Zero Punctuation: DMC: Devil May Cry

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actually doesn't sound too bad to me, but then I wasn't the biggest fan of the previous games. wonder what my friend, the one who actually liked DMC, would think. I suppose it hasn't had as huge a fall as Ninja Gaiden did

DVS BSTrD:
Since we're big on acronyms, I wonder if the heros call themselves GROSS: Get Rid Of Slimy Succubi.

Oh man, you just gave me a massive Calvin & Hobbes flashback! Perfect for Yahtzee's "kids in a treehouse" analogy.

southparkdudz:
Thank you Ninja Theory for ruining one of the greastes capcom series ever.

Those knobends.
So. Many. Penis jokes...

I miss the bitter, angry Yahtzee of yesteryear :(

Sure Yahtzee recommended it, but the recommendation was really tepid, a 'nothing really insulted my intelligence.'

The boss fight comment really stood out to me. It's gotten to the point that the smaller a boss is in an action game, the more likely I expect a challenging fight. And that has pretty much been the case for the last few years.

Saika Renegade:
Whilst I am not the target audience of the original Devil May Cry or this reboot, I can understand the frustration of having a game series feel like it's lost its sense of challenge. That aside, I also have a new favorite euphemism now.

Except that DMD in this one is still piss easy. DMD used to tear you into shreds if you were to make one mistake or 2 in DMC1,3 and 4. It's like they give you more enemies with higher HP so you can farm even more points with the utterly broken style ranking system.

Also if the game rewards you with an S in the category ''Number of times died'' with the number being 2, you know that the game has been casualified down right to the core.

So is this going to be the next big gaming controversy now?

The harder difficulties are still difficult, it plays like a Devil May Cry game (in fact, I'd say it plays better than all of them with a possible slight exception for Devil May Cry 4), the writing and story are just as good as any of previous games and better than at least two of them, and while the level design may not be as convoluted and intricate as DMC3, it's at least better than other games in the same genre like God of War III and the art direction completely blows it out of the water.

And really, anyone who says the first Devil May Cry was better than this hasn't played that game in a long time. It's got the worst camera angles of the entire franchise, practically a non-existent story, and slow, tedious combat that yeah, bears some resemblance to the rest of the franchise, but was quite obviously the first implementation of the system.

Playing through with the Classic Dante skin is a laugh and a half in itself, though.

This sounds like the perfect game for me once it goes on sale for about 7.50 or less on steam. :)

The game, taken ENTIRELY on it's own merits, is only a little bad, with some occasional bits of good thrown in, like the level design and...

and the level design.

But quite frankly, fuck taking things on their own merits, this is the 5th entry in a series, and it is in every way a step down from 3 and 4 (We don't talk about 2) except for the level design, and quite frankly, good level design isn't enough to carry a game, and even that is at times ruined by the awful overuse of screaming colors and bloom so strong you can't tell what the fuck is going on.

Maybe I could have dealt with all this, if it wasn't so screamingly fucking obvious how much contempt Ninja Theory has for the original games and their fanbase.

So in conclusion, fuck Ninja Theory, and fuck this game

shrekfan246:
So is this going to be the next big gaming controversy now?

The harder difficulties are still difficult, it plays like a Devil May Cry game (in fact, I'd say it plays better than all of them with a possible slight exception for Devil May Cry 4), the writing and story are just as good as any of previous games and better than at least two of them, and while the level design may not be as convoluted and intricate as DMC3, it's at least better than other games in the same genre like God of War III and the art direction completely blows it out of the water.

And really, anyone who says the first Devil May Cry was better than this hasn't played that game in a long time. It's got the worst camera angles of the entire franchise, practically a non-existent story, and slow, tedious combat that yeah, bears some resemblance to the rest of the franchise, but was quite obviously the first implementation of the system.

Playing through with the Classic Dante skin is a laugh and a half in itself, though.

Hey I knew a rational person would show up sooner or later! After playing through DmC, I picked up The HD Collection. Admittedly, I haven't gotten very far into the first one, but so far what I've seen is slower, uglier (Not talking graphics, just the generic castle asthetic), and in general duller than DmC.

If this is how you "ruin" things, Ninja Theory, do you think you could "ruin" some other franchises?

bificommander:
There really is a scene where a mop falls on his head, giving him the old look, and then tosses it away? I guess the devs didn't take well to the fans/fanboys complaining about the new look. Rather than just making their new game and see if people appriciate it, they open up by saying "Fuck everyone who prefered the old look, we think it looks stupid and we're making the game, not you, neiner-neiner". Can't deny that it's a funnier response, but I don't think it's a good buisness practice. Plus, seeing Dante's new look on the screenshots, I can't say I find it looking any less stupid.

well, it's not a mop. It's a wig.

So, I can be perfectly fine by sticking to Devil May Cry 4. I can live with that, it's actually lots of fun and by the looks of the videos I've watched about DmC, Devil May Cry 4 actually looks a lot much better.

I wasn't expecting a recommendation on this one from you Yahtzee. Guess you got impressed by this title as much as I was.

Loved this one, carry on my good sir.

Nice visuals? Fast-paced gameplay? Easy-to-S-rank levels? Pathetically easy, yet epic bosses? Looking back at the main character's past and wildly different personality at the time?

That sounds like Sonic Generations, and I loved Sonic Generations, and I coincidentally beat Sonic Generations a few days ago! To follow through with that tangent, I like how the levels are easy enough to S-rank on the second go. It didn't waste my time, except in the last level, but that main stage was 5 minutes long on average between the gameplay styles.

You see, my most aggravating factor in games is when they make me restart levels or level sections. My time is valuable to me, and when I play games, I want that time to be consistently fun.

you see, I like this game but I can't compare it to previous devil may cry instalments because it feels and plays like Heavenly Sword. Heavenly Sword itself was a bit of a half baked idea, and I see DmC as second attempt of the same game play concept, both games have the heavy and light trigger holds for their weapons and both run on the same engine and have the same problem of enemies not doing anything when they are not on screen.

I feel this game would have done a lot better if it was Heavenly Sword 2 and not a game that plays like Heavenly Sword but is wearing the flesh of another game franchise.

and for my personal preference i would like to see the old Dante return, but this rendition can continue as well; do the whole Modern Warfare/Black ops run then both parties are happy.

EDIT: as for the difficulty my first play through had me attaining on average SS on nephilim difficulty (I attained a single A on mission 16 because i was careless) and a SSS rank on the final boss.

Taste is a funny and really surprising thing. An example? I kind of enjoyed Devil May Cry 2, both with Dante and Lucia, and even with Trish, but I did not finish the game with her.
Second, I've finished DMC 4, in Devil Hunter, first time I've played it and them started and finished DmC in Nephilim. And yeah, it was much harder to get to the SSS level in DMC 4, I think I've only managed to get to it three times during all the game. It was easier with DmC, but, one thing people don't seem to see, we are experienced players, who played the older games, and they were not easy at all. So, is DmC easy, or is it easy for us, the most experienced girls and guys?
Second, NT remembered to add one of the defining traits from the old DMC series: Indestructible cloths: How many times did Dante got his chest trespassed by Rebellion? It happened in DMC 1,3 and 4! This new Dante is also pretty good at absorbing damage, and get his clothes intact.
In the end, the things this new DmC lacks: The medieval castles from Resident Evil, really, every DMC could happen in Raccoon City, Rockfort Island or any Spencer Mansion. This could had been solved if the mansion level were bigger, or a bit more explored. The soundtrack had some sweet battle songs, some better than the older ones, but the eerie songs, the ones used during the exploration, or the menus, those songs are not present in DmC, and that is a shame.
I also wanted the menus represented more of the story, a bit like what we see in racing games like DiRT, or Max Payne 3, but this wasn't present in the old ones too.
And the last thing, for me, that was forgotten, and I'm proud of them for that: Cleavage! After I've finished DMC 4 and saw the cutscenes with Mary, Trish and Gloria I was full of WTF's in my mind. That was weird. That was absurd and wasn't funny.
In the other hand, people love to talk about characters in game, so, we must talk about Kat. She is human, she is smart, dependable, resilient, had a good presence during all of the game and looked like a normal girl, not a glorified doll! That is a plus.
In the end, It's funny to see people talk as if the older Runs of DMC were perfect games: They are linear, they are completely composed of, enter room, it gets locked, fight monsters, wins, open door to next room, repeat. And it's the same for Ninja Gaiden, the same for Bayonetta, God of War, and so on. If the game had another name, it would be a solid enter in the "get locked inside room full of monsters weaker than you" genre we love so much. But been a "reboot", I wonder how long until the reboot of the reboot, so it will look like the old again.

Thinking about buying DMC, I've never played a Devil May Cry game before, come to think of it I've never played a hack n' slash game before so I think this is a good entry point for me to the genre.

Also (don't kill me for this) I like new Dante better than old Dante, in a purely aesthetic sense.

How did Yatzee know about my OKcupid profile picture?... I mean wat?

Still doesn't give me any desire to get it. The message about corperate consumerism really is too ham fisted to enjoy the story, and the combat seems entertaining, but not enough to warrent 60 bucks.

I wish I was joking about the profile picture, but I'm kinda not...>.>

1nfinite_Cros5:
Exactly. All the complaints that were brought up pre-game release aren't really that valid anymore. I can actually say that the younger Dante is kinda believable as a younger version of a cocky cock from the later games. Granted, he's still a cocky cock, but slightly more restrained.

Also, the people complaining that the easiness of the game ruins it, hear this from a hardcore Demon's/Dark Souls player: It's a game, not a final exam for college-level Calculus. Besides, no one is forcing you to play it on easy. The difficulty option can still be bumped up.

Which of the complaints "aren't valid anymore"? The middle school level, profanity filled dialogue? The hamfisted and not subtle in the slightest "corporations are evil and anarchy makes sense" values and the developers calling it "deep and artistic"? Removing perfectly fine game mechanics, such as hard lock-on, essentially disallowing all directional input related moves and favoring less moves scattered over more buttons and then plastering Heavenly Sword combat on top of it? The combat developer admitting that he had no idea about how juggling in the previous games worked?

"Not all games need to be hard" is no valid argument. What if they nerfed the upcoming Dark Souls 2 in favor of "wider audiences"? Would you be saying the same thing then? The old DMC games also had lower difficulties for possible struggling players but the new DmC is a piss easy button smasher (the game rewards you for spamming high damaging moves and doesn't care for variety) more akin to God of War, even on the "hard" difficulty levels.

Mcoffey:
If this is how you "ruin" things, Ninja Theory, do you think you could "ruin" some other franchises?

It's quite funny how all reviewers and DmC defenders compare the new title to the old and dated game instead of it's vastly more challenging and fast-paced sequels (namely 3 and 4, 2 is absolute dogshit) and feel like they can weigh in on the subject.

I find it amazing how Yahtzee, the most picky critic with higher standarts that I know of, said that he recommends the game, and even then the fanboys put their fingers in their ears and go "La la la he said that it sucks, it's a crap game and Ninja Theory should shut down cause they ruined Devil May Cry FOREVAAAAAAAAAAHRRR".

Seriously, it's pretty good. If you guys find it annoying that MovieBob keeps whining about Amazing Spider-Man even though most people thought it was pretty good, then you shouldn't be doing the same thing.

It's not as though Devil May Cry was that great of a series to begin with. Problems that can be attributed to this can mostly also be attributed to the other games in the series.

Polite Sage:

Mcoffey:
If this is how you "ruin" things, Ninja Theory, do you think you could "ruin" some other franchises?

It's quite funny how all reviewers and DmC defenders compare the new title to the old and dated game instead of it's vastly more challenging and fast-paced sequels (namely 3 and 4, 2 is absolute dogshit) and feel like they can weigh in on the subject.

I never played 2 or 3. I did play the demo of 4 briefly on the Xbox a long time ago, and found it repetitive and the camera angles irritating.

As a game, I feel DmC is better than the original. Which is what I said. Perhaps I'll have a different opinion if/when I get to the others.

I loved the picture for "Gravity" being a grumpy old man! XD one of the funniest parts of the video.

"Not in a million years"

Yeah, I remember that white wig scene. Sent me in to a gigantic gigglefit it did.
----------------------------------------------------

So this review was basically what my friend, who is an avid Devil May Cry fan, has been saying for weeks now. Gameplay's fine if lacking a bit of the freedom of the previous games, bosses are disappointing and piss easy, worlds are gorgeous, etc.

The only difference between he and Yahtzee's opinions on the game is that he liked the story and character dynamic, whereas Yahtzee didn't even touch it for some odd reason.

I understand the way Yahtzee recommended this. I said the same thing, yeah...it's pretty and the combat is satisfying in a "calm down and mash buttons" kind of way, so it's worth it if you thought the previous ones were too difficult/slow paced. I'd honestly put it above 2 but below 1,3, and 4. But that's thinking of it as a legitimate entry in the series, when it almost feels like a last-minute DMC re-skin. I've recently gone for a second playthrough on SoS and it really magnifies the issues with the game. The engine just doesn't allow enough enemies on screen at once, and it sucks that they just stand there if they aren't on screen. It really is the prettiest UE3 game I've played on my PC, though.

I was hoping for a bit more than a few sparks, really.

shrekfan246:
the writing and story are just as good as any of previous games and better than at least two of them.

Except I'm fairly sure the last two games weren't written by a 12 year old who just discovered the word "fuck" and an obsession with emo melodrama, nor was Dante so utterly obsessed with being "cool" in that unique way that just make you come across like a massive twat. I have heard plenty of people complain about games being dumbed down to appeal to the shooter bro crowd, but this is the first time I have seen a franchise dumbed down just to appeal to the 15 year hot topic dweller crowd.
(disclaimer: basically never played old or new DMC all this is based off watching other people play, and the fact that 10 minutes of playing DMC4 didn't make me want to kill the protagonist, while the DmC demo sure did).

OT: Gameplay looks fun if way to easy, but I refuse to buy a game where the PC looks and acts like he was formed from some kind of liquid emo that was scraped off the floor of a HotTopic.

Meeh... some people are soo ridiculously childish.. I wonder what it is with zealotry.. you have nothing important to get defensive about, so you go out of your way to prove that people liking something different than you are WRONG? At least the game clearly has an interest in actually commenting and expanding the mythology of the universe, and remains coherent with the tennants that the originals pursued. Grow up, or alternatively, if that doesn't work, get over yourselves.-

I personally have always had a soft spot for the dmc series, even tried my best to enjoy DMC2, and although I was hesitant, I found this FUN. Dante, and the game narratives have always been a ridiculous pastiche of cliches, and I'd even say that this is probably the most likeable and understandable that he has ever been. But it's not like they trampled over the whole concept.
NO,it's not the best game in the world, but DMC has never been the best game series in the world either. There are still many aspects of the game that are a definite improvement over previous entries. And others are a matter of preference.

Sure, the challenge is not the same, but you can still crank it up if it's boring you, and even if that's not enough, DONT WORRY! now we have leaderboards where you can insult everyone else for sucking! and playing the game altogether! (if getting a SSSS and bragging rights was so profoundly important for you)

major_chaos:

shrekfan246:
the writing and story are just as good as any of previous games and better than at least two of them.

Except I'm fairly sure the last two games weren't written by a 12 year old who just discovered the word "fuck" and an obsession with emo melodrama, nor was Dante so utterly obsessed with being "cool" in that unique way that just make you come across like a massive twat. I have heard plenty of people complain about games being dumbed down to appeal to the shooter bro crowd, but this is the first time I have seen a franchise dumbed down just to appeal to the 15 year hot topic dweller crowd.
(disclaimer: basically never played old or new DMC all this is based off watching other people play, and the fact that 10 minutes of playing DMC4 didn't make me want to kill the protagonist, while the DmC demo sure did).

OT: Gameplay looks fun if way to easy, but I refuse to buy a game where the PC looks and acts like he was formed from some kind of liquid emo that was scraped off the floor of a HotTopic.

so you haven't played it, but you are having a big melodramatic rant/cry/sook about it?
who is the emo kid now?

DrunkOnEstus:
The engine just doesn't allow enough enemies on screen at once, and it sucks that they just stand there if they aren't on screen.

Just for knowledge's sake, I can explain that bolded part specifically for you because I feel it was a really clever piece of game design on their part that wasn't talked about much. While it may seem like they're just standing there, they're actually on nearly the same combat routine, but with lessened aggression. Ninja Theory did this because they believe it prevents the "unfair" false difficulty of the previous games where enemies would still be full-on aggressive and would blind side you, which was especially an issue due to the close position of the camera in segments, unlike in fixed camera angles where you can actually see the enemies coming to hit you from behind. If you still stand with your back to the enemies, they will hit you if you're not careful. It's just seasoned DMC players who are used to that previous AI routines and thus are usually making sure there's not a chance to hit us from behind by mentally tracking enemies and making sure to move with some combos.

Delcast:
Meeh... some people are soo ridiculously childish.. I wonder what it is with zealotry.. you have nothing important to get defensive about, so you go out of your way to prove that people liking something different than you are WRONG? At least the game clearly has an interest in actually commenting and expanding the mythology of the universe, and remains coherent with the tennants that the originals pursued. Grow up, or alternatively, if that doesn't work, get over yourselves.-

Yes. Because perfectly valid criticism is your definition of "childish" and "zealous".
And what the hell are with the comments essentially telling "DMC was never a good series to begin with, so DmC is completely excused even if it's a shitty reboot"?

Sure, the challenge is not the same, but you can still crank it up if it's boring you, and even if that's not enough, DONT WORRY! now we have leaderboards where you can insult everyone else for sucking! and playing the game altogether! (if getting a SSSS and bragging rights was so profoundly important for you)

Like many former DMC players have said, the game has next to no challenge even on the higher difficulties. The enemies are slightly less brain dead but you're still rewarded the most for spamming the same buttons and the cutscene laden, 1 second parry window copy pasta boss fights are still awful. It's not about bragging rights, it's about Ninja Theory taking out all the good points out of the former, challenging combat system of 3 and 4 then replacing it with Heavenly Sword's simplistic controls.

Polite Sage:

Mcoffey:
If this is how you "ruin" things, Ninja Theory, do you think you could "ruin" some other franchises?

It's quite funny how all reviewers and DmC defenders compare the new title to the old and dated game instead of it's vastly more challenging and fast-paced sequels (namely 3 and 4, 2 is absolute dogshit) and feel like they can weigh in on the subject.

3 is slow and clunky as hell. Dante moves slower, the combat is much slower paced, and the camera angles have a way of hiding enemies from you until they streak in to attack you. I know this because I tried playing it again alongside DmC over the past few days. Switching between weapons is awkward, chaining combos is slow and easily screwed up, and while getting "SSS" ranked combos is more difficult, part of that is because half of the time you end up half the screen away from an enemy with no way of closing the distance before your style meter has gone down. The boss fights are a lot better though, I'll give it that.

4 is a lot better, and arguably the only one I'd say compares on a gameplay level, but purely from a pacing perspective the game plays slower still than the newest one. Not that that's a bad thing, but it doesn't keep the adrenaline pumping nearly as effectively. And while the gameplay is the best of the four original titles and keeping up stylistic combos is easier and more fun because Nero has the Demon Grab and Dante has a lot more maneuverability overall, it stumbles drunkenly over the level design and makes the second half of the game backtracking through the first half of the game.

I've been a fan of Devil May Cry for a long time. You're damn right I feel like I can weigh in on the subject.

Nice to hear Ninja Theory is keeping their terrible traditions of collectibles they don't let you collect because you went exploring and accidentally progressed the level forward. Also, wow, quite the cockstravaganza this week. Was this just barrel scraping, or did you fail to miss last year's obligatory dick joke quota, and vowed to do this year's all in one go?

This is a good one to watch first with the sound muted and try to work out based on the images alone what the fuck he's talking about.

I was thinking of getting this, but Ninja Theory acting like a bunch of cunts has put me off it

Mcoffey:

shrekfan246:
So is this going to be the next big gaming controversy now?

The harder difficulties are still difficult, it plays like a Devil May Cry game (in fact, I'd say it plays better than all of them with a possible slight exception for Devil May Cry 4), the writing and story are just as good as any of previous games and better than at least two of them, and while the level design may not be as convoluted and intricate as DMC3, it's at least better than other games in the same genre like God of War III and the art direction completely blows it out of the water.

And really, anyone who says the first Devil May Cry was better than this hasn't played that game in a long time. It's got the worst camera angles of the entire franchise, practically a non-existent story, and slow, tedious combat that yeah, bears some resemblance to the rest of the franchise, but was quite obviously the first implementation of the system.

Playing through with the Classic Dante skin is a laugh and a half in itself, though.

Hey I knew a rational person would show up sooner or later! After playing through DmC, I picked up The HD Collection. Admittedly, I haven't gotten very far into the first one, but so far what I've seen is slower, uglier (Not talking graphics, just the generic castle asthetic), and in general duller than DmC.

If this is how you "ruin" things, Ninja Theory, do you think you could "ruin" some other franchises?

Agreed, while I had fun with the previous games, this one I feel has breathed a new kind of life into the series. Plus it's a complete restart, I'm glad it's changed things, you want the old games? they're still there, this new one doesn't ruin the previous ones.

Glad to see I'm not the only one looking at this thread that thought like this.

I enjoy this game and have been playing Devil May Cry since way back when. Maybe I'm just used to reboots, but I don't typically end up comparing them, because what's the point? Every single game is going to have fans that complain that the new title isn't as good as the last one. Every game, even if it's not a reboot. I guess I'll never understand why people complain when a sequel/reboot is not 100% like their favorite installment, but maybe that's because I play too many games to care.

Devil May Cry has never been a stellar series for me anyway. It's just always been a fun filler sort of game that I play for the hell of it. I'd rate them as follows:

Devil May Cry: Good

Devil May Cry 2: Terrible

Devil May Cry 3: Great

Devil May Cry 4: Okay

Devil May Cry (DMC): Great

So I've liked most of them, but none of them have really blew me away and I probably wouldn't even put a DMC game in my top 10 games ever played list.

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