Jimquisition: A-LIE-ns: Colonial Marines

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Kyogissun:
I just... I really don't have words. I did not realize that this shit as bad as it... was. I mean I was getting the jist of it from the reviews but, good god.

When was the last time this big of a disappointment happened for the gaming industry? Like... Driver 3 maybe? Or is there something else non-Aliens related I'm forgetting?

I seriously hope Gearbox is in some deep shit for this, they were probably one of the few remaining companies I felt weren't completely fucking up but with this... I seriously hope there's something that went terribly wrong and that this wasn't just the outcome of laziness.

It happens a lot actually, it's just that people tend not to notice unless it's a game they happen to be interested in or following. Being a big-budget FPS that had FPS junkies drooling due to the liscence attached to it and the cred Gearbox built up from "Borderlands" it's getting a lot more attention because it's comparitively mainstream.

To put things into perspective right alongside this, a company called Gazillion is in the hotseat. They are the ones making the "Marvel Heroes" MMO, which occasionally gets mentioned. They are basically running a "Marvel Ultimate Alliance" inspired MMO where you buy access to specific super heroes and run around in a top-down persistant world beating the crap out of legions of thugs. It's still under development and there have been articles and videos and stuff of it all over The Internet if you look, and it has come up here on "The Escapist".

What Gazillion did was offer people "founders deals" where if you paid to buy characters to play off of them early you'd get these super deals for early adoption. A pretty common gimmick. Well just now they decided to run a deal where they are giving away Jean Gray and Cyclops for free to anyone who buys any level of founder pack from them on Valentines day. This needless to say really slots off anyone who bought those characters specifically to see them being given away free as a promotion for a game that hasn't even come out yet. There is a bit of a storm about it on their forums, I wrote a few messages about it as well.

Then of course we had the entire "Mass Effect 3" contreversy which didn't entirely revolve around the ending just sucking, but that it sucked and was directly contridictory to promises made by the developers as the game was being created, with those promises and statements being used to promote the game. Then there was a "behind the scenes" app showing that the guys doing the game never actually intended for any of those promises to be met... and also a "you can't make crap like this up" bit explaining that the ending they decided to go with was basically coceived by like an
8 year old boy who wrote in to them. At the end of the day it wasn't as involved as a demo showing "this is what our game is" and then not delivering anything close, but it went into the same territory by having guys who are developers and should know their stuff coming out and saying "this will not be an A B or C choice ending", etc... A lot of people don't really get the anger surrounding Mass Effect 3, summarizing it simply as "rage over not liking the ending" doesn't quite cover why this got to be so much bigger than other products with endings people don't like.

Then of course we had "Duke Nukem Forever" and we see how close that product turned out to the promises made and what footage of the game we actually got to see. Gearbox was ALSO responsible for that, and there are already parallels being drawn here, given the information circulated, lies, fan exploitation, pre-order gimmicks, and everything else. I think Totalbiscuit made this parallel last night in a video he did talking about why you shouldn't pre-order. It's paticularly damning when you consider that this is twice we've more or less beeen looking at the same kind of garbage from the same company.

Then of course we have "Dragon Age 2" which wound up being a mess of brawler mechanics, reused maps, and laughably enough loading screens that instructed you with basic "RPG strategy" about using fighters to block for mages and stuff, when this wasn't even possible in the game given the way enemies dropped ninja like off of rooftops, and pretty much ran right past your characters with no effort, etc... almost like the guys writing those loading screens had no idea the game they were writing it for. This isn't even getting into the entire "Hawke contreversy" where Bioware asked the fans if it was okay to remove character generation and have Hawke always be a human in exchange for voice acting, the response was pretty resoundingly negative, but Bioware said it was positive and did their thing anyway.

Then of course we had "The War Z" a game that didn't even have a fraction of the features (character skills, etc..) promised in the game's advertisement page on STEAM... to name a few things. Leading to a whole laughable series of events not too long ago where the guys running the company were trying to weakly justify why they weren't liars.

The point is not to try and start a giga-post of refighting all these tired battles in one thread, but to point out that these contreversies exist, and happen constantly. People just tend to forget about them rapidly, or just don't care unless it involves a game they happen to like or are interested in. Pretty much every one of those examples above involves a gaming company telling, or showing, people one thing, and then delivering something entirely differant, followed by a titanic shitstorm. We keep seeing it because we let these guys get away with it. It's not like Gearbox did anything here that nobody else did, they just took it to another level, which isn't surprising since the sheer audacity on display here has been climbing for a while.

At the end of the day the same thing is likely to happen here. Your going to have fanboys, like the infamous Biodrones, come out to defend their favorite devs and IPs as mindlessly as possible, filling those devs with validation and taking this as a queue that they got away with it and they still have fans. Understand this isn't a crack just on Bioware fans, The War Z even has it's defenders, and crap.. at the end of the day Colonial Marines will have it's fanatical defenders, both of the game, and Borderlands fans rallying behind Gearbox. People not interested in the game the contreversy is about will sit back and laugh about it and call everyone on both sides idiots (up until it happens to a game they are interested in), and things will die down and then another company will pull a huge lie, and the same thing will happen again. Nothing will change because we will not stop them.

Ideally it would be a case where gamers in general would all thrown down against companies like EA/Bioware, Gearbox, Hammerpoint, and whomever else and show them what level "toxic" can be taken to, not just in expressed online (and snailmail) fury, but also by refusing to buy their products, any product, until they make good for the things they have already done. A situation where fanboys defending things like "Mass Effect 3" or "Colonial Marines" would be horribly singled out and pushed out by the rest of the gaming community as leperous pariahs, as everyone, interested in the games in question or not turned on them, and with pretty much one voice we could tell the gaming industry to get it's crap together, and see lies like we've been seeing actually ruin companies as opposed to providing a five minute uproar on message boards and maybe the gaming press.

Of course it's not an ideal world, so we're not going to see that happen. We'll all get POed about "Colonial Marines", noise will be made. When "Borderlands 3" comes out Gearbox will make a fortune, few will care anymore, and those that do will be shouted down by the "I luv Borderlands, the games were good, why should I care because Colonial Marines was crappy?" crowd, missing the entire point that it's the same company, issues like this aren't about the specific product label.

Such are my thoughts.

I'm glad I dodged that bullet. Although even if I didn't, I'd demand a refund on account of false advertisement.

Well that's a shame, at least we still have Alien vs Predator 2 and the recent Alien vs Predator with their Marine campaigns as well as Aliens Infestation and the hundred other games with Xenomorphs. Either way I hope Gearbox answers to this, I don't like it when developers lie.

Have they even released a statement about how shitty the game is?

Glad I still don't regret buying AvP 2010 on Steam, I actually enjoyed that game and the multiplayer was lots of fun when it worked.

I can't see anything good come from this, Gearbox is in some deep shit and that is an understatement.

thetenet:
I love the series too. I am sure it will survive one crappy game and whoever tries to make an aliens game in the future will have this demo as a solid foundation.

I don't know. I grew up up with Aliens and the original Alien is one of the few horror movies that actually scared me. But that was almost 3 decades ago. The AvP PC games were good, but the amount of bad far outweighs the good. For me, I think it's gotten to the point where if I see a new Alien movie or game, that I'll look forward to it with the same amount of enthusiasm as another Michael Bay Transformers Movie or another Call of Duty. Or about as much enthusiasm as banging my elbow on the edge of a table.

FoolKiller:

Magmarock:

Arnoxthe1:
OK...

But WHAT ABOUT THE MULTIPLAYER? Is it half-way decent? I've already asked this in a similar thread but everyone's apparently still too busy crying about the campaign. Yes, it's crap. Didn't happen. Sorry. Let's move on now, shall we?

Who cares about the multiplayer? There's enough MP shooter games already we need more single player ones.

Oh... and the MP blows too. Its too glitchy and just isn't properly balanced. It feels like a cool idea, but tacked on with the engine of the weak sauce single player game. The maps are quite tiny and when playing a xeno, you don't feel very mobile considering what you are.

Which is probably exactly what happened and would explain why there's no FPP for Xenos. Why spend time adding a First Person Perspective when you can just tack controls onto existing models?

I know Jim is a solid Aliens fan, so I can see why he is upset.

I'm a passing Aliens fan, I really just love the atmosphere.. it is perfect for a game, and I was looking forward to this for at least a year. I just *love* movies like this, and I absolutely would love for games to capture the Aliens atmosphere and intensity. Thank God for Dead Space eh? At least we have something.

Sadly I paid $60 for this the day it was released, I heard it was "average"... by the time it finished downloading I visited Metacritic and.. well, my day was over. =/

SupahGamuh:
Glad I still don't regret buying AvP 2010 on Steam, I actually enjoyed that game and the multiplayer was lots of fun when it worked.

I can't see anything good come from this, Gearbox is in some deep shit and that is an understatement.

AvP 2010 is actually pretty decent. Very flawed in it's design, in that it feels more like a cobbled-together "arena shooter", and not a true "experience".. if that makes sense. However, the game was very technically impressive and tense. It just gets a little stale...

Dead Space is as close we'll ever get to an "Alien" experience, and it's not a bad one to be perfectly honest.

Easily the best episode of Jimquisition I've ever seen.
Your point was made clearly and you didn't have to troll about it to keep attention and interest.

On Topic:

As a gamer.
This is extremely upsetting. We only have so many tools at our disposal before we commit to a full game purchase. If this practice somehow becomes the norm than there's no reason to follow a games production until we get the final hands-on review. They might as well just show cinematics and withhold ingame footage until launch.

As a general consumer.
It's pretty amazing we haven't seen this stuff happen until now.
Look at a burger commercial and compare that to the served product.
Look at the absurdly misrepresenting labels on the groceries. The reality here is sickening.
Look at how much a movie trailer can misrepresent the movie
Gamers have had it great when you consider other products. This demo comes off as an infomercial product. Amazing to watch but doesn't even remotely deliver. See: Slap Chop vs video's mocking the real thing.

Therumancer:

Kyogissun:
I just... I really don't have words. I did not realize that this shit as bad as it... was. I mean I was getting the jist of it from the reviews but, good god.

When was the last time this big of a disappointment happened for the gaming industry? Like... Driver 3 maybe? Or is there something else non-Aliens related I'm forgetting?

I seriously hope Gearbox is in some deep shit for this, they were probably one of the few remaining companies I felt weren't completely fucking up but with this... I seriously hope there's something that went terribly wrong and that this wasn't just the outcome of laziness.

-snip-

Such are my thoughts.

Damn son, thanks for the refresher, I hadn't thought about that. And while I might say some of those were 'didn't live up to expectations but we still enjoyable/good', it is odd that not only did A:CM fail to live up to expectations but is a BAD game in general.

It's one thing for a licensed property like this to be 'okay' or 'mediocre' but for it to be as bad as people are calling it just has me kind of shuddering.

Hopefully it will come out in the reviews that it was a crock... I really wanted to like this game, perhaps they'll patch it, but doubtful.

I would chime in on this, but I can't even play the stupid thing. The fucking ridiculously bad console port keeps insisting I have a controller plugged in and refuses to accept keyboard commands. Good thing Steam's so cool about giving refunds.

I'm probably one of very few people who think this but, I would have much preferred a good Aliens game instead of Borderlands 2. Hell, I'd take anything over another Borderlands game. In fact, if I was forced to choose between this obviously terrible game and Borderlands 2, i'd still pick ACM.

Also no pre-loading? That is just unforgivable.

While I can agree that the final product being inferior technologically is something something worth condemning.
It is entirely [unreasonable] to whine about a sequence/mission from the demo not being in the actual game.

Several games have done it before to various extents, from just altering the edges of the sequence to make it self contained, to having entire dedicated demo levels.

Yes, the final product is unquestionably shit.
Yes, the demo it of higher polish than the actual product.

No, the exact sequence of events not taking place is not something that should be complained about.

From what I've heard this game wasn't actually developed by Gearbox and that Gearbox actually outsourced the game to another studio to work on.

If that's true, then my best guess as to what happened is that Gearbox made that demo, then handed it over to whatever other studio made the game and told them "make it like that." And in the end, that studio did "make it like that" since most of the stuff in the demo is in the final game, it's just that the studio didn't "make it like that" very well, and completely missed the point of what most of the stuff in the demo was.

Again, that's just my theory on what happened but I think it's a theory that makes sense. Still, if this IS indeed what happened then Gearbox still deserves all of the blame it's getting.

I don't necessarily think that this demo should've been a Jimquisition video in its entirety, because he's missing so many other things to grip about. This game is so awfil, in not just gameplay its, but how it manipulates and fabricates the truth so much, that if gamers get pissed, really pissed, this could change the nature of pre-ordering, and quite frankly, accountability. This game is, I don't even know what to compare it to, its so bad in its many ways unrelated to gameplay. The ending isn't in the game, thats DLC. Mass Effect 3's ending way have been completely insulting shit, but it was an actual ending. Oh, and the plotholes in Aliens: Colonial Marines are as insulting to your intelligence to the plotholes in the ME3 ending, and like ME3, you're supposed to swallow them wholeheartedly. They appear to piss on one of the most beloved sci-fi franchises for a buck. The developers might just have actually lied to their publisher, and broke the terms of a contract by outsourcing to other studios, so they could expand their studio by buying the Duke Nukem IP, and then they continued to lie (if they were in the first place) by making their hit Borderlands 2. SEGA might be able to sue Gearbox pretty much out of existence if they get any evidence of these rumours. Then there was the Survivor trailer, which was a complete fabrication to make it look like, as everybody knows it, horde mode, and absolutely nobody from Gearbox or SEGA correctly that as hundreds of articles and thousands of threads online were created on forums like this one, all under the assumption that it was, and they never corrected themselves until it was leaked by a Wal-Mart slip that is given to anybody who pre-orders there, which happened less than 48 hours before its digital relase, and of course, the review embargos, which I know serve a point, but that point has been a base point for a quite frankly anti-consumer tactic.

Jim, been following you for years, and your fanship is clouting your judgment. This video should've slammed everything. There is literally a conspiracy behind the launch of the game, which is growing larger and larger. You need to not just slam SEGA and Gearbox, but take this opportunity as an example of many things wrong that are pervading the industry. And since I know he's actually reading this, its up to you, everybody else reading it. If you don't want to deal with this stuff, fine, okay, but we as consumers make part of this problem, I'd like to take this golden opportunity to fix something, if at all possible. I don't want a witch hunt, but we have to show that things like this are intolerable, and regardless of what IP it is being released, regardless of what developer, regardless of whatever is being taken out of the game to be given to people who pre-ordered at a certain outlet, that we're not going to put up with things like this.

This looks like a really bad case of unfinished feature creep, consolitus, and being rushed. Mostly consolitus.

@marsatlas, I understand that you're annoyed, join the club. I don't think flying off the handle at Jim is going to change much. Most of his recent episodes have described and derided exactly the subjects you're saying he should. As for this vid, jim doesn't normally release them on a wednesday. He didn't have to do this one. I for one am glad he took the time out to make this vid, it continues to demonstrate exactly who his videos are for. Us. The people who see and agreet that right now, too many publishers are trying to screw gamers and that too many gamers are allowing, even licensing them to do it.

This vid is spot. Frankly I think he'll prolly cover this in more depth on Monday. Jim's a gamer AND an Alien fan. I can't see this one sliding.

Dexter111:

Jesus, now that's sad.

I actually had high hopes for A:CM. I was hoping for a TRUE Aliens experience, what with the press demo and all. But now, All of my expectations are down the crapper.

*Sigh*

Gearbox... Where did things go wrong, man? Seriously.

Reminds me of the Iron Man trailer:

Only difference is Iron Man turned out awesome.

I've seen this before. There was once a Mass Effect 1 demo in which you could see the gameplay almost as it is in Mass Effect 2 (which had better gameplay IMO), but that never happened and ME1 ended up with mediocre gameplay, though story was awesome. This on the other hand had neither story nor gameplay and that's why it's a fail.

This is really fucked up. I hope everyone can get a refund.

Most of the demo was probably pre-scripted to get around the AI tricks, so any hope of them releasing the demo is probably null. My biggest concern is what happened to the graphics. It's not impossible to recreate that level of awesome atmosphere in actual gameplay, so I'm wondering which was outsourced or if part of the code was lost somehow.

Imp Emissary:

Grouchy Imp:
I'll start right off the bat by saying I don't know when this demo was made, but surely a game that has been in development for seven years will have some content cut from it that was at some point meant to be included? Fair enough if this demo is six months old then there is no excuse for it, but if this demo is older than that and is showing a sequence that was going to be in the game but then got cut after the demo was made, well, is it that bad?

Incidentally Jim, Facehuggers only twitch if it's love at first sight. Maybe this one just didn't feel your vibe. :)

Well my grouchy friend, it's not really so much that they removed the specific part where you "go do whatever", but rather (from what Jim has said in the viedo) it's more about the bigger "long term" things. Like the lack of detail in levels, the aliens not attacking smartly, the aliens not being introduced in such cool ways, and the little things like the facehuggers trying to say ":D HI!" It's more about removing those things, and not so much about just not having the same levels as in the demo.

That's what I think is more of what the issue is.
May you have a nice day.

I see where you're coming from, but it just doesn't sit right with me. The lack of detail in levels - well that's just a case of scaling a PC release to a console release isn't it (and I say that as a console owner, to forestall PC Masterace comments). Aliens not attacking smartly? Jim cites aliens not exiting and then re-entering vents to flank players as a feature that has been removed, but I saw evidence of this as early as the tutorial mission, not to mention through future levels. Aliens not getting the dramatic reveal they deserve ... fair do's, A:CM is pretty much guilty as charged on this point. At the end of the day a video game is much like a film in it's development, which is to say you'll always end up with a section on the bonus disc labelled 'deleted scenes'. I'm not saying A:CM is fault free (far from it in truth) but I am surprised by how quickly people have been to condemn a game whose only real 'crime' - and I use the term very loosely - is being average.

Anyhow I realise you weren't really wanting a back-and-forth but I felt the need to clarify my initial post. May you yourself have a good evening. *doffs cap*

Is it wrong of me to be glad this game is a disaster, in hopes that it might shake up some game publishers' obsession with that fucking movie?

I will be buying the game regardless.
Not that I don't trust Jim... In fact the timing of it all lends credit to the idea that he has been sitting on this for a while.
I'm guessing he played the game pre-release for review purposes but had to sign some form of NDA that prevented him from telling us sooner...
But anyway, I love all things Aliens so it's on my purchase list.

Fucking hell Gearbox, if you've got the skill on hand to make a demo as exciting as that, what happened to the rest of the game? And why make a big fancy demo, and then go through it and take all the good stuff out when putting it in the game? Why would you intentionally do that? Who's idea was that? Fire them! This was all just a big nasty joke, wasn't it?

Through the years as a gamer I have grown from making pre-orders and trusting companies to do right by their customers to Not trusting anything they say prior to the final product being released.

I have made my mistakes but I can happily say that I will never pre-order a game or think twice about trailers/gameplay presentations until I can see actual footage of the final products gameplay to make the decision myself.

The only downside is companies think I have no interest in their product such as with DMC I am waiting for it to go 20 bucks or less on steam. The game got record low sales but I have been burned way too many times by Publishers/Developers to trust them with 60 bucks again.

MarsAtlas:
Jim, been following you for years, and your fanship is clouting your judgment. This video should've slammed everything. There is literally a conspiracy behind the launch of the game, which is growing larger and larger. You need to not just slam SEGA and Gearbox, but take this opportunity as an example of many things wrong that are pervading the industry. And since I know he's actually reading this, its up to you, everybody else reading it. If you don't want to deal with this stuff, fine, okay, but we as consumers make part of this problem, I'd like to take this golden opportunity to fix something, if at all possible. I don't want a witch hunt, but we have to show that things like this are intolerable, and regardless of what IP it is being released, regardless of what developer, regardless of whatever is being taken out of the game to be given to people who pre-ordered at a certain outlet, that we're not going to put up with things like this.

I have the same hours in the day that you do and multiple game coverage jobs. I've been covering this shitshow extensively for Destructoid (which happens to be my day job) and took time out of that to make this video. Not that I'm saying, "Suck it up and be grateful," I'm saying this is just one part of a boatload of attention I've been giving this around the Internet. Just to prove I've not been idle this week, check these posts out:

My extensive review of Aliens: Colonial Marines.
http://www.destructoid.com/review-aliens-colonial-marines-244276.phtml

My captured footage of CM's ridiculous glass damage pop-out:
http://www.destructoid.com/aliens-colonial-marines-innovates-with-self-heal-glass--244698.phtml

Review round up:
http://www.destructoid.com/reviews-elsewhere-aliens-colonial-marines-244711.phtml

Patch coverage:
http://www.destructoid.com/aliens-colonial-marines-patched-on-all-systems-244825.phtml

SEGA's outsourcing denial:
http://www.destructoid.com/sega-denies-aliens-colonial-marines-was-outsourced-244728.phtml

I've done a LOT more than just bring up this sham of a demo. And as far as you talking about me addressing wrongs across the entire industry -- you said you've been following me for a while, surely you know I do that on Jimquisition almost every week!

Naqel:
While I can agree that the final product being inferior technologically is something something worth condemning.
It is entirely [unreasonable] to whine about a sequence/mission from the demo not being in the actual game.

Several games have done it before to various extents, from just altering the edges of the sequence to make it self contained, to having entire dedicated demo levels.

Yes, the final product is unquestionably shit.
Yes, the demo it of higher polish than the actual product.

No, the exact sequence of events not taking place is not something that should be complained about.

I was not "whining" about the exact sequence of events not taking place. NONE of those events come CLOSE to taking place. The demo is a fabrication on par with Killzone 2's first ever E3 trailer -- and at least Killzone 2 came clean before release and subsequent screenshots/trailers were truthful.

The demo shown here was mined for trailer footage and screenshots for months after its appearance. I'm a massive fan of Aliens, been covering this for years, and not once was I ever led to believe the things I'd seen wouldn't be in the game. Quite the opposite. It's not just that the demo wasn't "exactly" like the game. It was a different game -- period.

Mister Six:
Jesus. I thought people were blowing how bad the game was out of proportion by comparing it to Duke Nukem, but Christ if this true Gearbox really dropped the ball.

To be honest, it isn't ALL Gearbox's fault. Most of the game was developed out of studio, while the demo itself was developed in-house, at least from what I have heard.

If it is 100% true, then I wish Gearbox would have kept the entire thing in-house as it might have been a good game, otherwise. We have a few Gearbox employee's on the escapist. I wish they could go into more detail about this.

Wow, the game was so bad that Jim actually did a "Special Edition" just to express his distaste for it.

I'm probably just trying to force myself, but I at least found the game moderately enjoyable. But then again, I'm a huge fan of the series. I've heard some say that's even more of a reason to feel insulted by this, but by "big fan" I simply mean I love the movies and have liked every Aliens and/or Predator game I've played, yet I'm just ignorant enough of the full scope of the lore that the "Big Canon-Destroying Twist" didn't strike me as a huge mistake.

That said, I won't deny that I'm disappointed in it for the very reason this video exists: it was nothing like what was shown to us. The AI in particular doesn't leave much to be desired, it leaves EVERYTHING to be desired. This game suffered the same fate as Duke Nukem Forever in that it spent almost the same amount of time in developement hell. It never stood a chance of living up to how awesome and amazing it was supposed to be. At least with Duke, there's the flimsy argument of "Well, it IS a Duke Nukem game, just what WERE you expecting?" But in this case, there are examples of genuinely good aliens-based games (AvP2 for the PC standing out as the gold-star example in my book).

But I preordered it which means I bought it. I've completed the campaign but haven't touched the multiplayer yet, I hear that aspect of it is actually pretty good (and the aspect that Gearbox actually worked on while Time Gate did the campaign).

Ronack:
So, basically... False advertising? Isn't that against the law in the US of A?

Yes, but the issue is one where you have to ask who will bring the case. We've been down this path before. Take say "Mass Effect 3" for example, when you get past the details of the ending, there is a bottom line where we have tons of solid information and promises saying specifically that is not the kind of ending we'd get, combined with an App showing that behind the scenes they had no intention of keeping those promises. Love it, hate it, or feel the whole situation is overblown... the bottom line is EA/Bioware very clearly and directly lied to people, they promised things they did not deliver on, and were shown to have had no intention of delivering on. I believe there was an attempt to bring this to court, but like most things it fell apart, and I don't think it was ever heard in court, or if it was it probably wasn't represented properly.

See, a big part of the problem is that all of the big lawyers that know enough to fight entertainment companies like this, work for those companies, or at least get paid a small fee to create a "conflict of interests" and prevent them from representing another side. A common tactic for big business, you ensure none of the guys that can seriously hurt you or play the game will ever be able to. Lawyers are in business so they are typically more than happy to take the money. You run into this whenever you want to fight big businesses all the time. For example when I was screwed by my employer, it took an act of congress to even find a lawyer who COULD represent me, and thousands of dollars later he just wasn't able to practically force them to face me off of the Reservation (ie under state/federal law) where I would have won, since he just didn't have the connections and knowhow to work the process. I was badly screwed, and 100% right, but the game was basically loaded against me from the beginning.

The gaming industry also got wise to this a while back, and you might notice they have started writing things into EULAs about people using their products giving up the right to engage in class action suits and/or other coordinated legal action. Meaning you have to pay for your own lawyer and go after them as an individual, as opposed to getting say 5000 angry people together, pooling resources and then being able to potentially finannce and maintain a legal effort against a big business assuming they could find someone with the right expertise to make it possible. How this applies in the case of Gearbox I do not know, but it seems to be an issue, and I remember reading about it (even on The Escapist if I remember) when we first started seeing the trend appear.

That's the problem with big business, the safeguards that exist against them are not practical to use. They haven't done anything illegal by simply making it nearly impossible for you to pursue legal action against them.

At the end of the day any person POed about losing $50 on a video game to the point of wanting to go after a video game company, probably doesn't have any clue of how to contact an expert in the right kind of law, never mind find a lawyer who is enough of an expert to pursue a case like this the right way, from the right angles, with the right precedents to have a chance. Assuming he could find someone, how the hell does he pay that person in what is liable to be a long case? When a business has tons of money, and you operate out of pocket, a common strategy is just to engage in delaying tactics to draw things out and render you unable to sustain your own lawyer/legal team. Then of course by drawing out the process they run up their own legal bills, which in of themselves become a deterrant because then the guy gets stuck with them if they lose. At this level the guy could be gambling his entire future livelyhood on the fact that someone lied to him and cost him a personal stake of like $50.

This isn't exactly expertly written, but it's a general breakdown of why it being illegal doesn't matter. Breaking the law doesn't much matter if you can't afford justice. In theory you could convince the state to pursue it as a criminal matter, but at the end of the day the state probably isn't going to want to use it's resources over something as trivial as a video game producer, they are liable to suggest the civil court system to you anyway. The state can choose when and when not to pursue charges.... which is also incidently why so many businesses pursue govermental contacts and finance politicians. It's high corruption, but if the governor or DA owes you a favor, it doesn't much matter if your wrong or not if the state just chooses not to pursue the case and decides to never accept there being enough evidence even when there is. Sure that's high corruption, and can ruin careers, but only if you can prove that's going on and of course find someone who cares enough about corruption over a business issue to care. If it's something like a video game, the odds of some CNN reporter or whatever with the juice to pull this off deciding to champion your corruption story are slim, because at the end of the day you personally only got screwed out of $50 no matter how big the issue was overall.

I'll also say it's not just an American issue, at the end of the day pretty much every major nation's legal system is corrupt in the same basic ways. It's why the crusading lawyers and cops and such are so popular in the civilized world as fantasy characters... it's escapism from how screwed up the system really tends to be. It's nice to see a fantasy story where the evil corperations take a beating at the hands of some lawyer that (lulz) doesn't care about money, or some DA who (lulz) doesn't care about his political career. UK Crime Dramas, Japan's "Pheonix Wright" games... all kind of tap into the same frustration on some level I think.

At any rate I'm rambling the point is that while it sucks, chances are this is illegal in pretty much every civilized nation they sold it in, but at the same time it's unlikely it could ever be pursued in any of those nations in a practical sense. All of which is why I talk about the fantasy of gamers standing up to the companies by you know, costing them money, and just not buying their products, while ramping up the toxic behavior and letting no supporting voice go unopposed. That's crazy fantasy, but the sad thing is that rallying gamers (which is like herding cats) is more plausible than you know... having the problem handled legally because they did something like fraud... heck the legal system is so messed up that there are probably arguements that could be made now that despite lying and trying to pass off their game as something other than it was, it wasn't actually fraud, and that somehow it was all legitimate to screw people... because the legal system is just that far gone when it comes to this kind of thing.

Jimothy Sterling:

MarsAtlas:
Jim, been following you for years, and your fanship is clouting your judgment. This video should've slammed everything. There is literally a conspiracy behind the launch of the game, which is growing larger and larger. You need to not just slam SEGA and Gearbox, but take this opportunity as an example of many things wrong that are pervading the industry. And since I know he's actually reading this, its up to you, everybody else reading it. If you don't want to deal with this stuff, fine, okay, but we as consumers make part of this problem, I'd like to take this golden opportunity to fix something, if at all possible. I don't want a witch hunt, but we have to show that things like this are intolerable, and regardless of what IP it is being released, regardless of what developer, regardless of whatever is being taken out of the game to be given to people who pre-ordered at a certain outlet, that we're not going to put up with things like this.

I have the same hours in the day that you do and multiple game coverage jobs. I've been covering this shitshow extensively for Destructoid (which happens to be my day job) and took time out of that to make this video. Not that I'm saying, "Suck it up and be grateful," I'm saying this is just one part of a boatload of attention I've been giving this around the Internet. Just to prove I've not been idle this week, check these posts out:

My extensive review of Aliens: Colonial Marines.
http://www.destructoid.com/review-aliens-colonial-marines-244276.phtml

My captured footage of CM's ridiculous glass damage pop-out:
http://www.destructoid.com/aliens-colonial-marines-innovates-with-self-heal-glass--244698.phtml

Review round up:
http://www.destructoid.com/reviews-elsewhere-aliens-colonial-marines-244711.phtml

Patch coverage:
http://www.destructoid.com/aliens-colonial-marines-patched-on-all-systems-244825.phtml

SEGA's outsourcing denial:
http://www.destructoid.com/sega-denies-aliens-colonial-marines-was-outsourced-244728.phtml

I've done a LOT more than just bring up this sham of a demo. And as far as you talking about me addressing wrongs across the entire industry -- you said you've been following me for a while, surely you know I do that on Jimquisition almost every week!

Jim, why was Rebellion's AvP so... mediocre? I am only just going through it (Picked it up for $5.00) and so far it seems fun. The Marine campaign, while short so far, is actually tense and frightening. Does something happen later in the game that ruins it?

Also, I have to agree wholeheartedly with Aliens: Colonial Marines. I bought the Collector's Edition, only to return it that day after playing a friend's copy at his house. We both beat the game in under 8 hours. That shouldn't happen.

Capitano Segnaposto:
Jim, why was Rebellion's AvP so... mediocre? I am only just going through it (Picked it up for $5.00) and so far it seems fun. The Marine campaign, while short so far, is actually tense and frightening. Does something happen later in the game that ruins it?

Also, I have to agree wholeheartedly with Aliens: Colonial Marines. I bought the Collector's Edition, only to return it that day after playing a friend's copy at his house. We both beat the game in under 8 hours. That shouldn't happen.

Here's my old review of AvP. I have a kind of weird fondness for it, but it had too many issues for me to simply ignore: http://www.destructoid.com/review-aliens-vs-predator-164318.phtml

Grouchy Imp:

Imp Emissary:

Grouchy Imp:

Incidentally Jim, Facehuggers only twitch if it's love at first sight. Maybe this one just didn't feel your vibe. :)

Not much of an Alien fan, so I can't really say much about the quality(or lack there of) of the game(especially because I have not played the game).

I was just saying that Jim's argument was more about all the little(or big depending on how you look at it) things that were taken away from the game rather than some parts(levels I guess you could say).

As for people being mad at the game even though it's just "average"? Well, this is Aliens, and that bit of fiction has a very big/passionate fanbase. So, you could say the okay, or good enough is just not "adequate".

Also, don't be sorry about giving me a response! For someone with Grouchy in their name you have been very polite. Thank you for that, and the returned wish of a good time.

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