Jimquisition: A-LIE-ns: Colonial Marines

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This is why I don't pre-order anything and wait for the actual game to be out a week or two.

In UK law, it is a legal requirement that if you sell goods by sample then, according to the Sale of Goods Act 1979, the product must correspond to the sample.
Now sure how that would work in the case of a video-game, mind you. Also, gearbox could argue it wasn't a sample.
Still, interesting thought, I wonder if we'll ever get an answer.

Grouchy Imp:

Legion:
Damn that demo looked good. A whole game along them lines was exactly what I was hoping for when I heard about the game in the first place.

Grouchy Imp:
I'll start right off the bat by saying I don't know when this demo was made, but surely a game that has been in development for seven years will have some content cut from it that was at some point meant to be included? Fair enough if this demo is six months old then there is no excuse for it, but if this demo is older than that and is showing a sequence that was going to be in the game but then got cut after the demo was made, well, is it that bad?
)

A good point, but the issue I think isn't just that these things do not exist, it's that they do not represent actual game-play. That the game itself, is actually worse than the demo, as the AI is not as smart, the graphics are not as good, the animations are not as smooth and so on.

If all the things they showed were a part of the game, but not quite how it was shown, then I don't think it'd be a problem. As it is, the demo quite simply is of a higher quality than the game itself, and that amounts to false advertising.

Not that they will get in trouble for it, as they said it was a "work in progress."

The inclusion of the phrase "work in progress" kinda renders this whole shitstorm pointless, surely. Seems about half the ads I see on TV for videogames have the disclaimer "Not representative of actual gameplay" in the bottom of the screen and no-one kicks up a fuss over them, so if this particular A:CM trailer states "work in progress" then I fail to understand the magnitude of this uproar. It's a shame that the finished product didn't have all the features Gearbox wanted to implement, sure, but at no point did Gearbox promise these things to us. They aren't going back on some contract by witholding these features, as cool as it would have been to have then in the final product.

But that's the difference. It may say work in progress, but it also says in-game footage. While you are correct in saying that the former means that they admitted it's not the final product, the fact that the final product is worse, is another matter entirely.

Although it is never explicitly stated, it is taken as a given that when somebody advertises something, and what they show is a "work in progress", it is meant to say "Don't judge it too harshly, as it's still got more work to be done."

In this instance, the "work in progress" is actually better than the final product, so people are pissed off, because it is effectively false advertising. Nobody looks at a work in progress and expects it to be better than what they are getting, even if the phrase doesn't guarantee otherwise.

Like Dexter said, you are defending poor business practices. It doesn't matter that they have absolved themselves of any legal issues by claiming it was a work in progress, they deceived people by advertising a superior product than the one they actually released. Nobody expects a half done product still being worked on to be better than the one they buy.

It's like they released an Alpha build of the game on accident, wtf. :P

Fucking pathetic on the part of Gearbox. They really should know better.

I can't believe I got suckered into this too. I'm sending my copy back right away. In fact I'd forgotten that I'd even preordered it in the first place! Seeing it arrive today was like being told I was a complete loser. I think I'm going to have to start being more sensible with my video game purchases in future.

Legion:

Grouchy Imp:

Legion:
>snip<

>snip<

But that's the difference. It may say work in progress, but it also says in-game footage. While you are correct in saying that the former means that they admitted it's not the final product, the fact that the final product is worse, is another matter entirely.

Although it is never explicitly stated, it is taken as a given that when somebody advertises something, and what they show is a "work in progress", it is meant to say "Don't judge it too harshly, as it's still got more work to be done."

In this instance, the "work in progress" is actually better than the final product, so people are pissed off, because it is effectively false advertising. Nobody looks at a work in progress and expects it to be better than what they are getting, even if the phrase doesn't guarantee otherwise.

Like Dexter said, you are defending poor business practices. It doesn't matter that they have absolved themselves of any legal issues by claiming it was a work in progress, they deceived people by advertising a superior product than the one they actually released. Nobody expects a half done product still being worked on to be better than the one they buy.

I wouldn't say I'm defending poor business practices, just really pointing out this level of reaction is disproportionate to the offence (and it is an offence, just not one of earth-shaking magnitude).

As has been previously pointed out by other users, this article sheds some light on exactly what happened to the game displayed in the trailer and after reading it I am more inclined to blame Timegate for the loss of content than Gearbox.

It's almost like they made a completely different game and just borrowed some stuff from the demo.

Maybe it was pre-rendered or some sort of money saving plan that didn't require such good game play throughout. I guess it depends on what they referred to it as? but I imagine there is some sort legal BS that absolves them of the responsibility.

I guess anything worth saying is worth saying verbosely, eh?

"And here this part isn't in the game, and.. oh yeah this part isn't in the game either, nor is this part..."

Kinda got the point after 2 minutes.

So, Gearbox should have their demo team make the full game and have their full game team go get lunch for the demo team?

Didn't Halo 2 pull something similar?

This video was put out... when? Early 2012, Summer 2012? Well, this was over a year and when they decide to cut things out or add things, can you blame them for changing things? There were a lot of games, which showed the game to be A and it was in fact B. Heck, the first Half Life 2 Screenshots showed TONS of content not present in the final game... did anyone call Valve out on it? No. (Granted, they had quite a lot more time between the release of their screenshots and their game, but still)

And some of that stuff is just nitpicking in my oppinion. For example the Weapon-table-example - so, in the actual game, they decided not to make the thing nice and tidy but for the demo, they did it to make it easier for them to show/find stuff. Turret-Placement: Again, maybe they felt that putting it down in first-person would feel better than doing it in third-person.

I am not saying that the game is actually great (in fact, I haven't played it yet but I am going to at the weekend), but blaming them to show stuff they change later? Come on, it's not the first time someone did this.

Proverbial Jon:
I can't believe I got suckered into this too. I'm sending my copy back right away. In fact I'd forgotten that I'd even preordered it in the first place! Seeing it arrive today was like being told I was a complete loser. I think I'm going to have to start being more sensible with my video game purchases in future.

Here's what I do:
1) Never buy into hype (Ghost Recon: Future Soldier, Amazing 2010 demo, crappy final product, so I know what you guys are going through)
2) Don't even preorder, put them as holiday gift ideas or shell out $60 and buy it yourself a month after release.
3) Don't even pay any attention to the game news.

I got the game but haven't played it yet, but now watching this video is already putting me on the train to regretsville. Hopefully there is something redeemable about the game.
Now I am really worried.

Good episode.

Now I know some people have problems with CGi trailers. A problem which I neither understand or share but when companies release these things as "demos" they're leading you to believe that it's a slice of the game and that really pisses me off.
I too was really quite positive when I saw this "demo". Luckily a friend of mine bought this game and I realised that one had very tittle to do with the other. I really do think that it's a bit of a dirty practice.

If the finished product had even an iota of the polish shown in this "demo" then it would have made the game a whole lot better. I know people (who love the Alien lore) who thought the game was decent enough. Playable. But I couldn't really look past all it's faults. I tried loving it but as soon as you were immersed in an environment or situation that really reminded you of the movies and were starting to get in to it the game would rip you out that state of mind and remind you just how messy it is.

Why is it so hard to make a great Aliens game? Why? They need to make it into a survival horror, not a shooting gallery... Perhaps Irrational Games should have a go?

I would say that perhaps Gearbox just shouldn't work with other people's properties... but they did fine with Half-Life, once upon a time.

This is just... what the hell happened...? How did this game, from most reports, turn into such a cluster-f@#%? Sega even did a pretty good job with the Aliens game they made on the DS, for cryin' out loud; how did a a developer and a publisher with relatively good records manage to turn a good license into such an apparently under-developed product? Did they not allow enough time to optimize it for consoles and have to cut a bunch of corners at the last minute? Or spend too much time trying to sync up the art assets to their final version to work on the AI? The demo seems to indicate, if nothing else, that they knew what the game should look like; how did they fall so short?

DVS BSTrD:
A:CL "Hey demo! Have you ever been mistaken for an actual Aliens game?"
Demo "No, Have you?"

Hahaha!
Thank you, you just made my day

Jesse Billingsley:

Proverbial Jon:
I can't believe I got suckered into this too. I'm sending my copy back right away. In fact I'd forgotten that I'd even preordered it in the first place! Seeing it arrive today was like being told I was a complete loser. I think I'm going to have to start being more sensible with my video game purchases in future.

Here's what I do:
1) Never buy into hype (Ghost Recon: Future Soldier, Amazing 2010 demo, crappy final product, so I know what you guys are going through)
2) Don't even preorder, put them as holiday gift ideas or shell out $60 and buy it yourself a month after release.
3) Don't even pay any attention to the game news.

You're right, of course.

I normally only preorder games that I'm pretty damn sure will be magnificent, or games I will play despite what any of the reviews say. Skyrim was a good example and I'm hoping Bioshock Infinite will be too. This one? Perhaps I had far too much faith.

That said, I have been saved by not buying the latest Resident Evil and Assassin's Creed sequels this time around. Both of their previous games gave me an inkling that their franchises were going downhill.

Am I the only one who wondered how that marine had an alien drooling all over him, and then shoot it in the face point-blank, and still somehow manage not to get a single drop of that high-molar acid all over him?

So, other than the obvious financing rationales, why make such a great proof of concept and then not prove the concept? Did they blow through their budget making the demo? If so, they may as well have just released the demo, included a final sequence against the Queen and then sold that for like 9-20 bucks, Maybe as a trial run for an episodic set up. The thing that struck me was that, there was such a glaring descrepency not only in the quality of the presentation, but the competence of the developers and their understanding of pacing, tension, drama and design. Methinks the team that made this demo asked for too much cheddar and either Gearbox or Sega went with a cheaper dev team. As a result we, the consumers suffer and isn't that becoming par for the course.

socialmenace42:

Extra video on a Wednesday
No Intro or theatrics
No Ironic self-referential smarmyness
No swearing, calm blow-by-blow break down

I think this is a major problem with internet personalities. While their work is entertaining, it seems to always come pre-packaged with this type of stuff. I think it makes them worse because it takes away the focus from the material, which is the reason why people keep coming back. Spoony is VERY guilty of this and it is part of the reason why I stopped watching him. I never liked the Nostalgia Critic (I thought his older stuff ranges from OK to Not Bad), but the series relaunch included a bunch of unfunny skits(Probably to keep the DR actors in a job) and a drawn-out intro sequence; some of the reasons why I stopped watching spoony. The cinema snob and Yahtzee do it too, but they are subtle about it, and that is what makes them great.

I don't know if it's just me, but I tend to skip over all that stuff.

BTW, does this count as JimSkippable? Do we next get an episode of UnQuisition?

I just finished the game last night. I don't think it's as bad as some reviewers have been saying, but I will admit, I wouldn't give it more then a 5 out of 10. I wrote up a first impressions review a few days ago and I still agree with most I said there, I never posted a score etc because I hadn't finished the game and didn't think that would be fair.

That said, I think the campaign is shallow and average. The story was predictable, the twist, I don't think was as bad as some games do, could have been handled better, but at least we get a little explanation for it and it wasn't in the last 5 minutes of the game either. As for the game never explaining how the Sulaco ended up back over LV-426, it didn't need to, you got your answer when

I've been finding the multiplayer fun, I gotta admit I won't play the campaign again unless a friend got this and begs me to co-op it, even then I may not as it was pretty forgettable aside from the sewer level. So yeah, I guess I'd the multiplayer is the only solid reason to get the game, as it isn't the game we were promised. Still got an awesome cargo loader figure though, guess that's something else.

Well, that is legitimately appalling...

Congrats Gearbox, you bombed it. First Duke Nukem Forever and now this, just stick to what you're good at, making your own IPs.

Reminds me of the exact same thing they did with Halo 2. While the game was fun, those tech demos were criminal in portrayal, compared to the end product.

tzimize:
Isnt this fraud?

This is fraud. Right?

I bought my game on steam, so I guess I'm fucked either way...but god damnit.

Make a ticket with Steam requesting a refund. They've done them in the past, can't guarantee you'll get it this time though, but very much worth a shot. Include some decent reasoning too, it's not like they haven't made plenty of fuck-ups you can cite.

Wow, am I ever happy I didn't see that footage before now. I might have actually been hyped for this game. It's actually really heart breaking to look at this and then think back to the actual gameplay footage I have seen. Just, wow.

Jeez, it's going to take one hell of a quality streak in product before I can really trust Randy and Gearbox again... And that hurts because I liked them....

This is worrisome. Everybody knows that trailers don't indicate what the game will be like when it comes out.

But now, pre-release gameplay doesn't indicate what the game will be like.

xDarc:
This is why I don't pre-order anything and wait for the actual game to be out a week or two.

Same here. I made an exception for ONE game: Portal 2. But because that game was made by Valve software I knew that I would actually GET the product that I thought I would get.

It's just staggering the audacity Gearbox had to pull this bullshit. They make an awesome looking demo... and then completely disregard everything they put into the awesome looking demo and made a shitty game. Yeah, I'm pretty sure that WAS just prerendered bullshit because otherwise I'd have to swallow that Gearbox just threw away perfectly good gameplay and replaced it with complete shit for absolutely no reason. Which makes the demo a total scam, intentionally trying to pass off a prerendered CG movie as gameplay to falsely advertise a shitty product.

In one masterstroke, Gearbox have managed to throw away EVERY scrap of respect I had for them, earned from Half Life: Opposing Force, Borderlands and even having the courage to TRY and save Duke Nukem Forever (even if that failed horribly). To just have the NERVE to try and pull this garbage is just outright sleazy.

tzimize:
If the multiplayer was anywhere near the AVP from 1999 I would buy it only for that, fuck single player.

That or AVP2 would be fine with me. I'd absolutely get it just for multiplayer like that, and I hardly play competitive FPSes anymore. I have fond lanparty memories of different races as separate teams in separate rooms with open doors between them, so you could talk quietly to the people next to you and then yell at the people across the hall when you ate their face off after hiding above a doorway they didn't bother checking on their way through. I wasn't actually good at the games, but they were just so much fun to be mediocre at. Heh.

Ukomba:
It's like they released an Alpha build of the game on accident, wtf. :P

That would at least explain the inconsistencies. Maybe, if you bought the game, you'll get the actual game by mail or something.

OT: I am a huge Alien fan and fan of Colonial Marines (the group not the game). I preordered because of that 10 minute demo thinking "If this is the Demo, then the full game will be awesome." I preordered the collector's edition, paid in full, and patiently waited for the game to be released. Sadly, like so many things, it failed to live up to even the smallest of expectations. The story is horrible (even if it was fan fiction), the visuals are extremely low quality, the animations (I'm an animator, so this is a big one for me) wouldn't have passed in my Advanced class, the characters are boring and unlikable, and ...

image
I am very disappointed with Gearbox on this one. I will never preorder a game ever again.

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