On Gaymers and Cons Pages PREV 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 . . . 23 NEXT | |
Huh, seems weird to me, though I guess it's cause my gay friend's ego is so big, it filters out all insults, and my bi friends ego is almost as big, but with a brash attitude to go with it. So yeah, if it was nearby, I'd go just out of curiosity as to what all would happen at such a place. And hell, I may even find a ladyfriend who's bi and I wouldn't be such a lonely bastard, yey! | |
But what's the difference between the bar patrons and the 'gaymers'? Surely at least a few homosexual individuals go to both. I'm not saying that a straight individual would get stoned and ostracised for attending Gaymerson, I'm just saying that they might not feel welcome if the event is clearly aimed at a different audience and some, not necessarily the majority, of people in the event may question why a heterosexual person is there. While I understand that the 'booth-babes' and other such marketing at vanilla gaming cons certainly make it clear that it is aimed primarily at heterosexual males, I don't think the appropriate response is to create an event which just inverts the original problem. Again, maybe I'm missing something, but Gamercon - in title alone - doesn't shout 'HOMOSEXUAL? NOT FOR YOU' while Gaymercon does shout 'HETEROSEXUAL? NOT FOR YOU', at least to me. | |
Maybe this is my ignorance speaking, but I hope that it would be moreso my idealism. Regardless, in an ideal world I feel like we wouldn't have to have a GaymerCon. In an ideal world, people could be comfortable with each other and able to chill and talk about their games at a convention without that kind of prejudice. But I won't be so naive as to say that homophobia isn't existent in the gaming community (or any community really). And beyond that there are probably other reasons why one would want to attend a GaymerCon as opposed to a game convention. So while I wish they didn't need to exist, I am glad they do for the comfort and happiness of others. | |
If you would feel uncomfortable at a Gaymers con, then you now know why the Gaymers con exists. | |
Yeah it took me a few times to notice that he wasnt wearing any pants and then I was like 0.o OT: I didnt even know this was a thing... So...yay them I guess? | |
Do these not events not segregate part of the community though? When the social interaction involves a potential expression of your sexuality, then it makes sense to maybe differentiate between preferences (for instance, nightclubs or bars), or when the media is directly and almost uniquely aimed at a market then yeah, I get the potential desire to cater to a specific crowd. With videogames, however, there is absolutely no requirement. Like many things in life, sexuality is not a limiting factor in gaming, and while I completely identify the disgusting bigotry that some of the LGBT community can face in the gaming community, this is not unique, or especially prominent in gaming conventions. While "gay" conventions might be nice to some of the gay community (but by no means all of the gay community), they only serve to reaffirm the negative attitudes of the ignorant minority, rather than convince and alter their viewpoints. Isn't the gay pride chant "I'm here, I'm queer, get over it" rather than, "we're doing this now, please go away"? | |
Exactly. Which is why the comic strip makes no sense. A religion IS something that requires places. Same goes for something related to sex, i.e. a bathroom (if we lived in a society where it wasn't necessarily sexual for males to see female genitalia and viceversa, there wouldn't be a need for separate bathroom. But in our society, seeing naked adult genitalia is always pretty much sexual). A gaming convention? The only requirement is being interested in videogames. When you add sexuality to it, then it's the same as a "baseball meeting - but for gay people" or as a "heavy metal concert - for straight people". Retarded. | |
I'd think rather then forming your own Con (with hookers and blackjack!) I would be more inclined to find the assholes who make you uncomfortable at other cons and kick their asses. It just seems like an odd combination since the two have nothing to do with each other, like a convention for toy cars and washing machines. Or a stand that sells hotdogs and life insurance. I know why this exists, the same reason that game conventions exist at all, to collect a group of people with similar interest. It's the combination that baffles me. Also, straw man and false analogy... but that's the joke... | |
Hi. Gay guy here. I LOVE going to PAX East. I have a great time there and wouldn't miss it for the world. I go with my friends who are also gay and I'm hoping one day I'll be able to drag my boyfriend out to it although I don't think he'll have as much fun as I do. Do I have a great time? Absolutely. Do I feel 100% comfortable in that environment? No. Why? Because people harass, physically and psychologically assault and KILL gay people in the real world. I'm not saying it happens at cons, but it happens. Period. There are many other groups that experience the same thing. Living your life with that fact hanging over head sort of changes your perspective on a lot of things. The prospect of hanging out with 80000 people, a small number of which will come from the ignorant and bigoted pool that I hear and see using slurs of all kinds online, is one of those situations where you just can't shake that feeling. That feeling must be worse for someone who has experienced that kind of discrimination personally. I count myself lucky that due to my size and pass-times no one has ever messed with me in that way. The Gaymers convention is a place where we won't need to have that cloud follow us and we are more than happy to share that feeling with our friends and allies. This issue isn't just gaming, it's just in general. Instead of asking why we need it, accept that we do and if it truly doesn't bother you then please help us end the need to have a separate 100% comfortable environment by being an ally. Call out any kind of discrimination or bigotry of any kind that you hear or experience. Once the voices come from everyone instead of just the minority of targets it will be impossible to for the industry to ignore. I guarantee that the preference of each and everyone of the organizers and attendees of the Gaymer convention dreams of a day when it won't be necessary. Thanks for listening. | |
For those who don't quite get why there is a need for a convention catering to gay gamers, I would suggest reading Jim Sterling's article on Destructoid. It states the desire for such a convention far more eloquently than I ever could: http://www.destructoid.com/the-importance-of-a-gay-gamer-convention-232467.phtml | |
I have to admit, I really don't get the whole "Gaymer" con thing. I mean, really, what the hell does your sexual orientation have to do with gaming? How would that even come up unless you choose to bring it up? I can understand wanting to have a Con for something where the subject matter is relevant, such as an RPG con or a Shooter con, but I'm not sure how sexuality can have enough of an effect to really matter for most games (With the possible exception of games like dead or alive). It seems like having a Black Gamer's con or asian gamer con; it just doesn't seem like these things have-or at least should have-any sort of real connection to gaming. I mean, my gender, race and sexual orientation have never really come up in a game, at least a good game. | |
Actually they are and its been going on for a while now - take the Rotary Club for example. Establishments for men and men alone are slowly but surely being being dismantled despite the fact that it is a needed tool for people to let off steam without offending the sensitivities of members of the opposite gender. Those that remain are labeled as misogynistic and chauvinistic. However there remains the fact that there are many establishments or events where men are excluded. You have Women only clubs like the InnerWheel the Womens version of Rotary (no men allowed), women only gyms and women only sports events (with no events for men). I understand not having men and women compete in the same event for physical, safety or even fair play issues. But to have a meet that completely excludes men and doesnt even provide events for them to partake in is in my mind wrong considering if the invesr was true it would be decried and condemned. Why is it ok to have exclusivity for one but not for the other. I have no problem with exclusivity - its a great way for communities to get together without having to worry about harassment from an unwanted party. The problem I have is when it is ok for certain segments of to have exclusivity but not for others. Its just the other side of bigotry. Seriously I understand that the homosexual community wants an environment where they dont have to put up with every other snot nosed kid calling anything they dont care for as "gay", more power to them. However if on the flip side there was a con called Hetero/Malecon there would be hell to pay. Its inconsistent and that is my problem with it. | |
*Comic asking people not to be "that guy"* *five pages of people being "that guy"* I love this board. | |
I care just enough about the gaymer thing to say, "I don't care." | |
I think we might as well add an additional clause to § 32, "Pics or it did not happen". "If it did not happen to a straight, preferably white, male, then it did not happen." Edit: I do like the vague undercurrent of "Oh, those ungrateful dolphins, segregating themselves from regular society that's done so much for them...", it's a logical summersault Arkimedes himself would've been baffled by. | |
Uh...I can understand wanting to get together and connect with a bunch of people that have a shared "Interest" so to speak, I mean thats what a con already is. And I can understand the feeling that being in that environment can allow you to more freely express yourself without being judged. But honestly you're coming off as a bit freaking paranoid. I mean, I can understand "I don't want to have to hear someone call me a 'fag'" but Talking about being assaulted and killed? You make it sound like gamercon's are nothing but horrible homophobes with nail bats. It seems like Hyperbole. Like starting a black gamer con not because a bunch of gamers with a shared cultural background want to get together, but because black gamers are scared at more generalized cons because white people might lynch them. | |
Well hello. I'm a woman - some people harass, physically and psychologically assault and KILL women in the real world. Another person could perhaps say: I'm black - some people harass, physically and psychologically assault and KILL black people in the real world. And so on. So let's make a gaming convention for women, a gaming convention for black people, one for Asian people, and one for each and every category of people that faces some form of discrimination. NO, that is not the solution. That just makes discrimination much easier. | |
I recently watched TV, and there was a report on the christmas market in a major german city, where the homosexual community members have opened up their own "gay" christmas market. So they sell calenders with naked men on them, and have stages with lingerie models and stuff. Seriously, why do we have to split people into groups based on their sexual preferences. Who cares if you're gay? I don't. Just finally shut up about it! | |
You, like many others, are making the assumption that sexuality affects only sexual-related things. It comes up EVERYWHERE. I'd love to explain the concept to you, but it's been done quite well by those much more eloquent than me on the previous pages. | |
Here here! An excellent comic. I hadn't really ever thought about the "need" for a specially themed convention, but what the hell. Plus, I would totally go, probably have a wicked time playing games with my fellow humans. (am straight btw) I like the approach to be honest, and showing the inherent equality. | |
The thing is, they don't want to be exclusionary. They just want to be able to have a safe environment with which to mingle. There isn't anything exclusionary about it. I have never been to any gay event where I was turned away as a straight male (I had a gay roommate for years, so I went to these events quite often). If anything they went out of their way to make me feel welcome. Now if you get some of them drunk enough, they might hit on you, but it has never taken me anything more than to say "Sorry m8, I'm straight" and they backed off. Same thing goes with just about any gathering. There has only been one gathering where I actually felt unwelcome, but in all fairness it was a black pride meeting and I am a white guy. This happened shortly after the Rodney King beatings so, I don't really hold it against them. I went back the next year, and they were plenty welcoming. | |
You can go if you're straight; I pre-ordered a pass through the Kickstarter. All the organizers expect is for attendees to be accepting. | |
I get why they have these cons, hence why they're named what they are (So people know what they're going to), I just don't get why they have to separate themselves with a new term. "Gaymer" or "Girl Gamer" and things like that just seem silly to me. We're all just gamers, why the need for extra titles, you want to be treated the same, sweet as. Why the need for attention grabbing titles that separate you from the rest of the culture. We're all just gamers here, and I would like to think we're all equal. But creating sub groups and titles can sort of create a bit of a divide. I don't know, maybe it's something I just don't understand. | |
When you define an event by something completely unrelated (sexuality, gender, race etc), you are specifically discriminating against others. This isn't a situation where something is being created as an "alternative to the normal" because the "normal" convention isn't a heterosexual thing. It's a game thing. I'd protest a heterosexual games convention as strongly as a homosexual one, because the intention behind it is to discriminate against the interested parties that don't fit into the narrow, imposed restrictions. As I've previously stated, in certain situations where sexuality has a part to play (such as nightclubs) there is a logical and honest reason why some segregation might occur. Beyond that, there is no reason to split the communities. We're supposed to be living and working together regardless of sex, age, race etc, not separately. That's what the hateful want. | |
Thats not the point, if someone did do a heterocon it would get blasted by every gay rights group out there for being a bigoted and homophobic venture. It's double standards and that defeats the whole point of such movements in the first place as they are supposed to eliminate double standards NOT propagate them. | |
What? How does that work? Do I just go to some convention filled with members of a minority and start shouting at them? That would end badly for me... Are you trying to say that it encourages discrimination to some extent? How? The convention is made to celebrate the LGBT community. You don't need to belong to the community in order to join it. It's not some sort of "gays only" club... BTW. There exists a convention for women geeks, and I somehow doubt that's the reason why geeks hate on women but the other way around. | |
Have you ever seen a public restroom? I don't know where you live, but in the US they can get pretty nasty. OT: Can't we all just get along? I wish that I would live to see a world where people aren't judged for petty things, but it seems that will never happen. | |
The problem isn't that the question is asked (at least, for my money it's not). The problem is how often it's used as an attack. Which seems more the thrust of this than not. The main answer is "not get harassed and ridiculed by a culture that seems to harass and ridicule anyone who's different." I'm not saying that all straight people are bad or anything, but when you look at the responses to gender/sexuality/race issues in gaming, there's a lot of tantrums to be found. gays/women/minorities get crap for trying to be included, then get crap for trying to band together (either via inclusion or exclusion). It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario. There is a contingent of people who "suffer" from privilege and are quick to call discrimination without looking at the overall scenario. That's sort of the issue here.
That is amazingly optimistic.
Except they don't really check your sexuality at the door. It's a shame you are so optimistic about the majority but so negative when dealing with the minority. If you think it's not relevant, that's probably because you haven't experienced any real discrimination and are trivialising the issues at hand. In fact, you're definitely doing the latter.
I'd settle for not having to worry about my safety. I can't speak for you, but I know that shouldn't be deemed an "unreasonable" demand. Few homosexuals are looking for respect. At least, not more than the basic respect and dignity most other groups are afforded and desired. The "special snowflake" deal is a strawman argument. It was tired when they made it about women. It was tired when they made it about blacks. It's tired when they make it about hispanics. And it's tired when they make it about homosexuals.
What about my gay?
Yes, homosexuals cannot be offended by being mocked for being different, but you're getting out of sorts because...? You couldn't help but feel discriminated against by a Gaymer con, but your attitude to homosexuals is tantamount to "suck it up." Try an single standard. For further reading, I suggest reading Susan Arendt's post on the subject. I don't completely agree with her, but I find it a respectable sentiment. | |
Yep, that's us straights alright: all grey and no colour... We pretty much view the world through a Tim Burton filter. | |
1: And you insulted him and several other forumites, including myself, with your post. Where's your warning? How does it feel to not only have no repercussions for insulting your user base on a site that treats insults as heinous crimes, but to actually get paid to do it? 2: I don't judge people based on their sexual preference. To me, people are people, not gay people, black people, white people, man people, woman people, etc. I find "Gaymer-con" to be a ridiculous idea that only serves to further alienate gay gamers by cordoning them off from the rest of the community and calling attention to the fact that they're different. Apparently this makes me a dick because my opinion doesn't match up with yours. | |
You're right. A gaming convention shouldn't have anything to do with our sexuality. It's unfortunate that a convention is required where gay gamers can feel comfortable, because that implies they aren't comfortable at the current ones. I understand where you're coming from, I really do, I just wish it were that easy.
Not even going to bother with this side of things anymore. I already addressed why things wont be called that, and why it would be bad if they were. | |
Yeah... because that's what happens regularly: gay people discriminating against straight people. It's not like it's the other way round or anything. | |
This is a supper important issue that needs far more attention then it's getting! I am glad that it is being addressed here. | |
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For those not understanding the reasons behind this:
~~~Do you play multiplayer games?
If the answer is yes, then the answer to "why" this convention is put up is self evident. There is hate on a daily basis in Halo 4, WoW, Guild Wars 2, League of Legends, DotA 2, Call of Duty, and so many other games. Not only is there hate and spite towards homosexuals, there's also the issue with people throwing the slang terms around like it's their second language.
There are many times that I've asked people to "please don't use that term" when they calling enemies/allies 'f***ets' or when they die they say 'that's gay'. Most of the time it doesn't result in them stopping, instead it's more of "STFU you stupid ******" and going into worse. Sure, there's reporting them, but it only ever rarely works. People are either just ignorant or don't care. I've even had a guildmate kicked out by a leader because he refused to stop using such words in both chat and Teamspeak.
So, why a con? Because the CON is a place were a panel can be formed to discuss such discrimination in games (which is never a topic discussed at normal cons). It's also a place where people don't have to deal with that kind of slang and hate-terms just for the hell of it.