Fake Geek Girls

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Agente L:
So, I was a bit away from all the gamer drama last month or so, what's up with this fake geek girl thingy? I know this isn't exactly new, but what happened lately that suddenly the whole bee nest is out? Did kotaku write an article or it or something

Controversy drives page hits, drives ad revenue, drives the website.

Not that any major journalism hub seems to have gotten the issue. It has very little to do with someone entirely versed in every facet of nerd-dom, and much more with women who are just riding on the coat tails of it for no clear reason. It's about the women (and men, though its a smaller problem amongst males) who can't pass absurdly low bars for the fan groups they profess to be a part of such as being able to identify the character they're cosplaying, the IP it / they are from, ect.

Was the close proximity between this and the Jimquisition about this topic purely coincidental or planned?

Have I missed something where this topic has suddenly exploded into the spotlight of the internet hate machine recently?

acosn:

Agente L:
So, I was a bit away from all the gamer drama last month or so, what's up with this fake geek girl thingy? I know this isn't exactly new, but what happened lately that suddenly the whole bee nest is out? Did kotaku write an article or it or something

Controversy drives page hits, drives ad revenue, drives the website.

Not that any major journalism hub seems to have gotten the issue. It has very little to do with someone entirely versed in every facet of nerd-dom, and much more with women who are just riding on the coat tails of it for no clear reason. It's about the women (and men, though its a smaller problem amongst males) who can't pass absurdly low bars for the fan groups they profess to be a part of such as being able to identify the character they're cosplaying, the IP it / they are from, ect.

No clear reason? Women have been exploiting men using sexuality, or pretending to like things they like, or a combination of the two, for pretty much the same reasons over literal millenia. Either because they just genuinely like the attention or because they're hired to, usually by men, to promote something (I guess there might also be the more psychotic ones who snare men into fathering children, they're few and far between and we don't need to bring them into the discussion). Nerd-dom and gaming culture aren't special in this regard, they're just the newest and most popular things at the moment.

Add to that the ever-present portion of young people who get into what their friends are into just to fit in, female or male, even if it's not really their thing. I can understand taking issue with the scorn that gets dished out to these people by pathetic elitists with nothing else going on, but that doesn't make them not real.

I'm not trying to stir up paranoia, and it must be clearly understood that it is a small portion of the female population that acts this way, and I do believe the majority of girls who are nerdy are geniuine, but yeah, the Escapist's sudden pretension (that the notion fake nerd girls even exist is ridiculous) does seem a bit simple, forced, and sexist to men.

It is unfair that girls have to prove themselves in field where guys don't, but that's an unfairness that exists everywhere in our society. I don't defend it one bit, but to dissassemble it, you've gotta do better than just repeating "there's no excuse", because some guys will always feel they have reason to be paranoid of women, even if they don't, and some women will always try to manipulate men because of their offensive assumptions, even if it isn't that many of them. They perpetuate each other... like some kind of spiral... that points downward...

That being said, I probably should have ranted on Jim's video rather than here. I enjoyed the comic. Hopefully the story continues and escalates to dizzying heights.

P.S. To the moderater who gave a warning to "Captain Pancake"... awe come on. I'm calling you out, that comment was perfectly cromulant. Is there just a word minimum? Did you not read the comic? Do you not know who Ben Reilly is? (that last one would be an honest mistake, we won't judge)

On one hand, I know plenty of moderate-to-attractive girls who cosplay and go to cons.

On the other hand, I just saw a serious offer from some small game maker looking to hire an 'attractive female spokesperson, must be familiar with some games and game terminology.' It wasn't a sex game or even an eye candy game, that's literally just hiring someone with tits to hold a controller because you think it'll sell your game.

It's nothing new, just subtly depressing. Someone raging at legit cosplayers is just unhinged though.

Phuctifyno:

acosn:
[quote="Agente L" post="6.394334.16000625"]So, I was a bit away from all the gamer drama last month or so, what's up with this fake geek girl thingy? I know this isn't exactly new, but what happened lately that suddenly the whole bee nest is out? Did kotaku write an article or it or something

P.S. To the moderater who gave a warning to "Captain Pancake"... awe come on. I'm calling you out, that comment was perfectly cromulant. Is there just a word minimum? Did you not read the comic? Do you not know who Ben Reilly is? (that last one would be an honest mistake, we won't judge)

Relax, Max. The guy got reported because it was a Low Content-Post. You can't just write two words.

As for OT: You know what bothers me about this? It isn't that there are "fake"-"nerds" (and stop using the concept 'nerd' as if it symbolizes something unified. It doesn't. None of you can even define what a 'nerd' is and isn't. There aren't Standardized Tests, damnit.) but that some people enjoy attention, and can get it by just flashing some skin. Guys are easy to manipulate.
So no, I don't mind that you don't know any Pokémon, you haven't watched Stargate or played any Fallout. But I mind that you desperately need to dress up in a specific fashion to manipulate men that you clearly have no interest in, just so you can feel better.
And you know what? I see your kind at the clubs all the time. This isn't a "nerd" thing. This is exactly the same thing women do all the time (and some men). Talk to someone, get free drinks, ignore the buyer. So yes, I do mind that you are an asshole.
I also mind that people are fucking gullible enough to fall for it.

So no matter if you actually "know" your supposed area of "expertise", be it "nerd" or whatever, please don't enter a convention (or any establishment) just to manipulate suckers into paying you attention (and other things), no matter what sex you are.
However, if you just want to show up, and enjoy people looking at you, that's fine. Just don't lead them on.

Realitycrash:

Phuctifyno:

acosn:
[quote="Agente L" post="6.394334.16000625"]So, I was a bit away from all the gamer drama last month or so, what's up with this fake geek girl thingy? I know this isn't exactly new, but what happened lately that suddenly the whole bee nest is out? Did kotaku write an article or it or something

P.S. To the moderater who gave a warning to "Captain Pancake"... awe come on. I'm calling you out, that comment was perfectly cromulant. Is there just a word minimum? Did you not read the comic? Do you not know who Ben Reilly is? (that last one would be an honest mistake, we won't judge)

Relax, Max. The guy got reported because it was a Low Content-Post. You can't just write two words.

As for OT: You know what bothers me about this? It isn't that there are "fake"-"nerds" (and stop using the concept 'nerd' as if it symbolizes something unified. It doesn't. None of you can even define what a 'nerd' is and isn't. There aren't Standardized Tests, damnit.) but that some people enjoy attention, and can get it by just flashing some skin. Guys are easy to manipulate.
So no, I don't mind that you don't know any Pokémon, you haven't watched Stargate or played any Fallout. But I mind that you desperately need to dress up in a specific fashion to manipulate men that you clearly have no interest in, just so you can feel better.
And you know what? I see your kind at the clubs all the time. This isn't a "nerd" thing. This is exactly the same thing women do all the time (and some men). Talk to someone, get free drinks, ignore the buyer. So yes, I do mind that you are an asshole.
I also mind that people are fucking gullible enough to fall for it.

So no matter if you actually "know" your supposed area of "expertise", be it "nerd" or whatever, please don't enter a convention (or any establishment) just to manipulate suckers into paying you attention (and other things), no matter what sex you are.
However, if you just want to show up, and enjoy people looking at you, that's fine. Just don't lead them on.

As far as people who just want attention, that doesn't bother me too much. Like most guys, I'm annoyed when my hormones are abused, but they can have my attention if they earn it. For example, a good cosplayer is a good cosplayer, regardless of motivation.

Now, "nerds" not defining something unified, I'll agree with you, but try telling that to marketing departments. It's a bonafied, mostly male, demographic. Thus, game controller + boobies = appropriate and effective advertisement strategy. Sometimes I hate this planet, too. Most of the time I just ignore it, but it does get on my nerves when I see good franchises that don't even need sexualization (*cough*Hitman*cough*) fall back on it.

As for Captain Pancake, oh I'm not mad, I don't even know the guy... I guess a few more words could have helped his case... but Ben Reilly IS the clone who took Peter Parker's place... so it was kinda relevent. Maybe I'm spending too much time over at AV Club, where brevity and non sequitur is the standard.

why fake nerd girl thing even a problem? in fact if this is even a "problem" by talking about them you make it worst. i was not even aware this "problem" existed until jim sterling brought it up
they are people out there who are being posers who want attention; they exist in every group. if you don't give them any special attention then they go away.

there is the solution to this so called "problem".

also i can't answer that spider man question because i don't read comics. i mainly sick to playing video games and the once in while i will watching or read a anime/cartoon/manga

Realitycrash:
(and stop using the concept 'nerd' as if it symbolizes something unified. It doesn't. None of you can even define what a 'nerd' is and isn't. There aren't Standardized Tests, damnit.)

Nerd (n)
an unstylish, unattractive, or socially inept person; especially : one slavishly devoted to intellectual or academic pursuits <computer nerds>

From Merriam Webster. HAH! I have defeated you!

saintdane05:

Realitycrash:
(and stop using the concept 'nerd' as if it symbolizes something unified. It doesn't. None of you can even define what a 'nerd' is and isn't. There aren't Standardized Tests, damnit.)

Nerd (n)
an unstylish, unattractive, or socially inept person; especially : one slavishly devoted to intellectual or academic pursuits <computer nerds>

From Merriam Webster. HAH! I have defeated you!

By that definition, one who spends all his money and all his time on oh-let-say Comic Books but aren't unstylish, unattractive or socially inept, aren't a nerd either.

...

Yeah.

What no one got so far is that the correct answer is THERE IS NO SUCH THING DO NOT MENTION SPIDERMAN CLONES AGAIN.

obviously they are fake.

everyone knows that mami uses muskets, not pistols.

Realitycrash:

saintdane05:

Realitycrash:
(and stop using the concept 'nerd' as if it symbolizes something unified. It doesn't. None of you can even define what a 'nerd' is and isn't. There aren't Standardized Tests, damnit.)

Nerd (n)
an unstylish, unattractive, or socially inept person; especially : one slavishly devoted to intellectual or academic pursuits <computer nerds>

From Merriam Webster. HAH! I have defeated you!

By that definition, one who spends all his money and all his time on oh-let-say Comic Books but aren't unstylish, unattractive or socially inept, aren't a nerd either.

...

Yeah.

and vs. or, it makes a huge difference.

I think that ultimately the notion that people think that "Fake nerd girls" exist goes to show how vain they are. I see no reason to assume that someone who is at a convention, in cosplay or otherwise, is there purely for attention and not out of any love for any particular geek franchise.

It's pretty preposterous to assume that a girl would go through the effort to do research on a geekdom and create or buy a costume to wear to a convention ~just~ to get attention, if not "prey" on male geeks. If a girl wants attention and/or an easy lay then there are far easier routes to take than trying to worm your way into apparently one of the harshest self scrutinising subcultures known to man. So to whoever thinks that fake geek girls are a real thing: Please stop thinking you're so awesome that a random girl would go through all that effort just to get your attention.

Pedro The Hutt:
I think that ultimately the notion that people think that "Fake nerd girls" exist goes to show how vain they are. I see no reason to assume that someone who is at a convention, in cosplay or otherwise, is there purely for attention and not out of any love for any particular geek franchise.

It's pretty preposterous to assume that a girl would go through the effort to do research on a geekdom and create or buy a costume to wear to a convention ~just~ to get attention, if not "prey" on male geeks. If a girl wants attention and/or an easy lay then there are far easier routes to take than trying to worm your way into apparently one of the harshest self scrutinising subcultures known to man. So to whoever thinks that fake geek girls are a real thing: Please stop thinking you're so awesome that a random girl would go through all that effort just to get your attention.

You win this particular thread I think. Really, the entire problem with the "fake geek girls"-myth is that it insults two groups of people and then goes on to paint out one of them as incredibly attractive and awesome for no real reason. I mean the components of the myth itself is that:
1. Girls pretend to be interested in "geeky"-stuff/does cosplay for cons, but only does this because they are desperately seeking attention (supposedly of the sexualized nature) from the men who like the geeky-stuff.
2. Men who are into the geeky stuff are so shallow/socially inept/lovelorn that they will immediately fall for the girls ruse and go on to give them undue amounts of attention because of their cosplay/faked interest for geeky stuff.
3. The girls do this because geeky men supposedly hold some kind of special awesome that these girls want.

What I think is more likely here is that the average "girl geek", just like the average "guy geek", likes a subset of the geeky stuff and follows it with some degree of interest and passion. This might mean that they read every number of Spiderman or owns every Super Mario game ever released or collect Nintendo merchandise, but they are also fairly uninterested in the deeper discussions about X-men continuity or Nintendo's role in the game's crash of the 80's. If someone with a burning passion goes on to try and discuss something obscure, like how the Dark Phoenix arc altered the storytelling paradigm in subsequent X-men comics, with these people of course they'll just shrug and walk away. Doesn't mean they aren't interested in the same stuff as the rest of the con goers, just that they don't share your burning enthusiasm for some specific things.

As a good example I'd take my girlfriend: She plays a lot of Portal, Little Big Planet and Binding of Isaac. We occasionally play Borderlands and Left 4 Dead together and some other games and she owns several gaming themed shirts that she wears frequently. So she certainly qualifies as a gamer, but she doesn't really care much for talking about game mechanics or game developers or the e-sport scene. That her passion for gaming is less intense then mine doesn't make her passion any less real, but it makes anyone calling her a fake a pretty big asshole.

What I find most boggling about this is how distorted this is without even going through two people's worth of communication.

THIS IS NOT ABOUT WOMEN. IT NEVER WAS. Anyone who thinks otherwise, who thinks that's the source of 'righteous' rage is making shit up for attention (I believe we call that 'trolling' around these parts).

IF a woman wants attention, and will use these tactics to get it, then good on her. She can have my attention. Mission accomplished. I have been deceived, and I am okay with that.

What I am less okay with is when they are someone else's agent. Again, no malice to the ladies -- I've done far stupider and more demeaning things for a paycheck than 'be pretty in public,' so pot-kettle -- but it's the soulless marketing people who would prey on one particular fantasy of mine -- that I might theoretically share an interest with a beautiful woman -- for just 15 seconds of my attention. That is what I find offensive. Using such tactics for so little return. It strikes me as contemptuous.

If there is one thing I cannot stand, it is being held in contempt by someone I've never met and don't know. It's being ismed. Being ismed sucks. Ask LITERALLY ANYBODY.

Gee, some good looking girls wants to show off her tits and ass dressed as fantasy characters?

I am not sure if I should be offended.

I should stare for a reallly long time.

...

...

...

Don't wait for me to give an answer...this may take a while.

Instead of trying to Isolate them why don't we try to bring them into the fold? by growing the fan base we then collectively have more power, more of what we like is made and by having these future wives and mothers as fans of our nerdy stuff then their kids become fans and the base grows larger and larger.

After doing some research (IE looking at pictures of Mad Moxxi, Power Girl and the recent Catwoman), I've come to the conclusion that there are only 2 sets of people allowed to be offended by fake gamer girls. They are #1 Real Gamer Girls, #2 Gay guys...though to a much lesser extent than #1.

I shall elaborate. For all you straight guys, gamers or not, let me remind you that boobs are awesome. If a woman wants to show them off, who cares what her real motivations are? Seriously! Just look as long as you want, even she gets creeped out. She's flaunting it, go ahead and enjoy it.

As for real gamer girls, your offense is legit. You are trying to enjoy the setting whether it is anime, comics or games and the person or people you are trying to talk to are distracted. Your anger is righteous. You are flirting with that cute gamer guy that you seem to have a good connection with and he gets distracted or pulled away by Susie Big-Boobs who has nothing going for her other than her skin. Again, anger is authorized. But if you RGGs dress similar to FGGs, this whole argument becomes much less valid.

As for gay guys...sort of the same argument as above. But c'mon...boobs are nice! Even if you don't want to sleep with her, at least enjoy the artistry and aesthetics of her form in the costume. Unless the costume is a piece of crap just thrown together to accentuate the boobs, then indignation is permitted.

Everyone else: Man up (woman up...whatever), enjoy the view and STFU.

Mike Fang:
M'kay, scanned the article that was linked to in the dialogue underneath the comic. I think both Harris and Faraci have legit points...and both where they're acting like idiots. First, Harris; it is true, some of these ladies are just looking for attention because they like toying with people. Women like that are bitches because they're treating the men in a given fan community in a way very similar, if not identical, to the way some men treat women as nothing more than meat; both are using the opposite gender to get what they want with no concern for other people's feelings.

However, as Faraci points out, Harris goes so bonkers at points he overlooks the fact that anybody in costume at a convention is looking for attention. It's not fair to just blame the women who go there for it, the guys do it too. Maybe not for the exact same reasons, but it's still an attempt at getting people to stare. The question is whether or not the woman doing it would be appreciative of the people giving her that attention, or if she would just kick any attention-giver to the curb if he tried to get to know her better after she'd had her fun.

But while Faraci correctly points out that just because an attractive woman cosplays or shows up at a convention without a lot of knowledge of comics, movies, etc. the convention's about doesn't immediately mean they're doing something reprehensible, he THEN goes on to do something stupid; he talks about how nerds will overlook the "real" girl nerds and only talk to the attractive women that are "out of their league". Okay, the stupidity here is twofold. First, it insinuates that no "real" girl nerds can be physically attractive; nice job reinforcing the stereotype there. Saying that paints the picture of the nerd girl as always having to be plain looking or downright unattractive.

Second, by supporting the notion that person A can be out of person' B's league based solely on physical appearance, he also perpetuates the very shallowness he just tried to speak against. The concept of people being in leagues based on physical attractiveness utterly negates the idea that things like personality, shared interests, intellect, and the like are more important than looks. It's a concept that suggests no matter how much two people may have in common or may find appealing in one another, as long as one of them is better looking (by the majority-accepted definition of attractiveness) than the other, there can never be anything romantic between them.

I agree with this 100%.

seerbrum:
The fact this subject is even given the slightest of mental energy... is so unbelievably sad I might die from grief... I'm fucking serious.

I don't understand. To put it bluntly. I really don't fucking get it.

Being nerd or a geek, or whatever is not a club. There is no secret handshake, there is/was no meeting. It isn't even a fucking a blimp. It's this word, a term, whether an insult in the past or a term of endearment in its present form. No one owns "Nerd" no one owns "Geek". No one died and made any one person Duke of Geek-dom, So I kind of wish you fucking nerds would shut the fuck up and go back to your geeky life style. Happy.

This is more painful then watching "Punk Culture". where its not punk to be punk anymore... or something or only real punks listen to X,Y,Z and if you don't you aren't punk...
I dunno it just sounds like a bunch of people to lazy to actually contribute anything to the culture, so they invent a problem. A straw man or straw girl, to beat up on. Something to be angry about because cause they have nothing really to angry about.

Listen she's hot, she's at a comic book con. She's there for her own reasons, and if you get your heart broken, well idiot that's on you. Grow up, deal with it, learn that PEOPLE generally suck, and move on with life.

It's no more complicated then that. Everyone every where, has face this problem. Girls who "like" sports but don't know anything, just there to meet guys. Like guys who have no business at the club, don't like dancing, or music, there to meet chicks. People generally use other peoples for whatever they want too and they don't need special circumstances to do it. It's a complete none issue and an insult to geek culture for it to even matter. Wake up idiots, there is no such thing as a "fake nerd". Never will be, get over it, you are not special, or unique.

And I'm ashamed that I wrote that much on the subject.

Don't feel ashamed. People need to stop saying you are a "nerd" or "geek" if you do nerd X, Y, Z or geek X, Y, Z, or call out people who don't know stuff like Lord of the Rings, Star Wars, Star Trek, Mario, Sonic, Batman, Spider-Man, X-Men, Final Fantasy, Kirby, etc. as fake. It is sad, pathetic, and disgusting. People need to stop crying up a river. They need to build a bridge and GET THE FUCK OVER IT. Hell, I've gotten into debates with people who "call out fake nerds" and I changed a good chunk of their view about it.

The Tall Nerd:
we don't really care if you don't know the comic, just when we have our conversations don't expect us to explain to you the series of robins or batman's badass murderous son.
just don't go around promoting batman as the best super hero ever, we just don't like those guys, because that statement to even be made kinda means you actually know anything about batman besides " i saw this cartoon and movie once".

You say that as though Batman is a real person. As someone that has read a lot of the Batman comics, graphic novels, seen most all the movies and cartoons, I would actually say that Batman: TAS is the best version of him and just as legitimate. He's a fictional character, don't get snooty because of the medium someone knows him from. Now if the only thing they saw was nipple Batman, sure, show the person that there's better stuff out there. But there have been good movies and bad comics. Medium doesn't matter. And when someone isn't aware of certain things, don't get angry or shut them out, introduce them!

no is getting snooty with anything
and know one said someone would be shunned

and to an extent, yes you do have to read graphic novels, thats his roots, or you should try. just learning where people come from nothing wrong with that.( and yes i am going to value someones opinion who knows more about the subject matter than you , that's how f*** everything works)

but it is something wrong with you assuming things when i was clearly joking in the beginning

yes of course i had a point, people saying batman is awesome is kinda annoying, its kinda like a small child saying math is easy, sure it is when you haven't been exposed to anything with more depth.

but it was still a joke at its core, that you took way too seriously

Hilarious! All I can say about this is I hope they were using bullets and not knock out darts on the guy at the door ;)

I don't know the answer to that question and I'm a guy.

It's pathetic how people act like you don't have sufficient "nerd cred" if your area of geek culture doesn't match theirs', but with women they're presumed whereas a guy wouldn't ask me without some concrete reason.

John Funk:

Pandora92:
And what happens if someone starts to wonder where the security guy at the door vanished to? Sometimes I really wish Mami wouldn't get so ahead of herself.

I laughed.

I've crept out of my year long internet hiatus to say that I laughed as well.

I was half expecting a random decapitation next strip being ignorant of this whole issue, but I found this strip to be funny regardless.

88chaz88:

Cory Rydell:

FelixG:

Are you seriously unaware that the point of a web comic is to get page views?

And I am pointing out that this is the second item this week that has gone on about fake gamer girls on this website.

We occasionally try and tell jokes too.

It may be possible that Grey saw the Jimquisition episode, thought of something funny, pitched the idea to me, I liked it, then we made a comic about it.

Clearly all The Escapist contributors are in cahoots.

From now you must all remain oblivious to any other content on the site to maintain a clear and unbiased atmosphere. Don't talk to each other either, use smoke signals if you have to.

Also my Captcha was appropriately, "head case".

It's almost as if they all work for the same website!

1. considered entering this community.
2. looked for a topic likely to expose the average stupidity of the dumbest among this community
3. found a nice comic related to the gender issue
4. found the comment section full of pubescent whiteboys and worse
5. ohmyglobwhatisthis
6. ????
7. ...is there no gamer-community at least a little more mature and educated on average?

also, watch and learn about the "fake nerd girl" topic (spoiler: there is no such thing)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0ggK9-TBVY

Nice strip, guys! Though I have to admit, half of my approval stems from my glee at recognizing the Mami cosplay. ^^; ftw, indeed...

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