Zero Punctuation: Aliens: Colonial Marines

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It's not a glitch per se, but a pretty severe narrative derp. At the game's onset, you're making your way through the umbilical and towards the Sulaco. One of your guys suddenly is afflicted with a Chest-Burster; nevermind how a Facehugger never even entered the picture!

"Uuuuh, Randy, we gotta use that animation! We gotta!
- But it makes no sense in the current build!
- WE GOTTA USE IT OR IT'S GAME OVER, MAN! GAME OVER!
- Okay, fine! Use it! Jeeze!
- Kthnxbai!" *gleefully proceeds ahead with the murder of an already moribund plot*

hands down, the funniest ZP since DNF. loved it

So this game is hamfisted into the movie franchise continuity?

-Dragmire-:
Now, I shouldn't really involve myself in this but...

I don't think any of the developers did the ad campaign. Sounds like the publisher side of things.

I do agree though, that blame should fall heaviest on the shoulders of the last people to work on the game before release. Having to go over layers of preexisting code must have been a bitch to deal with though, then again, they said it was done...

Oh, sure, the publisher was likely responsible for much of the ad-space ads. As in, adverts on the television, website banners, etc. I'm not forgetting that. That's why I said Sega is as much to blame as Gearbox.

However, Gearbox has been doing their own adverts and hyping. Some of it via Youtube, Twitter, etc. Some of it via the blog-o-sphere. Much of it, however, in the form of Randy Pitchford getting out in front of the gaming community and doing the PR shuffle by saying, "Oh man, this game is so sweet! We love Aliens and we're making sure this game is the best thing to hit the franchise ever! Trust me, I'm Randy Pitchford!"

Why anyone still trusts what that man says after the travesties and broken promises of Duke Nukem Forever, Aliens: Colonial Marines, and all the other nonsense he spews forth is beyond me...

[edit]
Don't misunderstand me, though. I have no beef with many of the people over at Gearbox. They have quite a few talented artists, designers, programmers, and engineers over there. Many of my issues are with the corporate side of things.

My favorite glitch was when the soldier who had a chest burster in him just got onto his knees, hollered with a grenade in his hand, and blasted himself to bits sending you and a few other crew members to die...

Which sadly, was not a glitch. It was scripted in the game's plot and honestly was very poorly written.

Everything about this game made me think about how gaming companies are acting. I can't even pre-order games anymore without being flat out lied to, and I regret pre-ordering Dead Space 3 because it turned out to be a crappy game too. Not as bad as this one mind you, but still had elements in which made me regret getting the game despite knowing it was the series being milked by EA.

I apologize for my cruddy mood, but really this is getting a bit much. Please, to all developers.. don't do this kind of stuff anymore. Let us trust you again through your efforts of showing good faith and stop these awful practices because you're greedy or to lazy to improve.

Vigormortis:

Hardly their game - they just did about 10% of it as the game when they got it was more or less finished. You can't blame them for that.

...Just as it was their fault Duke Nukem Forever released in such an awful state.

Except I was talking about DNF?

mike1921:

RedDeadFred:

mike1921:

Businesses should fall and rise with their products. Otherwise the consumer always gets fucked. If a business is untrustworthy and does shitty things like BLATENTLY FALSE ADVERTISEMENT in the form of a demo than it should cripple them.

While I agree that they should definitely lose money and maybe even get fined (wishful thinking probably) over their business practice, to condemn their entire company to death would be a major overreaction and just plain barbaric. And quite honestly, people wouldn't be getting screwed over if they didn't pre-order and actually took time to research the product they are buying. I mean, you can't honestly say that Gearbox has a track record worthy of pre-order trusting (Duke Nukem!?). When you pre-order, you are gambling your money and sometimes you lose. Is it fair? No, of course not but that doesn't mean people shouldn't realize the risk.

Losing money past a certain point is the death of the company.

I've said it before that you need to treat pre ordering as an investment and decide on risk vs reward, and that A:CM is incredibly high risk for the incredibly petty reward. I don't honestly see it as unfair either that there's a risk. You are , by preordering, deciding that you are convinced that the game is good enough for you to not wait for reviews to give them your money for whatever reward they're giving you.

Although in the case of Colonial Marines: Anyone who preordered the game should be god damn entitled to a full refund after that fucking demo faking false advertisement.

Well of course losing money past a certain point make a company go belly up but considering how well Borderlands 1 and 2 did, I don't think that's really a problem for them. I was just saying that there should be repercussions for this.

Anyway, I completely agree with everything you said. The false advertising is why I said it was unfair.

Sadly, I bought this damn game. Great review Yahtzee, it really needed a good thrashing.

Favorite glitch: Alien teleported into a closed off room, froze, and became immortal. It was just moving its head back and forth like it was looking for enemies.

Bindal:

hermes200:

Bindal:
Sorry but here, I am peed off out of princible. If Yathzee reveals such a huge part of the plot (and pretty big twist in the canon), then yes, I expect a freaking spoiler warning. It doesn't matter how good or bad the game is - it is still wrong to do.

You do realize this game is not part of the cannon, right? FOX distanciate themselves as far as they could of this turd (who can blame them?) even before it was revealed to be that bad. In fact, it is exactly the point Yatzhee makes: that by bringing back a character that was established to be dead in Alien 3, they reduced the story of A:CM to the level of fan fiction, where they can retell the cannon to include the characters they like...

Bindal:
Hardly their game - they just did about 10% of it as the game when they got it was more or less finished. You can't blame them for that.

Which is exactly what they are doing to justify this game. Blame TimeGate and Sega about the status of the game...

Do you see a pattern there? Because it makes me doubt the excuses they give to Duke Nukem. It seems the blame game is the best game Pitchford knows how to play...

1 - No, it is canon. Deal with it. Was stated a billion times and was even a selling point.
2 - No, DNF was an entirely different. They were never even related to it until they decided to purchase what was done (a game about 90%) so it could finally get released after 14 years of waiting and it about to die.

1 - My fault then... I thought I read somewhere that Fox has decided to distance themselves from the game and only sold the rights for the IP. At the end of the day, I would expect them to consider this canon the same way Star Wars: Force Unleashed is canon (which is, until some movie directly contradicts it, at which point it stops being such). In any case, I would advice you to take "selling point" from gearbox with a grain of salt; the chances of being spoiled of such "experience" with a more gratitude spirit; and the Alien canon with less sacrosanct respect, since Fox, after 2 AvsP movies and this glorified fanon, obviously doesn't.

2 - No, just no. That is only an excuse from Pitchford to cop out some blame, which I will not accept. There were 9 months from the announcement (September 2010) to the release of the game (June 2011), with a delay in between. There are games that are completed in that time. Are you going to tell me that, in all that time, no one in Gearbox looked at the game and said "this is crap"? A game that has been in development for longer than MS has a gaming division was now "90% complete"? How about the CEO of the company threatening people that didn't like the game (http://www.gamefront.com/gearboxs-randy-pitchford-reviewers-who-dont-like-duke-nukem-forever-will-be-held-accountable/)? Or comparing it to Half Life 2 http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-07-13-duke-nukem-forever-a-discussion-with-randy-pitchford ? Or interviews where he says all the work they did updating the game and its humor to the present (thank god, if the final product is any indication I don't want to think what was left on the cutting room floor)? Please note that most of those interviews were published around (or after) the game release, so ignorance is not a valid excuse. When shit hit the fan and the game quality was inexcusable under the 2K and Gearbox standards, he turned around and started pointing fingers at everyone but themselves (in stereotypical executive fashion): "the journalists don't get it", "the humor is not for everyone", "the other guys were the guys that REALLY developed", "we only bought it", "next time, we will get it right". And now, its all over again... I could almost predict his moves based on the timeline of DKF, but this time it took them 6 years, not 14.

serious biscuit:
All I took away from this is that we need a Blues Brothers game.

We have a Blues Brothers' game.

The glitch Yatzhee mentioned seemed to be something common in Gearbox games.

he pretend not to like being characterised like a personal attack dog for shitty games. But this review was top form. It clearly brings out the best in him.

I'm thinking that Weyland-Yutani based their business model on that of the Umbrella Corporation. ...or vice versa.

I would like to know, why the hell everyone bitches about this game? Not once in my both playthroughs did I ever have a glitch. The controls are fine, the weapons are fine, the AI needs a bit of a touch up (Works well enough), and the adventure on the planet was fun. You people just don't appreciate what people TRY to do for you. The game was to give a backstory of what happened after Aliens 2 and Gearbox worked hard on this. I bet some of you didn't even go through the first damn mission and came up with some 'review' just because a graphic mesh didn't pop in. You people are unbelievably stupid and arrogant. The whole gaming community is filled with petty little children and ignorant people.

It's a game. Not everything is going to work out all the time just because you expect it to.

General Vengeance:
1. I hope this crushes Gearbox, they have no integrity.
2. I hope this ends people preordering games, it just encourages assholes like Gearbox to make cash grab games.
3. I hope Yahtzee starts to review good games, constantly reviewing bad games is cute and funny but its like shooting fish in a barrel.

Really? No integrity? Gearbox is an asshole? Gearbox is like the uncle of the video game revolution. Half Life, Counter Strike, Borderlands, Borderlands 2, Halo CE, and Brothers In Arms.

Don't down talk a company that was involved in so much of the video game's history.

SS Betrayal... I have to write that one down.

... Ok then. ^^

GildaTheGriffin:

General Vengeance:
1. I hope this crushes Gearbox, they have no integrity.
2. I hope this ends people preordering games, it just encourages assholes like Gearbox to make cash grab games.
3. I hope Yahtzee starts to review good games, constantly reviewing bad games is cute and funny but its like shooting fish in a barrel.

Really? No integrity? Gearbox is an asshole? Gearbox is like the uncle of the video game revolution. Half Life, Counter Strike, Borderlands, Borderlands 2, Halo CE, and Brothers In Arms.

Don't down talk a company that was involved in so much of the video game's history.

You give them too much credit. Of all those examples, the only series that are truly theirs are Borderlands and Brothers in Arms. For Counter Strike they did some development (main developers were Valve and Ritual), and their involvement in HL and Halo was mainly porting jobs. Nice jobs, but hardly the pillars of videogames history you presume.

GildaTheGriffin:
I would like to know, why the hell everyone bitches about this game? Not once in my both playthroughs did I ever have a glitch. The controls are fine, the weapons are fine, the AI needs a bit of a touch up (Works well enough), and the adventure on the planet was fun. You people just don't appreciate what people TRY to do for you. The game was to give a backstory of what happened after Aliens 2 and Gearbox worked hard on this. I bet some of you didn't even go through the first damn mission and came up with some 'review' just because a graphic mesh didn't pop in. You people are unbelievably stupid and arrogant. The whole gaming community is filled with petty little children and ignorant people.

Here is the deal... everyone works hard on everything. Games are hard, and you can be sure the developers of any facebook game worked as hard (or harder) than the developer of some AAA game; so working hard is no real differentiation on the quality of something.

The idea of something being excused of being bad because its hard is not a real excuse. If I cook a cake made of shit, I don't expect people to eat it because "I worked hard on it", not when there are a lot of other cakes around that are NOT made of shit, and not when I try to CHARGE people for my shit cake. And I won't be taken seriously if I start saying "this cake is not shit" or "its shit, but so tasty you barely notice it". Want to know why we bitch about this game? Because its not good, they know it, yet they expect us to act like it was god gift to us (or, at least, just as good as any other game).

Sorry, but companies don't make games "for you", they make them to sell them TO YOU. Pitchford made himself clear when he talked down, banned or threatened people that had complains with his games, that his idea of community is not based on sympathy, so he shouldn't expect sympathy from us. They don't work "on good intentions"; they don't sell games "on good intentions", so they shouldn't expect people to pay them "on good intentions". That kind of attitude can be understandable on an indie developer that makes a small game as a hobby on his free time and is trying to make a name for himself; but Gearbox is a big company, with a big budget, years of experience and dozens of people working full time for 6 years... So, no. What they "TRY to do" is not good enough, and it "works well enough" is not good enough.

I do feel bad for people that truly worked on the game and had no way of communicating to the outside world that it was shit and no real power to change it, so if Gearbox goes down the sink tomorrow (which it deserves), I will hope for two things: that the few talented people had little problem to find a new job, and that the people responsible for this overpriced shit cake sinks with it.

hermes200:

GildaTheGriffin:

General Vengeance:
1. I hope this crushes Gearbox, they have no integrity.
2. I hope this ends people preordering games, it just encourages assholes like Gearbox to make cash grab games.
3. I hope Yahtzee starts to review good games, constantly reviewing bad games is cute and funny but its like shooting fish in a barrel.

Really? No integrity? Gearbox is an asshole? Gearbox is like the uncle of the video game revolution. Half Life, Counter Strike, Borderlands, Borderlands 2, Halo CE, and Brothers In Arms.

Don't down talk a company that was involved in so much of the video game's history.

You give them too much credit. Of all those examples, the only series that are truly theirs are Borderlands and Brothers in Arms. For Counter Strike they did some development (main developers were Valve and Ritual), and their involvement in HL and Halo was mainly porting jobs. Nice jobs, but hardly the pillars of videogames history you presume.

GildaTheGriffin:
I would like to know, why the hell everyone bitches about this game? Not once in my both playthroughs did I ever have a glitch. The controls are fine, the weapons are fine, the AI needs a bit of a touch up (Works well enough), and the adventure on the planet was fun. You people just don't appreciate what people TRY to do for you. The game was to give a backstory of what happened after Aliens 2 and Gearbox worked hard on this. I bet some of you didn't even go through the first damn mission and came up with some 'review' just because a graphic mesh didn't pop in. You people are unbelievably stupid and arrogant. The whole gaming community is filled with petty little children and ignorant people.

Here is the deal... everyone works hard on everything. Games are hard, and you can be sure the developers of any facebook game worked as hard (or harder) than the developer of some AAA game; so working hard is no real differentiation on the quality of something.

The idea of something being excused of being bad because its hard is not a real excuse. If I cook a cake made of shit, I don't expect people to eat it because "I worked hard on it", not when there are a lot of other cakes around that are NOT made of shit, and not when I try to CHARGE people for my shit cake. And I won't be taken seriously if I start saying "this cake is not shit" or "its shit, but so tasty you barely notice it". Want to know why we bitch about this game? Because its not good, they know it, yet they expect us to act like it was god gift to us (or, at least, just as good as any other game).

Sorry, but companies don't make games "for you", they make them to sell them TO YOU. Pitchford made himself clear when he talked down, banned or threatened people that had complains with his games, that his idea of community is not based on sympathy, so he shouldn't expect sympathy from us. They don't work "on good intentions"; they don't sell games "on good intentions", so they shouldn't expect people to pay them "on good intentions". That kind of attitude can be understandable on an indie developer that makes a small game as a hobby on his free time and is trying to make a name for himself; but Gearbox is a big company, with a big budget, years of experience and dozens of people working full time for 6 years... So, no. What they "TRY to do" is not good enough, and it "works well enough" is not good enough.

I do feel bad for people that truly worked on the game and had no way of communicating to the outside world that it was shit and no real power to change it, so if Gearbox goes down the sink tomorrow (which it deserves), I will hope for two things: that the few talented people had little problem to find a new job, and that the people responsible for this overpriced shit cake sinks with it.

1. Facebook games are not under the pressure like a 'real' company is. Companies have hundreds or even thousands of workers in over several locations around the world with several positions of bosses/managers that rely on the cooperation of there workers to do their jobs the way they see fit. Games like Aliens CM have publishers, who market and fund the games. Games like Farmville don't. So they have to fit in a budget and make sure its to fit the platforms with the hardware and software it has. You are trying to compare two different types of games and thinking it makes sense to you. But I do my research, I look at how things are made and woven together from both a publisher's view and a developer's view.

2. Trying is the best thing you can do. Employees at Bungie stated when Halo CE was in development, they were not sure of their abilities to make a triple A title so they just followed their ideas and hoped that game sold well. Valve employees did the same thing during Half-Life's development, because they were designing a game that was of nothing the world had seen before in that time period, so they just tried their best and followed through. Nobody really knows how people react to it, so they TRY. So please, show some respect for all those game developers who do their hardest to please you with something they hope makes you happy and gets them their paychecks. If they didn't make you happy, then at least pat them on the back and tell them they did the best they could with the software, the money, and the talent they had to work with.

Bindal:

Vigormortis:

Hardly their game - they just did about 10% of it as the game when they got it was more or less finished. You can't blame them for that.

...Just as it was their fault Duke Nukem Forever released in such an awful state.

Except I was talking about DNF?

So you're saying Duke Nukem Forever being released as such an awful mess wasn't their fault because, after purchasing the rights to the game, they only bothered to put "10%" of the work into the final product?

Do you not realize how utterly ridiculous that sounds? If they saw how bad the game was when they bought the rights to it (which they assuredly realized) but never bothered to even try to fix it, how is it NOT their fault the game released as such a piece of shit? They knew what they had. They released it anyway. It's riddled with their logos. Randy Pitchford still makes a point of bragging about the game and saying it's dramatically better than it is.

Then, to add insult to injury, they (especially Randy Pitchford) lied to us about what it was. And, had the audacity to charge sixty dollars for it.

Still failing to see how the awfulness of DNF and A:CM weren't Gearbox's fault.

GildaTheGriffin:

General Vengeance:
1. I hope this crushes Gearbox, they have no integrity.
2. I hope this ends people preordering games, it just encourages assholes like Gearbox to make cash grab games.
3. I hope Yahtzee starts to review good games, constantly reviewing bad games is cute and funny but its like shooting fish in a barrel.

Really? No integrity? Gearbox is an asshole? Gearbox is like the uncle of the video game revolution. Half Life, Counter Strike, Borderlands, Borderlands 2, Halo CE, and Brothers In Arms.

Don't down talk a company that was involved in so much of the video game's history.

But how much respect can you give to someone who simply rides the coat-tails of the revolutionaries?

I agree the artists, programmers, and engineers over at Gearbox deserve a lot of respect. They are some damn talented people. However, the corporate side of Gearbox isn't something I'd openly brag about. If anything, their corporate level employees are holding back their best designers.

My fave glitch wasn't a very big or impressive one like most I've read on hear. Mine was a humble alien jumping off a wall, falling through the floor and dying, with but one hand sticking up through the floor. When I shot the hand (as you do in these situations) it started waving. I watched it for about a minute and waved back, thinking, "Maybe these aliens ain't all bad..."

Darth_Payn:

MB202:
Watching this video, I have to wonder... Does Yantzee watch any of Jim Sterling's stuff? Like, he's been going on about the Alien franchise and this game in particular for a few weeks now, so I find it weird that Yantzee would not only not mention this in his video, but called out all Alien fans by saying everything after Aliens was crap.

I think it's general consensus that everything after Aliens sucks; even Ridley Scott discounts everything after Aliens as non-canon (except Prometheus, because that was a prequel). A lot of calls for "Yahtzee should eviscerate Colonial Marines" were made in the comments for Jim's videos talking about Aliens. Although Yahtzee isn't above taking the occasional jab at fellow Escapist contributors (ex: MovieBob).

What you see as a supposed "jab" against MovieBob, I see as Yahtzee giving Bob WAAAAAY too much credit.

Is it just me, or does the gamebox art look better after Yahtzee gave it the shade of "eggy fart"? Because that is an apt description of the game itself.

Caramel Frappe:
My favorite glitch was when the soldier who had a chest burster in him just got onto his knees, hollered with a grenade in his hand, and blasted himself to bits sending you and a few other crew members to die...

Which sadly, was not a glitch. It was scripted in the game's plot and honestly was very poorly written.

I like how you are walking through the umbilical facing towards the centre when he blows the grenade (asshole). You then fall backwards out of the Sulaco towards the opening.

Is it just me, or the Co-Op problem in all action horror games could be solved by simply, you know, enabling friendly fire? this way only a FEW people would need to shoot the aliens in a formation that doesnt make their bullets be aimed at the team.

GildaTheGriffin:
I would like to know, why the hell everyone bitches about this game? Not once in my both playthroughs did I ever have a glitch. The controls are fine, the weapons are fine, the AI needs a bit of a touch up (Works well enough), and the adventure on the planet was fun. You people just don't appreciate what people TRY to do for you. The game was to give a backstory of what happened after Aliens 2 and Gearbox worked hard on this. I bet some of you didn't even go through the first damn mission and came up with some 'review' just because a graphic mesh didn't pop in. You people are unbelievably stupid and arrogant. The whole gaming community is filled with petty little children and ignorant people.

It's a game. Not everything is going to work out all the time just because you expect it to.

Pitchford, is that you? :>

Seriously though, I would've thought that the main reasons for most people's gripes with this game have been well-enough documented (time and time again) so I don't understand you saying "I don't know what everyone's complaining about". If you enjoyed it then good for you and if you didn't encounter any glitches then again good for you - looks like you're in the lucky minority.

However I don't think you can just brush this off with 'Gais. Gais. C'mon gais, they tried, so go easy on them' attitude. These are supposed professionals and are supposed to be releasing a product with a professional level of quality and by many accounts they've dropped a turd. Yes, give folks credit for their hard graft - especially as commented the poor artists and coders who did their job but could do nothing really to change the course of what was happening. A released product should come with an expected minimum standard of quality and if many people do not believe a product meets that standard, then complaining about it does not make them stupid, arrogant, petty or ignorant. If you go to a restaurant, order a meal and are given (and then expected to pay for) something that's not up to reasonable standards, you are not the bad person for complaining about it.

EDIT: P.S. Yahtzee, you Callipygian Superman. Don't be so coy. You know we always want you around!
2nd edit: spelling d'oh

GildaTheGriffin:

hermes200:

GildaTheGriffin:
Really? No integrity? Gearbox is an asshole? Gearbox is like the uncle of the video game revolution. Half Life, Counter Strike, Borderlands, Borderlands 2, Halo CE, and Brothers In Arms.

Don't down talk a company that was involved in so much of the video game's history.

You give them too much credit. Of all those examples, the only series that are truly theirs are Borderlands and Brothers in Arms. For Counter Strike they did some development (main developers were Valve and Ritual), and their involvement in HL and Halo was mainly porting jobs. Nice jobs, but hardly the pillars of videogames history you presume.

GildaTheGriffin:
I would like to know, why the hell everyone bitches about this game? Not once in my both playthroughs did I ever have a glitch. The controls are fine, the weapons are fine, the AI needs a bit of a touch up (Works well enough), and the adventure on the planet was fun. You people just don't appreciate what people TRY to do for you. The game was to give a backstory of what happened after Aliens 2 and Gearbox worked hard on this. I bet some of you didn't even go through the first damn mission and came up with some 'review' just because a graphic mesh didn't pop in. You people are unbelievably stupid and arrogant. The whole gaming community is filled with petty little children and ignorant people.

Here is the deal... everyone works hard on everything. Games are hard, and you can be sure the developers of any facebook game worked as hard (or harder) than the developer of some AAA game; so working hard is no real differentiation on the quality of something.

The idea of something being excused of being bad because its hard is not a real excuse. If I cook a cake made of shit, I don't expect people to eat it because "I worked hard on it", not when there are a lot of other cakes around that are NOT made of shit, and not when I try to CHARGE people for my shit cake. And I won't be taken seriously if I start saying "this cake is not shit" or "its shit, but so tasty you barely notice it". Want to know why we bitch about this game? Because its not good, they know it, yet they expect us to act like it was god gift to us (or, at least, just as good as any other game).

Sorry, but companies don't make games "for you", they make them to sell them TO YOU. Pitchford made himself clear when he talked down, banned or threatened people that had complains with his games, that his idea of community is not based on sympathy, so he shouldn't expect sympathy from us. They don't work "on good intentions"; they don't sell games "on good intentions", so they shouldn't expect people to pay them "on good intentions". That kind of attitude can be understandable on an indie developer that makes a small game as a hobby on his free time and is trying to make a name for himself; but Gearbox is a big company, with a big budget, years of experience and dozens of people working full time for 6 years... So, no. What they "TRY to do" is not good enough, and it "works well enough" is not good enough.

I do feel bad for people that truly worked on the game and had no way of communicating to the outside world that it was shit and no real power to change it, so if Gearbox goes down the sink tomorrow (which it deserves), I will hope for two things: that the few talented people had little problem to find a new job, and that the people responsible for this overpriced shit cake sinks with it.

1. Facebook games are not under the pressure like a 'real' company is. Companies have hundreds or even thousands of workers in over several locations around the world with several positions of bosses/managers that rely on the cooperation of there workers to do their jobs the way they see fit. Games like Aliens CM have publishers, who market and fund the games. Games like Farmville don't. So they have to fit in a budget and make sure its to fit the platforms with the hardware and software it has. You are trying to compare two different types of games and thinking it makes sense to you. But I do my research, I look at how things are made and woven together from both a publisher's view and a developer's view.

2. Trying is the best thing you can do. Employees at Bungie stated when Halo CE was in development, they were not sure of their abilities to make a triple A title so they just followed their ideas and hoped that game sold well. Valve employees did the same thing during Half-Life's development, because they were designing a game that was of nothing the world had seen before in that time period, so they just tried their best and followed through. Nobody really knows how people react to it, so they TRY. So please, show some respect for all those game developers who do their hardest to please you with something they hope makes you happy and gets them their paychecks. If they didn't make you happy, then at least pat them on the back and tell them they did the best they could with the software, the money, and the talent they had to work with.

1. That's... not even close to the point. My point was that quality and difficulty are independent, and even games with no quality are as difficult to make as the best AAA game. Hardship is a given in any example, so it is not be differentiation factor. In that case, "being difficult" and "working hard" are not really excuses for delivering something of less quality, especially in the professional environment. So, your rebuttal is that they are "difficult" on a different sense? That's not even close to the point. Does it bother you so much that I choose examples that are not equal because the funding is different? How about Daikatana and Deus Ex (they are both published by external entities, are made for the same platform and are even from the same year)... Does that sound like a fairer comparison to you? Should I hold them on equal terms of quality because "John Romero tried so hard to make me his bitch"? No one can deny a lot of people worked hard on both of them (at least, someone has to), but that alone says nothing of the end result.

Also, if you think facebook developers answer to no one, are not under pressure or don't have budget and time restrictions to make their work, you need to go back to "research". Ask any of the thousands of employees of Zynga or EA/Facebook how is it not to work for a "real" company.

2. Here is a revolutionary concept in gaming development that both your examples use extensively (I am sure as someone that "do my research, I look at how things are made and woven together from both a publisher's view and a developer's view", you have stumble on it), its called "iterative development". This is how it work: people TRY something, evaluate it, learn from it, find what doesn't work, fix it and TRY again, evaluate it, learn from it, and so on. Alternatively, they might realize it doesn't work at all and dump it entirely. No idea should go straight from the mind of his creator to the finished product; great ideas are not done by accident, they are iterated time and time again by several people until they are up to his creators standards, or they die in the cutting room floor (to make those decisions is the job of the game director). Valve and Bungie are great examples because they don't just "go with their guts"... nothing, from the tone of voice of GLADOS to the opening of Halo 1 is the result of chance, but the result of a cohesive vision that was given form after countless details has been done and redone. Rovio made 27 games before angry birds, each of which contributing (in terms of experience acquired and knowledge of what did and did not work) to the success of their latest game, and each of them iterating countless times themselves.

So, yes... I appreciate when artists and developers try new things (in fact, experimenting is a vital part of design and development on any field) or designers make their intentions public; but attempts and intentions are cheap. I appreciate a lot more when they iterate on their attempts to make them better and more consistent with the game they work on, not when they try a few times and give up because someone decides "that is good enough". Or, you can say: when they all act as professionals about it.

So this is one to avoid. I really hope Metal Gear Revengeance is going to get a video review, I liked the game and Yahtzee's take on the final boss by itself would be worth it.

Vigormortis:

Bindal:

Vigormortis:

...Just as it was their fault Duke Nukem Forever released in such an awful state.

Except I was talking about DNF?

So you're saying Duke Nukem Forever being released as such an awful mess wasn't their fault because, after purchasing the rights to the game, they only bothered to put "10%" of the work into the final product?

Keep in mind DNF is abbreviation for Did Not Finish, as well.
Which is just fine description of both games, on several layers.

They are all to blame. Never mind arguing about who's to blame MORE.

IamLEAM1983:
It's not a glitch per se, but a pretty severe narrative derp. At the game's onset, you're making your way through the umbilical and towards the Sulaco. One of your guys suddenly is afflicted with a Chest-Burster; nevermind how a Facehugger never even entered the picture!

"Uuuuh, Randy, we gotta use that animation! We gotta!
- But it makes no sense in the current build!
- WE GOTTA USE IT OR IT'S GAME OVER, MAN! GAME OVER!
- Okay, fine! Use it! Jeeze!
- Kthnxbai!" *gleefully proceeds ahead with the murder of an already moribund plot*

Not gonna argue with you as to whether or not the whole blowing up a grenade in the middle of an umbilical and fucking a whole bunch of other marines was stupid and/or bad writing (because it was). But on the whole 'facehugger never entered the picture' thing, you are actually wrong my friend.

The moron who blows himself up, Keyes, is the first marine you encounter on the Sulaco. He's one of Rhino squad, the group that was sent in before you. Remember where you found him? It was in the room with the lurker, which you probably remember as actually being atmospheric and a little scary due to the cat and mouse game you play. Now, do you remember what you were doing before the lurker interrupted you and what you finish doing afterward?

You cut him free from where he's been cocooned into the wall. Remember what else is in that room? Alien eggs. Some of which are open. And if you take a moment or two to explore, know what you can find on the floor? Dead facehuggers.

So him getting chestburst is actually foreshadowed. The scene itself is still dumb as all hell, but doesn't come out of nowhere

Teh Jammah:

IamLEAM1983:
It's not a glitch per se, but a pretty severe narrative derp. At the game's onset, you're making your way through the umbilical and towards the Sulaco. One of your guys suddenly is afflicted with a Chest-Burster; nevermind how a Facehugger never even entered the picture!

"Uuuuh, Randy, we gotta use that animation! We gotta!
- But it makes no sense in the current build!
- WE GOTTA USE IT OR IT'S GAME OVER, MAN! GAME OVER!
- Okay, fine! Use it! Jeeze!
- Kthnxbai!" *gleefully proceeds ahead with the murder of an already moribund plot*

Not gonna argue with you as to whether or not the whole blowing up a grenade in the middle of an umbilical and fucking a whole bunch of other marines was stupid and/or bad writing (because it was). But on the whole 'facehugger never entered the picture' thing, you are actually wrong my friend.

The moron who blows himself up, Keyes, is the first marine you encounter on the Sulaco. He's one of Rhino squad, the group that was sent in before you. Remember where you found him? It was in the room with the lurker, which you probably remember as actually being atmospheric and a little scary due to the cat and mouse game you play. Now, do you remember what you were doing before the lurker interrupted you and what you finish doing afterward?

You cut him free from where he's been cocooned into the wall. Remember what else is in that room? Alien eggs. Some of which are open. And if you take a moment or two to explore, know what you can find on the floor? Dead facehuggers.

So him getting chestburst is actually foreshadowed. The scene itself is still dumb as all hell, but doesn't come out of nowhere

Whoa. The game has to be rather frightfully generic for me to not remember that, because you're absolutely right.

Put it down to the whole thing feeling so monumentally dumb I didn't even bother to remember anyone's names. Except maybe O'Neill, but that's because O'Neill's AI seems to be frightfully bad.

Forget Amnesia. Forget H.P. Lovecraft adaptations. O'Neill's AI is utterly terrifying in its ineptitude.

Chattermouth:

Vigormortis:

Bindal:

Except I was talking about DNF?

So you're saying Duke Nukem Forever being released as such an awful mess wasn't their fault because, after purchasing the rights to the game, they only bothered to put "10%" of the work into the final product?

Keep in mind DNF is abbreviation for Did Not Finish, as well.
Which is just fine description of both games, on several layers.

They are all to blame. Never mind arguing about who's to blame MORE.

That's what I was saying in my previous posts. They all have equal blame in regards to the two games "that shall not be named".

The person I was "conversing" with seemed bent on alleviating Gearbox of all fault. Which, to me, was ridiculous.

My favorite glitch was when the npc characters would stand behind cover completely frozen, staring off into space like they were waiting for the next mother ship to land, and you'd stand there waiting for them so you can continue on, only for them to randomly run out from behind cover screaming at you about how they'll leave your pussy ass behind if you don't grow a pair and run. My next favorite glitch was how when you played as a alien you could sometimes crawl on things that weren't there, or glitch through walls.

Vigormortis:

Chattermouth:

Vigormortis:

So you're saying Duke Nukem Forever being released as such an awful mess wasn't their fault because, after purchasing the rights to the game, they only bothered to put "10%" of the work into the final product?

Keep in mind DNF is abbreviation for Did Not Finish, as well.
Which is just fine description of both games, on several layers.

They are all to blame. Never mind arguing about who's to blame MORE.

That's what I was saying in my previous posts. They all have equal blame in regards to the two games "that shall not be named".

The person I was "conversing" with seemed bent on alleviating Gearbox of all fault. Which, to me, was ridiculous.

He can't have meant that. I mean, seeing as how the nice-looking demo, with all that juicy dynamic lighting and great content which simply does not exist in the full game, was actually presented by Gearbox with comments and bragging by Pitchford!
They can't possibly shy away from from taking their fair share of the steaming fecal-pie.

Chattermouth:

He can't have meant that. I mean, seeing as how the nice-looking demo, with all that juicy dynamic lighting and great content which simply does not exist in the full game, was actually presented by Gearbox with comments and bragging by Pitchford!
They can't possibly shy away from from taking their fair share of the steaming fecal-pie.

You'd think that, but he basically was. I think he honestly meant it. And, he's not alone. Quite a few Gearbox/Borderlands fans have been doing the same.

As for Gearbox, well....they're* acting about the same as they were with Duke Nukem Forever.

One minute they're saying the game is "amazing" and that gamers are just "whining". The next they're saying, "It's not our fault! [insert scapegoat here] did it! We made Borderlands! You can't hate us!"

* and by "they're" I mean Randy Pitchford.

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