're saying would be valid if it were never the case that someone is dressing up in a revealing gaming-related costume and if that weren't doing so they would still be at a gaming convention, but it's self-evident that this is not the case. The fact that there are exceptions, however large, to the full intentions of someone dressing up in a revealing costume doesn't make dressing up in a revealing costume irrelevant to trying to get attention.

It isn't irrelevant to whether someone genuinely enjoys gaming at all, it denotes motivation. You can assume that someone likes gaming if they're dressing up like Mad Moxxi, but they might not really give a shit because revealing cosplay fulfills a desire in itself and it's peripheral to gaming. You can assume someone likes gaming if they're playing a lot of videogames, looking at and talking about gaming-related shit, because they're expressing a direct interest in gaming.

For some of them it's positive and NEGATIVE easy attention they crave
They want to get idiots to prove some sort of point for them regardless of whether or not that point is grounded in reality
They want to made out as the victim
and if I didn't care about most of these 'fake gamer girls', i just don't approve of the type I mentioned above
I mean thank Jim there are not that many of them but they make a lot of waves over the net

They would not be a big deal if people didn't make it one
People don't like to belong to a crowd they think is easily duped but welcome to the entire frigging world then
They don't like the idea of others getting free stuff because of gender or multiplayer games being brought to a standstill so half of the morons playing can faun over this one of an entire field of special little flowers
I do not regard myself as having a problem with women, I was brought up with my sisters and apparently I'm the women's favorite least sleazy friend in the friend zone yay for me
A part of me however internally screams whenever I see images of girls trying to look sexy chewing on a controller or in piles of cds not in their cases that amounts to HOW DARE YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO EXIST

Now that socially awkward hot girl is a thing (see everything Zoey Deschanel does), there's a lot of mimics flocking to the center of what still is considered socially awkward e.g nerds
Oh and girls are not the only ones, a lot of attention is being spread to skinny awkward guys in hipster jeans. OMG it's like a global conspiracy to emancipate the entire male populace (only half sarcastic)

CaptainChip:
Just because a cosplayer chose a sexy costume does not mean s/he's not a fan of the show.

doesn't matter if they are a fan or not. Once you move from consumer to sexual commodity, it doesn't matter how much of a fan you are, you are just there for the attention. Its kind of like if we had a sports event delayed due to a streaker. No one sits around justifying her actions by saying "oh well, she really is a fan of the sport."

It doesn't matter if she's a fan or not, when her design choices makes it abundantly clear that its just about being a sexual commodity.

CaptainChip:
And even if they picked a sexy costume, does that mean they're doing it for attention? No! Has it NEVER occurred to you that maybe, just maybe, they really like the character?

Mate, all cosplay, without fail is for attention. These cosplayers don't walk the dog, od the dishes, or go play in the park in these costumes mate. It is done specifically to garner attention. Thats not bad in and of itself, but when it is done specifcally to be a sexual commodity, regardless of ones love for a franchise, one still needs to get a reality check.

If you go to con wearing two inches of material, the predominate thought in your mind is not "how much will my fellow geeks love me for my mind & encylopediac knowledge of all things geeky."

So lets put a cap on this bullshit already. Women who go to cons dressed in barely there costume are not doing it for love of a franchise: They are doing it for the attention they can garner by looking like a sexual commodity. something you'd have gathered had you read any of the previous 20 pages.

matthew_lane:

Strangely these kinds of women are the sorts women will deny exist, but when they start to impact them they'll become all catty & tear each others eyes out. Then as soon as the cat fighting ends (usually because the new female has been kicked out), will immediately go back to pretending that that kind of woman just doesn't exist... Oh except for that one bitch that got was coming to her *insert z snap here* She was obviously a unique individual & no other woman would ever act like her.

It really is strange seeing how same group preference can warp our perception of others.

No, I've yet to meet any gamer, male or female, that denies that wastes of skin like the ones you described exist. We know they do. I've had to show at least 4 of them the door for the garbage they pulled. It's when people like you then automatically presume that merely having XX chromosomes is enough of a similarity to warrant expulsion from the hobby that I get pissy...

Chemical Alia:
All this thread has succeeded in is making me hate nerds and nerd culture even more than I usually do. For such a "maligned" group ofpeople, some of you sure seem to have an unusual interest in judging others.

Not to mention a downright baffling qualification process.

Only one person here has given any kind of actual criteria to be met before one can call themselves a "gamer", and fuck, even my experience wasn't up to snuff because I hadn't played any of the MMO's I've played since their Alpha release.

matthew_lane:
No one is geek checking 15 year old girls on the basis of gender,

Ignored Fluoexetine's posts, did you? Ignored that we were told to "get off of his cloud" because we females had "higher clouds" to occupy?

Thats not elitist, its just not pandering to people who actually have no real interest or knowledge of what we are talking about.

Define "have no real interest or knowledge" because according to the one person who actually had the stones to set a criteria, I have no real interest or knowledge because I haven't played any MMO's before their Beta releases.

Swap out higher order mathematics for prefered geeky time-sink & you've got the current situation.

Mathematics has a far better defined criteria than gaming and especially geeky time-sinks.

GunsmithKitten:
It's when people like you then automatically presume that merely having XX chromosomes is enough of a similarity to warrant expulsion from the hobby that I get pissy...

Were exactly did i presume this? I'm sorry, but what you just did was an appeal to motive & i don't buy it.

GunsmithKitten:

matthew_lane:
No one is geek checking 15 year old girls on the basis of gender,

Ignored Fluoexetine's posts, did you? Ignored that we were told to "get off of his cloud" because we females had "higher clouds" to occupy?

[/quote]

No, i'm not ignoring it, i'm choosing to not let it phase me, since i've already said 12 times now "there are wankers on both sides of the gender divide." I swear i've said that so often in this conversation, that i'm thinking about having t-shirts made.

GunsmithKitten:
Define "have no real interest or knowledge" because according to the one person who actually had the stones to set a criteria, I have no real interest or knowledge because I haven't played any MMO's before their Beta releases.

I'm sorry, but double bullshit Gunsmith. Do not try to make a slippery slope argument. How would not having played a beta of a game stop you from having played the public edition of the game?

Those two things don't even correltae, let alone causate.

GunsmithKitten:
Mathematics has a far better defined criteria than gaming and especially geeky time-sinks.

Not really it isn't. There is a level of expertise with anything, gamings no different. For example if i'm discussing the shittyness of post level 30 DCUO grinding & someone who has just played the tutorial level comes up & tells me i'm wrong about the quality of the post level 30 content, unless they have some other very outstanding experience with the content (developer, beta-tester, sleeping with the developer, etc), then there opinion doesn't really matter: Since there opinion is unfounded.

This is the thing, awareness of something geeky is not the same thing as enthusiasm & indepth knowledge of something geeky. I'm aware of fashion, it doesn't mean i know frack all about the fashion industry though.

Wow... This thread has been um interesting to say the least.

Firstly on the topic of girls putting that they're a girl in their steam profile, or letting people know they're a girl. At the fast food joint I work at I'm on the front counter. Before I started working there every guy wanted to work in the back and it eventually led to only guys working out the back and only girls working at the front and when I first started the managers would constantly refer to everyone out the front as girls as it was the norm. It annoyed me to no end and after a few days of it I started to bring attention to myself every time a manager would say it and they would apologize and after a while they all no longer say it when I'm there in fact we even started getting more guys working with me now. This is the same in principle, people just assume they're guys due to this kind of mentality and they're simply letting people know that they are girls because they don't want to be referred to as guys.

As for attention seekers, they're everywhere. I've seen both guys and girls be attention seekers with all sorts of hobbies and in various groups. This isn't some sort of unique thing to gaming or whatever. It doesn't matter if they're cosplaying in super skimpy clothing or bragging about their muscles or their 2500 WoW arena rating(Note in each of these hobbies there are the two sides, the people who just do it because they find it fun or enjoy doing it, and the people who do it for the attention). If people just learnt to recognize the symptoms and ignored them they wouldn't have a problem. But people feed them, give them attention and they get this stupid narcissistic attitude which then makes them feel entitled to blow people off or whatever.

On the male sexuality thing, you can control yourself. I'm attracted to women, yes I'll check women out but I'm not going to turn into some sort of cave man because a hot girl could possibly be interested in the same things as I am. Nor am I going to get mad if she doesn't want to pay attention to me. Yes it can be frustrating to be rejected, or to think you've found someone who is interested in you and then find out she isn't. But it's how the world works, you just move on and try someone else eventually you'll find someone out there... probably.

Finally, who cares if people label themselves as gamers or not, my dad's played over 3000 hours of counter-strike but if you were to call him a nerd or a hardcore gamer he'd probably tell you to fuck off. There isn't some sort of requirement to be a gamer and the only time what you've played/ how much you've played should matter is when you're trying to put your opinion forth on game design or something. If you're going to argue to me about balance in Dota 2 then you're going to want to tell me how long you've been playing before I start caring about your opinion. But if you're just saying you're a nerd because you enjoy a few games and watch some anime and doctor who I'm not going to care too much, especially if they're willing to try other things related to it.

God I only wanted to make a quick post and ended up writing an essay >.>

Astro:

CaptainChip:

Astro:

From what you've read meaning only part of my argument because I've addressed what you brought up?

How is discussing a subset of girls feigning an interest in gaming in order to reap attention irrelevant to the topic?

Oh, also, "Because they are dressing up as sexy characters in a convention usually filled with men, it's because they want attention!" Still weak.

And still irrelevant because sexy cosplayers =/= fake geek girls. This is what I'm hammering on. You can still have a sexy Samus costume, genuinely enjoy nintendo games and metroid games in particular, and be a real geek. You can have a not sexy mario costume, chose it only because he's popular, and be a fake geek.

The sexiness of a cosplay is entirely irrelevant to whether or not a person genuinely enjoys gaming

Why would anyone cosplay if not for attention?

Fun. It's fun. Getting together with a group of people who like what you like and sometimes are also in costume is fun. Underlined for emphasis on the point of cosplaying. There are whole commmunities devoted to cosplays. And they make cosplays, they get together and have fun.

Tell me, do you think everyone who wears a costume on Halloween is an attention whore?

The entire issue with scantily clad cosplay is that it's the wrong kind of attention, but there can be no question of intent.

YES, there can be. Just because you think all cosplayers are attention whores doesn't make it so.

I'm not disputing that, it just doesn't make what I'm saying off-topic. Maybe what you're saying would be valid if it were never the case that someone is dressing up in a revealing gaming-related costume and if that weren't doing so they would still be at a gaming convention, but it's self-evident that this is not the case. The fact that there are exceptions, however large, to the full intentions of someone dressing up in a revealing costume doesn't make dressing up in a revealing costume irrelevant to trying to get attention.

It isn't irrelevant to whether someone genuinely enjoys gaming at all, it denotes motivation. You can assume that someone likes gaming if they're dressing up like Mad Moxxi, but they might not really give a shit because revealing cosplay fulfills a desire in itself and it's peripheral to gaming. You can assume someone likes gaming if they're playing a lot of videogames, looking at and talking about gaming-related shit, because they're expressing a direct interest in gaming.[/quote]

But it IS. It is irrelevant.. If they like attention, that's COMPLETELY irrelevant to whether or not they enjoy playing games. Your whole logic is "cosplayers are attention whores" and "geek girls are attention whores" therefore, "cosplayers are fake geek girls". It's really faulty.

matthew_lane:

CaptainChip:
Just because a cosplayer chose a sexy costume does not mean s/he's not a fan of the show.

doesn't matter if they are a fan or not. Once you move from consumer to sexual commodity, it doesn't matter how much of a fan you are, you are just there for the attention. Its kind of like if we had a sports event delayed due to a streaker. No one sits around justifying her actions by saying "oh well, she really is a fan of the sport."

It doesn't matter if she's a fan or not, when her design choices makes it abundantly clear that its just about being a sexual commodity.

Usually whenever I see a streaker, they are usually male, and usually, they don't do it because "LOOK AT HOW SEXY I AM". They because they find it fun/funny. And because they're drunk also.

CaptainChip:
And even if they picked a sexy costume, does that mean they're doing it for attention? No! Has it NEVER occurred to you that maybe, just maybe, they really like the character?

Mate, all cosplay, without fail is for attention. These cosplayers don't walk the dog, od the dishes, or go play in the park in these costumes mate. It is done specifically to garner attention. Thats not bad in and of itself, but when it is done specifcally to be a sexual commodity, regardless of ones love for a franchise, one still needs to get a reality check.

If you go to con wearing two inches of material, the predominate thought in your mind is not "how much will my fellow geeks love me for my mind & encylopediac knowledge of all things geeky."

So lets put a cap on this bullshit already. Women who go to cons dressed in barely there costume are not doing it for love of a franchise: They are doing it for the attention they can garner by looking like a sexual commodity. something you'd have gathered had you read any of the previous 20 pages.

Tell me sir, have you ever cosplayed? Have you ever been part of a cosplay group or talked with cosplayers?

It's because it's fun. Plain and simple fun. That's all there is to it. I've cosplayed many a time, and it's fun.

EDIT: Also, as I said in a previous post: "cosplayers are attention whores" and "fake geeks are attention whores" does not mean "cosplayers are fake geeks". This conversation is still irrelevant to the topic.

Claiming there's no such thing as 'fake' nerd girls only proves you haven't experienced the phenomenon. For the purposes of this, I'm going to leave cosplayers who don't really care about anything except costumery out of the equation. Fake nerd girls *do* exist, and they are a much sadder indictment of male gamers that they prey on than they are of female anything.
As it happens, I get mixed up in a lot of nerdy stuff- liked tabletop miniature wargaming and pen and paper roleplaying. As it also happens, I have female friends who happen to enjoy, or have a varying level of interest, in both of those hobbies. Said female acquaintances also acknowledge the existence of these 'fake nerd girls'. You see, it is unfortunately true to the stereotype that the average (male) roleplayer/tabletop gamer is perhaps not the most socially well adjusted of people,and there is a tendency towards a body type that resembles some sort of human cocoon for a burger-king butterfly. Female contact, especially friendly, approving, and affectionate female contact, massages the tormented psyche of these less fortunate gamers, who rarely have the opportunity to enjoy the company of women. Thus, some females, perhaps ones who are not the most popular in other places, can cultivate a harem of attention-providing schlubs by simply talking to them while wearing a Gears of War tshirt or whatever.

In the end,it bothers me (slightly) that these nerds allow themselves to be manipulated so easily, more than anything. It is also mildly irritating to hear someone claim how they're "like, sooooooo into C'thulhu," in the same way people laughing uproariously and screaming "the cake is a lie!" were a few years back, when you knew they had never ever played Portal and didn't understand what the sentence even meant. I'm not gonna lose sleep over it. However, Jim's asanine rant (never change, Mr Sterling) merely blames men for imagining the entire thing. No one likes to see their "scene" degraded into a desperate whoring for attention. If the internet hated on guys pretending they had read Wilde, Voltaire, Nietzsche, or whatever in a desperate attempt to get attention from literary-minded women, no one would bat an eyelid- but because this view targets women, who have already have enough negative and crappy aspects of nerd-dom to deal with, it's dismissed out of hand.

The thing is, fake nerd girls do contribute to the issues that are holding back gaming- they objectify themselves, and revel in simple attention whoring. While no doubt a bunch of the people hating on them on the internet are simply the angry misogynists who can't connect with women themselves, I do think it's a thing that needs to be confronted and dealt with, until we, as a subculture, grow the fuck up.
And I left cosplay out of it entirely.
Thank you for reading, if you bothered.

"Fun. It's fun. Getting together with a group of people who like what you like and sometimes are also in costume is fun. Underlined for emphasis on the point of cosplaying. There are whole commmunities devoted to cosplays. And they make cosplays, they get together and have fun.

Tell me, do you think everyone who wears a costume on Halloween is an attention whore?

YES, there can be. Just because you think all cosplayers are attention whores doesn't make it so.

But it IS. It is irrelevant.. If they like attention, that's COMPLETELY irrelevant to whether or not they enjoy playing games. Your whole logic is "cosplayers are attention whores" and "geek girls are attention whores" therefore, "cosplayers are attention whores". It's really faulty."

_______________________________________________________________________________________________

I don't think it being fun makes a difference.

If a girl is wearing a scantily clad costume on Halloween, yes, she is seeking attention. It's less contemptible because of the context, however, obviously.

No, that is not my "whole logic" at all. No where have I stated that it's impossible to be genuinely passionate about gaming and wear a provocative costume. You, on the other hand, seem to be trying to argue that because it's a possibility that you aren't trying to draw sexual attention to yourself by wearing a Mad Moxxi costume, that must mean no-one ever does, so it's illegitimate to question the intent of any person in cosplay. The issue with your argument is that it requires you to ignore blatantly attention-seeking behavior and the acute lack of non-sexualized female cosplay.

GunsmithKitten:

Chemical Alia:
All this thread has succeeded in is making me hate nerds and nerd culture even more than I usually do. For such a "maligned" group ofpeople, some of you sure seem to have an unusual interest in judging others.

Not to mention a downright baffling qualification process.

Only one person here has given any kind of actual criteria to be met before one can call themselves a "gamer", and fuck, even my experience wasn't up to snuff because I hadn't played any of the MMO's I've played since their Alpha release.

A true gamer will have beat Ecco the Dolphin 1 and 2 between the years of 1992 and 1996, without the aid of Game Genie or level select. <10 trilobite deaths, no throwing of the controller.

I've never played an MMO, nor do I ever care to, so maybe I can just construct my own rigid set of criteria someone has to meet for me to take them seriously as a video game hobbyist.

But yeah, I've seen this kind of attitude in other areas, particularly art, and it's just as sad. I think there was even some dude in this thread somewhere saying the same thing about how amateur photographers were defiling the art form he does for a living. How many artists started off with just a casual interest in a medium, just messing around in Photoshop, drawing shitty Sonic the Hedgehog fanart, making bad Steam Workshop 3d models, or taking crappy amateur photos? Probably most of them! That's not to say that all crap beginner artists will ever become professional, or even want to, but having a casual interest often leads into improving, learning, and doing much greater things.

I could take a shitty and elitist attitude and hate on everyone who isn't on the same level of experience as me, or I could encourage and help people who want to learn skills and show a bit of interest. And honestly, if they have no desire to become professional and simply enjoy the hobby at a lower skill level, who is to say that they're wrong in that? If you're so insecure your profession that you think that amateurs are bringing down the art form, then you probably never should have gotten into it in the first place. And if you're having trouble competing with them, then it's probably more of a personal problem.

Because fake is bad. Be it fake gamer girls, fake tits or fake cheese.

matthew_lane:

Were exactly did i presume this? I'm sorry, but what you just did was an appeal to motive & i don't buy it.

Talk about the pot calling the kettle black there, mister "Anyone who cosplays is just wanting sexual based attention". Yea, baby, because NOTHING says "my milkshakes bring all the geeks to the yard" like slapping on faux tactical vests and BDU's as "STARS: Southwest Virginia Unit". Yea, I was totally wearing that at Technicon to get some hot geek wiener, wasn't I?

No, i'm not ignoring it, i'm choosing to not let it phase me, since i've already said 12 times now "there are wankers on both sides of the gender divide." I swear i've said that so often in this conversation, that i'm thinking about having t-shirts made.

You ignored it, yet you ignore it. Stop with the MC Escher argument style, I mean it. You try arguing like a zen koan one more time, and we're through.

I'm sorry, but double bullshit Gunsmith. Do not try to make a slippery slope argument. How would not having played a beta of a game stop you from having played the public edition of the game?

Those two things don't even correltae, let alone causate.

DOn't talk to ME, jack, I didn't set the rule.

GunsmithKitten:
Mathematics has a far better defined criteria than gaming and especially geeky time-sinks.

Not really it isn't. There is a level of expertise with anything, gamings no different. For example if i'm discussing the shittyness of post level 30 DCUO grinding & someone who has just played the tutorial level comes up & tells me i'm wrong about the quality of the post level 30 content, unless they have some other very outstanding experience with the content (developer, beta-tester, sleeping with the developer, etc), then there opinion doesn't really matter: Since there opinion is unfounded.

This is the thing, awareness of something geeky is not the same thing as enthusiasm & indepth knowledge of something geeky. I'm aware of fashion, it doesn't mean i know frack all about the fashion industry though.

So be a part of the solution here; propose to me a list of minimal criteria so I can submit it to my congressman and demand that liscensure be required before someone can legally call themselves a nerd/geek/gamer. We do it for doctors, legal personnel, military, ect, after all....

Okay, one thing I don't get. I really don't get why it went this way and how it came to be:

I thought we are talking about fake nerd girls (or whatever it is). How do cosplayer play a role in it? Even if they are not gamer - the topic was never about those. It was about nerd girls. And sorry, someone who spends a lot of time and money into a costume to wear it on a convention with a nerdy theme (gaming cons, comic cons and whatever) is by extension a nerd.

Knowledge about the figure in question is irrelevant. I know people who know their stuff but when it comes to cosplay they mostly cosplay what they thing looks nice and cool - they try to make an accurate representation and roll with it.

Nerd - spending a lot of time with non-mainstream activities.

So what is so bad about cosplayer? How are they 'fake nerd girls'?

GunsmithKitten:

So be a part of the solution here; propose to me a list of minimal criteria so I can submit it to my congressman and demand that liscensure be required before someone can legally call themselves a nerd/geek/gamer. We do it for doctors, legal personnel, military, ect, after all....

Just as a matter of personal reference I've always thought of geeks are to nerds what foodies are to kitchens. The difference between someone enjoying something for what it is, and them being driven to take some active role, no matter how slight or minor in the creative process.

But that's just my personal lexicon. Nobody else has to use it.

Paradoxrifts:

GunsmithKitten:

So be a part of the solution here; propose to me a list of minimal criteria so I can submit it to my congressman and demand that liscensure be required before someone can legally call themselves a nerd/geek/gamer. We do it for doctors, legal personnel, military, ect, after all....

Just as a matter of personal reference I've always thought of geeks are to nerds what foodies are to kitchens. The difference between someone enjoying something for what it is, and them being driven to take some active role, no matter how slight or minor in the creative process.

But that's just my personal lexicon. Nobody else has to use it.

The thing is that beyond some personal requirements there is no official entry barrier. Higher mathematics have entry barriers by nature (as in, educational degrees), or any group that can experience negative consequences if there are frauds involved (groups you can only be part of if you have a certain degree).

Gaming is none of those. All those 'fake' yells burst when we apply reality towards it: There is no definition as to when someone is officially a gamer. The one 'joke' that someone threw here would dismiss about everyone (owned 5 consoles, partaken in 3 alphas of MMORPGs and such).
There is no minimum expertise that someone has to know to be a gamer. If someone plays video games he is a gamer. Be it the 30-60 minutes a day in CoD or the mom who only plays on facebook - they are gaming and thus they are gamer.

Gamer - A person who plays a game or games, typically a participant in a computer or role-playing game.

for nihilists, you guys never shut up.

I get it. Fake people suck, elitism sucks.

Moving on.

I really think a lot of people need to ask this one question: "So what?" Some girls like to pretend they are geeks...so what? Some men find that highly uncomfortable...so what? Sometimes I find people dressed in revealing outfits to be very funny...and again so what?

I have encountered tons of things I've liked and disliked, but it doesn't give me free range to tell others how to behave, if they are acting in a manner that is legal.

This argument seems even sillier than some. Every human is somewhat "fake." That's not a bad thing. Example: My husband updates me on his LoL Elo everyday. I don't care, he knows I don't care, and yet everyday I smile and say something along the lines of, "That's great, hun!" It makes him happy, and costs me nothing to smile. In return, when I prattle on about a book I just read, he pretends to listen even though I know he isn't.

Or for example, Sean, Seth, Tim, my Mom and I, all went to see the movie Troy because we heard that Brad Pitts naked bum was on screen. Now most of the people in the theater went to see the movie because of different assets(see what I did there :p), but it doesn't change the fact that we all went to see it.

To bring it full circle, if certain women actually exist, that want to pretend they are into geeky things and some men want to ogle/pay attention to those women, have at it. Her reason for wanting to be a geek are her own, and he can talk to whoever he wishes. I don't want anything to do with it, but that's my choice...so what?

TheKasp:
Gaming is none of those. All those 'fake' yells burst when we apply reality towards it: There is no definition as to when someone is officially a gamer. The one 'joke' that someone threw here would dismiss about everyone (owned 5 consoles, partaken in 3 alphas of MMORPGs and such).
There is no minimum expertise that someone has to know to be a gamer. If someone plays video games he is a gamer. Be it the 30-60 minutes a day in CoD or the mom who only plays on facebook - they are gaming and thus they are gamer.

Gamer - A person who plays a game or games, typically a participant in a computer or role-playing game.

To use another analogy you will always get the rough outdoor types who deliberately hike out into the middle of the wilderness to camp underneath a canopy of stars devoid of light pollution, who will look down their noses at people whose idea of camping involves driving from campsite to campsite in their camper-vans.

And most anyone who does not own a camper-van will agree that so far as campers go, those that carry their own swag are more authentic 'campers' than those who don't.

sammysoso:
When gamers wonder why we're not taken seriously? Why we're still held at a distance by the mainstream media?

Things like this.

This. A million times this. It's really sad to see that the stereotypical image of the gamer as a socially retarded, childish loser isn't that far off in many cases.

I also find it pretty funny that I've never been grilled on the subject of whether or not I'm a "true gamer". I'm a reasonably attractive, tall, physically active 22 year old man who is very socially capable. Funny how no one ever gives me any shit about being a poser.

I hate when people cry sexism, but "SEXISM!"

CaptainChip:
Tell me sir, have you ever cosplayed? Have you ever been part of a cosplay group or talked with cosplayers?

It's because it's fun. Plain and simple fun. That's all there is to it. I've cosplayed many a time, and it's fun.

Of course it is. Being the center o0f attention is fun. Which is why people do it.

CaptainChip:
EDIT: Also, as I said in a previous post: "cosplayers are attention whores" and "fake geeks are attention whores" does not mean "cosplayers are fake geeks".

Which would meamn that you are concurring with what i've already said. I swear its like people can't read.

GunsmithKitten:

matthew_lane:

Were exactly did i presume this? I'm sorry, but what you just did was an appeal to motive & i don't buy it.

Talk about the pot calling the kettle black there, mister "Anyone who cosplays is just wanting sexual based attention".

Gunsmith, two things.
1. This still doesn't show your presumption, even if your statement were true
2. Do not try to make up quotes. Show me where i have EVER used that quote.

When you have to straight up lie to mkae your case there is a very good chance you are talking complete shit.

I hate too say it, but I don't think this is a conversation worth having.

The only kind of person I can imagine believing in "Fake nerd girls" would be the kind of elitist snob who takes their opinion as fact. These people can not be persuaded, and should not be entertained. They are the Wesboro baptist church of the nerd community and giving them a voice could only ever serve to detour women from enjoying our medium, as they already do.

I can imagine a girl being mistaken for a "Fake nerd". Maybe she is just now getting into video-games, comic books, what ever. She doesn't know all that much but she is learning. None of up slid down the slime chute with the solution to every dungeon in LOZ:OoT memorized. Let's face it, when we are younger games definitely appeared to be a "boy" thing. (This may be less true, or completely untrue today). While many women enjoyed them, some may be getting into them later. This is true for men as well.

Anytime you hear the phrase "Fake Nerd Girl" applied to a women on the internet, or in that bright and scary real world. Stand up for her, show her that not all of us are raging morons. Discuss the sect of nerdyness she likes with her, and even if her knowledge is less than yours, treat her as you would any guy who didn't know of a game you really like "Oh dude, you MUST play Earth Defense Force."

God forbid we be inclusive, and approachable to new comers.

 Pages PREV 1 . . . 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 NEXT

Reply to Thread

Log in or Register to Comment
Have an account? Login below:
With Facebook:Login With Facebook
or
Username:  
Password:  
  
Not registered? To sign up for an account with The Escapist:
Register With Facebook
Register With Facebook
or
Registered for a free account here