Jimquisition: A-LIE-ns: Colonial Marines

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Ulquiorra4sama:
Well hey, look on the bright side.

At least Gearbox have now managed to blow a massive hole in Jesse Scehll's "Demos hurt sales" theory.

Technically they still got the sales BECAUSE they had no demo all. All it cost them was their buyers respect!

Dexter111:
You can find an a/b comparison of certain scenes between the "Demo" they've shown and the actual game here, just showing the "Demo" and talking doesn't exactly have the same effect as comparing the two directly:

Arnoxthe1:
OK...

But WHAT ABOUT THE MULTIPLAYER? Is it half-way decent? I've already asked this in a similar thread but everyone's apparently still too busy crying about the campaign. Yes, it's crap. Didn't happen. Sorry. Let's move on now, shall we?

Just get Natural Selection 2 or AvP (2010) instead.

Thank you that really helped me better understand what some of the differences were in the game vs the demo especially the ai. God it really looks like shit by comparison. it almost makes you wonder what we would say without something "better" to compare it to.

rhizhim:

but it turns out its just another pre rendered thing that was labeled as actual gameplay just like duke nukem forever.

They did that with DukeNukem Forever? As in, released prerendered animation as gameplay?

Mister Six:
Jesus. I thought people were blowing how bad the game was out of proportion by comparing it to Duke Nukem, but Christ if this true Gearbox really dropped the ball.

I think it's worse than Duke in that Duke Nukem Forever was simply a bad game, however this Alien game is an utter lie when compared to the demo. I believe if the demo had been sincere it might not have pissed everyone so much and just passed as "another bad Alien game".

The comparison video which Dexter111 posted was incredibly jarring. The graphics in the final game are a fucking embarrassment. I'd go so far as to say that some of those textures look like they were lifted from Rebellion's AvP - the 1999 version.

Siege_TF:
People are looking at this the wrong way; it's a conspiracy. Gearbox is doing okay, between Borderlands and XCOM they can get away with making a bad game that performs terribly and walk away unscathed. That's not the case with the publisher Sega, and Gearbox developed this game to give them a sucker punch and bring them one step closer to the brink.

XCom is Firaxis/2K. Gearbox has ACM, BL, and Duke.

- - -

Gearbox really needs to be taken to task for this blatant bit of false advertising. It's like seeing an ad for a Quarter Pounder w/ Cheese, going to a McDonald's, ordering a QPwC, and getting a fish head wrapped in week-old lettuce instead. No one would put up with that kind of shit, and neither should anyone who got suckered in by Gearbox's lies.

As someone who never really followed this whole thing and the was confused by the nerdrage over it this video is pretty helpful. Makes me wonder why there isn't a wiki for internet blowouts, I still have no idea where the WarZ thing went. :/

edited for me being stoopid

I remember watching this demo ages ago so I assumed the final game would be a bit different. Not to that extent though kinda like how the Halo 2 demo at E3 had nothing that was in the final game.

I pre-ordered the Collector's Edition, I might be too forgiving but I am having fun wtih the game and think it was worth my money. They've the got the Marines and their weapons perfectly nailed.

The Xenomorphs do swarm you but they jump onto the ceilings and walls while coming and they do try to flank and surround. When on their own they hide behind objects and hiss to lure you in. I was also surprised about how quickly they can kill you, no God mode COD that's for sure.

Fighting the human enemies is annoying and tedious, graphics aren't the best but the gameplay is smooth and I didn't encounter any bugs or glitches like other people have. Winters can be a bit of a blank slate but he does have his moments as do the rest of the cast. I haven't touched the multiplayer yet.

Could have been a lot better but could have been worse too.

michael87cn:
Sounds/looks to me like they ran into hardware limitations and had to cut a lot of things out.

I would assume they(the devs) were as heartbroken as we are about it, but the console generation is seriously out of date by now. Thems the breaks, wait until next generation for this kind of game play.

Jim goes on an angry rant as if they were just stupid or something, but I seriously doubt thats the case. They probably ran out of funding or (as I said) ran into hardware limitations. So the actual game couldn't play like the demo did.

Edit: Or time limitations. Funders don't give them "until its done" to polish these games, you know.

Dood, what are you smoking? Have you seen skyrim, the lighting mods for it? Have you seen Dead Space? Hell, even Bioshock. They do exactly what A:CM failed to do.
And Jim isn't acting like they were stupid, he's acting like they lied. Which they did. Put this into context. Gearbox/Sega, released the demo video with the expectations that this would be the gameplay. They then gagged any review from discussing the game until day of release.

At no point did they mention or allow to be mentioned that the graphics, animation and content were scaled back, drastically, for ANY reason. What you are saying might make sense if other previous Alien games over the last ten years hadn't existed and done a better job in many ways.

Fact is, they mislead consumers, held back anychance anyone had of knowing what had becoem of the game, continued to pretend everything was a-ok, then hoodwinked everyone. They knew that pre-orders would sell on this game based on the footage they released and the obvious fan anticipation. There is nothing reasonable or regretful about this. They could have told us that they fucked up, they didn't. They could have even tried to blame it on hardware limitations. They didn't. They took the money and ran.

Maybe, with enough backlash, they may try to make some good on this.

And EA pigs might fly.

How long has the actual title been under work? I mean specifically Aliens: Colonial Marines, because I remember hearing about this before AvP2(the game - not the movie) which was a lot of years ago.

I remember how I thought it was going to suck utter balls to be locked in one perspective, compared to playing all three, and how team work at the time would be near impossible, if you relied on AI companions. Of course, this was a long time ago, but it sounds like nothing has changed.

I am definitely an Alien fanboy, the concept is amazing and the stories around the characters who are subjected to these are great, in a sci-fi kind of low-brow way. It's all about the heat of the moment, which the demo pretty much promises.

The sad part is that I am not surprised at the result, I haven't tried it yet and I'm not bound to bother. I didn't like the last installment either, which felt like a pure console experience - which I personally hate.
Especially the way you had to change between walls as an alien was horrible and made my favourite game type the worst I had ever tried.

Wow...I...don't know how they managed to do it...but Gearbox ACTUALLY justified the argument of illegally downloading a game to demo it...

Glad you made this Jim, this was very fitting.

Another DUKE style release. oh well glad i didnt buy that game.

Smilomaniac:
How long has the actual title been under work? I mean specifically Aliens: Colonial Marines, because I remember hearing about this before AvP2(the game - not the movie) which was a lot of years ago.

There WAS a previous 'Colonial Marines' game in development years back. But that one got cancelled, and this one by Gearbox has only been in like the last...I think, 3-4'ish years in development at most. But just like Duke Nukem it was simply that they took too much time developing/promoting a game, while failing to make the game itself better. They DID try and make it look better and more sleek, but that took away from the time needed for making the game fun. Because while there are people who say the game looks like crap, it actually looks pretty impressive in terms of that old'school Sci-Fi gritty/sleekness that the movies had (Aliens HAS a reason to be full of gray and dull backgrounds, and guns that sound out of synch with the muzzle flash).

But overall they hyped the game, focused too much on licensing and being 100% accurate to little details most people won't notice (ie. the muzzle flash and out of synch gunfire, which was in the actual movies), and getting the 100% go ahead from the series creator. Plus it might've also had to do with trying to compete with fast-paced action shooters of this generation (COD, Battlefield, ect.), and less on the horror aspect that the Aliens universe inspires. (Kinda how Deadspace went from 'Jump and scream like a girl in #1' to 'Stomp aliens to death while singing Cotten Eyed Joe in #3', and YES that was a Critical Miss reference).

SteewpidZombie:
*snip*

Thanks for the info :)

My brother got this game. He was glad that he didn't get the CE, but he texted me that, "wall running in AVP was better than this" and that "XMen Destiny had more replayability than this". His gamer pride was hurt, but it wasn't until I directed him to the YouTube video depicting the difference between the demo and the actual game that his pride was absolutely crushed.

He sleeps now with a broken heart, much like one Jimothy Sterling.

I showed my friend this video after he finished the game... and now he is just sad. As am I.

I am so disappointed. I had literally only just watched alien and aliens a week or so before this came out and loved both. Then I remembered this game and got a bit hyped. And then. Saw a couple of reviews which said it was just mediocre and I thought maybe I could pick it up when it was cheap. And then. I heard from everyone else that it was a pile of tripe and not even worth waiting for it to be cheap. I feel very let down

Lieju:

rhizhim:

but it turns out its just another pre rendered thing that was labeled as actual gameplay just like duke nukem forever.

They did that with DukeNukem Forever? As in, released prerendered animation as gameplay?

there you go:
in 1998, and they said its mostly finished and needs some minor polish.

in 2001, its mostly done and will come out "when its done"

guess what came out in 2003?

Ronack:
So, basically... False advertising? Isn't that against the law in the US of A?

In practice, no. Capitalism and all that. Even in the rare cases where advertisers fail to loophole their way out of breaking the law there is no actual punishment for false advertising in the US. No fines. No sentences. Literally not even a slap on the wrist.

Ronack:
So, basically... False advertising? Isn't that against the law in the US of A?

That big "work in progress" watermark they had at the beginning of the "demo" absolves them of false advertising claims. From there they can come up with any number of excuses for why the game doesn't look like this; especially if they never actually said it was true gameplay footage. (there are a number of ways to not say that while still tricking the public that you are and get away with it legally) Which is a damn shame because that looked really awesome; they may have had an unexpected customer in me had it not been fake.

I am just so disappointed with what a travesty this game turned out to be. It's fucking disgraceful really. I was looking forward to this game for six years. I was expecting THE Aliens game.

I can't even bring myself to be mad. I'm just.... I don't even know.

Yokillernick:

Arnoxthe1:
OK...

But WHAT ABOUT THE MULTIPLAYER? I've already asked this in a similar thread but everyone's apparently still too busy crying about the campaign. Yes, it's crap. Didn't happen. Sorry. Let's move on now, shall we?

I'm not 100% sure how many people actually bought an Aliens game for the multiplayer. It's like asking how many people bought Battlefield 3 solely for the singleplayer, it just doesn't happen.

Y- You're kidding, right? Go to any forum discussing any Aliens game, and it's going to be 90% topics discussing the multiplayer (balancing issues, how to play as certain races, etc), 8% topics saying that the game doesn't measure-up to AvP1999, and 2% topics about the actual campaign. Give or take.

Damn that demo looked good. A whole game along them lines was exactly what I was hoping for when I heard about the game in the first place.

Grouchy Imp:
I'll start right off the bat by saying I don't know when this demo was made, but surely a game that has been in development for seven years will have some content cut from it that was at some point meant to be included? Fair enough if this demo is six months old then there is no excuse for it, but if this demo is older than that and is showing a sequence that was going to be in the game but then got cut after the demo was made, well, is it that bad?
)

A good point, but the issue I think isn't just that these things do not exist, it's that they do not represent actual game-play. That the game itself, is actually worse than the demo, as the AI is not as smart, the graphics are not as good, the animations are not as smooth and so on.

If all the things they showed were a part of the game, but not quite how it was shown, then I don't think it'd be a problem. As it is, the demo quite simply is of a higher quality than the game itself, and that amounts to false advertising.

Not that they will get in trouble for it, as they said it was a "work in progress."

Wait, scores in the FORTIES!? Holy jumping mother of god in a sidecar with chocolate jimmies and a lobster bib - they REALLY screwed up.

At least this proves that not all review scores can be bought.

well, at some points i was thinking meh so they made a new level for the demo that's not so bad
but then i was all.. nah they've totally made a new, better more polished and complete version of the game
so why didn't this make it into the final game? did they hire a workforce of competent people for the demo
and just slack jawed yokels for the game development?

it's flabbergasting, and shocking and completely illogical
i mean, seriously if your demo is this good vs the rest of the game,
then delete the game and use the demo level

Sweet demo. But for 90% of it to be a lie?
Someone should get fired for this, or sued for false advertising.

I'm still trying to come up with an explanation for how they did not re-use the assets from the demo.

I mean, I may have no clue about how this works whatsoever, but couldn't you - theoretically - if you have a texture or model or so set up for a high-poly pre-rendered CGI section just take that and reduce the poly count/resolution and fit it into the game? There is absolutely NO discernible reason whatsoever for them to take out things like the cracked glass in the landing bridge sequence, or alter the textures that much, or omit most of the animations.

WHAT ON EARTH HAPPENED?

Theory: The demo was created by an external contractor, who either went bankrupt or made off without giving Gearbox access to the assets. Something like that.

Honestly I am legally blind without my contacts in, and even with them in my eyesight is shit, so all of this just seems like bitching about nothing when talking about the graphics .Please don't interpret that to mean that you don't have a right to bitch, you do. I am just unable to commiserate with you on the subject as they both look very similar to my eyes (saves me lots of money on graphics cards). Still though I'm in the pissed off boat.

It was the AI for me that did me in. I checked out the demo videos before I plopped down my 50 on the PC version (got a pre-order deal) and loved how the aliens moved. I loved the AI and the pathing and how everything screamed Aliens. Then I played the game and got suicide bomber shooter #8. I went back and checked the other difficulty settings (I played on normal first), and there wasn't any noticeable change in the AI.

Thank god for you Jim, too bad I didn't see this sooner...

I hadn't paid any attention to colonial marines until all the crappy reviews came out but that demo was so good I got retroactively excited just watching it. Kind of wish I hadn't traded in AvP now.

Awesome video.
The one thing that is really mind-boggling about this is how much work they obviously put into that demo only to throw it away afterwards... I mean, there's plenty of animations there they could have used, they voiced 10 minutes of what looked like a game etc... that's TONS of content just down the drain.
Other than that, Gearbox really should apologize for this kind of BS.

After all this I'm really glad I didn't preorder the game's collector's edition like I intended to after watching that demo.

Halo 2, man...

Remember kids, dont pre-order stuff and just wait for the final product.

The original AvP game in `99 or so was phenomenal. I crapped myself sooooo many times it wasn't funny. No saves as you go through, xenomorphs respawning here there and everywhere meant you couldn't 'stay put', and having to freakin' double back through a place you went through before and thought 'oh Jesus I'm glad I'm not going the other way because this would SO be a place for an ambush...' .... phenomenal game. Just phenomenal.

And then there's this apparent sham/fantasy ... a SHAMTASY!

Hell, in a few months when it's on Steam's Easter Sale or whatnot for $2 I might buy it. But based on the bad press I've heard so far they can go fuck emselves.

Seriously people @ Gaybox or whatever you're called .. you work in fucking IT. You know how quickly word travels on the Internet when you take a beloved IP with almost 30 yrs of history and love put into it, some of the most freakin' awesome moments of cinema history, bend it over and fuck it dry. Look at George Lucas and that fuckin' Jar Jar, or Indiana being raped by crystal skulls n whatnot ... Jesus you fucktards. Your moron managers with their sham MBAs need to go back to kindergarten. Let's see them finger paint a green Mickey Mouse and see how the kids react to them and their 'vertical fucking slice'.

Vertical slice wtf marketing bullshit is that ?!

Legion:
Damn that demo looked good. A whole game along them lines was exactly what I was hoping for when I heard about the game in the first place.

Grouchy Imp:
I'll start right off the bat by saying I don't know when this demo was made, but surely a game that has been in development for seven years will have some content cut from it that was at some point meant to be included? Fair enough if this demo is six months old then there is no excuse for it, but if this demo is older than that and is showing a sequence that was going to be in the game but then got cut after the demo was made, well, is it that bad?
)

A good point, but the issue I think isn't just that these things do not exist, it's that they do not represent actual game-play. That the game itself, is actually worse than the demo, as the AI is not as smart, the graphics are not as good, the animations are not as smooth and so on.

If all the things they showed were a part of the game, but not quite how it was shown, then I don't think it'd be a problem. As it is, the demo quite simply is of a higher quality than the game itself, and that amounts to false advertising.

Not that they will get in trouble for it, as they said it was a "work in progress."

The inclusion of the phrase "work in progress" kinda renders this whole shitstorm pointless, surely. Seems about half the ads I see on TV for videogames have the disclaimer "Not representative of actual gameplay" in the bottom of the screen and no-one kicks up a fuss over them, so if this particular A:CM trailer states "work in progress" then I fail to understand the magnitude of this uproar. It's a shame that the finished product didn't have all the features Gearbox wanted to implement, sure, but at no point did Gearbox promise these things to us. They aren't going back on some contract by witholding these features, as cool as it would have been to have then in the final product.

Arnoxthe1:

PainInTheAssInternet:
You have AVP. You don't need this one. Enough games go to shit because they crowbar-in multiplayer.

AvP2 is unbalanced in the predators favor and AvP is too old. I don't know about AvP 2010 but I'm sure nobody plays that anymore as well.

It would've helped if it wasn't such a pain in the ass (heh) to just get to the game. Seriously, whose idea was it to make a single person be able to launch a game without an automatic timer? I swear there are people who start lobbies and then leave it running just to troll. Then there are the idiots who insist on trying to fill all the slots who have obviously never played online meaning that they just end up getting a revolving door of players and never launch.

And if someone drops out, they can't be replaced for some stupid reason, meaning that if a game becomes unbalanced, it's impossible to balance them unless someone on the other team (or two teams) quits as well.

But I stand by what I said; Aliens Colonial Marines was sold on the signale-player, as it should have been, thus their failure to accomplish that is very notable.

Though it might have been because they knew multiplayer was such a mess.

KeyMaster45:
That big "work in progress" watermark they had at the beginning of the "demo" absolves them of false advertising claims. From there they can come up with any number of excuses for why the game doesn't look like this; especially if they never actually said it was true gameplay footage. (there are a number of ways to not say that while still tricking the public that you are and get away with it legally) Which is a damn shame because that looked really awesome; they may have had an unexpected customer in me had it not been fake.

They did say that though, e.g. see this, which is apparently still one of the Trailers/Advertising materials being shown on Xbox Live:

You're going to see what, what the game actually looks like. Not just Screenshots, but the actual gameplay.

But then, he's famous for being a known liar/exxagerator/PR person, I wouldn't ever really trust anything he says.

Grouchy Imp:
The inclusion of the phrase "work in progress" kinda renders this whole shitstorm pointless, surely. Seems about half the ads I see on TV for videogames have the disclaimer "Not representative of actual gameplay" in the bottom of the screen and no-one kicks up a fuss over them, so if this particular A:CM trailer states "work in progress" then I fail to understand the magnitude of this uproar. It's a shame that the finished product didn't have all the features Gearbox wanted to implement, sure, but at no point did Gearbox promise these things to us. They aren't going back on some contract by witholding these features, as cool as it would have been to have then in the final product.

Please stop defending bad business practices and the people involved that tried to hoodwink you, you aren't doing anyone any favors by doing that, least of all yourself.

There is no other conceivable reason for them to make a 10 minute long game demo that looked better than the final product and state it is "actual gameplay" other than trying to deceive people and try and get in those juicy early sales.

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